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Thread: The Rebellion that Desolates

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    Quote Originally Posted by Interplanner View Post
    You would think he would at least retract the brick. Since what Paul is saying is totally clear.
    You do not know the abomination of desolation from a hole in the ground.
    Quote Originally Posted by Interplanner View Post
    They can't compete with a real writer and grammar scholar
    Quote Originally Posted by Interplanner View Post
    You're too literal to get it.
    Quote Originally Posted by Interplanner View Post
    The New Covenant preceded the Old Covenant.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Right Divider View Post
    Dan 8:13 (AKJV/PCE)
    (8:13) Then I heard one saint speaking, and another saint said unto that certain [saint] which spake, How long [shall be] the vision [concerning] the daily [sacrifice], and the transgression of desolation, to give both the sanctuary and the host to be trodden under foot?

    IP the Fabulous ASSUMES (due to his pushing HIS "interp" upon the Bible) that this "transgression" refers to Israel rebelling against Rome. What a loon!

    The following verse helps clarify what the Daniel really means and it does NOT match with IP's vain machinations.

    Dan 8:14 (AKJV/PCE)
    (8:14) And he said unto me, Unto two thousand and three hundred days; then shall the sanctuary be cleansed.

    The sanctuary is the Temple and it will be cleansed and NOT destroyed.

    The word used for CLEANSED is:
    H6663 צָדַק tsadaq (tsaw-dak') v.
    1. to be right (in a moral or forensic sense).
    2. (causatively) to make right (in a moral or forensic sense).
    [a primitive root]
    KJV: cleanse, clear self, (be, do) just(-ice, -ify, -ify self), (be turn to) righteous(-ness).

    It is quite clear that the "rebellion" is against GOD and not Rome.

    Why does Rome care about the desecration of the Temple?

    Jesus also clarified this quite nicely:

    Matt 24:15 (AKJV/PCE)
    (24:15) When ye therefore shall see the abomination of desolation, spoken of by Daniel the prophet, stand in the holy place, (whoso readeth, let him understand

    The abomination of desolation is STANDING in the holy place....

    Too clear and simple for "real writer and grammar scholar" to understand.



    Sorry, but you missed most of it.

    The rebellion is against Rome because there was no need to fight for the independence of Israel. The mission of Christ was going to be able to go all over the world with Roman technology. Israel rebelled against God and Christ, but by doing so pit themselves against Rome to fight for Israel. Notice how many times, even I Pet 2B, that Christians are not to bother with rebellion against Rome. Rom 13. Acts 21.

    You won't understand this until you allow yourself more knowledge of the 1st century , which is a sin.

    Christ succeeded in cleansing the sanctuary in his Gospel; his redemptive accomplishments are listed there in Dan 9.

    The abomination expression starts as a rebellion that desolates. Call it a transgression if you like. The point from the entire chapter is that the rebellion would peak and ruin the country. There is no arguing that.

    The person (the AofD) was the leader of that rebellion. Just read the history. It is plain to see what happened. They all did it claiming God's intervention and signs and wonders and even claiming to be Messiah.

    Your arguments are a piece of cake to dismantle, but go ahead.
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    The cleansing of the temple is addressed in: "to atone for wickedness...to anoint the most holy..." which is language that shows up again in Heb 9:12.

    But you'd have to be a student of the 2500 uses of the OT to see that...
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    Quote Originally Posted by Interplanner View Post
    Sorry, but you missed most of it.
    No, I did not.

    Quote Originally Posted by Interplanner View Post
    The rebellion is against Rome because there was no need to fight for the independence of Israel.
    More subjectivist, humanist, self-think.

    Quote Originally Posted by Interplanner View Post
    The mission of Christ was going to be able to go all over the world with Roman technology. Israel rebelled against God and Christ, but by doing so pit themselves against Rome to fight for Israel. Notice how many times, even I Pet 2B, that Christians are not to bother with rebellion against Rome. Rom 13. Acts 21.


    Quote Originally Posted by Interplanner View Post
    You won't understand this until you allow yourself more knowledge of the 1st century , which is a sin.


    Quote Originally Posted by Interplanner View Post
    Christ succeeded in cleansing the sanctuary in his Gospel; his redemptive accomplishments are listed there in Dan 9.
    You really are completely insane.

    Quote Originally Posted by Interplanner View Post
    The abomination expression starts as a rebellion that desolates.
    I'll just go with what the Bible says.

    Quote Originally Posted by Interplanner View Post
    Call it a transgression if you like.
    That's exactly your problem. You call things anything that you like.

    Quote Originally Posted by Interplanner View Post
    The point from the entire chapter is that the rebellion would peak and ruin the country. There is no arguing that.

    The person (the AofD) was the leader of that rebellion. Just read the history. It is plain to see what happened. They all did it claiming God's intervention and signs and wonders and even claiming to be Messiah.

    Your arguments are a piece of cake to dismantle, but go ahead.
    Your arguments dismantle themselves.
    Col 2:9 (AKJV/PCE)
    (2:9) For in him dwelleth all the fulness of the Godhead bodily.

    1Tim 4:10 (AKJV/PCE)
    (4:10) For therefore we both labour and suffer reproach, because we trust in the living God, who is the Saviour of all men, specially of those that believe.

    Quote Originally Posted by Interplanner View Post
    They can't compete with a real writer and grammar scholar
    Something that was SPOKEN OF since the world began CANNOT be the SAME thing as something KEPT SECRET since the world began.

    Has Amos 9:15 been cancelled?

    Eph 2:8-9 (AKJV/PCE)
    (2:8) For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: [it is] the gift of God: (2:9) Not of works, lest any man should boast.

    The list: http://theologyonline.com/entry.php?...quot-list-quot Great Bible software: http://www.theword.net/

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    Quote Originally Posted by Right Divider View Post
    No, I did not.


    More subjectivist, humanist, self-think.








    You really are completely insane.


    I'll just go with what the Bible says.


    That's exactly your problem. You call things anything that you like.


    Your arguments dismantle themselves.





    So you must think Christ was on the side of zealot rebels all through his career and advocated that to the disciples.
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    RD,
    since I don't accept your dictates--whether theology or vocab or even contemporary words--you might want to find another way to communicate. ie, if you dictate it, I don't pay any attention. As soon as you have reasons for your beliefs, I will pay attention.

    Since the rebellion in the middle of Dan 8 is the main event there, and desolates the country, I have no idea why you would object to 'the rebellion that desolates' earlier.

    The reconsecrated temple referred to Christ's new covenant, heb 9-10.
    All Lives Matter --Marcus Sanford, youtube.com

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    Quote Originally Posted by Interplanner View Post
    So you must think Christ was on the side of zealot rebels all through his career and advocated that to the disciples.
    You think WRONG again.... what a surprise!
    Col 2:9 (AKJV/PCE)
    (2:9) For in him dwelleth all the fulness of the Godhead bodily.

    1Tim 4:10 (AKJV/PCE)
    (4:10) For therefore we both labour and suffer reproach, because we trust in the living God, who is the Saviour of all men, specially of those that believe.

    Quote Originally Posted by Interplanner View Post
    They can't compete with a real writer and grammar scholar
    Something that was SPOKEN OF since the world began CANNOT be the SAME thing as something KEPT SECRET since the world began.

    Has Amos 9:15 been cancelled?

    Eph 2:8-9 (AKJV/PCE)
    (2:8) For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: [it is] the gift of God: (2:9) Not of works, lest any man should boast.

    The list: http://theologyonline.com/entry.php?...quot-list-quot Great Bible software: http://www.theword.net/

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    Quote Originally Posted by Interplanner View Post
    RD,
    since I don't accept your dictates--whether theology or vocab or even contemporary words--you might want to find another way to communicate. ie, if you dictate it, I don't pay any attention. As soon as you have reasons for your beliefs, I will pay attention.
    You never pay attention in the first place.

    Quote Originally Posted by Interplanner View Post
    Since the rebellion in the middle of Dan 8 is the main event there, and desolates the country, I have no idea why you would object to 'the rebellion that desolates' earlier.
    That's just nonsense that you got from a commentary.

    Quote Originally Posted by Interplanner View Post
    The reconsecrated temple referred to Christ's new covenant, heb 9-10.
    Made up.
    Col 2:9 (AKJV/PCE)
    (2:9) For in him dwelleth all the fulness of the Godhead bodily.

    1Tim 4:10 (AKJV/PCE)
    (4:10) For therefore we both labour and suffer reproach, because we trust in the living God, who is the Saviour of all men, specially of those that believe.

    Quote Originally Posted by Interplanner View Post
    They can't compete with a real writer and grammar scholar
    Something that was SPOKEN OF since the world began CANNOT be the SAME thing as something KEPT SECRET since the world began.

    Has Amos 9:15 been cancelled?

    Eph 2:8-9 (AKJV/PCE)
    (2:8) For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: [it is] the gift of God: (2:9) Not of works, lest any man should boast.

    The list: http://theologyonline.com/entry.php?...quot-list-quot Great Bible software: http://www.theword.net/

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    Quote Originally Posted by Right Divider View Post
    You think WRONG again.... what a surprise!


    I'm not here to play 20 questions. Do you know how to communicate what you believe, or is it just a juvenile game?
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    Quote Originally Posted by Interplanner View Post
    Sorry, but you missed most of it.

    The rebellion is against Rome because there was no need to fight for the independence of Israel. The mission of Christ was going to be able to go all over the world with Roman technology. Israel rebelled against God and Christ, but by doing so pit themselves against Rome to fight for Israel. Notice how many times, even I Pet 2B, that Christians are not to bother with rebellion against Rome. Rom 13. Acts 21.

    You won't understand this until you allow yourself more knowledge of the 1st century , which is a sin.

    Christ succeeded in cleansing the sanctuary in his Gospel; his redemptive accomplishments are listed there in Dan 9.

    The abomination expression starts as a rebellion that desolates. Call it a transgression if you like. The point from the entire chapter is that the rebellion would peak and ruin the country. There is no arguing that.

    The person (the AofD) was the leader of that rebellion. Just read the history. It is plain to see what happened. They all did it claiming God's intervention and signs and wonders and even claiming to be Messiah.

    Your arguments are a piece of cake to dismantle, but go ahead.
    All made up.
    Quote Originally Posted by Interplanner View Post
    They can't compete with a real writer and grammar scholar
    Quote Originally Posted by Interplanner View Post
    You're too literal to get it.
    Quote Originally Posted by Interplanner View Post
    The New Covenant preceded the Old Covenant.

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    IP still does not know the abomination of desolation from a hole in the ground.
    I cannot believe the fantasy island ideas he has about it. I'm shocked.
    Quote Originally Posted by Interplanner View Post
    They can't compete with a real writer and grammar scholar
    Quote Originally Posted by Interplanner View Post
    You're too literal to get it.
    Quote Originally Posted by Interplanner View Post
    The New Covenant preceded the Old Covenant.

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    Quote Originally Posted by SaulToPaul View Post
    Daniel 8
    9 And out of one of them came forth a little horn, which waxed exceeding great, toward the south, and toward the east, and toward the pleasant land.

    10 And it waxed great, even to the host of heaven; and it cast down some of the host and of the stars to the ground, and stamped upon them.

    11 Yea, he magnified himself even to the prince of the host, and by him the daily sacrifice was taken away, and the place of the sanctuary was cast down.

    12 And an host was given him against the daily sacrifice by reason of transgression, and it cast down the truth to the ground; and it practised, and prospered.



    The abomination of desolation



    Daniel 9
    27 And he shall confirm the covenant with many for one week: and in the midst of the week he shall cause the sacrifice and the oblation to cease, and for the overspreading of abominations he shall make it desolate, even until the consummation, and that determined shall be poured upon the desolate.


    The abomination of desolation



    Daniel 11
    30 For the ships of Chittim shall come against him: therefore he shall be grieved, and return, and have indignation against the holy covenant: so shall he do; he shall even return, and have intelligence with them that forsake the holy covenant.

    31 And arms shall stand on his part, and they shall pollute the sanctuary of strength, and shall take away the daily sacrifice, and they shall place the abomination that maketh desolate.

    32 And such as do wickedly against the covenant shall he corrupt by flatteries: but the people that do know their God shall be strong, and do exploits.


    The abomination of desolation.
    Quote Originally Posted by Interplanner View Post
    They can't compete with a real writer and grammar scholar
    Quote Originally Posted by Interplanner View Post
    You're too literal to get it.
    Quote Originally Posted by Interplanner View Post
    The New Covenant preceded the Old Covenant.

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    IP's interpretation of the abomination of desolation is 100% fantasy.
    Quote Originally Posted by Interplanner View Post
    They can't compete with a real writer and grammar scholar
    Quote Originally Posted by Interplanner View Post
    You're too literal to get it.
    Quote Originally Posted by Interplanner View Post
    The New Covenant preceded the Old Covenant.

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    I did read you here because I thought there might be some connection to the title of the other--rebellion.

    Here's the problem: we have just one NT reference about the expression, by Christ, and it is smack in the middle of the circumstance of the Jewish revolt. So I for one can't budge from that. He also said it was happening in that generation. Those literal apostles would see those literal construction stones of those literal buildings dropped. It is not complicated.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Interplanner View Post
    I did read you here because I thought there might be some connection to the title of the other--rebellion.

    Here's the problem: we have just one NT reference about the expression, by Christ, and it is smack in the middle of the circumstance of the Jewish revolt. So I for one can't budge from that. He also said it was happening in that generation. Those literal apostles would see those literal construction stones of those literal buildings dropped. It is not complicated.
    Your interpretation of the abomination of desolation is pure fantasy.
    Quote Originally Posted by Interplanner View Post
    They can't compete with a real writer and grammar scholar
    Quote Originally Posted by Interplanner View Post
    You're too literal to get it.
    Quote Originally Posted by Interplanner View Post
    The New Covenant preceded the Old Covenant.

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