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Thread: Trinity Proof Scriptures

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    Quote Originally Posted by Aimiel View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Mixed_Brown
    John 10:30 "I and the Father are one.

    This is discussing the union between the Father and Son. This is not saying they are one in being
    But, you didn't say WHY it doesn't say that They're One in Being.
    1)It doesn't say "being" in the verse at all. So, I'm guessing you actually meant, "you didn't say WHY it doesn't mean they're only one being".
    2) MANY Scriptures prove they are NOT one being.
    3) Jesus himself explains, ALL believers are one, EVEN AS Jesus and his God are one.

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    Quote Originally Posted by JudgeRightly View Post
    First of all... who are you talking to?



    In other words, you're asking trinitarians, who use the entire Bible, which states that He is triune, to state which verses say that He is not?
    No, he's merely asking for honesty.
    And cited a wonderful example; 1 John 5:7.... which separates the trinitarians who are honest about the text, from those who refuse to admit that ANY of their pet texts might be false.
    Quote Originally Posted by JR
    See, here's the thing. The burden of proof is on you to show that what the Bible says, which is that God is triune, is wrong.

    It's called "onus probandi."
    See, here is the thing .... there are ZERO Scriptures that state God is triune .... and there are MANY that state God is ONE .... and Jesus himself said of his God ...

    John 17:3 "This is eternal life, that they may know You, the only true God, and Jesus Christ whom You have sent.

    the ONLY true God!!!

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    Quote Originally Posted by JudgeRightly View Post
    First of all... who are you talking to?



    In other words, you're asking trinitarians, who use the entire Bible, which states that He is triune, to state which verses say that He is not?

    Are you trying to introduce contradiction into scripture?



    See, here's the thing. The burden of proof is on you to show that what the Bible says, which is that God is triune, is wrong.

    It's called "onus probandi."
    What was your username last time?
    "There is one thing worse than going to Hell. That would be going to Hell and having it be a surprise."
    Terence Mc Lean

    [most will be very surprised]


    Everyone who has not believed the Gospel of grace is not saved, no matter what else they believe or do.
    By that measure, how many professing Christians are on their way to the Lake of Fire?

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    "There is one thing worse than going to Hell. That would be going to Hell and having it be a surprise."
    Terence Mc Lean

    [most will be very surprised]


    Everyone who has not believed the Gospel of grace is not saved, no matter what else they believe or do.
    By that measure, how many professing Christians are on their way to the Lake of Fire?

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    Does the Bible refer to three distinct persons? Yes.

    Is each of the three referred to, at some point, as God? Yes.

    Does the Bible say there only one God? Yes.

    The Trinity position aligns with with what the Bible says.
    "There is one thing worse than going to Hell. That would be going to Hell and having it be a surprise."
    Terence Mc Lean

    [most will be very surprised]


    Everyone who has not believed the Gospel of grace is not saved, no matter what else they believe or do.
    By that measure, how many professing Christians are on their way to the Lake of Fire?

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    Quote Originally Posted by musterion View Post
    What was your username last time?
    I'm not following you...

    The only other username I've had was MasterWhiteWolf, which I had Knight change shortly after joining TOL to JudgeRightly.

    I joined in 2015.

    This is the only account I've ever had.

    Quote Originally Posted by musterion View Post


    Quote Originally Posted by musterion View Post
    Does the Bible refer to three distinct persons? Yes.

    Is each of the three referred to, at some point, as God? Yes.

    Does the Bible say there only one God? Yes.

    The Trinity position aligns with with what the Bible says.

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    In other words, you're asking trinitarians, who use the entire Bible, which states that He is triune, to state which verses say that He is not?

    Are you trying to introduce contradiction into scripture?
    Let me just say I am trying to be a sincere as possible. This is one of the responses I feared I would get from creating this thread. You know I'm non trinitarian so your trying to attack what I'm saying rather than listening to what I'm asking.

    Let me try and clarify.
    Trinitarians (As a whole) use many scriptures to teach the trinity. Some of these clearly are being misused.
    See post no.1 for examples
    I am asking trinitarians (and non) to be honest and state which scriptures are often used to defend the trinity, but are being interpreted incorrectly in doing so? ( I didn't say you cant use other scriptures to try and prove the trinity, but there clearly are some that shouldn't be used. I even gave 2 examples)



    See, here's the thing. The burden of proof is on you to show that what the Bible says, which is that God is triune, is wrong.

    It's called "onus probandi."
    The burden of proof would be on me, if that is what I was debating, I'm not. I clearly stated I'm not debating whether the trinity is true.
    See the 1st post,if you are actually interested in the question I asked?

    Please can I ask that instead of reply to my post with pro trinity idology, you please read what I asked and the examples I gave.

    I believe we should all be as honest as possible. If you cant be honest about these scriptures that I highlighted, then how can anyone be who reads this thread that is looking for truth, ever believe that you will be honest about the other things you teach.

    Maybe in the future we can debate the trinity in another thread, but for now let want to discuss the question I asked please

    Kind Regards
    Mixed

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    Quote Originally Posted by Dartman View Post
    No, he's merely asking for honesty.
    And cited a wonderful example; 1 John 5:7.... which separates the trinitarians who are honest about the text, from those who refuse to admit that ANY of their pet texts might be false.
    I don't consider 1 John 5:7 to be inspired Scripture, but a verse that was added later, either in full or in part.

    Also, have you noticed that not once have I used that verse to defend my beliefs.

    See, here is the thing .... there are ZERO Scriptures that state God is triune
    Of course there aren't, not explicitly stated, at least. Just like there are no scriptures that state explicitly other things that are true.

    But once again, you're missing the forest for the trees. Looking to individual verses instead of getting a grasp of what the entirety of Scripture says, an overview, if you will.

    .... and there are MANY that state God is ONE
    Something that Trinitarians do not disagree with, so what's your point?

    .... and Jesus himself said of his God ...

    John 17:3 "This is eternal life, that they may know You, the only true God, and Jesus Christ whom You have sent.

    the ONLY true God!!!
    Once again:

    If the verse had said, "ONLY YOU, the true God," you would have a case against the position that God is triune.

    But it does NOT say that.

    It says, "know You [The Father], the only true God."

    "Only" is describing God, not "You."

    We Trinitarians believe there is only one God. He is Father, Son, Holy Spirit, three Persons.

    The Father is the only true God.
    The Son is the only true God.
    The Holy Spirit is the only true God.

    To say otherwise is to make an argument from silence (fallacious logic), that since scripture only says that "the Father is the only true God," but does not say the same about the Son and the Holy Spirit, therefore the Son is not also the only true God, and the Holy Spirit is not also the only true God.

    The LORD our God, the LORD is one.
    The YHWH our Elohim, the YHWH is echad.

    Echad means one of unity, a plurality, like several people are one group, not of singularity, like a single person is one person.

    The ending "-im" in Hebrew indicates a plurality, like with cherub and cherubim, seraph and seraphim. Elohim is the plural form of "El", which is the singular form of the word for God. Ellah indicates duality. Elohim is more than two, a plurality, yet still one.

    Which is why, from the very first verse in the Bible, Moses wrote...


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    Quote Originally Posted by JudgeRightly View Post
    Talk about missing the forest for the trees...

    Sheesh....
    To use clueless to describe keypurr would be a terrible insult to the word clueless.
    Quote Originally Posted by Squeaky View Post
    That explains why your an idiot.
    Quote Originally Posted by God's Truth View Post
    Father figure, Son figure, and Holy Spirit figure.
    Quote Originally Posted by God's Truth View Post
    You preach against me for preaching obedience to Christ for salvation.
    Col 2:9 (AKJV/PCE)
    (2:9) For in him dwelleth all the fulness of the Godhead bodily.

    1Tim 4:10 (AKJV/PCE)
    (4:10) For therefore we both labour and suffer reproach, because we trust in the living God, who is the Saviour of all men, specially of those that believe.

    Something that was SPOKEN OF since the world began CANNOT be the SAME thing as something KEPT SECRET since the world began.

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    Quote Originally Posted by JudgeRightly View Post
    I'm not following you...

    The only other username I've had was MasterWhiteWolf, which I had Knight change shortly after joining TOL to JudgeRightly.

    I joined in 2015.

    This is the only account I've ever had.







    Sorry! That was meant for mixed brown.
    "There is one thing worse than going to Hell. That would be going to Hell and having it be a surprise."
    Terence Mc Lean

    [most will be very surprised]


    Everyone who has not believed the Gospel of grace is not saved, no matter what else they believe or do.
    By that measure, how many professing Christians are on their way to the Lake of Fire?

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    Quote Originally Posted by musterion View Post
    Sorry! That was meant for mixed brown.
    All's good then

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    Quote Originally Posted by Right Divider View Post
    To use clueless to describe keypurr would be a terrible insult to the word clueless.
    Fair point.

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    Quote Originally Posted by JudgeRightly View Post
    I don't consider 1 John 5:7 to be inspired Scripture, but a verse that was added later, either in full or in part.
    Awesome! I respect that level of honesty ..... but not all your trinitarian friends are that honest ..... which was the point of the OP.

    Quote Originally Posted by JudgeRightly View Post
    Of course there aren't, not explicitly stated, at least. Just like there are no scriptures that state explicitly other things that are true.
    Sorry, "of course there aren't" is completely unacceptable for a Doctrine that is the most important in ALL the Gospel. And, this is in STARK CONTRAST to the CLEAR, CONSISTENT message that ONLY Jehovah is God.... ONLY the Father is God.
    How can you justify the vacuum of verses that state your premise, with the VAST quantities of Scriptures that contradict your premise??
    Quote Originally Posted by JR
    But once again, you're missing the forest for the trees. Looking to individual verses instead of getting a grasp of what the entirety of Scripture says, an overview, if you will.
    Sorry, that criticism goes to the trinity/oneness theories.
    You just admitted there are NONE that explicitly state your premise!

    Quote Originally Posted by JR

    Once again:

    If the verse had said, "ONLY YOU, the true God," you would have a case against the position that God is triune.

    But it does NOT say that.
    Of course it does. The verse plainly states that eternal life = 1) knowing that the Father is "the ONLY true God" 2) knowing that Jesus was sent by the only true God.
    Quote Originally Posted by JR
    It says, "know You [The Father], the only true God."

    "Only" is describing God, not "You."
    NOW YOUR DENYING THAT THE FATHER IS GOD??????????

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    Quote Originally Posted by musterion View Post
    Sorry, all these coincidences don't offset Jehovah's words, and Christ's words.

    Deut 18:17-19 And Jehovah said unto me, They have well said that which they have spoken.
    18 I will raise them up a prophet from among their brethren, like unto thee; and I will put my words in his mouth, and he shall speak unto them all that I shall command him.
    19 And it shall come to pass, that whosoever will not hearken unto my words which he shall speak in my name, I will require it of him.


    John 12:49-50 For I spake not from myself; but the Father that sent me, He hath given me a commandment, what I should say, and what I should speak. 50 And I know that His commandment is life eternal: the things therefore which I speak, even as the Father hath said unto me, so I speak.

    John 14:24 He that loveth me not keepeth not my words: and the word which ye hear is not mine, but the Father's who sent me.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Dartman View Post
    Sorry, all these coincidences don't offset Jehovah's words, and Christ's words.

    Deut 18:17-19 And Jehovah said unto me, They have well said that which they have spoken.
    18 I will raise them up a prophet from among their brethren, like unto thee; and I will put my words in his mouth, and he shall speak unto them all that I shall command him.
    19 And it shall come to pass, that whosoever will not hearken unto my words which he shall speak in my name, I will require it of him.


    John 12:49-50 For I spake not from myself; but the Father that sent me, He hath given me a commandment, what I should say, and what I should speak. 50 And I know that His commandment is life eternal: the things therefore which I speak, even as the Father hath said unto me, so I speak.

    John 14:24 He that loveth me not keepeth not my words: and the word which ye hear is not mine, but the Father's who sent me.

    Coincidences?

    In the Bible?

    You are an idiot.
    "There is one thing worse than going to Hell. That would be going to Hell and having it be a surprise."
    Terence Mc Lean

    [most will be very surprised]


    Everyone who has not believed the Gospel of grace is not saved, no matter what else they believe or do.
    By that measure, how many professing Christians are on their way to the Lake of Fire?

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