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    Quote Originally Posted by meshak View Post
    I don't think you will love it there because it is too peaceful for most of you who love to fight.
    You think wrong, as usual.
    Quote Originally Posted by Squeaky View Post
    That explains why your an idiot.
    Quote Originally Posted by God's Truth View Post
    Father figure, Son figure, and Holy Spirit figure.
    Quote Originally Posted by God's Truth View Post
    You preach against me for preaching obedience to Christ for salvation.
    Col 2:9 (AKJV/PCE)
    (2:9) For in him dwelleth all the fulness of the Godhead bodily.

    1Tim 4:10 (AKJV/PCE)
    (4:10) For therefore we both labour and suffer reproach, because we trust in the living God, who is the Saviour of all men, specially of those that believe.

    Something that was SPOKEN OF since the world began CANNOT be the SAME thing as something KEPT SECRET since the world began.

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  3. #47
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    Quote Originally Posted by Idolater View Post
    We perceive His majesty, we apprehend it, from afar. Like looking at Mt. Everest from miles away. We know from far away how immense God is, but not in much detail, this is from miles away.
    That's sad. I'm IN CHRIST. How much closer can I get?

    I'm seated in HEAVENLY PLACES per Paul.

    Quote Originally Posted by Idolater View Post
    Now, He was born to His sacred mother, Mary---she's sacred because of Who her Son is, not somehow independent of that fact, that she is the mother of the Lord. He is holy, and so somehow, His mother must also be holy, because He could not live within an unholy, desecrated vessel---His mom had to be holy, for Him, because He is most holy; so she had to be most holy also, within the limit of humanity, and that, Mary was.

    She's the queen mother. She's on a throne, she has a throne. Her throne isn't associated with where the Lord is seated at the right hand of the Father (have mercy on us!), her throne is not God's throne, she is not God.
    Please provide the SCRIPTURE to support this myth of yours.

    More babbling nonsense. You've bought a lie and you like it.
    Quote Originally Posted by Squeaky View Post
    That explains why your an idiot.
    Quote Originally Posted by God's Truth View Post
    Father figure, Son figure, and Holy Spirit figure.
    Quote Originally Posted by God's Truth View Post
    You preach against me for preaching obedience to Christ for salvation.
    Col 2:9 (AKJV/PCE)
    (2:9) For in him dwelleth all the fulness of the Godhead bodily.

    1Tim 4:10 (AKJV/PCE)
    (4:10) For therefore we both labour and suffer reproach, because we trust in the living God, who is the Saviour of all men, specially of those that believe.

    Something that was SPOKEN OF since the world began CANNOT be the SAME thing as something KEPT SECRET since the world began.

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  5. #48
    LIFETIME MEMBER meshak's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by nikolai_42 View Post
    How does that describe the organizational churches? Even if it were true that all organizational churches to NOT preach the gospel, how does that fulfill what is said of Babylon in verse 3 above?
    Babylon is symbolism for idle worshippers.

    All denominational or organizational churches follow their own idea of Gospel and His teachings.

    So you don't have be rocket scientist to identify who or what they are.
    If you want to be true to God and Jesus, abandon any kind of violence at all cost. By advocating any kind of violence, you are misrepresenting Christianity.

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    Over 1500 post club nikolai_42's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by meshak View Post
    Babylon is symbolism for idle worshippers.
    Where do you get that from? I know Babylon has a meaning close to "confusion" - so I could see starting there by identifying denominationalism as Babylon (though I don't agree). But where do get that imagery?

    Quote Originally Posted by meshak View Post
    All denominational or organizational churches follow their own idea of Gospel and His teachings.

    So you don't have be rocket scientist to identify who or what they are.
    Revelation is a book of symbols and images that often represent things. So when they do (and we know Babylon probably does represent something simply because there is no Babylon physically around today) we have to follow the biblical mandate for interpreting these symbols. Just because Babylon means something bad doesn't mean we identify it as meaning idolatry. Otherwise we could do the same thing with Egypt, for example. Revelation uses both Egypt and Sodom in a spiritual sense (Rev 11:8) and both those nations were guilty of idolatry. So is that what we are to read them as?

    So no, aeronautics isn't going to help you identify Babylon, but just picking a definition isn't going to give you the right understanding either. And if all you are relying on is the fact that Babylon represents idol worshippers AND your identification of that with the organizational churches, then you are probably not going to fit in with the biblical defintion. And verse 3 helps us identify who Babylon is/was.

    So...again...how does the organizational/denominational church system fulfill verse 3 (which is describing Babylon and its interaction with the world):

    For all nations have drunk of the wine of the wrath of her fornication, and the kings of the earth have committed fornication with her, and the merchants of the earth are waxed rich through the abundance of her delicacies.
    Rev 18:3
    If God promises life, He slayeth first; when He builds, He casteth all down first. God is no patcher; He cannot build on another's foundation. - William Tyndale

    The heart is deceitful above all things, and desperately wicked: who can know it?
    Jeremiah 17:9

    Who is among you that feareth the Lord, that obeyeth the voice of his servant, that walketh in darkness, and hath no light? let him trust in the name of the Lord, and stay upon his God.
    Behold, all ye that kindle a fire, that compass yourselves about with sparks: walk in the light of your fire, and in the sparks that ye have kindled. This shall ye have of mine hand; ye shall lie down in sorrow.

    Isaiah 50:10-11

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    Over 4000 post club lifeisgood's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by meshak View Post
    I don't think you will love it there because it is too peaceful for most of you who love to fight.
    How do you know? Where is your source for such assertion?
    No man can come to God except through Christ. (Jn. 14:20)
    No man can come to Christ unless he comes through the Cross. (Jn. 3:16; Eph. 2:1318)
    No man can come to the Cross without a denial of self. (Lk. 9:2324)

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    Over 750 post club Idolater's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Right Divider View Post
    That's sad.
    It's wonderful, and joyful. Marvelous. Stupendous. Outrageously majestic and glorious.
    Quote Originally Posted by Right Divider View Post
    I'm IN CHRIST. How much closer can I get?
    If our Husband desires His Bride to adore Him in a particular way, wouldn't you think that when the Church obeys Him as our Husband, that it is preferable to disobeying Him? Just hypothetically, I'm asking. It's not a salvation issue, just a practical, hypothetical question.
    Quote Originally Posted by Right Divider View Post
    I'm seated in HEAVENLY PLACES per Paul.
    Then you ought to know this stuff. But you don't, and the reason that you don't, is because you're just a private Bible interpreter, and you read where Christ promised His future Apostles the Spirit of truth, and you think that He's speaking to you and to me, but He's speaking to His future Apostles, and the Spirit of truth led them into all truth, and their duty to the Body of Christ is to relay the truth to the rest of us, the faithful, who are in Christ, and seated in the heavenlies. Their college and office is our source for sure, reliable Christian teaching, which takes into account the whole Bible, and the whole history of the Church, and the whole Apostolic witness, including what is written in the New Testament, plus what the Apostles themselves uttered but did not record, and those teachings that originated from non-Apostles, but that the Apostles themselves approved, e.g., when someone, seeking to understand a topic, asks their teacher, in their own words, "Do you mean this?" and the teacher says, "Yes."

    Meanwhile, right on cue:
    Quote Originally Posted by Idolater View Post
    You'll say 'that's not in the Bible,' as if that matters, but it's demanded by the Lord God's immensity, that it be so. Just because something isn't explicitly mentioned in the Bible, doesn't mean it isn't true.
    Quote Originally Posted by Right Divider View Post
    Please provide the SCRIPTURE to support this myth of yours.
    I don't have to. If the Scripture is true, then it must be true. Our Lord's immensity demands that it be true.
    Quote Originally Posted by Right Divider View Post
    More babbling nonsense. You've bought a lie and you like it.
    Not babbling nonsense, and not a lie, but I do like it; very much.
    "Those who believe in Christ" are all the Christians, Catholic or not.

    @Nee_Nihilo

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    Quote Originally Posted by nikolai_42 View Post
    Where do you get that from? I know Babylon has a meaning close to "confusion" - so I could see starting there by identifying denominationalism as Babylon (though I don't agree). But where do get that imagery?



    Revelation is a book of symbols and images that often represent things. So when they do (and we know Babylon probably does represent something simply because there is no Babylon physically around today) we have to follow the biblical mandate for interpreting these symbols. Just because Babylon means something bad doesn't mean we identify it as meaning idolatry. Otherwise we could do the same thing with Egypt, for example. Revelation uses both Egypt and Sodom in a spiritual sense (Rev 11:8) and both those nations were guilty of idolatry. So is that what we are to read them as?

    So no, aeronautics isn't going to help you identify Babylon, but just picking a definition isn't going to give you the right understanding either. And if all you are relying on is the fact that Babylon represents idol worshippers AND your identification of that with the organizational churches, then you are probably not going to fit in with the biblical defintion. And verse 3 helps us identify who Babylon is/was.

    So...again...how does the organizational/denominational church system fulfill verse 3 (which is describing Babylon and its interaction with the world):

    For all nations have drunk of the wine of the wrath of her fornication, and the kings of the earth have committed fornication with her, and the merchants of the earth are waxed rich through the abundance of her delicacies.
    Rev 18:3
    My reasonings are all contextual, rightly divided.

    So if you don't like it, it is your problem.

    I cannot help you.

    All scriptural debate is subjective.

    We just wait and see who are spreading the truth.

    God cannot be mocked.

    good day.
    If you want to be true to God and Jesus, abandon any kind of violence at all cost. By advocating any kind of violence, you are misrepresenting Christianity.

  12. #53
    Over 1500 post club nikolai_42's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by meshak View Post
    My reasonings are all contextual, rightly divided.

    So if you don't like it, it is your problem.

    I cannot help you.

    All scriptural debate is subjective.

    We just wait and see who are spreading the truth.

    God cannot be mocked.

    good day.
    You haven't given me any reasoning. Just assertions. You've said "Babylon is the organizational church" but no support (except to say that Babylon stands for idol worship). You have to first of all show where you get Babylon meaning idol worship before you can make that claim. If there were nothing to describe Babylon in these verse, then you might have a good reason to say Babylon represents idol worship. But when verse 3 describes what is going on with Babylon, you need to explain how the organizational church meets that description or else you are just making things up as you go along to suit your own views.

    So how does the organizational church do what verse 3 says Babylon does?
    If God promises life, He slayeth first; when He builds, He casteth all down first. God is no patcher; He cannot build on another's foundation. - William Tyndale

    The heart is deceitful above all things, and desperately wicked: who can know it?
    Jeremiah 17:9

    Who is among you that feareth the Lord, that obeyeth the voice of his servant, that walketh in darkness, and hath no light? let him trust in the name of the Lord, and stay upon his God.
    Behold, all ye that kindle a fire, that compass yourselves about with sparks: walk in the light of your fire, and in the sparks that ye have kindled. This shall ye have of mine hand; ye shall lie down in sorrow.

    Isaiah 50:10-11

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    Quote Originally Posted by Idolater View Post
    It's wonderful, and joyful. Marvelous. Stupendous. Outrageously majestic and glorious.
    It's sad that you're so far. You should be close.

    Quote Originally Posted by Idolater View Post
    If our Husband desires His Bride to adore Him in a particular way, wouldn't you think that when the Church obeys Him as our Husband, that it is preferable to disobeying Him? Just hypothetically, I'm asking. It's not a salvation issue, just a practical, hypothetical question.
    I'm a part of His body. How much closer can I get than that?

    You are on the outside looking in.

    Quote Originally Posted by Idolater View Post
    Then you ought to know this stuff. But you don't, and the reason that you don't, is because you're just a private Bible interpreter, and you read where Christ promised His future Apostles the Spirit of truth, and you think that He's speaking to you and to me, but He's speaking to His future Apostles, and the Spirit of truth led them into all truth, and their duty to the Body of Christ is to relay the truth to the rest of us, the faithful, who are in Christ, and seated in the heavenlies.

    I just believe what the Bible clearly says. I don't need anyone's interpretation of what it says.

    Quote Originally Posted by Idolater View Post
    Their college and office is our source for sure, reliable Christian teaching, which takes into account the whole Bible, and the whole history of the Church, and the whole Apostolic witness, including what is written in the New Testament, plus what the Apostles themselves uttered but did not record, and those teachings that originated from non-Apostles, but that the Apostles themselves approved, e.g., when someone, seeking to understand a topic, asks their teacher, in their own words, "Do you mean this?" and the teacher says, "Yes."
    This is exactly the kind of utter and total confusion that you get from failing to rightly divide the Word of truth.

    Quote Originally Posted by Idolater View Post
    Meanwhile, right on cue:I don't have to. If the Scripture is true, then it must be true. Our Lord's immensity demands that it be true.
    Not babbling nonsense, and not a lie, but I do like it; very much.


    Like the title says, COME OUT OF HER.
    Quote Originally Posted by Squeaky View Post
    That explains why your an idiot.
    Quote Originally Posted by God's Truth View Post
    Father figure, Son figure, and Holy Spirit figure.
    Quote Originally Posted by God's Truth View Post
    You preach against me for preaching obedience to Christ for salvation.
    Col 2:9 (AKJV/PCE)
    (2:9) For in him dwelleth all the fulness of the Godhead bodily.

    1Tim 4:10 (AKJV/PCE)
    (4:10) For therefore we both labour and suffer reproach, because we trust in the living God, who is the Saviour of all men, specially of those that believe.

    Something that was SPOKEN OF since the world began CANNOT be the SAME thing as something KEPT SECRET since the world began.

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    Quote Originally Posted by meshak View Post
    My reasonings are all contextual, rightly divided.
    Quote Originally Posted by Squeaky View Post
    That explains why your an idiot.
    Quote Originally Posted by God's Truth View Post
    Father figure, Son figure, and Holy Spirit figure.
    Quote Originally Posted by God's Truth View Post
    You preach against me for preaching obedience to Christ for salvation.
    Col 2:9 (AKJV/PCE)
    (2:9) For in him dwelleth all the fulness of the Godhead bodily.

    1Tim 4:10 (AKJV/PCE)
    (4:10) For therefore we both labour and suffer reproach, because we trust in the living God, who is the Saviour of all men, specially of those that believe.

    Something that was SPOKEN OF since the world began CANNOT be the SAME thing as something KEPT SECRET since the world began.

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  18. #56
    LIFETIME MEMBER meshak's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by nikolai_42 View Post
    You haven't given me any reasoning. Just assertions.

    that's your opinion which you are entitled to have them.

    good day.
    If you want to be true to God and Jesus, abandon any kind of violence at all cost. By advocating any kind of violence, you are misrepresenting Christianity.

  19. #57
    LIFETIME MEMBER meshak's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Right Divider View Post
    I am so glad that I can entertain you.
    If you want to be true to God and Jesus, abandon any kind of violence at all cost. By advocating any kind of violence, you are misrepresenting Christianity.

  20. #58
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    Cool

    Quote Originally Posted by meshak View Post
    I am so glad that I can entertain you.
    You entertain us all with your hilarious posts.
    Quote Originally Posted by Squeaky View Post
    That explains why your an idiot.
    Quote Originally Posted by God's Truth View Post
    Father figure, Son figure, and Holy Spirit figure.
    Quote Originally Posted by God's Truth View Post
    You preach against me for preaching obedience to Christ for salvation.
    Col 2:9 (AKJV/PCE)
    (2:9) For in him dwelleth all the fulness of the Godhead bodily.

    1Tim 4:10 (AKJV/PCE)
    (4:10) For therefore we both labour and suffer reproach, because we trust in the living God, who is the Saviour of all men, specially of those that believe.

    Something that was SPOKEN OF since the world began CANNOT be the SAME thing as something KEPT SECRET since the world began.

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  22. #59
    LIFETIME MEMBER meshak's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Right Divider View Post

    Like the title says, COME OUT OF HER.
    You too, sir.

    Come out of following all man-made doctrines.
    If you want to be true to God and Jesus, abandon any kind of violence at all cost. By advocating any kind of violence, you are misrepresenting Christianity.

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    Over 750 post club Idolater's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by meshak View Post
    Babylon is symbolism for idle worshippers.
    Did you know that back then, when the Bible talks about idolatry, that there were pagans/heathen who were sacrificing to their idols? They wouldn't just possess statues of 'gods,' they would literally slaughter animals and burn bread and incense all to worship their deities. Idolatry wasn't just praying to false gods, it was offering sacrifices to them.

    When the Catholic Conquistadors discovered the New World, they were absolutely horrified to find that the Aztec pagans/heathen took this notion to the extreme, and actually sacrificed human beings to their false gods, innocent people from their own population sometimes, sometimes criminals, sometimes people captured from surrounding villages. That's why the Christian Conquitadors felt the need to destroy the civilization utterly from the earth, something that modern historians lament and judge the Christians for doing, but it is at least understandable, them coming from Christian Europe, where nobody even sacrificed animals to false deities, let alone people.

    This form of idolatry was virtually blotted out from humanity by the Church during Christendom, and we shouldn't be surprised if people here and there decide to revive the ancient practice of sacrificing animals to false pagan heathen 'gods.' The unraveling of Christendom is going to permit it to occur, and I just wouldn't put anything past what pagans might want to do at some point.
    Quote Originally Posted by meshak View Post
    All denominational or organizational churches follow their own idea of Gospel and His teachings.
    Because nobody has a direct line to Jesus, so of course it's going to be 'their own idea' of what He wants of us. Who else's idea should they believe? Nobody has a direct line to Him.
    Quote Originally Posted by meshak View Post
    So you don't have be rocket scientist to identify who or what they are.
    Babylon is Rome, the city, and the powerful Romans, who were at the time murdering Christians, including both Peter (crucified upside down; the upside down cross is Peter's cross) and Paul (beheaded), along with scores of less important people, many of whom were fastened to stakes, covering in oil, and set on fire, and many of whom were devoured alive by lions, before crowds of pagans, watching with enjoyment.

    Nero is Mr. 666.
    "Those who believe in Christ" are all the Christians, Catholic or not.

    @Nee_Nihilo

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