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Thread: How To Get To Heaven When You Die

  1. #61
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bradley D View Post
    ?

    "Cain made love to his wife, and she became pregnant and gave birth to Enoch. Cain was then building a city, and he named it after his son Enoch" (Gen. 4:17).
    Not sure what that has to do with the Tree of the Knowledge of Good and Evil.

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    Quote Originally Posted by xfrodobagginsx View Post
    You are mixing up two events. One is the rapture of the Church. Two is the Second Coming of Christ. They aren't the same event. They are 7 years apart.
    Not according to Scripture. Both events coincide with the exact same trumpet, the 7th/last trumpet.
    There is no "rapture of the church", that's a VERY recent theory, and isn't Biblical.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Dartman View Post
    Not according to Scripture. Both events coincide with the exact same trumpet, the 7th/last trumpet.
    There is no "rapture of the church", that's a VERY recent theory, and isn't Biblical.
    Yup...

    And the coming of a thief at night is only a surprise to ones NOT watching for him...

    nothing secret/surprise at all when EVERY EYE shall see His coming

    and the righteous dead...those asleep in Him...rise first in the same manner He did with flesh and blood...

    ...then the living righteous are twinkled into new bodies and follow to meet Him in the air to go to mansions He prepared...

    the rest of unrighteousness living join their fellow dead...to sleep...the earth now made desolate...satan chained by darkness for a thousand years...no one to tempt...

  4. #64
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dartman View Post
    Not according to Scripture. Both events coincide with the exact same trumpet, the 7th/last trumpet.
    There is no "rapture of the church", that's a VERY recent theory, and isn't Biblical.
    Yes according to Scripture. Paul's writing was written to the primarily Gentile Church, the other one was written to the Jews under the Kingdom. Two separate events. The rapture precedes the second coming of Christ by 7 years. Ever heard of Daniel's 70 weeks? 490 years? The last week of 7 years isn't fulfilled until after the rapture. Because the jews rejected their Messiah, the clock stopped until the time of the Gentiles is fulfilled. Once the Church is taken out of the way, the clock will start again and the last 7 years will begin. That's known as the 7 year tribulation.

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    Quote Originally Posted by xfrodobagginsx View Post
    Yes according to Scripture. Paul's writing was written to the primarily Gentile Church, the other one was written to the Jews under the Kingdom.
    There is no such division in the Church;
    Gal 3:26-29 For ye are all the children of God by faith in Christ Jesus. 27 For as many of you as have been baptized into Christ have put on Christ.
    28 There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither bond nor free, there is neither male nor female: for ye are all one in Christ Jesus. 29 And if ye be Christ's, then are ye Abraham's seed, and heirs according to the promise.




    Quote Originally Posted by XX
    Two separate events.
    Not at all. Identical descriptions, one event. ALL righteous, of ALL time, of ALL ethnicities, ALL resurrected to eternal life at the same time, at the same trump.


    Quote Originally Posted by XX
    The rapture precedes the second coming of Christ by 7 years. Ever heard of Daniel's 70 weeks? 490 years? The last week of 7 years isn't fulfilled until after the rapture. Because the jews rejected their Messiah, the clock stopped until the time of the Gentiles is fulfilled. Once the Church is taken out of the way, the clock will start again and the last 7 years will begin. That's known as the 7 year tribulation.
    I'm well aware of the fallacy of this so-called 7 year rapture. The distortion of Daniels 490 years is sad. The last 7 years of the 490 years is Christ's ministry for 3 1/2 years, and then the apostles going to Israel for another 3 1/2 years. ALL 490 were fulfilled, and then the gospel went to the Gentiles..... exactly like Jesus had foretold.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Dartman View Post
    There is no such division in the Church;
    Gal 3:26-29 For ye are all the children of God by faith in Christ Jesus. 27 For as many of you as have been baptized into Christ have put on Christ.
    28 There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither bond nor free, there is neither male nor female: for ye are all one in Christ Jesus. 29 And if ye be Christ's, then are ye Abraham's seed, and heirs according to the promise.


    I'm well aware of the fallacy of this so-called 7 year rapture. The distortion of Daniels 490 years is sad. The last 7 years of the 490 years is Christ's ministry for 3 1/2 years, and then the apostles going to Israel for another 3 1/2 years. ALL 490 were fulfilled, and then the gospel went to the Gentiles..... exactly like Jesus had foretold.
    I understand that the Gospel of Grace extends to all. But the Gospel of the Kingdom was a bit different. It was given to the Jews under the Law and required water Baptism. The Gospel of Grace is of Faith in Christ alone, believing that He died and rose again, shedding His blood for your sins.

    Secondly, it is not called the 7 year rapture. It's simply called the rapture of the Church. The 490 years were not fulfilled. 489 were until the time of His death and resurrection. Because Israel rejected their Messiah, there was a pause, break in the program and the Gospel of Grace was extended to the Gentiles under Paul, but yes it is to anyone who will believe. God is NOT through with Israel. They WILL turn back to God and accept their Messiah Jesus Christ. The rapture/tribulation period brings this to happen. The Holy Spirit is the one holding back the power of satan to bring it about in the world today. The Bible says that He will be taken out of the way (during the rapture)

    2 Thessalonians 2:7 For the mystery of iniquity doth already work: only he who now letteth will let, until he be taken out of the way.

    51 Behold, I shew you a mystery; We shall not all sleep, but we shall all be changed,

    52 In a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trump: for the trumpet shall sound, and the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed.53 For this corruptible must put on incorruption, and this mortal must put on immortality.

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    Dead are dead.

    They have no consciousness therefore cannot go anywhere.

    See Psalm 6:5. Ecclesiastes 9.

    I These 4:13-17.

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    Quote Originally Posted by oatmeal View Post
    Dead are dead.

    They have no consciousness therefore cannot go anywhere.

    See Psalm 6:5. Ecclesiastes 9.

    I These 4:13-17.
    wrong. Conciousness goes on after physical death. The verse you referenced is regarding the physical body, not the soul and the spirit. The story of the Rich man and Lazarus is another example. There are many examples. Revelation has people in heaven talking to God.


    1It is not expedient for me doubtless to glory. I will come to visions and revelations of the Lord. 2I knew a man in Christ above fourteen years ago, (whether in the body, I cannot tell; or whether out of the body, I cannot tell: God knoweth such an one caught up to the third heaven. 3And I knew such a man, (whether in the body, or out of the body, I cannot tell: God knoweth 4How that he was caught up into paradise, and heard unspeakable words, which it is not lawful for a man to utter. 5Of such an one will I glory: yet of myself I will not glory, but in mine infirmities. 6For though I would desire to glory, I shall not be a fool; for I will say the truth: but now I forbear, lest any man should think of me above that which he seeth me to be, or that he heareth of me. 7And lest I should be exalted above measure through the abundance of the revelations, there was given to me a thorn in the flesh, the messenger of Satan to buffet me, lest I should be exalted above measure.

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    .....

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    Live a life like AMR and you will go there too.
    He is no fool who gives what he cannot keep to gain what he cannot lose.

    Jim Elliot

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    Quote Originally Posted by Bright Raven View Post
    Live a life like AMR and you will go there too.
    It's only by faith alone in Christ and His sacrifice on the cross.

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    Greetings xfr,
    Quote Originally Posted by xfrodobagginsx View Post
    It's only by faith alone in Christ and His sacrifice on the cross.
    It seems that Philip preached a different message to what you preach:
    Acts 8:5-6,12 (KJV): 5 Then Philip went down to the city of Samaria, and preached Christ unto them. 6 And the people with one accord gave heed unto those things which Philip spake, hearing and seeing the miracles which he did. 12 But when they believed Philip preaching the things concerning the kingdom of God, and the name of Jesus Christ, they were baptized, both men and women.

    Kind regards
    Trevor

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