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Thread: Hermeneutics - The Who? What? Where? and When? of Scripture

  1. #31
    TOL Legend Jerry Shugart's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by iamaberean View Post
    The age of Law has ended. We are in the age of Grace and according to biblical info I have read, this age is just about over.
    There is no such thing as an "age" of grace because throughout history men have been saved in only one way--by grace through faith.

    The kingdom age will not even be near until the Lord Jesus returns to the earth, as witnessed by what the He said in the following passage:

    "And then shall they see the Son of man coming in a cloud with power and great glory. And when these things begin to come to pass, then look up, and lift up your heads; for your redemption draweth nigh. And he spake to them a parable; Behold the fig tree, and all the trees; When they now shoot forth, ye see and know of your own selves that summer is now nigh at hand. So likewise ye, when ye see these things come to pass, know ye that the kingdom of God is nigh at hand" (Lk.21:27-31).

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  3. #32
    Over 750 post club iamaberean's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jerry Shugart View Post
    There is no such thing as an "age" of grace because throughout history men have been saved in only one way--by grace through faith.

    The kingdom age will not even be near until the Lord Jesus returns to the earth, as witnessed by what the He said in the following passage:

    "And then shall they see the Son of man coming in a cloud with power and great glory. And when these things begin to come to pass, then look up, and lift up your heads; for your redemption draweth nigh. And he spake to them a parable; Behold the fig tree, and all the trees; When they now shoot forth, ye see and know of your own selves that summer is now nigh at hand. So likewise ye, when ye see these things come to pass, know ye that the kingdom of God is nigh at hand" (Lk.21:27-31).
    Joh 1:17 For the law was given by Moses, but grace and truth came by Jesus Christ.

    Eph 2:8 For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:
    Eph 2:9 Not of works, lest any man should boast.

  4. #33
    TOL Legend Jerry Shugart's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by iamaberean View Post
    Joh 1:17 For the law was given by Moses, but grace and truth came by Jesus Christ.

    Eph 2:8 For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:
    Eph 2:9 Not of works, lest any man should boast.
    If you are quoting those verses to try to prove that believers weren't saved by grace until the Cross then explain why we read the following about Abraham:

    "What shall we say then that Abraham our father, as pertaining to the flesh, hath found? For if Abraham were justified by works, he hath whereof to glory; but not before God. For what saith the scripture? Abraham believed God, and it was counted unto him for righteousness. Now to him that worketh is the reward not reckoned of grace, but of debt. But to him that worketh not, but believeth on him that justifieth the ungodly, his faith is counted for righteousness"
    (Ro.4:1-5).

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  6. #34
    Over 750 post club iamaberean's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jerry Shugart View Post
    There is no such thing as an "age" of grace because throughout history men have been saved in only one way--by grace through faith.

    The kingdom age will not even be near until the Lord Jesus returns to the earth, as witnessed by what the He said in the following passage:

    "And then shall they see the Son of man coming in a cloud with power and great glory. And when these things begin to come to pass, then look up, and lift up your heads; for your redemption draweth nigh. And he spake to them a parable; Behold the fig tree, and all the trees; When they now shoot forth, ye see and know of your own selves that summer is now nigh at hand. So likewise ye, when ye see these things come to pass, know ye that the kingdom of God is nigh at hand" (Lk.21:27-31).
    Point taken!

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    We have always been told that we are body, spirit and soul.

    Actually, the same Hebrew word for body 'nephesh', a breathing creature, is also translated as soul, without any reason.

    נֶפֶשׁ
    nephesh
    neh'-fesh
    From H5314; properly a breathing creature, that is, animal or (abstractly) vitality; used very widely in a literal, accommodated or figurative sense (bodily or mental): - any, appetite, beast, body, breath, creature, X dead (-ly), desire, X [dis-] contented, X fish, ghost, + greedy, he, heart (-y), (hath, X jeopardy of) life (X in jeopardy), lust, man, me, mind, mortality, one, own, person, pleasure, (her-, him-, my-, thy-) self, them (your) -selves, + slay, soul, + tablet, they, thing, (X she) will, X would have it.

    Gen 2:7 And the LORD God formed man of the dust of the ground, and breathed into his nostrils the breath of life; and man became a living soul (creature).

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    Quote Originally Posted by iamaberean View Post
    We have always been told that we are body, spirit and soul.

    Actually, the same Hebrew word for body 'nephesh', a breathing creature, is also translated as soul, without any reason.

    נֶפֶשׁ
    nephesh
    neh'-fesh
    From H5314; properly a breathing creature, that is, animal or (abstractly) vitality; used very widely in a literal, accommodated or figurative sense (bodily or mental): - any, appetite, beast, body, breath, creature, X dead (-ly), desire, X [dis-] contented, X fish, ghost, + greedy, he, heart (-y), (hath, X jeopardy of) life (X in jeopardy), lust, man, me, mind, mortality, one, own, person, pleasure, (her-, him-, my-, thy-) self, them (your) -selves, + slay, soul, + tablet, they, thing, (X she) will, X would have it.

    Gen 2:7 And the LORD God formed man of the dust of the ground, and breathed into his nostrils the breath of life; and man became a living soul (creature).
    The soul in man is eternal while the soul in creatures is temporal.
    I know Him, correctly, as Messiah whom you call Christ. Yah Shua whom you call Jesus. Messianists who you call Christians.

    "Touch not mine anointed, and do my prophets no harm".

    I refuse, point blank, to speak peace to the unregenerate, hypocrites, religious dogma lovers and those that oppose the following statement:
    A regenerate man trusts in the evangelism of salvation conditioned on the atoning blood and imputed justness of Messiah alone.
    If you are fully persuaded, by experience, of this delightful, beautiful and life giving doctrine then I love you as a brother.

    Anyone who thinks that salvation is conditioned on anything a man thinks, does or says is atheist. I cannot and will not speak peace to him or her.

    I don't make statements online that I wouldn't repeat in front of my Maker, my grandmother or a judge.

  10. #37
    Over 750 post club iamaberean's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Truster View Post
    The soul in man is eternal while the soul in creatures is temporal.
    As we have been taught, you would be right. But the bible does not say the soul is eternal. Creatures are those that have breath, the soul would not have breath.
    In the old testament those that had died were raised up for judgment. When we die we either go to our grave or to heaven. The choice has been ours according to our belief.

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    Quote Originally Posted by iamaberean View Post


    As we have been taught, you would be right. But the bible does not say the soul is eternal. Creatures are those that have breath, the soul would not have breath.
    In the old testament those that had died were raised up for judgment. When we die we either go to our grave or to heaven. The choice has been ours according to our belief.
    You obviously have no idea of what soul and spirit mean. How they differ and what the office of each is.
    I know Him, correctly, as Messiah whom you call Christ. Yah Shua whom you call Jesus. Messianists who you call Christians.

    "Touch not mine anointed, and do my prophets no harm".

    I refuse, point blank, to speak peace to the unregenerate, hypocrites, religious dogma lovers and those that oppose the following statement:
    A regenerate man trusts in the evangelism of salvation conditioned on the atoning blood and imputed justness of Messiah alone.
    If you are fully persuaded, by experience, of this delightful, beautiful and life giving doctrine then I love you as a brother.

    Anyone who thinks that salvation is conditioned on anything a man thinks, does or says is atheist. I cannot and will not speak peace to him or her.

    I don't make statements online that I wouldn't repeat in front of my Maker, my grandmother or a judge.

  12. #39
    Over 750 post club iamaberean's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Truster View Post
    You obviously have no idea of what soul and spirit mean. How they differ and what the office of each is.
    You are right, I do not see changing the Hebrew word to mean 'soul' when 'creature' fits just fine.

    I know that when God breathed into Adam the breath of life, that was Spirit.
    Last edited by iamaberean; March 11th, 2019 at 04:59 AM.

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    TOL Legend Jerry Shugart's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Truster View Post
    You obviously have no idea of what soul and spirit mean. How they differ and what the office of each is.
    Would you mind explaining what both mean?

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    Over 750 post club iamaberean's Avatar
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    Hermanutics is finding related scripture and the second testament scripture may also be in the first.
    Here are some examples:

    Mat 1:1 The book of the generation of Jesus Christ, the son of David, the son of Abraham.
    Who is David and Abraham? We find that in the old testament. You will find that in the Old.

    First the new and then the old.
    Mat 1:21 And she shall bring forth a son, and thou shalt call his name JESUS: for he shall save his people from their sins.
    She, is Mary, and she is mentioned in the Old.
    Isa 7:14 Therefore the Lord himself shall give you a sign; Behold, a virgin shall conceive, and bear a son, and shall call his name Immanuel.

    Mat 2:4 And when he had gathered all the chief priests and scribes of the people together, he demanded of them where Christ should be born.
    Mic 5:2 But thou, Bethlehem Ephratah, though thou be little among the thousands of Judah, yet out of thee shall he come forth unto me that is to be ruler in Israel; whose goings forth have been from of old, from everlasting.

    Mat 2:14 When he arose, he took the young child and his mother by night, and departed into Egypt:
    Mat 2:15 And was there until the death of Herod: that it might be fulfilled which was spoken of the Lord by the prophet, saying, Out of Egypt have I called my son.
    Hos 11:1 When Israel was a child, then I loved him, and called my son out of Egypt.

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    Over 750 post club iamaberean's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by iamaberean View Post
    Just felt that either the end of the age or the end of the world as they knew it. That is because age of law ended in 70 AD. Relates to the time that God told his children to go into the promise land and because they didn't believe they could take the land. God kept them from entering for 40 years, until that generation had passed away. Jesus witnessed to his people in Jerusalem and because some would not except him' he kept them in the age of law, which would end in 40 years. Jesus was around 30 years old when crucified plus 40 years to the end of that generation. That would make it 70 AD and that was when the temple was totally destroyed. I also believe it was considered the last day and the dead children of Israel were raised and judged.

    Joh 11:24 Martha saith unto him, I know that he shall rise again in the resurrection at the last day.
    Some times things seem logical, such as judgment day and the resurrection. Although the destruction of the temple completed the age of law it appears that the resurrection of the dead happened the day Jesus died on the cross.

    Luk 23:39 And one of the malefactors which were hanged railed on him, saying, If thou be Christ, save thyself and us.
    Luk 23:40 But the other answering rebuked him, saying, Dost not thou fear God, seeing thou art in the same condemnation?
    Luk 23:41 And we indeed justly; for we receive the due reward of our deeds: but this man hath done nothing amiss.
    Luk 23:42 And he said unto Jesus, Lord, remember me when thou comest into thy kingdom.
    Luk 23:43 And Jesus said unto him, Verily I say unto thee, To day shalt thou be with me in paradise.

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