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Thread: The Gospel. 1 Corinthians 15:1-8.

  1. #46
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    Quote Originally Posted by beloved57 View Post
    Who did Paul mean when he wrote " Christ died for our sins according to scripture" ?
    That would be the identical one's St. John wrote of.

    "He is the Mercy Seat for our sins, and not for our sins ONLY, but for the sins of the whole world."

    He is the hilasmos of the holos!

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    Quote Originally Posted by Aimiel View Post
    I don't believe that God is restricted to our 'view' of time. I believe that He is above time and that is why Paul said:

    For this we say unto you by the word of the Lord, that we which are alive and remain unto the coming of the Lord shall not prevent them which are asleep.


    I believe that the moment we die that we're at the rapture.
    I do not believe that, as nothing says that.

    Also, you say that you have already been translated. Whatever that means.

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    Originally Posted by beloved57

    Who does Paul mean by Christ first of all ? Exactly who was this Christ that died for sins?
    Originally Posted by beloved57

    Who did Paul mean when he wrote " Christ died for our sins according to scripture" ?

    I believe the "first of all" in 1 Cor. 15:3 that Paul was addressing were those Christ specifically died for, and who had a Union with Him before the foundation of the world Eph. 1:3-4 to have forgiveness of sins Eph. 1:7; His Church Eph. 5:25, or His Sheep John 10:11,15, when He died, was buried and raised again in their behalf exclusively. And it's because of that Union with Him, that they are ensured to be born again and raised from spiritual death to Newness of Life in time. Now this Christ who died for their sins is Almighty God !

    Is. 9:6 For unto us a child is born, unto us a son is given: and the government shall be upon his shoulder: and his name shall be called Wonderful, Counsellor, The mighty God, The everlasting Father, The Prince of Peace.
    My soul thirsts for God, the God Who Lives Forever:
    when shall I be brought in to see His Face? -Psalm 42:2

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jacob View Post
    I do not believe that, as nothing says that.
    Scripture says that we won't prevent those who are dead from going into Heaven but that we'll go there together...

    For this we say unto you by the word of the Lord, that we which are alive and remain unto the coming of the Lord shall not prevent them which are asleep. For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first: then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord.

    I believe that those who are 'asleep' are referred to as such because the moment they die is the rapture (from their perspective of time).
    Also, you say that you have already been translated. Whatever that means.
    We're already in The Kingdom...

    Who hath delivered us from the power of darkness, and hath translated us into the kingdom of his dear Son.
    "That man of sin must first be revealed." -- Jesus

    If you haven't tried: you've already failed. -- Aimiel

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jacob View Post
    What about resurrection for the dead and going to heaven for those who are alive when He returns?
    Do you mean that the rapture will take Christians all the way into the third heaven (of 2 Corinthians 12:2b)? If so, note that nothing in the Bible requires that Christians will be raptured any higher than the clouds of the sky, the first heaven, to hold a meeting in the air with Jesus Christ at His future, Second Coming (1 Thessalonians 4:15-17). After that meeting, in which the Church will be judged by Jesus (Psalms 50:3-5, cf. Mark 13:27) and the obedient part of the Church will be married to Jesus (Revelation 19:7, Matthew 25:1-13), the obedient part of the Church will come back down from the sky, the first heaven, with Jesus (Revelation 19:15-21) to physically reign on the earth with Him for 1,000 years (Revelation 20:4-6, Revelation 5:10, Revelation 2:26-29). After the 1,000 years and subsequent events (Revelation 20:7-15, Ezekiel chapters 38-39) the obedient part of the Church will then live on a New Earth, as in a new surface for the earth, with God the Father and Jesus in the literal city of New Jerusalem (Revelation chapters 21-22).

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    Quote Originally Posted by bibleverse2 View Post
    Do you mean that the rapture will take Christians all the way into the third heaven (of 2 Corinthians 12:2b)? If so, note that nothing in the Bible requires that Christians will be raptured any higher than the clouds of the sky, the first heaven, to hold a meeting in the air with Jesus Christ at His future, Second Coming (1 Thessalonians 4:15-17). After that meeting, in which the Church will be judged by Jesus (Psalms 50:3-5, cf. Mark 13:27) and the obedient part of the Church will be married to Jesus (Revelation 19:7, Matthew 25:1-13), the obedient part of the Church will come back down from the sky, the first heaven, with Jesus (Revelation 19:15-21) to physically reign on the earth with Him for 1,000 years (Revelation 20:4-6, Revelation 5:10, Revelation 2:26-29). After the 1,000 years and subsequent events (Revelation 20:7-15, Ezekiel chapters 38-39) the obedient part of the Church will then live on a New Earth, as in a new surface for the earth, with God the Father and Jesus in the literal city of New Jerusalem (Revelation chapters 21-22).
    100% wrong division.

    The elect gathered from the four winds is NOT the body of Christ... it is Israel per prophecy.
    Quote Originally Posted by Squeaky View Post
    That explains why your an idiot.
    Quote Originally Posted by God's Truth View Post
    Father figure, Son figure, and Holy Spirit figure.
    Quote Originally Posted by God's Truth View Post
    You preach against me for preaching obedience to Christ for salvation.
    Col 2:9 (AKJV/PCE)
    (2:9) For in him dwelleth all the fulness of the Godhead bodily.

    1Tim 4:10 (AKJV/PCE)
    (4:10) For therefore we both labour and suffer reproach, because we trust in the living God, who is the Saviour of all men, specially of those that believe.

    Something that was SPOKEN OF since the world began CANNOT be the SAME thing as something KEPT SECRET since the world began.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Right Divider View Post
    100% wrong division.

    The elect gathered from the four winds is NOT the body of Christ... it is Israel per prophecy.
    Yep!

    Deu 7:6 For thou art an holy people unto the LORD thy God: the LORD thy God hath chosen[Heb-bachar/Grk LXX-eklektos/Eng-elect] thee to be a special people unto himself, above all people that are upon the face of the earth.
    Deu 7:7 The LORD did not set his love upon you, nor choose[Heb-bachar/Grk LXX-eklektos/Eng-elect] you, because ye were more in number than any people; for ye were the fewest of all people:
    Deu 7:8 But because the LORD loved you, and because he would keep the oath which he had sworn unto your fathers, hath the LORD brought you out with a mighty hand, and redeemed you out of the house of bondmen, from the hand of Pharaoh king of Egypt.

    Deu 30:4 If any of thine be driven out unto the outmost parts of heaven, from thence will the LORD thy God gather thee, and from thence will he fetch thee:
    Deu 30:5 And the LORD thy God will bring thee into the land which thy fathers possessed, and thou shalt possess it; and he will do thee good, and multiply thee above thy fathers.

    Neh 1:9 But if ye turn unto me, and keep my commandments, and do them; though there were of you cast out unto the uttermost part of the heaven, yet will I gather them from thence, and will bring them unto the place that I have chosen to set my name there.

    Isa 11:12 And he shall set up an ensign for the nations, and shall assemble the outcasts of Israel, and gather together the dispersed of Judah from the four corners of the earth.

    Eze 37:21 And say unto them, Thus saith the Lord GOD; Behold, I will take the children of Israel from among the heathen[nations], whither they be gone, and will gather them on every side, and bring them into their own land:
    Eze 37:22 And I will make them one nation in the land upon the mountains of Israel; and one king shall be king to them all: and they shall be no more two nations, neither shall they be divided into two kingdoms any more at all:

    Mat 24:31 And he shall send his angels with a great sound of a trumpet, and they shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other.

    Rom 15:8 Now I say that Jesus Christ was a minister of the circumcision for the truth of God, to confirm the promises made unto the fathers:
    Jer 23:5 Behold, the days come, saith the LORD[YHVH], that I will raise unto David a righteous Branch, and a King shall reign and prosper, and shall execute judgment and justice in the earth.
    Jer 23:6 In his days Judah shall be saved, and Israel shall dwell safely: and this is his name whereby he[the Branch] shall be called, THE LORD[YHVH] OUR RIGHTEOUSNESS.

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  10. #53
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    Quote Originally Posted by Aimiel View Post
    Scripture says that we won't prevent those who are dead from going into Heaven but that we'll go there together...

    For this we say unto you by the word of the Lord, that we which are alive and remain unto the coming of the Lord shall not prevent them which are asleep. For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first: then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord.

    I believe that those who are 'asleep' are referred to as such because the moment they die is the rapture (from their perspective of time).We're already in The Kingdom...

    Who hath delivered us from the power of darkness, and hath translated us into the kingdom of his dear Son.
    You make much more sense here. Hopefully you can keep working on it.

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    Quote Originally Posted by bibleverse2 View Post
    Do you mean that the rapture will take Christians all the way into the third heaven (of 2 Corinthians 12:2b)? If so, note that nothing in the Bible requires that Christians will be raptured any higher than the clouds of the sky, the first heaven, to hold a meeting in the air with Jesus Christ at His future, Second Coming (1 Thessalonians 4:15-17). After that meeting, in which the Church will be judged by Jesus (Psalms 50:3-5, cf. Mark 13:27) and the obedient part of the Church will be married to Jesus (Revelation 19:7, Matthew 25:1-13), the obedient part of the Church will come back down from the sky, the first heaven, with Jesus (Revelation 19:15-21) to physically reign on the earth with Him for 1,000 years (Revelation 20:4-6, Revelation 5:10, Revelation 2:26-29). After the 1,000 years and subsequent events (Revelation 20:7-15, Ezekiel chapters 38-39) the obedient part of the Church will then live on a New Earth, as in a new surface for the earth, with God the Father and Jesus in the literal city of New Jerusalem (Revelation chapters 21-22).
    So those who are dead would be OT dead not NT dead, for these come with Christ? When we who are alive rise, though there were OT dead who rose with Christ?

    As you can see I am a bit confused.

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