The Christian life is about denying scriptures so as to obey Love, uncondtionally .

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Gurucam

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1 John: 4 verse: 8 of the King James Version of the New Testament says:
"He that loveth not knoweth not God; for God is love."

God is Love therefore the Spirit of God are urging of Love.

The Spirit of God is the will of God.

Matthews: 7 KJV N.T.
21 Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven.

(humans will know the will of God as urging of love)

John: 4 King James Version (KJV)
24 God is a Spirit: and they that worship him must worship him in spirit and in truth.

(humans will know God (Who is Spirit) as urging of love. This is the only way to know God and His Will)

Matthew: 7 King James Version (KJV)
14 Because strait is the gate, and narrow is the way, which leadeth unto life, and few there be that find it.

(if you do not not know that the will of God are urgings of Love you have not found the straight gate and narrow way)

Romans: 8 KJV N.T.
2 For the law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus hath made me free from the law of sin and death.

Acts 13 KJV N.T.
39 And by him all that believe are justified from all things, from which ye could not be justified by the law of Moses.

(the law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus is unconditional obedience to urgings of love even if one has to ignore and transgress the law of sin and death)

Romans: 7 KJV N.T.
4 Wherefore, my brethren, ye also are become dead to the law by the body of Christ; that ye should be married to another, even to him who is raised from the dead, that we should bring forth fruit unto God.

(those who are in the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus are not at all under the law of sin and death. At all events, those who are in the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus must leave their old law based marriages behind. However having done this there are two choices for the next step.

a. One choice is to form new marriages according to urging of love and not according to what the ten commandments says.

b. The other choice is to be 'married' to 'him who is raised from the dead'.

In both these cases one will stop bringing forth fruits onto dead/children of the flesh and start bringing forth only fruits onto God/children onto God) )

5 For when we were in the flesh, the motions of sins, which were by the law, did work in our members to bring forth fruit unto death.

(when humans are under the law of sin and death they bring forth only fruits onto death/children onto death. The Lord Jesus attempted to stop this by doing away with the the law of sin and death. However the law of sin and death could not be done away with for 'the dead', i.e. those whose hearts are waxed gross.)

6 But now we are delivered from the law, that being dead wherein we were held; that we should serve in newness of spirit, and not in the oldness of the letter.

(Speaking to those whose hearts are no longer waxed gross, i.e. no longer 'the dead', the Lord says: We are no longer dead within. Therefore we must drop the law of sin and death and serve in the newness of spirit. That is we must now serve love and not ideals and laws. That is we must embrace the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus. And then we will stop bringing forth fruits onto dead and start bringing forth fruits onto God)


[size=+1]The above verses all confirm a very simple request, from the Lord Jesus.

The request is that, in all things and every thing, one must obey urging of love, unconditionally.

Also the verses confirm that one must do so even if one has to transgress all ideals and laws of society, morality and religiosity (i.e. including laws in scriptures)

Also the above revelations confirm that when one is led by love unconditionally, in the above manner in all things, one brings forth only fruits onto God. With respect to children, when couples are led into their procreative sex by love (and not by law), they bring forth only children onto God.

Also the above revelations confirm that if one is not led by love, unconditionally in the above manner, in all things, one brings forth only fruits onto death. With respect to children, when couples are not led into their procreative sex by love, they bring forth only children onto death.

Also the above revelations confirm that those who esteem the law of sin and death (i.e. the ten commandments) bring forth only fruits onto God. With respect to children, those couples who are guided into their sexual procreation, by the law of sin and death (i.e. the ten commandments), they bring forth only children onto God.

This is the literal truth from the KJV N.T. [/size]

 
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Gurucam

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Be liberated from the 'killing fields'. I refer not to the fields where one is killed physically. I refer to the fields where one is killeth spiritually.

I refer to 'the dead burying their own kind, the dead'. 'The dead' describes the spiritually dead, i.e. one whose heart is waxed gross.

About 'the dead', the Lord said:

Matthews: 13 KJV N.T.
15 For this people's heart is waxed gross, and their ears are dull of hearing, and their eyes they have closed; lest at any time they should see with their eyes, and hear with their ears, and should understand with their heart, and should be converted, and I should heal them. (this described every one except the twelve disciples)

However to those who were chosen to follow the Lord, He said:

Matthews: 13 KJV N.T.
16 But blessed are your eyes, for they see: and your ears, for they hear (this described only the twelve disciples).

The Lord confirmed that He encountered two different types of people and He treated them differently. He gave them totally different approaches to God's righteousness:

Matthews: 8 KJV N.T.
22 But Jesus said unto him, 1.) Follow me; and 2.) let the dead bury their dead.


Among which set, do you choose to be counted?

'The killing fields' refer to the absolute uninformed and indiscriminate use of 1.) the law of sin and death and 2.) the written scriptures by absolutely misguided and spiritually dead people. These are given (by Lord Jesus) for the dead to bury their dead counterparts. He instructed, 'let the dead bury their dead'

However spiritually dead leaders are foisting the things that are given for the dead to bury their dead onto aspiring Christians. They are false brethren mentioned in:

Galatians: 2 KJV N.T.
4 And that because of false brethren unawares brought in, who came in privily to spy out our liberty which we have in Christ Jesus, that they might bring us into bondage:

Spiritually dead leaders cannot have a clue about things spiritual. They are simply unaware of things spiritual. However, Christianity is anchored on one's own spirit, the Spirit of Jesus and the Holy Spirit. Therefore spiritually dead people cannot be Christian popes, priests, pastors, etc. They will simply be false prophets who came in Jesus' name. And indeed they will misguide many. They will misguide everyone who comes to them seeking to be Christians.

The very great majority of these people were self-appoint or misguided into assuming leadership positions in what passes for Christianity, on earth. They are millions and they are literally misguiding and (spiritually) burying masses of (at least a billion) unsuspecting aspiring Christians.

This has resulted in many being called to Christianity and the very great majority being misled by these (seemingly unwitting) corrupt leaders. Then these great masses of aspiring Christians erroneously believe that they are getting Christianity. They err and do not make it. This seem to have been ongoing for the past 2000 odd years in traditional Christianity. These false prophets are within the highest place and highest leadership position in traditional Christianity.

Traditional Christianity is in serious need of being purified. The promise is that purification of what erroneously passed for Christianity, will happen only in the last days, i.e. in the fullness of time, which is now at hand.

Therefore this is the last opportunity for traditional Christians to awaken to or get truth. The straight gate and narrow way to life is only now being confirmed in simple and total clarity.

Please do not miss the straight gate and narrow way that leadeth onto life. Only the Spirit giveth life. The law and the scriptures do not giveth life. However, the end do not look good. It is confirmed in the KJV N.T. that at any event, only a few will be chosen from among the billion or so who are called to Christianity. That is only a few will find this straight gate and narrow way that leadeth onto life.

And these 'chosen' few will find it only in these last days (when Christianity will be finally purified). Among those called to Christianity, the chance of anyone being chosen is very very slim. Yet the opportunity will be openly offered to everyone, now in the fullness of time, in the simplest terms.

Mark 8 KJV N.T.
36 For what shall it profit a man, if he shall gain the whole world, and lose his own soul?

Luke: 9 KJV N.T.
25 For what is a man advantaged, if he gain the whole world, and lose himself, or be cast away?

My posts are the literal truth from the KJV N.T. This is the surfacing of authentic Christianity which is totally and literally supported by the KJV N.T. revelations. This is the fullness of time. I urge you to embrace my posts. Then you can be among the last to Christianity. You will get truth and not err but be among the first of the few who are chosen.

Matthew 20 KJV N.T.
16 So the last shall be first, and the first last: for many be called, but few chosen.

The masses who are in traditional Christianity are 'the first to Christianity'. Many are veterans. They boldly but unwittingly quote parables for truth. They are a billion or so. It is prophesied that 'the first' shall be last. Considering that only a few are chosen, the situation in traditional Christianity is very very serious.
 
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meshak

meshak

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Don't get me wrong, I don't endorse unconditional love.

Salvation is not unconditional. It is conditioned to be faithful to Jesus and His teachings.

Still your title is so misgiving.
 
PureX

PureX

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As soon as someone starts spouting off about "obedience" relative to love, I know they are missing the mark. Because love has very little to do with obedience. Love neither demands it, nor responds with it. Love is the ultimate act of free will, while obedience is the negation of it.

When we can establish a concept and relationship with God that is NOT dependent on the idea of obedience, we will finally, perhaps, have established a concept of and relationship with God that is truly based on love.
 
meshak

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PureX said:
As soon as someone starts spouting off about "obedience" relative to love, I know they are missing the mark. Because love has very little to do with obedience. Love neither demands it, nor responds with it. Love is the ultimate act of free will, while obedience is the negation of it.

When we can establish a concept and relationship with God that is NOT dependent on the idea of obedience, we will finally, perhaps, have established a concept of and relationship with God that is truly based on love.
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Jesus sums us His commands in two: Love God and love your neighbor as yourself.

Jesus is all about love, friend.

You need to read His word.
 
Epoisses

Epoisses

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meshak said:
Don't get me wrong, I don't endorse unconditional love.

Salvation is not unconditional. It is conditioned to be faithful to Jesus and His teachings.

Still your title is so misgiving.
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God's love is unconditional. God loves us because he is love. Human love is conditional which is what you have.
 
G

Gurucam

Well-known member
Matthew 20 KJV N.T.
16 So the last shall be first, and the first last: for many be called, but few chosen.

The masses who are in traditional Christianity are 'the first to Christianity'. Many are veterans. They boldly but unwittingly quote and use parables for truth. They are a billion or so. It is prophesied that 'the first' shall be last. Considering that only a few are chosen, the situation in traditional Christianity is very very serious.

Matthews: 13 KJV N.T.
10 And the disciples came, and said unto him, Why speakest thou unto them in parables?
11 He answered and said unto them, Because it is given unto you to know the mysteries of the kingdom of heaven, but to them it is not given.
12 For whosoever hath, to him shall be given, and he shall have more abundance: but whosoever hath not, from him shall be taken away even that he hath.
13 Therefore speak I to them in parables: because they seeing see not; and hearing they hear not, neither do they understand.
14 And in them is fulfilled the prophecy of Esaias, which saith, By hearing ye shall hear, and shall not understand; and seeing ye shall see, and shall not perceive:
15 For this people's heart is waxed gross, and their ears are dull of hearing, and their eyes they have closed; lest at any time they should see with their eyes and hear with their ears, and should understand with their heart, and should be converted, and I should heal them.
16 But blessed are your eyes, for they see: and your ears, for they hear.

From the above revelation, parables were given only for:
1. people who are not given to know the mysteries of God's kingdom of heaven.
2. people who do not have the eyes to see, the ears to hear and the hearts to understand.
3. people whose hearts are waxed gross
4. people who hath not and from them shall be taken away even that they hath.

Parables are given for the dead to bury their dead. Do any of you guys use parables?
 
G

Gurucam

Well-known member
PureX said:
As soon as someone starts spouting off about "obedience" relative to love, I know they are missing the mark. Because love has very little to do with obedience. Love neither demands it, nor responds with it. Love is the ultimate act of free will, while obedience is the negation of it.

When we can establish a concept and relationship with God that is NOT dependent on the idea of obedience, we will finally, perhaps, have established a concept of and relationship with God that is truly based on love.
Click to expand...

What about parables do you quote and use them?

Matthews: 13 KJV N.T.
10 And the disciples came, and said unto him, Why speakest thou unto them in parables?
11 He answered and said unto them, Because it is given unto you to know the mysteries of the kingdom of heaven, but to them it is not given.
12 For whosoever hath, to him shall be given, and he shall have more abundance: but whosoever hath not, from him shall be taken away even that he hath.
13 Therefore speak I to them in parables: because they seeing see not; and hearing they hear not, neither do they understand.
14 And in them is fulfilled the prophecy of Esaias, which saith, By hearing ye shall hear, and shall not understand; and seeing ye shall see, and shall not perceive:
15 For this people's heart is waxed gross, and their ears are dull of hearing, and their eyes they have closed; lest at any time they should see with their eyes and hear with their ears, and should understand with their heart, and should be converted, and I should heal them.
16 But blessed are your eyes, for they see: and your ears, for they hear.

In the above, the Lord Jesus confirmed that parables were given only for:
1. people who are not given to know the mysteries of God's kingdom of heaven.
2. people who do not have the eyes to see, the ears to hear and the hearts to understand.
3. people whose hearts are waxed gross
4. people who hath not and from them shall be taken away even that they hath.

Do you quote and use parables? A billion strong traditional Christians are quoting and using parables under the misguided idea that it is truth.


With respect to love:

Are you aware that God is a Spirit?

Are you aware that the Spirit of God is the Will of God?

Are you aware that only those who do the will of God enters His kingdom of heaven?

Are you aware that God is Love and only those who have loved know God?

Are you aware that doing the Will of God is obedience to Love?

 
meshak

meshak

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Epo,

This is what Jesus says who is the center of salvation:

"for God so love the world that He gave His only begotten Son that whoever believes in Him shall not perish but have eternal life".

You see, "whoever believes in Him..." Believe in Him is conditional. so simple.

good try but no cigar.
 
PureX

PureX

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Gurucam said:
What about parables do you quote and use them?
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I don't understand how this question is relevant to my post.

I rarely quote anyone else, since I can usually make myself understood by my own words. But what does this have to do with my pointing out that love is not about obedience, nor is obedience about love?
 
meshak

meshak

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Guru,

You are making this so complicated with wordy posts and reasoning.

So I am making it simple so everyone can understand and get the point.
 
meshak

meshak

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Epoisses said:
God gave you Salvation 'in Christ' before you were born or did anything good or bad.

That's Love!!!
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So you are Calvinist.

You make up your own salvation, disregarding Jesus' word.

You have no bases for your claim.

very convenient one.

Unfortunately there are many people like your salvation but you will not get it because you don't value Jesus' word.
 
meshak

meshak

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Epo,

Are you Calvinist or Universalist?

They have many in common in what they claim and your are claiming the same.
 
Epoisses

Epoisses

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meshak said:
Epo,

Are you Calvinist or Universalist?

They have many in common in what they claim and your are claiming the same.
Click to expand...

I'm a three and a half point Arminian. I reject the Arminian provisional atonement hands down. What Christ accomplished at the cross was perfect, finished and complete for the whole world. I also believe in a limited form of eternal security. Instead of once saved always saved I believe in once mature always mature. Mature believers in Christ do not fall away but the babes in Christ can and often do fall away.
 
meshak

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Epoisses said:
I'm a three and a half point Arminian. I reject the Arminian provisional atonement hands down. What Christ accomplished at the cross was perfect, finished and complete for the whole world. I also believe in a limited form of eternal security. Instead of once saved always saved I believe in once mature always mature. Mature believers in Christ do not fall away but the babes in Christ can and often do fall away.
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whatever your theology is your dismissal of Jesus conditional love message is not good.

It certainly tickles itching ears but that about it. It sound empty "love".

"for God love the world that He gave His only begotten Son that whoever believes in Him shall not perish but have eternal life."

You are dismissing the core of Jesus' love message.
 
Epoisses

Epoisses

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meshak said:
whatever your theology is your dismissal of Jesus conditional love message is not good.

It certainly tickles itching ears but that about it. It sound empty "love".

"for God love the world that He gave His only begotten Son that whoever believes in Him shall not perish but have eternal life."

You are dismissing the core of Jesus' love message.
Click to expand...

God's love is unconditional.

Meshak's love is conditional and there's the problem.

You view God thru the lens of your sinful flesh.
 
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