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Thread: What if climate change is real and human caused--what should Christians do about it?

  1. #31
    Over 1500 post club Derf's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Stripe View Post
    I'd rather deal with issues without the "if."
    Then you would be dealing in another thread.


    That's more like it. :like:

    That's the funny thing about liberals: Their ideas are nonsense, but they give them names that could apply to real things.

    The global flood could indeed be referred to as catastrophic, anthropogenic climate change, and what is to come could have the same description.

    However, the science behind those things and our response to them would not include banning plastic bags and saving polar bears.
    Why not? I'm not asking because I disagree (I might or might not). Why does the answer not involve plastic bags and polar bears?

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    Quote Originally Posted by WatchmanOnTheWall View Post
    The climate has always been changing and will continue too till Jesus comes in 2029 so with tribulation beginning in 2022 we have bigger things to concern ourselves with. Most of us here will be dead within the next 10 years.
    And your point is??? Do you think that it is pointless to attempt anything because of the impending end of the world and death of everybody except 144,000?

    Don't you realize, that if you are one of the 144,000 that survive the tribulation, you will be cleaning up the mess left by the 7 or 8 billion that perished?

    And you only have 1000 years to do it!

  3. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by kmoney View Post
    We should be doing what we can in our personal lives to live as good stewards and as it relates to public policy we should support policies that will make the biggest impacts. Obviously the difficulty is in the details. As you say in a later post there will be trade-offs. Those who can best manage the changes should bear the most burden. It's tough to put this into a hypothetical.
    I agree! It's tough to put it into a hypothetical, but if we wait until it isn't hypothetical any longer, it may be hard to correct without much loss of life--which is not a biblical idea unless we as Christians are volunteering to lose our lives for others, right?

    To be frank, I am very skeptical of the proposed ideas (which are also mostly dealing with the hypothetical), and the reasoning behind them (which do NOT take into account the resilience I believe God designed into the earth and the heavens). But that doesn't mean they are all wrong, nor the science behind the scare, either.

  4. #34
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Berean View Post
    I'm not suggesting anything. I'm simply stating the facts as I understand them. The world currently has over 7 billion people. According to some population projections by 2100 the world's population could hit 11 billion. How would we provide the same standard of living with better, more natural materials? Everything we create originally comes from the Earth. Iron ore, oil, trees, water, precious metals, gemstones, food all come from the Earth. We make finished products from these natural resources. It doesn't matter if we try to use natural materials to improve everyone's standard of living because there will always be scarcity. If the population hit 11 billion where is all that food and water going to come from to feed all those people? I can foresee water wars and wars over farm land being fought. Shoot, people are starting to steal sand to make concrete today.

    https://science.howstuffworks.com/en...ng-tons-it.htm

    So it's simply not possible to give every human on Earth a high living standard. So the current system in place where the very few wealthy nations hording and controlling all the natural resources will continue.
    But as Christians, we have an inside track with the designer of the earth. If He intended for it to handle 11 billion people, don't you think He would have designed it to handle 11 billion people? Or if not, perhaps He would have designed it not to reach 11 billion people.

    Let's assume the former for the sake of discussion, and see what kinds of things are possible. Are there tips in His word on how to water, feed, clothe, house, and sewage for 11 billion?

    You call yourself "The Berean". Let's see some of that searching of scripture you are supposed to be known for!

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    Quote Originally Posted by Derf View Post
    Why does the answer not involve plastic bags and polar bears?
    Because those things represent the liberal answer: Regulations.
    Where is the evidence for a global flood?
    E≈mc2
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    Quote Originally Posted by Stripe View Post
    Because those things represent the liberal answer: Regulations.
    I'm personally having a major environmental disaster in my kitchen. I use those plastic grocery bags for trash cans and other things, so I don't like to throw them away before I use them again. But they pile up much faster than I can use them, so they are overflowing.

    I did hear a great re-use idea for them. You can melt them with a solder gun to repair other plastic things. i did it with one of my kids' sleds last spring, and we'll soon see if it worked.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Derf View Post
    But as Christians, we have an inside track with the designer of the earth. If He intended for it to handle 11 billion people, don't you think He would have designed it to handle 11 billion people? Or if not, perhaps He would have designed it not to reach 11 billion people.
    Well we don't know if God intended for the Earth to have 11 billion people.
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Berean View Post
    Well we don't know if God intended for the Earth to have 11 billion people.
    Then the 2 possible results are 1. That it will work as designed, and the population won't reach 11B, or 2. God's design is flawed.

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    Last edited by Derf; November 30th, 2017 at 02:57 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Derf View Post
    If the bible gives wisdom for all occasions, then it should be able to handle this:

    Let's say, for argument's sake, that Global Climate change is a fact, and that it is caused by humans.

    What then should we as Christians do about it? I'll suggest up front that while some of the secular proposals are feasible, and some not so much, there are consequences that also demand biblical consideration.

    Here's a for-instance:
    Let's say that one of the problems causing warming is cooking/warming fires (this can be applied to more or less modern cooking and heating devices), and the carbon dioxide and pollution both create conditions that contribute in some way to the warming, but they are necessary for people to survive, supposedly. Thus, if we outlaw or severely limit such fires, we run the risk of starving some people, or exposing them to cold, or causing them to to have to drink unsanitary water, or whatever. On the other hand, if we do nothing, some people are likely to lose their homes or their lives because of the effects of global warming/climate change. Thus we face the problem of not loving our neighbor in either case.

    Consider the following from a biblical standpoint (and there are likely other things that will need to be added to this list as we go forward):
    • God gave man dominion over His creation.
    • God made man in His image (unlike any other animal or plant).
    • Loving God entails love for His creation.
    • Loving God entails love especially for those made in His image.
    • Science is important and necessary, but isn't always right, as man is fallible.
    • Biblical interpretation is important and necessary, but it also isn't always right, as man is fallible.


    What should we be doing????


    Spoiler
    In case someone wants to know, even though it probably doesn't matter for this hypothetical approach, I think there is definitely a warming trend, but I don't know whether it is human-caused or not, and I don't know if it's a bad thing or not. Participants of the thread should feel free to explore the different sides.
    Search youtube for global cooling, or freezing, now beginning.

    LA
    My theology is that the elect of Israel became the scattered church among the nations, and when filled up with the full number of gentiles who believe to become one with them, then Christ will return and gather them, and God will then pour out His wrath on the unbelievers of both Jew and Gentile.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Derf View Post
    Then the 2 possible results are 1. That it will work as designed, and the population won't reach 11B, or God's design is flawed.

    Sent from my Z992 using TheologyOnline mobile app
    There is a third choice.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jonahdog View Post
    There is a third choice.
    Not in this thread.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Lazy afternoon View Post
    Search youtube for global cooling, or freezing, now beginning.

    LA
    Please explain how that should affect what we decide to do, LA.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Derf View Post
    And your point is??? Do you think that it is pointless to attempt anything because of the impending end of the world and death of everybody except 144,000?

    Don't you realize, that if you are one of the 144,000 that survive the tribulation, you will be cleaning up the mess left by the 7 or 8 billion that perished?

    And you only have 1000 years to do it!
    Ahhr but Jesus can do anything and will supernaturally restore the Earth. Just think about the miracles of calming the storm, creating food, healing people, etc. It will be simple to restore the atmosphere to whatever it 'should' be.

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    Lazy afternoon (November 30th, 2017)

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    Quote Originally Posted by Derf View Post
    Please explain how that should affect what we decide to do, LA.

    Sent from my Z992 using TheologyOnline mobile app
    Move to warmer areas not to cooler areas.

    LA
    My theology is that the elect of Israel became the scattered church among the nations, and when filled up with the full number of gentiles who believe to become one with them, then Christ will return and gather them, and God will then pour out His wrath on the unbelievers of both Jew and Gentile.

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    What's wrong with 11 billion people?

    Sent from my SM-A520F using TOL mobile app
    Where is the evidence for a global flood?
    E≈mc2
    When the world is a monster
    Bad to swallow you whole
    Kick the clay that holds the teeth in
    Throw your trolls out the door

    "The waters under the 'expanse' were under the crust."
    -Bob B.

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