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Thread: Jesus CANNOT be Jehovah/YHVH God

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    Quote Originally Posted by clefty View Post
    and by that you mean we DON’T have to keep His commandments...DON’T have to follow Him His way becoming more like He was or living as He did...

    Cuz when I observe Him I observe Him instructing us Matt 23:2 “The scribes and Pharisees sit in Moses’ seat. 3So practice and observe everything they tell you. But do not do what they do, for they do not practice what they preach...”
    There are no more scribes and Pharisees, and there is no more temple building.
    The temple was destroyed and no one can or is supposed to obey the old law anymore.


    Quote Originally Posted by clefty View Post
    sure...those that did wanted to...those that didnt want to didnt and fell into doing something else...unbelieving otherwise first...

    Goyim were with them the whole time as the Sabbath commandment is the only one that includes them...the irony...
    Why do you keep saying ‘goyim’? It’s like the only Jewish word you use.
    Quote Originally Posted by clefty View Post

    ONE LAW for native and goyim alike...goyim crowded synagogues to hear of One resurrected...begged for more the next Sabbath and then almost the whole city showed up...on Sabbath

    circumcision NEVER saved...as how can something done TO you by others save you without your consent? Is why we don’t baptise infants even...
    The Jews had to obey the law or they would be cut off from God.
    As for Moses, he had to circumcise his son or what would happen?
    Why did you avoid that question?

    Quote Originally Posted by clefty View Post
    you ever sell a house car or shoes? You change owners not the thing sold...the transfer of the Law to another administration happens all the time as it did when He became its Final High Priest to ministrate it...
    Jesus came and gave a new testament, a new covenant.

    Quote Originally Posted by clefty View Post
    yup even pray you wont break the Sabbath fleeing future persecutions...or have to flee in the winter...He obviously expected winters and Sabbaths to continue...
    The gates were closed on the Sabbath and the Jews would have a hard time fleeing.

    Nehemiah 13: 19 And it came to pass, that when the gates of Jerusalem began to be dark before the sabbath, I commanded that the gates should be shut, and charged that they should not be opened till after the sabbath: and some of my servants set I at the gates, that there should no burden be brought in on the sabbath day.

    Quote Originally Posted by clefty View Post
    Those ordinances WERE the law.
    without law there is not debt...you just destroyed the reason you need a Savior...destroy the Law...destroy your need of salvation...
    That is just beyond ignorant. Jesus reconciles us to God and he had to come and die for us.
    Jesus gave us new guidelines to obey.
    Quote Originally Posted by clefty View Post

    Those ordinance were hand written NOT by the finger of Yah...His Law was...By His own Finger

    LOL you are really twisted and tortured over this...you dont just have faith in the law you DO IT...and live...not just faith but actually live...the man who does shall live by them...we are redeemed from its curse thus live...we are NOT redeemed from THE LAW...is why Judgement Day remains...and Paul is clear we ESTABISH LAW...the the law we establish represents the One we serve
    The law was not based on faith that is what God says.
    The people had to clean themselves by doing the purification/ceremonial works of the law. Now we do not clean ourselves because Jesus does it, just by our faith that he does, after we repent of our sins and call on him.

    Quote Originally Posted by clefty View Post
    NOPE...once justified is what His people WANT TO DO...no bitterness as they are IN LOVE...
    The bitter root is about people saying we have to do the old law.
    Quote Originally Posted by clefty View Post

    Yup...IN LOVE with Him is to realize what He did for you...and thus love His teachings and want to obey...is why His yoke is easy and His burden is light...no bitterness
    Your bitterness is when you put a day up there with Jesus. Jesus is our Sabbath Rest, and a day is just a day.
    Oh how I love the Word of God!

    Do not just read the word do it.

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    Quote Originally Posted by clefty View Post
    ummm wow so two persons in the same space...maybe one is on the other’s bosom?
    All humans have their own spirit. Jesus’ spirit happens to be the Spirit of God.
    Quote Originally Posted by clefty View Post

    In the 10 what changed? NOTHING
    We have commands from Jesus, and he does not tell us we have to do the old rules for the Sabbath. Do you really do the old rules for the Sabbath? Have you lifted anything on a Sabbath?
    Jesus’ new rule concerning the Sabbath is for us not to do wrong but to do good.

    A NO WORK rule was in place for the old rules for the Sabbath day. Faith and NO WORKS save us; Jesus says it is UNLAWFUL to do evil on the NO WORK day of the Sabbath, and Jesus said it was LAWFUL to do good on the NO WORK day of the Sabbath, see Luke 6:9.
    Oh how I love the Word of God!

    Do not just read the word do it.

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    Quote Originally Posted by clefty View Post
    Wait wut? Earthy things dont matter anymore?
    You are playing games with what I said.
    It is a temple made by hands that doesn't matter anymore.
    Oh how I love the Word of God!

    Do not just read the word do it.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Dartman View Post
    "I am" is never a name.

    And God spoke to Moses, saying, I am THE BEING; and he said, Thus shall ye
    say to the children of Israel, THE BEING has sent me to you. LXX
    And Jesus is that Being.
    Oh how I love the Word of God!

    Do not just read the word do it.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Apple7 View Post
    Dartman has taken one too many darts to the head...
    He doesn't like the screen name I use, but he thinks we should like Dartman.

    King James Bible
    Above all, taking the shield of faith, wherewith ye shall be able to quench all the fiery darts of the wicked.
    Oh how I love the Word of God!

    Do not just read the word do it.

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    Quote Originally Posted by God's Truth View Post
    There are no more scribes and Pharisees, and there is no more temple building.
    The temple was destroyed and no one can or is supposed to obey the old law anymore.
    the scribes and pharisees were made to administer the immutable eternal Law...the temple was made to house It in...

    We are the new ministers of that same IMMUTABLE ETERNAL LAW...our bodies are the temples in which it is now housed...written in our now circumcised hearts and minds...

    You conflate moral law with ceremonial law...confuse literal with spiritual...replace obedience and lawfulness with liberty and lawlessness...


    Why do you keep saying ‘goyim’? It’s like the only Jewish word you use.
    because you are doing the same thing they are...seperating His people...replacing the wall He abolished...

    They use goyim to designate between Jew and NOT JEW and they claim Yahushua changed the customs Moses delivered...SO DO YOU...on both counts...

    What’s the matter you don’t like being seperated? Then stop seperating yourself and LIVE AS HE DID...according to His customs and even as Paul did...NO DISTINCTION between jew and goyim Peter preached multiple times



    The Jews had to obey the law or they would be cut off from God.
    As for Moses, he had to circumcise his son or what would happen?
    Why did you avoid that question?
    the jews were saved BEFORE they even received the Law...keeping the Law did not MAKE THEM CHILDREN OF ABRAHAM...they already were...

    And if they were cut off for disobeying it was because ALREADY INSIDE THEY WERE UNCLEAN UNCIRCUMCISED...


    Jesus came and gave a new testament, a new covenant.
    SAME LAWS...but NEW administration...

    Because of Sabbath you reject all the others? LOL

    The 10 remain as Matt 23:3 confirms this...

    you really think the 10 commandments were not included in His life and teaching when He said keep my commandments...do my Father’s will...Love as I loved you...

    He signed and sealed the new covenant having taught and demonstrated Sabbath keeping...the first day in that new covenant age was a SABBATH just like the first full day in the EDENIC one...neat eh?

    Is why James the brother of Yahushua concluded the council they convened in jerusalem (as too many goyim were crowding the synagogues on the sabbath and rules of fellowship were necessary) with the expectation that Moses would continue to be heard preached and read in all cities EVERY SABATH...

    4 things were required...all 4 were already from the ONE LAW for native and goyim in the OT...3 of which where levitical kosher laws...imagine that this AFTER Peter had the vision...

    So well NO DISTINCTION...or do you expect only these 4 things were required of the goyim...the other 9 Laws were not expected as they were abolished right? LOL

    Yup James expected goyim to keep crowding into synagogues on Sabbaths to hear more about Moses and the One resurrected and why He was killed why He was raised...etc

    THESE GOYIM WANTED TO OBEY...begged Paul to return the next Sabbath to preach more...not come back the next day...the next Sabbath almost the whole goyim city showed up...


    The gates were closed on the Sabbath and the Jews would have a hard time fleeing.
    the walls went around Judea did they? “...let those who are in Judea flee to the mountains...” but NOT on the Sabbath as fleeing aint resting...you know keeping the Sabbath..

    Nehemiah 13: 19 And it came to pass, that when the gates of Jerusalem began to be dark before the sabbath, I commanded that the gates should be shut, and charged that they should not be opened till after the sabbath: and some of my servants set I at the gates, that there should no burden be brought in on the sabbath day.
    that sabbath gate closing thingy is SOOOO OT...dontcha know they would have stopped doing that at 70AD LOL

    Yahushua fully expected winter times and Sabbath times to continue...long after His DBR and ascension...


    That is just beyond ignorant. Jesus reconciles us to God and he had to come and die for us.
    Jesus gave us new guidelines to obey.
    reconcile us to a LAWLESS GOD? LOL try not keeping one of His lawsin the kingdom you are to reign...

    SEE? Long before you even enter His undivided house...your unclean uncircumcised heart will bare witness with different your rebellious fruit...bitter and opposite what the tree its trunk and root produce...


    The law was not based on faith that is what God says.
    do this and live...and now forever by faith with works...grace received the world overcome by Him in us...

    [quoteThe people had to clean themselves by doing the purification/ceremonial works of the law. Now we do not clean ourselves because Jesus does it, just by our faith that he does, after we repent of our sins and call on him.[/quote] receive the Holy Spirit because we obey...just like they did...Spirit cleanses us it is so true to live MORE LIKE HE DID...less like the world and our former selves...


    The bitter root is about people saying we have to do the old law.
    happily I am not saying that at all...but saved His WANT TO...want to hear Moses preached as He did and DID what He preached and asked we do the same to follow Him...


    Your bitterness is when you put a day up there with Jesus. Jesus is our Sabbath Rest, and a day is just a day.
    your rebellious uncircumcised unclean heart is noted...

    He is NOT a period of time...He is the Lord of the Sabbath...which you reject...the very thing that authorizes Him as Lord...

    You rather follow jewish false witness...that He changed the Law...His Father’s IMMUTABLE ETERNAL LAW

    Rather make Him and others LIARS when it remains “Here are they that keep the commandments of Yah and the faith OF Yahushua”...all of them...and have the same faith as He practiced...same faith walk He walked...

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    Quote Originally Posted by God's Truth View Post
    All humans have their own spirit. Jesus’ spirit happens to be the Spirit of God.
    yes a spirit that returns to Him upon death...His spirit changes us to be more like Him...given to us when we obey...given even more when we obey further...and so it goes until the end...the Last Day

    We have commands from Jesus, and he does not tell us we have to do the old rules for the Sabbath. Do you really do the old rules for the Sabbath? Have you lifted anything on a Sabbath?
    Jesus’ new rule concerning the Sabbath is for us not to do wrong but to do good.
    you make void the commandments of Yah with the traditions of man...you your idolatrous EVE (who also added to His word and deceived herself by it) is showing...

    Sabbath was given many additional laws by man which He rejected to clarify His Father’s Will

    A NO WORK rule was in place for the old rules for the Sabbath day. Faith and NO WORKS save us; Jesus says it is UNLAWFUL to do evil on the NO WORK day of the Sabbath, and Jesus said it was LAWFUL to do good on the NO WORK day of the Sabbath, see Luke 6:9.
    Yes see? Sabbath remains just not the additional traditions.

    SEVEN TIMES Yahushua healed people that could easily have waited until the next day...

    SEVEN TIMES Yahushua healed to provoke and trigger Pharisees about their own traditions...

    Seven times Yahushua wished to remind that Sabbath HEALS...as He Himself rose on the Sabbath day healed rested and refreshed...that first full day of the new covenant age...

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    Quote Originally Posted by God's Truth View Post
    You are playing games with what I said.
    It is a temple made by hands that doesn't matter anymore.
    You started it...and losing you lash out with a red card rep point...lol

    It is a temple made by hands that NEVER MATTERED TO Him...He wanted we learn MERCY RATHER THAN SACRIFICE...we wanted a glorious building...

    He rather His people house HIS ETERNAL IMMUTABLE LAW written on our circumcised hearts and minds...

    He never wanted the physical temple...David did

    Cyrus built the second temple which NEVER HAD HIS SPIRIT...until It showed up in the infant body of Yahushua in according to the LAW

    That temple was destroyed again as it was an IDOL...jews wanted IT and rejected Him

    Of course the temple no longer matters...He never wanted it...humans do...

    unbelievers still want one and plan to build a THIRD one...an abomination of desolation...this of course will trigger the END...some will be raptured....2/3 jews will be killed...a christ will rule in a new world order...yada yada yada

    Its not the house but the His LAWFUL Spirit...not the building but the Law is housed...

    And here you are claiming the Law He taught and lived doesnt matter...is abolished...

    What lawless games you and yours play...

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    Quote Originally Posted by Apple7 View Post
    We are not discussing the Tetragrammaton, however, here is the lexical definition...

    יְהוָה = “Yahweh”

    “Yahweh” definition:

    H3068 Singular noun. The Tetragrammaton YHWH, the Lord, or Yahweh, the personal name of God and His most frequent designation in scripture, occurring 5321x. The word refers to the proper name of the God of Israel, particularly the name by which He revealed Himself to Moses (Ex: 6.2-3). It comes from the root “hawa” H1961, which means either existence, or development; “to be”. “The existing one”.

    H1961 “hawa” A primitive root (compare H1933); to exist, that is, be or become, come to pass (always emphatic, and not a mere copula or auxiliary): - beacon, X altogether, be (-come, accomplished, committed, like), break, cause, come (to pass), continue, do, faint, fall, + follow, happen, X have, last, pertain, quit (one-) self, require, X use.

    H1933 “havah” A primitive root supposed to mean properly to breathe; to be (in the sense of existence): - be, X have.


    References:
    Theological Dictionary of the New Testament (TDNT), Gerhard Kittel, Gerhard Friedrich, & Geoffrey W. Bromiley, volume three, pp. 1067 - 1081
    Theological Wordbook of the Old Testament (TWOT) #484a, Harris, Archer, Waltke, volume 1, pp. 210 – 212
    The Complete Wordstudy Dictionary of the Old Testament, Warren Baker, Eugene Carpenter, p. 426

    I see these roots are mistaken as intransitive nouns. Why is the direct object marker never or rarely used with them?

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    Hebrews 1:8
    But of the Son he says, “Your throne, O God, is forever and ever, the scepter of uprightness is the scepter of your kingdom.

    One being...three person's...

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    Quote Originally Posted by GT View Post
    And Jesus is that Being.
    Impossible.

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    Quote Originally Posted by MennoSota View Post
    Hebrews 1:8
    But of the Son he says, “Your throne, O God, is forever and ever, the scepter of uprightness is the scepter of your kingdom.
    Ps 45:1-11
    My heart is inditing a good matter: I speak of the things which I have made touching the king: my tongue is the pen of a ready writer.
    2 Thou art fairer than the children of men: grace is poured into thy lips: therefore God hath blessed thee for ever.
    3 Gird thy sword upon thy thigh, O most mighty, with thy glory and thy majesty.
    4 And in thy majesty ride prosperously because of truth and meekness and righteousness; and thy right hand shall teach thee terrible things.
    5 Thine arrows are sharp in the heart of the king's enemies; whereby the people fall under thee.
    6 Thy throne, O God, is for ever and ever: the sceptre of thy kingdom is a right sceptre.
    7 Thou lovest righteousness, and hatest wickedness: therefore God, thy God, hath anointed thee with the oil of gladness above thy fellows.
    8 All thy garments smell of myrrh, and aloes, and cassia, out of the ivory palaces, whereby they have made thee glad.
    9 Kings' daughters were among thy honourable women: upon thy right hand did stand the queen in gold of Ophir.
    10 Hearken, O daughter, and consider, and incline thine ear; forget also thine own people, and thy father's house;
    11 So shall the king greatly desire thy beauty: for he is thy Lord; and worship thou him.


    This is a prophecy concerning the KINGS of Israel, which CLEARLY includes Jesus.... even though the remarks about women don't apply to Jesus, but are more specific.
    And, in this text, you skipped
    ...therefore God, thy God, hath anointed thee with the oil of gladness above thy fellows.


    .... I wonder why you would skip that .......

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    Quote Originally Posted by Dartman View Post
    Ps 45:1-11
    My heart is inditing a good matter: I speak of the things which I have made touching the king: my tongue is the pen of a ready writer.
    2 Thou art fairer than the children of men: grace is poured into thy lips: therefore God hath blessed thee for ever.
    3 Gird thy sword upon thy thigh, O most mighty, with thy glory and thy majesty.
    4 And in thy majesty ride prosperously because of truth and meekness and righteousness; and thy right hand shall teach thee terrible things.
    5 Thine arrows are sharp in the heart of the king's enemies; whereby the people fall under thee.
    6 Thy throne, O God, is for ever and ever: the sceptre of thy kingdom is a right sceptre.
    7 Thou lovest righteousness, and hatest wickedness: therefore God, thy God, hath anointed thee with the oil of gladness above thy fellows.
    8 All thy garments smell of myrrh, and aloes, and cassia, out of the ivory palaces, whereby they have made thee glad.
    9 Kings' daughters were among thy honourable women: upon thy right hand did stand the queen in gold of Ophir.
    10 Hearken, O daughter, and consider, and incline thine ear; forget also thine own people, and thy father's house;
    11 So shall the king greatly desire thy beauty: for he is thy Lord; and worship thou him.


    This is a prophecy concerning the KINGS of Israel, which CLEARLY includes Jesus.... even though the remarks about women don't apply to Jesus, but are more specific.
    And, in this text, you skipped
    ...therefore God, thy God, hath anointed thee with the oil of gladness above thy fellows.


    .... I wonder why you would skip that .......
    Why do you ignore Hebrews...
    Hebrews 1:8

    But of the Son he says, “Your throne, O God, is forever and ever, the scepter of uprightness is the scepter of your kingdom.

    One being...three person's...

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    Quote Originally Posted by MennoSota View Post
    Why do you ignore Hebrews...
    Hebrews 1:8
    Why would you state an untruth like this?
    I directly addressed Heb 1:8 AND 9

    Why do you ignore Heb 1:9???

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    Quote Originally Posted by God's Truth View Post
    The Holy Spirit IS the Spirit of God. Jesus is the Spirit. There are three and the three are one and the same.





    The Old Testament is full of prophecies about what was coming, about who was coming.

    The Holy Spirit is simply another name for God who is both holy and spirit

    Another name of scores of names that God uses torefer to himself.

    You know how
    The Holy Spirit IS the Spirit of God. Jesus is the Spirit. There are three and the three are one and the same.
    absured that is in light of the scriptures I posted.

    You excel at contradicting scripture
    "And they continued stedfastly in the apostles' doctrine and fellowship and in breaking of bread and in prayers." Acts 2:42

    "Fulfil ye my joy, that ye be likeminded, having the same love, being of one accord, of one mind" Philippians 2:2

    Pro scripture = Protestant

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