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Thread: chrysostom

  1. #1711
    Out of Order Town Heretic's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by chrysostom View Post
    it could have been me
    I had one too many
    went into a bedroom to lie down
    fell on a girl who started to scream
    put my hand over her mouth to assure her I meant no harm
    That's not what you'd do to assure her. Continue to pin her and stop her from making noise. What you'd do is leap from the bed AS you apologized profusely for not seeing her.

    Of course that's not the narrative. The narrative is that you pushed her into the room, onto the bed, groped her, held her, stifled her.

    Either that happened or it didn't.
    You aren't what you eat, but you're always what you swallow.

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    TOL Legend chrysostom's Avatar
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    where is the evidence?

    you are okay with destroying a good man
    -if-
    you are okay with killing babies
    a voice crying in the wilderness :chrysost:

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    TOL Legend chrysostom's Avatar
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    morning sickness

    they have the evidence

    he is angry and overreacted
    a voice crying in the wilderness :chrysost:

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    Quote Originally Posted by chrysostom View Post
    where is the evidence?
    Where it could be, in her testimony. I found them both credible as witnesses. I would like to have heard from some of the people who weren't present and under the light of examination. The alleged other party and the accuser's husband should have been testifying at the very least.


    you are okay with destroying a good man
    -if-
    you are okay with killing babies
    I suppose, but it doesn't cover a lot of people who simply want reassurances about the truth of the matter.
    You aren't what you eat, but you're always what you swallow.

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  6. #1715
    Resident Rocket Surgeon rocketman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Town Heretic View Post
    Where it could be, in her testimony. I found them both credible as witnesses. I would like to have heard from some of the people who weren't present and under the light of examination. The alleged other party and the accuser's husband should have been testifying at the very least..
    Witnesses? witnesses to what? a fabricated story which not one person will corroborate? these were not witnesses there was an accuser and the accused with not a shred of supporting evidence, I saw nothing credible about any of this circus side show. The entire affair was shameful really, and as I was right about Trump winning the presidency I will predict that Kavanaugh will be confirmed and the liberals will pay the price for the sham they have made America endure at the ballot box in November.

    Quote Originally Posted by Town Heretic View Post
    I suppose, but it doesn't cover a lot of people who simply want reassurances about the truth of the matter.
    Truth? this was never about truth TH...this was political hit job pure and simple, now you have democrats crying for another investigation of witnesses that have said it never happened, and an accuser who doesn't even know what, where, why ,or how of the matter. The truth is that an investigation of nothing will produce nothing, and the "truth" has already been revealed, nothing happened that involved Kavanaugh because there is absolutely no evidence to support it but, a flimsy accusation...the burden of proof was never met.
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    TOL Legend chrysostom's Avatar
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    time to vote

    pro life 11

    baby killers 10
    a voice crying in the wilderness :chrysost:

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    Quote Originally Posted by rocketman View Post
    Witnesses? witnesses to what? a fabricated story which not one person will corroborate? these were not witnesses there was an accuser and the accused with not a shred of supporting evidence, I saw nothing credible about any of this circus side show. The entire affair was shameful really, and as I was right about Trump winning the presidency I will predict that Kavanaugh will be confirmed and the liberals will pay the price for the sham they have made America endure at the ballot box in November.



    Truth? this was never about truth TH...this was political hit job pure and simple, now you have democrats crying for another investigation of witnesses that have said it never happened, and an accuser who doesn't even know what, where, why ,or how of the matter. The truth is that an investigation of nothing will produce nothing, and the "truth" has already been revealed, nothing happened that involved Kavanaugh because there is absolutely no evidence to support it but, a flimsy accusation...the burden of proof was never met.

    now now rocketdude - you should know by now that with an accusation of rape there is no presumption of innocence - the burden is on the accused to prove that something didn't happen 36 years ago, something that wasn't a rape, but could have become a rape

    you know, if kavanaugh had actually raped her

    and he could have, because he's a white male

    isn't that enough?

    shouldn't that be enough?

    shouldn't an unsupported accusation of feeling threatened 36 years ago in circumstances that the accuser can't remember be enough?




    to those who answer "of course" - the hardcore left, those sympathetic to feminist causes, those who identify as "progressive" - this will play in November

    to the rest of the country it will be another evidence of the truth that the left is corrupt and immoral and should be denied any influence in congress

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  12. #1718
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    Quote Originally Posted by rocketman View Post
    Witnesses? witnesses to what? a fabricated story which not one person will corroborate?
    Only three people are in a position to speak directly to the narrative. Two of them did. The third sent a lawyer letter. He should have been examined on the points given he was allegedly in the room. The husband should have been questioned to verify under oath that his wife named Kavanaugh years earlier and long before this process began. That sort of thing.

    these were not witnesses there was an accuser and the accused with not a shred of supporting evidence,
    Outside of testimony what evidence could there be to a groping?

    I saw nothing credible about any of this circus side show.
    Then I'd suggest your bias overwhelmed you. I thought the politicians behaved largely like politicians. But that was expected, from Graham's hypocritical charge that the dems were trying to do what the reps did to Obama to the "heroic" tap dance on the other side. Just exploitive business as usual for both parties.

    The entire affair was shameful really, and as I was right about Trump winning the presidency I will predict that Kavanaugh will be confirmed and the liberals will pay the price for the sham they have made America endure at the ballot box in November.
    He will likely be confirmed. I don't believe anything came out that would convince someone leaning in favor of him to go the other way. I was disappointed by the evasion in his testimony on drinking, but I can understand it.

    Truth? this was never about truth TH.
    Of course it was, to the two people for whom this mattered. The rest? I don't give a fried fig about the political talking heads trying to use the process to their own ends.

    ..this was political hit job pure and simple
    No. That's the prepared talking points that I was disappointed to see Kavanaugh advance. Now in case you missed it, as with Gorsuch before him, I have from the start supported his nomination to the Court. Everything I knew about either man has given me every reason to find them able, even extraordinary jurists. So I don't have a dog in the "get him" mentality from the left show. But I wish he'd risen above the theater. I think when he did that he looked great.

    now you have democrats crying for another investigation of witnesses that have said it never happened
    Actually, that's another sore point in his testimony for me. What I've read is that the people she recalled had no recollection of the party in question. That's not the same as saying it never happened, though Kavanaugh used that language as well. And their recollection or absence thereof is understandable. If you weren't in the room it was just one event in dozens from nearly 40 years prior. Who remembers that? I have an unusually good memory, at least for things that interest me, and I'm sure my long term memory has dumped most of that sort of inconsequential stuff. Now if I'd witnessed something unusual I might recall it, depending on the degree of exceptionality involved, but mostly I'd bet I wouldn't nor would anyone else.

    , and an accuser who doesn't even know what, where, why ,or how of the matter.
    If I asked most people about details surrounding the day they got their first car in high school, assuming they did, I'd bet most of the details would be missing or suspect. Heck, cm, I've examined witnesses to traumatic events that unfolded within a very short period of time and you'd be amazed at how unreliable they can be for facts people uninvolved would consider basic.

    The truth is that an investigation of nothing will produce nothing, and the "truth" has already been revealed, nothing happened that involved Kavanaugh because there is absolutely no evidence to support it but, a flimsy accusation...the burden of proof was never met.
    I'd say that an examination of the people I noted might well produce a different weight, but it won't happen. In any event, not even the nominee suggested the accusation was anything more than misplaced.
    You aren't what you eat, but you're always what you swallow.

    Pro-Life







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  14. #1719
    TOL Legend Jerry Shugart's Avatar
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    The sad thing is that conservative and well-qualified judges will hesitate to even want to be nominated for the Supreme Court because they KNOW about the methods the left will employ to try to disqualify them.

    Bork...Thomas...Kavanaugh.

    Any liberal judges will not worry about the process because the Republicans play fair!

    They would never stoop so low as the Dems did during the hearings on Bork, Thomas and Kavanaugh.

  15. #1720
    TOL Legend chrysostom's Avatar
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    it is time to vote
    -and-
    I am not talking about the us senate
    I am talking about republicans
    -who-
    do not vote for baby killers
    a voice crying in the wilderness :chrysost:

  16. #1721
    Out of Order Town Heretic's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jerry Shugart View Post
    The sad thing is that conservative and well-qualified judges
    Good to see you recognize those are two different groups.

    Kidding. I liked the president's first nominee. I supported this one going in. At present I don't. I'm mulling about him.

    Kavanaugh did a few very stupid things during the proceeding that give me pause. First, he decided to advance an attack against some senators present, invoking conspiracy and threw some questions back at senators examining him. That's the sort of entitled arrogance I see in more than a few of my friends born to privilege. It was troubling temperament to see in a judge. To his credit, he caught some of it and came back to apologize for the questioning part, which was out of place.

    That could be reformed. A judge is accustomed to asking, not answering questions. It's second nature. They're also a wee bit arrogant, which that sort of power will do to them. It's one reason why higher justices that are worth a darn will surround themselves with able and strong willed clerks. People who can both lessen the workload and challenge the judge's thinking.

    The second thing he did that was pointlessly, infuriatingly stupid was to lie about his drinking in college. Of course he occasionally drank too much in college--as did by and large all of us. And we've had presidents who drank and did other things earlier in life, from Bush to Obama. No one expects to find a saint in the offering.

    The only reason to deny drinking too much from time to time as a young man went to his fear that it made her testimony more credible. But that was a bad choice, had the same calculated feel as his subsequent "I went to Yale and did a lot of things all the time" in lieu of answering yes or no directly on questions involving whether or not those who said he did drink to excess once upon a time were lying.

    The answer, if he had to try to bs us on the point, should have been, "I drank in college. I did not drink to the point where I wasn't in control of my actions or subsequently could not recall them." But then, he never should have taken that denial to begin with.

    He'd already denied being at the party in question, being with Ford. So what if he drank too much in college sometimes? So what if he drank too much sometimes as a legal teenager getting ready for college?

    What, an admission on that point means he was guilty or makes it more likely? Really? That was true of a lot of legal 18 year olds at parties and in colleges. It's as damning as saying, "Yes, I'm right handed" and someone suggesting it made him more likely to have been the culprit because Ford recalled the culprit being right handed.

    The last stupid thing he did involved misrepresenting the testimony of others as refuting or rejecting Ford's narrative. Saying you don't remember isn't saying something didn't happen. The judge knows that. He repeatedly misrepresented that in his closing remarks to the Committee.

    In short, Kavanaugh needed better prep for the hearing. He should have been told the thing I always told my clients before allowing them on the stand. I'd say, remember that you are the wronged and you are right. Be brief in your responses, honest in your recollection, and civil in your answering. You are neither prosecutor nor judge. Be humble and let your sincerity and focus lead them to your side of the question.


    Kavanaugh forgot that or never learned it and it hurt him when so much of his response was terrific.

    will hesitate to even want to be nominated for the Supreme Court because they KNOW about the methods the left will employ to try to disqualify them.
    Nah. You'll just have to pick Mormons and Muslims from here on out.

    So, Mormons then.

    Bork...Thomas...Kavanaugh.
    Garland.

    Any liberal judges will not worry about the process because the Republicans play fair!
    Garland. Or, never let it be said that you lack a sense of humor.

    They would never stoop so low as the Dems did during the hearings on Bork, Thomas and Kavanaugh.
    You don't have to stoop when you're already down there.
    Last edited by Town Heretic; September 29th, 2018 at 09:52 AM.
    You aren't what you eat, but you're always what you swallow.

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    TOL Legend Jerry Shugart's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Town Heretic View Post
    Garland.
    When Vice-President Joe Biden was the Senate Judiciary Chairman in 1992 he said a hypothetical Supreme Court opening should not be filled during a presidential election year, and that it was acceptable for the court to only have eight justices temporarily.

    After refusing Garland a hearing during an election year Senate Majority Leader Mitch McConnell said:

    "President Obama and his allies may now try to pretend this disagreement is about a person, but as I just noted, his own vice president made clear it’s not. The Biden Rule reminds us that the decision the Senate announced weeks ago remains about a principle, not a person."

    Biden told the Senate during the Thomas hearing that an FBI investigation was useless but despite that this year the Democrats yelled from the rooftops that Kavanaugh's hearing wouldn't be legitimate unless there was one!

    The Democrats demand one set of standards from the Republicans but when it comes to them they declare that those same standards shouldn't apply to them.

    And they get away with it because the mainstream press let's them.

    Now I would like your opinion on the Bork hearing and the Thomas hearing and the way that Dr. Ford's testimony ended up going public.

    Thanks!

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jerry Shugart View Post

    And they get away with it because the mainstream press let's them.
    they won't get away with it in november

  20. #1724
    Out of Order Town Heretic's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jerry Shugart View Post
    When Vice-President Joe Biden was the Senate Judiciary Chairman in 1992
    He's entitled to think whatever he wants. That's not what the Constitution says and what the republicans did then is exactly what Graham was outraged about, in potential, the democrats looking to do to him and his now, except the dems lack the real muscle to manage it without some help.

    The Democrats demand one set of standards from the Republicans but when it comes to them they declare that those same standards shouldn't apply to them.
    What I've noted is that hypocrisy abounds. The republicans are upset now that the democrats might do to them what they did to Obama.

    That's one reason I proposed changing the advice and consent window, or rather establishing a reasonable window to vote up or down. I'd also give Congress a one strike limit. Meaning that provided the American Bar approves the candidate as qualified, Congress can only play politics once. After that the nominee is appointed without them.

    And they get away with it because the mainstream press let's them.
    In what world does the press get a vote? I missed that one, living here.

    Now I would like your opinion on the Bork hearing and the Thomas hearing and the way that Dr. Ford's testimony ended up going public.
    I agree with Graham on the way the democrats played this. I think they did a disservice to both parties while playing a longer political end game. I've noted that, along with Grahams raging hypocrisy on the point. So he's right, but he's wrong, if you get my drift.

    Bork was brilliant, but I don't believe he belonged on the Court. His opinions were too radical. I'd have felt the same way about someone on the left sharing a similarly charged judicial philosophy. The Hill/Thomas debacle was just that and should have been handled the way this one should have been handled...but neither were.
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    TOL Legend Jerry Shugart's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Town Heretic View Post
    He's entitled to think whatever he wants. That's not what the Constitution says and what the republicans did then is exactly what Graham was outraged about, in potential, the democrats looking to do to him and his now, except the dems lack the real muscle to manage it without some help.
    I think that those who wrote the Constitution would agree with Biden and with McConnell who insisted in a floor speech that the vacancy should be filled by the next president.

    “The next justice could fundamentally alter the direction of the Supreme Court and have a profound impact on our country, so of course the American people should have a say in the court’s direction," he said.

    "The Senate will continue to observe the 'Biden Rule' so the American people have a voice in this momentous decision. The American people may well elect a president who decides to nominate Judge Garland for Senate consideration. The next president may also nominate somebody very different. Either way, our view is this: Give the people a voice in filling this vacancy."


    Quote Originally Posted by Town Heretic View Post
    In what world does the press get a vote? I missed that one, living here.
    The press should be the bedrock of our democracy and when I was younger it was. But what is passing for "truth" today in the mainstream press is not the truth and they know it is not the truth. But just like the rest of the self-righteous liberals they have decided that the end justifies the means.

    Quote Originally Posted by Town Heretic View Post
    I agree with Graham on the way the democrats played this. I think they did a disservice to both parties while playing a longer political end game.
    I'm glad that you see that and it not only do a disservice to the process but to the United States of America. People down here where I live comment that America is beginning to resemble a banana republic with the way the process has been perverted and how the Obama Justice Department and FBI and the CIA were and are so dishonest!

    Quote Originally Posted by Town Heretic View Post
    Bork was brilliant, but I don't believe he belonged on the Court. His opinions were too radical.
    The decision as to whether or not Bork belonged on the Supreme Court is supposed to be based on one thing. Was he qualified? And he was highly qualified but since he believed that the Justices shouldn't legislate from the bench and he was a strict consitutionalist the Democrats attacked his beliefs and didn't follow the laws concerning Bork's qualification.

    And the leader of the smear job was none other than Ted Kennedy of Chappaquiddick fame! The Democrats were really concerned about women's rights then, right?

    Quote Originally Posted by Town Heretic View Post
    I'd have felt the same way about someone on the left sharing a similarly charged judicial philosophy. The Hill/Thomas debacle was just that and should have been handled the way this one should have been handled...but neither were.
    So you think that more should be be considered about a Supreme Court Justice that his or her qualifications? The Republicans only considered the qualifications both of Obama's nominees and should serve as the only way that Supreme Court Justices should be confirmed.

    And do you agree with Justice Thomas when he said that he was a victim of a high tech lynching?

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