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Thread: Is Calvinism Wrong?

  1. #1441
    TOL Legend john w's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by glorydaz View Post
    Dad gum it. That fits right in with Total Depravity.

    Robert, the Gospel is the POWER OF GOD UNTO SALVATION. Romans 1:16

    This is why we preach it. This is why man is without excuse. We believe because we HEAR. If your claim is that God must intervene before we are able to hear, then you're preaching what the Calvinists do. Paul say we are sealed AFTER we heard and believed.

    Eph. 1:13 In whom ye also trusted, after that ye heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation: in whom also after that ye believed, ye were sealed with that holy Spirit of promise,
    Yes, GD, Pate protests vehemently against Calvinism, Catholicism, but he talks like them-they talk like him. He is a poser, oblivious to his contradictions, forgetting what he had just posted minutes ago.


    As the great Andy Griffith would say, "Pitiful, pitiful, pitiful....."
    Saint John W

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  3. #1442
    TOL Subscriber glorydaz's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by john w View Post
    Yes, GD, Pate protests vehemently against Calvinism, Catholicism, but he talks like them-they talk like him. He is a poser, oblivious to his contradictions, forgetting what he had just posted minutes ago.


    As the great Andy Griffith would say, "Pitiful, pitiful, pitiful....."
    Heck, I forget the names of my own grandkids.....but at least I listen when I'm reminded.

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  5. #1443
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    Quote Originally Posted by Robert Pate View Post
    The Pharisees followed the religion of the law. The law is found in the first 5 books of the Old Testament. The answer is yes.

    They thought that Stephen had committed blasphemy and was worthy of death.
    That wasn't the law's fault or religion's fault. It was because of their own unbelief.

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    Over 5000 post club Rosenritter's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Robert Pate View Post
    No you don't have to understand all that I posted, but if you do understand it you will not be led away by false doctrine. We are saved by simple child like faith in Jesus.

    Calvinist and Catholics do not have child like faith. If they did they would not need their religion.
    That seems like an awfully broad generalization.

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    Over 5000 post club Rosenritter's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by john w View Post
    I won't be able to sleep tonight, with all these meanies, ganging up on me. Stop it!!!

    How did I do?
    You actually had a pretty good constructive criticism a page back: you showed a contradiction just by quoting back the original words and it spoke for itself. I tried to give it a + mark but the page crashed... it shows up as #0 but it's between 1389 and 1391.

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    Last edited by Grosnick Marowbe; November 15th, 2018 at 02:00 AM.

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    Last edited by Grosnick Marowbe; November 15th, 2018 at 02:00 AM.

  12. #1448
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    Quote Originally Posted by Robert Pate View Post
    If you have faith in the work and the person of Jesus Christ for your salvation you will not need a religion. Religion is an indication of the absence of faith.
    No it isn't.

    It could perhaps be an indication of a lack of faith but not the absence of it, at least not to the extent that all relgious people aren't saved by virtue of their religious beliefs. Your stance here turns religious belief into the unpardonable sin! That's just ridiculous.

    Believing false doctrine does not overcome the blood of Christ. If you believe "the gospel" as I laid out before (I'll post it again below) then I don't care what else you believe, you will be saved - period. False doctrine will deprive you of blessing here on Earth and of rewards in Heaven but it will not remove you from the hand of God once you have accepted Jesus as your savior and believed that God raised Him from the dead.


    • God exists. He is the Creator of all things and He is holy, perfect and just.
    • We have, by doing evil things, rebelled against God.
    • We, having rebelled against the God who gave us our life and is Life itself, deserve death.
    • God, being unwilling that all should perish, provided for Himself a propitiation (an atoning sacrifice) in the person of His only begotten Son, God the Son, whom we call Jesus.
    • Jesus willingly bore the sins of the world and died on the cross on our behalf.
    • If you call upon the name of the Lord (i.e. acknowledge your need of a savior and that He is that Savior) and believe that God raised Him from the dead, YOU WILL BE SAVED.
    Last edited by Clete; November 14th, 2018 at 07:44 AM.

    "The [open view] is an attempt to provide a more Biblically faithful, rationally coherent, and practically satisfying account of God and the divine-human relationship..." - Dr. John Sanders

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    Last edited by Grosnick Marowbe; November 15th, 2018 at 02:01 AM.

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    Last edited by Grosnick Marowbe; November 15th, 2018 at 02:01 AM.

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    Last edited by Grosnick Marowbe; November 15th, 2018 at 01:50 AM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by glorydaz View Post
    Dad gum it. That fits right in with Total Depravity.

    Robert, the Gospel is the POWER OF GOD UNTO SALVATION. Romans 1:16

    This is why we preach it. This is why man is without excuse. We believe because we HEAR. If your claim is that God must intervene before we are able to hear, then you're preaching what the Calvinists do. Paul say we are sealed AFTER we heard and believed.

    Eph. 1:13 In whom ye also trusted, after that ye heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation: in whom also after that ye believed, ye were sealed with that holy Spirit of promise,

    Many hear the Gospel but do not believe it, Hebrews 4:2. Only those that hear and believe the Gospel are given the Holy Spirit. You must believe that Jesus atoned for your sins, Romans 10:9-11. We that are saved are continuously trusting in Christ to save us. It is not a one time thing, it is a continuous trusting and believing process.

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  19. #1453
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    Quote Originally Posted by Clete View Post
    No it isn't.

    It could perhaps be an indication of a lack of faith but not the absence of it, at least not to the extent that all relgious people aren't saved by virtue of their religious beliefs. Your stance here turns religious belief into the unpardonable sin! That's just ridiculous.

    Believing false doctrine does not overcome the blood of Christ. If you believe "the gospel" as I laid out before (I'll post it again below) then I don't care what else you believe, you will be saved - period. False doctrine will deprive you of blessing here on Earth and of rewards in Heaven but it will not remove you from the hand of God once you have accepted Jesus as your savior and believed that God raised Him from the dead.


    • God exists. He is the Creator of all things and He is holy, perfect and just.
    • We have, by doing evil things, rebelled against God.
    • We, having rebelled against the God who gave us our life and is Life itself, deserve death.
    • God, being unwilling that all should perish, provided for Himself a propitiation (an atoning sacrifice) in the person of His only begotten Son, God the Son, whom we call Jesus.
    • Jesus willingly bore the sins of the world and died on the cross on our behalf.
    • If you call upon the name of the Lord (i.e. acknowledge your need of a savior and that He is that Savior) and believe that God raised Him from the dead, YOU WILL BE SAVED.

    Jesus did far more than atone for our sins and the sins of the world. You have half of the Gospel but not the whole Gospel. Not only did Jesus die for us, he lived for us. In our name and on our behalf he offered to God the father a life of perfect obedience according to God's Holy Law. When God accepted Jesus into heaven we were accepted in him. This is how we are justified. Jesus justifies the ungodly, Romans 4:5. He justifies the ungodly by doing for them that which we cannot do for ourselves.

  20. #1454
    Body part Right Divider's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Robert Pate View Post
    Many hear the Gospel but do not believe it, Hebrews 4:2. Only those that hear and believe the Gospel are given the Holy Spirit. You must believe that Jesus atoned for your sins, Romans 10:9-11. We that are saved are continuously trusting in Christ to save us. It is not a one time thing, it is a continuous trusting and believing process.
    So you believe that being sealed with the Holy Spirit of promise is not really sealed?

    First you use the past tense "saved", but then you show that you really don't believe that.

    Which is it?

    P.S. This is the kind of confusion that you get for not rightly dividing.
    All of my ancestors are human.
    Quote Originally Posted by Squeaky View Post
    That explains why your an idiot.
    Quote Originally Posted by God's Truth View Post
    Father figure, Son figure, and Holy Spirit figure.
    Col 2:9 (AKJV/PCE)
    (2:9) For in him dwelleth all the fulness of the Godhead bodily.

    1Tim 4:10 (AKJV/PCE)
    (4:10) For therefore we both labour and suffer reproach, because we trust in the living God, who is the Saviour of all men, specially of those that believe.

    Something that was SPOKEN OF since the world began CANNOT be the SAME thing as something KEPT SECRET since the world began.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Right Divider View Post
    So you believe that being sealed with the Holy Spirit of promise is not really sealed?

    First you use the past tense "saved", but then you show that you really don't believe that.

    Which is it?

    P.S. This is the kind of confusion that you get for not rightly dividing.

    We are saved and sealed with the Holy Spirit by hearing and believing the Gospel. Not by going forward in some religious crusade to give your heart to Jesus. Listen to Ephesians 1:13.

    "In whom you also trusted, after you heard the word of truth, THE GOSPEL OF YOUR SALVATION: in whom after that you believed, you were sealed with the Holy Spirit of promise"

    There are many on this Forum that do not believe the Gospel, but think that they are Christians.

    In the Gospel. Jesus defeats, sin, death and the devil, Hebrews 1:3. In the Gospel Jesus justifies the ungodly, Romans 4:5. In the Gospel Jesus fulfills all of the demands of God's Holy Law, Matthew 5:18. In the Gospel Jesus atones for our sins and the sin of the whole world, 1 John 2:2. In the Gospel Jesus makes us complete in himself, Colossians 2:10. In the Gospel we have been justified, sanctified and redeemed, 1 Corinthians 1:30. In the Gospel we are accepted because Jesus is accepted.

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