theophilus (February 26th, 2016)
1 Corinthians 15:1-2 KJV - 1 Corinthians 15:3-4 KJV -
Colossians 1:13-14 KJV - Colossians 1:15-16 KJV - Colossians 1:17-18 KJV -
Colossians 1:19-20 KJV - Colossians 1:21-22 KJV - Colossians 1:23 KJV -
Colossians 1:25-26 KJV 27, 28, 29 - Ephesians 1:7 KJV - Ephesians 1:13, 14 -
Some early church fathers like Origen believed in 'universal reconciliation', and entertained the possibility that even 'satan' might be saved when all things and beings are reconciled in Christ. "all shall be made alive in Christ". There are some that contend that the first 5 centuries of Christian theology was more kin towards 'universalism' than what later evolved into a more exclusive conditional salvation system. Im a universalist at heart seeing the divine will ultimately triumph... love being all-supreme. In such a context, if love does ultimately triumph...then God's will is indeed ultimately victorious, and in the end 'God' does become all in all. The only other alternative is a system of 'conditional immortality' where the free-will of each soul is 'sovereign' as regards its personal destiny, some souls choosing life, some souls bearing the consequence of their final choice as the 'second death' (disintegration of individual existence).
I might add that in some schools...the devil (whether depicted as 'satan' or 'lucifer') has already converted over in the spirit-world and is now serving 'God'. Awesome eh ? Man has enough of his own problems with his own propensity towards sin and selfishness to attain self-mastery over himself, than assuming a devil or 'satan' is to blame for tempting him, for man is for the most part tempted by his own desires. As I've said before,....as long as a sentient being has the ability to repent, there is hope of salvation, since God will not turn away a truly penitent heart or contrite spirit, who calls upon his name. Therefore in every situation, 'repentance' is the key.
It might behoove some that the Bible is not the only artifact of religious literature that contains 'revelation', since revelation is on-going, enlightenment progressive. Therefore there really is no 'closed canon', as revelations are given when the time is ripe for them, during seasons or dispensations. Love's provision is ever available,(unless one could totally and finally reject such love), for such is Love's will and nature to provide for.
I'm going to go a ways with you here:
I Realize that you are a Genius of some-sort not sure how much or far, but I think You Are. - However, it's not just being a "Genius" that is the important thing. It's where ones Ingenuity lies. -- Hitler and Obama are / were Geniuses, but Geniuses of "LYING", and nothing else. - Moses and Jesus were Geniuses, but geniuses of Truth, and nothing else. - Normal People today, regardless of their Genius, it's where their Ingenuity lies. However, I see that your ingenuity / genius lies only in Yourself; not with anything else. There is not Any Single thing or thing written that you can hold to, but every thing that you can but in with your own belief, to make your belief Grow. --- I could go farther, but no need; I think that's enough!!
PAUL, DAVID -- 091215
---"Am I therefore become your enemy because I tell you the truth"???
I trust you did read my past post-response to yours here
I don't claim genius (although I think we all have the 'germ' of genius within, waiting to be developed), but value ingenuity in our craft as we engage in discussion. Our sharing of language (logos) is just that,...hence my focus on 'creative dialogue'.
This space is a canvas, paint as you wish, but know that with each stroke and each syllable we are 'co-creating' with Spirit at every turn,...and all actions, words, thoughts carry their corresponding results or effects. We can co-create anything we like within our powers.
As far as my 'ingenuity' lying only in my 'Self' or in my own 'beliefs',....well,....as far as I know...there is no reality that can be known or realized apart from my 'Self' (my conscious center), the field and nexus of knowledge. I AM. - this very conscious identity is 'God'. 'God' includes All There Is. This is the truth of 'non-duality' where primal consciousness is at the heart of all, - all is arising in this consciousness, so there is no reality apart from this awareness. This is it (reality itself) - it is clearly being.... prior to any words or concepts,...being What IS.
Now of course when we discuss various theologies or religious traditions/cults/beliefs/myths, etc... its 'relative'...figurative, metaphoric, conceptual...word-symbols that we relate to and with in any given religious or philosophical context. Hence we use the 'terms' and 'meanings' commonly understood or defined in those particular schools, or religious writings/culture. That's whats cool about studying 'comparative religions', and universal laws and principles, we get the 'bigger picture' and see how all relates having their origin and destiny in a primal unity at the Heart. 'God' is the primal Heart. Hence 'God' is like the Great Central SUN, and all expressions or revelations of 'God' within various religious traditions or schools....are 'rays' of that sun. I could go on, since this is the essence of the Ancient or Perennial Wisdom
Last edited by ebenz47037; September 13th, 2015 at 09:57 AM. Reason: too big
Last edited by ebenz47037; September 13th, 2015 at 09:56 AM. Reason: too big
Sadly seems to be the case (those stuck on believing in the 'inerrancy' or 'infallibility' of a mere 'book'),.....when 'truth' is about the totality of existence, our experience of it, which includes all our relationships in space, and how it unfolds in time. As far as religious texts go,...I enjoy a variety of them from different religious traditions, each have something of interest and value to contribute to the whole.
For those interested in my commentaries on 'eternal punishment' of the wicked, or ECT (eternal conscious torment) of souls in hell, see here,...a portal page to a host of informative articles as well. In general I find the teaching to be 'insane' since it violates a few if not more principles of justice, equity and mercy,...while preventing the will of God to be fulfilled, which is ever towards the healing, reformation or restoration of souls. It forever denies love its very heart and will. I think the doctrine has done more harm than good. There is more involved here also where it concerns 'free will', but these require more serious research and deeper reflection. With that, I hope you enjoy considering some of the propositions shared, and question things for yourselves.
Well, looks like the latest ECT thread is going down the tubes a bit, with petty banter from meshak's hat, to tit for tat....all the while missing the real language/translation issues behind the word 'aion', its use in ancient times, understanding it in context, and the English translation of these words which stretch meanings out of context.
Not necessarily in meshak's defense but somewhat, more going on about the whole ECT bit, I address Sherman on the matter here.
Also a post to Chrysostom on 'universal salvation' here. - he insists the ECT supporters want you to suffer,...the irony of that, has subtle sadistic undertones behind some sense of divine justice. The universal law of compensation (karma) resolves somewhat the bold presumption of ECT, but with modifiers.
Then, 'Research, ponder and properly contextualize'
Time to trim the fat
Will put you off 'ignore' just for this round, and you've been reported for trolling my thread here.
I'd rather be 'gay' (happy) than depressed, sad, pretentious, sorry or bigoted. As far as me being 'gay',...readers can read my 'report' on this 'claim' in the Woodshed here
To reiterate, whether I'm gay, bi, tri, trans or queer....that's irrelevant and none of your business unless I choose to make it your business.
If you'd actually like to engage in an intelligent, civil, respectful dialogue, or even in this format a debate of some kind, then you can do that, if you're able. Furthermore, as I shared in my OP, if you can digest it,...take an honest look at your own religious-beliefs, opinions, assumptions, biases and see if there is any merit or imperfection in those, - dare to research and question reality, and your concepts of 'God', 'religion', etc. Here at the café, its allowed or even recommended
Have a no holds barred battle with your own assumptions of reality. Do you have the courage to do so?
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