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Thread: The earth is flat and we never went to the moon--Part II

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    Quote Originally Posted by SaulToPaul View Post
    The god of this world is the father of lies, according to the Lord Jesus Christ.
    It makes sense to question everything we're told while living in this present evil world.
    Within reason... some things are being unreasonably questioned.
    Quote Originally Posted by Squeaky View Post
    That explains why your an idiot.
    Quote Originally Posted by God's Truth View Post
    Father figure, Son figure, and Holy Spirit figure.
    Col 2:9 (AKJV/PCE)
    (2:9) For in him dwelleth all the fulness of the Godhead bodily.

    1Tim 4:10 (AKJV/PCE)
    (4:10) For therefore we both labour and suffer reproach, because we trust in the living God, who is the Saviour of all men, specially of those that believe.

    Something that was SPOKEN OF since the world began CANNOT be the SAME thing as something KEPT SECRET since the world began.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Clete View Post
    No, I do not have to show that!
    Right, you don't have to.


    The point is that it does not teach that the Earth is flat,
    It does not teach the earth is a spinning globe propelling through space.


    which is a good thing because if it did I could prove that the bible was false.
    That's what a lot of science data attempts to prove.


    Now, let's try again and see if we can give a straight answer to a really simple question that is intended to show more about you than it is about whether the Earth is flat.


    If one could prove that the Earth could not possibly be flat and do so in a way that you could verify for yourself, would that be sufficient to persuade you that the Earth is not flat and that the bible does not teach that the Earth is flat?
    Well geese, Clete, if anything can be PROVEN then why wouldn't anyone believe it?
    That would hold true for anything.


    You see, I ask the question because I think your answer is "No, Clete, I don't care what you think you can prove, I'm going to believe the Earth is flat and that the bible teaches that it is flat no matter what you or anyone else says."
    I don't say whether the earth is flat or a spinning globe because I, personally, don't know for sure.
    My interest is with what the bible says about the earth.


    That's for sure what Dave's answer is, he's demonstrated it and so has every other lunatic that's come on this thread defending this delutional stupidity. You all come on here acting all intellectually honest and cincere but I don't buy it any more. If you're not intellectually honest enough to drop something that is clearly and simply falsified in a way that you can verify for yourself then there no point in even discussing it because you're not even being rational, never mind honest.

    Prove me wrong. Please!
    I'm not a dishonest person.

    I just want to view this from what the bible says about it.
    I see things the bible says about it that can not be possible on a globe earth.
    If all that the bible says about the earth is only to be taken metaphorically, then that is just more of the bible to cast on the pile of not being historical, but metaphorical.
    It seems that is the pile most want to cast the bible onto.
    (Not saying that is you, just that through the ages many have presented "proof" that it is not to be taken literally.)
    Reducing the bible more and more to just being akin to Aesop's fables book. (Has a moral message but is not literal).

    Have a good day, Clete.
    If you don't want to continue to discuss it with me, I'm ok with that.
    I will discuss with those that do.

    Sincerely,
    Tambora

    We don't tell our children fairy tales so that they will know that monsters exist.
    They already know monsters exist.
    We tell our children fairy tales so that they will know that monsters can be killed.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Tambora View Post
    It does not teach the earth is a spinning globe propelling through space.
    It doesn't say one way or the other. There are a LOT of details about the creation that are not included in the Bible.

    Quote Originally Posted by Tambora View Post
    I don't say whether the earth is flat or a spinning globe because I, personally, don't know for sure.
    My interest is with what the bible says about the earth.
    The Bible doesn't say one way or the other.

    Quote Originally Posted by Tambora View Post
    I just want to view this from what the bible says about it.
    The Bible doesn't say one way or the other.

    Do you think that God made us so that we could explore His creation?

    Quote Originally Posted by Tambora View Post
    I see things the bible says about it that can not be possible on a globe earth.
    Like...??

    P.S. I've investigated many of the verses that supposedly "prove" that the earth is flat and they ALL fail to do that.
    Quote Originally Posted by Squeaky View Post
    That explains why your an idiot.
    Quote Originally Posted by God's Truth View Post
    Father figure, Son figure, and Holy Spirit figure.
    Col 2:9 (AKJV/PCE)
    (2:9) For in him dwelleth all the fulness of the Godhead bodily.

    1Tim 4:10 (AKJV/PCE)
    (4:10) For therefore we both labour and suffer reproach, because we trust in the living God, who is the Saviour of all men, specially of those that believe.

    Something that was SPOKEN OF since the world began CANNOT be the SAME thing as something KEPT SECRET since the world began.

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  7. #4114
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    Quote Originally Posted by SaulToPaul View Post
    The god of this world is the father of lies, according to the Lord Jesus Christ.
    It makes sense to question everything we're told while living in this present evil world.
    No, it doesn't make sense STP. Not everyone is lying to you about almost everything, which is precisely what one must believe in order to maintain for more than an hour that large percentages of people who work in any airospace, aviation, weather forcasting, astronomy, physics or government related job is in on the world wide, centuries long conspiracy to trick the hoy-paloy that the Earth is round for no good reason at all.

    It's abosulte delusional stupidity that can be irrefutably falsified with 7th grade level math and one single observation of the sunrise or sunset that anyone with even a rudamentary sextant can perform.

    Clete

    "The [open view] is an attempt to provide a more Biblically faithful, rationally coherent, and practically satisfying account of God and the divine-human relationship..." - Dr. John Sanders

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  9. #4115
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tambora View Post
    Right, you don't have to.
    I'm saying that there is no rational reason why I need to do that.

    It does not teach the earth is a spinning globe propelling through space.
    That's right and if anyone attempted to get you to prove biblically that the Earth was a round spinning ball orbiting the Sun, you'd be right to tell them that there is no reason for you to do that.

    Why?

    Because of the portion of what I said that you didn't quote! The bible is not a science text book! That's why! There are all sorts of things that the bible is silent about and for you to hold me to the standard of "All you gotta do is show me where scripture presents the earths as a spinning globe propelling through space." is not rational!

    That's what a lot of science data attempts to prove.
    Who cares what they attempt to do?

    I'm not talking about the sort of pseudo-proofs that modern science uses to "prove" things like global warming or over population or black holes or dark matter. I'm talking about the sort of proof that is truly and genuinely irrefutable. A proof that even a middle school aged public schooled child can understand and duplicate for himself.

    Well geese, Clete, if anything can be PROVEN then why wouldn't anyone believe it?
    That would hold true for anything.
    Is this you responding to my question in the affirmative or is this you suggesting that nothing can be proven? I can't tell for sure whether you're being sarcastic or not.

    I don't say whether the earth is flat or a spinning globe because I, personally, don't know for sure.
    My interest is with what the bible says about the earth.
    Well, the bible doesn't have a whole lot to say about cosmological issues. It's an interesting topic of discussion and study but you aren't going to find a definite answer about whether the Earth is flat or round by reading a book that doesn't discuss that topic. Just as you wouldn't read "Atlas Shrugged" by Ayn Rand to learn about how to properly train puppies, the bible is of little value when trying to figure out whether the Earth is flat or not.

    I'm not a dishonest person.
    I don't mean to suggest that you're a liar. I fully believe that you believe what you say you believe and so you aren't lying in the sense of trying to be deceptive. My point has to do with intellectual honesty in the sense that one is willing to accept the verdict of sound reason even if that verdict falsifies their doctrine. It's simple, plain old honest rationality that I'm looking for.

    I just want to view this from what the bible says about it.
    I see things the bible says about it that can not be possible on a globe earth.
    If all that the bible says about the earth is only to be taken metaphorically, then that is just more of the bible to cast on the pile of not being historical, but metaphorical.
    It seems that is the pile most want to cast the bible onto.
    (Not saying that is you, just that through the ages many have presented "proof" that it is not to be taken literally.)
    Reducing the bible more and more to just being akin to Aesop's fables book. (Has a moral message but is not literal).
    Well look, some of the bible is literally true and some of it isn't. There are figures of speech on every single page of the bible. There are whole sections of the bible that are flat out allegorical. Some things are taught as absolutes and others as rules of thumb. The point isn't to turn the bible into anything other than what it is or to take it in any way other than it was intended to be taken. And that sometimes takes some effort to accomplish because we are far removed in time from when the bible was written and some words and concepts don't mean now what they meant 2000+ years ago.

    What I'm here to tell you is that there is not one single verse of scripture that requires one to believe that the Earth is flat. The Christian church nor the Jewish tradition that preceded it ever believed or taught that the Earth was flat. Not ever, not even one time for even ten minutes. The idea that it did is a myth. If you believe that the Earth is flat, it isn't because of the bible nor because of any doctrine that the church has ever taught. Rather, the modern day beleif that the Earth is flat eminates from YouTube and nothing else.

    Have a good day, Clete.
    If you don't want to continue to discuss it with me, I'm ok with that.
    I will discuss with those that do.

    Sincerely,
    Tambora
    I'm totally fine discussing anything with anyone so long as they are at least trying to be rational and not being willfully ignorant and ignoring the arguments presented to them.

    I'm going to assume that you were not being sarcastic a moment ago. The flavor of the rest of your post would seem to suggest that is most likely and so I want to present the following proof to you that the Earth cannot be flat. I've posted it several times on this thread and I'm sure you've probably already seen it, but look at it again with fresh eyes. I know its sort of long but don't let it glaze your eyes over and really think it through because I'm not exaggerating when I say that it is an utterly irrefutable proof that the Earth is not flat that you can verify for yourself. If math works (which it does) and the sun sets (which it does) then the Earth is not flat. Here's the proof....




    FET (Flat Earth Theory) claims the Sun is approximately 3000 miles above the Earth and they do not dispute well established distances between points on the surface of the Earth. I'm going to be using these two presuppositions in my calculations and you'll want to refer to the following diagram to keep track of the variables...

    Attachment 26417

    Side a is the distance from the ground to the Sun (3000 mi).
    Side b is the distance from an observer to a point on the Earth where it is high noon (the point at which the Sun is at it's highest point in the sky).
    Side c (a.k.a. the hypotenuse) is the distance from the observer to the Sun itself.
    Angle A is the height of the Sun above the horizon in degrees as seen from the observer.
    Angle C is always 90
    Angle B is not relevant to this discussion.

    Note from the start that if the Earth is flat and the Sun is 3000 miles up (or any number of miles up for that matter) that angle A can never ever get to 0. The Sun would never set because no matter how long you make side b of that triangle, angle A is always a positive number. The only way for the Sun to set on a flat Earth is if the Sun dipped below the plane of the flat Earth. If that were to happen, then it would be night everywhere on Earth at once, which we know does not happen. It's always high noon somewhere on the Earth.

    That, by itself, ought to be enough to convince anyone that the Earth cannot be flat but there more. Let's take a look at some of these photos we took last week...

    So, since we're assuming a flat Earth, I'm going to focus on just a couple of photos that both show the position of the Sun in degrees above the horizon. I should point out that you don't have to trust the numbers generated by the app on the phones used to take these photos. The numbers can be confirmed by anyone by simply fashioning a simple sextant from a cheap plastic protractor.

    I'll use these two photos...

    Attachment 26418 Attachment 26419

    On the left is the Sun's position as seen from my house on May 8th at 01:00 UCT (8:00:01pm central time)
    On the right is the Sun's position as seen from Knight's house on the same day just 38 seconds later (7:00:39pm mountain time).

    The position of the Sun at my house is just .1 above the horizon while at Knight's it was 10.2 (This information is displayed just to the right of the Sun position indicator. It shows the Sun's heading and then it's elevation in degrees. On Knight's photo it's sort of hidden a little by the NW direction indicator but it reads "Sun 284.0 W 10.2" The 10.2 is the elevation above the horizon in degrees)

    So, let's look at Knight's first...

    How far West would you have to go from Knight's house (where sides b and c meet) to get to a place on a flat Earth where it was high noon (where sides a and b meet)?

    It turns out that when dealing with right triangles if you have the length of any one side and either angle A or B, you can know everything about the whole triangle!
    The math is boring and so I'm not going to show all that. Just go HERE and plug in the numbers for side b (3000) and angle A (10.2).
    You get the following results...

    Someone 16,700 miles (length of side b) to his west would see the Sun at it's highest point in the sky for that day.

    There is no point on Earth 16,700 miles from Denver Colorado.


    Still not convinced? Well just wait till you plug in the numbers from my house!


    At my house the Sun was only .1 degrees above the horizon. So plugging in the numbers from my house (side b = 3000 and angle A = .1) we get the following results...

    You have to go 1,720,000 miles to my West to find high noon beneath a Sun that was 3000 miles above the surface of a flat Earth.

    That's One MILLION seven hundred twenty THOUSAND miles!
    (That's more that 7 times the real distance to the Moon!)

    Now seriously folks! What more proof could you possibly need? How are you going to possibly refute this?

    Are you going to deny that the Sun is about 10 further above the horizon in Denver than it is in Houston? Even if you did that, the distance to noon calculations aren't dependent on that!

    Are you going to challenge the validity of the Pythagorean Theorem?

    It seems that's your only option! It's either refute the Pythagorean Theorem or you must reject the notion that the Earth is flat based on the mere fact that the Sun gets to within .1 of the horizon at one point on the Earth while at the same time being directly over head at another.

    Clete
    Last edited by Clete; August 24th, 2019 at 06:34 AM.

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    Not the best picture, but taken personally with my cell phone.
    20190817_120245.jpg
    Note the curved shadow on the left hand side (the sun was setting to the right).

    This clearly demonstrates that the moon is not flat, but a globe. Why would anyone think that the earth in any different?
    Quote Originally Posted by Squeaky View Post
    That explains why your an idiot.
    Quote Originally Posted by God's Truth View Post
    Father figure, Son figure, and Holy Spirit figure.
    Col 2:9 (AKJV/PCE)
    (2:9) For in him dwelleth all the fulness of the Godhead bodily.

    1Tim 4:10 (AKJV/PCE)
    (4:10) For therefore we both labour and suffer reproach, because we trust in the living God, who is the Saviour of all men, specially of those that believe.

    Something that was SPOKEN OF since the world began CANNOT be the SAME thing as something KEPT SECRET since the world began.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Tambora View Post
    All you gotta do is show me where scripture presents the earths as a spinning globe propelling through space.
    Oh my gosh! please do not tell me that you actually sign on to this flat earth nonsense? Please tell me that you are not buying this lie...
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tambora View Post
    All you gotta do is show me where scripture presents the earths as a spinning globe propelling through space.
    The Bible doesn't tell you that anything other than a bird can fly either...much less an airplane flys in a circle over Dallas yet, you see airplanes flying everyday. There are many things that the Bible does not address as it relates to the knowledge that the authors had no idea of at the time, the Bible does not speak of telephones, television, electricity, cars, or much else of modern technology but, there it is...It does not make the Bible false anymore than it makes all science & technology false. The Bible is a guide to life with Him, not an answer to the validity of all things science & technology that didn't exist when it was written...that is just nonsense.
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    Quote Originally Posted by rocketman View Post
    The Bible doesn't tell you that anything other than a bird can fly either...much less an airplane flys in a circle over Dallas yet, you see airplanes flying everyday. There are many things that the Bible does not address as it relates to the knowledge that the authors had no idea of at the time, the Bible does not speak of telephones, television, electricity, cars, or much else of modern technology but, there it is...It does not make the Bible false anymore than it makes all science & technology false. The Bible is a guide to life with Him, not an answer to the validity of all things science & technology that didn't exist when it was written...that is just nonsense.
    Rocky!
    What a pleasure to see you again.

    I agree the bible does not tell us about telephones and airplanes, etc. that men have made.
    But it does tell us about the earth GOD made.

    We don't tell our children fairy tales so that they will know that monsters exist.
    They already know monsters exist.
    We tell our children fairy tales so that they will know that monsters can be killed.

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    Quote Originally Posted by rocketman View Post
    The Bible doesn't tell you that anything other than a bird can fly either.
    I've said my hello to you (again, good to see ya).
    Now I'm gonna mess with ya! hehe!

    It does too!

    Isa 6:6 Then flew one of the seraphims unto me, having a live coal in his hand, which he had taken with the tongs from off the altar:

    We don't tell our children fairy tales so that they will know that monsters exist.
    They already know monsters exist.
    We tell our children fairy tales so that they will know that monsters can be killed.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Tambora View Post
    I agree the bible does not tell us about telephones and airplanes, etc. that men have made.
    But it does tell us about the earth GOD made.
    Not in specific detail, and if God thought you needed great detail He would have told you of all the other great technological details that you witness today, including the computer that you converse with me on. The Bible does not tell us to ignore all knowledge either, that just seems to be Christandoms willful ignorance, and using the Bible's silence on specific things as an excuse for it.
    Last edited by rocketman; August 25th, 2019 at 07:48 AM.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tambora View Post
    Rocky!
    What a pleasure to see you again.
    It is a pleasure to see you as well, though I am troubled seeing the spread of flat earth nonsense... and it is just nonsense.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Clete View Post
    I'm saying that there is no rational reason why I need to do that.


    That's right and if anyone attempted to get you to prove biblically that the Earth was a round spinning ball orbiting the Sun, you'd be right to tell them that there is no reason for you to do that.

    Why?

    Because of the portion of what I said that you didn't quote! The bible is not a science text book! That's why! There are all sorts of things that the bible is silent about and for you to hold me to the standard of "All you gotta do is show me where scripture presents the earths as a spinning globe propelling through space." is not rational!


    Who cares what they attempt to do?

    I'm not talking about the sort of pseudo-proofs that modern science uses to "prove" things like global warming or over population or black holes or dark matter. I'm talking about the sort of proof that is truly and genuinely irrefutable. A proof that even a middle school aged public schooled child can understand and duplicate for himself.


    Is this you responding to my question in the affirmative or is this you suggesting that nothing can be proven? I can't tell for sure whether you're being sarcastic or not.


    Well, the bible doesn't have a whole lot to say about cosmological issues. It's an interesting topic of discussion and study but you aren't going to find a definite answer about whether the Earth is flat or round by reading a book that doesn't discuss that topic. Just as you wouldn't read "Atlas Shrugged" by Ayn Rand to learn about how to properly train puppies, the bible is of little value when trying to figure out whether the Earth is flat or not.


    I don't mean to suggest that you're a liar. I fully believe that you believe what you say you believe and so you aren't lying in the sense of trying to be deceptive. My point has to do with intellectual honesty in the sense that one is willing to accept the verdict of sound reason even if that verdict falsifies their doctrine. It's simple, plain old honest rationality that I'm looking for.


    Well look, some of the bible is literally true and some of it isn't. There are figures of speech on every single page of the bible. There are whole sections of the bible that are flat out allegorical. Some things are taught as absolutes and others as rules of thumb. The point isn't to turn the bible into anything other than what it is or to take it in any way other than it was intended to be taken. And that sometimes takes some effort to accomplish because we are far removed in time from when the bible was written and some words and concepts don't mean now what they meant 2000+ years ago.

    What I'm here to tell you is that there is not one single verse of scripture that requires one to believe that the Earth is flat. The Christian church nor the Jewish tradition that preceded it ever believed or taught that the Earth was flat. Not ever, not even one time for even ten minutes. The idea that it did is a myth. If you believe that the Earth is flat, it isn't because of the bible nor because of any doctrine that the church has ever taught. Rather, the modern day beleif that the Earth is flat eminates from YouTube and nothing else.


    I'm totally fine discussing anything with anyone so long as they are at least trying to be rational and not being willfully ignorant and ignoring the arguments presented to them.

    I'm going to assume that you were not being sarcastic a moment ago. The flavor of the rest of your post would seem to suggest that is most likely and so I want to present the following proof to you that the Earth cannot be flat. I've posted it several times on this thread and I'm sure you've probably already seen it, but look at it again with fresh eyes. I know its sort of long but don't let it glaze your eyes over and really think it through because I'm not exaggerating when I say that it is an utterly irrefutable proof that the Earth is not flat that you can verify for yourself. If math works (which it does) and the sun sets (which it does) then the Earth is not flat. Here's the proof....




    FET (Flat Earth Theory) claims the Sun is approximately 3000 miles above the Earth and they do not dispute well established distances between points on the surface of the Earth. I'm going to be using these two presuppositions in my calculations and you'll want to refer to the following diagram to keep track of the variables...

    Attachment 26417

    Side a is the distance from the ground to the Sun (3000 mi).
    Side b is the distance from an observer to a point on the Earth where it is high noon (the point at which the Sun is at it's highest point in the sky).
    Side c (a.k.a. the hypotenuse) is the distance from the observer to the Sun itself.
    Angle A is the height of the Sun above the horizon in degrees as seen from the observer.
    Angle C is always 90
    Angle B is not relevant to this discussion.

    Note from the start that if the Earth is flat and the Sun is 3000 miles up (or any number of miles up for that matter) that angle A can never ever get to 0. The Sun would never set because no matter how long you make side b of that triangle, angle A is always a positive number. The only way for the Sun to set on a flat Earth is if the Sun dipped below the plane of the flat Earth. If that were to happen, then it would be night everywhere on Earth at once, which we know does not happen. It's always high noon somewhere on the Earth.

    That, by itself, ought to be enough to convince anyone that the Earth cannot be flat but there more. Let's take a look at some of these photos we took last week...

    So, since we're assuming a flat Earth, I'm going to focus on just a couple of photos that both show the position of the Sun in degrees above the horizon. I should point out that you don't have to trust the numbers generated by the app on the phones used to take these photos. The numbers can be confirmed by anyone by simply fashioning a simple sextant from a cheap plastic protractor.

    I'll use these two photos...

    Attachment 26418 Attachment 26419

    On the left is the Sun's position as seen from my house on May 8th at 01:00 UCT (8:00:01pm central time)
    On the right is the Sun's position as seen from Knight's house on the same day just 38 seconds later (7:00:39pm mountain time).

    The position of the Sun at my house is just .1 above the horizon while at Knight's it was 10.2 (This information is displayed just to the right of the Sun position indicator. It shows the Sun's heading and then it's elevation in degrees. On Knight's photo it's sort of hidden a little by the NW direction indicator but it reads "Sun 284.0 W 10.2" The 10.2 is the elevation above the horizon in degrees)

    So, let's look at Knight's first...

    How far West would you have to go from Knight's house (where sides b and c meet) to get to a place on a flat Earth where it was high noon (where sides a and b meet)?

    It turns out that when dealing with right triangles if you have the length of any one side and either angle A or B, you can know everything about the whole triangle!
    The math is boring and so I'm not going to show all that. Just go HERE and plug in the numbers for side b (3000) and angle A (10.2).
    You get the following results...

    Someone 16,700 miles (length of side b) to his west would see the Sun at it's highest point in the sky for that day.

    There is no point on Earth 16,700 miles from Denver Colorado.


    Still not convinced? Well just wait till you plug in the numbers from my house!


    At my house the Sun was only .1 degrees above the horizon. So plugging in the numbers from my house (side b = 3000 and angle A = .1) we get the following results...

    You have to go 1,720,000 miles to my West to find high noon beneath a Sun that was 3000 miles above the surface of a flat Earth.

    That's One MILLION seven hundred twenty THOUSAND miles!
    (That's more that 7 times the real distance to the Moon!)

    Now seriously folks! What more proof could you possibly need? How are you going to possibly refute this?

    Are you going to deny that the Sun is about 10 further above the horizon in Denver than it is in Houston? Even if you did that, the distance to noon calculations aren't dependent on that!

    Are you going to challenge the validity of the Pythagorean Theorem?

    It seems that's your only option! It's either refute the Pythagorean Theorem or you must reject the notion that the Earth is flat based on the mere fact that the Sun gets to within .1 of the horizon at one point on the Earth while at the same time being directly over head at another.

    Clete
    Pissin' into the wind again I see.
    Use that theorem on the stars.
    Oh wait, you can't because they're light years away.(Convenient ay?)

    Not only that, where do you get the idea that the sun is always 90% straight up above you at noon?

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    Quote Originally Posted by rocketman View Post
    Not in specific detail, and if God thought you needed great detail He would have told you of all the other great technological details that you witness today, including the computer that you converse with me on. The Bible does not tell us to ignore all knowledge either, that just seems to be Christandoms willful ignorance, and using the Bible's silence on specific things as an excuse for it.
    I think him saying he looks down on the circle of the earth is hardly being silent.
    If it was a ball he would have to look up or sideways at least wouldn't he?


    Like clay is molded by a signet ring, the earth's hills and valleys then stand out like the colors of a garment.

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    Quote Originally Posted by ffreeloader View Post
    That video describes a completely separate problem. The net effect of the problem I see is that there can only be daytime on a flat earth. You can demonstrate this for yourself by using a round table, turning out the lights, and then using a flashlight with an adjustable beam where it can be focused in a tight beam or have the light greatly diffused. Hold the flashlight above the table with a focused beam and move it around. There will be areas of light and shadow on the table. Now take a bare light bulb and power it up over the table. The entire table will be bathed in light no matter where over the table you move it. This will happen with a flat light source too for the light will flow in all directions but behind the surface of it, not in a focused beam.

    The same thing would happen on a flat earth just because of the omni-directional flow of light from a light source that has not been provided with a mechanical deflector of some type to focus the light.
    Nope.
    Hang a lantern in your campsite.
    How far up do you hang it before it does you less good.
    Then also where do you post your sentries?
    Outside the lights perimeter, no?
    If the sun is 30 miles in diameter why would it illuminate a plane that is over 50,000 miles in diameter?

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