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    The Politically Incorrect Truth About American Indians

    Many Americans seem to have bought into a story in which our 19th century ancestors were heartless, brutal imperialists while American Indians were the peaceful victims of American atrocities.

    There were certainly some atrocities committed by some American soldiers and settlers. And there were certainly some peaceful Indian tribes, like the Tonkawas or Delawares. But the idea of peaceful, innocent American Indians being regularly slaughtered by American soldiers and settlers for no reason is quite frankly, mythology.

    The following examples come from the book, A Fate Wore Than Death; Indian Captivities in the West; 1830-1885 by Gregory and Sussan Michno. The book is often gruelingly gruesome, but is hard to put down.

    Read more: http://www.reclinercommentaries.com/...han-death.html

    Last edited by aCultureWarrior; September 6th, 2019 at 02:08 AM.
    The very long history of Donald Trump's pro homosexual and transgender activism, before and during his Presidency, can be found on page 141, post # 2113 and #2114.
    http://theologyonline.com/showthread...=1#post5336963
    http://theologyonline.com/showthread...=1#post5336964

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    Quote Originally Posted by aCultureWarrior View Post
    Many Americans seem to have bought into a story in which our 19th century ancestors were heartless, brutal imperialists while American Indians were the peaceful victims of American atrocities.

    There were certainly some atrocities committed by some American soldiers and settlers. And there were certainly some peaceful Indian tribes, like the Tonkawas or Delawares. But the idea of peaceful, innocent American Indians being regularly slaughtered by American soldiers and settlers for no reason is quite frankly, mythology.

    The following examples come from the book, A Fate Wore Than Death; Indian Captivities in the West; 1830-1885 by Gregory and Sussan Michno. The book is often gruelingly gruesome, but is hard to put down.

    Read more: http://www.reclinercommentaries.com/...han-death.html

    90% of the aboriginal population in North and South America were rapidly wiped out by diseases like "smallpox" that were imported from Europe - so New World natives were never in a position to marshal a concerted response in defence of their homelands!

    It also explains that as the number of aboriginals dwindled. European settlers were forced to replace native slaves with slaves imported from Africa who, apparently, possessed greater resistance to these imported diseases!

    New World aboriginals were no more or less violent than their counterparts in other parts of the world at the same stage(s) of development - given that the Old Testament records that the Israelites were instructed to kill every man, woman and child when conquering Jericho, European Christians have some difficulty claiming to be morally superior to their non-Christian adversaries!
    Last edited by jgarden; September 5th, 2019 at 10:31 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by jgarden View Post
    90% of the aboriginal population in North and South America was wiped out by diseases like "smallpox" that were imported from Europe - so natives were never in a position to mount a credible defence of their homeland!

    It also explains that as the number of aboriginals dwindled. European settlers were forced to replace them with slaves imported from Africa who possessed greater resistance to these imported diseases!
    Aside from the conspiracy theory that blankets were purposely infected with smallpox, can you believe the barbaric practices of the various Indian tribes? Even the women were savages.
    The very long history of Donald Trump's pro homosexual and transgender activism, before and during his Presidency, can be found on page 141, post # 2113 and #2114.
    http://theologyonline.com/showthread...=1#post5336963
    http://theologyonline.com/showthread...=1#post5336964

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    Quote Originally Posted by aCultureWarrior View Post
    Aside from the conspiracy theory that blankets were purposely infected with smallpox, can you believe the barbaric practices of the various Indian tribes? Even the women were savages.
    Read "Lord of the Flies" - its easy to moralize when you've never experienced a subsistence existence whereby "barbaric" and "savage" practices may be the difference between life and death!

    Given the scale of the maltreatment and genocide inflicted on millions of captured soldiers and civilians during WW2 by supposedly Christian European nations, the aboriginals in the New World could be considered amateurs when it came to barbaric and savage practices!

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    Quote Originally Posted by aCultureWarrior View Post
    Aside from the conspiracy theory that blankets were purposely infected with smallpox, can you believe the barbaric practices of the various Indian tribes? Even the women were savages.
    Quote Originally Posted by jgarden View Post
    Read "Lord of the Flies" - its easy to moralize when you've never experienced a subsistence existence whereby "barbaric" and "savage" practices may be the difference between life and death!
    There was a case in which a warrior got upset at a captive baby’s crying so he ripped the baby from its mother’s arms, threw the baby on the ground and speared it as the mother was forced to watch.
    http://www.reclinercommentaries.com/...han-death.html

    Hardly a practice that would mean the difference between life and death for the savages.


    Given the scale of the maltreatment and genocide inflicted on millions of captured soldiers and civilians during WW2 by supposedly Christian European nations, the aboriginals in the New World could be considered amateurs when it came to barbaric and savage practices!
    Yes, Adolf Hitler and his fellow homosexuals of the Third Reich, who worshipped a Nordic pagan god and abhorred Christianity, like the American Indian, did unmentionable things to men, women and children. Countless books, movies and documentaries have been written on the subject. The purpose of this thread is to show what isn't being written in the modern day history books:

    The barbarianism of the American Indian.
    Last edited by aCultureWarrior; September 6th, 2019 at 02:43 AM.
    The very long history of Donald Trump's pro homosexual and transgender activism, before and during his Presidency, can be found on page 141, post # 2113 and #2114.
    http://theologyonline.com/showthread...=1#post5336963
    http://theologyonline.com/showthread...=1#post5336964

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    Quote Originally Posted by aCultureWarrior View Post
    There was a case in which a warrior got upset at a captive baby’s crying so he ripped the baby from its mother’s arms, threw the baby on the ground and speared it as the mother was forced to watch.
    Given that these are 2nd and 3rd hand accounts, these stories were written by those who hand a vested interest in "demonizing" the North American Indian and providing the necessary justification for treating this group as subhuman and a rationale for forcing them off their homelands!

    Yes, Adolf Hitler and his fellow homosexuals of the Third Reich, who worshipped a Nordic pagan god and abhorred Christianity, like the American Indian, did unmentionable things to men, women and children. Countless books, movies and documentaries have been written on the subject. The purpose of this thread is to show what isn't being written in the modern day history books:

    The barbarianism of the American Indian.

    Catholic Bishops giving the Nazi salute in honor of Hitler.
    Note Joseph Goebbels (far right) and Wilhelm Frick (second from right)

    http://www.nobeliefs.com/nazis.htm
    ******************************************

    "Petty tyrants such as Richard Nixon, or more successful tyrants such as Hitler, have regarded themselves as exemplary Christians, an estimate their followers had no trouble accepting. Hitler’s religiosity—he was a Catholic until his death—is often glossed over, but it is critical in understanding his motivation."
    —Anne Nicol Gaylor

    - Adolf Hitler crimminalized homosexuals, herding them into concentration camps - "aCultureWarrior" would approve!

    - Martin Luther’s book, On the Jews and Their Lies, deploring Jews and implying they would be better exterminated, inspired many parts of Hitler’s Mein Kampf in which Hitler praised Luther as a hero of the Germans.

    - "We tolerate no one in our ranks who attacks the ideas of Christianity ... in fact our movement is Christian."
    - Adolf Hitler, 1928
    Last edited by jgarden; September 6th, 2019 at 06:20 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by aCultureWarrior View Post
    Aside from the conspiracy theory that blankets were purposely infected with smallpox, can you believe the barbaric practices of the various Indian tribes? Even the women were savages.
    It's true that there were attempts to infect Indian tribes, but that generally wasn't the case. It wasn't even necessary. In most cases, the diseases of the Europeans moved far ahead of them,and they arrived only after plagues had decimated native American populations. The Mississippian civilization collapsed from European diseases before any European arrived in the area.
    This message is hidden because ...

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    From history.

    Damn any man who sympathizes with Indians! ... I have come to kill Indians, and believe it is right and honorable to use any means under God's heaven to kill Indians. ... Kill and scalp all, big and little; nits make lice.

    — - Col. John Milton Chivington, U.S. Army
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Berean View Post
    From history.

    Damn any man who sympathizes with Indians! ... I have come to kill Indians, and believe it is right and honorable to use any means under God's heaven to kill Indians. ... Kill and scalp all, big and little; nits make lice.

    — - Col. John Milton Chivington, U.S. Army
    Thank you for pointing out what was already addressed in the OP: That there were atrocities committed by whites/non Indians as well.

    It appears that the US Government frowned upon the actions of Chivington:

    The atrocity resulted in an investigation by the Joint Committee on the Conduct of War, and across the country most saw the massacre as a revolting butchery of mostly women and children. Regarding the massacre, Congress’ Joint Committee on the Conduct of War penned, “As to Colonel Chivington, your committee can hardly find fitting terms to describe his conduct. Wearing the uniform of the United States, which should be the emblem of justice and humanity; holding the important position of commander of a military district, and therefore having the honor of the government to that extent in his keeping, he deliberately planned and executed a foul and dastardly massacre which would have disgraced the veriest savage among those who were the victims of his cruelty. Having full knowledge of their friendly character, having himself been instrumental to some extent in placing them in their position of fancied security, he took advantage of their apprehension and defenseless condition to gratify the worst passions that ever cursed the heart of man. It is thought by some that desire for political preferment prompted him to this cowardly act; that he supposed that by pandering to the inflamed passions of an excited population he could recommend himself to their regard and consideration.”
    https://www.legendsofamerica.com/ah-johnchivington/

    The question that needs to be asked is this:

    Was Chivington and his troops responding to the one of the many barbaric acts that numerous tribes committed against settlers?
    The very long history of Donald Trump's pro homosexual and transgender activism, before and during his Presidency, can be found on page 141, post # 2113 and #2114.
    http://theologyonline.com/showthread...=1#post5336963
    http://theologyonline.com/showthread...=1#post5336964

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    Quote Originally Posted by aCultureWarrior View Post
    Thank you for pointing out what was already addressed in the OP: That there were atrocities committed by whites/non Indians as well.

    It appears that the US Government frowned upon the actions of Chivington:

    Regarding the author of the book in your OP, and Chivington, and apparently invented quotes, this adds some interesting context:

    I later emailed Byron Strom and asked if he had seen the program and showed him some of the questionable quotes. His answer was pretty shocking. He said that the “quotes” came from a book by Bruce Cutler called “The Massacre at Sand Creek: Narrative Voices (American Indian Literature and Critical Studies Series).” Referred to as a novel in its review by Publishers Weekly, this book is also dubbed a “poetic version of the tragedy.” In other words, it is fact-based but it is fiction.

    Interestingly, Byron said he first saw the misquotes in the work of Gregory Michno, the Rush Limbaugh of Colorado history, whose views on the Sand Creek massacre run contrary to those of most historians and experts on Sand Creek. In Michno’s universe, peace chiefs such as Black Kettle were actually trying to make trouble and the white men who negotiated with the tribes and later advocated for them – men such as Ned Wynkoop, Sam Tappan, and Silas Soule – were actually the real villains of this horrific event. In his book, “Battle of Sand Creek: The Military Perspective,” Michno is a Chivington apologist and works hard to make Wynkoop, Soule and the others look like incompetents and immoral characters.

    In “Battle of Sand Creek: The Military Perspective,” Michno uses several quotes from Cutler as real Soule quotes. For example, on page 267, he quotes from a supposed letter that Soule wrote on April 15, 1865 to his mother after his wedding, which took place April 1, 1865. In fact, the last letter Soule wrote to his mother was in January of 1865, in which he told her about the women and children who had been scalped at Sand Creek. This supposed letter that Michno quotes can be traced directly back to Cutler’s novel (which can be found online on google books).

    A shorter and shockingly acerbic version of Michno’s views can be found online on historynet.com in his article “Sand Creek Massacre: The Real Villains,” Published Online: June 12, 2006. (http://www.historynet.com/sand-creek...l-villains.htm). In this article, Michno again uses the Cutler quotes as real quotes from real Silas Soule letters . . . .

    The Tears in the Sand documentary, despite misquoting Soule’s letters, did not change the essence of who Soule was. However, in the case of Michno, his article and his book are full of un-footnoted and poorly-researched accusations against Soule and others who decried what happened at Sand Creek.

    Tried and waited then got tired, that's about it

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    Quote Originally Posted by annabenedetti View Post
    Regarding the author of the book in your OP, and Chivington, and apparently invented quotes, this adds some interesting context:

    I later emailed Byron Strom and asked if he had seen the program and showed him some of the questionable quotes. His answer was pretty shocking. He said that the “quotes” came from a book by Bruce Cutler called “The Massacre at Sand Creek: Narrative Voices (American Indian Literature and Critical Studies Series).” Referred to as a novel in its review by Publishers Weekly, this book is also dubbed a “poetic version of the tragedy.” In other words, it is fact-based but it is fiction.

    Interestingly, Byron said he first saw the misquotes in the work of Gregory Michno, the Rush Limbaugh of Colorado history, whose views on the Sand Creek massacre run contrary to those of most historians and experts on Sand Creek. In Michno’s universe, peace chiefs such as Black Kettle were actually trying to make trouble and the white men who negotiated with the tribes and later advocated for them – men such as Ned Wynkoop, Sam Tappan, and Silas Soule – were actually the real villains of this horrific event. In his book, “Battle of Sand Creek: The Military Perspective,” Michno is a Chivington apologist and works hard to make Wynkoop, Soule and the others look like incompetents and immoral characters.

    In “Battle of Sand Creek: The Military Perspective,” Michno uses several quotes from Cutler as real Soule quotes. For example, on page 267, he quotes from a supposed letter that Soule wrote on April 15, 1865 to his mother after his wedding, which took place April 1, 1865. In fact, the last letter Soule wrote to his mother was in January of 1865, in which he told her about the women and children who had been scalped at Sand Creek. This supposed letter that Michno quotes can be traced directly back to Cutler’s novel (which can be found online on google books).

    A shorter and shockingly acerbic version of Michno’s views can be found online on historynet.com in his article “Sand Creek Massacre: The Real Villains,” Published Online: June 12, 2006. (http://www.historynet.com/sand-creek...l-villains.htm). In this article, Michno again uses the Cutler quotes as real quotes from real Silas Soule letters . . . .

    The Tears in the Sand documentary, despite misquoting Soule’s letters, did not change the essence of who Soule was. However, in the case of Michno, his article and his book are full of un-footnoted and poorly-researched accusations against Soule and others who decried what happened at Sand Creek.
    "ACultureWarrior" keeps moving the moral goalposts to justify the persecution of those "nasty" Aboriginals who aren't conducting themselves in accordance with his rules - rules that shift with each successive post!

    The fact that these accounts were often written by those who harboured no sympathy for the plight of the North American Indian and no interest in verifying the more salacious events only provides ammunition for a zealot like "aCultureWarrior" to promote his own agenda!

    I'm surprised that "aCultureWarrior" hasn't concocted a narrative that all those "evil" Indians must be "gay" - he's used every other accusation in his arsenal to demonize them!
    Last edited by jgarden; September 6th, 2019 at 11:44 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by annabenedetti View Post
    Regarding the author of the book in your OP, and Chivington, and apparently invented quotes, this adds some interesting context:
    Ahhh, political correctness makes yet another appearance in the thread.

    In essence the American Indian really wasn't barbaric, and just sat around petting baby buffalo and stringing beads all day.

    Sorry, but there is plenty of evidence showing otherwise; my post on page 1 talking about historian Francis Parkman is one example.
    The very long history of Donald Trump's pro homosexual and transgender activism, before and during his Presidency, can be found on page 141, post # 2113 and #2114.
    http://theologyonline.com/showthread...=1#post5336963
    http://theologyonline.com/showthread...=1#post5336964

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    The very first governor of California, Peter Burnnet, gave this State of the State Address in 1851.

    https://governors.library.ca.gov/add...-Burnett2.html

    Among the more immediate causes that have precipitated this state of things, may be mentioned the neglect of the General Government to make treaties with them for their lands. We have suddenly spread ourselves over the country in every direction, and appropriated whatever portion of it we pleased to ourselves, without their consent and without compensation. Although these small and scattered tribes have among them no regular government, they have some ideas of existence as a separate and independent people, and some conception of their right to the country acquired by long, uninterrupted, and exclusive possession. They have not only seen their country taken from them, but they see their ranks rapidly thinning from the effects of our diseases. They instinctively consider themselves a doomed race; and this idea leads to despair; and despair prevents them from providing the usual and necessary supply of provisions. This produces starvation, which knows but one law, that of gratification; and the natural result is, that these people kill the first stray animal they find. This leads to war between them and the whites; and war creates a hatred against the white man that never ceases to exist in the Indian bosom.

    This state of things, though produced at an earlier period by the exciting causes mentioned, would still have followed in due course of time. Our American experience has demonstrated the fact, that the two races cannot live in the same vicinity in peace...That a war of extermination will continue to be waged between the races until the Indian race becomes extinct must be expected. While we cannot anticipate this result but with painful regret, the inevitable destiny of the race is beyond the power or wisdom of man to avert.




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    LIFETIME MEMBER aCultureWarrior's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Berean View Post
    The very first governor of California, Peter Burnnet, gave this State of the State Address in 1851.

    https://governors.library.ca.gov/add...-Burnett2.html

    Among the more immediate causes that have precipitated this state of things, may be mentioned the neglect of the General Government to make treaties with them for their lands. We have suddenly spread ourselves over the country in every direction, and appropriated whatever portion of it we pleased to ourselves, without their consent and without compensation. . They have not only seen their country taken from them, but they see their ranks rapidly thinning from the effects of our diseases. They instinctively consider themselves a doomed race; and this idea leads to despair; and despair prevents them from providing the usual and necessary supply of provisions. This produces starvation, which knows but one law, that of gratification; and the natural result is, that these people kill the first stray animal they find. This leads to war between them and the whites; and war creates a hatred against the white man that never ceases to exist in the Indian bosom.

    This state of things, though produced at an earlier period by the exciting causes mentioned, would still have followed in due course of time. Our American experience has demonstrated the fact, that the two races cannot live in the same vicinity in peace...That a war of extermination will continue to be waged between the races until the Indian race becomes extinct must be expected. While we cannot anticipate this result but with painful regret, the inevitable destiny of the race is beyond the power or wisdom of man to avert.
    Thank you for pointing out that the US was an uncivilized land and that the pagan nomadic and often times barbaric tribes that lived on it weren't the caretakers of it, but only residents.
    The very long history of Donald Trump's pro homosexual and transgender activism, before and during his Presidency, can be found on page 141, post # 2113 and #2114.
    http://theologyonline.com/showthread...=1#post5336963
    http://theologyonline.com/showthread...=1#post5336964

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    But wait, there's more! (There always is)….


    The Hungate massacre involved the murder of the family of Nathan Hungate along Running Creek (Box Elder Creek near present-day Elizabeth, Colorado) on June 11, 1864.[1][2] It was a precipitating factor leading to the Sand Creek massacre of November 29, 1864.

    The Hungates moved to the area, about 25 miles southeast of Denver, about March of that year. The family included Nathan, his wife Ellen, Laura and Florence. They lived on the ranch of Issac P. Van Wormer,[1] who employed Nathan as the ranch manager.[2] The ranch was located just south of the County Line Road between Araphaoe-Elbert counties, east of Running Creek,[3] and north of the town of Elizabeth.

    Attack[edit]
    On June 11, Nathan rode out with a hired hand, Mr. Miller, after the herd of cattle.[a] Several miles from the ranch, they saw smoke coming from the area of Hungate's cabin and suspected an attack by Native Americans. Miller said that he was riding for Denver and advised Hungate that his family was likely dead and if he went back to the cabin he would be killed, too. Hungate rode back to find that his cabin was on fire and his family had been killed and badly mutilated. He was captured and was similarly killed.[2][3] The couple was in their twenties, Laura was 2 1/2 years of age, and Florence was a 6-month-old infant.[1]
    Miller made it to Denver and gave news of the attack to Van Wormer, who rode to the ranch to find the Hungate family killed. Nathan Hungate's body was badly mutilated with 80 bullets a distance from the house. The bodies of Ellen and the two girls were found mutilated, bound together, and thrown into a shallow well. All of his stock had been taken and the buildings were burned down.[3]
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hungate_massacre
    The very long history of Donald Trump's pro homosexual and transgender activism, before and during his Presidency, can be found on page 141, post # 2113 and #2114.
    http://theologyonline.com/showthread...=1#post5336963
    http://theologyonline.com/showthread...=1#post5336964

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