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Thread: Christ's Commandments

  1. #286
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    Quote Originally Posted by WeberHome View Post
    .
    1Tim 2:9-10 . . In like manner also, that women adorn themselves in modest apparel, with shamefacedness and sobriety; not with braided hair, or gold, or pearls, or costly array; but (which becomes women professing piety) with good works.

    The Greek word for "sobriety" is sophrosune (so-fros-oo'-nay) which means soundness of mind; viz: sane, composed, and self controlled. A woman in the throes of hysteria, passionate rage, misandry, door-slamming, or a hissy fit doesn't fit the definition.

    Some folk, obsessed with asceticism, use that verse to prove it's wrong for women to use cosmetics and dress themselves in current fashions. But the passage doesn't forbid that. What it forbids is a woman putting a higher priority on her appearance than her character.

    The old adage "You can't judge a book by its cover" applies here as well as in literature. I've met women with tattoos, studs in their tongues, multicolored hair, fishnet stockings, outrageous earrings, tight-fitting concert tee shirts, low-slung hip huggers, and black lipstick that were really peaches while I've met dignified, neatly dressed women with horrible personalities. They say a rose in any language is still a rose; yeah, well, a pig, no matter how it's dressed, is still a pig whether in belly shirts and flip-flops or haute couture.

    "An attractive woman who lacks discretion is like a gold ring in a pig's snout." (Prv 11:22, cf. 1Pet 3:1-6)

    The koiné Greek word for "shamefacedness" is "aidos" (ahee-doce') which means: bashfulness; which is just the opposite of insolence, impudence, and brazenness. Bashful people have a hard time looking people in the eye because they are so shy, non-confrontational, timid, self conscious, and non-assertive. What we're looking at here relates to one of The Lord's beatitudes.

    "Blessed are the poor in spirit: for theirs is the kingdom of heaven." (Matt 5:3)

    That's a very comforting beatitude because it confirms that difficult people are not permitted in the kingdom of heaven.
    _
    Please explain "difficult" as you meant it in the post quoted.

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  2. #287
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    Quote Originally Posted by popsthebuilder View Post
    Please explain "difficult" as you meant it in the post quoted.
    Quote Originally Posted by WeberHome View Post
    hysteria, passionate rage, misandry, door-slamming, hissy fit, insolence, impudence, assertive, confrontational, and brazenness.
    _

  3. #288
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    Post Re: Christ's Commandments

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    1Tim 2:11 . . Let a woman quietly receive instruction with entire submissiveness.

    The koiné Greek word for "submissiveness" is hupotage (hoop-ot-ag-ay') which basically refers to subordination.

    Hupotgage appears in a number of applications. In Matt 22:12 the word means tongue tied. In Mark 4:39 it means calm down. In 1Tim 5:18 it infers suppression. In 1Tim 2:15 it means to negate, i.e. render invalid and/or unworthy of consideration.

    During my 74 years on this planet; I've encountered quite a few women that enjoy debating with men; and especially pointing out men's faults and/or proving men wrong. I don't know why they're like that, I guess it's just a female thing. But Christ doesn't allow it.

    If 1Tim 2:11 is telling me anything at all it's that Christ doesn't want to see Christian women debating, quarrelling, or arguing with men in church; and that includes Sunday school discussions. In point of fact, according to 1Cor 14:35, women aren't even allowed to raise their hands and ask a question.

    Gender equality is a big issue out in the world; but God forbid it should become an issue in church because the personal feelings and/or opinions of Christ's believing followers are trumped by a final opinion higher than any on Earth.
    _

  4. #289
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    Post Re: Christ's Commandments

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    1Tim 2:12-15 . . I do not allow a woman to teach or exercise authority over a man, but to remain quiet. For it was Adam who was first created, and then Eve. And it was not Adam who was deceived, but the woman being quite deceived, fell into transgression.

    In the "my" church of Matt 16:18, male Christians are the gender designated to captain the ships; not the females. I pity a church supervised by female managers and pastors. Why? Because it tells me that Christ is not active in that church providing it with the tools the congregation needs in order to serve him faithfully, loyally, and effectively.

    The men in those kinds of churches need to lift up holy hands and pray that Christ send them males to oust the females; and if not, then the men should evacuate-- now! --while they can.
    _

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    Post Re: Christ's Commandments

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    1Tim 2:15 . . Women shall be preserved through the bearing of children if they continue in faith and love and sanctity with self-restraint.

    In other words, it isn't necessary for women to be pastors, deacons, and/or adult Sunday school teachers in order to serve Christ faithfully, loyally, and effectively. Homemaking is just as high a calling as any in church.

    Can a female church manager or a pastor; continue in faith, love, and sanctity with self-restraint? In point of fact, it is a non sequitur to say a female church manager or pastor continues in faith. If she did, she would be neither a church manager nor a pastor. This is precisely why God rejected Cain's offering. It was a perfectly good offering, and no doubt Cain had brought God the very same thing in the past, but God rejected it that time because that's the one time that Cain failed to offer it in faith. (Gen 4:7, Heb 11:4)
    _

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    Post Re: Christ's Commandments

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    1Tim 3:2a . . An overseer, then, must be above reproach

    The koiné Greek word for "overseer" is episkopos (ep-is'-kop-os) which means: a superintendent; viz: church officers.

    Pastors of modern churches aren't really pastors in the true Biblical sense; they're actually managers. A true pastor is essentially a shepherd; which is totally different (and somewhat rare too). In point of fact, pastors no longer supervise churches at all: boards run churches, and pastors are merely employees; viz: hirelings.

    To tell the truth, I'm afraid of today's career pastors; I don't trust them, and do my best to avoid them because I don't feel safe in their presence; which is very abnormal. If there's anybody on God's green earth that The Lord's sheep should be able to trust, it's their local shepherd, but far too many church managers today regard congregations as numbers and/or threats to their security.

    Why must pastors be above reproach? Because the work they do is a "good" work (1Tim 3:1) and much good can be ruined by even a little wickedness.

    "Dead insects will cause even a bottle of perfume to stink! Yes, an ounce of foolishness can outweigh a pound of wisdom and honor." (Ecc 10:1)

    Before the wonders of modern chemistry, perfumes were made (and many still are) from animal and vegetable sources. Those, being 100% organic in a time when chemical preservatives didn't exists, could spoil if the perfumer wasn't careful to keep his product protected from exposure to temperature, insects, dirt, moisture, and other contaminants. All the skills and patience and knowledge exercised in the making of expensive ointments could be completely annulled by simply forgetting to put the cap (or the cork; whatever) back on a jar.

    Anyway, Ecc 10:1 certainly rings true in this day and age as the Roman Catholic Church's credibility steadily erodes because of its ongoing pedophilia scandals and the hierarchy's deplorable cover-ups.
    _

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    Quote Originally Posted by WeberHome View Post
    .
    1Tim 3:2a . . An overseer, then, must be above reproach

    The koiné Greek word for "overseer" is episkopos (ep-is'-kop-os) which means: a superintendent; viz: church officers.

    Pastors of modern churches aren't really pastors in the true Biblical sense; they're actually managers. A true pastor is essentially a shepherd; which is totally different (and somewhat rare too). In point of fact, pastors no longer supervise churches at all: boards run churches, and pastors are merely employees; viz: hirelings.

    To tell the truth, I'm afraid of today's career pastors; I don't trust them, and do my best to avoid them because I don't feel safe in their presence; which is very abnormal. If there's anybody on God's green earth that The Lord's sheep should be able to trust, it's their local shepherd, but far too many church managers today regard congregations as numbers and/or threats to their security.

    Why must pastors be above reproach? Because the work they do is a "good" work (1Tim 3:1) and much good can be ruined by even a little wickedness.

    "Dead insects will cause even a bottle of perfume to stink! Yes, an ounce of foolishness can outweigh a pound of wisdom and honor." (Ecc 10:1)

    Before the wonders of modern chemistry, perfumes were made (and many still are) from animal and vegetable sources. Those, being 100% organic in a time when chemical preservatives didn't exists, could spoil if the perfumer wasn't careful to keep his product protected from exposure to temperature, insects, dirt, moisture, and other contaminants. All the skills and patience and knowledge exercised in the making of expensive ointments could be completely annulled by simply forgetting to put the cap (or the cork; whatever) back on a jar.

    Anyway, Ecc 10:1 certainly rings true in this day and age as the Roman Catholic Church's credibility steadily erodes because of its ongoing pedophilia scandals and the hierarchy's deplorable cover-ups.
    _
    Seems toe the pope is doing what he can to reconcile the Catholic Church....just my opinion.

    Pastors should be a shining light...you are right.

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  8. #293
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    Post Re: Christ's Commandments

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    1Tim 3:2b . . the husband of one wife

    That directive is a bit ambiguous. Some feel it says a pastor can have only one wife at a time; viz: not a polygamist; while others feel it says he can be married only once in his lifetime; viz: not a widower or a divorced man.

    I tend to think it means one wife at a time. If so; then this passage, and Titus 1:5-6 have the distinction of being the only places in the entire Bible prohibiting polygamy.

    However; the rule is very narrow. It specifically regulates the home life of church officers, so it would be wrong to use those passages to justify forcing monogamy upon the rank and file. But, if polygamy conflicts with the laws of one's State of residence, then of course the State has the final say in that regard. (cf. Rom 13:1-5)
    _

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    Quote Originally Posted by WeberHome View Post
    -
    John 14:21 . .Whoever has my commands and obeys them, he is the one who loves me.

    God's commands as per Exodus, Leviticus, Numbers, and Deuteronomy are covenanted commands, i.e. contractual. Christ's followers are not contracted with God to comply with those particular commands; and lucky them because Lev 26:3-38, Deut 27:15-26, and Deut 28:1-69 specify a large number of curses for non compliance.

    Deut 27:26 . . Cursed is the man who does not uphold the words of this law by carrying them out.

    Note the grammatical tense of that curse; it's present tense rather than future, indicating that the very moment a Jew breaks one of the covenanted commands he racks up a curse upon himself-- no delay and no waiting period; for example:

    Lev 19:11 . . You shall not deal falsely, nor lie to one another.

    Every time a Jew is dishonest, he accrues a curse; for each offense. Lets say a Jew is dishonest ten times in a week. Well according to the covenant, his ten counts of dishonesty accrue ten curses; and those curses are contractual, i.e. God is obligated by the covenant to fulfil them lest He himself fall into breach of contract. Obviously then, serial dishonesty is pretty serious for people contracted with God as per Exodus, Leviticus, Numbers, and Deuteronomy.

    Ergo: I do not recommend converting to Judaism lest one find themselves under a sword of Damocles hanging by a slender thread easily broken by just one lie.

    /

    What specific commands of Christ are you addressing ?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Faither View Post
    What specific commands of Christ are you addressing ?
    They begin at post #17
    _

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    Quote Originally Posted by WeberHome View Post
    .


    They begin at post #17
    _

    Just to clarify , are you addressing only statements Christ Himself made ?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Faither View Post
    are you addressing only statements Christ Himself made?

    Sort of.

    1Cor 14:37 . . If any man think himself to be a prophet, or spiritual, let him acknowledge that the things that I write unto you are the commandments of The Lord.

    1Thess 4:1-2 . .We beseech you, brethren, and exhort you by The Lord Jesus, that as ye have received of us how ye ought to walk and to please God, so ye would abound more and more. For ye know what commandments we gave you by The Lord Jesus.
    _

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    Quote Originally Posted by WeberHome View Post
    .



    Sort of.

    1Cor 14:37 . . If any man think himself to be a prophet, or spiritual, let him acknowledge that the things that I write unto you are the commandments of The Lord.

    1Thess 4:1-2 . .We beseech you, brethren, and exhort you by The Lord Jesus, that as ye have received of us how ye ought to walk and to please God, so ye would abound more and more. For ye know what commandments we gave you by The Lord Jesus.
    _

    Ok , got it .

    Sorry for all these questions , just laying some ground work to see where our understandings are .

    God's Word in general ? Do you understand God's Word to belong to anyone who claims it to be ? Or is there a precondition that needs to be met on your eyes ?

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    Post Re: Christ's Commandments

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    1Tim 3:2c . . temperate

    The koiné Greek word for "temperate" can be either nephaleos (nay-fal'-eh-os); or nephalios (nay-fal'-ee-os) and means: sober. This kind of sobriety has nothing to do with alcohol rather it relates to an even-keeled personality: not overly silly, not overly excitable and not overly serious: right in the middle; viz: well-balanced.

    1Tim 3:2d . . prudent

    The koiné word for "prudent" is sophron (so'-frone) which means: having a sound mind; viz: rational, reasonable, and sensible as opposed to emotional and reactive.

    1Tim 3:2e . . respectable

    The koiné Greek word for "respectable" is kosmios (kos'-mee-os) which means: orderly, viz: decorous.

    Webster's defines decorous as marked by propriety; viz: correct; and exhibiting good taste in conduct, language, or appearance. A decorous person is-- among other things --neat, tidy, well-mannered, well-groomed, and polite. They bathe often too.

    1Tim 3:2f . . hospitable

    The koiné word for "hospitable" is philoxenos (fil-ox'-en-os) which means: fond of guests. In other words, church officers shouldn't be a hermit types, or a friendless loners who prefers solitude. Not that there's anything wrong with hermits and loners; it's just that church officers are supposed to be shepherds, which requires them to associate with the sheep entrusted to their care. A man who doesn't mingle easily and comfortably really should consider another line of work.
    _

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    Post Re: Christ's Commandments

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    1Tim 3:2g . . apt to teach

    "apt to teach" is from the Greek word didaktikos (did-ak-tik-os') which means: instructive ("didactic")

    That word is tricky. It's sometimes translated "able to teach". That's okay I guess, but i suspect didaktikos actually refers to role models, i.e. people whose manner of life exemplifies Christianity.
    _

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