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  1. #1
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    What is holding us back?

    John 14:12 did Jesus Christ say that those that believe on him would do the same works that he and greater works?

    Yes, he did.

    So why are not Christians doing that?

    It is because Christians who are not doing the same works and greater works are not believing.

    Why not?

    Why are we not one with the Father even as Jesus Christ is one with the Father? John 10:30

    If we are not one with the Father then who are we one with? The world? Sin? Satan? A denomination?

    What does it take to become one with the Father?

    What did it take for Jesus Christ to be one with the Father?

    He is God's son, so are we.

    I John 3:2
    Beloved, now are we the sons of God, and it doth not yet appear what we shall be: but we know that, when he shall appear, we shall be like him; for we shall see him as he is.

    Romans 8:14
    For as many as are led by the Spirit of God, they are the sons of God.

    What ever is holding us back we need to mortify so we can be one with the Father as well

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    Fear?

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    Don't know how?

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    How could you not know how?

    Would God have Jesus Christ say that without telling us how?

    Why isn't your denomination teaching you how to do what Jesus Christ said we can do?

    Was Jesus Christ wrong in John 14:12?

    So what excuses do you have?

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    Over 750 post club Guyver's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by oatmeal View Post
    How could you not know how?

    Would God have Jesus Christ say that without telling us how?

    Why isn't your denomination teaching you how to do what Jesus Christ said we can do?

    Was Jesus Christ wrong in John 14:12?

    So what excuses do you have?
    It isnít real? It doesnít work? People donít do the works of Jesus, or the works that Jesus said believers would do because they canít do them. If they could, they would clear out the childrenís hospital by instant healings, the whole world would see it and then become Christian. That doesnít happen because Christians canít do it.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Guyver View Post
    It isnít real? It doesnít work? People donít do the works of Jesus, or the works that Jesus said believers would do because they canít do them. If they could, they would clear out the childrenís hospital by instant healings, the whole world would see it and then become Christian. That doesnít happen because Christians canít do it.
    Guyver? Is that really you?

    Wow, I'm so happy to see you back again.



    And you're exactly correct with your response.

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    Quote Originally Posted by glorydaz View Post
    Guyver? Is that really you?

    Wow, I'm so happy to see you back again.



    And you're exactly correct with your response.
    I wanna thank ya.
    Sometimes the hardest thing and the right thing are the same.

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    Quote Originally Posted by glorydaz View Post
    Guyver? Is that really you?

    Wow, I'm so happy to see you back again.



    And you're exactly correct with your response.
    You might want to read what I replied to his post.

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    Quote Originally Posted by oatmeal View Post
    You might want to read what I replied to his post.
    Well, you be wrong and Guyver be right.

    Those healings you speak of were for a particular time and a particular reason.
    Just like the manna from heaven was for a particular time and a particular reason.

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    Quote Originally Posted by oatmeal View Post
    You might want to read what I replied to his post.
    And you might want to read what Aimiel and I have been discussing.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Guyver View Post
    It isn’t real? It doesn’t work? People don’t do the works of Jesus, or the works that Jesus said believers would do because they can’t do them. If they could, they would clear out the children’s hospital by instant healings, the whole world would see it and then become Christian. That doesn’t happen because Christians can’t do it.
    Jesus Christ said what he meant and he meant what he said.

    John 14:12 is truth.

    God word is truth and Jesus spoke the truth.

    It is up to us to believe.

    We can do them because Jesus Christ said that those who believe on him could. So who is believing on him and who is not?

    I can do all things through Christ, not through my own wisdom or power but through Christ.

    If they could, they would clear out the children’s hospital by instant healings, the whole world would see it and then become Christian. That doesn’t happen because Christians can’t do it.
    Funny you should say that

    Let us read more closely what Jesus Christ said.

    John 14:12

    Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that believeth on me, the works that I do shall he do also; and greater works than these shall he do; because I go unto my Father.

    Why don't we ask what works Jesus Christ did?

    Did Jesus Christ "clear out the children’s hospital by instant healings,"????

    No, he did not.

    (Seems though that you would have a problem with that. Why would you have a problem with that? For that matter, if what you say,
    the whole world would see it and then become Christian.
    is true then I ask, why didn't the whole world become followers of Jesus Christ in the time of his earthly ministry? For that matter, since Jesus Christ did do many healings, miracles, casting out devil spirits, and raising the dead to life again, why hasn't the entire world become Christian?)

    What did he say?

    The same works and greater.

    Did Jesus Christ heal everyone in the world?

    Did Jesus Christ raise all the dead people who had died from Adam and Eve from the dead?

    Why not?

    Why did he not heal everyone?

    Why did he not raise all people from the dead?

    Why only a select few?

    Is that all that Jesus Christ did is heal children? What else did he do?
    Last edited by oatmeal; March 14th, 2019 at 01:36 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by oatmeal View Post
    Jesus Christ said what he meant and he meant what he said.

    John 14:12 is truth.

    God word is truth and Jesus spoke the truth.

    It is up to us to believe
    That post was too big.

    You can believe whatever you wish to believe and I have no doubt that makes it true for you in one sense. People believe all kinds of things.

    But when you start speaking of truth, thatís another thing altogether. If something is going to be true, then it has be real or itís make believe. Make believing doesnít make anything true.

    Thereís no question that thereís no Christians clearing out the childrenís hospital because they have no power to do it. And since they donít, thereís no good reason to believe they ever did from a truth perspective.
    Sometimes the hardest thing and the right thing are the same.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Guyver View Post
    That post was too big.

    You can believe whatever you wish to believe and I have no doubt that makes it true for you in one sense. People believe all kinds of things.

    But when you start speaking of truth, thatís another thing altogether. If something is going to be true, then it has be real or itís make believe. Make believing doesnít make anything true.

    Thereís no question that thereís no Christians clearing out the childrenís hospital because they have no power to do it. And since they donít, thereís no good reason to believe they ever did from a truth perspective.
    Amen.

    Unfortunately some today don't want to believe that God's marching orders change, depending on the dispensation. This is not the age of signs and wonders, no matter how badly man wants to perform such things.

    Acts 5:12 And by the hands of the apostles were many signs and wonders wrought among the people; (and they were all with one accord in Solomon's porch.

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    Why don't we simply believe what is written?

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    Quote Originally Posted by oatmeal View Post
    Why don't we simply believe what is written?
    You really don't get it. It's what I tried telling you the other day (I think it was you) when you quoted from John and tried to apply it to yourself and everyone else. You're doing the same thing in the OP here.

    The reason people don't believe the same is because they don't believe the same.

    The reason they don't believe the same is because they're reading 100 different Bibles, even if they all use the same translation.

    That's the problem. That's why an idea like TOL is ultimately a waste of time when people don't/can't/won't agree on how the Bible is to be rightly understood.

    If that point is not settled, anything beyond that point is a complete and total waste of everyone's time. Any agreement they may have will be merely a matter of coincidental details; the fundamental chasm remains.

    The reason I stay here is because of the people who I align with, not the people I don't. They're pretty much immune to everything we say...but they'd say the same about us. And so would you.

    Why don't we simply believe what is written?
    Different Bibles. That's your answer.
    "There is one thing worse than going to Hell. That would be going to Hell and having it be a surprise."
    Terence Mc Lean

    [most will be very surprised]


    Everyone who has not believed the Gospel of grace is not saved, no matter what else they believe or do.
    By that measure, how many professing Christians are on their way to the Lake of Fire?

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