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Thread: What is God's first creation?

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    Over 5000 post club CherubRam's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jamie View Post
    All things were made by he Word who became human.
    The Word
    Zechariah 11:11
    It was revoked on that day, and so the afflicted of the flock who were watching me knew it was The Word [Yahshua] of [the Lord / Yahwah.]


    The Word [Yahshua]

    John 1:1

    In beginning was The Word, and The Word was with The Only Divine Eternal, and The Word was divine.


    John 1:1 above is a complete translation of the ancient Greek text. It is not an interpretation.

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    Over 5000 post club CherubRam's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by keypurr View Post
    This does not answer the question.

    Col 1:15 Who is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn of every creature:
    Col 1:16 For by him were all things created, that are in heaven, and that are in earth, visible and invisible, whether they be thrones, or dominions, or principalities, or powers: all things were created by him, and for him:

    Who is "him"?

    1. He is invisible
    2. He is firstborn of ALL creatures/creation.
    3. Everything was created through him.
    Because of other scriptures we know that (Him) is referring to Yahwah.

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    Old Timer SonOfCaleb's Avatar
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    The first creative work was Jesus himself who Jehovah created. Collosians 1:13-15
    "He rescued us from the authority of the darkness and transferred us into the kingdom of his beloved Son, 14 by means of whom we have our release by ransom, the forgiveness of our sins. 15 He is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn of all creation; 16 because by means of him all other things were created in the heavens and on the earth, the things visible and the things invisible, whether they are thrones or lordships or governments or authorities. All other things have been created through him and for him."
    Jesus is the person referred to in Genesis 1:26 when Jehovah said
    "Then God said: “Let us make man in our image, according to our likeness"
    Jesus wasnt a co-creator with God but he assisted with ALL of creation including the Angels, the material heaven of our Universe, the Earth and so on.
    John 1:1 "In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was a god. 2 This one was in the beginning with God. 3 All things came into existence through him, and apart from him not even one thing came into existence".

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    LIFETIME MEMBER jamie's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by CherubRam View Post
    In beginning was The Word, and The Word was with The Only Divine Eternal, and The Word was divine. [/FONT]
    We know the Word was not eternal - he died.

    The Word who created all things was conceived as a human by the Spirit.

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    Old Timer SonOfCaleb's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jamie View Post
    We know the Word was not eternal - he died.

    The Word who created all things was conceived as a human by the Spirit.
    Jesus was raised up to Heaven and given the gift of immortality.Prior to this and even as an Angel in Heaven by Gods side he was mortal. Romans 6:9
    "For we know that Christ, now that he has been raised up from the dead, dies no more; death is no longer master over him."
    The Apostle Paul punctuates this further in Hebrews 7:15-17
    "And this becomes even clearer when another priest arises who is like Mel·chizʹe·dek, 16 who has become such, not by the legal requirement that depends on fleshly descent, but by the power of an indestructible life."
    John 1:1 "In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was a god. 2 This one was in the beginning with God. 3 All things came into existence through him, and apart from him not even one thing came into existence".

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    Over 5000 post club CherubRam's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SonOfCaleb View Post
    The first creative work was Jesus himself who Jehovah created. Collosians 1:13-15

    Jesus is the person referred to in Genesis 1:26 when Jehovah said

    Jesus wasnt a co-creator with God but he assisted with ALL of creation including the Angels, the material heaven of our Universe, the Earth and so on.
    Genesis 1:26,27
    God spoke, making man in (our / their) image and likeness; "Let him dominate the fish of the sea, the birds of the sky, the livestock animals, and all the earth, and every land animal that walks the earth." 27 So God created mankind in his own image, in the image of God he created them; male and female he created them.

    "Let us" is AIT. It is not in the original scriptures.


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    Quote Originally Posted by Idolater View Post
    Did God create language, or is language eternal like Him?
    I said
    God created everything.

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    Old Timer SonOfCaleb's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by CherubRam View Post
    [FONT="]Genesis 1:26[/FONT][FONT="],[/FONT][FONT="]27[/FONT][FONT="]
    God spoke, making man in (our / their) image and likeness; "Let him dominate the fish of the sea, the birds of the sky, the livestock animals, and all the earth, and every land animal that walks the earth." 27 So God created mankind in his own image, in the image of God he created them; male and female he created them.

    "Let us" is AIT. It is not in the original scriptures.[/FONT]
    Not sure what Bible you're using but its in multiple translations from the Byingtons to the Reference Bible. Heres the King James translation:-

    Genesis 1:26 King James Version (KJV)
    26 And God said, Let us make man in our image, after our likeness: and let them have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over the cattle, and over all the earth, and over every creeping thing that creepeth upon the earth.
    John 1:1 "In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was a god. 2 This one was in the beginning with God. 3 All things came into existence through him, and apart from him not even one thing came into existence".

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    Quote Originally Posted by SonOfCaleb View Post
    Not sure what Bible you're using but its in multiple translations from the Byingtons to the Reference Bible. Heres the King James translation:-

    Genesis 1:26 King James Version (KJV)
    A person needs a NIV Exhaustive Concordance to see how things are translated.

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    Quote Originally Posted by CherubRam View Post
    A person needs a NIV Exhaustive Concordance to see how things are translated.
    I suppose Paul used one.
    I know Him, correctly, as Messiah whom you call Christ. Yah Shua whom you call Jesus. Messianists who you call Christians.

    "Touch not mine anointed, and do my prophets no harm".

    I refuse, point blank, to speak peace to the unregenerate, hypocrites, religious dogma lovers and those that oppose the following statement:
    A regenerate man trusts in the evangelism of salvation conditioned on the atoning blood and imputed justness of Messiah alone.
    If you are fully persuaded, by experience, of this delightful, beautiful and life giving doctrine then I love you as a brother.

    Anyone who thinks that salvation is conditioned on anything a man thinks, does or says is atheist. I cannot and will not speak peace to him or her.

    I don't make statements online that I wouldn't repeat in front of my Maker, my grandmother or a judge.

  11. The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to Truster For Your Post:

    JudgeRightly (June 23rd, 2018),lifeisgood (June 26th, 2018)

  12. #41
    TOL Legend keypurr's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by CherubRam View Post
    The bible says that Yahwah did the creating.

    Col 1:16 For by (him / Yahwah) were all things created
    True, but does it also say that YHWH created ALL through his Son? If so, who is that son?

    Col 1:15 Who is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn of every creature:
    Col 1:16 For by him were all things created, that are in heaven, and that are in earth, visible and invisible, whether they be thrones, or dominions, or principalities, or powers: all things were created by him, and for him:
    Col 1:17 And he is before all things, and by him all things consist.
    Col 1:18 And he is the head of the body, the church: who is the beginning, the firstborn from the dead; that in all things he might have the preeminence.
    Col 1:19 For it pleased the Father that in him should all fulness dwell;

    Heb 1:2 Hath in these last days spoken unto us by his Son, whom he hath appointed heir of all things, by whom also he made the worlds;
    Heb 1:3 Who being the brightness of his glory, and the express image of his person, and upholding all things by the word of his power, when he had by himself purged our sins, sat down on the right hand of the Majesty on high;

    Php 2:5 Let this mind be in you, which was also in Christ Jesus:
    Php 2:6 Who, being in the form of God, thought it not robbery to be equal with God:


    What was IN Jesus Christ?
    Psalm 1[/COLOR] and Job 28:28

    Rev 22:14 Blessed are they that do his commandments, that they may have right to the tree of life, and may enter in through the gates into the city.

    Joh 4:23 "But an hour is coming, and now is, when the true worshipers will worship the Father in spirit and truth; for such people the Father seeks to be His worshipers.

    I love the God of my Lord Jesus Christ

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    TOL Legend keypurr's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by CherubRam View Post
    All things were created for Yahshua by Yahwah.
    I disagree, the Universe was not created through a man. Yahwah is a man born to Mary and God. The son mentioned at the creation is the Son of Man. Only the Son of Man has decended from the Father.


    The key of understanding this is in Heb 1:3 EXPRESS IMAGE, EXACT IMAGE. God is a spirit, not a man.
    Psalm 1[/COLOR] and Job 28:28

    Rev 22:14 Blessed are they that do his commandments, that they may have right to the tree of life, and may enter in through the gates into the city.

    Joh 4:23 "But an hour is coming, and now is, when the true worshipers will worship the Father in spirit and truth; for such people the Father seeks to be His worshipers.

    I love the God of my Lord Jesus Christ

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    TOL Legend keypurr's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by CherubRam View Post
    John 10:36
    what about the one whom the Father set apart as his very own and sent into the world? Why then do you accuse me of blasphemy because I said, ‘I am God’s Son’?
    In Context | Full Chapter | Other Translations

    [FONT="]A Body You Have Prepared For Me.[/FONT]
    [FONT="]Psalm 40 commentary.
    N.I.V. foot note for [/FONT]
    [FONT="]Psalms 40:6[/FONT][FONT="] reads:[/FONT][FONT="] “Hebrew; Septuagint: but a body you have prepared for me. (See also Symmachus and Theodotion)” End of quote. [/FONT]
    [FONT="]Symmachus the Ebonite was a late 2nd century author of one of the Greek versions of the Old Testament.[/FONT][FONT="]

    Theodotion 200 A.D.
    Theodotion was a Jewish scholar, perhaps working in Ephesus, who translated the Hebrew Bible into Greek. Whether he was revising the Septuagint, or was working from Hebrew manuscripts that represented a parallel tradition that has not survived, and is debated. His finished version, which filled some lacunae in the Septuagint version of the Book of Jeremiah and Book of Job, formed one column in Origen's Hexapla. (The Hexapla presented six Hebrew and Greek texts side-by-side: two Greek versions, by Aquila of Sinope and Symmachus, preceding the Septuagint, and Theodotian's version following it, apparently reflecting a contemporary understanding of their historical sequence.

    Theodotion's translation was so widely copied in the Early Christian church, that it superseded the Septuagint Book of Daniel. Jerome, in his preface to Daniel records the rejection of the Septuagint version in Christian usage, asserting that its translation was very faulty.

    Although Theodotion was Anti-Christ, it may not have occurred to him to change the Hebrew Psalm script from reading: “But a body you have prepared for me.” [/FONT]
    [FONT="]In [/FONT][FONT="][FONT="]Hebrews 10:5[/FONT][/FONT] the verse is also repeated. “Therefore, when Christ came into the world, he said: "Sacrifice and offering you did not desire, but a body you prepared for me;”…


    Heb 10:4 For it is not possible that the blood of bulls and of goats should take away sins.
    Heb 10:5 Wherefore when he cometh into the world, he saith, Sacrifice and offering thou wouldest not, but a body hast thou prepared me:

    Jesus is the BODY prepared to hold the Son of Man, the true spirit Son that was at the creation, the LOGOS. This logos spoke through Jesus. Jesus is the body that could die for our sins, the logos is a FORM of God. Not God himself but a FORM of.
    Psalm 1[/COLOR] and Job 28:28

    Rev 22:14 Blessed are they that do his commandments, that they may have right to the tree of life, and may enter in through the gates into the city.

    Joh 4:23 "But an hour is coming, and now is, when the true worshipers will worship the Father in spirit and truth; for such people the Father seeks to be His worshipers.

    I love the God of my Lord Jesus Christ

  15. #44
    TOL Legend keypurr's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jamie View Post
    "All things came into being through him, and without him not one thing came into being." (John 1:3 NRSV)
    Amen
    Psalm 1[/COLOR] and Job 28:28

    Rev 22:14 Blessed are they that do his commandments, that they may have right to the tree of life, and may enter in through the gates into the city.

    Joh 4:23 "But an hour is coming, and now is, when the true worshipers will worship the Father in spirit and truth; for such people the Father seeks to be His worshipers.

    I love the God of my Lord Jesus Christ

  16. #45
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    Quote Originally Posted by Squeaky View Post
    John 1-14
    I said
    look at the word (made) in KJV. You have (became) in your version. Now look at some of the definitions--be divided, draw, be ended, fall, be finished, follow, be found, be fulfilled,. The flesh ended control and the Word took control. Became is a much better word. It wasnt a part of the original flesh but "became" part of the flesh. Most of the time when the Word is talking about the flesh it is talking about your emotions and feelings. And when it says to crucify your flesh with its emotions and feelings. Its talking about taking back control from them. And giving the control to the Word of God. The verses. If you can do that the Word becomes your flesh. Jesus gave total control to the Word of God.


    John 1:14
    14 And the Word became flesh and dwelt among us, and we beheld His glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father, full of grace and truth.
    (NKJ)

    John 1:14
    14 And the Word was made flesh, and dwelt among us, (and we beheld his glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father,) full of grace and truth.
    (KJV)

    1096 ginomai (ghin'-om-ahee);

    a prolongation and middle voice form of a primary verb; to cause to be ("gen"- erate), i.e. (reflexively) to become (come into being), used with great latitude (literal, figurative, intensive, etc.):

    KJV-- arise, be assembled, be (-come, -fall, -haveself), be brought (to pass), (be) come (to pass), continue, be divided, draw, be ended, fall, be finished, follow, be found, be fulfilled, + God forbid, grow, happen, have, be kept, be made, be married, be ordained to be, partake, pass, be performed, be published, require, seem, be showed, X soon as it was, sound, be taken, be turned, use, wax, will, would, be wrought.

    xxxNow look at the last part of the verse. What is the glory of God that is full of grace and truth-His Word, spoke Word.

    the glory as of the only begotten of the Father,) full of grace and truth.

    xxxNow how did we receive that grace and truth?

    John 1:17
    17 For the law was given through Moses, but grace and truth came through Jesus Christ.
    (NKJ)

    xxxNow how did Jesus get the Word?

    2 Cor 5:18-19
    18 Now all things are of God, who has reconciled us to Himself through Jesus Christ, and has given us the ministry of reconciliation,
    19 that is, that God was in Christ reconciling the world to Himself, not imputing their trespasses to them, and has committed to us the word of reconciliation.
    (NKJ)

    John 12:48-50
    48 "He who rejects Me, and does not receive My words, has that which judges him-- the word that I have spoken will judge him in the last day.
    49 "For I have not spoken on My own authority; but the Father who sent Me gave Me a command, what I should say and what I should speak.
    50 "And I know that His command is everlasting life. Therefore, whatever I speak, just as the Father has told Me, so I speak."
    (NKJ)

    xxxIts obvious once you understand how John 1-1 was originally worded.

    The KJV was taken from all these versions. The 1611 KJV was the one who added "He" in place of "IT". The He was added to give the Word authority. God is neither male nor female and we call Him a "He". The Holy Spirit is neither male nor female and we call Him a "He". He is a Spiritual title of authority. And the KJV wanted to give the Word(verses) the same title of authority. It was never meant to say that Jesus is the Word. The Word came through Jesus. And the Word can control flesh or become flesh.

    Tyndale 1534:
    Joh 1:1 In the beginnynge was the worde and the worde was with God: and the worde was God. 2 The same was in the beginnynge with God. 3 All thinges were made by it and with out it was made nothinge that was made. 4 In it was lyfe and the lyfe was ye lyght of men

    Bishops 1568:
    Joh 1:1 In the begynnyng was the worde, & the worde was with God: and that worde was God. 2 The same was in the begynnyng with God. 3 All thynges were made by it: and without it, was made nothyng that was made. 4 In it was lyfe, and the lyfe was the lyght of men,

    Geneva 1587:
    Joh 1:1 In the beginning was that Word, and that Word was with God, and that Word was God. 2 This same was in the beginning with God. 3 All things were made by it, and without it was made nothing that was made. 4 In it was life, and that life was the light of men.

    And now our modern Concordant Literal Version:
    Joh 1:1 In the beginning was the word, and the word was toward God, and God was the word. " 2 This was in the beginning toward God. 3 All came into being through it, and apart from it not even one thing came into being which has come into being." 4 In it was life, and the life was the light of men."
    Tyndale 1534:
    Joh 1:1 In the beginnynge was the worde and the worde was with God: and the worde was God. 2 The same was in the beginnynge with God. 3 All thinges were made by it and with out it was made nothinge that was made. 4 In it was lyfe and the lyfe was ye lyght of men

    Bishops 1568:
    Joh 1:1 In the begynnyng was the worde, & the worde was with God: and that worde was God. 2 The same was in the begynnyng with God. 3 All thynges were made by it: and without it, was made nothyng that was made. 4 In it was lyfe, and the lyfe was the lyght of men,

    Geneva 1587:
    Joh 1:1 In the beginning was that Word, and that Word was with God, and that Word was God. 2 This same was in the beginning with God. 3 All things were made by it, and without it was made nothing that was made. 4 In it was life, and that life was the light of men.

    The word "IT" is a big word. Like SpirIT.
    Psalm 1[/COLOR] and Job 28:28

    Rev 22:14 Blessed are they that do his commandments, that they may have right to the tree of life, and may enter in through the gates into the city.

    Joh 4:23 "But an hour is coming, and now is, when the true worshipers will worship the Father in spirit and truth; for such people the Father seeks to be His worshipers.

    I love the God of my Lord Jesus Christ

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