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Thread: Jesus Changed Everything

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    Over 500 post club Idolater's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by keypurr View Post
    The Law itself was NEVER changed, but its content was magnified in the hearts of the believers.
    But Abraham believed in Christ. He saw Christ's day and was glad, and he believed in God being able to raise the dead. Abraham didn't know what was going to happen when Christ came, almost two thousand years after Abraham, but Abraham was all ready to believe in Christ, in what he already did believe almost two thousand years before Christ. Nothing would have prevented Abraham from believing in Christ, whenever he first heard the Gospel that He is risen. As soon as Abraham actually heard the Gospel, he definitely believed the Gospel---that instant.
    "Those who believe in Christ" are all the Christians, Catholic or not.

    @Nee_Nihilo

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    Quote Originally Posted by Idolater View Post
    But Abraham believed in Christ. He saw Christ's day and was glad, and he believed in God being able to raise the dead. Abraham didn't know what was going to happen when Christ came, almost two thousand years after Abraham, but Abraham was all ready to believe in Christ, in what he already did believe almost two thousand years before Christ. Nothing would have prevented Abraham from believing in Christ, whenever he first heard the Gospel that He is risen. As soon as Abraham actually heard the Gospel, he definitely believed the Gospel---that instant.
    I said
    Before, and after.

  3. #78
    TOL Legend keypurr's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Squeaky View Post
    I said
    You to. When Jesus says "you have heard(old testament) but I say(new testament. That is a change. But even the word says. What I don't understand is why some people just cant believe what is written.

    [Heb 7:12
    12 For the priesthood being changed, of necessity there is also a change of the law.

    [Mat 5:21-32
    21 "You have heard that it was said to those of old, 'You shall not murder, and whoever murders will be in danger of the judgment.'
    22 "But I say to you that whoever is angry with his brother without a cause shall be in danger of the judgment. And whoever says to his brother, 'Raca!' shall be in danger of the council. But whoever says, 'You fool!' shall be in danger of hell fire.
    23 "Therefore if you bring your gift to the altar, and there remember that your brother has something against you,
    24 "leave your gift there before the altar, and go your way. First be reconciled to your brother, and then come and offer your gift.
    25 "Agree with your adversary quickly, while you are on the way with him, lest your adversary deliver you to the judge, the judge hand you over to the officer, and you be thrown into prison. 26 "Assuredly, I say to you, you will by no means get out of there till you have paid the last penny. 27 "You have heard that it was said to those of old, 'You shall not commit adultery.'
    28 "But I say to you that whoever looks at a woman to lust for her has already committed adultery with her in his heart.
    29 "If your right eye causes you to sin, pluck it out and cast [it] from you; for it is more profitable for you that one of your members perish, than for your whole body to be cast into hell.
    30 "And if your right hand causes you to sin, cut it off and cast [it] from you; for it is more profitable for you that one of your members perish, than for your whole body to be cast into hell.
    31 "Furthermore it has been said, 'Whoever divorces his wife, let him give her a certificate of divorce.'
    32 "But I say to you that whoever divorces his wife for any reason except sexual immorality causes her to commit adultery; and whoever marries a woman who is divorced commits adultery.
    Yep, he came to magnify the LAW.

    Mat 5:17 Think not that I am come to destroy the law, or the prophets: I am not come to destroy, but to fulfill.
    Mat 5:18 For verily I say unto you, Till heaven and earth pass, one jot or one tittle shall in no wise pass from the law, till all be fulfilled.
    Mat 5:19 Whosoever therefore shall break one of these least commandments, and shall teach men so, he shall be called the least in the kingdom of heaven: but whosoever shall do and teach them, the same shall be called great in the kingdom of heaven.

    Mat 22:36 Master, which is the great commandment in the law?
    Mat 22:37 Jesus said unto him, Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind.
    Mat 22:38 This is the first and great commandment.
    Mat 22:39 And the second is like unto it, Thou shalt love thy neighbor as thyself.
    Mat 22:40 On these two commandments hang all the law and the prophets.

    Mar 7:7 Howbeit in vain do they worship me, teaching for doctrines the commandments of men.
    Mar 7:8 For laying aside the commandment of God, ye hold the tradition of men, as the washing of pots and cups: and many other such like things ye do.
    Mar 7:9 And he said unto them, Full well ye reject the commandment of God, that ye may keep your own tradition.

    Rom 7:25 I thank God through Jesus Christ our Lord. So then with the mind I myself serve the law of God; but with the flesh the law of sin.


    Rom 6:1 What shall we say then? Shall we continue in sin, that grace may abound?
    Rom 6:2 God forbid. How shall we, that are dead to sin, live any longer therein?

    Rom 6:14 For sin shall not have dominion over you: for ye are not under the law, but under grace.


    Jer 31:33 But this shall be the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel; After those days, saith the LORD, I will put my law in their inward parts, and write it in their hearts; and will be their God, and they shall be my people.

    Rom 2:15 Which show the work of the law written in their hearts, their conscience also bearing witness, and their thoughts the mean while accusing or else excusing one another

    Heb 8:10 For this is the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel after those days, saith the Lord; I will put my laws into their mind, and write them in their hearts: and I will be to them a God, and they shall be to me a people:

    Heb 10:16 This is the covenant that I will make with them after those days, saith the Lord, I will put my laws into their hearts, and in their minds will I write them;
    Psalm 1[/COLOR] and Job 28:28

    Rev 22:14 Blessed are they that do his commandments, that they may have right to the tree of life, and may enter in through the gates into the city.

    Joh 4:23 "But an hour is coming, and now is, when the true worshipers will worship the Father in spirit and truth; for such people the Father seeks to be His worshipers.

    I love the God of my Lord Jesus Christ

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    TOL Legend keypurr's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Idolater View Post
    But Abraham believed in Christ. He saw Christ's day and was glad, and he believed in God being able to raise the dead. Abraham didn't know what was going to happen when Christ came, almost two thousand years after Abraham, but Abraham was all ready to believe in Christ, in what he already did believe almost two thousand years before Christ. Nothing would have prevented Abraham from believing in Christ, whenever he first heard the Gospel that He is risen. As soon as Abraham actually heard the Gospel, he definitely believed the Gospel---that instant.
    Rom 4:13 For the promise, that he should be the heir of the world, was not to Abraham, or to his seed, through the law, but through the righteousness of faith.
    Rom 4:14 For if they which are of the law be heirs, faith is made void, and the promise made of none effect:
    Rom 4:16 Therefore it is of faith, that it might be by grace; to the end the promise might be sure to all the seed; not to that only which is of the law, but to that also which is of the faith of Abraham; who is the father of us all,
    Psalm 1[/COLOR] and Job 28:28

    Rev 22:14 Blessed are they that do his commandments, that they may have right to the tree of life, and may enter in through the gates into the city.

    Joh 4:23 "But an hour is coming, and now is, when the true worshipers will worship the Father in spirit and truth; for such people the Father seeks to be His worshipers.

    I love the God of my Lord Jesus Christ

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    TOL Legend keypurr's Avatar
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    Psa 1:1 Blessed is the man that walketh not in the counsel of the ungodly, nor standeth in the way of sinners, nor sitteth in the seat of the scornful.
    Psa 1:2 But his delight is in the law of the LORD; and in his law doth he meditate day and night.
    Psalm 1[/COLOR] and Job 28:28

    Rev 22:14 Blessed are they that do his commandments, that they may have right to the tree of life, and may enter in through the gates into the city.

    Joh 4:23 "But an hour is coming, and now is, when the true worshipers will worship the Father in spirit and truth; for such people the Father seeks to be His worshipers.

    I love the God of my Lord Jesus Christ

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    Quote Originally Posted by keypurr View Post
    Yep, he came to magnify the LAW.

    Mat 5:17 Think not that I am come to destroy the law, or the prophets: I am not come to destroy, but to fulfill.
    Mat 5:18 For verily I say unto you, Till heaven and earth pass, one jot or one tittle shall in no wise pass from the law, till all be fulfilled.
    Mat 5:19 Whosoever therefore shall break one of these least commandments, and shall teach men so, he shall be called the least in the kingdom of heaven: but whosoever shall do and teach them, the same shall be called great in the kingdom of heaven.

    Mat 22:36 Master, which is the great commandment in the law?
    Mat 22:37 Jesus said unto him, Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind.
    Mat 22:38 This is the first and great commandment.
    Mat 22:39 And the second is like unto it, Thou shalt love thy neighbor as thyself.
    Mat 22:40 On these two commandments hang all the law and the prophets.

    Mar 7:7 Howbeit in vain do they worship me, teaching for doctrines the commandments of men.
    Mar 7:8 For laying aside the commandment of God, ye hold the tradition of men, as the washing of pots and cups: and many other such like things ye do.
    Mar 7:9 And he said unto them, Full well ye reject the commandment of God, that ye may keep your own tradition.

    Rom 7:25 I thank God through Jesus Christ our Lord. So then with the mind I myself serve the law of God; but with the flesh the law of sin.


    Rom 6:1 What shall we say then? Shall we continue in sin, that grace may abound?
    Rom 6:2 God forbid. How shall we, that are dead to sin, live any longer therein?

    Rom 6:14 For sin shall not have dominion over you: for ye are not under the law, but under grace.


    Jer 31:33 But this shall be the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel; After those days, saith the LORD, I will put my law in their inward parts, and write it in their hearts; and will be their God, and they shall be my people.

    Rom 2:15 Which show the work of the law written in their hearts, their conscience also bearing witness, and their thoughts the mean while accusing or else excusing one another

    Heb 8:10 For this is the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel after those days, saith the Lord; I will put my laws into their mind, and write them in their hearts: and I will be to them a God, and they shall be to me a people:

    Heb 10:16 This is the covenant that I will make with them after those days, saith the Lord, I will put my laws into their hearts, and in their minds will I write them;
    I said
    Do you realize that the new testament is the law of God. And the old testament is the law of God. But they are different laws.

    [Heb 7:12
    12 For the priesthood being changed, of necessity there is also a change of the law.

    Rom 7:25 is talking about keeping the law of God from the new testament.

  7. #82
    TOL Legend keypurr's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Squeaky View Post
    I said
    Do you realize that the new testament is the law of God. And the old testament is the law of God. But they are different laws.

    [Heb 7:12
    12 For the priesthood being changed, of necessity there is also a change of the law.

    Rom 7:25 is talking about keeping the law of God from the new testament.
    No my friend I never looked at it that way. How is the NT the Law of God?
    Psalm 1[/COLOR] and Job 28:28

    Rev 22:14 Blessed are they that do his commandments, that they may have right to the tree of life, and may enter in through the gates into the city.

    Joh 4:23 "But an hour is coming, and now is, when the true worshipers will worship the Father in spirit and truth; for such people the Father seeks to be His worshipers.

    I love the God of my Lord Jesus Christ

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    Quote Originally Posted by keypurr View Post
    No my friend I never looked at it that way. How is the NT the Law of God?
    I said

    The Law Of Christ-New Testament


    Gal 6:2-5
    2 Bear one another's burdens, and so fulfill the law of Christ.
    3 For if anyone thinks himself to be something, when he is nothing, he deceives himself.
    4 But let each one examine his own work, and then he will have rejoicing in himself alone, and not in another.
    5 For each one shall bear his own load.
    [Jhn 15:14, 17
    14 "You are My friends if you do whatever I command you. ...
    17 "These things I command you, that you love one another.
    John 15:14
    14 "You are My friends if you do whatever I command you.
    Luke 12:4-5
    4 "And I say to you, My friends, do not be afraid of those who kill the body, and after that have no more that they can do.
    5 "But I will show you whom you should fear: Fear Him who, after He has killed, has power to cast into hell; yes, I say to you, fear Him!
    John 10:8-11
    8 "All who ever came before Me are thieves and robbers, but the sheep did not hear them.
    9 "I am the door. If anyone enters by Me, he will be saved, and will go in and out and find pasture.
    10 "The thief does not come except to steal, and to kill, and to destroy. I have come that they may have life, and that they may have it more abundantly.
    11 "I am the good shepherd. The good shepherd gives His life for the sheep.
    Rom 2:12-29
    12 For as many as have sinned without law will also perish without law, and as many as have sinned in the law will be judged by the law
    13 (for not the hearers of the law are just in the sight of God, but the doers of the law will be justified;
    14 for when Gentiles, who do not have the law, by nature do the things in the law, these, although not having the law, are a law to themselves,
    15 who show the work of the law written in their hearts, their conscience also bearing witness, and between themselves their thoughts accusing or else excusing them)
    16 in the day when God will judge the secrets of men by Jesus Christ, according to my gospel.
    17 Indeed you are called a Jew, and rest on the law, and make your boast in God,
    18 and know His will, and approve the things that are excellent, being instructed out of the law,
    19 and are confident that you yourself are a guide to the blind, a light to those who are in darkness,
    20 an instructor of the foolish, a teacher of babes, having the form of knowledge and truth in the law.
    21 You, therefore, who teach another, do you not teach yourself? You who preach that a man should not steal, do you steal?
    22 You who say, "Do not commit adultery," do you commit adultery? You who abhor idols, do you rob temples?
    23 You who make your boast in the law, do you dishonor God through breaking the law?
    24 For "The name of God is blasphemed among the Gentiles because of you," as it is written.
    25 For circumcision is indeed profitable if you keep the law; but if you are a breaker of the law, your circumcision has become uncircumcision.
    26 Therefore, if an uncircumcised man keeps the righteous requirements of the law, will not his uncircumcision be counted as circumcision?
    27 And will not the physically uncircumcised, if he fulfills the law, judge you who, even with your written code and circumcision, are a transgressor of the law?
    28 For he is not a Jew who is one outwardly, nor is circumcision that which is outward in the flesh;
    29 but he is a Jew who is one inwardly; and circumcision is that of the heart, in the Spirit, not in the letter; whose praise is not from men but from God.
    Rom 8:1-8
    1 There is therefore now no condemnation to those who are in Christ Jesus, who do not walk according to the flesh, but according to the Spirit.
    2 For the law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus has made me free from the law of sin and death.
    3 For what the law could not do in that it was weak through the flesh, God did by sending His own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh, on account of sin: He condemned sin in the flesh,
    4 that the righteous requirement of the law might be fulfilled in us who do not walk according to the flesh but according to the Spirit.
    5 For those who live according to the flesh set their minds on the things of the flesh, but those who live according to the Spirit, the things of the Spirit.
    6 For to be carnally minded is death, but to be spiritually minded is life and peace.
    7 Because the carnal mind is enmity against God; for it is not subject to the law of God, nor indeed can be.
    8 So then, those who are in the flesh cannot please God.
    (NKJ)
    xxx The law of Christ is to walk after the Holy Spirit. And the Holy Spirit only quotes verses. It takes a law to enforce a commandment. And Jesus has many commandments we must obey.


    Isa 42:1-4

    1 "Behold! My Servant whom I uphold, my Elect One in whom My soul delights! I have put My Spirit upon Him; he will bring forth justice to the Gentiles.
    2 He will not cry out, nor raise His voice, nor cause His voice to be heard in the street.
    3 A bruised reed He will not break, and smoking flax He will not quench; he will bring forth justice for truth.
    4 He will not fail nor be discouraged, till He has established justice in the earth; and the coastlands shall wait for His law."
    (NKJ)

    Gal 3:10-12
    10 For as many as are of the works of the law are under the curse; for it is written, "Cursed is everyone who does not continue in all things which are written in the book of the law, to do them."
    11 But that no one is justified by the law in the sight of God is evident, for "the just shall live by faith."
    12 Yet the law is not of faith, but "the man who does them shall live by them."
    (NKJ)
    [Rom 8:7
    7 Because the carnal mind [is] enmity against God; for it is not subject to the law of God, nor indeed can be.

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    [Jhn 14:1
    1 "Let not your heart be troubled; you believe in God, believe also in Me.
    [Gal 6:2
    2 Bear one another's burdens, and so fulfill the law of Christ.
    [Jhn 17:21
    21 "that they all may be one, as You, Father, [are] in Me, and I in You; that they also may be one in Us, that the world may believe that You sent Me.
    [Jhn 12:48-50
    48 "He who rejects Me, and does not receive My words, has that which judges him--the word that I have spoken will judge him in the last day.
    49 "For I have not spoken on My own [authority]; but the Father who sent Me gave Me a command, what I should say and what I should speak.
    50 "And I know that His command is everlasting life. Therefore, whatever I speak, just as the Father has told Me, so I speak."
    [Heb 7:12
    12 For the priesthood being changed, of necessity there is also a change of the law.
    [Rom 2:12-13
    12 For as many as have sinned without law will also perish without law, and as many as have sinned in the law will be judged by the law
    13 (for not the hearers of the law [are] just in the sight of God, but the doers of the law will be justified;
    [Jhn 15:14, 17
    14 "You are My friends if you do whatever I command you. ...
    17 "These things I command you, that you love one another.

  10. #85
    TOL Legend keypurr's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Squeaky View Post
    [Jhn 14:1
    1 "Let not your heart be troubled; you believe in God, believe also in Me.
    [Gal 6:2
    2 Bear one another's burdens, and so fulfill the law of Christ.
    [Jhn 17:21
    21 "that they all may be one, as You, Father, [are] in Me, and I in You; that they also may be one in Us, that the world may believe that You sent Me.
    [Jhn 12:48-50
    48 "He who rejects Me, and does not receive My words, has that which judges him--the word that I have spoken will judge him in the last day.
    49 "For I have not spoken on My own [authority]; but the Father who sent Me gave Me a command, what I should say and what I should speak.
    50 "And I know that His command is everlasting life. Therefore, whatever I speak, just as the Father has told Me, so I speak."
    [Heb 7:12
    12 For the priesthood being changed, of necessity there is also a change of the law.
    [Rom 2:12-13
    12 For as many as have sinned without law will also perish without law, and as many as have sinned in the law will be judged by the law
    13 (for not the hearers of the law [are] just in the sight of God, but the doers of the law will be justified;
    [Jhn 15:14, 17
    14 "You are My friends if you do whatever I command you. ...
    17 "These things I command you, that you love one another.
    Squeaky, you seem to be saying pretty much that the Law is still in effect. Christ came to teach us how to keep the Law. It is a Law of love friend kept in the spirit to show our love for him who gave it.
    Psalm 1[/COLOR] and Job 28:28

    Rev 22:14 Blessed are they that do his commandments, that they may have right to the tree of life, and may enter in through the gates into the city.

    Joh 4:23 "But an hour is coming, and now is, when the true worshipers will worship the Father in spirit and truth; for such people the Father seeks to be His worshipers.

    I love the God of my Lord Jesus Christ

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    Quote Originally Posted by keypurr View Post
    Squeaky, you seem to be saying pretty much that the Law is still in effect. Christ came to teach us how to keep the Law. It is a Law of love friend kept in the spirit to show our love for him who gave it.
    I said
    I'm saying there are two different laws. The old testament law of sin and death. And the new testament law of Christ. The old testament law will judge the world on judgment day. The new testament law will deliver Christians from the old testament law. If we abide in the new testament law. Jesus changed the law. Jesus made the old testament law obsolete to Christians. But the old testament law is still in affect to the rest of the world.

    [Heb 7:12
    12 For the priesthood being changed, of necessity there is also a change of the law.
    [Heb 8:13
    13 In that He says, "A new [covenant]," He has made the first obsolete. Now what is becoming obsolete and growing old is ready to vanish away.

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    Quote Originally Posted by keypurr View Post
    Squeaky, you seem to be saying pretty much that the Law is still in effect. Christ came to teach us how to keep the Law. It is a Law of love friend kept in the spirit to show our love for him who gave it.

    All this to merely avoid work six days and rest the seventh...


    Christians like sneaky have no trouble with 9/10ths of the Law...but that 4th commandment He instructed prayers be said in order it be kept in future times of trouble...is rejected

    With this instruction for prayers He was clear...two times would remain in the future...winter time and Sabbath time...

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    Quote Originally Posted by clefty View Post
    All this to merely avoid work six days and rest the seventh...


    Christians like sneaky have no trouble with 9/10ths of the Law...but that 4th commandment He instructed prayers be said in order it be kept in future times of trouble...is rejected

    With this instruction for prayers He was clear...two times would remain in the future...winter time and Sabbath time...
    I said
    ROFLOL You must be a muslim or an atheist. Why else would it bother you that I worship 7 days a week instead of only one. You are weird.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Squeaky View Post
    I said
    ROFLOL You must be a muslim or an atheist. Why else would it bother you that I worship 7 days a week instead of only one. You are weird.
    It’s not just about worship silly...

    It’s about work and rest...and obedience to His way...you know the way He did instruct and model for us...

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    Quote Originally Posted by clefty View Post
    It’s not just about worship silly...

    It’s about work and rest...and obedience to His way...you know the way He did instruct and model for us...
    I said
    lolol You cant use the word "us" I'm a real Christian. Your denial of Christianity makes you something else. I've asked you over and over what you are. You have some kind of perverted idea that you can ask but you don't have to answer questions. So you interrogate Christians.

    [Mat 10:33
    33 "But whoever denies Me before men, him I will also deny before My Father who is in heaven.

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