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Thread: Things known for ages--Acts 15

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    Things known for ages--Acts 15

    The reaching of the Gentiles for salvation was known for ages. It was happening before the apostles eyes. It was the raised tent of David that had fallen. V14 is actually interpreting it before we get to it.

    There are therefore two things in Acts 15's reflective comments that show that the mission to the nations, not a kingdom offer, was the drive of early Acts: Peter's own remark in v7 and James agreement with that WHICH IS THE SET-UP FOR UNDERSTANDING THE QUOTE FROM AMOS.

    The only way to believe D'ism/Judaism/MAD is to fracture these statements in this one coherent paragraph from each other and isolate them as though they each had a disease. Which is my impression of MAD's handling of them.
    Last edited by Interplanner; November 2nd, 2016 at 06:41 AM. Reason: To sharpen the double declaration here
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    Quote Originally Posted by Interplanner View Post
    The reaching of the Gentiles for salvation was known for ages. It was happening before the apostles eyes. It was the raised tent of David that had fallen. V14 is actually interpreting it before we get to it.
    Please teach us
    1 Corinthians 15:1-2 KJV - 1 Corinthians 15:3-4 KJV -


    Colossians 1:13-14 KJV - Colossians 1:15-16 KJV - Colossians 1:17-18 KJV -

    Colossians 1:19-20 KJV - Colossians 1:21-22 KJV - Colossians 1:23 KJV -

    Colossians 1:25-26 KJV 27, 28, 29 - Ephesians 1:7 KJV - Ephesians 1:12-13, 14 -



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    That's as simple as I can go. Tell me the first word that you don't understand.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Interplanner View Post
    The reaching of the Gentiles for salvation was known for ages. It was happening before the apostles eyes. It was the raised tent of David that had fallen. V14 is actually interpreting it before we get to it.
    Was it told to happen in the way it happened? Or did something else, that surprised even the followers of Jesus, happen? Why did Paul refer to himself as one born out of due time?


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    Quote Originally Posted by Interplanner View Post
    The reaching of the Gentiles for salvation was known for ages. It was happening before the apostles eyes. It was the raised tent of David that had fallen. V14 is actually interpreting it before we get to it.


    Gentile salvation has ALWAYS been in the plan of God.
    Through Israel's rise, not their fall.

    Think!
    Quote Originally Posted by Interplanner View Post
    They can't compete with a real writer and grammar scholar
    Quote Originally Posted by Interplanner View Post
    You're too literal to get it.
    Quote Originally Posted by Interplanner View Post
    The New Covenant preceded the Old Covenant.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Lighthouse View Post
    Was it told to happen in the way it happened? Or did something else, that surprised even the followers of Jesus, happen? Why did Paul refer to himself as one born out of due time?
    Rom 16:7
    Salute Andronicus and Junia, my kinsmen, and my fellowprisoners, who are of note among the apostles, who also were in Christ before me.


    The other Apostles obviously taught the "mystery" because they were in Jesus before Paul according to Paul.
    Heb 4:2
    For unto us was the gospel preached, as well as unto them: but the word preached did not profit them, not being mixed with faith in them that heard it.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Interplanner View Post
    That's as simple as I can go. Tell me the first word that you don't understand.
    "The"
    Quote Originally Posted by Interplanner View Post
    They can't compete with a real writer and grammar scholar
    Quote Originally Posted by Interplanner View Post
    You're too literal to get it.
    Quote Originally Posted by Interplanner View Post
    The New Covenant preceded the Old Covenant.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Interplanner View Post
    The reaching of the Gentiles for salvation was known for ages. It was happening before the apostles eyes. It was the raised tent of David that had fallen. V14 is actually interpreting it before we get to it.
    What do you mean the reaching for ?
    "... I have my own private opinion that there is no such a thing as
    preaching Christ and him crucified, unless you preach what now-a-days is
    called Calvinism. I have my own ideas, and those I always state boldly. It is
    a nickname to call it Calvinism; Calvinism is the gospel, and nothing else."

    Charles Spurgeon !

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    Quote Originally Posted by SaulToPaul View Post


    Gentile salvation has ALWAYS been in the plan of God.
    Through Israel's rise, not their fall.

    Think!
    Actually its through their fall Rom 11:11


    Romans 11:11
    I say then, Have they stumbled that they should fall? God forbid: but rather through their fall salvation is come unto the Gentiles, for to provoke them to jealousy.
    "... I have my own private opinion that there is no such a thing as
    preaching Christ and him crucified, unless you preach what now-a-days is
    called Calvinism. I have my own ideas, and those I always state boldly. It is
    a nickname to call it Calvinism; Calvinism is the gospel, and nothing else."

    Charles Spurgeon !

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    Quote Originally Posted by dodge View Post
    Rom 16:7
    Salute Andronicus and Junia, my kinsmen, and my fellowprisoners, who are of note among the apostles, who also were in Christ before me.


    The other Apostles obviously taught the "mystery" because they were in Jesus before Paul according to Paul.

    Hi and there are many verses , and here is another AMOS 9:11 and 12 and going back to Genesis !!

    If Rom 16:7 is true and I say that it is , There are NO Jews in the Body of Christ as Gal 3:28 says !!

    It is a twisting of scripture AS in Gal 3:28 there are no Jews , nor Greeks , nor Bond or Freel nor Male nor Female and it also proves OSAS !!

    Only people saved by the Revelation of the MYSTERY are " in Christ ."

    dan p

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    Quote Originally Posted by Interplanner View Post
    The reaching of the Gentiles for salvation was known for ages. It was happening before the apostles eyes. It was the raised tent of David that had fallen. V14 is actually interpreting it before we get to it.
    Hi and many of us , believe that this the LAST time that Peter is mentioned in Acts , Acts 15:14 as James has taken over in Acts 21:18 !!

    In other words Peter is OUT as Israel will be soon be set aside in Acts 13:46 , Acts 18:6 and in Acts 28:28 !!

    dan p
    Last edited by DAN P; November 1st, 2016 at 01:36 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by beloved57 View Post
    Actually its through their fall Rom 11:11


    Romans 11:11
    I say then, Have they stumbled that they should fall? God forbid: but rather through their fall salvation is come unto the Gentiles, for to provoke them to jealousy.
    You're reading that wrong.

    He is saying that God is not through with unbelieving Israel.

    That it only looks as if He is through with unbelieving Israel.

    Later in the chapter he will again assert that God is able to graft them back in again.

    What Paul is asserting is that God is in fact using His salvation of Gentiles during unbelieving Israel's fall, to provoke unbelieving Israel to jealousy through said Gentile salvation.

    The passage does not stand alone. It is based on Romans 1-3 and 9-11.

    So, there is all that to consider.

    Not to mention, translation issues.

    I prefer studying from a KJV, but ever aware its English is not only an earlier form of English, but a British one - both the word structure and words meanings of which at times differ from North American English.

    As in the word "prevent" in following passage...

    1 Thessalonians 4:15 For this we say unto you by the word of the Lord, that we which are alive and remain unto the coming of the Lord shall not prevent them which are asleep.

    1 Thessalonians 4:16 For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first: 4:17 Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord.

    In our North American English, the word "prevent" is meant in the sense of "to keep from, or not allow."

    Whereas in the Early Modern (British) English (of 500 years ago) it means "to precede, or go first."

    Thus, a rule like "well it means what it says" will only fall short of what else is needed - other rules.

    Like the rule of "comparing verse with verse."

    As in comparing verse 15's "we which are alive and remain unto the coming of the Lord shall not prevent them which are asleep" with verse 16's "and the dead in Christ shall rise first:"

    And then there is the issue of word structure. Again, all the above applies.

    Thus why Rom. 11:11 only appears to be saying that "through their fall salvation is come unto the Gentiles."

    In reality, Paul is asserting that one aspect of the salvation of God that He is now working among the Gentiles during unbelieving Israel's fall, has in mind His provoking unbelieving Israel to jealousy through said Gentile salvation.

    Out the window goes your (Calvin's) doctrine of election, by the way.

    Paul is talking about unbelieving Israel.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Danoh View Post
    You're reading that wrong.

    He is saying that God is not through with unbelieving Israel.

    That it only looks as if He is through with unbelieving Israel.

    Later in the chapter he will again assert that God is able to graft them back in again.

    What Paul is asserting is that God is in fact using His salvation of Gentiles during unbelieving Israel's fall, to provoke unbelieving Israel to jealousy through said Gentile salvation.

    The passage does not stand alone. It is based on Romans 1-3 and 9-11.

    So, there is all that to consider.

    Not to mention, translation issues.

    I prefer studying from a KJV, but ever aware its English is not only an earlier form of English, but a British one - both the word structure and words meanings of which at times differ from North American English.

    As in the word "prevent" in following passage...

    1 Thessalonians 4:15 For this we say unto you by the word of the Lord, that we which are alive and remain unto the coming of the Lord shall not prevent them which are asleep.

    1 Thessalonians 4:16 For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first: 4:17 Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord.

    In our North American English, the word "prevent" is meant in the sense of "to keep from, or not allow."

    Whereas in the Early Modern (British) English (of 500 years ago) it means "to precede, or go first."

    Thus, a rule like "well it means what it says" will only fall short of what else is needed - other rules.

    Like the rule of "comparing verse with verse."

    As in comparing verse 15's "we which are alive and remain unto the coming of the Lord shall not prevent them which are asleep" with verse 16's "and the dead in Christ shall rise first:"

    And then there is the issue of word structure. Again, all the above applies.

    Thus why Rom. 11:11 only appears to be saying that "through their fall salvation is come unto the Gentiles."

    In reality, Paul is asserting that one aspect of the salvation of God that He is now working among the Gentiles during unbelieving Israel's fall, has in mind His provoking unbelieving Israel to jealousy through said Gentile salvation.

    Out the window goes your (Calvin's) doctrine of election, by the way.

    Paul is talking about unbelieving Israel.
    Don't know what you talking about,I read it right.
    "... I have my own private opinion that there is no such a thing as
    preaching Christ and him crucified, unless you preach what now-a-days is
    called Calvinism. I have my own ideas, and those I always state boldly. It is
    a nickname to call it Calvinism; Calvinism is the gospel, and nothing else."

    Charles Spurgeon !

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    Ben
    If Rom 16:7 is true and I say that it is , There are NO Jews in the Body of Christ as Gal 3:28 says !!
    Gal3:28 doesn't say that there are no jews in the Body of Christ,no more than it says there are no Gentiles in the Body of Christ. Are there any golden calfs?
    "... I have my own private opinion that there is no such a thing as
    preaching Christ and him crucified, unless you preach what now-a-days is
    called Calvinism. I have my own ideas, and those I always state boldly. It is
    a nickname to call it Calvinism; Calvinism is the gospel, and nothing else."

    Charles Spurgeon !

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    Quote Originally Posted by beloved57 View Post
    Don't know what you talking about,I read it right.
    Consider that if you knew how to read a thing right (how to properly approach another's words) you would know what any writer or poster is talking about.

    Paul's pattern of thought as to the above is recurrent throughout.

    It is just a matter of getting at what said recurrent pattern throughout...is.

    Where any writer is concerned.

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