Modern spiritualized swill

Some people have favorite radio stations. They keep the stations on the presets and like to skip around to their favorites. I mostly despair for my generation as I hear the music, but still scan in hopes of some lonely song that doesn’t reek like an old corpse.

I’m from Denver, so I’m going to use Denver radio as my baseline example. Starting low on the dial, we have classical radio, for when I want to fall asleep at the wheel, crash into a tree, be thrown through the windshield and fly through the back window of a schoolbus, terrifying and permanently scarring the children inside said bus. Really though, there is so much good classical music out there, and it’s like this public radio garbage finds only the most monotonous and boring classical stuff out there. Try a little harder!

That brings us to the the public talk radio stations. I'd rather feed myself to dolphins than listen to public radio. People with nothing to say who think that they do in fact have something to say. Scanning forward, we have a mix of country, pop and hip hop. Well there’s a bad trio. Real bad. Starting with country, I just don’t understand it. Singers with no talent, singing about absolutely nothing. It’s not just that they have no talent, it’s also that they are quite simply awful. I mean, terrible. Just terrible. Screeching losers seems a fitting description for country singers. I shutter to think what people who listen to country are like. What happened to country anyway? Going back to guys like Johnny Cash and Waylon Jennings, it’s hard to tell how it got so bad (but I digress).

Moving forward to pop, 93.3 being a great example of the type of music I’m talking about, this is gayness at its finest. Great waves of gayness start coming out of the speakers when the radio passes by this station. It’s the epitome of trendy garbage that zombies, high school kids, and generally bad people listen to. Never before have I heard such whiney and vomit inducing music. Owl City? Really? Really? Since when did it get cool for dudes to sound like chicks?

Hip hop. Ah yes. Hip hop. Not even sure I should get into this one. More than hip hop, however I’d like to discuss R&B. That stands for, as I’m sure we all know, Queer. Anyone can talk into a voice distorter. It takes a certain type of imbecile to think it sounds good.

Moving up the dial, there’s the rock station 106.7 featuring neanderthal DJ Uncle Nasty. KBPI actually plays some pretty good music, but also plays some pretty awful music. One second you’re jamming to Metallica and the next it’s Nickelback. What a joke. (For sake of the argument, I'd like to point out Nickelback’s lead singer’s hair.)

(Yeah.)


There are a few classic rocks stations and some other random stuff I don’t have much of an opinion on (take it or leave it), but I’d like to get to the stations I intentionally skipped over:

The Christian stations, KLove, 89.7, etc. How should I put this? Christianity has failed music. It has crumbled and fallen apart and retreated from music. I don’t mean that Christian music doesn’t exist, I mean that it (if I may use the term) sucks.

Sometimes I just laugh and laugh as the radio scan setting stops at a Christian station. It’s just comical. Cliched, repetitive, nonsensical garbage. Looking back at history, Christians often led the way in their fields: science, art and music to name a few. Now look at us. We have what? Absolutely nothing, it's all marginalized swill. That’s Christian music. If the Christians can’t come up with good music, then what can I expect from the world? The sad part is that the world’s music is often better than Christian music.

Klovey music might even have a good message sometimes, but it’s usually a very simple, theologically incorrect, feel good type of message that ultimately amounts to nothing except making a Christian feel a little better about his apathetic, un-affecting life. Even the better popular Christian bands can’t seem to find inspiration to write good music. Christian radio is mainly just a pretend spiritual show. I don't remember the last time I heard a song on a Christian radio station and thought to myself, "That was sincere." (Not that I usually think like that; that seems a little weird. Again, I digress)

Christians need to start thinking about music that sounds good and has real meaning. I believe if we had popular Christian bands singing about real things, not recycled mantra, Christianity wouldn’t be so marginalized.

I feel like Christian musicians have failed a calling to use their skills to create a new song, to lead the way in the culture. If Christians started thinking like Christian composers from history whose works are still remembered today as great advancements in music, we would have works of art. Art that brings glory to God and has real meaning and cultural impact, not music that is brushed over and forgotten because it is really really lame.

Instead of a Show

Jim Carrey at MTV awards show said:

Would it kill ya to play some Foghat?

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I agree with the Christian music. The only thing that came close was Stryper, and the Pentecostals said they were demon possesd.

LOL

I pretty much agree. Have to admit I don't try very hard to find good Christian music, but that's mostly because I've come to expect it to be bad.

I listen to talk or sports talk mostly. Radio music usually fails pretty hard for my tastes, and I couldn't agree more about hating whiney singers and songs.

There's a reason why I gave up on commercial radio entirely when I was a teenager. It all started sounding pretty much the same, mediocore. Even now when a friend points me to the "latest and greatest" in stuff that gets played on the radio, I seldom find myself impressed. I'll openly admit there is a bit of narrowmindedness at work there as well as me being a bit of a music snob. However, most popular music is about appealing to the lowest common denominator, as that does tend to sell the most records. It seems to find it's way to every genre. At least every mass marketable one.

In my teenage years I discovered independant music. There's indie artists in just about every other genre, I'm sure you can find Christian indie as well. In the independant music that I have been listening to all these years, mostly electronic, gothic, industrial, symphonic metal, I have found innovation. I have found lyrics that are very deep and meaningful. I have found artists that are not afraid to do something really different in the name of creating art.

In the time when Christian music was at it's most innovative was when the priority of the artist was service to God. I did a research paper in my medieval studies class when I was in college on differences between sacred and secular music. Sacred music went from monophony, to polyphony and finally to symphony over time. All these changes were developed by monks, fryars and the like. Musical notation that we use today was developed in the church as well. Those men were not concerned with money. They were not driven by greed. Popular, commercially played musicans are. This even includes those that claim to be Christian musicians. Commercial record labels work on a formula that sells the most records. They don't sign artists that do not conform to that formula.

If I had to guess where innovation and creativity came from in our modern world, I'd say it's moved more to the college. Nearly every independant artist that I researched (at least those that I am most familiar with) has had at least some college and started making music there. Not too terribly long ago I asked Zoog, one half of the Australian industrial band, Angelspit, about this. He's got a degree in music theory. One of the things he said was, "when you have knowledge you can know why something in the music is awesome - and you can keep building on it." More on that discussion here. Also it seems that the college campus makes it easier for one to find educated, like minded individuals to trade ideas with.

Perhaps Christian musicians should at least trade ideas with those that they attend church with. Just a thought. And focus on the message, not the money. Of course that may not get one played on the radio, but do we really need the radio in a world that has the internet?

My suggestion for your problem with whats on the radio would be to do as I have done, stop listening to it. If you like to have music while you drive, take along CD's. Or better yet, if your car does not have a jack for an MP3 player, there are means of connecting one to it.

That was great Wamba I agree about Christian music, you have to search pretty hard to find the good ones, but they are out there. I love Jon Foreman and Switchfoot. About anything on the radio is pertty horrible.

Wamba said:

Never before have I heard such whiney and vomit inducing music. Owl City? Really? Really? Since when did it get cool for dudes to sound like chicks?

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I'd just like to point out that, while I personally don't really like Owl City all that much, Adam Little is pretty openly Christian. I think he does a good job of making wholesome music that people enjoy (and by people, I mean their 1,322,703 fans on facebook) without making cliche Christian music. *shrug*

Wamba said:

Klovey music might even have a good message sometimes, but it’s usually a very simple, theologically incorrect, feel good type of message that ultimately amounts to nothing except making a Christian feel a little better about his apathetic, un-affecting life. Even the better popular Christian bands can’t seem to find inspiration to write good music. Christian radio is mainly just a pretend spiritual show. I don't remember the last time I heard a song on a Christian radio station and thought to myself, "That was sincere." (Not that I usually think like that; that seems a little weird. Again, I digress)

Christians need to start thinking about music that sounds good and has real meaning. I believe if we had popular Christian bands singing about real things, not recycled mantra, Christianity wouldn’t be so marginalized.

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I feel this way a lot of the time. But on the other hand I listen to Judas Priest, my favorite secular band. The lead singer is a homo, and some of my favorite songs are about breaking the law, and partying all night. None of their songs give me any new insight into the world and how it ought to work (really the opposite).

I also listen to Ozzy, Iron Maiden, The Eagles, Styx, Jimmy Buffet, Aerosmith, etc. Never have I felt disappointed that the message in their songs isn't theologically correct. In fact I think almost all of these people are probably idiots who I wouldn't want to associate with in real life. But I enjoy their music.

So is it fair to treat Christian music that way? The Christian artists are at least people I could stand to be around in real life. Its hard because its a topic I really care about. But I think its best to just judge them for the music. I try not to give them a higher standard than I give Ozzy, because its just music. If you do hold them to a higher standard, then you must think Christian music has a higher purpose. But for me its just music, and most of the time I like the message more than I like Ozzy's message.

Oh, my wife loves Owl City. I can't stand them lol. Didn't know they were Christian.

Have you heard Barlow Girl? I know, I know their name stinks - makes you think you're in for more ZOEgirl - Blech! But they are a rock band - the only girl band I've ever liked, whether secular or Christian.

Have a look:

Grey

The best Christian music (in my opinion) is underground.

mewithoutyou

Showbread

Manchester Orchestra

Popular/mainstream Christian music = :vomit:

I have a local Christian radio station too and I don't mind it. It tends to be better during certain parts of the day though. :idunno:

Wamba said:

The Christian stations, KLove, 89.7, etc. How should I put this? Christianity has failed music. It has crumbled and fallen apart and retreated from music. I don’t mean that Christian music doesn’t exist, I mean that it (if I may use the term) sucks.

Sometimes I just laugh and laugh as the radio scan setting stops at a Christian station. It’s just comical. Cliched, repetitive, nonsensical garbage. Looking back at history, Christians often led the way in their fields: science, art and music to name a few. Now look at us. We have what? Absolutely nothing, it's all marginalized swill. That’s Christian music. If the Christians can’t come up with good music, then what can I expect from the world? The sad part is that the world’s music is often better than Christian music.

Klovey music might even have a good message sometimes, but it’s usually a very simple, theologically incorrect, feel good type of message that ultimately amounts to nothing except making a Christian feel a little better about his apathetic, un-affecting life. Even the better popular Christian bands can’t seem to find inspiration to write good music. Christian radio is mainly just a pretend spiritual show. I don't remember the last time I heard a song on a Christian radio station and thought to myself, "That was sincere." (Not that I usually think like that; that seems a little weird. Again, I digress)

Christians need to start thinking about music that sounds good and has real meaning. I believe if we had popular Christian bands singing about real things, not recycled mantra, Christianity wouldn’t be so marginalized.

I feel like Christian musicians have failed a calling to use their skills to create a new song, to lead the way in the culture. If Christians started thinking like Christian composers from history whose works are still remembered today as great advancements in music, we would have works of art. Art that brings glory to God and has real meaning and cultural impact, not music that is brushed over and forgotten because it is really really lame.

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I agree with some of this. Namely, that much of Christian music is cliched and just "feel good". However, I'd like to know what exactly you mean by some of the other stuff you say. First, one thing you say is that the music is theologically wrong. I don't think it's fair to quibble on the theology of the music because there all sorts of viewpoints out there. And let's be honest, your views aren't exactly common within the Christian circle so don't be surprised when you don't find people talking about God not knowing the future and executing homosexuals and adulterers. :chuckle:

You also say that you want Christian bands singing about "real things" and the songs should have "real meaning". What do you mean by that? What sorts of topics and issues do you think should be in songs?

So much of this is subjective. What is "good music"? :idunno: What makes you say, "Man, that was a good song"?

When listening to secular music, a lot of the lyrics are just stupid and pointless. They sing about the same things over and over again. Love. Relationships. Breaking up. Partying. Having sex. The songs with a real message are far outnumbered by those that are probably written in 10 minutes but make it because it comes with a catchy beat.

As Guy says below, are we holding Christians to a double standard? Perhaps we should. Perhaps they should be giving out a better message because they have a better message to share, but honestly, how many new and original songs can you make conveying Christian messages? It's just like worship songs. Do we really need more? They just recycle the same things over and over again. So I almost can't blame Christian artists for getting stuck in a rut, so to speak.

So I find myself agreeing with several of your sentiments, and I think the some of the Christian music industry falls in line with the rest of the cliched, mainstream Christian stuff, but at the same time I'm not sure all the criticism is fair because I'm not sure what they SHOULD be doing, what they should be singing about. :idunno:

GuySmiley said:

So is it fair to treat Christian music that way? The Christian artists are at least people I could stand to be around in real life. Its hard because its a topic I really care about. But I think its best to just judge them for the music. I try not to give them a higher standard than I give Ozzy, because its just music. If you do hold them to a higher standard, then you must think Christian music has a higher purpose. But for me its just music, and most of the time I like the message more than I like Ozzy's message.

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I agree with this some. However, it seems like some people do place a higher purpose on Christian music. Secular music is mostly for entertainment (some music has a real message behind it), but it seems like Christian music is put forth as just about always having a message behind it. It's supposed to uplift and encourage. It's not just entertainment. At least my local station often presents it in that manner.

nicholsmom said:

Have you heard Barlow Girl? I know, I know their name stinks - makes you think you're in for more ZOEgirl - Blech! But they are a rock band - the only girl band I've ever liked, whether secular or Christian.

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I have a Barlow Girl cd. They're pretty good. :up:

Vaquero45 said:

I listen to talk or sports talk mostly. Radio music usually fails pretty hard for my tastes, and I couldn't agree more about hating whiney singers and songs.

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Random question - who do you listen to for sports talk? I like Mike and Mike (ESPN) but never really get to see or hear them anymore. Now I listen mostly to Dan Patrick and Jim Rome.

I too think music is its own medium, not so much a message with me, since I did not care for much of the folk music that came out of my generation. Country music is well liked by many in the US. Here is the deal, as I see it: the US has come to a division in music tastes between the rap/hiphop and country, not necessary by ones ethnic background, but that is a factor, since few black kids like country. The rap.hiphop is hugh in the USA.

In Europe, it is very different, there is a continuance between hard rock and metal that has remained. Such music is underground here, not because it is censored, just listen to rap, nothing seems censored; rather it is just not as popular as in Europe where rap/hiphop is far less popular.

I much prefer the progression from rock-in-roll, to rock, to metal, to the new genres of popular metal in Europe, especially the softer metal, often female fronted. None of this is really soft! I sometimes post this in the listing thread.

Here, I do prefer jazz fusion and there is some radio that plays only jazz. Another genre I like is classical crossover, such as Sarah Brightman and Charlotte Church fit this category. Last is quality classical.

I seldom play the radio: I have a Sansui and Kenwood analogue tuners, which will blow away any digital tuner ever made, but the commercials are to anxious and loud for me at this time in life.

As to Christian music, I hardly search for it. Now my taste in other than classical and jazz has become small, it is only some select classical influenced metal I care for. I do like oldies, but not what is though to be classical rock, although I do like some of the special blends of that rock.

I just wrote a big long response, then left for a while and it timed me out. :chuckle:

So I'll summarize my main point with this: I do sort of feel like Christians are called to make music with a higher purpose. We expect Ozzy to not quite "get it," because he isn't a Christian.

Christians sing about good things usually, I will say that. God is good. Jesus is good. Salvation is good. It's not bad to talk about that, it's great in fact!

But I will say that the Christian bands I like to listen to take themes like that and run them deeper. Christian radio comes off as spiritual filler, made to make people tear up and be so glad for their lives, but the music doesn't actually prod any spiritual growth.

A Christian band that I like (which will never be heard on the radio) sings a song about apathy being a killer, and that we need to show Christ's love to our neighbors- even the prostitutes, criminals and junkies. There's a song I can get behind. It has a real world message, and is more or less slapping around Christians who try to ignore the pain in this world.

A thing I find sad is that songs by Metallica, Tool, and the Offspring (a few bands I really enjoy) often have deeper meanings and more real world applications than the local Christian station holds.

One other thing I'd like to throw out there is that the Christian industry makes music that makes people cry a little and feel pretty good, but there's no lasting meaning derived from it. There is no further intellectual or more importantly spiritual growth from the music most of the time.

Wamba said:

I just wrote a big long response, then left for a while and it timed me out. :chuckle:

So I'll summarize my main point with this: I do sort of feel like Christians are called to make music with a higher purpose. We expect Ozzy to not quite "get it," because he isn't a Christian.

Christians sing about good things usually, I will say that. God is good. Jesus is good. Salvation is good. It's not bad to talk about that, it's great in fact!

But I will say that the Christian bands I like to listen to take themes like that and run them deeper. Christian radio comes off as spiritual filler, made to make people tear up and be so glad for their lives, but the music doesn't actually prod any spiritual growth.

A Christian band that I like (which will never be heard on the radio) sings a song about apathy being a killer, and that we need to show Christ's love to our neighbors- even the prostitutes, criminals and junkies. There's a song I can get behind. It has a real world message, and is more or less slapping around Christians who try to ignore the pain in this world.

A thing I find sad is that songs by Metallica, Tool, and the Offspring (a few bands I really enjoy) often have deeper meanings and more real world applications than the local Christian station holds.

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See I'm kind of weird (or maybe completely normal) because I go back and forth on this. Sometimes I think Christian music should have a higher purpose. Christian's in general should have a higher purpose! But I wanted to put my other thoughts out there too. And yeah, it was kind of a sad moment for me when I was writing that Christian bands have a better message than Ozzy, and then to be honest I had to go back and put in "most of the time"

kmoney said:

Random question - who do you listen to for sports talk? I like Mike and Mike (ESPN) but never really get to see or hear them anymore. Now I listen mostly to Dan Patrick and Jim Rome.

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Jim Rome is a lot of fun, that would be the main one. After that it's mainly local (104.3 "The Fan", or 850KOA) hosts. Alfred Williams, Scott Hastings, Dave Logan, Mike Evans, Sandy clough. I catch Dan Patrick and Mike and Mike once in a while also.

I hardly ever watch sports on tv, but I like the talk shows for some reason.

More and more it seems the majority of the Christian groups popular with Christians are horrible. Especially if you only ever hear them on mainstream Christian radio. However, if you hear them on secular radio and they are Christians and their message is expressly such they are very good, at least musically. But I agree that the gospel doesn't go very deep with most of them even then.

Vaquero45 said:

Jim Rome is a lot of fun, that would be the main one. After that it's mainly local (104.3 "The Fan", or 850KOA) hosts. Alfred Williams, Scott Hastings, Dave Logan, Mike Evans, Sandy clough. I catch Dan Patrick and Mike and Mike once in a while also.

I hardly ever watch sports on tv, but I like the talk shows for some reason.

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Cool. I think Dan Patrick is my favorite at the moment. I think Dan is pretty good and funny and then the interaction he has with the "Danettes" is great. Without them his show wouldn't be as good.

For me with TV, I catch "Pardon the Interruption" and "Around the Horn" on ESPN somewhat frequently depending on what's going on in the sports world, but nothing else.

Wamba said:

So I'll summarize my main point with this: I do sort of feel like Christians are called to make music with a higher purpose. We expect Ozzy to not quite "get it," because he isn't a Christian.

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I definitely agree that some of Christian music should have a higher purpose, but I don't know if I hold them to that standard all the time.

But I will say that the Christian bands I like to listen to take themes like that and run them deeper. Christian radio comes off as spiritual filler, made to make people tear up and be so glad for their lives, but the music doesn't actually prod any spiritual growth.

A Christian band that I like (which will never be heard on the radio) sings a song about apathy being a killer, and that we need to show Christ's love to our neighbors- even the prostitutes, criminals and junkies. There's a song I can get behind. It has a real world message, and is more or less slapping around Christians who try to ignore the pain in this world.

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Ever heard of Casting Crowns? They are one band that I know has a couple songs like that and they are mainstream. And I'm with you, I like that they have songs with that sort of message. But again, how many songs can you get with meanings like that? :idunno:

A thing I find sad is that songs by Metallica, Tool, and the Offspring (a few bands I really enjoy) often have deeper meanings and more real world applications than the local Christian station holds.

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Would you say that the majority of their songs have deeper meanings? Admittedly, I'm not terribly familiar with those bands' collections, but my general impression of what I do know is not one of deep meaning.