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Thread: Justification by Faith !

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    Quote Originally Posted by beloved57 View Post
    What Justification by Faith really is !

    First of all, Justification by Faith cant apply to #1. The unregenerate, because Faith is a Spiritual Fruit 5:22

    22 But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, longsuffering, gentleness, goodness, faith,

    Now, man may have faith which is the fruit of the flesh, a natural human faith, but that has nothing to do with Justification.

    #2. Justification by Faith cant apply to the unjustified, in other words, one must already be Justified before God before they can be Justified by Faith.

    Justification by Faith is when one who has been Justified by the Blood of Christ alone and before God based on Christ's Blood Rom 5:9 when they receive a conscience assurance of it by Faith the fruit of the Spirit.

    Faith justifies the conscience with the spiritual knowledge of the imputed righteousness of Christ . God purifies our hearts by Faith Acts 15:8-9

    8[FONT="]And God, which knoweth the hearts, bare them witness, giving them the Holy Ghost, even as he did unto us;[/FONT]

    9 [FONT="]And put no difference between us and them, purifying their hearts by faith.
    The word heart here does include the conscience, for its the word [/FONT]
    kardia and means:

    lit: the heart; mind, character, inner self, will, intention, center.

    kardía – heart; "the affective center of our being" and the capacity of moral preference


    Faith gives us assurance of our Justification as in the full assurance of Faith Heb 10:22

    [FONT="]Let us draw near with a true heart in full [/FONT]assurance of faith, having our hearts sprinkled from an evil conscience, and our bodies washed with pure water.

    Justification by Faith Rom 5:1 is again conscience Justification, wherein the conscience is given to know the peace it has with God, and so its the peace of believing Rom 15:13

    [FONT="]Now the God of hope fill you with all joy and [/FONT]peace in believing, that ye may abound in hope, through the power of the Holy Ghost.


    Perfectly explained!

    All God's Sons, Justified from everlasting In their Covenant Head Christ Jesus Eph. 1:4-7; Rom. 3:24; Rom. 5:9 shall be given a New Heart, a new nature; be Born of the Spirit, and receive Faith [passively] as evidence that His Blood was shed on their behalf.

    So God Given Faith Gal. 5:22 reveals their Justification in their mind, which from eternity already existed in God's Mind 2 Tim. 1:9, before they knew anything about it.

    Hence the Faith of God's Elect Rom. 8:33; Titus 1:1.


    Rom. 8:14-16

    14 For as many as are led by the Spirit of God, they are the sons of God.

    15 For ye have not received the spirit of bondage again to fear; but ye have received the Spirit of adoption, whereby we cry, Abba, Father.

    16 The Spirit itself beareth witness with our spirit, that we are the children of God:
    My soul thirsts for God, the God Who Lives Forever:
    when shall I be brought in to see His Face? -Psalm 42:2

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    Quote Originally Posted by Nanja View Post
    Perfectly explained!

    All God's Sons, Justified from everlasting In their Covenant Head Christ Jesus Eph. 1:4-7; Rom. 3:24; Rom. 5:9 shall be given a New Heart, a new nature; be Born of the Spirit, and receive Faith [passively] as evidence that His Blood was shed on their behalf.

    So God Given Faith Gal. 5:22 reveals their Justification in their mind, which from eternity already existed in God's Mind 2 Tim. 1:9, before they knew anything about it.

    Hence the Faith of God's Elect Rom. 8:33; Titus 1:1.


    Rom. 8:14-16

    14 For as many as are led by the Spirit of God, they are the sons of God.

    15 For ye have not received the spirit of bondage again to fear; but ye have received the Spirit of adoption, whereby we cry, Abba, Father.

    16 The Spirit itself beareth witness with our spirit, that we are the children of God:
    Well stated!

    Sent from my 5054N using TheologyOnline mobile app
    "... I have my own private opinion that there is no such a thing as
    preaching Christ and him crucified, unless you preach what now-a-days is
    called Calvinism. I have my own ideas, and those I always state boldly. It is
    a nickname to call it Calvinism; Calvinism is the gospel, and nothing else."

    Charles Spurgeon !

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    Quote Originally Posted by Nanja View Post
    Perfectly explained!

    All God's Sons, Justified from everlasting In their Covenant Head Christ Jesus Eph. 1:4-7; Rom. 3:24; Rom. 5:9 shall be given a New Heart, a new nature; be Born of the Spirit, and receive Faith [passively] as evidence that His Blood was shed on their behalf.

    So God Given Faith Gal. 5:22 reveals their Justification in their mind, which from eternity already existed in God's Mind 2 Tim. 1:9, before they knew anything about it.

    Hence the Faith of God's Elect Rom. 8:33; Titus 1:1.


    Rom. 8:14-16

    14 For as many as are led by the Spirit of God, they are the sons of God.

    15 For ye have not received the spirit of bondage again to fear; but ye have received the Spirit of adoption, whereby we cry, Abba, Father.

    16 The Spirit itself beareth witness with our spirit, that we are the children of God:
    Peter said he was elect by the foreknowledge of God 1Pet. 1:2

    Paul said those whom God foreknew he predestined to be conformed to the image of Christ Rom. 8:29

    The bastardization of predestination will the downfall of the Reformed gospel.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Epoisses View Post
    The bastardization of predestination will the downfall of the Reformed gospel.

    The Gospel Paul preached:

    2 Tim . 1:8-9
    8 Be not thou therefore ashamed of the testimony of our Lord, nor of me his prisoner: but be thou partaker of the afflictions of the gospel according to the power of God; 9 Who hath saved us, and called us with an holy calling, not according to our works, but according to his own purpose and grace, which was given us in Christ Jesus before the world began
    My soul thirsts for God, the God Who Lives Forever:
    when shall I be brought in to see His Face? -Psalm 42:2

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    Quote Originally Posted by Nanja View Post
    The Gospel Paul preached:

    2 Tim . 1:8-9
    8 Be not thou therefore ashamed of the testimony of our Lord, nor of me his prisoner: but be thou partaker of the afflictions of the gospel according to the power of God; 9 Who hath saved us, and called us with an holy calling, not according to our works, but according to his own purpose and grace, which was given us in Christ Jesus before the world began
    God didn't damn people before the world began and to even hint at such a thing is ignorance on a colossal scale. Jesus always used the things of nature to describe faith where it can grow and blossom in some while it can wither and die in others. All the 400 years of Calvinist postulation cannot say for certain why one is saved and another is lost. It's a mystery known only to God himself.

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    Lazy afternoon (July 10th, 2017)

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    This doctrine put forth has two large paradoxes.

    First off, the false equating of belief to "work." To say that "justified by faith" means Christ's faith, then what good is our faith? Obviously, Christ had faith. He is the incarnation of faith. This application of "justification by faith" is simply wrong. Faith is a free will act. Faith is believing. Simple belief, while being a technical "work," is more akin to an "act." No one classifies believing as a "work." This is simply preposterous.

    Second, if we have no choice in faith, then what point is there in belief? If we, as humanity, have no control over "faith," then one cannot blame the "unregenerate" for a lack of "faith," since it was never imputed upon them. Furthermore, if this is the case, then the logical conclusion IS that God damns people to hell, by His own actions. If God never imparts this "faith," then the Lost are not lost by their own doing, but by God's doing. God in effect has chosen to damn these people to eternal punishment.

    This entire doctrine, where faith is not an act of free will, and that God chooses people to save and to damn, is contrary to all of Scripture. It is contrary to the Words of Christ, Himself. It would render the Crucifixion and Resurrection useless. And most of all, it is illogical and goes against Truth, as well as, attributes of God/Christ.


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    Quote Originally Posted by jsanford108 View Post
    Faith is believing. Simple belief, while being a technical "work," is more akin to an "act." No one classifies believing as a "work." This is simply preposterous.

    Unless a person is Born of the Spirit, his own faith he exercises in his carnal mind is nothing but a work [ergon] of the flesh that can't please God Rom. 8:7-8.


    ergon, G2041:

    II. any product whatever, any thing accomplished by hand, art, industry, or mind

    https://www.blueletterbible.org/lang...041&t=KJV&ss=1


    So that classifies one's own faith as a work!


    Eph 2:8-9
    8 For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God: 9 Not of works, lest any man should boast.


    Therefore, to be Justified by Faith is when those who have been Justified by the Blood of Christ 2 Tim. 1:9 Rom. 5:9, 19 have it revealed to God Given Faith Gal. 5:22 by His Spirit in New Birth Rom. 8:9.
    My soul thirsts for God, the God Who Lives Forever:
    when shall I be brought in to see His Face? -Psalm 42:2

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    Quote Originally Posted by jsanford108 View Post
    This doctrine put forth has two large paradoxes.

    First off, the false equating of belief to "work." To say that "justified by faith" means Christ's faith, then what good is our faith? Obviously, Christ had faith. He is the incarnation of faith. This application of "justification by faith" is simply wrong. Faith is a free will act. Faith is believing. Simple belief, while being a technical "work," is more akin to an "act." No one classifies believing as a "work." This is simply preposterous.

    Second, if we have no choice in faith, then what point is there in belief? If we, as humanity, have no control over "faith," then one cannot blame the "unregenerate" for a lack of "faith," since it was never imputed upon them. Furthermore, if this is the case, then the logical conclusion IS that God damns people to hell, by His own actions. If God never imparts this "faith," then the Lost are not lost by their own doing, but by God's doing. God in effect has chosen to damn these people to eternal punishment.

    This entire doctrine, where faith is not an act of free will, and that God chooses people to save and to damn, is contrary to all of Scripture. It is contrary to the Words of Christ, Himself. It would render the Crucifixion and Resurrection useless. And most of all, it is illogical and goes against Truth, as well as, attributes of God/Christ.


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    Faith is not a choice, look up the words in the dictionary.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Nanja View Post
    Unless a person is Born of the Spirit, his own faith he exercises in his carnal mind is nothing but a work [ergon] of the flesh that can't please God Rom. 8:7-8.


    ergon, G2041:

    II. any product whatever, any thing accomplished by hand, art, industry, or mind

    https://www.blueletterbible.org/lang...041&t=KJV&ss=1


    So that classifies one's own faith as a work!


    Eph 2:8-9
    8 For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God: 9 Not of works, lest any man should boast.


    Therefore, to be Justified by Faith is when those who have been Justified by the Blood of Christ 2 Tim. 1:9 Rom. 5:9, 19 have it revealed to God Given Faith Gal. 5:22 by His Spirit in New Birth Rom. 8:9.
    You are utilizing the blue letter bible's interpretation, rather than simply reading what is written. The Blue Letter is not the authority on the Bible, is it? Yet, it is being treated like it is. (which is hypocritical when people who accuse Catholicism of this very same thing)

    Furthermore, nowhere in Paul's letter to the Romans, is "faith alone" found. Nowhere in the Bible does the phrase "faith alone" appear, except in James, where it says "not by faith alone." To imply that "faith alone" is biblical is simply promoting falsehood.

    Despite all this, "faith" is a grace we receive. But accepting that faith is a human act. I can impart gifts all day long; if you refuse them, then you are acting on your own free will. Likewise, God can give us gifts, and we as humans, in our free will, can reject those gifts. Is it sinful to do so? Obviously. Since God has deemed it good to impart these things, who are we to refuse? But the fact, supported by the Scriptures, is that man freely accepts or rejects God.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Epoisses View Post
    Faith is not a choice, look up the words in the dictionary.
    As I stated to Nanja, faith is a grace. Grace is any blessing/gift that God imparts to us. However, man, in their free will, can accept or reject these graces. Accepting that faith/grace is a human act. I can impart gifts all day long; if you refuse them, then you are acting on your own free will. Likewise, God can give us gifts, and we as humans, in our free will, can reject those gifts. Is it sinful to do so? Obviously. Since God has deemed it good to impart these things, who are we to refuse? But the fact, supported by the Scriptures, is that man freely accepts or rejects God.

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    Quote Originally Posted by jsanford108 View Post
    As I stated to Nanja, faith is a grace. Grace is any blessing/gift that God imparts to us. However, man, in their free will, can accept or reject these graces. Accepting that faith/grace is a human act. I can impart gifts all day long; if you refuse them, then you are acting on your own free will. Likewise, God can give us gifts, and we as humans, in our free will, can reject those gifts. Is it sinful to do so? Obviously. Since God has deemed it good to impart these things, who are we to refuse? But the fact, supported by the Scriptures, is that man freely accepts or rejects God.
    You don't have free will. Your will is in bondage to sin so that from birth you will always make the wrong decision and never choose what God wants. This is the 'will power' that you possess.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Epoisses View Post
    You don't have free will. Your will is in bondage to sin so that from birth you will always make the wrong decision and never choose what God wants. This is the 'will power' that you possess.
    If we do not have free will, then why do these verses, guided by the Holy Spirit, point to fee will and choice:

    Genesis 2
    Joshua 24:15
    Deuteronomy 30:19&20
    Ezekiel 18:30-32
    Isaiah 55:6&7
    Romans 10:9&10
    1 Corinthians 10:13
    Galations 5
    2 Peter 3

    Christ's Words:
    Mark 8:34
    Revelation 3:20

    These are just a few verses that specifically declare we have free will. There are more that allude to free will, such as John 3.




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    Quote Originally Posted by Epoisses View Post
    You don't have free will. Your will is in bondage to sin so that from birth you will always make the wrong decision and never choose what God wants. This is the 'will power' that you possess.
    If there is no free will, then the logical conclusion is that God has ordained mankind to go to hell or heaven; erasing hope itself for those pre-ordained for hell. If there is no free will, God is evil. (We know this cannot be so, therefore, logically and supported by Scripture, free will exists)


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    Quote Originally Posted by jsanford108 View Post
    If there is no free will, then the logical conclusion is that God has ordained mankind to go to hell or heaven; erasing hope itself for those pre-ordained for hell. If there is no free will, God is evil. (We know this cannot be so, therefore, logically and supported by Scripture, free will exists)


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    No the logical conclusion is that you don't see yourself as a sinner where your every thought, word and deed are corrupt. When the Holy Spirit convicts you of this and you humbly acknowledge it then you begin to make right decisions. Christians today are merely going thru the motions of their religion without even acknowledging their true condition. Jesus came into the world to save sinners and if you're not one then he can't help you.

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    See, Faith is a work, in that its an Spiritual Grace/ Fruit Gal 5:22, so it can have no other way to Justify one but in the declarative sense. See God alone is the One who Justifieth Rom 8:33

    33 Who will bring any charge against those whom God has chosen? It is God who justifies.


    See, Spiritual fruit is contrasted to works of the flesh Gal 5:19-20

    19 Now the works of the flesh are manifest, which are these; Adultery, fornication, uncleanness, lasciviousness,
    20 Idolatry, witchcraft, hatred, variance, emulations, wrath, strife, seditions, heresies,

    And these works are done with or in the mind or heart. For instance Adultery, Jesus says its a work or done in the heart /mind Matt 5:28

    28 But I say unto you, That whosoever looketh on a woman to lust after her hath committed adultery with her already in his heart.

    The word heart in the greek means:

    the soul or mind, as it is the fountain and seat of the thoughts, passions, desires, appetites, affections, purposes, endeavours

    of the understanding, the faculty and seat of the intelligence

    So by works of the flesh being contrasted to fruit of the Spirit, works and fruit are interchangeable denoting activities of the mind at work.

    So unless we are careful to understand Justification by Faith to be declarative before our own conscience, and not an act of our mind that causes God to Justify us before Himself, then we shall error into Justification before God by our works, the fruit of our minds.

    "... I have my own private opinion that there is no such a thing as
    preaching Christ and him crucified, unless you preach what now-a-days is
    called Calvinism. I have my own ideas, and those I always state boldly. It is
    a nickname to call it Calvinism; Calvinism is the gospel, and nothing else."

    Charles Spurgeon !

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