Atonement without blood according to Freelight.

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S-word

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freelight said:
:thumb:

Yes,...we come right back to the Lord Jesus teaching (confirmed by James), not only in the Sermon on the mount, but also right in the Lord's Prayer.

~*~*~

“This, then, is how you should pray:

“‘Our Father in heaven,
hallowed be your name,
your kingdom come,
your will be done,
on earth as it is in heaven.
Give us today our daily bread.
And forgive us our debts,
as we also have forgiven our debtors.
And lead us not into temptation,
but deliver us from the evil one.’

For if you forgive other people when they sin against you, your heavenly Father will also forgive you. But if you do not forgive others their sins, your Father will not forgive your sins.

- Matt. 6: 9-14
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Why then did the Lord, through his prophet Samuel, order King Saul to attack the Amalekites for what their ancestors had done some 400 years previously, and to destroy every thing they had? Saul was commanded to kill all the men, women, children, and babies, all their cattle, sheep, camels and donkeys. See 1st Samuel, 15: 1 to 3.

Is it, "Do as I say, not as I do?
 
1Mind1Spirit

1Mind1Spirit

Literal lunatic
S-word said:
Why then did the Lord, through his prophet Samuel, order King Saul to attack the Amalekites for what their ancestors had done some 400 years previously, and to destroy every thing they had? Saul was commanded to kill all the men, women, children, and babies, all their cattle, sheep, camels and donkeys. See 1st Samuel, 15: 1 to 3.

Is it, "Do as I say, not as I do?
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Good question.
 
patrick jane

patrick jane

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S-word said:
Why then did the Lord, through his prophet Samuel, order King Saul to attack the Amalekites for what their ancestors had done some 400 years previously, and to destroy every thing they had? Saul was commanded to kill all the men, women, children, and babies, all their cattle, sheep, camels and donkeys. See 1st Samuel, 15: 1 to 3.

Is it, "Do as I say, not as I do?
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Romans 12:19 KJV -
 
L

Lazy afternoon

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daqq said:
Saying "You are wrong" proves nothing and please see my post above. :)
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Did you not notice that Freelight says the blood of Christ is of no account in his imagined salvation and he supports the UB.

That is what you said thanks to.

LA
 
L

Lazy afternoon

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daqq said:
If you do not have and hold the Testimony of Messiah in uprightness and truth then neither do you have the atonement covering of his blood. And if you claim to be a follower of Messiah only in name, and do not do what he says to do in his Testimony, then you trample his Testimony which represents his blood.
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Freelight rejects the atonement covering of His blood, and then claims to be a follower of Messiah.

You approved of his position.(the position of Judaism, which video you approved, as did Marhig)

LA
 
freelight

freelight

Eclectic Theosophist
Some serpent wisdom for SP.......

Some serpent wisdom for SP.......

serpentdove said:
Re 7:14

Freeli's an antichrist (2 Pe 2:1). :listen: And so are you.
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:crackup:

Sorry,.....couldnt find another emoticon to fit the response :)

I'm far from 'anti-christ' by scriptural definition, and the basic meaning of the word, as far as being against Christ in person, principle, ethic, what he stands for, his teaching, his Spirit, etc. God knows his own by heart....so your judgments dont stick.

As a reminder Lazy afternoon is number 11 on Satan, Inc. (TOL Heretics list) in "The 'Jesus is not God' people (Non-trinitarians) category. :burnlib:
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First of all, that Satan, Inc. Heretic list thread is a circus. I was serving truth there and making corrections to various misconceptions and got BANNED from that specific thread for holding my ground. Thats the level of buffoonery, bias and bigotry you got going on.

You might as well put Jesus and his apostles on your 'non-trin' list too, because they were true blood Jewish Monotheist Unitarians. An education can do wonders, and this is debated in many other threads, the whole Unitarian/Trinitarian debate (Jesus is 'God' or only the 'Son' of God?), my commentaries holding. This however is not the place to debate that topic.

See:

Ascended Masters
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For a better education on 'ascended masters' I'd refer you to a good resource page here on 'Ascended Master schools'.

The Ascended Master Activities that have been sponsored by the Brotherhood of Light and the Spiritual Hierarchy of Ascended Masters, Cosmic Beings, and Angelic Host serving the Earth are: The Theosophical Society, The Agni Yoga Society, The I AM Activity, The Bridge to Freedom, The Summit Lighthouse, and The Temple of The Presence. (I would add 'Niscience' as well).

Some good teaching is there, but each must seek for truth on their own, and draw from the spirit of God within. YOU are the temple of God.
 
freelight

freelight

Eclectic Theosophist
S-word said:
Why then did the Lord, through his prophet Samuel, order King Saul to attack the Amalekites for what their ancestors had done some 400 years previously, and to destroy every thing they had? Saul was commanded to kill all the men, women, children, and babies, all their cattle, sheep, camels and donkeys. See 1st Samuel, 15: 1 to 3.

Is it, "Do as I say, not as I do?
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I dont know if the true Creator-God would ever command such a thing, so I question its authenticity at this point. I also dont know how this might fit into 'blood atonement',...the slaying of these people would surely be a blood-bath. There would be some kind of negative karma produced by such bloodshed, even in justified wars.

Is Love really this blood-thirsty? Would Love command or will such a thing? Would the 'God' and 'Father' of Jesus who Sent by Love's calling...be the same being as this jealous, wrath-wielding warlord god ? What does your conscience say?
 
freelight

freelight

Eclectic Theosophist
Lazy afternoon said:
Did you not notice that Freelight says the blood of Christ is of no account in his imagined salvation and he supports the UB.
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What I've shared on blood atonement stands, any can read all my commentary and make their own conclusions based on a fair hearing.

I've shared what the UB teaches on blood atonement, and there are plenty other religious writings too, besidses the BIBLE itself. - Thats why the Jewish view of atonement and forgiveness is being shared first, before we move onto other sources.

That is what you said thanks to.
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We agree what Jesus taught on this, see the Sermon on the Mount and the Lord's prayer...for starters.
 
L

Lazy afternoon

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freelight said:
I dont know if the true Creator-God would ever command such a thing, so I question its authenticity at this point. I also dont know how this might fit into 'blood atonement',...the slaying of these people would surely be a blood-bath. There would be some kind of negative karma produced by such bloodshed, even in justified wars.

Is Love really this blood-thirsty? Would Love command or will such a thing? Would the 'God' and 'Father' of Jesus who Sent by Love's calling...be the same being as this jealous, wrath-wielding warlord god ? What does your conscience say?
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You mean you do not believe the written word of God and you value your own conscience over that of Gods word.

Mic 5:10 And it shall come to pass in that day, saith the LORD, that I will cut off thy horses out of the midst of thee, and I will destroy thy chariots:
Mic 5:11 And I will cut off the cities of thy land, and throw down all thy strong holds:
Mic 5:12 And I will cut off witchcrafts out of thine hand; and thou shalt have no more soothsayers:
Mic 5:13 Thy graven images also will I cut off, and thy standing images out of the midst of thee; and thou shalt no more worship the work of thine hands.
Mic 5:14 And I will pluck up thy groves out of the midst of thee: so will I destroy thy cities.
Mic 5:15 And I will execute vengeance in anger and fury upon the heathen, such as they have not heard.
 
D

daqq

Well-known member
S-word said:
Why then did the Lord, through his prophet Samuel, order King Saul to attack the Amalekites for what their ancestors had done some 400 years previously, and to destroy every thing they had? Saul was commanded to kill all the men, women, children, and babies, all their cattle, sheep, camels and donkeys. See 1st Samuel, 15: 1 to 3.

Is it, "Do as I say, not as I do?
Click to expand...

Nope, it is rather "do as I do and show you to do" if you love the Father with all your heart, soul, mind, and strength. Therefore the same goes for all; put to death Agag, king of the Amalekites: cut him off, and cut off all his offspring, before they choke the seed of the Word from your own heart. Kill them before they kill you. Slay them before they slay you. Choke them out before they choke you out; for by secret hand Yah has sworn that YHWH shall war against Amalek from generation to generation. We are to show no mercy when it comes to devils and demons, (unless of course one loves devils and their doctrines). :chuckle:
 
marhig

marhig

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Lazy afternoon said:
You are wrong Dagg.

One must become a child of God through the blood of Christ before the other sacrifices for sins can be applied.(types)

Judaism is a rejection of Jesus Christ, yet you applaud their doctrine.

You are only hurting yourselves.

LA
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The thing is, you don't understand what what blood of Christ is, it's not his natural blood. It's his poured out life, he came by water and by blood, by the word of God and he lived it out, it's his life poured out for us. And once he is resurrected in our hearts by the Spirit, then his life is poured into us by the Spirit and we are then covered in his blood, in his life. And as we die to self, others see his life in us, and this is how we are justified by his blood.

When Jesus said pull down this temple and I will raise it again in three days. That was spiritual, and it was later explained that he meant his body the temple. But if that hadn't of been explained, many here would be arguing until they are blue in the face that it was the natural temple. Because they don't read the Bible in the Spirit, and try to work out what it means through the flesh. We have to be patient do Gods will, and wait for him and he will reveal to us what we are to know.

Jesus said those who have ears to hear, hear! Jesus was full of the Holy Spirit and once his apostles were born of God they received the power of the Spirit also, and they spoke in the spirit. The blood is not his natural blood on the natural cross, he bore his cross and he bore witness to the truth and through him we are saved. By truly following him and living it, being a doer of the word, baring witness to the truth and truly following Jesus.

When Jesus preached that we should deny ourselves, take up our cross and follow him. He didn't mean for us to be crucified naturally, and to be crucified is for our flesh to be put to death, our life laid down, so that Christ can live through us to bring others back to God.

And those who are not willing to take up their cross are not worthy of him!

Jesus said that he came into this world to bare witness to the truth, not to die on a cross to save, he was saving before he was crucified, he didn't need to naturally sacrificed to save anyone but rather he came as a living sacrifice and saved as many as would believe in him. And those who are of the truth hear his voice. We are saved once we believe in him through faith, by the grace of God.
 
marhig

marhig

Well-known member
Lazy afternoon said:
Did you not notice that Freelight says the blood of Christ is of no account in his imagined salvation and he supports the UB.

That is what you said thanks to.

LA
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I don't believe the natural blood of Christ saves either, and I've never read the UB. I've only ever read the Bible! Mostly only the KJV and rarely the Aramaic version.
 
marhig

marhig

Well-known member
Lazy afternoon said:
Freelight rejects the atonement covering of His blood, and then claims to be a follower of Messiah.

You approved of his position.(the position of Judaism, which video you approved, as did Marhig)

LA
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You forget, Jesus was a Jew! He came to show us how to live right before God, because the Jewish leaders had gone wrong putting the traditions of men before the will of God, blind guides leading the people wrong, and away from the truth. (A bit like many of the churches of today with their false teachings)

But now we have the perfect example in Jesus. He's showed us how to live right before God to please him, and he laid down his life and became a living sacrifice to do so, being dead to his flesh, he reconciled many to God by the word, by the ministry of reconciliation, we are not saved by his death on the cross, we are saved by his life.

So now that he has come and bore witness to the truth perfectly, we have no excuse, we can either follow him in the truth and obey God and do his will, or live by our own will and please our flesh put our own lives first, and deny him and God!
 
marhig

marhig

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daqq said:
Nope, it is rather "do as I do and show you to do" if you love the Father with all your heart, soul, mind, and strength. Therefore the same goes for all; put to death Agag, king of the Amalekites: cut him off, and cut off all his offspring, before they choke the seed of the Word from your own heart. Kill them before they kill you. Slay them before they slay you. Choke them out before they choke you out; for by secret hand Yah has sworn that YHWH shall war against Amalek from generation to generation. We are to show no mercy when it comes to devils and demons, (unless of course one loves devils and their doctrines). :chuckle:
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Yes, that's one way of putting to death, it's like when Jesus taught that if our right eye offends us pluck out out, he wasn't teaching us to naturally pluck our eyes out, but to stop looking the wrong and stop desiring with our eyes. And if our right arm offends us, cut it off isn't to chop off our arm, but to stop doing wrong in our lives. Cut off from sin and live right before God.

Jesus teaches us to start with ourselves first.

God also puts the flesh to death by the sword, which is the Spirit, which is his breath!

Isaiah 11

But with righteousness shall he judge the poor, and reprove with equity for the meek of the earth: and he shall smite the earth with the rod of his mouth, and with the breath of his lips shall he slay the wicked.

And if his Spirit is within in us, we will be able to use the sword to put our enemy to death.
 
D

daqq

Well-known member
marhig said:
Yes, that's one way of putting to death, it's like when Jesus taught that if our right eye offends us pluck out out, he wasn't teaching us to naturally pluck our eyes out, but to stop looking the wrong and stop desiring with our eyes. And if our right arm offends us, cut it off isn't to chop off our arm, but to stop doing wrong in our lives. Cut off from sin and live right before God.

Jesus teaches us to start with ourselves first.

God also puts the flesh to death by the sword, which is the Spirit, which is his breath!

Isaiah 11

But with righteousness shall he judge the poor, and reprove with equity for the meek of the earth: and he shall smite the earth with the rod of his mouth, and with the breath of his lips shall he slay the wicked.

And if his Spirit is within in us, we will be able to use the sword to put our enemy to death.
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Amen, and if you understand those types, allegories, and parables, you will understand the writings of Paul just the same because he teaches the commandments and Testimony of Messiah. For example Romans 7:14-25 teaches us that "sin" dwells in the flesh, and that is to say, the "outer bounds" or badlands of the body temple; "the commons" or "profane area" of the temple, (even as used in Ezekiel). So this analogy coming from the Gospel accounts, (devils and demons), reveals that sins are likened to devils and things learned from devils, (devils and their doctrines; for every devil has a doctrine, or teaching, for testimony is spirit), but likewise shows that it mainly concerns "the flesh" or "outer bounds" of the temple. Therefore the "inner man" of the heart is protected from such corrosion, in other words, not "possessed" on the inside, (but there are evil beasts and wild creatures of all typological sorts dwelling in the "outer bounds" that need to be either tamed or cut off, lol). That is why king Agag was still around even after being slain in earlier days, and why he rears his ugly head again in Haman the Agagite, in the book of Esther; in the typology Agag is one of seven heads, seven mountains, seven kings. The Father does not physically slaughter His own creation or command His people to do so, (but man likes to interpret His Word that way). :)
 
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