Jesus is God.

Elia · Jul 5, 2016

marhig said:
Why are people finding it so hard to see that Christ was a spirit before he came into flesh and was called Jesus? God said in the beginning, let's make man in our image, he was talking to Christ.

Bs"d

No, God was talking to the angels.

Genesis 1:26; "Let us make man" If anybody finds in a text the word "us", would any normal person assume that it refers to one person with a multi-personality disorder? Of course not.

But why then, when Christians see the word "us" in the Bible, do they think that?

Gen 1:26 is used as a 'proof' that there is more than one God, or one God who is not one, eventhough the Bible clearly teaches that there is only one God who is one. and despite the fact that there are several other valid explanations for the plural word "us". One explanation is that it is a majestic plural as used by kings. Another possible explanation is that God was talking to the angels.

Some Christians try to refute the last argument by saying that the angels didn't create. They point to Genesis 1:1; "In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth." They say: 'God was the creator, and not the angels.' However, it is a given in Jewish law that an emissary is equal to the one who sends him. When a Jewish man marries a woman through an agent, the legal effect is the same as when he marries her personally. A good Biblical example of this is to be found in Genesis 19 where is spoken about the destruction of Sodom and Gomorrah. God sent two angels to destroy the cities, the angels said to Lot in verse 13: "For we are about to destroy this place, because the outcry against its people has become great before the LORD, and the LORD has sent us to destroy it." Upon this Lot says to his sons in law: "Up, get out of this place; for the LORD is about to destroy the city." Lot didn't say: "The angels are going to destroy the city" He said: "The LORD (Y-H-W-H in the Hebrew text) is going to destroy the city". And in verse 29 it is written: "So it was that, when God destroyed the cities of the valley...." So the angels were send by God to destroy the cities, but God is considered to be the one who did it, because He was the one who sent them. So why shouldn't the same hold true for the creation?

But one way or the other, no plural created man. Look in Genesis 5:1; "When God created man ..." In Hebrew this is: "bara Elohiem adam" Here the verb "to create", in Hebrew "bara", is in the singular, indicating clearly that Elohiem who created man is one. The same goes for the very first verse of the Bible: "In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth." The word created is here written in the singular; it says "bara". If God was a plural, it should have been "baru".

BUT, back to the pronouns, Y-H-W-H says the following:

Isaiah 44:6 “This is what Y-H-W-H says- Israel's King and Redeemer, Y-H-W-H Almighty: I am the first and I am the last; apart from me there is no God.”

It says "I" am Y-H-W-H. And, as we all know, "I" is singular, and not plural, and therefore no three persons in Y-H-W-H. Otherwise He would have said: "WE are Y-H-W-H."

But no such thing, God says: "I am Y-H-W-H".

No trinity.

Another example of a pronoun:

Nehemiah 9:6 “You alone are Y-H-W-H.”

As we see, it says that YOU, in the Hebrew singular, not plural are Y-H-W-H.

Again, no YOU, plural, are Y-H-W-H, but YOU singular, are Y-H-W-H.

So no three persons in God.

Another one:

Isaiah 44:6 “This is what Y-H-W-H says- Israel's King and Redeemer, Y-H-W-H Almighty: I am the first and I am the last; apart from me there is no God.”

Clear what? It doesn't say: “This is what Y-H-W-H says- Israel's King and Redeemer, Y-H-W-H Almighty: WE are the first and WE are the last; apart from US there is no God.”

No such a thing, it is all SINGULAR.

Another one:

Joel 2:27 “Then you will know that I am in Israel, that I am Y-H-W-H your God, and that there is no other;”

Again, God says: "I am Y-H-W-H", and not "WE are Y-H-W-H" Such a thing simply doesn't exist.

I can go on and on with this, but these examples suffice. There is NO plurality in God.

And the word "us" when God speaks to the angels, does not imply otherwise.

"O Y-H-W-H, my strength and my fortress, my refuge in the day of affliction, the Gentiles shall come to You from the ends of the earth and say, 'Surely our fathers have inherited lies, worthlessness and unprofitable things.' Will a man make gods for himself, which are not gods?"
Jeremiah 16:19

lifeisgood · Jul 5, 2016

Only for those who are really interested in finding out if the Trinity is found in the Old Testament:

The Trinity in the Old Testament
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BNt5NKSse0Y

"...From the time that it was (from the beginning was The Word), I was there, and now the Lord God (The Father) and His Spirit (The Holy Spirit) have sent Me (The Son)." (Isaiah 48:16)

What is more amazing is that the context of Isaiah 48 is a confrontation between God and the Harlot of Babylon (Lady of Kingdoms). This Harlot is definitely anti-Trinity.

Listen to Me, O Jacob, even Israel whom I called; I am He, I am the first, I am also the last. Surely My hand founded the earth, and My right hand spread out the heavens; When I call to them, they stand together. Assemble, all of you, and listen! Who among them has declared these things? [Yahweh] or the LORD loves him; he shall carry out His good pleasure on Babylon, and His arm shall be against the Chaldeans. I, even I, have spoken; indeed I have called him, I have brought him, and He will make his ways successful. Come near to Me, listen to this: From the first I have not spoken in secret, from the time it took place, I was there. And now the Lord GOD has sent Me, and His Spirit." Isaiah 48:12-16

lifeisgood · Jul 5, 2016

marhig said:
keypurr is right, there is only one God and his son Jesus Christ and Christ was a spirit and came into flesh as Jesus.

If you follow keypurr all of a sudden 'new revelation' coming from no where of a twice possessed lord, you're in trouble already. You, marhig, as keypurr, are denying the Deity of Jesus the Christ.

Are you, marhig, following this:
-keypurr believes that Jesus' body has TWO spirits at one time as keypurr claims that the "Christ spirit" did NOT possess the body of Jesus until Jesus' was water baptized.
-keypurr has never explained what happened to the spirit that inhabited the body of Jesus before Jesus’ body was possessed by the Christ spirit at his water baptism.
-keypurr has declared “Wrong, a created spirit did possess Jesus. That is how Christ took the form of man.”
-keypurr has declared that Luke was written much later after the facts, HOWEVER, keypurr believes Acts (written by the same author as Luke many years after the facts) — go figure.

If you, marhig, get Jesus wrong, it matters not what else you get right, you, marhig and keypurr, got Jesus wrong.

lifeisgood · Jul 5, 2016

Elia said:
Bs'd

“This is what Y-H-W-H says- Israel's King and Redeemer, Y-H-W-H Almighty: I am the first and I am the last; apart from me there is no god.” Isaiah 44:6

Amen!

"...From the time that it was (from the beginning was The Word), I was there, and now the Lord God (The Father) and His Spirit (The Holy Spirit) have sent Me (The Son)." (Isaiah 48:16)

What is more amazing is that the context of Isaiah 48 is a confrontation between God and the Harlot of Babylon (Lady of Kingdoms). This Harlot is definitely anti-Trinity.

Isaiah 48:12-16 - Listen to Me, O Jacob, even Israel whom I called; I am He, I am the first, I am also the last. Surely My hand founded the earth, and My right hand spread out the heavens; When I call to them, they stand together. Assemble, all of you, and listen! Who among them has declared these things? [Yahweh] or the LORD loves him; he shall carry out His good pleasure on Babylon, and His arm shall be against the Chaldeans. I, even I, have spoken; indeed I have called him, I have brought him, and He will make his ways successful. Come near to Me, listen to this: From the first I have not spoken in secret, from the time it took place, I was there. And now the Lord GOD has sent Me, and His Spirit."

marhig · Jul 5, 2016

lifeisgood said:
If you follow keypurr all of a sudden 'new revelation' coming from no where of a twice possessed lord, you're in trouble already. You, marhig, as keypurr, are denying the Deity of Jesus the Christ.

Are you, marhig, following this:
-keypurr believes that Jesus' body has TWO spirits at one time as keypurr claims that the "Christ spirit" did NOT possess the body of Jesus until Jesus' was water baptized.
-keypurr has never explained what happened to the spirit that inhabited the body of Jesus before Jesus’ body was possessed by the Christ spirit at his water baptism.
-keypurr has declared “Wrong, a created spirit did possess Jesus. That is how Christ took the form of man.”
-keypurr has declared that Luke was written much later after the facts, HOWEVER, keypurr believes Acts (written by the same author as Luke many years after the facts) — go figure.

If you, marhig, get Jesus wrong, it matters not what else you get right, you, marhig and keypurr, got Jesus wrong.

First of all, what do you mean by if i follow keypurr?

I believe that Jesus has always been the Christ, Paul said that Christ was in the prophets. But, I believe that Jesus was anointed of God. Christ means anointed one. And God anointed him with the holy spirit and I believe that he was born with the spirit because he was conceived by the spirit.

But, I have to believe the scriptures, and if Jesus said that God is his father and his God also, then I believe him and i then believe that he isn't God, why would Jesus call God my God if he wasn't his God? Also, the apostles said, God and our lord Jesus Christ, they didn't ever say our God Jesus Christ.

Or how about this, Ephesians 1

That the God of our Lord Jesus Christ, the Father of glory, may give unto you the spirit of wisdom and revelation in the knowledge of him:

1 Thessalonians 3

Now God himself and our Father, and our Lord Jesus Christ, direct our way unto you.”*

1 Thessalonians 1:3

Blessed*be*the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, who hath blessed us with all spiritual blessings in heavenly*places*in Christ

Jude 1

and denying the only Lord God, and our Lord Jesus Christ

1 Corinthians 15

But thanks*be*to God, which giveth us the victory through our Lord Jesus Christ

1 Peter 1-3

Blessed*be*the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ,

2 Thessalonians 3

Now our Lord Jesus Christ himself, and God, even our Father

Paul and the other apostles call God the God of our lord Jesus Christ. So why would I believe that Jesus is God, when the apostles and Jesus say that God is the God of Jesus?

But I believe that they are at one in heart mind and strength and Christ is in the image of God.

It says theres one God, and one mediator between God and man, Christ Jesus. And I believe the Bible. Jesus asked God to forgive those who crucified them, if he was God, he wouldn't have had to ask God to forgive them, he could have just forgiven them himself, and he commended his spirit into Gods hands, why? Why do this if he's God? I see that Jesus is Gods son but not God right through the new testament. I can't believe the same as others if I don't believe it to be the truth. And i don't tell you or anyone else that you have to agree with me, we all have freewill.

But I don't believe that Jesus was possessed with the Christ spirit, and I think possessed is the wrong word to use. I do believe that he was already the Christ and came from being a spirit, into human sinful flesh, to overcome Satan by denying him and not sinning, and overcoming the world, and to show us the way, to be a witness to the truth and he is the life and a perfect example for us to follow. He did was Adam couldn't do, as rejected Satan, right up until his last breath, and he was tempted in every way, but never sinned. And I believe that his spirit, once he died, went back to God, and God has set him at his right hand over everything and that Christ is in subjection to God. I believe the only way to God is through Christ Jesus, he is the way.

So I do agree with keypurr that Jesus isn't God, but I don't believe that he was possessed, but that Jesus was anointed by the spirit of God. So Christ was anointed by Gods spirit with power from God.

Acts 10:38

How God anointed Jesus of Nazareth with the Holy Ghost and with power:*

And God raised Christ from the dead.

Romans 8:11

But if the Spirit of him that raised up Jesus from the dead dwell in you, he that raised up Christ from the dead shall also quicken your mortal bodies by his Spirit that dwelleth in you.

So I believe that there is one Christ and one God, who is the father and God of Jesus Christ, as it says in the Bible.

marhig · Jul 5, 2016

Elia said:
Bs"d

No, God was talking to the angels.

Genesis 1:26; "Let us make man" If anybody finds in a text the word "us", would any normal person assume that it refers to one person with a multi-personality disorder? Of course not.

But why then, when Christians see the word "us" in the Bible, do they think that?

Gen 1:26 is used as a 'proof' that there is more than one God, or one God who is not one, eventhough the Bible clearly teaches that there is only one God who is one. and despite the fact that there are several other valid explanations for the plural word "us". One explanation is that it is a majestic plural as used by kings. Another possible explanation is that God was talking to the angels.

Some Christians try to refute the last argument by saying that the angels didn't create. They point to Genesis 1:1; "In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth." They say: 'God was the creator, and not the angels.' However, it is a given in Jewish law that an emissary is equal to the one who sends him. When a Jewish man marries a woman through an agent, the legal effect is the same as when he marries her personally. A good Biblical example of this is to be found in Genesis 19 where is spoken about the destruction of Sodom and Gomorrah. God sent two angels to destroy the cities, the angels said to Lot in verse 13: "For we are about to destroy this place, because the outcry against its people has become great before the LORD, and the LORD has sent us to destroy it." Upon this Lot says to his sons in law: "Up, get out of this place; for the LORD is about to destroy the city." Lot didn't say: "The angels are going to destroy the city" He said: "The LORD (Y-H-W-H in the Hebrew text) is going to destroy the city". And in verse 29 it is written: "So it was that, when God destroyed the cities of the valley...." So the angels were send by God to destroy the cities, but God is considered to be the one who did it, because He was the one who sent them. So why shouldn't the same hold true for the creation?

But one way or the other, no plural created man. Look in Genesis 5:1; "When God created man ..." In Hebrew this is: "bara Elohiem adam" Here the verb "to create", in Hebrew "bara", is in the singular, indicating clearly that Elohiem who created man is one. The same goes for the very first verse of the Bible: "In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth." The word created is here written in the singular; it says "bara". If God was a plural, it should have been "baru".

BUT, back to the pronouns, Y-H-W-H says the following:

Isaiah 44:6 “This is what Y-H-W-H says- Israel's King and Redeemer, Y-H-W-H Almighty: I am the first and I am the last; apart from me there is no God.”

It says "I" am Y-H-W-H. And, as we all know, "I" is singular, and not plural, and therefore no three persons in Y-H-W-H. Otherwise He would have said: "WE are Y-H-W-H."

But no such thing, God says: "I am Y-H-W-H".

No trinity.

Another example of a pronoun:

Nehemiah 9:6 “You alone are Y-H-W-H.”

As we see, it says that YOU, in the Hebrew singular, not plural are Y-H-W-H.

Again, no YOU, plural, are Y-H-W-H, but YOU singular, are Y-H-W-H.

So no three persons in God.

Another one:

Isaiah 44:6 “This is what Y-H-W-H says- Israel's King and Redeemer, Y-H-W-H Almighty: I am the first and I am the last; apart from me there is no God.”

Clear what? It doesn't say: “This is what Y-H-W-H says- Israel's King and Redeemer, Y-H-W-H Almighty: WE are the first and WE are the last; apart from US there is no God.”

No such a thing, it is all SINGULAR.

Another one:

Joel 2:27 “Then you will know that I am in Israel, that I am Y-H-W-H your God, and that there is no other;”

Again, God says: "I am Y-H-W-H", and not "WE are Y-H-W-H" Such a thing simply doesn't exist.

I can go on and on with this, but these examples suffice. There is NO plurality in God.

And the word "us" when God speaks to the angels, does not imply otherwise.

"O Y-H-W-H, my strength and my fortress, my refuge in the day of affliction, the Gentiles shall come to You from the ends of the earth and say, 'Surely our fathers have inherited lies, worthlessness and unprofitable things.' Will a man make gods for himself, which are not gods?"
Jeremiah 16:19

I absolutely agree with you, there is only one God, no trinity, no three in one, just one God. But I do believe that Jesus is the Christ the son of the living God, anointed by God.

And, although I believe that God was talking to Christ when he said let's make man in our image. I agree with you, the i believe the angels would be there too.

Bright Raven · Jul 5, 2016

marhig said:
I absolutely agree with you, there is only one God, no trinity, no three in one, just one God. But I do believe that Jesus is the Christ the son of the living God, anointed by God.

And, although I believe that God was talking to Christ when he said let's make man in our image. I agree with you, the i believe the angels would be there too.

Explain the following scriptures;

John 1:1 New King James Version (NKJV)

The Eternal Word
1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.

John 1:14 New King James Version (NKJV)

The Word Becomes Flesh
14 And the Word became flesh and dwelt among us, and we beheld His glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father, full of grace and truth.

Nihilo · Jul 5, 2016

Elia said:
[QUOTE="Nihilo, post: 0"]The Trinity is One.
The Trinity is One.[/quot]

Bs"d

Wrong. The trinity is THREE in one.

No, you're wrong. The Trinity is One. I know the Trinity better than you. Just accept it.

Or, continue being a faithless mental midget. Your choice.

Elia said:
Lie.

No, true. I know the Trinity better than you.

Elia said:
"Woe to those who call evil good and good evil,
who put darkness for light and light for darkness,
who put bitter for sweet and sweet for bitter."
Isaiah 5:20

:spam:

Elia said:
WOE TO THOSE WHO CALL THREE ONE AND ONE THREE!!

Made up.

Caino · Jul 5, 2016

Judaism didn't have a Trinity or a Son of God, they only had One God, Yahweh. Jesus, as a divine being coming down from heaven, was a new revelation, his Jewish and later Gentile followers subsiquently forced him into OT writings.

lifeisgood · Jul 5, 2016

Elia said:
Bs"d

Then you have 2 gods.

You don't even agree with your Holy Writ:

"...From the time that it was (from the beginning was The Word), I was there, and now the Lord God (The Father) and His Spirit (The Holy Spirit) have sent Me (The Son)." (Isaiah 48:16)

What is more amazing is that the context of Isaiah 48 is a confrontation between God and the Harlot of Babylon (Lady of Kingdoms). This Harlot is definitely anti-Trinity.

Listen to Me, O Jacob, even Israel whom I called; I am He, I am the first, I am also the last. Surely My hand founded the earth, and My right hand spread out the heavens; When I call to them, they stand together. Assemble, all of you, and listen! Who among them has declared these things? [Yahweh] or the LORD loves him; he shall carry out His good pleasure on Babylon, and His arm shall be against the Chaldeans. I, even I, have spoken; indeed I have called him, I have brought him, and He will make his ways successful. Come near to Me, listen to this: From the first I have not spoken in secret, from the time it took place, I was there. And now the Lord GOD has sent Me, and His Spirit." Isaiah 48:12-16

lifeisgood · Jul 5, 2016

keypurr said:
Sorry my friend but I see the Trinity as false theory.

Sent from my SM-T330NU using TheologyOnline mobile app

So, you deny the Trinity (Father, Son, Holy Spirit). Got it.

keypurr · Jul 5, 2016

lifeisgood said:
So, you deny the Trinity (Father, Son, Holy Spirit). Got it.

BINGO

Sent from my A622GL using TheologyOnline mobile app

6days · Jul 5, 2016

keypurr said:
John 1. ...word was a god.

No wonder you reject so much scripture. You rely on the heretical NWT translation. The JW's translated scripture to fit their doctrine, rather than forming doctrine from scripture.

The JW translation is the only one who won't reveal who the translators were or their qualifications.
EVERY major translation other than the denominational JW bible has teams of translators...They reveal who the team was.
Jesus was not a god... Scripture tells us there is only one God.
And scripture refers to Jesus as God.
Parallel Verses

New International Version
In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.

New Living Translation
In the beginning the Word already existed. The Word was with God, and the Word was God.

English Standard Version
In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.

Berean Study Bible
In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.

Berean Literal Bible
In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.

New American Standard Bible
In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.

King James Bible
In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.

Holman Christian Standard Bible
In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.

International Standard Version
In the beginning, the Word existed. The Word was with God, and the Word was God.

NET Bible
In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was fully God.

Aramaic Bible in Plain English
In the origin The Word had been existing and That Word had been existing with God and That Word was himself God.

GOD'S WORD® Translation
In the beginning the Word already existed. The Word was with God, and the Word was God.

New American Standard 1977
In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.

Jubilee Bible 2000
In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with the God, and the Word was God.

King James 2000 Bible
In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.

American King James Version
In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.

American Standard Version
In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.

Douay-Rheims Bible
IN the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.

Darby Bible Translation
In [the] beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.

English Revised Version
In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.

Webster's Bible Translation
In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.

Weymouth New Testament
In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.

World English Bible
In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.

Young's Literal Translation

Keypurr..... Do you notice the pattern in all reliable translations...Jesus is God.

In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God;

6days · Jul 5, 2016

keypurr said:
Consider friend that Christ existed many years before Jesus did. There was the spirit son, Christ, before there was a world for the world was made through him. He was in the world and they knew him not.

You seem to create your own scripture and your own phrases in order to reject what God tells us. Christ existed before anything was created, both in Heaven and earth. Christ is not a created being. As much as you want to prove scripture wrong.... God the Father calls the Son, "God" in Heb. 1:8 In scripture, both God the Father and God the Son are referred to as "LORD". Christians have One Lord.

keypurr · Jul 5, 2016

6days said:
No wonder you reject so much scripture. You rely on the heretical NWT translation. The JW's translated scripture to fit their doctrine, rather than forming doctrine from scripture.

The JW translation is the only one who won't reveal who the translators were or their qualifications.
EVERY major translation other than the denominational JW bible has teams of translators...They reveal who the team was.
Jesus was not a god... Scripture tells us there is only one God.
And scripture refers to Jesus as God.
Parallel Verses

New International Version
In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.

New Living Translation
In the beginning the Word already existed. The Word was with God, and the Word was God.

English Standard Version
In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.

Berean Study Bible
In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.

Berean Literal Bible
In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.

New American Standard Bible
In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.

King James Bible
In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.

Holman Christian Standard Bible
In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.

International Standard Version
In the beginning, the Word existed. The Word was with God, and the Word was God.

NET Bible
In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was fully God.

Aramaic Bible in Plain English
In the origin The Word had been existing and That Word had been existing with God and That Word was himself God.

GOD'S WORD® Translation
In the beginning the Word already existed. The Word was with God, and the Word was God.

New American Standard 1977
In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.

Jubilee Bible 2000
In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with the God, and the Word was God.

King James 2000 Bible
In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.

American King James Version
In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.

American Standard Version
In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.

Douay-Rheims Bible
IN the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.

Darby Bible Translation
In [the] beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.

English Revised Version
In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.

Webster's Bible Translation
In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.

Weymouth New Testament
In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.

World English Bible
In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.

Young's Literal Translation

Keypurr..... Do you notice the pattern in all reliable translations...Jesus is God.

In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God;

Yep, and only the JWS got it right.

My opinion was formulated many years ago, before there was a JW Bible. I sat for many hours discussing this with a pastor who held a Phd. He was no match for scriptures. I fought it myself for I believed that Christ was God. When I left the church I paid a heavy price but I had to do it.

Sent from my SM-T330NU using TheologyOnline mobile app

6days · Jul 6, 2016

keypurr said:
Yep, and only the JWS got it right.

My opinion was formulated many years ago, before there was a JW Bible. I sat for many hours discussing this with a pastor who held a Phd. He was no match for scriptures. I fought it myself for I believed that Christ was God. When I left the church I paid a heavy price but I had to do it.

Sent from my SM-T330NU using TheologyOnline mobile app

Your belief system is heretical Keypurr. You continually distort scripture to fit your doctrine.
The JW's paraphrase of John 1:1 is not a translation. Its an addition to scripture meant to fit the JW belief system.
And again you did not answer (Or try explain away) Col. 1:15 which tells us that Christ is not created. You did not yet try explain away Heb. 1:8

Elia · Jul 6, 2016

Nihilo said:
No, you're wrong. The Trinity is One. I know the Trinity better than you. Just accept it.

Bs"d

I accept what the Torah teaches me, and that is that God is one.

NOWHERE is it written that God is a trinity. It's a lie made up by men. No way I'll ever accept that.

One is one and three is three. Three is not one, and one is not three.

1 + 1 + 2, and not 1.

So if you have a "God the Father", and a "god the son", then you have TWO (2) gods, and not one.

Therefore the Christians are polytheists and idol worshippers.

"O Y-H-W-H, my strength and my fortress, my refuge in the day of affliction, the Gentiles shall come to You from the ends of the earth and say, 'Surely our fathers have inherited lies, worthlessness and unprofitable things.' Will a man make gods for himself, which are not gods?"
Jeremiah 16:19

keypurr · Jul 6, 2016

6days said:
What is it you disagree with...the titles of Jesus; or the verse which tells us He created everything including heaven and the angels? (Angels who worship Him)

The answer is found throughout scripture and also found within the chapter you ask about. " But unto the Son he saith, Thy throne, O God, is for ever and ever"

Heb 1:8 But unto the Son he saith, Thy throne, O God, is for ever and ever: a sceptre of righteousness is the sceptre of thy kingdom.

Define what does O God mean?

Heb 1:9 Thou hast loved righteousness, and hated iniquity; therefore God, even thy God, hath anointed thee with the oil of gladness above thy fellows.

Notice: God, thy God. Christ has a God. How many Gods are there?

keypurr · Jul 6, 2016

6days said:
You seem to create your own scripture and your own phrases in order to reject what God tells us. Christ existed before anything was created, both in Heaven and earth. Christ is not a created being. As much as you want to prove scripture wrong.... God the Father calls the Son, "God" in Heb. 1:8 In scripture, both God the Father and God the Son are referred to as "LORD". Christians have One Lord.

You do not see the tree because of the forest.

Christ is the exact IMAGE of the Father.

Name any IMAGE that is not created.

Name any true God that can die.

Good luck on those friend.

keypurr · Jul 6, 2016

6days said:
Your belief system is heretical Keypurr. You continually distort scripture to fit your doctrine.
The JW's paraphrase of John 1:1 is not a translation. Its an addition to scripture meant to fit the JW belief system.
And again you did not answer (Or try explain away) Col. 1:15 which tells us that Christ is not created. You did not yet try explain away Heb. 1:8

Show me in Heb 1:8 and Col 1:15 where the son is not a creation.

Without assuming.

Jesus is God.

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