User Tag List

Page 5 of 65 FirstFirst ... 23456781555 ... LastLast
Results 61 to 75 of 966

Thread: John 20:28 and the Trinity

  1. #61
    Over 5000 post club Rosenritter's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2016
    Location
    The land of ice and snow.
    Posts
    5,456
    Thanks
    968
    Thanked 1,803 Times in 1,440 Posts

    Mentioned
    43 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Rep Power
    195051
    Quote Originally Posted by NWL View Post
    Where have I stated or argued the "god" mentioned in 2 Cor 4:4 was anyone but Satan? You've obviously been misreading this thread. Apple7 is the one denying "the god of this world" in 2 Cor 4:4 refers to Satan as the majority of Christianity understand the verse, he believes that "the god" in 2 Cor 4:4 refers to Jesus, that is the interpretation I referred to as unorthodox. I believe the "god" mentioned is speaking of Satan as you do.

    You need to be arguing against your brother in christ apple7 regarding this topic, not me, we are in agreement.
    I was asking myself why you would be arguing that point, and I went and reread it a few times to make sure. Seems I still got it wrong. I apologize for the confusion.

    Is Apple Calvinist? That might explain why he would read "God" as blinding the minds of everyone to prevent them from the gospel.

  2. #62
    Old Timer
    Join Date
    Oct 2007
    Location
    Phoenix
    Posts
    484
    Thanks
    0
    Thanked 19 Times in 15 Posts

    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Rep Power
    2144
    Quote Originally Posted by Rosenritter View Post
    Don't copy and paste from websites with words that are not your own without at least citing the source. That didn't even respond to the content of the post and as such merits no reply.
    Sorry, but they are my own words/research
    If you can get them to re-open My Trinity Talk thread that had over 2000 post... the one that converted so many Trinitarians like you to see the truth... the one that it was deleted several years ago because of this fact... then I could cite the sources... But they won't do that!

    You think I'm new here?


    So... Now that you that you failed to change the topic.... what was the in error in my post?
    What was Biblically incorrect in my post?




    Paul
    From the cowardice that shrinks from new truth,
    From the laziness that is content with half-truths,
    From the arrogance that thinks it knows all truth,
    Oh God of Truth, deliver us.

    ~ Ancient Prayer

  3. #63
    Over 2000 post club way 2 go's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2003
    Posts
    2,237
    Thanks
    2,188
    Thanked 1,474 Times in 830 Posts

    Mentioned
    31 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Rep Power
    420609
    your cut n paste from
    https://debatingchristianity.com/for...topic_id=30015

    Quote Originally Posted by Pierac View Post
    Why do you teach what you hear in Church and not study for yourself!

    You teach GodH430 =el-o-heem' Plural of H433 ; gods as if it's an American term/belief!

    Why do I... someone so lowly in life have to teach you the truth... It's out there if you only look!
    bragging about being humble , good start.

    what you are teaching is not true , so in looking for truth I would never find it.
    what I do find contradicts what you teach.
    Elohim
    Elohim has been a very confusing word for many people. The word elohim is used various ways in Scripture. It is not only used to describe the Almighty, but also individual pagan gods and even mighty human beings. Elohim may be translated as God, god, angels, judges, or even a human being who stands as God's representative or agent.
    left out on purpose GodH430 =el-o-heem' Plural of H433 ; gods , sin of omission

    For example
    Spoiler
    , the sons of Heth address Abraham as "a mighty prince," the word for "mighty" being elohim (Genesis 23:6). Some translations have Abraham here being called "Prince of God." Take another instance. In Exodus 4, the Lord tells Moses that he "shall be as God" (elohim) to his brother Aaron. Moses will have God's words in his mouth, and will stand as God's representative before Aaron. Here is a case where an individual human is called elohim. Again in Exodus 7:1, the Lord says to Moses, "See, I make you God [elohim] to Pharaoh." No one dares to suggest that there is a plurality of persons within Moses because he is called elohim, that is, God's representative. The pagan god Dagon is also called elohim in the Hebrew Bible. The Philistines lamented that the God of Israel was harshly treating "Dagon our God [elohim]" (1 Sam. 5:7). Dagon was a single pagan deity. The same holds true for the single pagan god called Chemosh: “Do you not possess what Chemosh your god [elohim] gives you to possess?" (Jud. 11:24). The same for the single deity called Baal.

    The Hebrew language has many examples of words which are plural but whose meaning is singular. In Genesis 23, Abraham's wife Sarah dies. The Hebrew text says, "the lives [plural] of Sarah were 127 years" (v. 1). Even the plural verb that accompanies the pronoun does not mean Sarah lived multiple lives. The Hebrews never taught reincarnation or plurality of personhood. Another example of this kind of anomaly in the Hebrew language is found in Genesis 43. After Joseph wept to see his brothers, we read that Joseph "washed his faces" (plural). This is another instance where in the Hebrew language the plural noun functions as a singular noun with a singular meaning, unless, of course, Joseph was a multi-faced human being! The same occurs in Genesis 16:8 where Hagar flees from "the faces" (plural) of her mistress Sarah. These are "anomalies" of the Hebrew language that are clearly understood by Hebrew scholars who rightly translate to a singular form in English.

    The better explanation is that the Hebrews used a form of speech called "the plural of majesty." Put simply this means that someone whose position was warrant of dignity was spoken in this way as giving a sign of honor. The plural acted as a means of intensification:
    Elohim must rather be explained as an intensive plural, denoting greatness and majesty.

    Whenever the word elohim refers to the God of Israel the Septuagint uses the singular and not the plural. From Genesis 1:1 consistently right through, this holds true. The Hebrews who translated their own scriptures into Greek simply had no idea that their God could be more than one individual, or a multiple personal Being! This is true too when we come to the New Testament
    . The New Testament nowhere hints at a plurality in the meaning of elohim when it reproduces references to the One God as ho theos, the One God.

    the word "run" has 97 definitions , context is key

    I gave context of why I believe Elohim is translated Gods
    you did not say why it could not be Gods or even admit it could be Gods


    Gen 1:1 is consistent with Joh 1:1-2

    God is consistent , you not so much

    with God & God
    Joh 1:1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.
    Joh 1:2 The same was in the beginning with God.


    My friend... It's easier for you to believe a lie you have heard 1000 times, than to believe the truth you have heard once!

    Here's your once on the topic!


    Paul
    Joh 8:32 And ye shall know the truth, and the truth shall make you free.

    are you JW or mormon ?

  4. #64
    Over 500 post club NWL's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2013
    Location
    London, England
    Posts
    549
    Thanks
    16
    Thanked 60 Times in 50 Posts

    Mentioned
    14 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Rep Power
    0
    Quote Originally Posted by Rosenritter View Post
    I was asking myself why you would be arguing that point, and I went and reread it a few times to make sure. Seems I still got it wrong. I apologize for the confusion.

    Is Apple Calvinist? That might explain why he would read "God" as blinding the minds of everyone to prevent them from the gospel.
    There's no need to apologize, we all misread things at times.

    I'm not sure what he is, I've asked him before but don't recall getting a reply.
    If you cant beat them join them

  5. #65
    Old Timer
    Join Date
    Oct 2007
    Location
    Phoenix
    Posts
    484
    Thanks
    0
    Thanked 19 Times in 15 Posts

    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Rep Power
    2144
    Quote Originally Posted by Right Divider View Post
    Paul did NOT say that Jesus was ONLY a man.

    You post as less than a child.

    Jesus said that He would raise Himself from the dead. Was Jesus a liar?
    Was Moses a Liar when He said he was the Lord Thy GOD?

    Deu 29:2 And Moses summoned all Israel and said to them, "You have seen all that the LORD did before your eyes in the land of Egypt to Pharaoh and all his servants and all his land; the great trials which your eyes have seen, those great signs and wonders. "Yet to this day the LORD has not given you a heart to know, nor eyes to see, nor ears to hear. "I have led you forty years in the wilderness; your clothes have not worn out on you, and your sandal has not worn out on your foot."You have not eaten bread, nor have you drunk wine or strong drink, in order that you might know that I am the LORD your God.

    You only see your American culture in scripture... You fail to understand the Hebrew concept of Agency

    DID Jesus raise himself up... or was he dead? Becauce if he was not dead you have no forgiveness of sin my friend!


    Act 2:24 "But God raised Him up again, putting an end to the agony of death, since it was impossible for Him to be held in its power.

    Act 2:32 "This Jesus God raised up again, to which we are all witnesses.

    Act 3:15 but put to death the Prince of life, the one whom God raised from the dead, a fact to which we are witnesses.

    Rom 10:9 that if you confess with your mouth Jesus as Lord, and believe in your heart that God raised Him from the dead, you will be saved;
    According to this verse your not saved because you think He raised himself!

    Act 2:23 this Man, delivered over by the predetermined plan and foreknowledge of God, you nailed to a cross by the hands of godless men and put Him to death. "But God raised Him up again, putting an end to the agony of death, since it was impossible for Him to be held in its power.

    You fail to understand... Jesus is the first born from the dead to be raised by GOD!!! Jesus is the second Adam! 1Co 15:45 So also it is written, "The first MAN, Adam, BECAME A LIVING SOUL." The last Adam became a life-giving spirit.

    Stop following the traditions of men... They lead to spiritual death

    Paul
    From the cowardice that shrinks from new truth,
    From the laziness that is content with half-truths,
    From the arrogance that thinks it knows all truth,
    Oh God of Truth, deliver us.

    ~ Ancient Prayer

  6. #66
    Body part Right Divider's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2013
    Posts
    15,873
    Thanks
    14,432
    Thanked 21,860 Times in 12,372 Posts

    Blog Entries
    7
    Mentioned
    45 Post(s)
    Tagged
    1 Thread(s)

    Rep Power
    2147713

    Question

    Quote Originally Posted by Pierac View Post
    Was Moses a Liar when He said he was the Lord Thy GOD?

    Deu 29:2 And Moses summoned all Israel and said to them, "You have seen all that the LORD did before your eyes in the land of Egypt to Pharaoh and all his servants and all his land; the great trials which your eyes have seen, those great signs and wonders. "Yet to this day the LORD has not given you a heart to know, nor eyes to see, nor ears to hear. "I have led you forty years in the wilderness; your clothes have not worn out on you, and your sandal has not worn out on your foot."You have not eaten bread, nor have you drunk wine or strong drink, in order that you might know that I am the LORD your God.

    You only see your American culture in scripture... You fail to understand the Hebrew concept of Agency

    DID Jesus raise himself up... or was he dead? Becauce if he was not dead you have no forgiveness of sin my friend!

    Act 2:24 "But God raised Him up again, putting an end to the agony of death, since it was impossible for Him to be held in its power.

    Act 2:32 "This Jesus God raised up again, to which we are all witnesses.

    Act 3:15 but put to death the Prince of life, the one whom God raised from the dead, a fact to which we are witnesses.

    Rom 10:9 that if you confess with your mouth Jesus as Lord, and believe in your heart that God raised Him from the dead, you will be saved;
    According to this verse your not saved because you think He raised himself!

    Act 2:23 this Man, delivered over by the predetermined plan and foreknowledge of God, you nailed to a cross by the hands of godless men and put Him to death. "But God raised Him up again, putting an end to the agony of death, since it was impossible for Him to be held in its power.

    You fail to understand... Jesus is the first born from the dead to be raised by GOD!!! Jesus is the second Adam! 1Co 15:45 So also it is written, "The first MAN, Adam, BECAME A LIVING SOUL." The last Adam became a life-giving spirit.

    Stop following the traditions of men... They lead to spiritual death

    Paul
    Was Jesus a liar when He said that He would raise Himself from the dead?
    Quote Originally Posted by Squeaky View Post
    That explains why your an idiot.
    Quote Originally Posted by God's Truth View Post
    Father figure, Son figure, and Holy Spirit figure.
    Quote Originally Posted by God's Truth View Post
    You preach against me for preaching obedience to Christ for salvation.
    Col 2:9 (AKJV/PCE)
    (2:9) For in him dwelleth all the fulness of the Godhead bodily.

    1Tim 4:10 (AKJV/PCE)
    (4:10) For therefore we both labour and suffer reproach, because we trust in the living God, who is the Saviour of all men, specially of those that believe.

    Something that was SPOKEN OF since the world began CANNOT be the SAME thing as something KEPT SECRET since the world began.

  7. #67
    Old Timer
    Join Date
    Oct 2007
    Location
    Phoenix
    Posts
    484
    Thanks
    0
    Thanked 19 Times in 15 Posts

    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Rep Power
    2144
    Quote Originally Posted by way 2 go View Post
    your cut n paste from
    https://debatingchristianity.com/for...topic_id=30015


    bragging about being humble , good start.

    what you are teaching is not true , so in looking for truth I would never find it.
    what I do find contradicts what you teach.


    left out on purpose GodH430 =el-o-heem' Plural of H433 ; gods , sin of omission



    the word "run" has 97 definitions , context is key

    I gave context of why I believe Elohim is translated Gods
    you did not say why it could not be Gods or even admit it could be Gods


    Gen 1:1 is consistent with Joh 1:1-2

    God is consistent , you not so much

    with God & God
    Joh 1:1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.
    Joh 1:2 The same was in the beginning with God.



    Joh 8:32 And ye shall know the truth, and the truth shall make you free.

    are you JW or mormon ?
    No... I follow no man or religion. I only seek out the truth... and few have it! Paul knew...1Co 13:9 For we know in part and we prophesy in part; but when the perfect comes, the partial will be done away.

    For now I seek as much part as I can know/find until the partial will be done away. Just know that you will not find it in any religion.

    I have studied all Christian denominations, where and why do they differ? Start here and you will see the traditions of men come to light. It's like picking spiritual meat off of bones!


    Paul
    From the cowardice that shrinks from new truth,
    From the laziness that is content with half-truths,
    From the arrogance that thinks it knows all truth,
    Oh God of Truth, deliver us.

    ~ Ancient Prayer

  8. #68
    Old Timer
    Join Date
    Oct 2007
    Location
    Phoenix
    Posts
    484
    Thanks
    0
    Thanked 19 Times in 15 Posts

    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Rep Power
    2144
    Quote Originally Posted by way 2 go View Post
    your cut n paste from
    https://debatingchristianity.com/for...topic_id=30015


    bragging about being humble , good start.

    what you are teaching is not true , so in looking for truth I would never find it.
    what I do find contradicts what you teach.


    left out on purpose GodH430 =el-o-heem' Plural of H433 ; gods , sin of omission



    the word "run" has 97 definitions , context is key

    I gave context of why I believe Elohim is translated Gods
    you did not say why it could not be Gods or even admit it could be Gods


    Gen 1:1 is consistent with Joh 1:1-2

    God is consistent , you not so much

    with God & God
    Joh 1:1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.
    Joh 1:2 The same was in the beginning with God.

    Whenever the word elohim refers to the God of Israel the Septuagint uses the singular and not the plural. From Genesis 1:1 consistently right through, this holds true. The Hebrews who translated their own scriptures into Greek simply had no idea that their God could be more than one individual, or a multiple personal Being! This is true too when we come to the New Testament. The New Testament nowhere hints at a plurality in the meaning of elohim when it reproduces references to the One God as ho theos, the One God.



    Don't skim.... read.
    Paul
    From the cowardice that shrinks from new truth,
    From the laziness that is content with half-truths,
    From the arrogance that thinks it knows all truth,
    Oh God of Truth, deliver us.

    ~ Ancient Prayer

  9. #69
    Old Timer
    Join Date
    Oct 2007
    Location
    Phoenix
    Posts
    484
    Thanks
    0
    Thanked 19 Times in 15 Posts

    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Rep Power
    2144
    Quote Originally Posted by Right Divider View Post
    Was Jesus a liar when He said that He would raise Himself from the dead?

    Just like Moses When He said... I am the LORD your God... Deu 29:6
    Moses when from 3rd person to 1st person in one speech!

    Study the Hebrew concept of Agency!


    Paul
    From the cowardice that shrinks from new truth,
    From the laziness that is content with half-truths,
    From the arrogance that thinks it knows all truth,
    Oh God of Truth, deliver us.

    ~ Ancient Prayer

  10. #70
    Over 5000 post club Rosenritter's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2016
    Location
    The land of ice and snow.
    Posts
    5,456
    Thanks
    968
    Thanked 1,803 Times in 1,440 Posts

    Mentioned
    43 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Rep Power
    195051
    Quote Originally Posted by Pierac View Post
    Sorry, but they are my own words/research
    If you can get them to re-open My Trinity Talk thread that had over 2000 post... the one that converted so many Trinitarians like you to see the truth... the one that it was deleted several years ago because of this fact... then I could cite the sources... But they won't do that!

    You think I'm new here?


    So... Now that you that you failed to change the topic.... what was the in error in my post?
    What was Biblically incorrect in my post?


    Paul
    1. If those were your words, they were words from another time and place that didn't respond to the post in question. As such they might as well have been from someone else because they weren't applicable. The point I addressed was that the use of the word "man" does not mean that the subject is neither God nor angel. Proof was provided.

    2. "... the one that converted so many Trinitarians like yourself to see the truth?" leaves me rather skeptical of your ability to gauge the topic at hand. I'll grant respect if you can correct what you can discern (and correct) what you might have said wrong within that statement.

    3. You were changing the subject (as to the implications or lack thereof from the word "man"). But if you want a critique of the rest of that cut-and-paste non-answer, yes, there were errors.

    "To say that the Messiah is God Himself is to contradict the whole point of this prophecy.
    For it announces that the ultimate spokesman for God is expressly not God but a human being"


    The point of the prophecy was not that the prophet would not be God, but rather that he would not speak with the "voice of the LORD" that shook mountains and the "great fire" that frightened them to fear of death.

    In addition, Jehovah God says clearly that he is not a man (
    Numbers 23:19; Job 9:32). The converse is therefore true: if a person is a man, then he can not be God.


    Taking these passages out of context will result in error, as is already demonstrated from the previous passages where God if called a man when he visited Abraham. Further example of the error of your "man is not God is not a man" interpretation is found where God visited Jacob in the night and wrestled with him.

    Genesis 32:24 KJV
    (24) And Jacob was left alone; and there wrestled a man with him until the breaking of the day.

    Genesis 32:30 KJV
    (30) And Jacob called the name of the place Peniel: for I have seen God face to face, and my life is preserved.

    Whatever your interpretation may be, it was not shared by Jacob, nor by Moses who wrote the account concerning Abraham,

    That said, I am not interested in pulling apart thousands of pages of your previous posts. I would be content if you would deal with the point at hand concerning the integrity of your specific argument. "Jesus of Nazareth, a man approved of God" is not a valid argument against the Christ's identity. It is a way of referring to the real person they would recognize.

    As for Peter speaking to the actual and ultimate identity of Jesus beyond his mere introduction, look here:

    Acts 2:32-35 KJV
    (32) This Jesus hath God raised up, whereof we all are witnesses.
    (33) Therefore being by the right hand of God exalted, and having received of the Father the promise of the Holy Ghost, he hath shed forth this, which ye now see and hear.
    (34) For David is not ascended into the heavens: but he saith himself, The LORD said unto my Lord, Sit thou on my right hand,
    (35) Until I make thy foes thy footstool.

    Why is it important that he tells them that David is not ascended to heaven? Because David himself prophesied of one who would ascend to heaven, and this Jesus is He who ascended. See Psalm 22, Psalm 23, and finally Psalm 24. This King of Glory who ascends to the hill of the LORD, who receives the blessing from the LORD, and righteousness from the God of his salvation, this King of Glory is the LORD of Hosts.

    Psalms 24:1-10 KJV
    (1) A Psalm of David. The earth is the LORD'S, and the fulness thereof; the world, and they that dwell therein.
    (2) For he hath founded it upon the seas, and established it upon the floods.
    (3) Who shall ascend into the hill of the LORD? or who shall stand in his holy place?
    (4) He that hath clean hands, and a pure heart; who hath not lifted up his soul unto vanity, nor sworn deceitfully.
    (5) He shall receive the blessing from the LORD, and righteousness from the God of his salvation.
    (6) This is the generation of them that seek him, that seek thy face, O Jacob. Selah.
    (7) Lift up your heads, O ye gates; and be ye lift up, ye everlasting doors; and the King of glory shall come in.
    (8) Who is this King of glory? The LORD strong and mighty, the LORD mighty in battle.
    (9) Lift up your heads, O ye gates; even lift them up, ye everlasting doors; and the King of glory shall come in.
    (10) Who is this King of glory? The LORD of hosts, he is the King of glory. Selah.

    And if we needed any more identification of the LORD of Hosts and the King of Glory, we are also told that this is the creator of the world and the seas. "All things were made by him; and without him was not any thing made that was made." (John 1:3).

    Plainly speaking, an argument that "man" means "not God" rather than "found in fashion as a man" (Php 2:8) runs into problems when compared against other scripture.

    Philippians 2:6-11 KJV
    (6) Who, being in the form of God, thought it not robbery to be equal with God:
    (7) But made himself of no reputation, and took upon him the form of a servant, and was made in the likeness of men:
    (8) And being found in fashion as a man, he humbled himself, and became obedient unto death, even the death of the cross.
    (9) Wherefore God also hath highly exalted him, and given him a name which is above every name:
    (10) That at the name of Jesus every knee should bow, of things in heaven, and things in earth, and things under the earth;
    (11) And that every tongue should confess that Jesus Christ is Lord, to the glory of God the Father.

    ... which is Paul's interpretation of this passage from Isaiah....

    Isaiah 45:21-23 KJV
    (21) Tell ye, and bring them near; yea, let them take counsel together: who hath declared this from ancient time? who hath told it from that time? have not I the LORD? and there is no God else beside me; a just God and a Saviour; there is none beside me.
    (22) Look unto me, and be ye saved, all the ends of the earth: for I am God, and there is none else.
    (23) I have sworn by myself, the word is gone out of my mouth in righteousness, and shall not return, That unto me every knee shall bow, every tongue shall swear.

    Paul considered the name and title of Jesus Christ as interchangeable with God in the context of "there is no God beside me; a just God and a Saviour; there is none beside me." Paul was not Unitarian; no Unitarian speaks that way.

  11. #71
    Over 5000 post club Rosenritter's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2016
    Location
    The land of ice and snow.
    Posts
    5,456
    Thanks
    968
    Thanked 1,803 Times in 1,440 Posts

    Mentioned
    43 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Rep Power
    195051
    Quote Originally Posted by Pierac View Post

    Just like Moses When He said... I am the LORD your God... Deu 29:6
    Moses when from 3rd person to 1st person in one speech!

    Study the Hebrew concept of Agency!


    Paul
    Or perhaps you might consider that the inflection of the voice can indicate quote marks.

    Deuteronomy 29:6 KJV (quotation marks added for emphasis, not in original)
    (6) Ye have not eaten bread, neither have ye drunk wine or strong drink: "that ye might know that I am the LORD your God."

    It's a phrase with which they ought to be familiar.

    Exodus 6:6-7 KJV
    (6) Wherefore say unto the children of Israel, I am the LORD, and I will bring you out from under the burdens of the Egyptians, and I will rid you out of their bondage, and I will redeem you with a stretched out arm, and with great judgments:
    (7) And I will take you to me for a people, and I will be to you a God: and ye shall know that I am the LORD your God, which bringeth you out from under the burdens of the Egyptians.

    Exodus 16:11-12 KJV
    (11) And the LORD spake unto Moses, saying,
    (12) I have heard the murmurings of the children of Israel: speak unto them, saying, At even ye shall eat flesh, and in the morning ye shall be filled with bread; and ye shall know that I am the LORD your God.

    ... for example, that is. That phrase "I am the LORD your God" occurs some 33 times in the Old Testament. It's summoning the familiar phrase and theme. That isn't the Unitarian "theory of agency" supposed to explain away why our God is not our God, it's the well known figure of speech known as quotation. Except they didn't use quotation marks or quote tags in the Hebrew.

  12. #72
    Body part Right Divider's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2013
    Posts
    15,873
    Thanks
    14,432
    Thanked 21,860 Times in 12,372 Posts

    Blog Entries
    7
    Mentioned
    45 Post(s)
    Tagged
    1 Thread(s)

    Rep Power
    2147713

    Lightbulb

    Quote Originally Posted by Pierac View Post

    Just like Moses When He said... I am the LORD your God... Deu 29:6
    Moses when from 3rd person to 1st person in one speech!

    Study the Hebrew concept of Agency!


    Paul
    Apparently your just going to ignore what the LORD Jesus Christ said. That makes sense as it's the only way to make your fairy tale come true.

    Joh 2:19-21 KJV Jesus answered and said unto them, Destroy this temple, and in three days I will raise it up. (20) Then said the Jews, Forty and six years was this temple in building, and wilt thou rear it up in three days? (21) But he spake of the temple of his body.

    There is no "agency" there, only your vivid imagination.
    Quote Originally Posted by Squeaky View Post
    That explains why your an idiot.
    Quote Originally Posted by God's Truth View Post
    Father figure, Son figure, and Holy Spirit figure.
    Quote Originally Posted by God's Truth View Post
    You preach against me for preaching obedience to Christ for salvation.
    Col 2:9 (AKJV/PCE)
    (2:9) For in him dwelleth all the fulness of the Godhead bodily.

    1Tim 4:10 (AKJV/PCE)
    (4:10) For therefore we both labour and suffer reproach, because we trust in the living God, who is the Saviour of all men, specially of those that believe.

    Something that was SPOKEN OF since the world began CANNOT be the SAME thing as something KEPT SECRET since the world began.

  13. The Following User Says Thank You to Right Divider For Your Post:

    way 2 go (December 27th, 2018)

  14. #73
    Over 2000 post club way 2 go's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2003
    Posts
    2,237
    Thanks
    2,188
    Thanked 1,474 Times in 830 Posts

    Mentioned
    31 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Rep Power
    420609
    Quote Originally Posted by Pierac View Post
    Whenever the word Elohim refers to the God of Israel the Septuagint uses the singular and not the plural. From Genesis 1:1 consistently right through, this holds true. The Hebrews who translated their own scriptures into Greek simply had no idea that their God could be more than one individual, or a multiple personal Being! This is true too when we come to the New Testament. The New Testament nowhere hints at a plurality in the meaning of elohim when it reproduces references to the One God as ho theos, the One God.



    Don't skim.... read.
    Paul
    Good thing we have the Hebrew to show us Elohim .


    theos all 3 times in these 2 verses

    Joh 10:34 Jesus answered them, Is it not written in your law, I said, Ye are gods?
    Joh 10:35 If he called them gods, unto whom the word of God came, and the scripture cannot be broken;

  15. #74
    Over 750 post club
    Join Date
    Dec 2018
    Location
    Washington State, USA
    Posts
    926
    Thanks
    59
    Thanked 126 Times in 116 Posts

    Mentioned
    5 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Rep Power
    4805
    Quote Originally Posted by Jacob View Post
    Shalom.

    The following verse seems to imply that Jesus is God. But is that what it says? Discuss.

    John 20:28 NASB - Thomas answered and said to Him, "My Lord and my God!"

    Shalom.

    Jacob
    First, the meaning of those 5 words cannot be known without the context.
    Here is an example;

    My brother, and my dog!

    Please tell me what I mean, by these 5 words, almost an EXACT quote of Thomas, without more context.

    Of course you can't.

    The context is crucial.

    Second, the context in John 20:24-29 is discussing Thomas' doubt, that his God had resurrected his Lord.

    There's your context, and there is the meaning of Thomas' answer to Christ proving that his God had resurrected his Lord.

    Thomas' very correctly praised them both.

  16. #75
    BANNED
    Join Date
    Jan 2006
    Location
    Lakewood, Washington
    Posts
    18,785
    Thanks
    126
    Thanked 947 Times in 871 Posts

    Mentioned
    39 Post(s)
    Tagged
    1 Thread(s)
    Rep Power
    0
    Quote Originally Posted by Dartman View Post
    First, the meaning of those 5 words cannot be known without the context.
    Here is an example;

    My brother, and my dog!

    Please tell me what I mean, by these 5 words, almost an EXACT quote of Thomas, without more context.

    Of course you can't.

    The context is crucial.

    Second, the context in John 20:24-29 is discussing Thomas' doubt, that his God had resurrected his Lord.

    There's your context, and there is the meaning of Thomas' answer to Christ proving that his God had resurrected his Lord.

    Thomas' very correctly praised them both.
    Interesting perspective. I am not sure that I follow you.

Thread Information

Users Browsing this Thread

There are currently 1 users browsing this thread. (0 members and 1 guests)

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  
About us
Since 1997 TheologyOnline (TOL) has been one of the most popular theology forums on the internet. On TOL we encourage spirited conversation about religion, politics, and just about everything else.

follow us