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Thread: The Good that Child Protective Services Does

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    What is a "deadly libertarian mentality ?"

    "Libertarian" is an ambiguous term for a political ideology at this point in history. "Right Wing Libertarianism" could refer to John Locke'secularization of the ideas of Christian Reformers - John Knox and Samuel Rutherford - and Jefferson's use of Locke to briefly describe an American political ideology in the Declaration of Independence. But "Left Wing Libertarianism" might describe Socialism, as an ideology under influence from Marx. And the Frankfurt School Marxists were deceptive in their change of focus from Economics to Culture and their use of psychoanalysis and later of theories in American personality and social psychology - Kurt Lewin, A.H. Maslow, and Carl Rogers, for example, to psychologize Marxism.

    Also, "Judeo-Christian values" is unclear in meaning. "Biblical Values and Biblical Morality" might be better. Much of what became Christian Values and Christian Morality applied to politics and everyday life came out of Old Testament Scripture. But this may not be the meaning of "Judeo." Here again, is the problem of "All Israel," meaning all physical Israel in a genetic sense. There is also an Israel after the flesh - I Corinthians 10: 18. The New Testament teaches in Romans 11: 1-5 that a remnant of Old Covenant Israel was elected by God, and that those who did not believe Christ and his Gospel were broken off (Romans 11: 17, 22)

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    When I talk about Libertarianism, I usually use a big L because the doctrine for Libertarianism is found in the Libertarian Party Platform, which was written by the leaders of the Libertarian movement.

    "As Libertarians, we seek a world of liberty: a world in which all individuals are sovereign over their own lives and are not forced to sacrifice their values for the benefit of others".
    https://www.lp.org/platform/

    Child Protective Services deals with people who don't "sacrifice their values" (getting drunk, getting high on drugs, sexual exploitation, etc.) for the benefit of the children in their custody.

    That selfish attitude also involves property rights as well. Libertarians are against things like zoning laws, believing that because they are the owner of property, they should be able to open up a nightclub in a residential neighborhood, or open a pornography store or a marijuana store next to a school, not caring how disruptive those would be to the residents/students of that neighborhood.

    The term "Judaeo-Christian doctrine" is well known by those who read the Bible, because in most Bibles you'll find the Old and New Testaments side by side. Much of our nations laws and culture came from the Old Testament and when it comes to this thread, you'll see throughout the Old and New Testaments that the protection/well-being of children is stressed.
    Last edited by aCultureWarrior; September 10th, 2019 at 08:48 AM.
    The very long history of Donald Trump's pro homosexual and transgender activism, before and during his Presidency, can be found on page 141, post # 2113 and #2114.
    http://theologyonline.com/showthread...=1#post5336963
    http://theologyonline.com/showthread...=1#post5336964

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    Quote Originally Posted by aCultureWarrior View Post
    https://healthimpactnews.com/2015/ch...on-services-ex

    Have the Governors and the Attorney Generals of these States been notified with some evidence to back these serious (and if not backed with hard evidence, libelous) allegations?

    Certainly if you're interested in the welfare of children you're doing something to stop these alleged child rapists.
    You've been told all child abuse and neglect cases are sealed. No part of the public has any access to any of them. You repeatedly ignore the facts and keep on insisting for court records. Your repeated ignoring of fact is why I have stopped interacting with you. You're a broken record that has the needle running back over the same groove every time. The lack of honesty is incredible.

    Also, as you insist CPS is Judeo-Christian in concept and execution then lgbtq is Christian in your eyes for CPS accepts it as a valid cohabitation/marriage relationship and places children in those homes.

    Your circular arguments get ridiculous as you just cycle them over and over again against all evidence you have been shown.

    J
    “Liberty cannot be established without morality, nor morality without faith.”
    ― Alexis de Tocqueville, Democracy in America

    “One and God make a majority.”
    ― Frederick Douglass

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    The ambiguity in Libertarianism as a political ideology now in 2019 comes from the fact that the present state of the Democratic Party is more extreme than the Left was for example in the sixties and seventies of the 20th century. The Marxist Democratic party is now aligned with the major universities, the ruling elite, the Internet giant monopolies, the Deep State bureaucracy and maybe even the Red Chinese totalitarians.

    Where does Libertarianism stand in relation to these power bases, all of which can be called the Left?

    I am not sure what I am saying about the problems with describing Christian morality as being Judeo-Christian is being understood here.

    But this is a very interesting issue. And it does deal with the issue of an "All Israel is elect" versus The Remnant of Israel, which shows up strongly in Romans 11: 1-5, and the line of thought that entry into that remnant - all the elect - is by faith and not by genetics in Romans 11: 17-24, and supported by the whole argument in Galatians 3.

    The elect is the remnant, not the multitude of Old Covenant Israel, a doctrine that might seem to go contrary to dispensationalism, depending on what is focused upon in dispensationalism, and what is considered in dispensationalism to be new revelation that changes Paul's doctrines concerning the remnant and the multitude and election by grace through faith alone.

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    Quote Originally Posted by ffreeloader View Post
    You've been told all child abuse and neglect cases are sealed. No part of the public has any access to any of them...
    3 Ways to Obtain CPS Records

    March 29, 2019

    Federal law requires state child protective services (CPS) agencies to maintain records of all reports and cases they process.[1] Whether you can access these records depends generally on who you are and why you need them. If you were in foster care or were the subject of a CPS investigation, you have the right to get your own records. If you're seeking someone else's records, you may need to get a court order for those records to be released. Due to law requirements for confidentiality, usually you must have been involved directly with the case and the case must be closed.

    Read more: https://www.wikihow.com/Obtain-CPS-Records

    Right to privacy laws have been around for at least a couple of decades now.

    Also, as you insist CPS is Judeo-Christian in concept
    Protecting children from harm and promoting their well-being is part of Judeo-Christian doctrine. Each respective State has child protective services that does that.
    The very long history of Donald Trump's pro homosexual and transgender activism, before and during his Presidency, can be found on page 141, post # 2113 and #2114.
    http://theologyonline.com/showthread...=1#post5336963
    http://theologyonline.com/showthread...=1#post5336964

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    Quote Originally Posted by aCultureWarrior View Post
    3 Ways to Obtain CPS Records

    March 29, 2019

    Federal law requires state child protective services (CPS) agencies to maintain records of all reports and cases they process.[1] Whether you can access these records depends generally on who you are and why you need them. If you were in foster care or were the subject of a CPS investigation, you have the right to get your own records. If you're seeking someone else's records, you may need to get a court order for those records to be released. Due to law requirements for confidentiality, usually you must have been involved directly with the case and the case must be closed.
    LOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOL!!!! Which is exactly what Freeloader said.....How about you take your sorry butt down to the judge and tell him you need to see CPS documents....
    The state — whatever its particular forms — always expresses itself as a collective form of property ownership. All political systems are socialistic, in that they are premised upon the subservience of individual interests to collective authority. Communism, fascism, lesser forms of state socialism, and welfarism, are all premised upon the state’s usurpation of privately-owned property. Whether one chooses to be aligned with the political "Left," "Right," or "Middle," comes down to nothing more than a preference for a particular franchise of state socialism.

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    Quote Originally Posted by drbrumley View Post
    LOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOL!!!! Which is exactly what Freeloader said.....How about you take your sorry butt down to the judge and tell him you need to see CPS documents....
    I suppose we could talk about why right to privacy laws exist and why certain measures are to be followed to obtain personal information on people.

    Do you want the thread to go in that direction now?

    If so, this information is a good starting point:
    https://www.childwelfare.gov/pubPDFs/confide.pdf
    The very long history of Donald Trump's pro homosexual and transgender activism, before and during his Presidency, can be found on page 141, post # 2113 and #2114.
    http://theologyonline.com/showthread...=1#post5336963
    http://theologyonline.com/showthread...=1#post5336964

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    Quote Originally Posted by genuineoriginal View Post
    Please show me the verses that say you must take your neighbor's children away from them whenever you suspect that the children are in danger.
    Quote Originally Posted by aCultureWarrior View Post
    Here, let me fix that sentence for you:
    No, just answer the question, since it is the proper question to ask about CPS.
    Quote Originally Posted by aCultureWarrior View Post
    How about we start with the biblical role of civil government?

    Romans 13:4
    The civil government is to execute wrath on people that have been proven to have committed a crime.

    CPS takes children away from their parents and guardians on mere suspicions and gossip, many of which are proven to be false.
    That is contrary to scriptural commands.

    Exodus 23:1
    23 Thou shalt not raise a false report: put not thine hand with the wicked to be an unrighteous witness.



    Leviticus 19:16
    16 Thou shalt not go up and down as a talebearer among thy people: neither shalt thou stand against the blood of thy neighbour; I am the Lord.

    Learn to read what is written.

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    Quote Originally Posted by aCultureWarrior View Post
    I suppose we could talk about why right to privacy laws exist and why certain measures are to be followed to obtain personal information on people.
    Sounds like right to privacy laws exist to protect CPS, not the children.
    Learn to read what is written.

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    ~ Dr Freeman Dyson

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    Quote Originally Posted by genuineoriginal View Post

    The civil government is to execute wrath on people that have been proven to have committed a crime.
    The Bible that you're reading from must say something different than mine:

    "4For the one in authority is God's servant for your good. But if you do wrong, be afraid, for rulers do not bear the sword for no reason. They are God's servants, agents of wrath to bring punishment on the wrongdoer."

    Investigating the scalding of a baby with boiling water because daddy was high on drugs and baby wouldn't stop crying (they like to be fed now and again) is something that falls under the jurisdiction of government per Romans 13.

    Quote Originally Posted by genuineoriginal View Post
    Sounds like right to privacy laws exist to protect CPS, not the children.
    As I've shown, access to information from CPS investigations is available to various parties and after that investigation is closed.
    That being said: please give an example why anyone should be able to access all information on a case during an open law enforcement investigation.
    The very long history of Donald Trump's pro homosexual and transgender activism, before and during his Presidency, can be found on page 141, post # 2113 and #2114.
    http://theologyonline.com/showthread...=1#post5336963
    http://theologyonline.com/showthread...=1#post5336964

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    Quote Originally Posted by aCultureWarrior View Post
    The Bible that you're reading from must say something different than mine:

    "4For the one in authority is God's servant for your good. But if you do wrong, be afraid, for rulers do not bear the sword for no reason. They are God's servants, agents of wrath to bring punishment on the wrongdoer."

    Investigating the scalding of a baby with boiling water because daddy was high on drugs and baby wouldn't stop crying (they like to be fed now and again) is something that falls under the jurisdiction of government per Romans 13.
    If it is a crime, send the police.
    CPS is not needed at all in that situation.

    Now, show me in the Bible where letting children walk to a neighborhood park constitutes "unsubstantiated child neglect" and is justification for government taking the children away from the parents.


    Has Child Protective Services Gone Too Far?

    Earlier this year, a Maryland couple, Alexander and Danielle Meitiv, made international news after two run-ins with Child Protective Services, sparked by their decision to let their children, ages 10 and 6, walk to neighborhood parks by themselves. As self-described “free-range parents,” the Meitivs are committed to giving their kids freedom from constant adult oversight. According to an interview with Danielle in Psychology Today, after the second incident, a social worker demanded that Alexander sign a “temporary safety plan” saying that his children would be supervised at all times until CPS could do a follow-up. When he balked, the social worker threatened to have the children taken away from him immediately and called the police. The couple were ultimately found “responsible for unsubstantiated child neglect,” which Danielle calls “an Orwellian judgment,” adding that their lawyer describes it as “‘legal purgatory,’ because it seems to be meaningless in plain English, yet it’s like a cloud hanging over our heads.”

    Learn to read what is written.

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    ~ Dr Freeman Dyson

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    Quote Originally Posted by genuineoriginal View Post
    If it is a crime, send the police.
    CPS is not needed at all in that situation.
    Child Protection Services is one of the many divisions of law enforcement, a division that only investigates matters where harm/danger to children is involved. CPS doesn't make any physical arrests, they pass information onto other authorities and arrests are made by the police.

    Now, show me in the Bible where letting children walk to a neighborhood park constitutes "unsubstantiated child neglect" and is justification for government taking the children away from the parents.
    Could you give me more information on this case:

    1). What City did this take place in?
    2). What neighborhood in this respective City did this take place in?
    3). Is this park known as a hang out for drug dealers/addicts? Have there been crimes (robberies, rapes, the molestation of children) reported in this park? If so, why were 10 and 6 year old children allowed to frequent that park unsupervised?

    Again: In order for me to comment on the case, I would need to know more information. Since this appears to be a closed case, perhaps you could access CPS documents and police reports on the case and link them to your reply?
    The very long history of Donald Trump's pro homosexual and transgender activism, before and during his Presidency, can be found on page 141, post # 2113 and #2114.
    http://theologyonline.com/showthread...=1#post5336963
    http://theologyonline.com/showthread...=1#post5336964

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    Quote Originally Posted by aCultureWarrior View Post
    The Bible that you're reading from must say something different than mine:

    "4For the one in authority is God's servant for your good. But if you do wrong, be afraid, for rulers do not bear the sword for no reason. They are God's servants, agents of wrath to bring punishment on the wrongdoer."
    How you disagree with GO's post:

    Quote Originally Posted by genuineoriginal View Post

    The civil government is to execute wrath on people that have been proven to have committed a crime.
    is plain looney on your part...

    The state — whatever its particular forms — always expresses itself as a collective form of property ownership. All political systems are socialistic, in that they are premised upon the subservience of individual interests to collective authority. Communism, fascism, lesser forms of state socialism, and welfarism, are all premised upon the state’s usurpation of privately-owned property. Whether one chooses to be aligned with the political "Left," "Right," or "Middle," comes down to nothing more than a preference for a particular franchise of state socialism.

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    Quote Originally Posted by drbrumley View Post
    How you disagree with GO's post:



    is plain looney on your part...

    What entity would do the investigation of criminal activity? What entity would make the arrest? What entity would hold proceedings to establish guilt?

    All of those things lead up to the punishment phase.
    The very long history of Donald Trump's pro homosexual and transgender activism, before and during his Presidency, can be found on page 141, post # 2113 and #2114.
    http://theologyonline.com/showthread...=1#post5336963
    http://theologyonline.com/showthread...=1#post5336964

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    Quote Originally Posted by aCultureWarrior View Post
    Child Protection Services is one of the many divisions of law enforcement
    CPS acts without due process, they are an abomination.

    Quote Originally Posted by aCultureWarrior View Post
    Again: In order for me to comment on the case, I would need to know more information.
    You are quibbling to divert attention against the fact that CPS destroys more lives than it helps.
    Learn to read what is written.

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    The people who are supposed to be experts and who claim to understand the science are precisely the people who are blind to the evidence.
    ~ Dr Freeman Dyson

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