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Thread: Scripture. What is considered Scripture?

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    Quote Originally Posted by glorydaz View Post
    If there's one thing we've learned from this thread.....no one can give a correct answer to any of the texts this Sonnet has presented. He refuses to hear anything but his own doubting, unbelieving mind, and he is out to besmirch God's Holy enduring Word. They've been trying to do this very thing from the beginning. But, the Bible just keeps on leading men to the Lord...just as He intended it would.
    You won’t present an answer.

    So you have no correct answer because you have no answer at all.

    Specifically:
    1) Did Jairus initially ask Jesus to heal a sick girl or to raise a dead girl?
    2) Did Jairus learn his daughter was dead before Jesus started to his house or afterwards?


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    Quote Originally Posted by glorydaz View Post
    The Gospel of the Circumcision was for the Jews, who looked for a King to sit on David's Throne here on earth. But they crucified Him when He came.

    Paul's Gospel was the Gospel of Salvation through which the Gentiles (and anyone) could be saved unto eternal life.

    Paul was sent to preach the Gospel of Grace....that is the ONE Gospel that saves.

    Perhaps you should read the entire chapter of Galatians.
    OK great, now we are getting at least an attempt at an answer and I give you 4/10 for that, just to not hurt your feelings, and because everyone is a winner.

    No, having read Galatians, the "other gospel" was that one has to be circumcised if one wanted to be a Christian.

    See Gal 5:1-3 Gal 6:12-16

    But at least your answer had substance and was not a stonewall.
    Stop the culling of Cape Town's baboons!

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    Quote Originally Posted by iouae View Post
    I said that God could have made us spirit bodies without the need for Christ to die, as God did with the angels.

    Glorydaz insisted otherwise.

    And to date she still cannot or will not explain. Either way, its the same. She has no answer, so that leaves her with one option - stonewall.

    Likewise, she still cannot or will not tell us what the gospel in Gal 1:9 is. Either way, its the same. She has no answer, so that leaves her with one option - stonewall.
    I answered both, but you didn't like my answer. Why am I not surprised?



    The fact that you accuse God of sending His Son to die on the Cross when He didn't have to is blasphemy. Clearly, you don't believe that God is Righteous. That's on you, not me.

    Had God wanted more spirit beings (like angels), they would still be merely angels. Is there some reason you don't understand that man, alone, was created in God's image? That man, alone, is a relational being? Perhaps you should study up on this "minor detail" before you go accusing me of not responding to your stupid "hypothesis". God did not ever intend for man to have the nature of angels and all that entails. They weren't created with bodies at all. They are merely spirit beings from start to end.

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    Quote Originally Posted by iouae View Post
    OK great, now we are getting at least an attempt at an answer and I give you 4/10 for that, just to not hurt your feelings, and because everyone is a winner.

    No, having read Galatians, the "other gospel" was that one has to be circumcised if one wanted to be a Christian.

    See Gal 5:1-3 Gal 6:12-16

    But at least your answer had substance and was not a stonewall.
    You're wrong. I'm glad you made your error so clear.

    If what you claim is true, then being circumcised would be the good news for the Jews. It wasn't.


    Matthew 4:23 And Jesus went about all Galilee, teaching in their synagogues, and preaching the gospel of the kingdom, and healing all manner of sickness and all manner of disease among the people.

    This Gospel of the Kingdom was no longer a valid Gospel because the Jews had crucified the Lord of Glory when He came. Thus, "Repent and be baptised" was no longer valid, either, under Paul's Gospel of Grace.

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    Quote Originally Posted by 2003cobra View Post
    You won’t present an answer.

    So you have no correct answer because you have no answer at all.

    Specifically:
    1) Did Jairus initially ask Jesus to heal a sick girl or to raise a dead girl?
    2) Did Jairus learn his daughter was dead before Jesus started to his house or afterwards?

    Did Jesus die for the sins of all men or not?

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    Quote Originally Posted by glorydaz View Post
    I answered both, but you didn't like my answer. Why am I not surprised?



    The fact that you accuse God of sending His Son to die on the Cross when He didn't have to is blasphemy. Clearly, you don't believe that God is Righteous. That's on you, not me.

    Had God wanted more spirit beings (like angels), they would still be merely angels. Is there some reason you don't understand that man, alone, was created in God's image? That man, alone, is a relational being? Perhaps you should study up on this "minor detail" before you go accusing me of not responding to your stupid "hypothesis". God did not ever intend for man to have the nature of angels and all that entails. They weren't created with bodies at all. They are merely spirit beings from start to end.
    Well great again. Two adults having an intelligent conversation.

    On your last point, you are wrong in saying angels do not have a body, because they do.

    Every time we are shown spirit beings/angels in heaven, they have bodies.

    Then you wrote
    The fact that you accuse God of sending His Son to die on the Cross when He didn't have to is blasphemy. Clearly, you don't believe that God is Righteous. That's on you, not me.
    "Blasphemy" seems to be a favoured word around here. Almost every time it is used it makes the user a "LIAR".

    If Christ had come to earth, preached for 3.5 years and risen into heaven from the Mt. of Olives as he did finally, I would have worshipped Christ and God, and become a Christian to get eternal life.

    So you are utterly wrong.

    But God has "good" ways. The way I described without Christ dying would have been "good".
    But having Christ die was a "better" way. We see how invested God is in this project. When folks like Clete ask me if God could just be fooling us, Christ's sacrifice is too big a price to pay for God to be having a practical joke on us. And we appreciate Christ all the more, and feel this makes Him MORE worthy of our worship.

    And Christ dying means that He is not asking us to do anything that He has not done, including give our lives for Him.

    So God has "good" ways and "better" ways. The better ways often fall into the "severity" of God.

    Rom 11:22
    Behold therefore the goodness and severity of God:

    But stop calling everyone with a different point of view to yours a "blasphemer". It's so childish.
    Stop the culling of Cape Town's baboons!

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    Quote Originally Posted by glorydaz View Post
    You're wrong. I'm glad you made your error so clear.

    If what you claim is true, then being circumcised would be the good news for the Jews. It wasn't.


    Matthew 4:23 And Jesus went about all Galilee, teaching in their synagogues, and preaching the gospel of the kingdom, and healing all manner of sickness and all manner of disease among the people.

    This Gospel of the Kingdom was no longer a valid Gospel because the Jews had crucified the Lord of Glory when He came. Thus, "Repent and be baptised" was no longer valid, either, under Paul's Gospel of Grace.
    No, I am glad you made your error so clear. Or maybe you misread me.

    The whole reason Paul was going "ape" in Gal 1:9 was because after he left Galatia, some Jewish Pharisee Christian converts came from Jerusalem and were insisting that the Gentile converts to Christianity had to be circumcised.

    THAT is the reason Paul wrote Galatians. This is summarised in Gal 5:1-3 and Gal 6:12-16. Period.
    Stop the culling of Cape Town's baboons!

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    Quote Originally Posted by glorydaz View Post
    Did Jesus die for the sins of all men or not?
    You answer first.

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    Quote Originally Posted by 2003cobra View Post
    You answer first.
    Scared, aren't you?

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    Quote Originally Posted by glorydaz View Post
    .
    So Glorydaz if somebody comes along and says that Christians have to be circumcised, that is another gospel.

    That is the time to go ape.
    Stop the culling of Cape Town's baboons!

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    Quote Originally Posted by iouae View Post
    Paul was saying that a false gospel is not a gospel because "gospel" means "good news" and what the false "gospel" was bringing was not good news.
    I agree.
    My New Years Resolution: 1 Peter 3:15
    Omniscient without man's qualification. John 1:3 "Nothing"
    Colossians 1:17 "Nothing" John 15:5 "Nothing"
    Mighty, ALL mighty (omnipotent). Revelation 1:8
    No possible limitation Isaiah 40:25 Joshua 24:15
    Infinite (Omnipresent) Psalm 145:3 Hebrews 4:13

    Is Calvinism okay? Yep

    Now to Him who is able to do exceeding abundantly above all that we ask or think... Amen. -Ephesians 3:20 & 21

    1Co 13:11 ... when I became an adult, I set aside childish ways. Titus 3:10 Ephesians 4:29-32; 5:11

    Separation of church and State is not atheism "We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights..."

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    Quote Originally Posted by 2003cobra View Post
    Once again you are wrong. I listed “a” valid answer, not the only valid answer.

    Again, you are evading the question.
    Says the guy who thinks God can make a rock He cannot pick up (by analogy).

    Again, "you" don't get to make up the rules.


    Quote Originally Posted by 2003cobra View Post
    More evasion.
    More 'my way!'

    Quote Originally Posted by 2003cobra View Post
    You will not answer a simple question about what the Bible says. Why?
    "Because" the answer to "can God pick up a rock He cannot pick up is" "This is not an intelligent logical question."
    (that's nicer than 'you are thick!' I'm working on it)

    Quote Originally Posted by 2003cobra View Post
    Is it because you shut your eyes to errors in the text
    TRY not to answer for me or anybody else. Answering for me does NOT encourage me to post in this thread.
    Remember me saying 'game over?' There is a reason for that. I have no desire to dialogue when you are trying to make all the rules and nobody gets to say anything.

    Quote Originally Posted by 2003cobra View Post
    and mislead others by telling them that they aren’t supposed to look closely enough at the Bible to see errors?
    Your hang up and false accusation. I'm misleading nobody. It is the truth. Deuteronomy 6 is pretty clear.


    Quote Originally Posted by 2003cobra View Post
    Why not just adopt the Roman Catholic approach ubiquitous in the time of Martin Luther: only seminary graduates should read the Bible and others should just fall in line with what the educated say?
    Kind of what you are doing here. Would you RATHER follow someone who really tried or someone who didn't bother? IOW, would you rather follow a Berean or a Corinthian in the first century?
    Quote Originally Posted by 2003cobra View Post
    Again I ask:

    Specifically:
    1) Did Jairus initially ask Jesus to heal a sick girl or to raise a dead girl?
    2) Did Jairus learn his daughter was dead before Jesus started to his house or afterwards?

    I'm not getting into you 'my ball, my rules' game. You don't 'get' to make the rules. All those playing get to decide or leave you all by yourself and go play someplace else.
    My New Years Resolution: 1 Peter 3:15
    Omniscient without man's qualification. John 1:3 "Nothing"
    Colossians 1:17 "Nothing" John 15:5 "Nothing"
    Mighty, ALL mighty (omnipotent). Revelation 1:8
    No possible limitation Isaiah 40:25 Joshua 24:15
    Infinite (Omnipresent) Psalm 145:3 Hebrews 4:13

    Is Calvinism okay? Yep

    Now to Him who is able to do exceeding abundantly above all that we ask or think... Amen. -Ephesians 3:20 & 21

    1Co 13:11 ... when I became an adult, I set aside childish ways. Titus 3:10 Ephesians 4:29-32; 5:11

    Separation of church and State is not atheism "We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights..."

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  19. #2233
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    Quote Originally Posted by iouae View Post
    No, I am glad you made your error so clear. Or maybe you misread me.

    The whole reason Paul was going "ape" in Gal 1:9 was because after he left Galatia, some Jewish Pharisee Christian converts came from Jerusalem and were insisting that the Gentile converts to Christianity had to be circumcised.

    THAT is the reason Paul wrote Galatians. This is summarised in Gal 5:1-3 and Gal 6:12-16. Period.
    No, that is not the reason Paul wrote Galatians. That was merely a side issue. Not the reason for writing Galatians and having nothing to do with the Gospel Paul preached.

    Paul makes it clear that his Gospel was not that preached by the Apostles or our Lord when He walked the earth. It was given Him by revelation of the Risen and Ascended Lord.

    Gal. 1:11-12 But I certify you, brethren, that the gospel which was preached of me is not after man. 12 For I neither received it of man, neither was I taught it, but by the revelation of Jesus Christ.

    Paul wrote Galatians to explain the difference between the Law and Grace, as he did all his letters.

    Gal. 2:2 And I went up by revelation, and communicated unto them that gospel which I preach among the Gentiles, but privately to them which were of reputation, lest by any means I should run, or had run, in vain.

    And this is the purpose of Galatians....that the law was merely a schoolmaster to lead us to faith in Christ. Justification by faith...not by works (circumcision or any other kind of work or self effort).

    Gal. 2:16 Knowing that a man is not justified by the works of the law, but by the faith of Jesus Christ, even we have believed in Jesus Christ, that we might be justified by the faith of Christ, and not by the works of the law: for by the works of the law shall no flesh be justified.

    Therefore, any who preach a false gospel, that has man earning his salvation by his own obedience or effort (of any kind), is to be accursed. Not only circumcision, or special days, or obedience to commandments, or sacrificing time or money, or unclean foods, or rites and rituals....none of it will save. The freewoman vs. the bondwoman....

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  21. #2234
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    Quote Originally Posted by iouae View Post
    So Glorydaz if somebody comes along and says that Christians have to be circumcised, that is another gospel.

    That is the time to go ape.
    You sound like God's UNtruth. She claims when Paul writes "not of yourselves", and "not of works", he is only talking about circumcision and various washings etc. That way, she is freed to preach her false gospel of obedience to earn her salvation and to stay saved.

    But that's a lie, and needs to be denounced. Paul is saying those who preach any other Gospel than his is to be ACCURSED. I take that seriously, as all believers should.

    Eph. 2:8-9 For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God: 9 Not of works, lest any man should boast.

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    Quote Originally Posted by glorydaz View Post
    God forbid, as Paul would say, I'm telling you the law he (HE WHO?) preached when He (HE WHO?) walked among us does not give life.
    He who? Jesus? The words Jesus preached when He walked among us does not give life? gldz I am astonished that so many of your doctrinal assertions are just in blatant opposition what Jesus actually said. The very words of Christ contradict you.

    Jesus words give life:
    Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that heareth my word, and believeth on him that sent me, hath everlasting life, and shall not come into condemnation; but is passed from death unto life.
    (Joh 5:24 KJV)

    Jesus words give life:
    It is the spirit that quickeneth; the flesh profiteth nothing: the words that I speak unto you, they are spirit, and they are life.
    (Joh 6:63 KJV)

    The scriptures I've been quoting are the words of Jesus who himself said they gave life. And furthermore commanded you to do these things.

    If ye love me, keep my commandments. (Joh 14:15 KJV)

    Jesus teachings are not law, Moses gave the law. Jesus teachings are spirit and truth which bring life.

    Quote Originally Posted by glorydaz View Post
    Galatians 3:21 Is the law then against the promises of God? God forbid: for if there had been a law given which could have given life, verily righteousness should have been by the law.

    What He did was preach what leads to LIFE, and that IS the purpose of the Law, and it's WHY He preached it. Do you think you can keep it? If so, you have not yet understood the purpose of what the Lord was saying in those verses you quote.
    Is there guile in Jesus? To mislead those who hear his words? For he said If ye love me, keep my commandments. Of course we can keep his commandments, and we do so with the help of the Holy Spirit. Otherwise Jesus was a very sick puppy to command people to do things he knew they couldn't.

    Quote Originally Posted by glorydaz View Post
    Rather than look to what you must do to have life with your own obedience or commandment keeping, you need to look to what the Risen and Ascended Lord revealed to Paul.
    And once again you have taken the teachings of Jesus and discarded them into the trash making Paul your new Messiah. Are you a dispensationalist like those who say that Jesus revealed to Paul that nothing Jesus spoke on earth had worth or value?

    Do you think that the sermon on the mount was God playing mind games?

    I have heard of people taking the very words of the Son of God, slapping the label of LAW upon them and then flushing them down the same toilet along with the LAW of Moses to preach a Paul is Messiah gospel. But you may be the first to do such so blatantly and so radically adopting this doctrine stating that Jesus words were worthless, being some kind of Jesaic Law.

    Zenn




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