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Thread: Judging the Mitchell Report

  1. #91
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    Quote Originally Posted by lifeisgood View Post
    Some speak as if Justices were robots and never get angry over anything, they're so mellow, they just let everything roll over their backs, they never get drunk. Yeah, right.

    Some speak as if they never get angry over anything, even here at TOL they're so mellow and they never disagree when someone make a libel statement against them. Yeah, right.
    No one assumes the person on the bench is devoid of passions. We do have a right to assume that they are capable of setting their passions, no matter how odious and even obvious the crime committed by the defendant in the dock. This is necessary for the principles of legal proceedings wherein matters of law are decided upon objections by the state and the defendant, leaving no doubt to all that one side is not favored over the other.

    Once the verdict is rendered, the sentence to be pronounced, a judge is well within his rights to exhibit his disdain and even disgust on behalf of the people. Yet even at that moment, he is expected to do his duty per whatever constraints exist, including showing mercy where warranted. So, no, your idea that jurists are to be robots is hyperbolic rhetoric.

    Justice is simply giving to each his due. Persons are due various things in judicial proceedings. One thing, an important thing, is impartiality by the person on the bench. Not feigned impartiality, façades, or chimeras. Genuine impartiality.

    From what I have witnessed of Kavanaugh, I have real reservations that he can muster genuine impartiality going forward. And given his testimony now on record, should he not be confirmed, he will find himself being asked to recuse himself from not a few future proceedings that will likely come before him. Likewise, if he is confirmed, every rendered verdict by SCOTUS having his name attached will no doubt be caviled about loudly as rank partisanship for years to come.

    AMR
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  3. #92
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    Quote Originally Posted by Idolater View Post
    It's the written rulings of the Supreme Court that become history, not what justices utter. Here, I think that Judge Kavanaugh showed that regardless of this debacle (an unbiased assessment, whether or not he is a victim), he can write. Many people, myself included and my guess is many who participate frequently in internet discussion boards and forums too, think by, in, through, etc., writing. This op-ed I think shows that perhaps it is so with Kavanaugh as well.

    His job won't involve uttering. It only involves writing.
    Actually, what we write is the result of what we think. The written form displays our thought processes, reasonings, and willings. Words spring from the fountain of our minds.

    Those that are careless, flippant, eristic, infelicitous, etc., in print are quite likely to be the same in person. Sure, folks can adopt some charade in discussion forums to tickle whatever motives and fancies as a form of entertainment or desire to be seen. But I am not speaking of these juvenile behaviors. Rather, the written form taken up in sincerity and seriousness.

    To the person that takes the written form seriously, as I do, Kavanaugh's op-ed speaks volumes about the mind of the man. I do not like what I see therein.

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  5. #93
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ask Mr. Religion View Post
    Actually, what we write is the result of what we think. The written form displays our thought processes, reasonings, and willings. Words spring from the fountain of our minds.
    And, many people actually advance their thoughts while writing. It's not just an image of what's already gone on, it's the going on itself, in process.
    Quote Originally Posted by Ask Mr. Religion View Post
    Those that are careless, flippant, eristic, infelicitous, etc., in print are quite likely to be the same in person.
    Agreed. I also know that people can be irl, in person, 'careless, flippant, eristic, infelicitous, etc.,' but very careful and polished in print.
    Quote Originally Posted by Ask Mr. Religion View Post
    Sure, folks can adopt some charade in discussion forums to tickle whatever motives and fancies as a form of entertainment or desire to be seen. But I am not speaking of these juvenile behaviors. Rather, the written form taken up in sincerity and seriousness.

    To the person that takes the written form seriously, as I do, Kavanaugh's op-ed speaks volumes about the mind of the man. I do not like what I see therein.
    I like that he promises to continue to be faithful to what the Constitution actually says, which will force those who want to amend it, to try to do so, rather than make laws which contravene it.
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    Quote Originally Posted by nikolai_42 View Post
    This is a tough one. When judges have a conflict of interest or don't believe they can be impartial, they are supposed to recuse themselves, aren't they? But is it not possible to separate the personal from the judicial? Is objectivity something we are to expect from a justice when it's all about his own actions? Maybe the question does arise if he can properly separate personal situations impacted by case matter, but at what point is the ice water in the veins allowed to thaw just a little (okay...more than a little in Kavanaugh's case)? These aren't rhetorical questions.

    And the next question I have would be if this disqualifies him from any service as a judge on any appellate court. Why only the Supreme Court? Because if that happens, then this man truly has been ruined and any previous service is now called into question. And if not, what would qualify him for a lower court but not SCOTUS? Constitutional issues, I would think, would be the easiest ones in which the judge could objectify the material at hand and separate himself emotionally from it.

    Or am I looking at this wrong?
    I think we have to recognize that the S. Ct. is a different animal. On a federal bench you're mostly known to the lawyers. We have SNL skits and films about Justices to the high court. So you're much more likely to see an investment in the personal. I'd be more worried about it there than elsewhere. And, to work in a bit of Idol's remarks, people might be surprised how much public interaction and jousting goes on with lawyers from the bench there in addition to writing opinions, where they might be surprised to find clerks doing much of that under direction of the Justices.
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    Looks like a banner day for democrats going into the midterms. A strong argument against unfettered power by any one party.


    And now Kavanaugh has the chance to make another public statement of sorts. Let's see what he does with the chance.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Town Heretic View Post
    Looks like a banner day for democrats going into the midterms. A strong argument against unfettered power by any one party.
    Obama was so fond of saying, "Elections have consequences."

    In what way do you think it will be a "banner day" for Democrats on November 6?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jerry Shugart View Post
    Obama was so fond of saying, "Elections have consequences."

    In what way do you think it will be a "banner day" for Democrats on November 6?
    Town is into wishful thinking.

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    Regular Americans were disgusted by the entire spectacle coming from the Loser Dems. Their attempt to trash a good man will come back to bite them in the mid-terms. Add to that the screaming maniacs that are swarming across our land, we can be sure a huge red wave is coming.

    Thank you Dems. You have put a big nail in your own coffin.

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    Quote Originally Posted by glorydaz View Post
    Town is into wishful thinking.
    I'd like to see the power divided in the country. I don't believe it's healthy for one party to have this much, especially when they represent a minority of the actual electorate. At least when the democrats get it I can count on them largely frittering it away with infighting. My hope is that this sort of thing will fuel a return of the House to the left. Time will tell.

    Quote Originally Posted by glorydaz View Post
    Their attempt to trash a good man will come back to bite them in the mid-terms.
    I don't know if he's a good man or a bad man, but I'm pretty sure the guy I heard doesn't belong on the Court. He violated just about every principle of judicial conduct he instructed law students in.

    Add to that the screaming maniacs that are swarming across our land, we can be sure a huge red wave is coming. Thank you Dems. You have put a big nail in your own coffin.
    That's what the democrats thought when Obama went into office.
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    I'd hope that he is more mindful and closer in demonstrated character from the bench than he appeared under examination, failing his litmus for a judge's demeanor sufficiently that he lost my support. A support he had before he began to offer testimony.

    I don't accept the father/son/husband defense. It was Kavanaugh who decided his family would be in attendance and then used them as an excuse. It was Kavanaugh who lectured law students on necessity of the appearance of implacable nonpartisanship before using prepared opening remarks to launch an angry conspiracy theory. It was Kavanaugh who chose to respond insubordinately to senators sitting in judgment on his merit. It was kavanaugh who chose to drink and then mislead on the point in a way no one who had ever been a beer loving college freshman would have found credible. It was Kavanaugh whose conduct was such that even in his contempt he felt obliged to apologize for it, both at the hearing and later in an op-ed.

    I'm not in any of this suggesting that Kavanaugh is an evil man. He may very well strive to be the best of men, as he sees it, driven by conscience and perhaps that distant past toward a higher standard. He may from this point forward be ranked as an able Justice, mindful of the women who will be observing his demeanor, desirous to demonstrate his commitment to their wellbeing and the oath he took shortly after assuming his office. Or, it may be that what we witnessed in response to challenge will be the cornerstone of Kavanaugh's future, if largely under the skin -- imperial, belligerent, partisan, and carrying a grudge like the cross of Calvary.

    Only time will tell and hope is free...so let us hope together then for something more.


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    Quote Originally Posted by Town Heretic View Post

    an able Justice, mindful of the women
    The women are 'the people.' And the Bill of Rights says that 'the right of the people to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed,' and if the right of the people were not already infringed back in the early 1980s, perhaps none of this would have happened, and instead the future doctor would have justly shot and killed the future judge, being well regulated, meaning well armed, and knowing how to shoot. This is what might have happened in a nation respectful enough of the highest law in the land to enforce that law, until such a time as we lawfully amend it.

    iow, if he follows his hand, and continues to defend the plain meaning, and the largely uniform authorized interpretation, of the Second Amendment, then Justice Kavanaugh can simultaneously better the lot of all women wrt rapists or murderers, and, by refusing to permit any laws that contravene the Second Amendment anymore, hold the Democrats' hands while they instead try to lawfully change the Constitution.

    'Seems like a win-win for everybody around, and the only thing that it hinges upon is him following his hand wrt the Second Amendment. The right of the people to keep and bear all instruments that constitute bearable arms, even those that were not in existence at the time of the founding, shall not be infringed. That's the law. But we can't carry (=bear) rifles, we can't carry concealed unless we're 'permitted' to (permit=infringe), and we can't own/possess (=keep) the weapons that are globally those most 'in common use.'

    And that's all just some big-ticket infringements. There are tons and tons of others; they all contravene the Constitution, and as such they all constitute a raping of the Constitution, and I hope that Justice Kavanaugh can play the part of ironic hero, and rescue the Constitution from the corrupt lawmakers who are raping it, all at the expense, further ironically, of 'the women;' whose inalienable right to prepare themselves for war/just self-defense (cf. 'If you want peace, prepare for war'), is currently seriously infringed by Democrat laws.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Town Heretic View Post
    He may from this point forward be ranked as an able Justice, mindful of the women who will be observing his demeanor, desirous to demonstrate his commitment to their wellbeing and the oath he took shortly after assuming his office. Or, it may be that what we witnessed in response to challenge will be the cornerstone of Kavanaugh's future, if largely under the skin -- imperial, belligerent, partisan, and carrying a grudge like the cross of Calvary.
    So you think that you can actually sit in judgment of this man, a man with a spotless record during twelve years on the United States Circuit Judge of the United States Court of Appeals for the District of Columbia Circuit?

    From what I can see about your comments I can only understand that you actually believe in "guilt by accusation"!

    Just wait until it happens to you and then perhaps you will finally learn to separate fantasy from reality!

    Now you are not connected to reality.

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    Quote Originally Posted by glorydaz View Post
    Town is into wishful thinking.
    I just hope he will answer in what way it will be a banner day for the Democrats come November 6. I think that once again he proves that he is divorced from reality.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jerry Shugart View Post
    So you think that you can actually sit in judgment of this man
    I was holding up the litmus he propounded and failed. I guess he shouldn't have authored one of them.

    a man with a spotless record during twelve years on the United States Circuit Judge of the United States Court of Appeals for the District of Columbia Circuit?
    He was a solid judge, a few peculiar holdings notwithstanding. That's why I supported him.

    From what I can see about your comments I can only understand that you actually believe in "guilt by accusation"!
    That's because you must not have actually read them. Because if you did that doesn't follow.

    Just wait until it happens to you and then perhaps you will finally learn to separate fantasy from reality!
    Again, my lack of support wasn't over the allegation or his response to it.

    Now you are not connected to reality.
    Your political bias should be listed under Learning Disabilities. Seriously, when you talk about politics you just untether. No idea why.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Idolater View Post
    The women are 'the people.' And the Bill of Rights says that 'the right of the people to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed,'
    And yet you can't own every sort of weapon legally. Or, there's a reasonable line to be drawn. The Court, I believe, made a mistake we're paying for on where they found that line. I believe I draw it where the Founders would be satisfied and that moving beyond that presents a clear and present danger to the people the right was meant to serve.
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