Hall of Fame inductees ~12-20-2003

Bob Enyart

Bob Enyart

Deceased
Staff member
Administrator
Z Man: "BTW, I hope you're not as biased in picking out these threads as you are with the POTD. It seems that I can't achieve the great POTD title because I believe in predestination. Is that true mister? "

If predestination is true, then of course you're complaining to the wrong administrator.

If predestination is not true, then of course your complaining is wrong.

Any questions?

And to Freak: In Chicago they've announced they're going to exorcise that baseball that lost the Cubs the playoffs. Just an FYI in case you want to apply.

-Bob Enyart
 
Freak

Freak

New member
Originally posted by Bob Enyart
And to Freak: In Chicago they've announced they're going to exorcise that baseball that lost the Cubs the playoffs.
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That's interesting.

Just an FYI in case you want to apply.

-Bob Enyart
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I have my hands full dealing with people who are tormented by demons.

As soon as they left the synagogue, they went with James and John to the home of Simon and Andrew. Simon's mother-in-law was in bed with a fever, and they told Jesus about her. So he went to her, took her hand and helped her up. The fever left her and she began to wait on them.
That evening after sunset the people brought to Jesus all the sick and demon-possessed. The whole town gathered at the door, and Jesus healed many who had various diseases. He also drove out many demons...

The need for Jesus is great. I'll pass on dealing with the object (the baseball). Humanity is much more important to God. :up:
 
Z Man

Z Man

New member
Bob,

If freewill is right, then you don't need Christ.

If freewill is wrong, then of course you're wrong.

Any questions?
 
BillyBob

BillyBob

BANNED
Banned
If freewill is wrong, then all the evangelism in world won't make one bit of difference, in which case, let's close the churches and fire the Pastors.

If predestination is correct, then some people are born destined to hell, no matter what, in which case, let's close the churches and fire the pastors.

PREDESTINATION IS INSANE!
 
Z Man

Z Man

New member
BTW,

Why is it everytime that I post on a thread, no matter what the subject is, somebody always wants to debate with me about predestination? What gives? Aren't there other "calvinists" you guys can pester?
 
Servo

Servo

Formerly Shimei!
LIFETIME MEMBER
Originally posted by Freak
Yep, it sure is. All one has to do is take a peek at Ephesians 1.
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Just because the word "predestined " is mentioned does not mean everything is predestined. Read the chapter in context. Paul is writing to the saints who are in Ephesus, people who are already "saved".

The Lord predestined us to win in the end.
 
Servo

Servo

Formerly Shimei!
LIFETIME MEMBER
Originally posted by Freak
I can see that you're still on milk.

Now that's a deep statement. :rolleyes:
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A few things are predestined Freak, but God do not predestine everything.

Freak, you should try some milk, but it seems you are lactose intolerant.
 
CryTears

CryTears

BANNED
Banned
Originally posted by Shimei
A few things are predestined Freak, but God do not predestine everything.

Freak, you should try some milk, but it seems you are lactose intolerant.
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LOL I like you both but ya got to admit Freak this was funny.
 
Nathon Detroit

Nathon Detroit

LIFETIME MEMBER
LIFETIME MEMBER
Originally posted by Z Man
Bob,

If freewill is right, then you don't need Christ.

If freewill is wrong, then of course you're wrong.

Any questions?
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Huh? :confused:

Z Man.... when making a "come back" try to make a "come back" that makes sense.

Having freewill doesn't mean having the freewill to get into heaven on your own accord without Christ or the freewill to force your way into heaven as an unrepentant sinner no more than freewill would mean having the freewill to defy gravity.

Therefore... your comment to Bob doesn't even address the argument in a way that is accurate to either side of the debate.

Better luck next time. :up:
 
Z Man

Z Man

New member
Originally posted by Knight
Having freewill doesn't mean having the freewill to get into heaven on your own accord without Christ or the freewill to force your way into heaven as an unrepentant sinner no more than freewill would mean having the freewill to defy gravity.
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If you have the freedom to choose or reject Christ, then you have the kind of freedom it takes to defy sin. That freedom doesn't exist. The Bible makes it clear that we are slaves to sin. We do what our nature tells us to do; sin. And after God saves us, we then become slaves to Him and righteousness. So, free will doesn't exist either way. It can't because we are slaves either to sin or Christ.
 
Servo

Servo

Formerly Shimei!
LIFETIME MEMBER
Originally posted by Z Man
If you have the freedom to choose or reject Christ, then you have the kind of freedom it takes to defy sin. That freedom doesn't exist. The Bible makes it clear that we are slaves to sin. We do what our nature tells us to do; sin. And after God saves us, we then become slaves to Him and righteousness. So, free will doesn't exist either way. It can't because we are slaves either to sin or Christ.
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Then it seems to me that we are more like programmed robots, not slaves. Even a slave can make an attempt to run away and be free.
 
Z Man

Z Man

New member
Originally posted by Shimei
Even a slave can make an attempt to run away and be free.
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Do you know of anybody who has the power, or the desire, to defeat sin on their own? No one on earth is born loving God, or wanting to be holy and blameless in His sight. All men are sinful and continually have evil thoughts in their hearts and minds.

The only way anybody ever has any hope of being freed from sin is if God saves them. That's what the whole Gospel message is about!
 
Servo

Servo

Formerly Shimei!
LIFETIME MEMBER
Originally posted by Z Man
Do you know of anybody who has the power, or the desire, to defeat sin on their own? No one on earth is born loving God, or wanting to be holy and blameless in His sight. All men are sinful and continually have evil thoughts in their hearts and minds.

The only way anybody ever has any hope of being freed from sin is if God saves them. That's what the whole Gospel message is about!
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I know that Jesus is the only way and that He can save us and forgive us for our sins. But we all have a choice in the matter. We are not forced to love and choose God. Forced love is not love.
 
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