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Thread: The False Doctrine of 'Once Saved, Always Saved'.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Hobie View Post
    Many people or ministers try to tell people that once they become Christians they are guarranteed salvation, but is this doctrine of 'Once Saved, Always Saved' what the Bible teaches, lets see. If you look in the Bible, salvation or to be saved, can be described as both past, present, and future, because it can be speaking of different aspects. If it is not understood, there can be confusion.

    But the Bible clearly tells us that even those who are Christians can fall away from salvation...........

    You are 100% correct sir.

    I will leave on that high note, since we probably disagree about other things. LOL.

    Check this out: Assurance of Salvation

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    It is obviously beyond your comprehension as you have no part in salvation. For those of us who have entered into eternal life and have been brought through many danger's, trials and snares it is proof of trust and life Himself.
    I know Him, correctly, as Messiah whom you call Christ. Yah Shua whom you call Jesus. Messianists who you call Christians.

    "Touch not mine anointed, and do my prophets no harm".

    I refuse, point blank, to speak peace to the unregenerate, hypocrites, religious dogma lovers and those that oppose the following statement:
    A regenerate man trusts in the evangelism of salvation conditioned on the atoning blood and imputed justness of Messiah alone.
    If you are fully persuaded, by experience, of this delightful, beautiful and life giving doctrine then I love you as a brother.

    Anyone who thinks that salvation is conditioned on anything a man thinks, does or says is atheist. I cannot and will not speak peace to him or her.

    I don't make statements online that I wouldn't repeat in front of my Maker, my grandmother or a judge.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Hobie View Post
    Many people or ministers try to tell people that once they become Christians they are guarranteed salvation, but is this doctrine of 'Once Saved, Always Saved' what the Bible teaches, lets see. If you look in the Bible, salvation or to be saved, can be described as both past, present, and future, because it can be speaking of different aspects. If it is not understood, there can be confusion.

    But the Bible clearly tells us that even those who are Christians can fall away from salvation...

    1 Corinthians 10:12
    Wherefore let him that thinketh he standeth take heed lest he fall.

    1 Timothy 3:5-7
    5 (For if a man know not how to rule his own house, how shall he take care of the church of God?)
    6 Not a novice, lest being lifted up with pride he fall into the condemnation of the devil.
    7 Moreover he must have a good report of them which are without; lest he fall into reproach and the snare of the devil.

    Hebrews 6:4-6
    4For it is impossible for those who were once enlightened, and have tasted of the heavenly gift, and were made partakers of the Holy Ghost,
    5 And have tasted the good word of God, and the powers of the world to come,
    6 If they shall fall away, to renew them again unto repentance; seeing they crucify to themselves the Son of God afresh, and put him to an open shame.

    Matthew 7:21
    Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven."

    So those who teach or preach 'Once Saved, Always Saved' really are saying, "I can do whatever I want, as long as I claim to have accepted Jesus. Many try use this verse, "For I am persuaded, that neither death, nor life, nor angels, nor principalities, nor powers, nor things present, nor things to come, nor height, nor depth, nor any other creature, shall be able to separate us from the love of God, which is in Christ Jesus our Lord." Romans 8:38, 39.

    Now its a promise, but does it say once a person is born again, it is impossible for him to lose his way and be lost? In fact, this verse is clearly talking about God's unconditional love towards man. You might also notice that the word "sin" was not included in the list of things which are unable to separate us from the love of God.

    If we continue in sin, after we have asked Jesus to be our personal Saviour, are we really in a saved relationship, are we converted? "For if we sin wilfully after that we have received the knowledge of the truth, there remaineth no more sacrifice for sins." Hebrews 10:26.

    We also have a few others that these teachers of 'Once Saved ,Always Saved' miss....
    For not the hearers of the law are just before God, but the doers of the law shall be justified." Romans 2:13.

    "Now the works of the flesh are manifest, which are these: Adultery, fornication, uncleanness, lasciviousness, idolatry, witchcraft, hatred, variance, emulations, wrath, strife, seditions, heresies, envyings, murders, drunkenness, revellings and such like: of the which I tell you before, as I have also told you in time past, that they which do such things shall not inherit the kingdom of God. But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, longsuffering, gentleness, goodness, faith, meekness, temperance: against such there is no law." Galatians 5:19-23.


    One is not saved just by becoming a Christian, the Bible clearly shows the doctrine of 'Once Saved, Always Saved', is not true, but brought out by Satans helpters to deceive those who want cheap grace and a guick cover for their sins and living in its domain of evil, and they will depart from the faith of Jesus and lose salvation...

    "Now the Spirit speaketh expressly, that in the latter times some shall depart from the faith, giving heed to seducing spirits, and doctrines of devils;" 1 Timothy 4:1.
    When a person disregards the eternal security of the believer its because they condition salvation on themselves and not Jesus Christ !
    "... I have my own private opinion that there is no such a thing as
    preaching Christ and him crucified, unless you preach what now-a-days is
    called Calvinism. I have my own ideas, and those I always state boldly. It is
    a nickname to call it Calvinism; Calvinism is the gospel, and nothing else."

    Charles Spurgeon !

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    Quote Originally Posted by beloved57 View Post
    When a person disregards the eternal security of the believer its because they condition salvation on themselves and not Jesus Christ !
    Or they rely on Calvinism to save and even go as far as to state that "Calvinism is the Gospel". Heretics are not redeemed, regenerate nor repentant. The heretic cap fits you, wear it with shame.
    I know Him, correctly, as Messiah whom you call Christ. Yah Shua whom you call Jesus. Messianists who you call Christians.

    "Touch not mine anointed, and do my prophets no harm".

    I refuse, point blank, to speak peace to the unregenerate, hypocrites, religious dogma lovers and those that oppose the following statement:
    A regenerate man trusts in the evangelism of salvation conditioned on the atoning blood and imputed justness of Messiah alone.
    If you are fully persuaded, by experience, of this delightful, beautiful and life giving doctrine then I love you as a brother.

    Anyone who thinks that salvation is conditioned on anything a man thinks, does or says is atheist. I cannot and will not speak peace to him or her.

    I don't make statements online that I wouldn't repeat in front of my Maker, my grandmother or a judge.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Hobie View Post
    As long as we are under the line of Adam, we are subject to the fallen nature which is passed on, and susceptible to sin.

    Romans 3:23 King James Version (KJV)
    23 For all have sinned, and come short of the glory of God;
    According to the gospel of the grace of God, we are saved apart from ourselves.

    Eph 2:4-10 KJV But God, who is rich in mercy, for his great love wherewith he loved us, (5) Even when we were dead in sins, hath quickened us together with Christ, (by grace ye are saved;) (6) And hath raised us up together, and made us sit together in heavenly places in Christ Jesus: (7) That in the ages to come he might shew the exceeding riches of his grace in his kindness toward us through Christ Jesus. (8) For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God: (9) Not of works, lest any man should boast. (10) For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus unto good works, which God hath before ordained that we should walk in them.

    Paul uses saved in the past tense. DONE!!

    You think that you can save yourself by your <whatever actions you want to claim>. You cannot.
    Quote Originally Posted by Squeaky View Post
    That explains why your an idiot.
    Quote Originally Posted by God's Truth View Post
    Father figure, Son figure, and Holy Spirit figure.
    Quote Originally Posted by God's Truth View Post
    You preach against me for preaching obedience to Christ for salvation.
    Col 2:9 (AKJV/PCE)
    (2:9) For in him dwelleth all the fulness of the Godhead bodily.

    1Tim 4:10 (AKJV/PCE)
    (4:10) For therefore we both labour and suffer reproach, because we trust in the living God, who is the Saviour of all men, specially of those that believe.

    Something that was SPOKEN OF since the world began CANNOT be the SAME thing as something KEPT SECRET since the world began.

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    Who unseals the work of the Holy Spirit?
    He is no fool who gives what he cannot keep to gain what he cannot lose.

    Jim Elliot

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    Quote Originally Posted by Bright Raven View Post
    Who unseals the work of the Holy Spirit?
    It would be an easier task to stop the sun, moon and stars in their courses.
    I know Him, correctly, as Messiah whom you call Christ. Yah Shua whom you call Jesus. Messianists who you call Christians.

    "Touch not mine anointed, and do my prophets no harm".

    I refuse, point blank, to speak peace to the unregenerate, hypocrites, religious dogma lovers and those that oppose the following statement:
    A regenerate man trusts in the evangelism of salvation conditioned on the atoning blood and imputed justness of Messiah alone.
    If you are fully persuaded, by experience, of this delightful, beautiful and life giving doctrine then I love you as a brother.

    Anyone who thinks that salvation is conditioned on anything a man thinks, does or says is atheist. I cannot and will not speak peace to him or her.

    I don't make statements online that I wouldn't repeat in front of my Maker, my grandmother or a judge.

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    Quote Originally Posted by nikolai_42 View Post
    Whether he was or not at that point, he was going to be.

    But I have prayed for thee, that thy faith fail not: and when thou art converted, strengthen thy brethren
    Luke 22:32

    In other words, the Lord knew Peter better than Peter knew himself. He knew Peter and where he would be. So His calling Peter "Satan" only recognizes the influence Satan was having through Peter.
    Peter thought he couldn't be turned, but when the cocked crowed, he was exposed....Satan is a deceiver we cant stop till the end...

    2 Peter 2:21-22 King James Version (KJV)
    21 For it had been better for them not to have known the way of righteousness, than, after they have known it, to turn from the holy commandment delivered unto them.
    22 But it is happened unto them according to the true proverb, The dog is turned to his own vomit again; and the sow that was washed to her wallowing in the mire.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Hobie View Post
    Peter thought he couldn't be turned, but when the cocked crowed, he was exposed....Satan is a deceiver we cant stop till the end...

    2 Peter 2:21-22 King James Version (KJV)
    21 For it had been better for them not to have known the way of righteousness, than, after they have known it, to turn from the holy commandment delivered unto them.
    22 But it is happened unto them according to the true proverb, The dog is turned to his own vomit again; and the sow that was washed to her wallowing in the mire.
    Will you disqualify Peter?

    Whosoever therefore shall confess me before men, him will I confess also before my Father which is in heaven.
    But whosoever shall deny me before men, him will I also deny before my Father which is in heaven.

    Matthew 10:32-33
    If God promises life, He slayeth first; when He builds, He casteth all down first. God is no patcher; He cannot build on another's foundation. - William Tyndale

    The heart is deceitful above all things, and desperately wicked: who can know it?
    Jeremiah 17:9

    Who is among you that feareth the Lord, that obeyeth the voice of his servant, that walketh in darkness, and hath no light? let him trust in the name of the Lord, and stay upon his God.
    Behold, all ye that kindle a fire, that compass yourselves about with sparks: walk in the light of your fire, and in the sparks that ye have kindled. This shall ye have of mine hand; ye shall lie down in sorrow.

    Isaiah 50:10-11

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    Quote Originally Posted by Fred Eans View Post
    In heaven during the time of turmoil, Lucifer led one third of Godís Cildren astray. The other two thirds, just like today, there was all types. procrastinators, took no interest, sat back and watched, etc. There were some who like those who get lots of print in the Bible, that fought for God. He uses these to fulfill His Plan. So although the Apostles are not like they were in the first age, God realized this, and gave them a great leeway in fulfilling the purpose chosen for them. Just think what it would be like serving God then. But Paul being weak like us all, I can just see Jesus smiling at him. Jesus was not talking to Peter, but Satanís spirit which was present getting a hold of him. Just like Jesus allowed Satan to temporarily get a hold on Judas Es. You should know, Satan was on earth and in heaven during the early part of this flesh age. When Jesus was being tempted by Satan, at the end of it, Jesus told him to get behind Him. Behind the heavenly Throne which was occupied by The Father (the Office of) Now he is in that bottomless pit till Micheal letís him out, boots him to earth.
    But don't forget, Jesus was tempted in the wilderness, in fact the Jewish leaders and scribes were constantly accusing and causing strife, trying Him in every way.

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    Quote Originally Posted by nikolai_42 View Post
    Will you disqualify Peter?

    Whosoever therefore shall confess me before men, him will I confess also before my Father which is in heaven.
    But whosoever shall deny me before men, him will I also deny before my Father which is in heaven.

    Matthew 10:32-33
    He, like Judas failed constantly relying on self, but Peter had a faith that allowed Jesus to work in him, and do its transformation which even after the Pentecost, Paul had to straighten him out on things. But we have to fight the good fight and keep on till the end

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    Quote Originally Posted by Hobie View Post
    Many people or ministers try to tell people that once they become Christians they are guarranteed salvation, but is this doctrine of 'Once Saved, Always Saved' what the Bible teaches, lets see. If you look in the Bible, salvation or to be saved, can be described as both past, present, and future, because it can be speaking of different aspects. If it is not understood, there can be confusion.

    But the Bible clearly tells us that even those who are Christians can fall away from salvation...

    1 Corinthians 10:12
    Wherefore let him that thinketh he standeth take heed lest he fall.

    1 Timothy 3:5-7
    5 (For if a man know not how to rule his own house, how shall he take care of the church of God?)
    6 Not a novice, lest being lifted up with pride he fall into the condemnation of the devil.
    7 Moreover he must have a good report of them which are without; lest he fall into reproach and the snare of the devil.

    Hebrews 6:4-6
    4For it is impossible for those who were once enlightened, and have tasted of the heavenly gift, and were made partakers of the Holy Ghost,
    5 And have tasted the good word of God, and the powers of the world to come,
    6 If they shall fall away, to renew them again unto repentance; seeing they crucify to themselves the Son of God afresh, and put him to an open shame.

    Matthew 7:21
    Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven."

    So those who teach or preach 'Once Saved, Always Saved' really are saying, "I can do whatever I want, as long as I claim to have accepted Jesus. Many try use this verse, "For I am persuaded, that neither death, nor life, nor angels, nor principalities, nor powers, nor things present, nor things to come, nor height, nor depth, nor any other creature, shall be able to separate us from the love of God, which is in Christ Jesus our Lord." Romans 8:38, 39.

    Now its a promise, but does it say once a person is born again, it is impossible for him to lose his way and be lost? In fact, this verse is clearly talking about God's unconditional love towards man. You might also notice that the word "sin" was not included in the list of things which are unable to separate us from the love of God.

    If we continue in sin, after we have asked Jesus to be our personal Saviour, are we really in a saved relationship, are we converted? "For if we sin wilfully after that we have received the knowledge of the truth, there remaineth no more sacrifice for sins." Hebrews 10:26.

    We also have a few others that these teachers of 'Once Saved ,Always Saved' miss....
    For not the hearers of the law are just before God, but the doers of the law shall be justified." Romans 2:13.

    "Now the works of the flesh are manifest, which are these: Adultery, fornication, uncleanness, lasciviousness, idolatry, witchcraft, hatred, variance, emulations, wrath, strife, seditions, heresies, envyings, murders, drunkenness, revellings and such like: of the which I tell you before, as I have also told you in time past, that they which do such things shall not inherit the kingdom of God. But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, longsuffering, gentleness, goodness, faith, meekness, temperance: against such there is no law." Galatians 5:19-23.


    One is not saved just by becoming a Christian, the Bible clearly shows the doctrine of 'Once Saved, Always Saved', is not true, but brought out by Satans helpters to deceive those who want cheap grace and a guick cover for their sins and living in its domain of evil, and they will depart from the faith of Jesus and lose salvation...

    "Now the Spirit speaketh expressly, that in the latter times some shall depart from the faith, giving heed to seducing spirits, and doctrines of devils;" 1 Timothy 4:1.
    Falling is sort of the opposite of standing.

    Losing salvation, ie, eternal life, is not the opposite of standing.

    Falling into condemnation, including the condemnation of the devil is not losing eternal life

    No one gets to become born again twice, at the moment of becoming born again, you receive incorruptible seed, I Peter 1:23, which is the gift of eternal life. Eternal life means eternal life, it does not mean life for the few minutes until you sin again. Eternal means eternal. God does not lie about that.

    There is no more sacrifice for sin for all sins have been paid for already. Jesus' work is complete in that regard

    Receiving eternal life is about eternal life, having eternal life we can either do the works that God has prepared for us to do and earn rewards and gain an inheritance or not do the works and gain no inheritance or sin and lose inheritance. Having an inheritance is a different issue than having eternal life.

    Departing from the faith does not negate eternal life. It would not be eternal if it was not eternal.

    Read what is written and trust God words not the words of men,not the false doctrines of men as they twist and pollute words found in scripture
    "And they continued stedfastly in the apostles' doctrine and fellowship and in breaking of bread and in prayers." Acts 2:42

    "Fulfil ye my joy, that ye be likeminded, having the same love, being of one accord, of one mind" Philippians 2:2

    Pro scripture = Protestant

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    Quote Originally Posted by beloved57 View Post
    When a person disregards the eternal security of the believer its because they condition salvation on themselves and not Jesus Christ !
    So Judas believed, but still had a temptation for power and money that brought him down. Need to understand that only God will judge who will receive eternal life, not man.

  17. #29
    TOL Legend beloved57's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hobie View Post
    So Judas believed, but still had a temptation for power and money that brought him down. Need to understand that only God will judge who will receive eternal life, not man.
    I don't know what you are talking about.

    Sent from my LGMP260 using Tapatalk
    "... I have my own private opinion that there is no such a thing as
    preaching Christ and him crucified, unless you preach what now-a-days is
    called Calvinism. I have my own ideas, and those I always state boldly. It is
    a nickname to call it Calvinism; Calvinism is the gospel, and nothing else."

    Charles Spurgeon !

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    Quote Originally Posted by Hobie View Post
    Was Peter saved, then how do explain these verses...

    Matthew 16:23
    But he turned, and said unto Peter, Get thee behind me, Satan: thou art an offence unto me: for thou savourest not the things that be of God, but those that be of men.

    Mark 8:33
    But when he had turned about and looked on his disciples, he rebuked Peter, saying, Get thee behind me, Satan: for thou savourest not the things that be of God, but the things that be of men.

    Luke 4:8
    And Jesus answered and said unto him, Get thee behind me, Satan: for it is written, Thou shalt worship the Lord thy God, and him only shalt thou serve.
    I believe Peter as did the other disciples were thinking of an earthly Messiah who would drive the Romans out and make Israel an earthly kingdom. I believe that was the common thinking of the day especially among the Pharisees. Of course the Disciples later learned the truth upon Christ's resurrection.

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