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Thread: Christ name is

  1. #16
    LIFETIME MEMBER jamie's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by CherubRam View Post
    The English language often borrows from other languages.
    Is the word "Jesus" borrowed from another language?

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    Quote Originally Posted by jamie View Post
    Is the word "Jesus" borrowed from another language?

    No it is not.

    Jesus: The English form "Jesus" was not seen nor spoken until after the year 1525,
    when Sir William Tyndale a Protestant Reformer from Oxford, England --- invented it!

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    Yah

    Yah (Hebrew: יהּ‎‎ Yah) is a short form of Yahwah (in consonantal spelling YHWH Hebrew: יהוה‎‎, called the Tetragrammaton), the proper name of God in the Hebrew Bible. This short form of the name occurs 50 times in the text of the Hebrew Bible, of which 24 form part of the phrase "Halleluyah".

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    Yahshua bible history

    Brown-Driver-Briggs
    יְהוֺשׁוּעַ, יְהוֺשֻׁעַ and (later) יֵשׁוּעַ,
    proper name, masculine (& location, see
    9 below) (׳י is salvation, or ׳י is opulence, compare אֱלִישָׁע, אֱלִישׁוּעַ, אֲבִישׁוּעַ & NesSK 1892, 573 f.; in any case it came to be associated with ישׁע, compare Matthew 1:21; on יֵשׁוּעַ see especially FräVOJ iv. 1890, 332 f. MüllSK 1892, 177 f. who cite analogue for change of וֹ to later ֵ֯, & Nesl.c.) —
    1 Moses' successor, son of Nun, (ᵐ5 Ἰησοῦς) יְהוֺשׁוּעַ Deuteronomy 3:21; Judges 2:7; = יְהוֺשֻׁעַ Exodus 17:9,10,13,14; Exodus 24:13; Exodus 32:17; Exodus 33:11; Numbers 11:28; Numbers 13:16; Numbers 14:6,30,38; Numbers 26:65; Numbers 27:18,22; Numbers 32:12,28; Numbers 34:17; Deuteronomy 1:38; Deuteronomy 3:28; Deuteronomy 31:3,7,14 (twice in verse); Deuteronomy 31:23; Deuteronomy 34:9; Joshua 1:1 167t. Joshua; Judges 1:1; Judges 2:6,7,8,21,23; 1 Kings 16:34; 1 Chronicles 7:27; = יֵשׁוּעַ Nehemiah 8:17 (ᵐ5 Ἰησοῦς); according to P, name changed by Moses from הוֺשֵׁעַ q. v. Numbers 13:8,16 (ᵐ5 Αὑση) Deuteronomy 32:44 (ᵐ5 Ἰησοῦς).
    2 יְהוֺשֻׁעַ a Bethshemite 1 Samuel 6:14,18 (ᵐ5 'Wshe, A Ἰησοῦς, ᵐ5L Ἰωσηε).
    3 high priest after the restoration, son of Jehozadak יְהוֺשֻׁעַ (ᵐ5 Ἰησοῦς) Haggai 1:1,12,14; Haggai 2:2,4; Zechariah 3:1,3,6,8,9; Zechariah 6:11; = יְשׁוּעַ (ᵐ5 Ἰησοῦς) Ezra 2:2; Ezra 3:2,8; Ezra 4:3; Ezra 5:2; Ezra 10:18; Nehemiah 7:7; Nehemiah 12:1,7,10,26.
    4 יְהוֺשֻׁעַ governor of Jerusalem under Josiah 2 Kings 23:8 (ᵐ5 Ἰησοῦς, ᵐ5L Ἰωσηε).
    5 יֵשׁוּעַ (ᵐ5 Ἰησοῦς). head of one of the classes of priests 1 Chronicles 24:11, possibly also Ezra 2:36 = Nehemiah 7:39.
    6 יֵשׁוּעַ (ᵐ5 Ἰησοῦς etc.), a Levitical family-name of frequent occurrence:
    a.Ezra 2:40; Ezra 3:9 = Nehemiah 7:43; Nehemiah 8:7; Nehemiah 9:4,5; Nehemiah 10:10; Nehemiah 12:8.
    b.2Chronicles 31:15; Ezra 8:33; Nehemiah 12:24.
    7 יֵשׁוּעַ (ᵐ5 id.), father of a builder at the wall Nehemiah 3:19, perhaps =
    8 a Judaite family-name (ᵐ5 id.), Ezra 2:6 = Nehemiah 7:11 (compare SmListen 12).
    9. proper name, of a locationin south of JudahNehemiah 11:26 בְּיֵשׁוּעַ (ᵐ5 ἐν Ἰησού, ᵐ5L ἐν Σουα).
    יְהוֺשֻׁעַ, יֵשׁוּעַ proper name.

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    It is believed by some that the letter J was introduced to keep people from pronouncing God's name in theophoric names.

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    Quote Originally Posted by jamie View Post
    Are you saying the Jews were right to refer to God as Adonai so they wouldn't misuse his name?

    How brilliant they were, what a great idea.

    So if I avoid the use of yah I'll never profane his name, right?
    Nope. Not at all. In fact jews were wrong idolatrous (false worship) to not pronounce or write His name whenever appropriate.

    Writing His name on a perishable paper is no offense or taking it in vain. Taking His name in vain is literally carrying it written in stone from Sinai to Jerusalem and still living NOT in accordance to His Will, after Him His way...bringing worship and honor and glory for all He did/does for His people...that is taking His name in vain...or having it for naught

    Avoid using Yah and you'll struggle saying HalleluYah or IsaiYah, or JeremiYah or EliYah etc.

    Or saying the name of His Son...

    The Septuagint translaters too may have followed with some agenda to make scripture more palatable for non jewish readers.

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    Quote Originally Posted by TrevorL View Post
    Greetings clefty, When Paul wrote to the Galatians and the Ephesians in Greek in the following verses, is there any evidence or suggestion that he used a different word for Jesus?
    Galatians 1:1-3 (KJV): 1 Paul, an apostle, (not of men, neither by man, but by Jesus Christ, and God the Father, who raised him from the dead; 2 And all the brethren which are with me, unto the churches of Galatia: 3 Grace be to you and peace from God the Father, and from our Lord Jesus Christ,
    Ephesians 1:1-3 (KJV): 1 Paul, an apostle of Jesus Christ by the will of God, to the saints which are at Ephesus, and to the faithful in Christ Jesus: 2 Grace be to you, and peace, from God our Father, and from the Lord Jesus Christ. 3 Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, who hath blessed us with all spiritual blessings in heavenly places in Christ:


    Kind regards
    Trevor
    Yes there is evidence Paul used a different word for Jesus. Jesus is an English word and he wrote in greek which was later translated into latin and finally also English.

    If I was writing in czech I would not call my czech brother-in-law John but Honza. Writing in English I might write the name John but won't as I want people to remember he is czech and John is not his name but Honza.

    Paul was a jew and known as a jew but wrote in greek to other jews who spoke greek about another jew. Writing His name to these readers it was understood He was still a jew. And they would know what His given name was and its cultural context.

    But I still run into christians that forget He was a jew and that He kept Torah and its Sabbaths, festivals, and kosher laws. As did Peter and Paul...and all of them asked us to do the same and watch out for false teachers and wolves in sheep clothing which would teach otherwise....

    Understandably as for centuries selling to Europeans a superstitious Semitic desert god would be difficult indeed. (Oh and jews didnt want Europeans to embrace the OT Torah and claim for themselves its protections against usury and provision for debt forgiveness. No sirreee...they did not want to see Europeans as family...or as He taught in Him there is neither Jew nor Gentile)

    Best pitch Him as a blond blue eyed greek speaking white dude...you gotta know your market. Keep the racket going.

  8. #23
    Over 4000 post club CherubRam's Avatar
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    Yahwah forms

    In an effort to keep people from speaking the name of God, the true pronunciation of the Tetragrammaton was hidden by the Masoretes, when they added vowel points to the text. There are seven different ways they vowel pointed the Tetragrammaton to achieve their goal.

    יְהוָֹה - Y'howah (ē - ĕ - hō - wä), example found in Genesis 3:14

    יְהוָה - Y'hwah (ē - ĕ - wä), example found in Genesis 2:4

    יֱהוִֹה - Yehowih (ē - ĕ - hō - wĭ), example found in Judges 16:28

    יֱהוִה - Yehwih (ē - ĕ - wĭ), example found in Genesis 15:2

    יְהוִֹה - Y'howih (ē - ĕ - hō - wĭ), example found in 1 Kings 2:26

    יְהוִה - Y'hwih (ē - ĕ - wĭ), example found in Ezekiel 24:24

    יֲהוָה - Yahwah (ē - ă - wä), example found in Psalm 144:15


    The variation "Yahweh" is not one of the seven.
    Last edited by CherubRam; September 23rd, 2017 at 10:27 PM.

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    The bottom line is this, the Rabbi's arbitrarily changed the Hebrew language so the people of the world would not know God's name.

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    Greetings again clefty,
    Quote Originally Posted by clefty View Post
    Yes there is evidence Paul used a different word for Jesus. Jesus is an English word and he wrote in greek which was later translated into latin and finally also English.
    Yes I agree Paul did not write in English. Perhaps I was not altogether clear. The Greek that we now have for “Jesus” in Galatians 1:1-3, Ephesians 1:1-3 is different than the English, but our Jesus is based on the Greek, rather than the Hebrew. What I am asking is concerning what is claimed in this thread, that we should use the English Yahshuah (or something similar) which is an attempt at, or equivalent to the Hebrew rather than the English Jesus which is an attempt at, or equivalent to the Greek.

    Kind regards
    Trevor

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    Yahshuah or Yahshua is fine. We should keep his real name out of respect.

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    Quote Originally Posted by TrevorL View Post
    Greetings again clefty, Yes I agree Paul did not write in English. Perhaps I was not altogether clear. The Greek that we now have for “Jesus” in Galatians 1:1-3, Ephesians 1:1-3 is different than the English, but our Jesus is based on the Greek, rather than the Hebrew. What I am asking is concerning what is claimed in this thread, that we should use the English Yahshuah (or something similar) which is an attempt at, or equivalent to the Hebrew rather than the English Jesus which is an attempt at, or equivalent to the Greek.

    Kind regards
    Trevor
    I try not to frustrate the gospel with language barriers. He will always be Jesus Christ to me.
    1 Corinthians 15:1-2 KJV - 1 Corinthians 15:3-4 KJV -


    Colossians 1:13-14 KJV - Colossians 1:15-16 KJV - Colossians 1:17-18 KJV -

    Colossians 1:19-20 KJV - Colossians 1:21-22 KJV - Colossians 1:23 KJV -

    Colossians 1:25-26 KJV 27, 28, 29 - Ephesians 1:7 KJV - Ephesians 1:12-13, 14 -



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    Greetings again CherubRam,
    Quote Originally Posted by CherubRam View Post
    Yahshuah or Yahshua is fine. We should keep his real name out of respect.
    Do we have any evidence that when Paul wrote in Greek to the Galatians or Ephesians that he used Yahshuah or Yahshua?

    Kind regards
    Trevor

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    Quote Originally Posted by TrevorL View Post
    Greetings again clefty, Yes I agree Paul did not write in English. Perhaps I was not altogether clear. The Greek that we now have for “Jesus” in Galatians 1:1-3, Ephesians 1:1-3 is different than the English, but our Jesus is based on the Greek, rather than the Hebrew. What I am asking is concerning what is claimed in this thread, that we should use the English Yahshuah (or something similar) which is an attempt at, or equivalent to the Hebrew rather than the English Jesus which is an attempt at, or equivalent to the Greek.

    Kind regards
    Trevor
    Yes I believe we should. For reasons already given. Namely the direct link to His Father's name Yah.

    Names matter and have meaning.

    https://youtu.be/iU5KxXTxOws

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    Quote Originally Posted by patrick jane View Post
    I try not to frustrate the gospel with language barriers. He will always be Jesus Christ to me.
    How is making the gospel more clear precise and accurate frustrating it?

    Thankfully there were others willing to be frustrated to get the gospel from greek and latin and hebrew into your language.

    And HalleluYah that even more were willing to be frustrated, killed even, to restore Him/His way from what the Church and its man made traditions would have us do.

    "...Choose ye this day whom ye would serve..."...Joshua 24:15 not irony that Yahushua asks of us the same...

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