Originally posted by rene
You keep calling baptism a "ritual" - as if the teaching were somehow a dirty word vs. a teaching that Jesus instructed to be followed to est. the church - a teaching that was to always be followed per His words.
Is such an attitude one that a Christian should have towards a teaching of Jesus, the Son of God, the one that they claim to follow?
As to the "qualification gospel" comment - if by my following and not altering the teachings of Jesus mean such - then yes, I believe that one must follow the teachings of Jesus to be qualified to be a Christain vs. going the buffet approach to the gospel.
This is the key problem to your gospel is that you make the gospel a must and not a want too.
We obey because we want too and the Holy Ghost that should be in us will guide us to want to obey and follow with an open heart and not to qualify as you do.
This is why we are led by the Holy Spirit and not by legalism or laws and qualification as you think.
When you one day the new born spiritual rebirth then you will see the change and the want to and the doing and fruits of a christian come into practise.
A gospel of a must and laws or not good news, but a free will offereing of yourself because Christ is in us does the finish works of salvation.
This is one reason OSAS comes into motion even though i do believe a person can deny Christ at any time and loss their salvation so this OSAS is not really true at whole, but if a wise person has accepted the free gift of salvation or became multi rich why go back to being poor busted and disgusted.
So this is why i knwo a real born again Spirit filled christian will want to get baptized and do all that has to be done jsut because that same Jesus is in them as sons and daughter to do the will of God and remains in the Kingdom of God as righteous people before God.
BTW the reason why I use ritual is because the meaning means:
Definitions of ritual on the Web:
any customary observance or practice
www.cogsci.princeton.edu/cgi-bin/webwn
the prescribed procedure for conducting religious ceremonies
www.cogsci.princeton.edu/cgi-bin/webwn
stereotyped behavior
www.cogsci.princeton.edu/cgi-bin/webwn
of or relating to or characteristic of religious rituals; "ritual killing"
www.cogsci.princeton.edu/cgi-bin/webwn
of or relating to or employed in social rites or rituals; "a ritual dance of Haiti"; "sedate little colonial tribe with its ritual tea parties"- Nadine Gordimer
www.cogsci.princeton.edu/cgi-bin/webwn
An activity which bonds the organization together and is traditionally secretive.
www.student-affairs.buffalo.edu/greeklife/grdef.shtml
In Witch terms, the time period from the concecretion of the circle at the beginning, to the opening of the circle at the end, and everything in between. Rituals usually have certain associated rites that are performed as a part of ritual.
thecave.virtualave.net/glossary.html
— n. An occasion when an individual or a group uses traditional practices in order to focus energy for an identified purpose, such as healing, transformation, empowerment, protection, celebration, etc. The basic elements of a ritual in the Reclaiming Tradition are: grounding and purifying; casting the Circle; invocation of the Directions; invocation of the Deity (or Deities); Magical working; sharing food and drink; and opening the Circle.
www.reclaiming.org/about/glossary.html
the traditional ceremonies of a chapter which are usually secret.
www.westga.edu/~stuacts/greeks/greek_glossary.shtml
A book of prayers and ceremonies used in the administration of the sacraments and other ceremonial functions. In the Roman Rite, the standard book of this kind is the Roman Ritual.
www.osvpublishing.com/catholicalmanac/04c.asp
the ceremonies celebrated and conducted by every chapter; the secret rites to membership
www.wsu.edu/hdrl/Greek/GreekLife/Greek_Glossary.htm
Liturgical manual containing the prayers for the administration of all the sacraments except the Eucharist.
www.ceu.hu/medstud/manual/MMM/glossary.html
A ceremonial act or performance used to heighten commitment and deepen understanding.
www.bced.gov.bc.ca/irp/drama810/apf.htm
The ceremony by which an organization brings those who have met initiation requirements into full membership. The ritual expresses the founding principles upon which each organization was established and is to be used to determine the value of each activity the organization chooses to become involved in.
www.uca.edu/divisions/student/greeks/glossary.htm
A formal series of generally predetermined actions (both mental or physical) performed to harness and then direct magickal powers toward the accomplishment of the goal at hand. [For more information see
http://www.spiritonline.com/wicca/spellbook.html]
www.spiritonline.com/dictionary/r.html
The traditional beliefs and oaths of a sorority or fraternity usually used in reference to the Ceremonies of Initiation as well as weekly chapter meetings. These traditions do not include any forms of hazing, because hazing weakens the bonds of brotherhood / sisterhood, and undermines the common experience of the fraternity or sorority. Ritual does however, ensure that all members share a common experience across multiple campuses and generations.
watserv1.uwaterloo.ca/~fsac/glossary_of_greek_terms.htm
A traditional cultural practice, usually religious, involving precise movements, music, spoken text, and/or gestures, that serves to communicate with deities. Ritual is often incorporated into plays, either as conventions of the theatre or as specific dramatized actions.
highered.mcgraw-hill.com/sites/0767430077/student_view0/glossary.html
the traditional secret ceremony of a fraternity or sorority.
www2.evansville.edu/glifeweb/glossary.htm
the visible control of abstract thoughts. Tries to control unpredictable events and the supernatural. Tries to know the unknowable and change the unchangeable.
oregonstate.edu/dept/anthropology/glossary2.htm
the traditional ceremonies of an organization, usually secret.
umanitobanpc.tripod.com/glossary.htm
A set routine of gestures, movements, actions and thoughts performed for a many number of reasons. Magical Ritual has a basic outline of repeated words, gestures, thoughts and actions.
www.webeffects-aus.com/quicksilversmagic/glossary.html
A loose term which is often ascribed to any object or site whose exact purpose is unknown or uncertain. The term encompasses ideas such as ceremonial, magical, and religious
www.halifax-today.co.uk/specialfeatures/triviatrail/a22_r.html
A sacred system of ceremonial acts in observance and accordance of ones spirituality.
thewiccanabode.freewebsitehosting.com/glossary.htm
Formalized ceremonial behavior in which the members of a group or community regularly engage.
www.jdar.org/dico/dico/R.htm
The mode of performing a rite.
www.goodshepherd1.com/A_Simple_Church_Glossary.htm
An instrumental action dealing with death, that is also expressional and that may or may not be charged with symbolic content expressing, among other things, the attitudes of the participants and possible onlookers (passive participants) who may be regarded as co-beneficiaries.
www.accd.edu/sac/soci/gpimente/1370/Mort.htm
A named set of rites Usually intended to be performed together. See also essay on Ceremony and Information Systems.
bart.cba.nau.edu/~durham-j/glossary_closed_system.htm
So getting baptized is an outward ritual which other can see and is done in an traditonal order as such above.
Now if we are taliking about a Spiritual baptism which is with the heart then we are talking about the key and the main thing which connect us to salvation and the thing which join us into the new born life that makes us Holy and righteous , and is the key that make us one with God and has all the complete effects in God`s kingdom.
