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Thread: Justice Kavanaugh’s first test on abortion comes this week

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    Quote Originally Posted by chair View Post
    to you as well. It is so easy to talk about what the doctor should do- but in much of the world there aren't doctors or hospitals available, and tough choices need to be made.
    That tough choices need to be made does not mean it is necessary to stop delivering the child in order to kill him.
    Where is the evidence for a global flood?
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    Quote Originally Posted by chair View Post
    It is so easy to talk about what the doctor should do-
    I don't think you're comprehending what I'm saying. Which, honestly, is not surprising, considering your bias.

    When I say a doctor should do everything he can to save both mother and child, I mean it in the strictest sense.

    He should not ever stop to kill the baby or the mother, because there is never a reason to.

    Not even in an ectopic pregnancy should the doctor stop to kill the baby. If necessary (and technology has advanced enough that it's starting to show that it's not necessary), the doctor should remove the baby from the mother's body, but there's no reason to stop and kill the baby. In addition, allowing the baby to reattach inside the mother's womb is increasingly an option, which takes the mother out of danger, and allows the baby to continue growing normally.

    https://kgov.com/can-a-baby-survive-...opic-pregnancy

    Also... Do they not teach the hippocratic oath anymore in medical schools?


    "I will use treatment to help the sick according to my ability and judgment, but never with a view to injury and wrong-doing. Neither will I administer a poison to anybody when asked to do so, nor will I suggest such a course. Similarly I will not give to a woman a pessary to cause abortion. But I will keep pure and holy both my life and my art."


    -Wikipedia, Hippocratic Oath

    but in much of the world there aren't doctors or hospitals available, and tough choices need to be made.
    Tough choices are ALWAYS being made. But choosing to stop delivering the baby to kill it and then go on to save the mother is not a logical one. There is NEVER any reason (other than blood-lust, which isn't a reason at all) to kill a baby.

    If you think there is, please, provide a specific example where you think it would be necessary to stop delivering the baby (and caring for the mother) long enough to kill it. Even if it's never happened, or is so unlikely, provide a specific example where it would be necessary to kill the baby. I posit that you cannot, because there is NEVER a situation where such is necessary.

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    Quote Originally Posted by JudgeRightly View Post
    ...
    When I say a doctor should do everything he can to save both mother and child, I mean it in the strictest sense.

    He should not ever stop to kill the baby or the mother, because there is never a reason to....
    Is it really that difficult to understand that births didn't occur in hospitals until recently, and that until this day millions of children are born in poor countries without the benefit of doctors and hospitals?

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    Gold level Subscriber JudgeRightly's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by chair View Post
    Is it really that difficult to understand that births didn't occur in hospitals until recently, and that until this day millions of children are born in poor countries without the benefit of doctors and hospitals?
    So what? Location of the delivery has no bearing on if it's right or wrong to stop and kill the baby.

    Would you like to address my point or are you going to continue to squirm?

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    Quote Originally Posted by chair View Post
    Is it really that difficult to understand that births didn't occur in hospitals until recently, and that until this day millions of children are born in poor countries without the benefit of doctors and hospitals?
    You are not respecting the opposition's position.

    We do not say that complications cannot arise.

    We do say that complications are solved by delivering the baby, which does not require the additional step of killing him.

    Also, you didn't describe why you think abortion is wrong (but not murder).

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    Where is the evidence for a global flood?
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    "The waters under the 'expanse' were under the crust."
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    Justice Kavanaugh’s first test on abortion comes this week

    ProLife supporters are vocal when expressing that no effort should be spared when saving the life of the foetus, but they are eerily silent when it comes to addressing the topic of those medical costs that accompany such efforts!

    These children are often born with pre-existing medical conditions that no insurance company wants to underwrite - where is all this "self-righteous indignation" when individual families are left to cope with the mounting financial burden?

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    Quote Originally Posted by JudgeRightly View Post
    So what? Location of the delivery has no bearing on if it's right or wrong to stop and kill the baby.

    Would you like to address my point or are you going to continue to squirm?
    Location and time have everything to do with this. You and Stripe keep pretending that all babies, always, were and are delivered in modern Western hospitals. That is simply false- you are the folks who are squirming.

    But, hey- if you don't want to face reality, fine. View it as a thought experiment. Is the life of an unborn child worth exactly as much as that of an adult?

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    Gold level Subscriber JudgeRightly's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by chair View Post
    Location and time have everything to do with this.
    No, they don't. Murder is ABSOLUTELY wrong. Do you not know the definition of absolute?

    You and Stripe keep pretending that all babies, always, were and are delivered in modern Western hospitals.
    No, we don't.

    That is simply false- you are the folks who are squirming.


    But, hey- if you don't want to face reality, fine. View it as a thought experiment. Is the life of an unborn child worth exactly as much as that of an adult?
    Both the mother and baby have INFINITE worth.

    You're trying to turn this into a math equation. Stop. Humans are not variables in a math equation. They're people, made in the image of God.

    But hey, if you don't want to face reality, it'll come back to bite you on Judgment Day.

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    Quote Originally Posted by jgarden View Post
    ProLife supporters are vocal when expressing that no effort should be spared when saving the life of the foetus.
    And pro-aborts shriek, scream and lash out when their supposed "right" to murder kids is questioned.

    Quote Originally Posted by chair View Post
    You and Stripe keep pretending that all babies, always, were and are delivered in modern Western hospitals.
    Nope. No matter where our when, delivering the baby might be the best thing to do in an emergency.

    It is never necessary to halt delivery in order to kill the baby.

    Is the life of an unborn child worth exactly as much as that of an adult?
    How about you answer the pertinent question: Why is abortion wrong (but not murder)?


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    Where is the evidence for a global flood?
    E≈mc2
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    Throw your trolls out the door

    "The waters under the 'expanse' were under the crust."
    -Bob B.

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    Quote Originally Posted by jgarden View Post
    Justice Kavanaugh’s first test on abortion comes this week

    ProLife supporters are vocal when expressing that no effort should be spared when saving the life of the foetus, but they are eerily silent when it comes to addressing the topic of those medical costs that accompany such efforts!

    These children are often born with pre-existing medical conditions that no insurance company wants to underwrite - where is all this "self-righteous indignation" when individual families are left to cope with the mounting financial burden?
    Well if you dont have the $ you should not have sex. Easy solution to the problem.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jonahdog View Post
    Well if you dont have the $ you should not have sex. Easy solution to the problem.
    Not really a solution, that one.

    Here's the best solution: don't have sex outside of marriage, so that there's a supporting structure called a family for taking care of children.

    Also, punish rapists by putting them to death, and love the child.

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    Quote Originally Posted by JudgeRightly View Post
    No, they don't. Murder is ABSOLUTELY wrong. Do you not know the definition of absolute?
    The question is: Is it murder? This is exactly the assumption I am questioning.
    Quote Originally Posted by JudgeRightly View Post
    But hey, if you don't want to face reality, it'll come back to bite you on Judgment Day.
    Do you speak for God? Have his cell phone number?

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    Quote Originally Posted by chair View Post
    The question is: Is it murder?
    The answer is:

    YES, it is murder.

    This is exactly the assumption I am questioning.
    Well, then I'm glad I can put your questioning to rest.

    Do you speak for God? Have his cell phone number?
    I have his Word, the book He wrote for all of humanity, and a direct line of communication with Him via prayer. You do too, but first you need to Romans 10:9.

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    Quote Originally Posted by JudgeRightly View Post
    The answer is:

    YES, it is murder.

    Well, then I'm glad I can put your questioning to rest.



    I have his Word, the book He wrote for all of humanity, and a direct line of communication with Him via prayer. You do too, but first you need to Romans 10:9.
    Whatever. Enjoy your non-thinking belief in whatever it is you believe.....

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    Quote Originally Posted by chair View Post
    Whatever. Enjoy your non-thinking belief in whatever it is you believe.....
    Chair, you used to have thought in your responses. But you are just an NPC in this thread. Why?

    Did you have an abortion? Did you have one done for someone you got pregnant? Did you approve of one for someone else?

    The questions are clear - Why is abortion wrong but not murder? Is it ever right to stop to kill the baby? And additionally I'd like to ask; if we view the baby-before-it-is-born as a human, aren't our protestations reasonable?

    If you can answer that last one in the affirmative, then can you restate our argument or are you an NPC? If you answer in the negative, then why do you say abortion is wrong in any way?
    Good things come to those who shoot straight.

    Did you only want evidence you are not going to call "wrong"? -Stripe

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