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    Quote Originally Posted by Jerry Shugart View Post
    I think that those who will be caught up with the Lord Jesus in the air will, at some point in time, return to the earth with the Lord Jesus when He sets up His kingdom at the beginning of the 1000 years.
    Then there will be people living on the earth who are still in the flesh...during that thousand years? This is the part I'm really confused about.

    Revelation 20:3And cast him into the bottomless pit, and shut him up, and set a seal upon him, that he should deceive the nations no more, till the thousand years should be fulfilled: and after that he must be loosed a little season.

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    Quote Originally Posted by glorydaz View Post
    Then there will be people living on the earth who are still in the flesh...during that thousand years? This is the part I'm really confused about.

    Revelation 20:3And cast him into the bottomless pit, and shut him up, and set a seal upon him, that he should deceive the nations no more, till the thousand years should be fulfilled: and after that he must be loosed a little season.
    There will be people, both Israelites and Gentiles who endure to the end and enter the earthly Davidic Messianic kingdom without a bodily change.

    For instance:


    Mat 25:31 When the Son of man shall come in his glory, and all the holy angels with him, then shall he sit upon the throne of his glory:
    Mat 25:32 And before him shall be gathered all nations: and he shall separate them one from another, as a shepherd divideth his sheep from the goats:
    Mat 25:33 And he shall set the sheep on his right hand, but the goats on the left.
    Mat 25:34 Then shall the King say unto them on his right hand, Come, ye blessed of my Father, inherit the kingdom prepared for you from the foundation of the world:


    There will be need for healing for unglorified bodies during the earthly reign. People will die from sin.
    People will populate the planet much as Shem, Ham and Japheth did post-flood.
    Jer 23:5 Behold, the days come, saith the LORD[YHVH], that I will raise unto David a righteous Branch, and a King shall reign and prosper, and shall execute judgment and justice in the earth.
    Jer 23:6 In his days Judah shall be saved, and Israel shall dwell safely: and this is his name whereby he[the Branch] shall be called, THE LORD[YHVH] OUR RIGHTEOUSNESS.

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  5. #78
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    Quote Originally Posted by steko View Post
    There will be people, both Israelites and Gentiles who endure to the end and enter the earthly Davidic Messianic kingdom without a bodily change.

    For instance:


    Mat 25:31 When the Son of man shall come in his glory, and all the holy angels with him, then shall he sit upon the throne of his glory:
    Mat 25:32 And before him shall be gathered all nations: and he shall separate them one from another, as a shepherd divideth his sheep from the goats:
    Mat 25:33 And he shall set the sheep on his right hand, but the goats on the left.
    Mat 25:34 Then shall the King say unto them on his right hand, Come, ye blessed of my Father, inherit the kingdom prepared for you from the foundation of the world:


    There will be need for healing for unglorified bodies during the earthly reign. People will die from sin.
    People will populate the planet much as Shem, Ham and Japheth did post-flood.
    Really? Evil and good dwelling together? Having their unglorified bodies being healed?


    Maybe this is why I doubted the thousand year reign in the past. Perhaps that thousand years is a day?

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    Over 1000 post club LoneStar's Avatar
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    Are there not 2 regathering, 2 temples built, and 2 wars of armies attacking Israel?

    The impression I get is the following outline.

    1. Israel regathers at least partially into the land and builds a temple the antichrist sets up the abomination of desolation. This regathering could possibly be orchestrated through the antichrist's false hope of peace.
    The false peace is disrupted by the abomination of desolation and great tribulation is poured out on Israel and they are told to flee. Another scattering of them.

    2. Christ comes and defeats the armies against Israel. Takes his seat on the throne and builds the kingdom and new temple for the millennium. Peace and safety for 1000 years as Satan is bound for that 1000 years.

    3. Satan is loosed after the 1000 years and gathers another army to attack Israel. Defeated permanently.


    My inclination is that there are 2 gatherings to the land, 2 wars against Israel and 2 temples built. Separating which prophesy goes with which one may prove to be confusing.

    Another thing I get mixed up about is how those mortals that are still living after that 2nd war after the millennium when Satan is loosed will receive a glorified body for eternity. Are they killed or finally all die and then resurrected or are they changed in a twinkling of the eye as we are for the rapture?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Tambora View Post

    Keep this in mind ......
    You can know the correct time without knowing how the watch was built.
    GOD has already given us the correct answer ----- no, GOD is not through with Israel as a national people.
    We don't have to be given every detail of how that comes about to know it is correct, anymore than you have to know every detail of the 6 days of creation to know it is correct.
    Makes my homework easier.

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    Quote Originally Posted by LoneStar View Post
    Are there not 2 regathering, 2 temples built, and 2 wars of armies attacking Israel?

    The impression I get is the following outline.

    1. Israel regathers at least partially into the land and builds a temple the antichrist sets up the abomination of desolation. This regathering could possibly be orchestrated through the antichrist's false hope of peace.
    The false peace is disrupted by the abomination of desolation and great tribulation is poured out on Israel and they are told to flee. Another scattering of them.

    2. Christ comes and defeats the armies against Israel. Takes his seat on the throne and builds the kingdom and new temple for the millennium. Peace and safety for 1000 years as Satan is bound for that 1000 years.

    3. Satan is loosed after the 1000 years and gathers another army to attack Israel. Defeated permanently.
    Sounds about right.
    A gathering of them to the anti-christ. (A false peace and security.) John 5:43 comes to mind.
    A gathering of them to Christ. (A true peace and security.)



    Another thing I get mixed up about is how those mortals that are still living after that 2nd war after the millennium when Satan is loosed will receive a glorified body for eternity. Are they killed or finally all die and then resurrected or are they changed in a twinkling of the eye as we are for the rapture?
    Hmmm.
    See there, you asked a question I had not even considered before. I don't have an answer as to what manner everyone alive (still mortal) will receive a glorified body.
    Maybe you can figure that one out for me!

    God Bless America

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    Quote Originally Posted by glorydaz View Post
    Really? Evil and good dwelling together? Having their unglorified bodies being healed?


    Maybe this is why I doubted the thousand year reign in the past. Perhaps that thousand years is a day?
    Seems like there would have to be both good and evil during the millennial reign, or else there would be nothing to judge during that time.

    God Bless America

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    TOL Legend Jerry Shugart's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by glorydaz View Post
    Then there will be people living on the earth who are still in the flesh...during that thousand years? This is the part I'm really confused about.
    Yes, there will be some people during the 1000 year reign of the Lord Jesus on the earth who will still be in their physical bodies. But initially only the saved will make up the kingdom (Jn.3:5). But there will be some people born of those who remain in their physical bodies who will rebel against the LORD (Rev.20:9).

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    TOL Legend Jerry Shugart's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by steko View Post
    Hey, Jerry, got any comments on 'the great commission' given to the twelve with regard to water baptism? If that program had continued, would every person on earth who believed and repented been water baptized?
    The rite of water baptism served to "make ready a people prepared for the Lord" so that they "might serve Him...in holiness and righteousness " (Lk.1:17,74,75).

    The believers who were baptized in water were more or less pledging to cease their sinful lifestyle so that they could serve Him in holiness and righteousness.

    However, when those who will be caught up to meet the Lord Jesus in the air and then later return to the earth with Him they will all be in glorious bodies like the Lord's glorious body and they will be equipped to serve Him in holiness and righteousness. Therefore, for them there will be no reason to submit to the baptism of repentance for the remission of sins.

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    TOL Subscriber glorydaz's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tambora View Post
    Seems like there would have to be both good and evil during the millennial reign, or else there would be nothing to judge during that time.
    Yeah, unless they were only judging which is the better way.

    Seriously, Tam, I have gone round and round over the Millennium and Revelation, and it's just become a big blur to me. Once the Lord takes me.....I go blank. LOL

    What in the world could possibly exist, and how many could possibly survive the bowls of wrath?

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    Quote Originally Posted by glorydaz View Post
    Yeah, unless they were only judging which is the better way.

    Seriously, Tam, I have gone round and round over the Millennium and Revelation, and it's just become a big blur to me. Once the Lord takes me.....I go blank. LOL

    What in the world could possibly exist, and how many could possibly survive the bowls of wrath?
    Revelation 6:8 KJV
    And I looked, and behold a pale horse: and his name that sat on him was Death, and Hell followed with him. And power was given unto them over the fourth part of the earth, to kill with sword, and with hunger, and with death, and with the beasts of the earth.





    There's 1/4 part of man killed. I googled the population of earth and it is around 7.5 billion. Let's round it to 8 giving room for more till the wrath.

    Don't know how many will be gone at the rapture. Let's say after the rapture there are 7 billion. 1/4 of them are killed leaving about 5.25 billion.



    Revelation 9:15 KJV
    (15) And the four angels were loosed, which were prepared for an hour, and a day, and a month, and a year, for to slay the third part of men.


    There's 1/3 of what is left (5.25 billion) of men. That leaves 3.5 billion. That would leave less than 1/2 of the population still alive. If the great tribulation is of the 3.5 years of the 7 years, more than 1/2 of the world's population will be killed within 3.5 years. I would say that will be the greatest time of destruction as the world has ever seen.

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    Quote Originally Posted by glorydaz View Post
    Yeah, unless they were only judging which is the better way.

    Seriously, Tam, I have gone round and round over the Millennium and Revelation, and it's just become a big blur to me. Once the Lord takes me.....I go blank. LOL

    What in the world could possibly exist, and how many could possibly survive the bowls of wrath?
    I thought Christ was gonna' rule this earth with a rod of iron after He returns. If there's no evil, why the rod?

    And...what about the promise of the twelve tribes restoration back to the land under the rule of Messiah reigning from the throne of David?
    Where and when does that happen?
    Jer 23:5 Behold, the days come, saith the LORD[YHVH], that I will raise unto David a righteous Branch, and a King shall reign and prosper, and shall execute judgment and justice in the earth.
    Jer 23:6 In his days Judah shall be saved, and Israel shall dwell safely: and this is his name whereby he[the Branch] shall be called, THE LORD[YHVH] OUR RIGHTEOUSNESS.

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    Quote Originally Posted by steko View Post
    I thought Christ was gonna' rule this earth with a rod of iron after He returns. If there's no evil, why the rod?

    And...what about the promise of the twelve tribes restoration back to the land under the rule of Messiah reigning from the throne of David?
    Where and when does that happen?
    Makes sense there would need to be something to judge. Are they judging for salvation into eternal life or judging the legal social laws of the land?

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    Quote Originally Posted by steko View Post
    I thought Christ was gonna' rule this earth with a rod of iron after He returns. If there's no evil, why the rod?

    And...what about the promise of the twelve tribes restoration back to the land under the rule of Messiah reigning from the throne of David?
    Where and when does that happen?
    Revelation 10:7 KJV -
    1 Corinthians 15:1-2 KJV - 1 Corinthians 15:3-4 KJV -


    Colossians 1:13-14 KJV - Colossians 1:15-16 KJV - Colossians 1:17-18 KJV -

    Colossians 1:19-20 KJV - Colossians 1:21-22 KJV - Colossians 1:23 KJV -

    Colossians 1:25-26 KJV 27, 28, 29 - Ephesians 1:7 KJV - Ephesians 1:12-13, 14 -



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    Quote Originally Posted by patrick jane View Post
    Revelation 10:7 KJV -
    Dan 2:44 And in the days of these kings shall the God of heaven set up a kingdom, which shall never be destroyed: and the kingdom shall not be left to other people, but it shall break in pieces and consume all these kingdoms, and it shall stand for ever.

    Dan 7:13 I saw in the night visions, and, behold, one like the Son of man came with the clouds of heaven, and came to the Ancient of days, and they brought him near before him.
    Dan 7:14 And there was given him dominion, and glory, and a kingdom, that all people, nations, and languages, should serve him: his dominion is an everlasting dominion, which shall not pass away, and his kingdom that which shall not be destroyed.
    Dan 7:27 And the kingdom and dominion, and the greatness of the kingdom under the whole heaven, shall be given to the people of the saints of the most High, whose kingdom is an everlasting kingdom, and all dominions shall serve and obey him.

    Rev 11:15 And the seventh angel sounded; and there were great voices in heaven, saying, The kingdoms of this world are become the kingdoms of our Lord, and of his Christ; and he shall reign for ever and ever.
    Jer 23:5 Behold, the days come, saith the LORD[YHVH], that I will raise unto David a righteous Branch, and a King shall reign and prosper, and shall execute judgment and justice in the earth.
    Jer 23:6 In his days Judah shall be saved, and Israel shall dwell safely: and this is his name whereby he[the Branch] shall be called, THE LORD[YHVH] OUR RIGHTEOUSNESS.

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