Messiah came in the first century AD according to the Book of Daniel

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Ben Masada

New member
beameup said:
Jesus' ministry to Israel:
The "Gospel of Jesus", as you call it, was presented to Israel. If you want to find out what you "missed out" on (ie: Millennial Kingdom) read various parts of Matthew, Mark, Luke & John. Read Acts 3:13-21.
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The gospel of Jesus was the Tanach and it was presented to Israel even before Jesus was born. But that's okay. Jesus came to confirm it down to the letter. (Mat. 5:17-19) Now, regarding what I have missed in your opinion, the "Millennial Kingdom" is not to be found in the NT but in the Torah if you read Exodus 19:5,6.
 
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Ben Masada

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Epoisses said:
But thou, O Daniel, shut up the words, and seal the book, even to the time of the end: many shall run to and fro, and knowledge shall be increased. Dan. 12:4 One of the markers of the time of the end is that knowledge will be increased. The internet is the single biggest increase in knowledge the world has ever seen. Google can tell me more than all the books in all the libraries of the whole world.
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Yes, that's when Daniel shut up the words and sealed the book, even to the time of the end of the exile when the Jewish People would enter the New World Order and participated themselves with the huge increase of knowledge. That was the end of prophecy as Daniel was concerned.
 
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beameup

beameup

New member
Ben Masada said:
The gospel of Jesus was the Tanach and it was presented to Israel even before Jesus was born. But that's okay. Jesus came to confirm it down to the letter. (Mat. 5:17-19) Now, regarding what I have missed in your opinion, the "Millennial Kingdom" is not to be found in the NT but in the Torah if you read Exodus 19:5,6.
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Exodus 19:5-6 was the ministry of John the Baptist. Baptism (ceremonial washing) was the necessary step in entering the Priesthood. However, it is the New Testament that reveals that the Priesthood of all those serving Messiah in Israel during the Millennium will be after The Order of Melchizedek (except for the Levitical Priests in Jerusalem, serving in the Temple).
FYI, the Millennium is found in Revelation.
 
keypurr

keypurr

Well-known member
Ben Masada said:
Yes, that's when Daniel shut up the words and sealed the book, even to the time of the end of the exile when
the Jewish People would enter the New World Order and participated themselves with the huge increase of knowledge. That was the end of prophecy as Daniel was concerned.
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The time of the end is the time of the END, not the time of the end of the exile friend.
 
beameup

beameup

New member
Ben Masada said:
Unfortunately, you are using a Jew to teach a Christian doctrine and this is akin to vandalism of Judaism which was the Faith of Jesus. I do not reject God's grace because I am aware that God has given us His Law as a result of His grace so that we be able to live in society. So, nothing will happen to me for rejecting the grace taught by Paul. Now, I don't know about you for teaching against the gospel of Jesus and in favor of the gospel of Paul.
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Obedience to the Law of Moses will not elevate you to have a close relationship with God like Adam had. God is Holy and so he sent his Son to die for your sins, so that you could receive redemption if you look to Him (Messiah) and confess you are sinful (like Moses raised up the serpent in the wilderness, the Son had to be "raised up" on wood). Unless God declares you Holy, you will be abhorrent to Him and He will be abhorrent to you after the resurrection when you stand before YHWH.
 
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Ben Masada

New member
beameup said:
Obedience to the Law of Moses will not elevate you to have a close relationship with God like Adam had. God is Holy and so he sent his Son to die for your sins, so that you could receive redemption if you look to Him (Messiah) and confess you are sinful (like Moses raised up the serpent in the wilderness, the Son had to be "raised up" on wood). Unless God declares you Holy, you will be abhorrent to Him and He will be abhorrent to you after the resurrection when you stand before YHWH.
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Why do you insist in resurrection when I have given you quotes from the Tanach that once dead no one will ever return from the grave? Is that because you consider Paul to have been more important than Jesus or the Prophets of the Most High? (2 Samuel 12:23; Isaiah 26:14; Job 7:9) Read 2 Timothy 2:8 "Jesus resurrected according to the gospel of Paul. Paul fabricated that idea. I see you are very gullible as the gospel of Paul is concern but very stiff-necked as the gospel of Jesus is concerned. Why? I though Jesus was more important than Paul.
 
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Ben Masada

New member
keypurr said:
The time of the end is the time of the END, not the time of the end of the exile friend.
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If your "time of the end" was absolutely the "time of the end" why then nothing has ended? The world remains in existence as at the time of Daniel and of Jesus. What did end then? What do you still have in mind about Jewish affairs that came to an end and you don't find it to be in tune with Christian preconceived notions?
 
keypurr

keypurr

Well-known member
Ben Masada said:
If your "time of the end" was absolutely the "time of the end" why then nothing has ended? The world remains in existence as at the time of Daniel and of Jesus. What did end then? What do you still have in mind about Jewish affairs that came to an end that is not in tune with Christian preconceived notions?
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The time of the end is yet to come Ben.

Sent from my A622GL using TheologyOnline mobile app
 
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Ben Masada

New member
beameup said:
Exodus 19:5-6 was the ministry of John the Baptist. Baptism (ceremonial washing) was the necessary step in entering the Priesthood. However, it is the New Testament that reveals that the Priesthood of all those serving Messiah in Israel during the Millennium will be after The Order of Melchizedek. (except for the Levitical Priests in Jerusalem, serving in the Temple). FYI, the Millennium is found in Revelation.
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See what I mean? A Jew is talking to you about a Jewish text in the Jewish Torah and you, a Christian finds too hard to accept because it doesn't go according to Christian preconceived notions. Beameup, read once more the text I quoted of Exodus 19:5,6. At the end of the text, the explanation is more than clear that, "These are the words that you shall speak to the children of Israel." Nothing at all to do with John the Baptism. It won't help you to stick to the Pauline policy of Replacement Theology.
 
B

Ben Masada

New member
beameup said:
Obedience to the Law of Moses will not elevate you to have a close relationship with God like Adam had. God is Holy and so he sent his Son to die for your sins, so that you could receive redemption if you look to Him (Messiah) and confess you are sinful (like Moses raised up the serpent in the wilderness, the Son had to be "raised up" on wood). Unless God declares you Holy, you will be abhorrent to Him and He will be abhorrent to you after the resurrection when you stand before YHWH.
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So, why did Jesus teach to listen to "Moses" aka the Law? Because the Decalogue had not come to an end as Paul claimed that Jesus had been the end of the Law. (Rom. 10:4)

Yes, God is Holy and not messed up to send someone to die for our sins and then instruct His Prophets that no one can die for the sins of another. (Jer. 31:30; Ezek. 18:20) What was happening up there!

Raise up on a wood! Jesus was not the only Jew to be raised up on a wood; thousands of Jews were crucified by the Romans only in the First Century if you want to read Josephus' "War of the Jews."
 
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daqq

Well-known member
beameup said:
Sure you can learn vast amounts of superfluous information that is unnecessary to build a basic timeline.

Born 6 B.C. - Maji visit @ 2yrs old 4 B.C. - Herod begins to kill boys under 2yrs to protect his throne, Joseph warned to flee to Egypt 4 B.C. - Joseph returns after the death of Herod and moves to Nazareth.
Jesus achieves age 30 in 25 A.D. and enters ministry which lasts 3 1/2 years.
Now, using Daniel you can start at the date of Artaxerxes proclamation and go forward 483 years to find the date that Messiah will present himself in Jerusalem as the King (ie: Palm Sunday).
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The problem is that you appear not to care one iota about how much contradiction your theory creates with other Gospel writers and texts. You clearly have not taken the time to even look at the difficulties and complications already present between the infancy narratives of Matthew and Luke before having embarked onto your own tangent, (which only exacerbates the already existing complications). So then, that being the case, no wonder you care nothing about the fact that Luke places the birth of Yeshua at the time of the census of Quirinius some nine or ten years after your theoretical dates of 6-4BC, (which was already mentioned to you). Everyone knows the census of Quirinius occurred in 6-7AD and this was what gave rise to the tax rebellion with Judas the Galilean being one of the early Messiah wannabes. The same event is mentioned yet again, in Acts 5:37, which specifically names Judas the Galilean along with the taxing or census, ("apographe" is used in both cases by "Luke" so the facts are inescapable). There is no doubt about what Luke says and there is no doubt that your dateline and numbers game is incorrect. Additionally there is no physical evidence whatsoever for any of the so-called decree of Artaxerxes, Nehemiah, or Ezra, (neither the so-called Ezra decree of 458-457BC nor the so-called Artaxerxes Longimanus decree of 445-444BC). There is no cylinder, tablet, inscription, parchment, papyrus, or imperial document of any kind having been dated anywhere near any of those supposed dates of decrees. Those dates are nothing more than hypothetical dates extracted from assumptions from the Biblical text by people who do not have a clue what they are reading because they completely ignore Josephus and the chronology clearly laid out in Ezra 4 when it comes to these things and their own pet date setting and numerical prophecy theories.
 
beameup

beameup

New member
Ben Masada said:
Why do you insist in resurrection when I have given you quotes from the Tanach that once dead no one will ever return from the grave? Is that because you consider Paul to have been more important than Jesus or the Prophets of the Most High? (2 Samuel 12:23; Isaiah 26:14; Job 7:9) Read 2 Timothy 2:8 "Jesus resurrected according to the gospel of Paul. Paul fabricated that idea. I see you are very gullible as the gospel of Paul is concern but very stiff-necked as the gospel of Jesus is concerned. Why? I though Jesus was more important than Paul.
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Jesus' message was to you Jews. Instead of repenting and entering into your Millennium, you rejected Messiah and chose to remain in your abhorrent sinfulness.
Therefore, the stoning of Stephen in Acts 7 was the "last-straw" in God's eyes, and YHWH Messiah appeared to Saul/Paul to take the message of God's LOVE directly to the Gentiles. And the message of Paul was not the "albatross around the neck" of the 613 "commandments" plus a multitude of other man-made "commandments".

For I [Job] know that my redeemer liveth, and that he shall stand at the latter day upon the earth: Job 19:25
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The ancient "fathers" knew God, obeyed God, and had a relationship with God. They knew that they would be resurrected. Abraham was confident that if he slew Isaac that God would raise him up again.

I believe your "god" is a puny god that seems to have very limited power and ability.
 
beameup

beameup

New member
Ben Masada said:
See what I mean? A Jew is talking to you about a Jewish text in the Jewish Torah and you, a Christian finds too hard to accept because it doesn't go according to Christian preconceived notions. Beameup, read once more the text I quoted of Exodus 19:5,6. At the end of the text, the explanation is more than clear that, "These are the words that you shall speak to the children of Israel." Nothing at all to do with John the Baptism. It won't help you to stick to the Pauline policy of Replacement Theology.
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You have missing "pieces" in the Bible as you reject the New Testament. John the Baptist was a "forerunner" to Messiah, preparing the way by "preparing the hearts" of Jews through repentance. John the Baptist performed the same function that Elijah will perform, calling for national repentance. Israel will be given a "second chance" to prepare for the return of Yeshua Messiah.
Behold, I will send you Elijah the prophet before the coming of the great and dreadful day of the LORD: And he shall turn the heart of the fathers to the children, and the heart of the children to their fathers, lest I come and smite the earth with a curse. Malachi 4:5-6
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Following the return of Yeshua Messiah, all Israel will be saved and enter into the Glorious Kingdom and the "restoration of all things" as promised.
 
beameup

beameup

New member
daqq said:
The problem is that you appear not to care one iota about how much contradiction your theory creates with other Gospel writers and texts.
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It's much too simple I guess. :bang:
Herod the Great died in 4 B.C. Prior to his death, he sought to kill the male children.
After his death it was safe for the family to leave Egypt and to return to Israel.
 
B

Ben Masada

New member
beameup said:
You have missing "pieces" in the Bible as you reject the New Testament. John the Baptist was a "forerunner" to Messiah, preparing the way by "preparing the hearts" of Jews through repentance. John the Baptist performed the same function that Elijah will perform, calling for national repentance. Israel will be given a "second chance" to prepare for the return of Yeshua Messiah.

Following the return of Yeshua Messiah, all Israel will be saved and enter into the Glorious Kingdom and the "restoration of all things" as promised.
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Again, the reference here is to the Messiah according to the collective concept, not individual. Jesus could not have been the Messiah and, the best evidence is that he died. The Messiah is not supposed to die but to remain as a People before the Lord forever. (Jer. 31:36) The individual is born, lives his span of life and dies. Are we supposed to expect a new Messiah in every generation? Obviously not. Now, as the people is concerned, "The Lord goes forth to save His People; to save His Anointed One."(Habakkuk 3:13) That's what the Messiah is, the Anointed one of the Lord aka the Jewish People.
 
Elia

Elia

Well-known member
beameup said:
Obedience to the Law of Moses will not elevate you to have a close relationship with God like Adam had.
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Bs"d

Every commandment of God, fulfilled by man, will lift man up.

Throwing God's laws overboard, and replacing them with paganism, and worshipping a dead carpenter in stead of God, will turn man into a lawless idolatrous pagan.


"Serve Y-H-W-H! And if it seems evil to you to serve Y-H-W-H, choose for yourselves this day whom you will serve, whether the gods which your fathers served that were on the other side of the River, or the gods of the Amorites, in whose land you dwell.
But as for me and my house, we will serve Y-H-W-H!”
Joshua 24:14-15
 
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