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Thread: Do you believe in predestination ?

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    Do you believe in predestination ?

    This is the million dollar question. Most in mans religions dont believe in this doctrine, or they believe it in a man centered way that deny the Sovereignty of God, but nevertheless its a Salvation Doctrine. In a book and chapter primarily about Salvation Paul writes Eph 1:3-6

    3 Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, who hath blessed us with all spiritual blessings in heavenly places in Christ:

    4 According as he hath chosen us in him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and without blame before him in love:

    5Having predestinated us unto the adoption of children by Jesus Christ to himself, according to the good pleasure of his will,

    6 To the praise of the glory of his grace, wherein he hath made us accepted in the beloved.

    Rom 8:28-30


    28 And we know that all things work together for good to them that love God, to them who are the called according to his purpose.

    29 For whom he did foreknow, he also did predestinate to be conformed to the image of his Son, that he might be the firstborn among many brethren.

    30 Moreover whom he did predestinate, them he also called: and whom he called, them he also justified: and whom he justified, them he also glorified.

    Theres no word of Salvation without predestination.
    "... I have my own private opinion that there is no such a thing as
    preaching Christ and him crucified, unless you preach what now-a-days is
    called Calvinism. I have my own ideas, and those I always state boldly. It is
    a nickname to call it Calvinism; Calvinism is the gospel, and nothing else."

    Charles Spurgeon !

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    Lets please look at Eph 1:5

    5 Having predestinated us unto the adoption of children by Jesus Christ to himself, according to the good pleasure of his will,

    Unto the adoption of Children or the placing as a Son.

    Paul writes in Gal 3:26

    For ye are all the children/sons of God by faith in Christ Jesus

    This therefore tells us that Faith in Christ Jesus, which reveals ones Son-ship with God comes as a result of having been predestinated unto the adoption of Sons.

    So Faith in Christ is a blessing of predestination ! And yet many so called believers dont even believe in predestination !
    "... I have my own private opinion that there is no such a thing as
    preaching Christ and him crucified, unless you preach what now-a-days is
    called Calvinism. I have my own ideas, and those I always state boldly. It is
    a nickname to call it Calvinism; Calvinism is the gospel, and nothing else."

    Charles Spurgeon !

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    Quote Originally Posted by beloved57 View Post
    This is the million dollar question. Most in mans religions dont believe in this doctrine, or they believe it in a man centered way that deny the Sovereignty of God, but nevertheless its a Salvation Doctrine. In a book and chapter primarily about Salvation Paul writes Eph 1:3-6

    3 Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, who hath blessed us with all spiritual blessings in heavenly places in Christ:

    4 According as he hath chosen us in him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and without blame before him in love:

    5Having predestinated us unto the adoption of children by Jesus Christ to himself, according to the good pleasure of his will,

    6 To the praise of the glory of his grace, wherein he hath made us accepted in the beloved.

    Rom 8:28-30


    28 And we know that all things work together for good to them that love God, to them who are the called according to his purpose.

    29 For whom he did foreknow, he also did predestinate to be conformed to the image of his Son, that he might be the firstborn among many brethren.

    30 Moreover whom he did predestinate, them he also called: and whom he called, them he also justified: and whom he justified, them he also glorified.

    Theres no word of Salvation without predestination.

    Absolutely !

    God's Elect were predestinated before time and prior to being called, justified and glorified Rom. 8:30; and called out of darkness to be conformed to the image of Christ in glorification.

    1 Pet. 2:9 But ye are a chosen generation, a royal priesthood, an holy nation, a peculiar people; that ye should shew forth the praises of him who hath called you out of darkness into his marvellous light:
    My soul thirsts for God, the God Who Lives Forever:
    when shall I be brought in to see His Face? -Psalm 42:2

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    That Faith in Christ is a blessing of Gods predestination is seen when we consider this blessed promise Rom 1:16-17

    16 For I am not ashamed of the gospel of Christ: for it is the power of God unto salvation to every one that believeth; to the Jew first, and also to the Greek.

    17 For therein is the righteousness of God revealed from faith to faith: as it is written, The just shall live by faith.

    This is a promise that the Just shall live by Faith This statement is in future indicative , indicating that something will certainly occur in the future. Now what makes it certain ? Gods predestination. Remember some had been predestinated to the adoption of children/sons which is manifested by Faith in Christ !
    Last edited by beloved57; May 15th, 2019 at 10:45 AM.
    "... I have my own private opinion that there is no such a thing as
    preaching Christ and him crucified, unless you preach what now-a-days is
    called Calvinism. I have my own ideas, and those I always state boldly. It is
    a nickname to call it Calvinism; Calvinism is the gospel, and nothing else."

    Charles Spurgeon !

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    Are you saying that the only time salvation is spoken is when predestination is a precursor.
    He is no fool who gives what he cannot keep to gain what he cannot lose.

    Jim Elliot

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    Not only were they predestinated to Faith, but predestinated to be saved They were saved already in the purpose of God before the world began 2 Tim 1:9

    9 Who hath saved us, and called us with an holy calling, not according to our works, but according to his own purpose and grace, which was given us in Christ Jesus before the world began,


    Eph 2:8-9

    8 For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:

    9 Not of works, lest any man should boast.
    "... I have my own private opinion that there is no such a thing as
    preaching Christ and him crucified, unless you preach what now-a-days is
    called Calvinism. I have my own ideas, and those I always state boldly. It is
    a nickname to call it Calvinism; Calvinism is the gospel, and nothing else."

    Charles Spurgeon !

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    Do you believe this is a salvation Scripture?

    John 3:16 King James Version (KJV)
    16 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.
    He is no fool who gives what he cannot keep to gain what he cannot lose.

    Jim Elliot

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    Quote Originally Posted by beloved57 View Post
    Lets please look at Eph 1:5

    5 Having predestinated us unto the adoption of children by Jesus Christ to himself, according to the good pleasure of his will,

    Unto the adoption of Children or the placing as a Son.

    Paul writes in Gal 3:26

    For ye are all the children/sons of God by faith in Christ Jesus

    This therefore tells us that Faith in Christ Jesus, which reveals ones Son-ship with God comes as a result of having been predestinated unto the adoption of Sons.

    So Faith in Christ is a blessing of predestination ! And yet many so called believers dont even believe in predestination !

    Just as you have clearly shown Brother, Paul preached the Gospel of predestination !

    This adoption of Sons Eph. 1:5 results in Faith in Jesus Christ after receiving in our heart the Spirit of Adoption.

    Rom. 8:15 For ye have not received the spirit of bondage again to fear; but ye have received the Spirit of adoption, whereby we cry, Abba, Father.

    And that's a great confirmation that we are His Sons; that from before the foundation of the World Eph. 1:3-4, we have always been His Children !


    Gal. 4:6-7

    6 And because ye are sons, God hath sent forth the Spirit of his Son into your hearts, crying, Abba, Father. 7 Wherefore thou art no more a servant, but a son; and if a son, then an heir of God through Christ.

    Gal. 3:26 For ye are all the children of God by [or because of] Faith.

    And with this scripture Paul warned:

    Gal. 1:8 But though we, or an angel from heaven, preach any other gospel unto you than that which we have preached unto you, let him be accursed.
    Last edited by Nanja; May 15th, 2019 at 03:15 PM.
    My soul thirsts for God, the God Who Lives Forever:
    when shall I be brought in to see His Face? -Psalm 42:2

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    Quote Originally Posted by beloved57 View Post
    That Faith in Christ is a blessing of Gods predestination is seen when we consider this blessed promise Rom 1:16-17

    16 For I am not ashamed of the gospel of Christ: for it is the power of God unto salvation to every one that believeth; to the Jew first, and also to the Greek.

    17 For therein is the righteousness of God revealed from faith to faith: as it is written, The just shall live by faith.

    This is a promise that the Just shall live by Faith This statement is in future indicative , indicating that something will certainly occur in the future. Now what makes it certain ? Gods predestination. Remember some had been predestinated to the adoption of children/sons which is manifested by Faith in Christ !
    Amen Brother !
    My soul thirsts for God, the God Who Lives Forever:
    when shall I be brought in to see His Face? -Psalm 42:2

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    Quote Originally Posted by beloved57 View Post
    Not only were they predestinated to Faith, but predestinated to be saved They were saved already in the purpose of God before the world began 2 Tim 1:9

    9 Who hath saved us, and called us with an holy calling, not according to our works, but according to his own purpose and grace, which was given us in Christ Jesus before the world began,


    Eph 2:8-9

    8 For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:

    9 Not of works, lest any man should boast.

    Exactly ! God's Grace was given exclusively to His Chosen Sons / Children who were already Saved and Called before the world began; not based on anything they do or don't do in time. For Christ's Righteousness was imputed to them, and their sins imputed to Him their Surety Heb. 7:22; Is. 53:6 from Everlasting !

    Rom. 4:6-8

    4 Even as David also describeth the blessedness of the man, unto whom God imputeth righteousness without works, 7 Saying, Blessed are they whose iniquities are forgiven, and whose sins are covered. 8 Blessed is the man to whom the Lord will not impute sin.

    Rom. 9:11 (For the children being not yet born, neither having done any good or evil, that the purpose of God according to election might stand, not of works, but of him that calleth)

    Eph. 3:11 According to the eternal purpose which he purposed in Christ Jesus our Lord:
    My soul thirsts for God, the God Who Lives Forever:
    when shall I be brought in to see His Face? -Psalm 42:2

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    Another scripture that puts forth the truth of faith or believing being the result of predestination is Acts 13:48

    48 And when the Gentiles heard this, they were glad, and glorified the word of the Lord: and as many as were ordained to eternal life believed.

    This word ordained is
    tassō

    to draw up in order, arrange
    Usage: (a) I assign, arrange, (b) I determine; mid: I appoint.
    as many as were appointed (A. V.ordained) (by God) to obtain eternal life, or to whom God bad decreed eternal life,

    The word ordained here is also synonym to destine !

    Now when was eternal life arranged and promised ? Before the world began Titus 1:1-2

    Paul, a servant of God, and an apostle of Jesus Christ, according to the faith of God's elect, and the acknowledging of the truth which is after godliness;

    2 In hope of eternal life, which God, that cannot lie, promised before the world began;

    Promised is closely akin to agreement, arrangement, covenant

    The ISV reads:

    48 When the gentiles heard this, they began rejoicing and glorifying the word of the Lord. Meanwhile, all who had been destined to eternal life believed
    "... I have my own private opinion that there is no such a thing as
    preaching Christ and him crucified, unless you preach what now-a-days is
    called Calvinism. I have my own ideas, and those I always state boldly. It is
    a nickname to call it Calvinism; Calvinism is the gospel, and nothing else."

    Charles Spurgeon !

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    Quote Originally Posted by beloved57 View Post
    This is the million dollar question. Most in mans religions dont believe in this doctrine, or they believe it in a man centered way that deny the Sovereignty of God, but nevertheless its a Salvation Doctrine. In a book and chapter primarily about Salvation Paul writes Eph 1:3-6

    3 Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, who hath blessed us with all spiritual blessings in heavenly places in Christ:

    4 According as he hath chosen us in him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and without blame before him in love:

    5Having predestinated us unto the adoption of children by Jesus Christ to himself, according to the good pleasure of his will,

    6 To the praise of the glory of his grace, wherein he hath made us accepted in the beloved.

    Rom 8:28-30


    28 And we know that all things work together for good to them that love God, to them who are the called according to his purpose.

    29 For whom he did foreknow, he also did predestinate to be conformed to the image of his Son, that he might be the firstborn among many brethren.

    30 Moreover whom he did predestinate, them he also called: and whom he called, them he also justified: and whom he justified, them he also glorified.

    Theres no word of Salvation without predestination.
    Please define the word predestination as you understand it.

    How does Webster's define it?

    What is the Greek definition for it?
    "And they continued stedfastly in the apostles' doctrine and fellowship and in breaking of bread and in prayers." Acts 2:42

    "Fulfil ye my joy, that ye be likeminded, having the same love, being of one accord, of one mind" Philippians 2:2

    Pro scripture = Protestant

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    Quote Originally Posted by beloved57 View Post
    Another scripture that puts forth the truth of faith or believing being the result of predestination is Acts 13:48

    48 And when the Gentiles heard this, they were glad, and glorified the word of the Lord: and as many as were ordained to eternal life believed.

    This word ordained is
    tassō

    to draw up in order, arrange
    Usage: (a) I assign, arrange, (b) I determine; mid: I appoint.
    as many as were appointed (A. V.ordained) (by God) to obtain eternal life, or to whom God bad decreed eternal life,

    The word ordained here is also synonym to destine !

    Now when was eternal life arranged and promised ? Before the world began Titus 1:1-2

    Paul, a servant of God, and an apostle of Jesus Christ, according to the faith of God's elect, and the acknowledging of the truth which is after godliness;

    2 In hope of eternal life, which God, that cannot lie, promised before the world began;

    Promised is closely akin to agreement, arrangement, covenant

    The ISV reads:

    48 When the gentiles heard this, they began rejoicing and glorifying the word of the Lord. Meanwhile, all who had been destined to eternal life believed

    Amen ! Also another scripture that puts forth the Truth of faith or believing being the result of God's predestination is John 6:47:

    Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that believeth on me hath everlasting life.

    This Eternal / Everlasting Life had been Promised exclusively to God's Elect before the world began Titus 1:2, because they had been ordained or determined or destined to it Acts 13:48.


    Now there are many who handle God's Word deceitfully, and persist in teaching the lie that it's their doing the work of believing in their unregenerate mind / heart is what ordains them to eternal life, when in actuality it's nothing but a work of the flesh that cannot please God Rom. 8:8.
    My soul thirsts for God, the God Who Lives Forever:
    when shall I be brought in to see His Face? -Psalm 42:2

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    Quote Originally Posted by beloved57 View Post
    but nevertheless its a Salvation Doctrine.
    Act 4:26 The kings of the earth set themselves, and the rulers were gathered together, against the Lord and against his Anointed'
    Act 4:27 for truly in this city there were gathered together against your holy servant Jesus, whom you anointed, both Herod and Pontius Pilate, along with the Gentiles and the peoples of Israel,
    Act 4:28 to do whatever your hand and your plan had predestined to take place.

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    The Bible clearly teaches predestination of the elect. It's not in doubt within scripture. It certainly is hated by most humans.

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