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Thread: The Gospel Verses the Law and Religion

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    The Gospel Verses the Law and Religion

    The religion of the Pharisees was the law. They took the first five books of the Old Testament and came up with the Torah. There are over 600 laws and rules in the Torah. Jesus was not pleased that they did that. The law tells us to do something or not to do something. You would think that Jesus and the Pharisees would be friends, seeing how they were both teachers of the law, yet they were bitter enemies. A religion of laws and rules is not a religion of faith. Living by laws, rules and religion is NOT living by faith, actually it is an indication of the absence of faith. The law is something that we do, we are not saved or justified by what we do.

    "But that no man is justified by the law in the sight of God, it is evident: for, THE JUST SHALL LIVE BY FAITH" Galatians 3:11.

    The just shall live by faith in what? The just shall live by faith in Christ and his Gospel. In the Gospel Jesus justifies the ungodly, Romans 4:5 and reconciles us and the world unto God, 2 Corinthians 5:18, 19. How does Jesus do that? Does he do it by making us holy through the law? If that were true then Jesus didn't have to come into the world and be crucified for the sins of the world. He could have just stayed in heaven and have sent his Spirit into the world to save the world. Beware of those who teach against the incarnation of Jesus Christ, they are enemies of the Gospel.

    Jesus was a real live, flesh and blood man. His mission was to come into the world and provide salvation for fallen man. As our substitute and representative he offered to God the Father a life of perfect obedience according to God's Holy Law. This life was lived for our justification, Romans 3:26. That was not enough, something had to be done about our sins and the sins of the whole world.

    "For he has made him to be sin for us, who knew no sin; that we might be made the righteousness of God in him" 2 Corinthians 5:21.

    The law has been fulfill, Matthew 5:18 and abolished, Ephesians 2:15. Our sins and the sins of the whole world have been atoned for. We can now stand before God's Holy Court as perfect and complete "In Christ" Colossians 2:10. This is the Gospel and is how we are justified by faith. Our faith is counted for righteousness. The law and religion does not produce righteousness, what it produces is wrath, Romans 4:15.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Robert Pate View Post
    The religion of the Pharisees was the law. They took the first five books of the Old Testament and came up with the Torah. There are over 600 laws and rules in the Torah. Jesus was not pleased that they did that. The law tells us to do something or not to do something. You would think that Jesus and the Pharisees would be friends, seeing how they were both teachers of the law, yet they were bitter enemies. A religion of laws and rules is not a religion of faith. Living by laws, rules and religion is NOT living by faith, actually it is an indication of the absence of faith. The law is something that we do, we are not saved or justified by what we do.

    "But that no man is justified by the law in the sight of God, it is evident: for, THE JUST SHALL LIVE BY FAITH" Galatians 3:11.

    The just shall live by faith in what? The just shall live by faith in Christ and his Gospel. In the Gospel Jesus justifies the ungodly, Romans 4:5 and reconciles us and the world unto God, 2 Corinthians 5:18, 19. How does Jesus do that? Does he do it by making us holy through the law? If that were true then Jesus didn't have to come into the world and be crucified for the sins of the world. He could have just stayed in heaven and have sent his Spirit into the world to save the world. Beware of those who teach against the incarnation of Jesus Christ, they are enemies of the Gospel.

    Jesus was a real live, flesh and blood man. His mission was to come into the world and provide salvation for fallen man. As our substitute and representative he offered to God the Father a life of perfect obedience according to God's Holy Law. This life was lived for our justification, Romans 3:26. That was not enough, something had to be done about our sins and the sins of the whole world.

    "For he has made him to be sin for us, who knew no sin; that we might be made the righteousness of God in him" 2 Corinthians 5:21.

    The law has been fulfill, Matthew 5:18 and abolished, Ephesians 2:15. Our sins and the sins of the whole world have been atoned for. We can now stand before God's Holy Court as perfect and complete "In Christ" Colossians 2:10. This is the Gospel and is how we are justified by faith. Our faith is counted for righteousness. The law and religion does not produce righteousness, what it produces is wrath, Romans 4:15.
    Did the Old Testament exist in the first century? I know that the law and the prophets did. Jesus said that He did not come to abolish them, but to fulfill.

    Atonement in Jesus is important. Thanks be to God.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jacob View Post
    Did the Old Testament exist in the first century? I know that the law and the prophets did. Jesus said that He did not come to abolish them, but to fulfill.

    Atonement in Jesus is important. Thanks be to God.
    A testament is only in force when the testator dies. Their blood flips the switch. Christ's blood 'flipped the switch' on the new testament, the New Covenant. It's interesting 'whose' blood 'flipped the switch' on the first testament, isn't it? Cf. Hebrews 9:18 KJV.
    "Those who believe in Christ" are all the Christians, Catholic or not.

    @Nee_Nihilo

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    Exclamation

    Quote Originally Posted by Robert Pate View Post
    The religion of the Pharisees was the law. They took the first five books of the Old Testament and came up with the Torah.
    WRONG.... they did no such thing. The simply CALLED the first five books the Torah.

    Quote Originally Posted by Robert Pate View Post
    The law has been fulfill, Matthew 5:18 and abolished, Ephesians 2:15.
    Repeating your lie does not make it true.

    Mat 5:17-18 KJV Think not that I am come to destroy the law, or the prophets: I am not come to destroy, but to fulfil. (18) For verily I say unto you, Till heaven and earth pass, one jot or one tittle shall in no wise pass from the law, till all be fulfilled.

    That scripture does NOT say what YOU say that it says.

    Some notes on your FALSE "doctrine":

    • It says the law OR THE PROPHETS.... it does NOT separate the two.
    • It says that He did NOT come to destroy THOSE (i.e., He was CONFIRMING them).
    • It says that not even the tiniest (jot or tittle) will pass from the law "Till heaven and earth PASS".

    Jesus goes ON to say this:

    Mat 5:19 KJV Whosoever therefore shall break one of these least commandments, and shall teach men so, he shall be called the least in the kingdom of heaven: but whosoever shall do and teach them, the same shall be called great in the kingdom of heaven.

    So it's easy to see that Jesus says that the law will be vitally important in the kingdom of heaven. According to this, you would be called THE LEAST in the kingdom of heaven.
    Quote Originally Posted by Squeaky View Post
    That explains why your an idiot.
    Quote Originally Posted by God's Truth View Post
    Father figure, Son figure, and Holy Spirit figure.
    Quote Originally Posted by God's Truth View Post
    You preach against me for preaching obedience to Christ for salvation.
    Col 2:9 (AKJV/PCE)
    (2:9) For in him dwelleth all the fulness of the Godhead bodily.

    1Tim 4:10 (AKJV/PCE)
    (4:10) For therefore we both labour and suffer reproach, because we trust in the living God, who is the Saviour of all men, specially of those that believe.

    Something that was SPOKEN OF since the world began CANNOT be the SAME thing as something KEPT SECRET since the world began.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Idolater View Post
    A testament is only in force when the testator dies. Their blood flips the switch. Christ's blood 'flipped the switch' on the new testament, the New Covenant. It's interesting 'whose' blood 'flipped the switch' on the first testament, isn't it? Cf. Hebrews 9:18 KJV.
    I do not know that I understand you, but I have benefitted from reading from Hebrews 9 here.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Right Divider View Post
    WRONG.... they did no such thing. The simply CALLED the first five books the Torah.


    Repeating your lie does not make it true.

    Mat 5:17-18 KJV Think not that I am come to destroy the law, or the prophets: I am not come to destroy, but to fulfil. (18) For verily I say unto you, Till heaven and earth pass, one jot or one tittle shall in no wise pass from the law, till all be fulfilled.

    That scripture does NOT say what YOU say that it says.

    Some notes on your FALSE "doctrine":

    • It says the law OR THE PROPHETS.... it does NOT separate the two.
    • It says that He did NOT come to destroy THOSE (i.e., He was CONFIRMING them).
    • It says that not even the tiniest (jot or tittle) will pass from the law "Till heaven and earth PASS".

    Jesus goes ON to say this:

    Mat 5:19 KJV Whosoever therefore shall break one of these least commandments, and shall teach men so, he shall be called the least in the kingdom of heaven: but whosoever shall do and teach them, the same shall be called great in the kingdom of heaven.

    So it's easy to see that Jesus says that the law will be vitally important in the kingdom of heaven. According to this, you would be called THE LEAST in the kingdom of heaven.

    Jesus was a teacher of the law. The purpose of the law is to reveal the righteousness of God and the sinfulness of man. The law cannot save or justify, "By the law is the knowledge of sin" Romans 3:20.

    There is no longer a need for the law because of the Gospel. This is why Paul wrote, "The law is not made for the righteous man, but for the lawless and disobedient" 1 Timothy 1:9.

    In the Gospel we are justified, sanctified and redeemed, 1 Corinthians 1:30 and now stand before God as perfect and complete "in Christ" Colossians 2:10.

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    We don't live by the law except with it's natural consequences such as reaping what you sow.
    Some posters on here are all about some 'law', consistently tossing aside grace to uphold death and punishment at every whim. It's not becoming or proper of a Christian, and I think it's simply due in being an equal, opposite force to the completely lawless thinkers who act like even the Ten Commandments aren't valid.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Crucifer View Post
    We don't live by the law except with it's natural consequences such as reaping what you sow.
    Some posters on here are all about some 'law', consistently tossing aside grace to uphold death and punishment at every whim. It's not becoming or proper of a Christian, and I think it's simply due in being an equal, opposite force to the completely lawless thinkers who act like even the Ten Commandments aren't valid.
    I am for God's Law and for God's grace.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Idolater View Post
    A testament is only in force when the testator dies. Their blood flips the switch. Christ's blood 'flipped the switch' on the new testament, the New Covenant. It's interesting 'whose' blood 'flipped the switch' on the first testament, isn't it? Cf. Hebrews 9:18 KJV.
    Who's blood flipped the switch in order for the old covenant to be in force?

    We don't tell our children fairy tales so that they will know that monsters exist.
    They already know monsters exist.
    We tell our children fairy tales so that they will know that monsters can be killed.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Robert Pate View Post
    Jesus was a teacher of the law. The purpose of the law is to reveal the righteousness of God and the sinfulness of man. The law cannot save or justify, "By the law is the knowledge of sin" Romans 3:20.

    There is no longer a need for the law because of the Gospel. This is why Paul wrote, "The law is not made for the righteous man, but for the lawless and disobedient" 1 Timothy 1:9.

    In the Gospel we are justified, sanctified and redeemed, 1 Corinthians 1:30 and now stand before God as perfect and complete "in Christ" Colossians 2:10.
    We all really enjoy the DEFLECTIONS that you use when someone points out your OBVIOUS errors.

    You did NOTHING to address my comments on YOUR original post.
    Quote Originally Posted by Squeaky View Post
    That explains why your an idiot.
    Quote Originally Posted by God's Truth View Post
    Father figure, Son figure, and Holy Spirit figure.
    Quote Originally Posted by God's Truth View Post
    You preach against me for preaching obedience to Christ for salvation.
    Col 2:9 (AKJV/PCE)
    (2:9) For in him dwelleth all the fulness of the Godhead bodily.

    1Tim 4:10 (AKJV/PCE)
    (4:10) For therefore we both labour and suffer reproach, because we trust in the living God, who is the Saviour of all men, specially of those that believe.

    Something that was SPOKEN OF since the world began CANNOT be the SAME thing as something KEPT SECRET since the world began.

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    JudgeRightly (December 5th, 2018),Tambora (December 5th, 2018)

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    Quote Originally Posted by Tambora View Post
    Who's blood flipped the switch in order for the old covenant to be in force?
    'Calves' and 'goats.' Hebrews 9:20 KJV
    "Those who believe in Christ" are all the Christians, Catholic or not.

    @Nee_Nihilo

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    Quote Originally Posted by Idolater View Post
    'Calves' and 'goats.' Hebrews 9:20 KJV
    Calves and goats made the old covenant????

    We don't tell our children fairy tales so that they will know that monsters exist.
    They already know monsters exist.
    We tell our children fairy tales so that they will know that monsters can be killed.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Tambora View Post
    Calves and goats made the old covenant????
    As I said, it's interesting.
    "Those who believe in Christ" are all the Christians, Catholic or not.

    @Nee_Nihilo

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    Quote Originally Posted by Idolater View Post
    As I said, it's interesting.
    Interesting indeed!

    Hebrews 9:16-17 KJV
    (16) For where a testament is, there must also of necessity bethe death of the testator.
    (17) For a testament is of force after men are dead: otherwise it is of no strength at all while the testator liveth.


    Not sure how calves and goats are the testator of the old covenant.

    We don't tell our children fairy tales so that they will know that monsters exist.
    They already know monsters exist.
    We tell our children fairy tales so that they will know that monsters can be killed.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Right Divider View Post
    We all really enjoy the DEFLECTIONS that you use when someone points out your OBVIOUS errors.

    You did NOTHING to address my comments on YOUR original post.
    You like to argue religion. I am not religious. If you want to discuss the scriptures I am open to that.

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