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Thread: What is the appropriate level of giving for retired people?

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    Quote Originally Posted by 2003cobra View Post
    I agree with this.

    I think your post implies that net worth is more important in that consideration than income is.

    Is that correct?
    Probably, as all that we have is not really ours, but God's. We are but stewards of God's abundance.

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    Quote Originally Posted by dcon View Post
    The commandment to tithe, or contribute a tenth of one’s belongings, was part of the Law given to the ancient nation of Israel. However, the Bible makes it clear that this Law—including the “commandment to collect tithes”—does not apply to Christians.—Hebrews 7:5, 18; Colossians 2:13, 14.

    It's obviously your choice whether or not to follow Jewish traditions. However, wouldn't it be prudent as Christians, who claim to follow Jesus, to obey the Bible’s direction to Christians: “Let each one do just as he has resolved in his heart, not grudgingly or under compulsion, for God loves a cheerful giver.”—2 Corinthians 9:7.

    Tithing is a requirement, it doesn't necessarily come from the heart. Contributing from the heart, means giving freely, not under compulsion or because you are expected to.

    Sent from my SM-J727P using Tapatalk
    You correctly point out that tithing is to come from the heart,

    but,

    Evidently, you did not read my entire post or you do not realize that Abraham, who tithed to Mel, the high priest, was not a Judean, nor was he under the law for the law was not yet given.

    Abraham is called the father of all those who believe. Do you consider yourself a believer? Should you follow your father's example? Should you tithe? Abraham did. what is holding you back?

    The tithe is not law, it is the financial recognition that God is God and that all you are, have, and ever hope to be as a human being, let alone a believer hinges on God's creating the heavens and earth and that God supplies you need according to his riches in glory. Philippians 4:19

    That being said, it is clear that tithing is not about the law but about heart and recognition that it is God that supplies all your need.

    What is the context of God supplying all your need? Philippians 4:19

    Giving and receiving.

    (note: people talk about the give and take of love, that is error, it is giving and receiving)

    Since you are no longer under the law, are you saying that adultery is now fine to do?

    How about worshipping idols?

    How about murder?

    Is is ok not to honor your father and mother?

    After all you are no longer under the law!

    Sin is described very well in the law of Moses.

    Those accurate descriptions of sin are still sin

    Not being under the law does not make sin into a virtue.
    "And they continued stedfastly in the apostles' doctrine and fellowship and in breaking of bread and in prayers." Acts 2:42

    "Fulfil ye my joy, that ye be likeminded, having the same love, being of one accord, of one mind" Philippians 2:2

    Pro scripture = Protestant

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    Quote Originally Posted by oatmeal View Post
    You correctly point out that tithing is to come from the heart,

    but,

    Evidently, you did not read my entire post or you do not realize that Abraham, who tithed to Mel, the high priest, was not a Judean, nor was he under the law for the law was not yet given.

    Abraham is called the father of all those who believe. Do you consider yourself a believer? Should you follow your father's example? Should you tithe? Abraham did. what is holding you back?

    The tithe is not law, it is the financial recognition that God is God and that all you are, have, and ever hope to be as a human being, let alone a believer hinges on God's creating the heavens and earth and that God supplies you need according to his riches in glory. Philippians 4:19

    That being said, it is clear that tithing is not about the law but about heart and recognition that it is God that supplies all your need.

    What is the context of God supplying all your need? Philippians 4:19

    Giving and receiving.

    (note: people talk about the give and take of love, that is error, it is giving and receiving)

    Since you are no longer under the law, are you saying that adultery is now fine to do?

    How about worshipping idols?

    How about murder?

    Is is ok not to honor your father and mother?

    After all you are no longer under the law!

    Sin is described very well in the law of Moses.

    Those accurate descriptions of sin are still sin

    Not being under the law does not make sin into a virtue.
    As I said, the Law does have value. But the new covenant, with Jesus's sacrifice, includes the Law, AND goes above and beyond it. He called it a new law, one that was easier for the people to adhere to, because it wasn't so strict. If you want to make your life more complicated by following a set of rules, that is your choice. Most of the people I've met, however, find man's laws overbearing enough; yet, the principles of Jesus's law are refreshing. They allow people the ability to think for themselves. They don't have to do things of the Law because that's what their ancestors did thousands of years ago.

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    Quote Originally Posted by dcon View Post
    As I said, the Law does have value. But the new covenant, with Jesus's sacrifice, includes the Law, AND goes above and beyond it. He called it a new law, one that was easier for the people to adhere to, because it wasn't so strict. If you want to make your life more complicated by following a set of rules, that is your choice. Most of the people I've met, however, find man's laws overbearing enough; yet, the principles of Jesus's law are refreshing. They allow people the ability to think for themselves. They don't have to do things of the Law because that's what their ancestors did thousands of years ago.
    Provide scripture to support this "new, less strict law".

    It seems that you have it backwards. Jesus made the law more strict.

    Matt 5:21-22 (AKJV/PCE)
    (5:21) ∂ Ye have heard that it was said by them of old time, Thou shalt not kill; and whosoever shall kill shall be in danger of the judgment: (5:22) But I say unto you, That whosoever is angry with his brother without a cause shall be in danger of the judgment: and whosoever shall say to his brother, Raca, shall be in danger of the council: but whosoever shall say, Thou fool, shall be in danger of hell fire.

    Matt 5:27-28 (AKJV/PCE)
    (5:27) ∂ Ye have heard that it was said by them of old time, Thou shalt not commit adultery: (5:28) But I say unto you, That whosoever looketh on a woman to lust after her hath committed adultery with her already in his heart.

    Jesus showed that the law was not limited to the outward action, but also to the inward heart.
    Quote Originally Posted by Squeaky View Post
    That explains why your an idiot.
    Quote Originally Posted by God's Truth View Post
    Father figure, Son figure, and Holy Spirit figure.
    Quote Originally Posted by God's Truth View Post
    You preach against me for preaching obedience to Christ for salvation.
    Col 2:9 (AKJV/PCE)
    (2:9) For in him dwelleth all the fulness of the Godhead bodily.

    1Tim 4:10 (AKJV/PCE)
    (4:10) For therefore we both labour and suffer reproach, because we trust in the living God, who is the Saviour of all men, specially of those that believe.

    Something that was SPOKEN OF since the world began CANNOT be the SAME thing as something KEPT SECRET since the world began.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Right Divider View Post
    Provide scripture to support this "new, less strict law".

    It seems that you have it backwards. Jesus made the law more strict.

    Matt 5:21-22 (AKJV/PCE)
    (5:21) ∂ Ye have heard that it was said by them of old time, Thou shalt not kill; and whosoever shall kill shall be in danger of the judgment: (5:22) But I say unto you, That whosoever is angry with his brother without a cause shall be in danger of the judgment: and whosoever shall say to his brother, Raca, shall be in danger of the council: but whosoever shall say, Thou fool, shall be in danger of hell fire.

    Matt 5:27-28 (AKJV/PCE)
    (5:27) ∂ Ye have heard that it was said by them of old time, Thou shalt not commit adultery: (5:28) But I say unto you, That whosoever looketh on a woman to lust after her hath committed adultery with her already in his heart.

    Jesus showed that the law was not limited to the outward action, but also to the inward heart.
    Matthew 22:37 This commandment was not in the Law of Moses specifically, yet Jesus said it was the greatest. How much more simple is it to love God completely, than to follow a set of laws that come to the same conclusion?

    Proverbs 10:12 1 Peter 4:8 The Law was very specific as to things the Israelites must not do. However, how simple is it to show unconditional love toward everyone, even our enemies, so that we would never do any of those things in the Law.
    1 Peter speaks of having intense love, which is more than just saying "until you start causing me problems".

    There's nothing wrong with following the Law to the letter; IF YOU FOLLOW IT TO THE LETTER. I capitalized this because of how difficult it can be to do so.


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    Quote Originally Posted by 2003cobra View Post
    I understand this is the Jewish Law.

    Have you read Acts 15? Believers of Gentile origin are not under the Jewish Law.

    Abraham did not give a tithe of his goods, but of what he took in battle ó the goods of others. Then he returned the 90% of the stolen goods.

    By the way, oatmeal, I have always given more than 10%. It just does not appear to me that there is scriptural evidence for 10% being the minimum.
    You are correct. Jewish law does not apply to people who are Christians. Insisting that people follow what you believe is tantamount to forcing you to do so.

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    Quote Originally Posted by dcon View Post
    Matthew 22:37 This commandment was not in the Law of Moses specifically, yet Jesus said it was the greatest. How much more simple is it to love God completely, than to follow a set of laws that come to the same conclusion?
    Deut 6:5 (AKJV/PCE)
    (6:5) And thou shalt love the LORD thy God with all thine heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy might.

    Matt 22:37 (AKJV/PCE)
    (22:37) Jesus said unto him, Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind.

    Jesus was not telling them something new.

    It seems that the OP is looking for a magic formula instead of understanding grace giving.
    Quote Originally Posted by Squeaky View Post
    That explains why your an idiot.
    Quote Originally Posted by God's Truth View Post
    Father figure, Son figure, and Holy Spirit figure.
    Quote Originally Posted by God's Truth View Post
    You preach against me for preaching obedience to Christ for salvation.
    Col 2:9 (AKJV/PCE)
    (2:9) For in him dwelleth all the fulness of the Godhead bodily.

    1Tim 4:10 (AKJV/PCE)
    (4:10) For therefore we both labour and suffer reproach, because we trust in the living God, who is the Saviour of all men, specially of those that believe.

    Something that was SPOKEN OF since the world began CANNOT be the SAME thing as something KEPT SECRET since the world began.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Right Divider View Post
    Deut 6:5 (AKJV/PCE)
    (6:5) And thou shalt love the LORD thy God with all thine heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy might.

    Matt 22:37 (AKJV/PCE)
    (22:37) Jesus said unto him, Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind.

    Jesus was not telling them something new.

    It seems that the OP is looking for a magic formula instead of understanding grace giving.
    Giving from the heart; a magic formula? That's a new one! Could it possibly be that you've been told time after time that tithing is the only way to give, that you won't accept any other option?

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    Quote Originally Posted by dcon View Post
    Giving from the heart; a magic formula? That's a new one! Could it possibly be that you've been told time after time that tithing is the only way to give, that you won't accept any other option?
    I never said "giving from the heart is a magic formula", among your other false accusations.
    Quote Originally Posted by Squeaky View Post
    That explains why your an idiot.
    Quote Originally Posted by God's Truth View Post
    Father figure, Son figure, and Holy Spirit figure.
    Quote Originally Posted by God's Truth View Post
    You preach against me for preaching obedience to Christ for salvation.
    Col 2:9 (AKJV/PCE)
    (2:9) For in him dwelleth all the fulness of the Godhead bodily.

    1Tim 4:10 (AKJV/PCE)
    (4:10) For therefore we both labour and suffer reproach, because we trust in the living God, who is the Saviour of all men, specially of those that believe.

    Something that was SPOKEN OF since the world began CANNOT be the SAME thing as something KEPT SECRET since the world began.

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    Quote Originally Posted by 2003cobra View Post
    I understand that believers of Gentile origin are not under the Law and we are not living in a theocracy. Therefore the Old Testament laws have application at most as historical guidance.

    Of course we are to give as God has prospered us, and we are to give cheerfully.

    In this thread, I am hoping to solicit comments on practical ways to determine appropriate giving levels.

    I have my own ideas on the topic, and I am seeking input. I donít think there is one right answer, other than to do as the Lord leads you.

    Comments?

    What are you giving to? If you are giving to an organized church that has no Gospel or very little Gospel, it is like stuffing money down a rat hole.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Right Divider View Post
    I never said "giving from the heart is a magic formula", among your other false accusations.
    Because I quote from the Bible, they're false accusations? I don't argue my beliefs with anyone, especially someone who is rude and impolite. Neither will I share my beliefs with a person who professes to be a Christian but definitely is lacking. I tried to show respect for you and your beliefs and that turned out to be my mistake. In the future, if you see my posts, please do not reply, and I'll do the same. Thank you.

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    Quote Originally Posted by dcon View Post
    Giving from the heart; a magic formula? That's a new one! Could it possibly be that you've been told time after time that tithing is the only way to give, that you won't accept any other option?

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    Quote Originally Posted by dcon View Post
    Because I quote from the Bible, they're false accusations? I don't argue my beliefs with anyone, especially someone who is rude and impolite. Neither will I share my beliefs with a person who professes to be a Christian but definitely is lacking. I tried to show respect for you and your beliefs and that turned out to be my mistake. In the future, if you see my posts, please do not reply, and I'll do the same. Thank you.
    There were NO Bible quotes in the post that contained FALSE accusations.

    Go look in a mirror. Christians don't make FALSE accusations.

    I will reply to any post that I choose.
    Quote Originally Posted by Squeaky View Post
    That explains why your an idiot.
    Quote Originally Posted by God's Truth View Post
    Father figure, Son figure, and Holy Spirit figure.
    Quote Originally Posted by God's Truth View Post
    You preach against me for preaching obedience to Christ for salvation.
    Col 2:9 (AKJV/PCE)
    (2:9) For in him dwelleth all the fulness of the Godhead bodily.

    1Tim 4:10 (AKJV/PCE)
    (4:10) For therefore we both labour and suffer reproach, because we trust in the living God, who is the Saviour of all men, specially of those that believe.

    Something that was SPOKEN OF since the world began CANNOT be the SAME thing as something KEPT SECRET since the world began.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Right Divider View Post
    There were NO Bible quotes in the post that contained FALSE accusations.

    Go look in a mirror. Christians don't make FALSE accusations.

    I will reply to any post that I choose.
    True Christians are never rude or accusatory. You have failed the test. Accept it.

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    Quote Originally Posted by dcon View Post
    True Christians are never rude or accusatory. You have failed the test. Accept it.
    You falsely accused me, therefore you are not a true Christian.
    Quote Originally Posted by Squeaky View Post
    That explains why your an idiot.
    Quote Originally Posted by God's Truth View Post
    Father figure, Son figure, and Holy Spirit figure.
    Quote Originally Posted by God's Truth View Post
    You preach against me for preaching obedience to Christ for salvation.
    Col 2:9 (AKJV/PCE)
    (2:9) For in him dwelleth all the fulness of the Godhead bodily.

    1Tim 4:10 (AKJV/PCE)
    (4:10) For therefore we both labour and suffer reproach, because we trust in the living God, who is the Saviour of all men, specially of those that believe.

    Something that was SPOKEN OF since the world began CANNOT be the SAME thing as something KEPT SECRET since the world began.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Right Divider View Post
    You falsely accused me, therefore you are not a true Christian.
    I went back and reviewed my posts to you and there are none where I've accused you of anything. If I said something and you took it that way, YOU have the problem. Deal with it!

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