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Thread: The Justification of the Ungodly, Romans 4:5

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    Quote Originally Posted by john w View Post
    No, neither I, nor most of TOL, and no member of the boc, are able to accept your devil "inspired," satanic doctrines of demons, that God's law is eliminated, is abolished, is destroyed, is made void, no longer exists, and your on record assertion that the law is against us, not the sin debt against breaking the law, your on record assertion that the law is not holy, is not good, is not right, is not spiritual, and we are not to use it to show the lost what sin is, and we are not to use it with the lost, to lead them to Christ, as a schoolmaster

    See how that works, satanist? I, other members of the boc, on TOl, have lambasted your sorcery, satanism, doctrine of demons, concluding that you, are unable to receive the truth, being under the authority of the devil, the father of all lies.





    No scripture asserts that the law was abolished demon, as the entire bible refutes your satanic, wicked doctrines of demons, and Romans 7:4 KJV, says no such thing, as you vomit, in drunkenness, your satanic "interpretation."

    We are dead to the law, moron, not because the law was abolished, but because the Lord Jesus Christ dies for our sins, sins that are defined by an existing law, and died in our place, taking judgment, for us, as sin(singular), as sinners, defined by an existing law, you demon. Of Course, you reject that, and thus pervert the gospel of Christ.


    There you go TOL audience-he reiterates his satanic "end game," i.e., replace/eliminate God's holy, objective law, with subjectivity.

    He, again, on record, devilishly replace God's objective holy law, conveyed via objective, written words, with a subjective law, per Judges 17:6 KJV, Judges 21:25 KJV, i.e., subjectivity, as he asserts that truth is relative to the individual, as each person determines truth, as they see it, and thus he cannot provide any objective reason, as to why murder, lying, cheating, suicide bombing, rape, sodomy, .................................................. .................................................. ..................................are wrong.



    Go ahead, Pate: What would you tell a lost person, as to why murder, rape,............................................. are wrong. Go ahead-tell all of the TOL audience what you would tell that person. Go ahead. Go ahead and tell us what you would tell a Muslim, who asserts that suicide bombings are just fine. Go ahead, Pate.

    I've asked him this over 25 times, and he won't touch it.

    Go ahead, Pate-tell us.

    I will pick you apart.

    He won't-his daddy devil tells him to just keep on spamming his satanic assertions, whose origins are the pits of hell, not from the LORD God.

    I have probably told you this 50 times, the unsaved are under the law and will be judged by the law.

    You are not really interested in correct doctrine. You are more interested in trying to discredit me.

    You are an unsaved arrogant twit that cannot receive the truth of God's word. You seldom if ever quote scripture. The reason is that you don't believe the scriptures. if you believed the scriptures you would believe what the scriptures are saying.

    The scripture plainly says that the law has been abolished, Ephesians 2:15 also Colossians 2:14. You are not able to receive this truth because you are void of the Holy Spirit, who is the teacher of truth, John 16:13.

  2. #167
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ask Mr. Religion View Post
    Yikes! At the very least you could at least agree with your now admitted atheist mentor, Brinsmead, who is also wrong:

    "Thus, ample textual and typological evidence demonstrates the truth of this one simple thesis: Jesus Christ replaces the Torah."
    Src: http://greatest1command.com/cd1__jes...ristianity.pdf

    Had to add that quote of yours above to my ongoing collection of your nonsense, Robert:

    http://theologyonline.com/showthread...62#post4402162



    AMR
    In your religious thinking Brinsmead is an atheist because he is anti-religion.

    I have bad news for you, Jesus was also anti-religion, this is why the religious Pharisees wanted to murder him.

    You and John W are under the law and will be judged by the law.

  3. #168
    Over 500 post club fishrovmen's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ask Mr. Religion View Post
    Yikes! At the very least you could at least agree with your now admitted atheist mentor, Brinsmead, who is also wrong:

    "Thus, ample textual and typological evidence demonstrates the truth of this one simple thesis: Jesus Christ replaces the Torah."
    Src: http://greatest1command.com/cd1__jes...ristianity.pdf

    Had to add that quote of yours above to my ongoing collection of your nonsense, Robert:

    http://theologyonline.com/showthread...62#post4402162



    AMR
    I wonder if the disciples of Brinsmead get into Tropical Fruit World for free? Of course, I would hope there wouldn't be too many of them.
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    Ask Mr. Religion (March 12th, 2018)

  5. #169
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    Quote Originally Posted by fishrovmen View Post
    I wonder if the disciples of Brinsmead get into Tropical Fruit World for free? Of course, I would hope there wouldn't be too many of them.
    Brinsmead does not have disciples. Due to his world wide publication of Verdict Magazine he still has some that read his teachings. I happen to be one of the many thousands. The motto for Verdict was, "The Gospel plus nothing and nothing but the Gospel". Which is really what the Bible teaches.

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    Quote Originally Posted by fishrovmen View Post
    I wonder if the disciples of Brinsmead get into Tropical Fruit World for free? Of course, I would hope there wouldn't be too many of them.
    Welcome to Brinsmead's Tropical Fruit World,
    A strange, bizarre world of oddities where everything contradicts, yet makes perfect sense.
    There are no laws or rules here, and no one is watching, so do whatever you like and have a good time.
    Be warned that you will be judged before you leave the park according to all that you did during your stay.
    Have a great day!
    Don't forget to visit our gift shop, we've imputed money to everyone's account, so feel free to use the money you don't have yet to buy our famous Catholic and Calvinist straw men.
    Last edited by fishrovmen; March 12th, 2018 at 09:09 AM.
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    TOL Legend john w's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Robert Pate View Post
    I have probably told you this 50 times, the unsaved are under the law and will be judged by the law.

    You are not really interested in correct doctrine. You are more interested in trying to discredit me.

    You are an unsaved arrogant twit that cannot receive the truth of God's word. You seldom if ever quote scripture. The reason is that you don't believe the scriptures. if you believed the scriptures you would believe what the scriptures are saying.

    The scripture plainly says that the law has been abolished, Ephesians 2:15 also Colossians 2:14. You are not able to receive this truth because you are void of the Holy Spirit, who is the teacher of truth, John 16:13.
    The reason is that you don't believe the scriptures. if you believed the scriptures you would believe what the scriptures are saying.
    Wow, devilish old man! That clinches it. Watch this:You don;t believe the scriptures, the Lord Jesus Christ, Paul. If you believed the scripture, the Lord Jesus Christ, Paul you would believe what the scriptures are saying.

    Fun!

    Moron.
    Quote Originally Posted by Robert Pate View Post
    the unsaved are under the law and will be judged by the law.
    What law, you demon? There is no law, according to you, by which the law can judge the unsaved! Watch him respond, with his convoluted, demon induced "logic," that not being under the law=the law no longer exists, that he spams on every thread, that the law has been abolished/destroyed/made void/eliminated/no longer exists for the saved, but it is resurrected/reincarnated/un-abolished/un-destroyed/un-made void/un-eliminated/re-exists after having been abolished, destroyed,made void .....for the lost, which perverts, corrupts the meaning of the words abolish/destroy/void-only a demon induced person can spam this convoluted "reasoning."


    Pate: The only way I cannot be judged for this traffic ticket for speeding, that I recently received, is if the court abolishes/destroys the law against speeding!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

    Pate: The only reason that I am not subject to the laws of Mexico, Spain, the UK.............................is because these laws were destroyed/abolished/made void-they no longer exists!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!:

    =demonic "logic"


    Arrogant twit, you muse, you loser, frail wimp? Real tough demon, are you, loser, lost, blind, admitted satanist You're such a demonic coward, you'd only say that behind your computer, punk.

    No scripture asserts your satanic trash,that that the law has been abolished/no longer exists, has been destroyed, has been eliminated, made void, and certainly not Ephesians 2:15 KJV/Colossians 2:14 KJV, as you spam, as all of TOL has witnessed your demonic changing the words in those 2 passages, as your daddy devil taught you well.

    No, neither I, nor most of TOL, and no member of the boc, are able to accept your devil "inspired," satanic doctrines of demons, that God's law is eliminated, is abolished, is destroyed, is made void, no longer exists, and your on record assertion that the law is against us, not the sin debt against breaking the law, your on record assertion that the law is not holy, is not good, is not right, is not spiritual, and we are not to use it to show the lost what sin is, and we are not to use it with the lost, to lead them to Christ, as a schoolmaster

    See how that works, satanist? I, other members of the boc, on TOl, have lambasted your sorcery, satanism, doctrine of demons, concluding that you, are unable to receive the truth, being under the authority of the devil, the father of all lies.


    No scripture asserts that the law was abolished demon, as the entire bible refutes your satanic, wicked doctrines of demons, and Romans 7:4 KJV, says no such thing, as you vomit, in drunkenness, your satanic "interpretation."

    We are dead to the law, moron, not because the law was abolished, but because the Lord Jesus Christ dies for our sins, sins that are defined by an existing law, and died in our place, taking judgment, for us, as sin(singular), as sinners, defined by an existing law, you demon. Of Course, you reject that, and thus pervert the gospel of Christ.
    Quote Originally Posted by Robert Pate View Post
    The law has been replaced by the Holy Spirit.
    Made up-no scripture asserts this. And there you go TOL audience-he reiterates his satanic "end game," i.e., replace/eliminate God's holy, objective law, with subjectivity.

    He, again, on record, devilishly replace God's objective holy law, conveyed via objective, written words, with a subjective law, per Judges 17:6 KJV, Judges 21:25 KJV, i.e., subjectivity, as he asserts that truth is relative to the individual, as each person determines truth, as they see it, and thus he cannot provide any objective reason, as to why murder, lying, cheating, suicide bombing, rape, sodomy, .................................................. .................................................. ..................................are wrong.



    Go ahead, Pate: What would you tell a lost person, as to why murder, rape,............................................. are wrong. Go ahead-tell all of the TOL audience what you would tell that person. Go ahead. Go ahead and tell us what you would tell a Muslim, who asserts that suicide bombings are just fine. Go ahead, Pate.

    I've asked him this over 25 times, and he won't touch it.

    Go ahead, Pate-tell us.

    I will pick you apart.

    He won't-his daddy devil tells him to just keep on spamming his satanic assertions, whose origins are the pits of hell, not from the LORD God.


    As I predicted-he won't touch this.
    Saint John W

  8. #172
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    Quote Originally Posted by Robert Pate View Post
    In your religious thinking Brinsmead is an atheist because he is anti-religion.
    Er, no.

    "In the early 1980s Brinsmead's theology shifted to liberal Christianity, and he now rejected the Adventist belief in the Sabbath. He abandoned his belief in many orthodox Christian teachings, including justification through faith in Christ and the divinity of Christ, seeing God's interaction with mankind as not being limited to just the history of the Bible, but as an ongoing and continuous interaction with humanity towards a positive future."

    See: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Robert_Brinsmead

    The man is an outright heretic now, Robert. Find another mentor.

    AMR
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    Quote Originally Posted by Robert Pate View Post
    You and John W are under the law and will be judged by the law.
    Observe, the continued satanic deception...

    Pate: Since US citizens are not "under" the laws of foreign countries, the laws of foreign countries are abolished/destroyed/no longer exist/void!!!!!. The only way US citizens can escape judgment of the laws of foregn countries, not be "under" them,i.e., their jurisdiction/authority, and their corresponding judgment for breaking those laws,is if they are abolished/destroyed/made void-do not exist!!!!!!


    That is his demon "inspired" "reasoning."
    Saint John W

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    Quote Originally Posted by john w View Post
    Observe, the continued satanic deception...

    Pate: Since US citizens are not "under" the laws of foreign countries, the laws of foreign countries are abolished/destroyed/no longer exist/void!!!!!. The only way US citizens can escape judgment of the laws of foregn countries, not be "under" them,i.e., their jurisdiction/authority, and their corresponding judgment for breaking those laws,is if they are abolished/destroyed/made void-do not exist!!!!!!


    That is his demon "inspired" "reasoning."

    Again, no scripture. Just hot air. No one will listen to you on this Forum if you don't have scripture to back up what you are saying. It appears that you are anti-Bible and anyone that quotes scripture is a heretic. I think that you are the real demon.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Robert Pate View Post
    Again, no scripture. Just hot air. No one will listen to you on this Forum if you don't have scripture to back up what you are saying. It appears that you are anti-Bible and anyone that quotes scripture is a heretic. I think that you are the real demon.
    Spam. No, I gave you, chapter, verse, as others have, and expounded at length, while all you do is copy'npaste, word-for-word, the same old satanic assertions, that your daddy devil taught you, and spam irrelevant scriptures, never explaining them, or butchering their meaning.

    Get off this site, satanic one, as I, and almost every member of the boc, on TOL, sees through your made up, satanic assertion, that the holy law of God no longer exists, replaced with subjectivity.


    Go ahead, Pate: What would you tell a lost person, as to why murder, rape,............................................. are wrong. Go ahead-tell all of the TOL audience what you would tell that person. Go ahead. Go ahead and tell us what you would tell a Muslim, who asserts that suicide bombings are just fine. Go ahead, Pate.

    I've asked him this over 30 times, and he won't touch it.

    Go ahead, Pate-tell us.

    I will pick you apart.

    He won't-his daddy devil tells him to just keep on spamming his satanic assertions, whose origins are the pits of hell, not from the LORD God.


    As I predicted-he won't touch this.



    Not a peep, as his daddy devil has a gag order on him.
    Saint John W

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    Quote Originally Posted by Robert Pate View Post
    "But to him that does no works, but believes on him that justifies the ungodly, his faith is counted for righteousness" Romans 4:5.

    Who are the ungodly? If you are a human being born after Adam you are the ungodly, Romans 5:12.

    How does Jesus justify the ungodly? Justification is not something that happens within the believer. Justification takes place totally and completely outside of the believer. All that is required of us is that we have faith in the doing and the dying of Jesus.

    When were we justified? We were justified by Jesus Christ over 2000 years ago. After we were justified we were also reconciled to God, 2 Corinthians 5:18. Justification and reconciliation go hand in hand. No one can be reconciled to God without first being justified.

    Justification is a legal word that is frequently used in a court of law. The word justify means to be made right or vindicated. To be declared guiltless. To be absolved from sin. I have heard it described as "just as though I had never sinned" But we know that all have sinned, Romans 3:23.

    This act of being justified is ours by simple child like faith. There is no works or obedience required. Paul wrote,

    "What shall we say then that Abraham our father as pertaining to the flesh, has found? For if Abraham were justified by works, he has whereof to glory: but not before God. For what does the scripture say? ABRAHAM BELIEVED GOD, AND IT WAS COUNTED UNTO HIM FOR RIGHTEOUSNESS" Romans 4:1-3.

    In the New Testament faith, not works or obedience counts for righteousness. This is very difficult for people that are religious to understand.

    Jesus does the work of justifying the ungodly. In our name and on our behalf, Jesus offers to God the Father a life of perfect obedience according to his Holy Law, Matthew 5:18. It is this life that was lived for our justification, Romans 3:26. That was not enough. In our name and on our behalf Jesus, who knew no sin, became sin for us that we might be made the righteousness of God in him, 2 Corinthians 5:21.

    God sees ALL THINGS in his Son Jesus Christ. Jesus's acceptance into heaven is our acceptance, we are accepted in him. In Jesus Christ we have been justified, sanctified and redeemed, 1 Corinthians 1:30. We now stand before God's holy court as perfect and complete in Jesus Christ, Colossians 2:10. Fully and completely justified. No religion was needed.
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    Quote Originally Posted by john w View Post
    Spam. No, I gave you, chapter, verse, as others have, and expounded at length, while all you do is copy'npaste, word-for-word, the same old satanic assertions, that your daddy devil taught you, and spam irrelevant scriptures, never explaining them, or butchering their meaning.

    Get off this site, satanic one, as I, and almost every member of the boc, on TOL, sees through your made up, satanic assertion, that the holy law of God no longer exists, replaced with subjectivity.


    Go ahead, Pate: What would you tell a lost person, as to why murder, rape,............................................. are wrong. Go ahead-tell all of the TOL audience what you would tell that person. Go ahead. Go ahead and tell us what you would tell a Muslim, who asserts that suicide bombings are just fine. Go ahead, Pate.

    I've asked him this over 30 times, and he won't touch it.

    Go ahead, Pate-tell us.

    I will pick you apart.

    He won't-his daddy devil tells him to just keep on spamming his satanic assertions, whose origins are the pits of hell, not from the LORD God.


    As I predicted-he won't touch this.



    Not a peep, as his daddy devil has a gag order on him.

    Christians are not under the law, unless you put yourself under the law by being subject to it.

    Why do you want to be under the law? To be under the law is to be under a curse, Galatians 3:10.

    The Bible plainly teaches that for the Christian the law has been abolished, Ephesians 2:15. There can be no freedom from sin if the law has not been abolished. Simply because where there is law there is judgment and condemnation. This is why Paul said, "Tell me that you desire to be under the law, do you not hear the law?" Romans 4:21.

    The law will damn you to hell.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ask Mr. Religion View Post
    Er, no.

    "In the early 1980s Brinsmead's theology shifted to liberal Christianity, and he now rejected the Adventist belief in the Sabbath. He abandoned his belief in many orthodox Christian teachings, including justification through faith in Christ and the divinity of Christ, seeing God's interaction with mankind as not being limited to just the history of the Bible, but as an ongoing and continuous interaction with humanity towards a positive future."

    See: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Robert_Brinsmead

    The man is an outright heretic now, Robert. Find another mentor.

    AMR
    Don't believe everything that you read about Brinsmead. Many like yourself label him as a heretic and a liberal Christian. This is very common with people that don't understand the Gospel and justification by faith. In the Gospel we are justified by faith alone because we are justified by Christ alone. This means that all religions are worthless and are false. Since your God is a religious one this will be offensive to you. But to us who believe it is great news and freedom.

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    TOL Legend john w's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Robert Pate View Post
    Christians are not under the law, unless you put yourself under the law by being subject to it.

    Why do you want to be under the law? To be under the law is to be under a curse, Galatians 3:10.
    =satanic spam, word-for-word devilish deceit, that he has littered on this site, for the 666th time, this year.


    You admitted vile, filthy demon, God hater, Christ rejector, with devil "logic," dung false dichotomy, as not being under the law, it's authority, does not mean that the law no longer exists, is made void, as you satanically keep spamming.

    Pate:US citizens are not under the law of other countries, so that means the laws of other countries have been abolished, no longer exist!!!

    On record-he has yet to address this, much less deny it, as he knows I picked his satanic sorcery apart.

    Quote Originally Posted by Robert Pate View Post
    The Bible plainly teaches that for the Christian the law has been abolished, Ephesians 2:15.
    No, the devil plainly teaches what he taught you, what you "teach," that the law is not good, holy, spiritual, and that it no longer exists, is made void. Ephesians 2:15 KJV says no such thing, God hater.


    Quote Originally Posted by Robert Pate View Post
    There can be no freedom from sin if the law has not been abolished.
    Pate: If I break the law, against speeding, there can be no freedom from the judgment of the law, unless the laws against speeding(murder, rape,....................)are abolished!!!!!


    That is this vile demon's satan induced "logic."

    No, you devil child, the sin debt, for breaking an existing law, which defines the offense/sin, was "wiped" out, not the law, you moron, as I/countless others, have shown you and your daddy devil.


    Quote Originally Posted by Robert Pate View Post
    Simply because where there is law there is judgment and condemnation.
    Pate:On record-everyone is saved, as since there is no law, there is no judgment and condemnation.

    No, moron-there is no judgment and condemnation, not because the law was abolished, but because the Saviour took the judgmednt and condemnation, in our place, for breaking God's existing laws, dying for our sins/sin.



    Pate the demon again is "outed" as a fraud, poser, charlatan, rejecting the gospel of Christ, as He asserts that Christ died in vain, as there is no law to define sin/sins, and thus for which to die.
    Quote Originally Posted by Robert Pate View Post
    This is why Paul said, "Tell me that you desire to be under the law, do you not hear the law?" Romans 4:21.
    Quite irrelevant to your satanic argument that the law no longer exists, is made void.
    Quote Originally Posted by Robert Pate View Post
    The law will damn you to hell.
    No, demonic drunk, the holy, good just, spiritual law does not damn anyone to hell; it is man breaking the existing law, and the resulting sib debt/IOU, that condemns one to hell. Thus, Christ died for our sins...became sin...was judged in the flesh....Existing law.

    Pate: I am going to hell, for committing murder, since there is a law against it.

    That is, again, this demon's satanic "logic," from the pits of hell.

    Get off this site, satanic one, as I, and almost every member of the boc, on TOL, sees through your made up, satanic assertion, that the holy law of God no longer exists, replaced with subjectivity.


    Go ahead, Pate: What would you tell a lost person, as to why murder, rape,............................................. are wrong. Go ahead-tell all of the TOL audience what you would tell that person. Go ahead. Go ahead and tell us what you would tell a Muslim, who asserts that suicide bombings are just fine. Go ahead, Pate.

    I've asked him this over 30 times, and he won't touch it.

    Go ahead, Pate-tell us.

    I will pick you apart.

    He won't-his daddy devil tells him to just keep on spamming his satanic assertions, whose origins are the pits of hell, not from the LORD God.


    As I predicted-he won't touch this.


    Not a peep, as his daddy devil has a gag order on him.
    Saint John W

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    Quote Originally Posted by john w View Post
    =satanic spam, word-for-word devilish deceit, that he has littered on this site, for the 666th time, this year.


    You admitted vile, filthy demon, God hater, Christ rejector, with devil "logic," dung false dichotomy, as not being under the law, it's authority, does not mean that the law no longer exists, is made void, as you satanically keep spamming.

    Pate:US citizens are not under the law of other countries, so that means the laws of other countries have been abolished, no longer exist!!!

    On record-he has yet to address this, much less deny it, as he knows I picked his satanic sorcery apart.



    No, the devil plainly teaches what he taught you, what you "teach," that the law is not good, holy, spiritual, and that it no longer exists, is made void. Ephesians 2:15 KJV says no such thing, God hater.




    Pate: If I break the law, against speeding, there can be no freedom from the judgment of the law, unless the laws against speeding(murder, rape,....................)are abolished!!!!!


    That is this vile demon's satan induced "logic."

    No, you devil child, the sin debt, for breaking an existing law, which defines the offense/sin, was "wiped" out, not the law, you moron, as I/countless others, have shown you and your daddy devil.




    Pate:On record-everyone is saved, as since there is no law, there is no judgment and condemnation.

    No, moron-there is no judgment and condemnation, not because the law was abolished, but because the Saviour took the judgmednt and condemnation, in our place, for breaking God's existing laws, dying for our sins/sin.



    Pate the demon again is "outed" as a fraud, poser, charlatan, rejecting the gospel of Christ, as He asserts that Christ died in vain, as there is no law to define sin/sins, and thus for which to die.

    Quite irrelevant to your satanic argument that the law no longer exists, is made void.


    No, demonic drunk, the holy, good just, spiritual law does not damn anyone to hell; it is man breaking the existing law, and the resulting sib debt/IOU, that condemns one to hell. Thus, Christ died for our sins...became sin...was judged in the flesh....Existing law.

    Pate: I am going to hell, for committing murder, since there is a law against it.

    That is, again, this demon's satanic "logic," from the pits of hell.

    Get off this site, satanic one, as I, and almost every member of the boc, on TOL, sees through your made up, satanic assertion, that the holy law of God no longer exists, replaced with subjectivity.


    Go ahead, Pate: What would you tell a lost person, as to why murder, rape,............................................. are wrong. Go ahead-tell all of the TOL audience what you would tell that person. Go ahead. Go ahead and tell us what you would tell a Muslim, who asserts that suicide bombings are just fine. Go ahead, Pate.

    I've asked him this over 30 times, and he won't touch it.

    Go ahead, Pate-tell us.

    I will pick you apart.

    He won't-his daddy devil tells him to just keep on spamming his satanic assertions, whose origins are the pits of hell, not from the LORD God.


    As I predicted-he won't touch this.


    Not a peep, as his daddy devil has a gag order on him.

    You are a blind fool.

    There is no condemnation to those that are "In Christ" Romans 8:1. There is no condemnation because there is no law. It has been abolished, Ephesians 2:15.

    Read this 10 times, maybe it will penetrate your thick skull.

    "For sin shall not have dominion over you, FOR YOU ARE NOT UNDER THE LAW, BUT UNDER GRACE" Romans 6:14

    The law is for lost sinners like yourself, 1 Timothy 1:9,10. Not for Christians.

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