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Thread: can anyone please give me proof that Jesus Christ is real?

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    Over 750 post club c.moore's Avatar
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    can anyone please give me proof that Jesus Christ is real?

    I have been dealing with this mythology teacher , and interviewing him on my tv and radio programs, and he gave incredible answers and question I don`t know to deal with them and if I let them be broadcast to the unbelievers and my audience it might prove to people there never was a real Christ and bible and religion is just a copy of pagan worship, and ancient customs.

    So can anyone here please give me science evidence or other evidence that Christ lived outside the use of the bible or an religious form of information??

    Please it must be logical evidence where can be traced or shown from people who have nothing to do with christianity and are not on any side just facts , and proofs, where no one can not say it is made up and please no stories, Just facts outside of the bible of Christ existance.

    maybe their is bones or dust , clothes, or personal writting of Christ that can proven today he lived out side the bible or religious system.

    maybe from the Egysiann side we can have evidence of the miracles of Moses or maybe someone can prove a millian people have really walked through the desert, and there is bones and writting of this all happening outside of the bible because non believers and other people have wrote about these biblical story and facts themselves to be trace to the bible as true facts.
    Even the proof of mary existance if there is any please give me any links on this or proofs outside of the religion , and the bible on this please, it is so important.


    This teacher has said there is no proof and no religion or scholar, priest , pastor, christian teachers can prove this out side of the bible, without using christian resources.


    God Bless
    www.revivaldisco.com

    Proverb:3:13: Happy is the man that findeth wisdom, and the man that getteth understanding.

    1Co:2:10: But God hath revealed them unto us by his Spirit: for the Spirit searcheth all things, yea, the deep things of God.
    1Co:2:11: For what man knoweth the things of a man, save the spirit of man which is in him? even so the things of God knoweth no man, but the Spirit of God.

    Proverb:12:15: The way of a fool is right in his own eyes: but he that hearkeneth unto counsel is wise.
    Proverb:12:16: A fool's wrath is presently known: but a prudent man covereth shame.
    Proverb:12:17: He that speaketh truth sheweth forth righteousness: but a false witness deceit.
    Evangelist c.moore

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    Over 750 post club c.moore's Avatar
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    This is a letter the teacher gave me so you can see where he is coming from, who also I am interviewing on tv and radio.

    This is a loop that can go on forever and honestly it gets boring. I don't respect the bible, I don't see it as truth and I cannot be convinced, no matter how many scriptures I'm given that the bible is real because I know it is not.

    For the message of the cross is foolishness to those who are perishing, but to us who are being saved it is the power of God. 19For it is written:
    "I will destroy the wisdom of the wise;
    the intelligence of the intelligent I will frustrate."

    This scripture is nonsense, Christians use scripture all the time because they have nothing else, nothing real to stand on. Christians and Muslims say that anyone who doesn't believe in their lies are foolish. The only thing Christians see as proof and truth is biblical scripture, but the source, the bible, is false. The cross is foolishness and I'm not perishing. It is the Christian who reads this verse and don't even realize himself that is already perished, confused and frustrated. Scripture like the one presented keep you believing that anyone who talk sense to you is foolish. The moment you talk reality to a Christian they open the lie they call a mystery and start quoting scriptures that have nothing to do with reality. I'm going to start walking around with a Peter Pan script and start quoting out of it. Simple ideas like divinity etc. become the most complex for Christians to understand because all they know is biblical explanations and months can be spent on the definition on a simple word.
    If you believe that I'm foolish for not believing in your Christ or cross etc., that's O.K. with me. The bible tells you to believe as a child, basically without a mind of your own. If I'm perceived as foolish to have my own mind and think as a mature man and not as a child believing in simple things like Santa Clause, Peter Pan and Jesus Christ, that's alright by me. "When I was a child I thought as a child and played as a child and did childish things, but when I became a man I put away my childish things." I don't believe in people walking on water, bringing the dead back to life, calling themselves the son of god and telling me I should give up my mind and take my power from myself and give my focus and money to some fabled so-called magician name Jesus Christ. These lies are for children. The believer accepts scriptures such as the ones presented as wisdom, not realizing that he is the one who foolishly accepts the cross, impossible miracles and the rest of the illogical lies as wisdom. A mature adult knows that such things like Christ, Peter Pan and the miracle of Santa Clause with rain dears flying through the air are nothing more than fantasy.
    Please no more scriptures. Talk to me outside of that which has your mind blinded to reality. Do you really believe as a child in Moses and Jesus feeding thousands of people from one basket full of bread etc.? If so, I have a bridge called the Brooklyn Bridge I'd like to sell you.
    www.revivaldisco.com

    Proverb:3:13: Happy is the man that findeth wisdom, and the man that getteth understanding.

    1Co:2:10: But God hath revealed them unto us by his Spirit: for the Spirit searcheth all things, yea, the deep things of God.
    1Co:2:11: For what man knoweth the things of a man, save the spirit of man which is in him? even so the things of God knoweth no man, but the Spirit of God.

    Proverb:12:15: The way of a fool is right in his own eyes: but he that hearkeneth unto counsel is wise.
    Proverb:12:16: A fool's wrath is presently known: but a prudent man covereth shame.
    Proverb:12:17: He that speaketh truth sheweth forth righteousness: but a false witness deceit.
    Evangelist c.moore

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    Journeyman Daniel50's Avatar
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    Jesus Christ is very much alive and real.
    No doubt.

    I was born and brought In a high caste Hindu background I had vision of Jesus Christ.
    Jn 12:26 "If anyone serves Me, let him follow Me; and where I am, there My servant will be also. If anyone serves Me, him [My] Father will honor.


    THANK YOU JESUS CHRIST.


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    C. Moore,

    You have a choice. You can believe in Jesus, or you can ignore Him. He doesn't 'prove' Himself to outsiders. If He wanted to show Himself, so that people would believe in Him by sight, instead of by faith, He would have recorded His Ministry, and it would be broadcast on TV. He chose to live when there is no historical evidence (other than the words of men, written on paper) to 'prove' anything.

    You have to believe in Him, in order to receive anything from Him. The proof that we have that He is Lord is the inward witness of The Holy Ghost, Who tells us that His Word is true. Those who don't hear Him, have refused Him, and will do so more and more, until their life is ended, and they are judged according to what they said. They obey thier lust. We must obey The Word of God.

    Preach the word; be instant in season, out of season; reprove, rebuke, exhort with all long suffering and doctrine. For the time will come when they will not endure sound doctrine; but after their own lusts shall they heap to themselves teachers, having itching ears; and they shall turn away their ears from the truth, and shall be turned unto fables.
    "Surely the Lord GOD will do nothing, but he revealeth his secret unto his servants the prophets." -- Amos 3:7

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    Merely Christian Nineveh's Avatar
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    Besides all of the eyewitness accounts, and the accuracy of the events? I don't think your teacher would believe even if a man was raised from the dead.
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    Originally posted by Nineveh

    Besides all of the eyewitness accounts, and the accuracy of the events? I don't think your teacher would believe even if a man was raised from the dead.
    "Surely the Lord GOD will do nothing, but he revealeth his secret unto his servants the prophets." -- Amos 3:7

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    TOL Legend Clete's Avatar
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    c. moore,

    Please ignore Aimiel! Post four may be the most idiotic thing I've seen anyone write on this subject.

    You have however gotten a hold a real super duper idiot with this mythology teacher! His conditions are unreasonable and probably intentionally so.

    Any extrabiblical evidence that exists will certainly have been seized upon and promoted by the Christian community for obvious reasons and conversely any such evidence would tend to be supressed or ignored by the nonchristian community so to demand that any evidence be presented by non christian sources is rediculous!

    However, the evidence that you present does not have to look like it came from a overtly Christian source. What I would do if I were you is to get Evidence that Demands a Verdict by Josh McDowell. The information in it is presented in a way that is very easy to quote and use in debates where citing sources might be necessary. It is not necessary to tell this ding dong teaher that you got this information from a Christian book. All the evidence presented can stand totally on its own and is independantly verifiable without ever having to reference Mr. McDowell's volume.

    Another outstanding resource is Bob Enyart's Mount Moriah Video. It would give you tons of ammo but your silly teacher wouldn't give it the time of day because it's obviously produced by a Christian.

    Anyway, I hope this helps!

    God Bless!

    Resting in Him,
    Clete
    Last edited by Clete; August 12th, 2004 at 11:45 AM.
    "The [open view] is an attempt to provide a more Biblically faithful, rationally coherent, and practically satisfying account of God and the divine-human relationship..." - Dr. John Sanders

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    Journeyman Daniel50's Avatar
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    Millions and millions Of Followers of Jesus christ.
    By faith you can see Him.
    Jn 12:26 "If anyone serves Me, let him follow Me; and where I am, there My servant will be also. If anyone serves Me, him [My] Father will honor.


    THANK YOU JESUS CHRIST.


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    The historians tell us there was a man called Jesus of Nazareth who was sentenced to death by the govenor of palestine; Pontias Pilot. Historians accept that much.
    shall I sin so grace may abound?

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    C. Moore--Our job is to testify of His existence, to bear witness of Him.
    There are secular writings from that period which refer to Him, Josephus being one of them.

    The encyclopedia Britannica says much about Him. Check it out. They will also list sources, or a bibliography.

    That being said, however, we MUST remember that those kinds of testimonies will be in vain. No one can truly know He lived--and still does live--until He is pleased to manifest Himself to that person, and He does so through the gospel; through the Scripture, and the preaching of it.

    A person may research other sources concerning Him until they begin to believe that He did indeed walk upon the earth, but that level of belief is not the kind of acknowledgement that makes Him REAL to people. That comes only by the power of the Holy Spirit. So my answer to a person who wanted evidence would be, "My job as His ambassador is to declare Him to you. If He is pleased to make Himself known to you, He will do so through His Word and our witness concerning Him. If not, anything else will be in vain.
    "For of Him and through Him and to Him are all things, to whom be glory forever. Amen" Romans 11:36

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    Originally posted by Clete Pfeiffer

    Please ignore Aimiel! Post four may be the most idiotic thing I've seen anyone write on this subject.
    What, specifically, if anything, did you find fault with in my post? Did you even read it? You provided references, but, beyond that, nothing. You didn't even consider the fact that these might not be readily available where Mr. Moore lives.
    "Surely the Lord GOD will do nothing, but he revealeth his secret unto his servants the prophets." -- Amos 3:7

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    TOL Legend Clete's Avatar
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    Originally posted by Aimiel

    What, specifically, if anything, did you find fault with in my post? Did you even read it?
    "He doesn't 'prove' Himself to outsiders. If He wanted to show Himself, so that people would believe in Him by sight, instead of by faith, He would have recorded His Ministry, and it would be broadcast on TV. He chose to live when there is no historical evidence (other than the words of men, written on paper) to 'prove' anything."

    All of the above is 100% false, mindless and ignorant.

    "You have to believe in Him, in order to receive anything from Him. The proof that we have that He is Lord is the inward witness of The Holy Ghost, Who tells us that His Word is true."

    Complete, idiotic, unfalsifiable nonsense!

    "We must obey The Word of God.'

    True but contradictory to the rest of your post.

    All in all your post was a complete waste of energy both to write and too read and now to copy and rebutt.
    Why would you even say such things? If nothing else it displays colossal ignorance of the very faith which you claim allegience to. If you weren't aware that such resources existed you should have said that or else just kept quiet and let someone who knows what they're talking about speak up. As it is, you make yourself look silly and discredit the Christian faith all at the same time. It just doesn't make any sense.


    You provided references, but, beyond that, nothing. You didn't even consider the fact that these might not be readily available where Mr. Moore lives.
    Okay! No pot smoking while on TOL!!!
    I gave internet links to purchase points for both resources, if he lives on this planet, FedEx can get them to him.

    Resting in Him,
    Clete
    "The [open view] is an attempt to provide a more Biblically faithful, rationally coherent, and practically satisfying account of God and the divine-human relationship..." - Dr. John Sanders

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    TOL Legend Clete's Avatar
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    Originally posted by Rolf Ernst

    C. Moore--Our job is to testify of His existence, to bear witness of Him.
    There are secular writings from that period which refer to Him, Josephus being one of them.

    The encyclopedia Britannica says much about Him. Check it out. They will also list sources, or a bibliography.

    That being said, however, we MUST remember that those kinds of testimonies will be in vain. No one can truly know He lived--and still does live--until He is pleased to manifest Himself to that person, and He does so through the gospel; through the Scripture, and the preaching of it.

    A person may research other sources concerning Him until they begin to believe that He did indeed walk upon the earth, but that level of belief is not the kind of acknowledgement that makes Him REAL to people. That comes only by the power of the Holy Spirit. So my answer to a person who wanted evidence would be, "My job as His ambassador is to declare Him to you. If He is pleased to make Himself known to you, He will do so through His Word and our witness concerning Him. If not, anything else will be in vain.
    This is going to be off topic so I'll keep it breif but Rolf, this is rank herecy or it is a meaningless thing to say.

    Do you believe that any such person exists that He would not be pleased to show Himslef too?

    If you answered yes, you are a heretic.
    If you answered no, then your above statement is meaningless.

    Faith is based upon substantive evidence, nothing less. To suggest otherwise is intellectually (and spirtually for that matter) insulting and unbiblical.

    Hbr 11:1 Now faith is the substance of things hoped for, the evidence of things not seen.


    Resting in Him,
    Clete
    "The [open view] is an attempt to provide a more Biblically faithful, rationally coherent, and practically satisfying account of God and the divine-human relationship..." - Dr. John Sanders

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    Over 6000 post club keypurr's Avatar
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    C. Moore,
    I was like you at one time in my life. I was about 19-20, and I was so confused with life that I doubted that the Bible was God's word. However a person came into my life and pointed out a few things to me. He started with the Second Chapter of Daniel. It wasn't long before my line of reason was passed and I knew that there is a Living God who loves us. Who else can declare the end from the beginning. Once I accepted that the Bible was from God, then the studies got serious to find out more about him. Knowledge builds faith and wisdom. It will not come overnight. But the search is well worth the time to find him. You can find him in the Bible. You will find the book interesting, confusing, sometime the pages look blank because you do not understand what your reading. That is what we all go through. But just look at the world, you know that something greater than MAN has been at work. For instance, who do you know that can make dirt? Teach a bird to fly? There is a God, and he has reveled himself to us in his Bible.
    Some folks have never searched in the right places to find him, I think your teacher is one of them. Believe me, he is real and he loves you.
    Yours in Christ, Keypurr (Bob)
    Psalm 1[/COLOR] and Job 28:28

    Rev 22:14 Blessed are they that do his commandments, that they may have right to the tree of life, and may enter in through the gates into the city.

    Joh 4:23 "But an hour is coming, and now is, when the true worshipers will worship the Father in spirit and truth; for such people the Father seeks to be His worshipers.

    I love the God of my Lord Jesus Christ

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    TOL Legend Clete's Avatar
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    keyperr,

    c. moore is a christian, has been for a long time.
    "The [open view] is an attempt to provide a more Biblically faithful, rationally coherent, and practically satisfying account of God and the divine-human relationship..." - Dr. John Sanders

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