Trump holds up LGBT rainbow flag at rally

Grosnick Marowbe said:

Hillary is a "Jezebel" to Bill Clinton's "Ahab." Together, they are a ruthless, lawless couple who lack a conscience or a sense of decency.

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And from a moral perspective Trump may or may not be a lot better, who knows. He can't be much worse! And at least he is wanting the get the government, at least partially, out of my life and out of my pocket book. He at least claims that he's going to appoint pro-life judges to the Supreme Court. He at least claims to believe that snipping the baby's spinal cord with scissors while his head is still in the birth canal isn't okay.

Maybe he's a big con and is lying through his teeth. But I can't read minds and have no good reason to believe he's lying and I know for a fact that Hillary is incapable of telling to the truth about anything except for the fact that she thinks parcial birth abortion is a perfectly fine medical procedure that any woman has the right to have performed.

People, and by people I mean mostly Christians, are acting as if there is no difference between these two candidates or that the difference is only a matter of degree. I don't believe that's the case at all and even if it is, ask the guy who gets beaten in Hell with many stripes (vs. getting beaten with few), whether matters of degree are important.

Clete said:

Well, I can't say that I'm nearly as apocalyptic as that. Countries like Russia and China would literally be blowing their own heads off by attacking the United States. Their economies cannot exist without the United States. If we go away, the world falls into a dark age that'll make the Dark Ages look like a Sunday morning church service and potluck picknick social.

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That's not true. In fact, it's hilarious because of how extremely exaggerated it is :chuckle:

American sin #1: Assuming an insane amount of self-importance.
Which other countries do not exhibit because they actually care about not looking like tools.

Clete said:

Not from this Christian nor any Christian I know.

Besides, last time I checked, the primaries are over. Christians probably voted mostly for someone else other than Trump

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No way Trump got the nomination without any votes from Christians.

but all those other Republicans lost and so now, for the Christian, it is no longer about voting in "your guy", its about voting out the person who is likely to be the least corrupt, the least murderous, the least evil.

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So in your mind, if given choice between casting your vote for Satan or Hitler, or voting for a third party, or not voting at all....

...you would vote for Hitler....as a Christian.

Fascinating.

Clete said:

Well, I can't say that I'm nearly as apocalyptic as that. Countries like Russia and China would literally be blowing their own heads off by attacking the United States. Their economies cannot exist without the United States. If we go away, the world falls into a dark age that'll make the Dark Ages look like a Sunday morning church service and potluck picknick social.


My motivation has less to do with fearing Hillary Clinton and more to do with simple straight forward tactics. The enemy of my enemy is my friend. It really is as simple as that. That, and I have no delusion about this still being some sort of a Christian nation. It is now a fully secular nation and I, therefore, don't expect that a Christian is going to win the White House - ever! That doesn't keep me from voting for Christians when I get the chance but when I don't have that option then I don't sit on my butt and just let the evil run over me.

Last weekend the Oklahoma Sooners defeated Kansas University by 53 points. I've been an OU fan my whole life but that was maybe the most boring football game I've ever seen. Blow-outs suck! But you know what would have made it worse? If KU had quit after the third quarter. They had no hope of winning but they understood one thing. It's better to lose by 53 than by 56 and it would have been better to lose 50 than by 53.

If you can't do what you want, do what you can.

Resting in Him,
Clete

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The problem is, Hillary has stated that If our country suffers future Cyber-attacks. it could bring about "Military action." I don't believe we can limit a war with Russia, to a traditional type of war without it ending up Nuclear at some point? She's planning on having a Syrian "No fly zone." That could escalate things further if Russian Jets were suddenly shot down by U.S. missiles. Also, one of our Generals publicly announced that we would beat our enemies (Russians, no doubt ETC.) like they've never been beaten before. That's called "Saber Rattling." I'm not saying Nuclear war will positively happen, however, there's always that possibility. It happened once before. One sided of course, but, none the less. We can't be so naive to say, "It can NEVER happen!"

Clete said:

And from a moral perspective Trump may or may not be a lot better, who knows. He can't be much worse! And at least he is wanting the get the government, at least partially, out of my life and out of my pocket book. He at least claims that he's going to appoint pro-life judges to the Supreme Court. He at least claims to believe that snipping the baby's spinal cord with scissors while his head is still in the birth canal isn't okay.

Maybe he's a big con and is lying through his teeth. But I can't read minds and have no good reason to believe he's lying and I know for a fact that Hillary is incapable of telling to the truth about anything except for the fact that she thinks parcial birth abortion is a perfectly fine medical procedure that any woman has the right to have performed.

People, and by people I mean mostly Christians, are acting as if there is no difference between these two candidates or that the difference is only a matter of degree. I don't believe that's the case at all and even if it is, ask the guy who gets beaten in Hell with many stripes (vs. getting beaten with few), whether matters of degree are important.

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Are they any less in hell? How many did they take with them?

Jose Fly said:

No way Trump got the nomination without any votes from Christians.



So in your mind, if given choice between casting your vote for Satan or Hitler, or voting for a third party, or not voting at all....

...you would vote for Hitler....as a Christian.

Fascinating.

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Hitler kills those in opposition. Trump vows to protect evangelicals. It's the progressives who want to wipe out Christianity from the public square and from any location of power or wealth. Trump isn't the progressive in this campaign.

Crucible, Trump DOES have a lot in common with Hitler .This is NOT "Godwin's Law ".
No, he's not as extreme as Hitler , but both are ruthless demagogues, rabble rousers ,
and pathological liars .
Hitler demonized the Jews . Trump demonizes Hispanics . Both created scapegoats .
Both called for mass deportations . Trump also demonizes Muslims, and just like Hitler, he has called for Muslims to wear signs showing their Muslim status, just as Hitler did this with the Jews of Germany .
Let's face it ; History is starting to repeat itself . There are so many other examples of Trump's vile bigotry , and you can google them yourself easily . Beware of what you ask for ! Trump is bad news not only for America but the entire world !

The Horn is bad for America

The Horn said:

Crucible, Trump DOES have a lot in common with Hitler .

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well, they're both carbon based life forms



except hitler


he's dead



:think:

much like your brain

Clete said:

And from a moral perspective Trump may or may not be a lot better, who knows. He can't be much worse! And at least he is wanting the get the government, at least partially, out of my life and out of my pocket book. He at least claims that he's going to appoint pro-life judges to the Supreme Court. He at least claims to believe that snipping the baby's spinal cord with scissors while his head is still in the birth canal isn't okay.

Maybe he's a big con and is lying through his teeth. But I can't read minds and have no good reason to believe he's lying and I know for a fact that Hillary is incapable of telling to the truth about anything except for the fact that she thinks parcial birth abortion is a perfectly fine medical procedure that any woman has the right to have performed.

People, and by people I mean mostly Christians, are acting as if there is no difference between these two candidates or that the difference is only a matter of degree. I don't believe that's the case at all and even if it is, ask the guy who gets beaten in Hell with many stripes (vs. getting beaten with few), whether matters of degree are important.

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I couldn't agree more.

At this point, the determining factor of who will be president is math.
Going against the odds is just bad math.

Crucible said:

That's not true. In fact, it's hilarious because of how extremely exaggerated it is :chuckle:

American sin #1: Assuming an insane amount of self-importance.
Which other countries do not exhibit because they actually care about not looking like tools.

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Believe what you like but socialism and communism do not work. They simply do NOT work because they foster ticks and teach them to despise the dog on which they live. Eventually, you end up with all ticks with no dog and then, when the whole things comes crashing down, the ticks blaim the dog they killed for dying.

And whether you choose to believe it or not, the fact is that the United States of America is the only dog left alive.

Jose Fly said:

No way Trump got the nomination without any votes from Christians.

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Of course. It was not my intention to suggest otherwise. My point is simply that Trump did not win that demographic. Not even close. Ted Cruze would have received many more Christian votes than Trump received while he was still running. And had he won, he wouldn't have been good enough for you either.

So in your mind, if given choice between casting your vote for Satan or Hitler, or voting for a third party, or not voting at all....

...you would vote for Hitler....as a Christian.

Fascinating.

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If an evil governmental system gives me the power to vote in their election, why wouldn't I?

I didn't make the system! I'm simply not stupid enough to refuse to use it to my best advantage to whatever extent that I am given the right to do so. Pick any two evil entities you want and if given the opportunity to do so, I'm going to vote against the worse of the two evils. I don't know about you, but I happen to think that Satan himself would be far worse than Hilter ever could be in his wildest dreams. The choice, while unpleasant in the extreme, would be an easy one to make.

Your idea is the equivalent of telling me that, when racing toward a cliff, it's wrong to put the brakes on. That it's somehow better to just let the society push on the gas peddle and get it over with as though going off the cliff isn't going to destroy lives and kill people.


Here is the situation you are in, that we are all in...

There's a bad guy with a gun and there's you with a coin in your hand that has heads showing. The bad guy gives you some power by telling you that he's going to kill and mame as many people as possible so long as that coin still has heads showing but that if you flip it and it comes up tails, he'll only kill or mame one person per minute and only seven per day on Sundays.

Do you exercise the power he's given you and flip the coin or refuse to participate?

If you want to know which is the right answer, ask his potential victims what they would have you do.

Jose Fly said:

It is fascinating to see fundamentalist Christians adamantly support a pro-LGBT candidate.

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Nobody has ever said he was moral. The opposite in fact. However, you claim his personal life doesn't effect how he will govern. And he will stop the redistribution of income. He is the anti-establishment, anti-DC candidate.

Grosnick Marowbe said:

The problem is, Hillary has stated that If our country suffers future Cyber-attacks. it could bring about "Military action." I don't believe we can limit a war with Russia, to a traditional type of war without it ending up Nuclear at some point? She's planning on having a Syrian "No fly zone." That could escalate things further if Russian Jets were suddenly shot down by U.S. missiles. Also, one of our Generals publicly announced that we would beat our enemies (Russians, no doubt ETC.) like they've never been beaten before. That's called "Saber Rattling." I'm not saying Nuclear war will positively happen, however, there's always that possibility. It happened once before. One sided of course, but, none the less. We can't be so naive to say, "It can NEVER happen!"

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Well sure, it could happen and it would be terrible if it did but I'm just saying that there is a lot of incentive on all sides to see that it doesn't happen. Plus, even if it did happen, it wouldn't be the world ending catastophe that the left would have you believe. Not that it wouldn't be really horrible but the scorched sky world where only roaches remain is a figment of 1960's, left wing, anti-anything-nuclear, nut-job imagination.

Why, by the way, does the left always think that the planet is always on the verge of being wiped out and usually by us humans? If it's not Halley's Comet, it's global cooling. If it's not global cooling, it's the China Syndrome. If it's not nuclear annialation, it's global warming. It's just one "The sky is falling!" cry after another with them!

Angel4Truth said:

Are they any less in hell? How many did they take with them?

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Nope, they are not "any less in Hell", as you put it and I'd confidently venture to say that the one getting the lighter punishment in Hell took fewer with him than did the one getting the heavier consequence for his actions.

The lesser is two evils is LESSER not equivalent and the difference matters - a lot.

Clete said:

Well sure, it could happen and it would be terrible if it did but I'm just saying that there is a lot of incentive on all sides to see that it doesn't happen. Plus, even if it did happen, it wouldn't be the world ending catastophe that the left would have you believe. Not that it wouldn't be really horrible but the scorched sky world where only roaches remain is a figment of 1960's, left wing, anti-anything-nuclear, nut-job imagination.

Why, by the way, does the left always think that the planet is always on the verge of being wiped out and usually by us humans? If it's not Halley's Comet, it's global cooling. If it's not global cooling, it's the China Syndrome. If it's not nuclear annialation, it's global warming. It's just one "The sky is falling!" cry after another with them!

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It will be God who destroys this planet and replace it with another world. Revelation 21:1 "And I saw a new heaven and a new earth: for the first heaven and the first earth were passed away; and there was no more sea."

Grosnick Marowbe said:

It will be God who destroys this planet and replace it with another world. Revelation 21:1 "And I saw a new heaven and a new earth: for the first heaven and the first earth were passed away; and there was no more sea."

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I very nearly said that exact thing in my post! I love it when that sort of thing happens.

Clete said:

I very nearly said that exact thing in my post! I love it when that sort of thing happens.

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Me too.

Clete said:

It would only work the other way if you're a liberal.

There is a reason why both sides what to get people to show up at the polls and why they care so much about the enthusiasm of their base.

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But see, there's that assumption again, that somehow the Republican party gets to assume my vote. That's the assumption that has perpetuated this harlotry on the part of the Church for decades now.

I'm not politically liberal, and I'm not politically conservative. I try to approach everything in light of scripture, and that puts me at odds with both sides more often than not.

Clete said:

Exactly! And so why is it that people cannot figure out that getting a good guy in there isn't an option but at least helping to keep this corrupt piece of trash out is?

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We have trouble understanding the idea that to remove the trash you have to set fire to the house.