User Tag List

Page 3 of 15 FirstFirst 12345613 ... LastLast
Results 31 to 45 of 219

Thread: Was Jesus real?

  1. #31
    Over 500 post club jzeidler's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2015
    Posts
    596
    Thanks
    65
    Thanked 98 Times in 68 Posts

    Mentioned
    1 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Rep Power
    75464
    Quote Originally Posted by chair View Post
    Quite likely that there was. But that has no bearing on the truth of Christianity or the historicity of the stories in the New Testament. Considering the times, there were likely dozens of teachers in Judea who were crucified.

    Agreed, I'm just trying to lay a foundation for us all to have a respectful conversation upon and grow ideas from this starting point.

  2. #32
    Over 3000 post club
    Join Date
    Feb 2003
    Location
    In front of the strange glowing screen of an inexplicable mechanism.
    Posts
    3,641
    Thanks
    0
    Thanked 43 Times in 43 Posts

    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Rep Power
    173076
    The massive consensus of historical scholarship says YES--Jesus actually existed.
    ____________________________________
    ...terrorism is the war of the poor and war is the terrorism of the rich...




    (STILL trying to set up conservatives and fundamentalists on blind dates with Jesus...)

  3. #33
    Over 500 post club jzeidler's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2015
    Posts
    596
    Thanks
    65
    Thanked 98 Times in 68 Posts

    Mentioned
    1 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Rep Power
    75464
    Now that we have come to a conclusion that there was a historical Jesus let me post another question.

    Was that Jesus like the Jesus that we find in the bible?

    Go

  4. #34
    Over 4000 post club
    Join Date
    Mar 2009
    Posts
    4,569
    Thanks
    38
    Thanked 238 Times in 222 Posts

    Mentioned
    12 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Rep Power
    113854

    Lightbulb

    Quote Originally Posted by jzeidler View Post
    Now that we have come to a conclusion that there was a historical Jesus let me post another question.

    Was that Jesus like the Jesus that we find in the bible?

    Go
    No, he was not. I believe that the Historical Jesus was real but what the NT says about him was not. Not to be completely negative though, I agree with 20% of the NT about Jesus and from him but, 80% is made up of anti-Jewish interpolations to promote the Pauline gospel of Replacement Theology.

  5. #35
    Over 750 post club Hedshaker's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2009
    Location
    http://soundcloud.com/dark-blue-man
    Posts
    959
    Thanks
    55
    Thanked 42 Times in 27 Posts

    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Rep Power
    83282
    Quote Originally Posted by jzeidler View Post
    On this thread my desire is for people to think intellectually through this topic. Please take on the evidence he proposes and bring forth your counter argument. Please do not just ignore the argument, interact with it.
    There is no argument really. The evidence supports both an HJ and MJ equally. I have no dog in that race. Even if there really was an historical figure on whom the stories were based it would make no difference to whether there is any truth to miracle claims.

    It's is only the die-hard believers that have a burden of proof.
    I think it more interesting to be a Rising Ape than a Falling Angel - Terry Pratchet

    ---Science is the poetry of reality---

    Plenty of things happen after you die but none of them will involve you.

  6. #36
    LIFETIME MEMBER Desert Reign's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2009
    Posts
    1,363
    Thanks
    14
    Thanked 186 Times in 118 Posts

    Mentioned
    2 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Rep Power
    454954
    Quote Originally Posted by rexlunae View Post
    About the best that I know if is Tacitus, the Roman historian.

    I don't find it all that compelling as an attestation to the historicity, being a full century after the events depicted in the Gospels, but many do.
    No one asked you to find it compelling.

    Quote Originally Posted by Hedshaker View Post
    It's is only the die-hard believers that have a burden of proof.
    There is no burden of proof in historical study. You have invented this to bolster your own lack of belief.
    Total Misanthropy.
    Uncertain salvation.
    Luck of the draw.
    Irresistible damnation.
    Persecution of the saints.

    Time is an illusion; lunchtime doubly so.
    (The Hitch Hiker's Guide to the Galaxy)

    RevTestament: It doesn't matter to me too much that the "New Testament wasn't written in Hebrew.
    Dialogos: Calvin, as a sinner, probably got some things wrong.
    Brandplucked: I'm shocked that other people disagree with me.

  7. #37
    Over 500 post club jzeidler's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2015
    Posts
    596
    Thanks
    65
    Thanked 98 Times in 68 Posts

    Mentioned
    1 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Rep Power
    75464
    Quote Originally Posted by Hedshaker View Post
    There is no argument really. The evidence supports both an HJ and MJ equally. I have no dog in that race. Even if there really was an historical figure on whom the stories were based it would make no difference to whether there is any truth to miracle claims.



    It's is only the die-hard believers that have a burden of proof.

    I understand, but please either have a dialogue with the evidence that was brought forth and bring in your own evidence. Only please don't say that there is no evidence for a historical Jesus yet fail to bring in any evidence for there not being one when evidence is brought forth that there is one. I do not desire hear say and straight denial without dialogue with an argument on my thread. I desire a structured intellectual and respectful discussion. Doesn't mean that we all have to agree, but we all have the responsibility to dialogue with any evidence brought up and not skirt past the issue. Thank you.

  8. #38
    LIFETIME MEMBER Desert Reign's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2009
    Posts
    1,363
    Thanks
    14
    Thanked 186 Times in 118 Posts

    Mentioned
    2 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Rep Power
    454954
    Quote Originally Posted by Ben Masada View Post
    No, he was not. I believe that the Historical Jesus was real but what the NT says about him was not. Not to be completely negative though, I agree with 20% of the NT about Jesus and from him but, 80% is made up of anti-Jewish interpolations to promote the Pauline gospel of Replacement Theology.
    Thanks for your less antagonistic reaction to the historical claims of Christianity. However, Paul did not teach replacement theology.
    Total Misanthropy.
    Uncertain salvation.
    Luck of the draw.
    Irresistible damnation.
    Persecution of the saints.

    Time is an illusion; lunchtime doubly so.
    (The Hitch Hiker's Guide to the Galaxy)

    RevTestament: It doesn't matter to me too much that the "New Testament wasn't written in Hebrew.
    Dialogos: Calvin, as a sinner, probably got some things wrong.
    Brandplucked: I'm shocked that other people disagree with me.

  9. #39
    Over 500 post club jzeidler's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2015
    Posts
    596
    Thanks
    65
    Thanked 98 Times in 68 Posts

    Mentioned
    1 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Rep Power
    75464

    Was Jesus real?

    Quote Originally Posted by Desert Reign View Post
    There is no burden of proof in historical study. You have invented this to bolster your own lack of belief.

    On my thread please do not attack the PEOPLE, have a respectful dialogue with their argument. If you do not like my rules you may leave my thread. Thank you. Maybe instead of attacking their lack of belief show them the evidence for the historical Jesus I.e 1st and 2nd century historians. Thanks for being on my thread.

  10. #40
    Over 6000 post club PureX's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2003
    Location
    NWPA
    Posts
    6,363
    Thanks
    72
    Thanked 828 Times in 571 Posts

    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Rep Power
    616347
    Quote Originally Posted by jzeidler View Post
    What is your opinion? Was there a historical Jesus? If so who was he? If not what evidence do you have that Jesus wasn't real. Keep the discussion civil. I look forward to reading your posts.
    To be honest, that question doesn't really matter much to me, as I don't base my faith in Christ on 'believing the stories' so much as on practicing faith in the ideals that the story of Jesus' life and death (and resurrection) embody. As I act on that faith, I find that the ideals and promises embodied by the story are true. And so I just go with what works.

    But since you asked, I suspect that there probably was some extraordinary person at the heart of this phenomenal new theological revelation that eventually became what we know as religious Christianity. And I even suspect that some of the quotes attributed to him in the gospels are fairly accurate, just because they are the kinds of things only an extraordinary person would have said. But I also think much of Jesus' story and many of the quotes attributed to him are mythic exaggerations, and are the product of biased religious dogmas, inserted after the fact for the purposes of establishing and maintaining religious adherence, cohesion, and authority.

  11. #41
    Teenage Adaptive Ninja Turtle Stripe's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2004
    Location
    Taipei, Taiwan
    Posts
    17,183
    Thanks
    300
    Thanked 10,243 Times in 7,567 Posts

    Blog Entries
    2
    Mentioned
    30 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)


    Rep Power
    2147823
    Quote Originally Posted by jzeidler View Post
    Was there a historical Jesus?
    Is jzeidler real?
    Where is the evidence for a global flood?
    E≈mc2
    When the world is a monster
    Bad to swallow you whole
    Kick the clay that holds the teeth in
    Throw your trolls out the door

    "The waters under the 'expanse' were under the crust."
    -Bob B.

  12. #42
    Over 4000 post club Caino's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2009
    Posts
    4,368
    Thanks
    117
    Thanked 328 Times in 297 Posts

    Mentioned
    3 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Rep Power
    188655
    Quote Originally Posted by jzeidler View Post
    Now that we have come to a conclusion that there was a historical Jesus let me post another question.

    Was that Jesus like the Jesus that we find in the bible?

    Go
    Something of the human and divine Jesus can be gleaned from the red letters + the presence of Jesus in the spirit of truth as we read his words. But the NT is basically Jesus according to Paul who never knew Jesus in the flesh.

    "Mortal man was never the property of the archdeceivers. Jesus did not die to ransom man from the clutch of the apostate rulers and fallen princes of the spheres. The Father in heaven never conceived of such crass injustice as damning a mortal soul because of the evil doing of his ancestors."UB

  13. #43
    Over 500 post club jzeidler's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2015
    Posts
    596
    Thanks
    65
    Thanked 98 Times in 68 Posts

    Mentioned
    1 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Rep Power
    75464
    Quote Originally Posted by Stripe View Post
    Is jzeidler real?

    If you don't have anything of meaning to add to this conversation please leave. I am trying to engage in an intelligent conversation with people.

  14. #44
    Over 4000 post club
    Join Date
    Mar 2009
    Posts
    4,569
    Thanks
    38
    Thanked 238 Times in 222 Posts

    Mentioned
    12 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Rep Power
    113854

    Lightbulb

    Quote Originally Posted by Desert Reign View Post
    Thanks for your less antagonistic reaction to the historical claims of Christianity. However, Paul did not teach replacement theology.
    DR, without any intention to exaggerate, you would not have the NT were not for the Pauline policy of Replacement Theology in it. RT is the essence of the NT. More so, a Christian preacher speaking from a pulpit, he or she cannot spend 5 minutes without speaking for RT. When Paul listened to the gospel being preached by the Apostles of Jesus, the impression he had was that they were preaching a different gospel about a different Jesus, and for that matter, he would consider them as false apostles, transforming themselves into the apostles of "Christ." (II Cor. 11:4-6, 13, 22) Later, Paul said to the Galatians that he would curse any one preaching a gospel different from his even an angel. (Gal. 1:6-9) The guy did mean business!

  15. #45
    Teenage Adaptive Ninja Turtle Stripe's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2004
    Location
    Taipei, Taiwan
    Posts
    17,183
    Thanks
    300
    Thanked 10,243 Times in 7,567 Posts

    Blog Entries
    2
    Mentioned
    30 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)


    Rep Power
    2147823
    Quote Originally Posted by jzeidler View Post
    If you don't have anything of meaning to add to this conversation please leave.
    I guess someone made you up.
    Where is the evidence for a global flood?
    E≈mc2
    When the world is a monster
    Bad to swallow you whole
    Kick the clay that holds the teeth in
    Throw your trolls out the door

    "The waters under the 'expanse' were under the crust."
    -Bob B.

Thread Information

Users Browsing this Thread

There are currently 1 users browsing this thread. (0 members and 1 guests)

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  
About us
Since 1997 TheologyOnline (TOL) has been one of the most popular theology forums on the internet. On TOL we encourage spirited conversation about religion, politics, and just about everything else.

follow us