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Thread: They Made Me Gay

  1. #661
    TOL Legend genuineoriginal's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Danoh View Post
    Actually, in Romans 1:18 through 3:20 the Apostle Paul is laying out a history of various of God's revealing of His will and or expectations of man in progressively clearer and clearer revelations, and man's having only continued to fall short of God's mark, ending with His revelation of a much fuller picture of His expected will of man towards Him: The Law.
    You are dodging the issue.
    Quote Originally Posted by Danoh View Post
    That out of the way, he returns back to the issue of the Glory of the Son's work ALONE that he began all that with, way back in...

    Romans 1:16 For I am not ashamed of the gospel of Christ: for it is the power of God unto salvation to every one that believeth; to the Jew first, and also to the Greek. 1:17 For therein is the righteousness of God revealed from faith to faith: as it is written, The just shall live by faith.
    You are misunderstanding the quote about the just (righteous) shall live by faith (their faithfulness).

    Quote Originally Posted by Danoh View Post
    justification can only be by faith and not by anyone's behaviours, or lack thereof):
    3:31 Do we then make void the law through faith? God forbid: yea, we establish the law.
    Paul was saying we establish (stand by) the law by our behaviour, and that God forbids making the law void (abolished) by our beliefs.

    Quote Originally Posted by Danoh View Post
    Man sins because he is a sinner; he is not a sinner because he sins.
    Original Sin is a heresy that Augustine brought into Christianity from Manichaeism.
    The Bible clearly teaches that man is a sinner because he sins.
    A person does not murder because he is a murderer, a person is a murderer because he commits murder.

    Quote Originally Posted by Danoh View Post
    Romans 6:17 But God be thanked, that ye were the servants of sin, but ye have obeyed from the heart that form of doctrine which was delivered you. 6:18 Being then made free from sin, ye became the servants of righteousness.

    In other words, it is not man's behaviour that is the issue, rather his identity - the fact of his having been born in Adam compels a rebellion in him.
    Without relying on the heresy of Original Sin, your statement is meaningless.
    However Paul was clear that it is your behavior that is the issue:

    Romans 6:16
    16 Know ye not, that to whom ye yield yourselves servants to obey, his servants ye are to whom ye obey; whether of sin unto death, or of obedience unto righteousness?


    This is clearly not an identity issue.

    Quote Originally Posted by Danoh View Post
    In this, homosexuality, the Identity, is nothing more than the natural manifestation of the Sin Identity, in some.
    Since there is no such thing as the "sin identity", there is also no such thing as the "homosexual identity".
    Homosexual behavior is deemed by God to be deserving of the harshest punishment in the Bible, death, along with adultery and murder.

    Quote Originally Posted by Danoh View Post
    In other words, within that Economy
    I see that you have a distorted view of the Bible because of the teaching of Dispensationalism.
    Just like the Pharisee pointing out the publican and saying "Thank you God for not making me like him," Dispensationalists are always pointing to the people they claim are in a different Dispensation (Economy) and saying "Thank you God for not making me like them."

    Quote Originally Posted by Danoh View Post
    In short, you'll have to find some other means of asserting your argument.
    Not at all.
    The overwhelming message of the Bible is that God judges us by our actions, not by our identity.
    Learn to read what is written.

    _____
    The people who are supposed to be experts and who claim to understand the science are precisely the people who are blind to the evidence.
    ~ Dr Freeman Dyson

  2. #662
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    GO, you have Law and Grace...confused.

    The Law was PERFORMANCE Based Acceptance.

    In contrast, Grace is ACCEPTED IN The Beloved BASED Acceptance.

    The Law pointed to one's Identity in Adam through the Behaviour it pointed out in one.

    Grace points one to one's Identity in Christ through pointing to Him - to what He ALONE accomplished.

    Galatians 2:20 I AM crucified WITH Christ: nevertheless I live; yet not I, but Christ liveth in me: and the life which I now live in the flesh I live by the faith of the Son of God, who loved me, and GAVE HIMSELF FOR ME.

    Galatians 6:15 For IN Christ Jesus neither circumcision availeth any thing, nor uncircumcision, but a new creature.

    Under Grace, neither Circumcision (not even that one time Behavior) nor Uncircumcision (lack of having engaged in said one time Behavior) availeth ANYTHING before God.

    Rather, a new Identity IN His Son does.

    Rom. 5:6-8.

  3. #663
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    Interesting short video testimony by a Believer who once lived a Homosexual lifestyle.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XG2bZJpueKs&app=desktop



    Rom. 5:6-8

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    Regarding the above video by that so eloquent a Believing sister in the Lord, it remains fascinating to me the difference in results in the Lord that different Believers tell of.

    She relates she still struggles with the temptations of homosexuality her flesh would tempt her to indulge.

    Other Believers report the temptation completely gone.

    And Believers of all sorts report one or the other of those two experiences, as to one temptation, or another.

    I myself still recall that when I first began to see in Scripture what I later found out from others was known as Acts 9 Dispensationalism, my use of four letter words returned.

    I was sharing this yesterday with someone on the phone and they responded that that had been a result of the freedom from the bondage of religion that my having begun to see Acts 9 distinctions like law in contrast to...grace, had resulted in.

    Though I understood where he was coming from (the doctrine that grace not only frees you from the "have to, or else" but then enables you to...be accountable) I had to admit that that had not been the case.

    That only in the moment that I became aware that my swearing had returned, was I aware it had vanished for a time.

    That I had not worked on getting rid of it, rather; that it had not only vanished on its own, but that until that moment I found it had returned, I had been unaware it had vanished.

    Of course, I then proceeded to work on eradicating it's return to my vocabulary, as the Apostle Paul often instructs.

    Still, I found this momentary, very personsal glimpse into these kinds of things, a fascinating one.

    Its questions and answers in light of the Word, remaining fascinating ones to this very day.

    Obviously, the whole of the actual dynamic going on within such things, is a complex one.

    One obviously comprised of various, interconnected components.

    How is it that one Believer reports their struggle as to one thing or another continues, and yet another reports no longer experiencing said struggle?

    As when one Believer finds that upon their first having Believed that Christ died for their sins, in that very instance their battle with one addiction or another, simply...vanished.

    In contrast to those Believers who find that no, their battle did not end upon their first having Believed that Christ died for their sins.

    And the Apostle Paul in his writings (which really amount to "instruction in ...righteousness") appears very much aware of the existence of both those different experiences - in different Believers.

    I greatly suspect the answer to such seeming dichotomies in "deliverance" experiences between different Believers is one the Lord has much more to say on in His Word than most who either struggle with such issues, or who conclude they have arrived at some last word on, have yet to arrive at.

    The study of this dynamic: the dynamic of actual change, remains a fascinating one for me.

    The answer to which, at least for the Believer, is perhaps in what one Pastor-Teacher has often noted is to basically be the Believer's focus this side of Grace: the focus that can be - the focus that is -"Don't judge yourself by your failures (Behavior), rather, by who (Identity) God says in His Word, He has made you in His Son."

    For in Scripture - especially this side of Grace - Behaviour is meant to be impacted by awareness of Identity, not...the other way around.

    1 Corinthians 6:11 And such WERE some of you: but ye ARE washed, but ye ARE sanctified, but ye ARE justified IN the name of the Lord Jesus, and BY the Spirit of OUR God.

    Rom. 5:6-8.

  5. #665
    TOL Legend genuineoriginal's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Danoh View Post
    GO, you have Law and Grace...confused.

    The Law was PERFORMANCE Based Acceptance.

    In contrast, Grace is ACCEPTED IN The Beloved BASED Acceptance.

    The Law pointed to one's Identity in Adam through the Behaviour it pointed out in one.

    Grace points one to one's Identity in Christ through pointing to Him - to what He ALONE accomplished.

    Galatians 2:20 I AM crucified WITH Christ: nevertheless I live; yet not I, but Christ liveth in me: and the life which I now live in the flesh I live by the faith of the Son of God, who loved me, and GAVE HIMSELF FOR ME.

    Galatians 6:15 For IN Christ Jesus neither circumcision availeth any thing, nor uncircumcision, but a new creature.

    Under Grace, neither Circumcision (not even that one time Behavior) nor Uncircumcision (lack of having engaged in said one time Behavior) availeth ANYTHING before God.

    Rather, a new Identity IN His Son does.

    Rom. 5:6-8.
    You are the one that is confused, but that is only because of 1,600 years of Christianity distorting the meanings of faith and grace, beginning with the heresies that Augustine brought into the Church.

    Don't be deceived.
    The Bible is clear that God is not a respecter of identity when it comes to judging us for our sins.
    Learn to read what is written.

    _____
    The people who are supposed to be experts and who claim to understand the science are precisely the people who are blind to the evidence.
    ~ Dr Freeman Dyson

  6. #666
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    Quote Originally Posted by quip View Post
    I know this post is over a year old but....lol!

    If he'd lose the coin toss bet "half the time" then it is indeed a 50/50 proposition.

    The odds of a coin coming up heads 99 times is indeed astronomical (else something's amiss) yet, his scenario is a hypothetical.
    iff (if and only if) the coin (fairly) came up heads 99 times there would still be a 50/50 chance on turn 100.
    You go with Dante.

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