The Heretics Message to the World:Be Baptized to be Saved! (HOF thread)
- Thread starter Freak
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PaladInChrist
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Baptism is spiritual, not just water.
JustAChristian
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The Bible Says Baptism Is Essential To Salvation
The Bible Says Baptism Is Essential To Salvation
Man can not be saved by faith without accepting baptism for the remission of sins. Any statement concerning salvation is conditioned on commands which originated in the mind of God. Scriptural baptism is a statement concerning salvation and is a commanded operation of God which originated in the mind of God; therefore among all statements concerning salvation is scriptural baptism and by virtue of originating from the mind of God, and not from the mind of man, is essential to our salvation in that a failure to comply with this simple act clearly demonstrates a lack of faith in His promises. Be baptized for the remission of sin for the is God's duty for man (Mark 16:16; Acts 2:38).
JustAChristian
Matthew 28:19 Go ye therefore, and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost:
Acts 2:38 Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.
Acts 2:41 Then they that gladly received his word were baptized: and the same day there were added unto them about three thousand souls.
Acts 8:36 And as they went on their way, they came unto a certain water: and the eunuch said, See, here is water; what doth hinder me to be baptized?
Acts 8:37 And Philip said, If thou believest with all thine heart, thou mayest. And he answered and said, I believe that Jesus Christ is the Son of God.
Acts 8:38 And he commanded the chariot to stand still: and they went down both into the water, both Philip and the eunuch; and he baptized him.
Acts 8:39 And when they were come up out of the water, the Spirit of the Lord caught away Philip, that the eunuch saw him no more: and he went on his way rejoicing.
Acts 22:16 And now why tarriest thou? arise, and be baptized, and wash away thy sins, calling on the name of the Lord.
Titus 3:5 Not by works of righteousness which we have done, but according to his mercy he saved us, by the washing of regeneration, and renewing of the Holy Ghost;
Galatians 3:27 For as many of you as have been baptized into Christ have put on Christ.
1 Peter 3:21 The like figure whereunto even baptism doth also now save us (not the putting away of the filth of the flesh, but the answer of a good conscience toward God,) by the resurrection of Jesus Christ:
The Bible Says Baptism Is Essential To Salvation
Man can not be saved by faith without accepting baptism for the remission of sins. Any statement concerning salvation is conditioned on commands which originated in the mind of God. Scriptural baptism is a statement concerning salvation and is a commanded operation of God which originated in the mind of God; therefore among all statements concerning salvation is scriptural baptism and by virtue of originating from the mind of God, and not from the mind of man, is essential to our salvation in that a failure to comply with this simple act clearly demonstrates a lack of faith in His promises. Be baptized for the remission of sin for the is God's duty for man (Mark 16:16; Acts 2:38).
JustAChristian
Matthew 28:19 Go ye therefore, and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost:
Acts 2:38 Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.
Acts 2:41 Then they that gladly received his word were baptized: and the same day there were added unto them about three thousand souls.
Acts 8:36 And as they went on their way, they came unto a certain water: and the eunuch said, See, here is water; what doth hinder me to be baptized?
Acts 8:37 And Philip said, If thou believest with all thine heart, thou mayest. And he answered and said, I believe that Jesus Christ is the Son of God.
Acts 8:38 And he commanded the chariot to stand still: and they went down both into the water, both Philip and the eunuch; and he baptized him.
Acts 8:39 And when they were come up out of the water, the Spirit of the Lord caught away Philip, that the eunuch saw him no more: and he went on his way rejoicing.
Acts 22:16 And now why tarriest thou? arise, and be baptized, and wash away thy sins, calling on the name of the Lord.
Titus 3:5 Not by works of righteousness which we have done, but according to his mercy he saved us, by the washing of regeneration, and renewing of the Holy Ghost;
Galatians 3:27 For as many of you as have been baptized into Christ have put on Christ.
1 Peter 3:21 The like figure whereunto even baptism doth also now save us (not the putting away of the filth of the flesh, but the answer of a good conscience toward God,) by the resurrection of Jesus Christ:
PaladInChrist
New member
JustAChristian is correct.
PaladInChrist
New member
I do not trust the water, I trust Jesus, and Jesus told us to be baptized. I am going to trust him, not you.
JustAChristian
New member
How?
How?
How can you trust the Creator who tells you to be immersed for the remission of sins? You curse the very commands that He gives you. You do not want to look to the spiritual side of baptism because you are afraid of what you will find. The commandments of God through Christ stand before you. Christ's word will judge you in the last day (John 12:48). The same word that tells you to be spiritually cleansed of sins with a union of the blood of Christ in the pool of water (Acts 22:16). You look for a reason, but I look in faith to the commandment. That will make all the difference.
JustAChristian :angel:
___________________________________
Hold fast the form of sound words, which thou hast heard of me, in faith and love which is in Christ Jesus. (2 Timothy 1:13)
How?
How can you trust the Creator who tells you to be immersed for the remission of sins? You curse the very commands that He gives you. You do not want to look to the spiritual side of baptism because you are afraid of what you will find. The commandments of God through Christ stand before you. Christ's word will judge you in the last day (John 12:48). The same word that tells you to be spiritually cleansed of sins with a union of the blood of Christ in the pool of water (Acts 22:16). You look for a reason, but I look in faith to the commandment. That will make all the difference.
JustAChristian :angel:
___________________________________
Hold fast the form of sound words, which thou hast heard of me, in faith and love which is in Christ Jesus. (2 Timothy 1:13)
JustAChristian
New member
Re: Re: How?
Re: Re: How?
I look to the water because that is where the spiritual cleansing blood of Christ will be found. Prove me wrong and I have no case.
JustAChristian :angel:
Re: Re: How?
I look to the water because that is where the spiritual cleansing blood of Christ will be found. Prove me wrong and I have no case.
JustAChristian :angel:
Freak
New member
Re: Re: Re: How?
Re: Re: Re: How?
That's your problem looking to water. The Bible says to:
Let us fix our eyes on Jesus, the author and perfecter of our faith, who for the joy set before him endured the cross, scorning its shame, and sat down at the right hand of the throne of God.
I just did.
Re: Re: Re: How?
That's your problem looking to water. The Bible says to:
Let us fix our eyes on Jesus, the author and perfecter of our faith, who for the joy set before him endured the cross, scorning its shame, and sat down at the right hand of the throne of God.
I just did.
JustAChristian
New member
Re: Re: Re: Re: How?
Re: Re: Re: Re: How?
Where? I asked for verses of scripture to prove that baptism is not essential for salvation and as you have always done, you "dodge the issue" and "beg the question" in your debate. Your statement above does not even relate to baptism much less disprove it. Frankly, I believe you are running scared and praying you might be right when you know you are probably wrong. Why don't you give up on this trip you are on and admit to the will of the Lord Jesus Christ. Jesus said. "If ye love me, keep my commandments (John 1`4:15). You haven't been baptized for the remission of sins, so how can you be keeping the Lord's commandment on baptism ? (Mark 16:16; Mt 28:18-20).
JustAChristian
____________________________________
Let us draw near with a true heart in full assurance of faith, having our hearts sprinkled from an evil conscience, and our bodies washed with pure water (Heb. 10:22).
Re: Re: Re: Re: How?
Where? I asked for verses of scripture to prove that baptism is not essential for salvation and as you have always done, you "dodge the issue" and "beg the question" in your debate. Your statement above does not even relate to baptism much less disprove it. Frankly, I believe you are running scared and praying you might be right when you know you are probably wrong. Why don't you give up on this trip you are on and admit to the will of the Lord Jesus Christ. Jesus said. "If ye love me, keep my commandments (John 1`4:15). You haven't been baptized for the remission of sins, so how can you be keeping the Lord's commandment on baptism ? (Mark 16:16; Mt 28:18-20).
JustAChristian
____________________________________
Let us draw near with a true heart in full assurance of faith, having our hearts sprinkled from an evil conscience, and our bodies washed with pure water (Heb. 10:22).
JustAChristian
New member
What Did You Say?
What Did You Say?
I am not able to read you from your statement, but if it concerns those who do not believe, the relevancy of not being baptized is not there. Everyone knows that an unbeliever will not be baptized so it would have been redundant for Mark to comment on that matter. The unbeliever is not condemned because he is not baptized but because he did not believe in the first place (see John 3:18).
JustAChristian :angel:
What Did You Say?
I am not able to read you from your statement, but if it concerns those who do not believe, the relevancy of not being baptized is not there. Everyone knows that an unbeliever will not be baptized so it would have been redundant for Mark to comment on that matter. The unbeliever is not condemned because he is not baptized but because he did not believe in the first place (see John 3:18).
JustAChristian :angel:
Freak
New member
JustWorks--
Scripture states:
Let us fix our eyes on Jesus, the author and perfecter of our faith, who for the joy set before him endured the cross, scorning its shame, and sat down at the right hand of the throne of God.
Jesus the person perfects our faith not water. You are truly blinded
Scripture states:
Let us fix our eyes on Jesus, the author and perfecter of our faith, who for the joy set before him endured the cross, scorning its shame, and sat down at the right hand of the throne of God.
Jesus the person perfects our faith not water. You are truly blinded
JustAChristian
New member
More Rhetoric...
More Rhetoric...
More dodging instead of proving....:doh:
JustAChristian :angel:
More Rhetoric...
Originally posted by Freak
JustWorks--
Scripture states:
Let us fix our eyes on Jesus, the author and perfecter of our faith, who for the joy set before him endured the cross, scorning its shame, and sat down at the right hand of the throne of God.
Jesus the person perfects our faith not water. You are truly blinded
More dodging instead of proving....:doh:
JustAChristian :angel:
HopeofGlory
New member
Where did Jesus tell you to be baptized in water?
Water baptism in the name of Jesus began with the Baptist under the law, it is no longer required.
I believe the gospel of Christ, that He died for my sins, and I have been baptized by the Spirit without the law.
He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved; but he that believeth not shall be damned. Mark 16:16
For John truly baptized with water; but (on the contrary) ye shall be baptized with the Holy Ghost not many days hence. Acts 1:5
Billwald
Billwald
The question is not of the believer who has no opportunity to be baptised but of the person who claims to believe but who's belief will not even move him to to take a bath when Jesus tells him to.
Baptism was not some radical new idea that Jesus came up with. It was a common Jewish practice which continues into the present as the ritual bath which a convert to Judism must undergo to this day. He does not everywhere specify that the baptism must be with water for the reason that water is the norm. It is like being told that someone went skiing. It is assumed that a snowy slope is involved. It is possible to ski without snow, it is possible to ski on flat land, but the norm is to ski on a snowy hillside.
Billwald
How about "He who says he believes and refuses to be baptized, as Jesus commanded, lies and does not believe."?
The question is not of the believer who has no opportunity to be baptised but of the person who claims to believe but who's belief will not even move him to to take a bath when Jesus tells him to.
Baptism was not some radical new idea that Jesus came up with. It was a common Jewish practice which continues into the present as the ritual bath which a convert to Judism must undergo to this day. He does not everywhere specify that the baptism must be with water for the reason that water is the norm. It is like being told that someone went skiing. It is assumed that a snowy slope is involved. It is possible to ski without snow, it is possible to ski on flat land, but the norm is to ski on a snowy hillside.
JustAChristian
New member
Where did Jesus Command Water?
Where did Jesus Command Water?
We learn in several ways how things are to be done. There is the "direct statement." We learn "by example." And, we can learn by "implication." When Jesus said, "Go into all the earth and preach the gospel..."(Mark 16:15), this was a direct statement and explained the expanse of venturing with the gospel.
We learn that we are to honor and respect God. This is a parental responsibility. Parents must teach their children respect for God. The best way to do this is by example. Showing respect for God and his word, parents can give their children training that will go with them throughout life. Making sure that the Bible is studied often helps to establish God's word as the rule. When children learn the principles taught in the Bible, and then observe those same principles in the lives of their parents, great things are going to take place where purity of life is practiced.
As I have stated, the Bible teaches by implication. By implication we mean that which the Bible clearly teaches without directly stating it. Gen. 12:10 clearly teaches by direct statement that Abram went down into Egypt. Gen. 13:1 just as clearly and plainly teaches that Lot also went down into Egypt; but there is no direct statement to that effect. The statement is to the effect that Lot came up out of Egypt. Since there was a time previous to this when Lot was not in Egypt, and since it is now stated that Lot came up out of Egypt, it necessarily follows that Lot had gone down into Egypt. Though there is no direct statement to the effect that Lot went into Egypt, the Bible teaches as emphatically that Lot went into Egypt as it teaches that Lot came out of Egypt.
Though we may not find a direct statement said by Jesus that water must be used in baptism, we learn from His direct statement that believers were to be baptized. We learn by example that many obeyed that command or statement, and by implication we learn that the element of concern was water. The book of Acts more than satisfies the willing individual to the intent and purpose of baptism. To deny its essentiality is futile.
Things required of the Law of Moses are not required of Christians unless included in the Law of Christ. Baptism for the remission of sins was not in the Law of Moses, nor of the prophets. It was introduced by John the baptizer in the wilderness of Judea. It was further required by Jesus for those entering the Kingdom of Heaven. It is still essential for that purpose today.
Many believe in Spirit baptism and depend upon it today, but the Holy Spirit baptism was never intended to cleanse of sins. It was to impart spiritual gifts and to provide the power of God to do the work of God. Baptism in water for spiritual cleansing is required for believers then and now (Mark 16:16; Acts 22:16).
True
To all these that Jesus spoke the Holy Spirit was to overwhelm them and provide the power to do God's work (John 14:16;14:26;15:26; 16:7). They were then to proclaim the Gospel of Salvation taught to them by Jesus and brought to their remembrance by the Holy Spirit which requires baptism for the remission of sins and cleansing of the soul of man.
JustAChristian
:angel:
Where did Jesus Command Water?
We learn in several ways how things are to be done. There is the "direct statement." We learn "by example." And, we can learn by "implication." When Jesus said, "Go into all the earth and preach the gospel..."(Mark 16:15), this was a direct statement and explained the expanse of venturing with the gospel.
We learn that we are to honor and respect God. This is a parental responsibility. Parents must teach their children respect for God. The best way to do this is by example. Showing respect for God and his word, parents can give their children training that will go with them throughout life. Making sure that the Bible is studied often helps to establish God's word as the rule. When children learn the principles taught in the Bible, and then observe those same principles in the lives of their parents, great things are going to take place where purity of life is practiced.
As I have stated, the Bible teaches by implication. By implication we mean that which the Bible clearly teaches without directly stating it. Gen. 12:10 clearly teaches by direct statement that Abram went down into Egypt. Gen. 13:1 just as clearly and plainly teaches that Lot also went down into Egypt; but there is no direct statement to that effect. The statement is to the effect that Lot came up out of Egypt. Since there was a time previous to this when Lot was not in Egypt, and since it is now stated that Lot came up out of Egypt, it necessarily follows that Lot had gone down into Egypt. Though there is no direct statement to the effect that Lot went into Egypt, the Bible teaches as emphatically that Lot went into Egypt as it teaches that Lot came out of Egypt.
Though we may not find a direct statement said by Jesus that water must be used in baptism, we learn from His direct statement that believers were to be baptized. We learn by example that many obeyed that command or statement, and by implication we learn that the element of concern was water. The book of Acts more than satisfies the willing individual to the intent and purpose of baptism. To deny its essentiality is futile.
Things required of the Law of Moses are not required of Christians unless included in the Law of Christ. Baptism for the remission of sins was not in the Law of Moses, nor of the prophets. It was introduced by John the baptizer in the wilderness of Judea. It was further required by Jesus for those entering the Kingdom of Heaven. It is still essential for that purpose today.
Many believe in Spirit baptism and depend upon it today, but the Holy Spirit baptism was never intended to cleanse of sins. It was to impart spiritual gifts and to provide the power of God to do the work of God. Baptism in water for spiritual cleansing is required for believers then and now (Mark 16:16; Acts 22:16).
True
To all these that Jesus spoke the Holy Spirit was to overwhelm them and provide the power to do God's work (John 14:16;14:26;15:26; 16:7). They were then to proclaim the Gospel of Salvation taught to them by Jesus and brought to their remembrance by the Holy Spirit which requires baptism for the remission of sins and cleansing of the soul of man.
JustAChristian
:angel: