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Thread: Do you have to believe in the Trinity to be a Christian?

  1. #46
    Over 5000 post club CherubRam's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by meshak View Post
    that is some lengthy link.
    Well, there is a lot of history in regards to trinitarianism.

    The Origin of the Trinity: From Paganism to Constantine
    by Cher-El L. Hagensick


    http://www.heraldmag.org/olb/Content...%20Trinity.htm

    Link tested.

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    Gold level Subscriber drbrumley's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by meshak View Post
    This is manipulative and trick question. It is not an honest question, dear.

    You are trinity believer, what else is new?
    No, just a question. I have no idea what your answer will be. Maybe you see one person. I really dont know what goes on in that head of yours
    If any of my views seem to be strange or new to you, it is to be hoped that you will not close your mind to them, but will emulate the noble Bereans, and not only read and study the chapters would discuss, but will also search the Scriptures to see whether these things be so.

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    Over 5000 post club CherubRam's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by CherubRam View Post
    Those involved in Philosophy were the Gnostics, they introduced the Sunday Sabbath, Trinitarianism, Hell, Messiah worship, authority of the Pope; the titles, Father, Lord, Rabbi, Teacher, Master.

    There were two different groups of Gnostic's during the first centuries AD.

    The first group of Gnostic's were opposed to Christianity.
    The other group of Gnostic's were not opposed, and joined Pagan notions to Christianity.

    The Gnostic Christians believed in Sunday Sabbath, authority of the Pope, and Trinitarianism, while the Judaizing Christians were opposed to such things as Catholicism [Universalism.]

    1 Tim 6:20
    "O Timothy, keep that which is committed to thy trust, avoiding profane and vain babblings, and oppositions of science falsely so called."

    The "oppositions of science falsely so called." is the opposition to Jewish and Pagan Gnosticism.

    Science is "gnosis" in the Greek.

    Philosophy and Gnosticism is the "profane and vain babblings" the Congregations had to combat.

    Albert Pike, a high prophet of Freemasonry, spoke on the origin of Trinitarianism. In his secret book "Morals and Dogma" he says of the Kabbalist "Jews were the direct precursors of Gnosticism," their Kabbalist doctrine is derived from their captivity while in Babylon.

    Philo of Alexandria was a Jew who played a key role in the development of the Trinitarian theory. Pike says, he was a Kabbalist "a initiate of the mysteries."

    Philo introduced the idea of a trinity to the Hellenistic Jews of Alexandria.
    Philo did not equate the three members of his trinity. He wrote that “the middle person of the three,” was Yahweh, the Father of the Universe, who is uncreated and unbegotten. God, the Father of the Universe was accompanied by two “body-guards”: the creative power and the royal power. God being greater than them. These ideas of Philo made a great impact on Christianity.

    Trinity
    In the fourth-century, Marcellus of Ancyra declared that the idea of the Godhead existing as three hypostases came from Plato, through the teachings of Valentinus. Valentinus is quoted as teaching that God is three, three prosopa (persons) called the Father, the Son and the Holy Spirit:

    These men also taught three hypostases, just as Valentinus the heresiarch first invented in the book entitled by him 'On the Three Natures'. It was believed he was the first to invent three hypostases and three persons of the Father, Son and Holy Spirit, but he was discovered to have taken this from Hermes and Plato.

    Valentinus (also spelled Valentinius) (c.100 - c.160) was known as a early Christian Gnostic Theologian.

    It should be noted that Nag Hammadi library Sethian text such as Trimorphic Protennoia identify Gnosticism as also professing Father, Son and feminine wisdom Sophia or as Professor John D Turner denotes, God the Father, Sophia the Mother, and Logos the Son.

    The Catholic Encyclopedia, II, page 263:
    "The baptismal formula was changed from the name of Jesus Christ to the words Father, Son, and Holy Spirit by the Catholic Church in the second century."
    Have you ever studied about Pagan trinities during the days of Abraham?

    The Origin of the Trinity: From Paganism to Constantine
    by Cher-El L. Hagensick


    http://www.heraldmag.org/olb/Content...%20Trinity.htm

    This link has also been tested.

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    Quote Originally Posted by drbrumley View Post
    No, just a question. I have no idea what your answer will be. Maybe you see one person. I really dont know what goes on in that head of yours
    I don't play your manipulative game for your doctrine.

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    Gold level Subscriber drbrumley's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by meshak View Post
    I don't play your manipulative game for your doctrine.
    Good bye. Your now on ignore
    If any of my views seem to be strange or new to you, it is to be hoped that you will not close your mind to them, but will emulate the noble Bereans, and not only read and study the chapters would discuss, but will also search the Scriptures to see whether these things be so.

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    Jesus nor any of His disciple did not say you have to believe in the trinity to be saved.

    It is that simple. Why do you make your doctrine to ostracize Jesus' followers just because they don't agree with your doctrine? Jesus did not do it, why should you?

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    Quote Originally Posted by CherubRam View Post
    Have you ever studied about Pagan trinities during the days of Abraham?

    The Origin of the Trinity: From Paganism to Constantine
    by Cher-El L. Hagensick


    http://www.heraldmag.org/olb/Content...%20Trinity.htm

    This link has also been tested.
    Excellent Link my friend.
    Psalm 1[/COLOR] and Job 28:28

    Rev 22:14 Blessed are they that do his commandments, that they may have right to the tree of life, and may enter in through the gates into the city.

    Joh 4:23 "But an hour is coming, and now is, when the true worshipers will worship the Father in spirit and truth; for such people the Father seeks to be His worshipers.

    I love the God of my Lord Jesus Christ

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    Gold level Subscriber drbrumley's Avatar
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    Anyone else care to answer the question? Obviously meshak is theatened by the question for some reason
    If any of my views seem to be strange or new to you, it is to be hoped that you will not close your mind to them, but will emulate the noble Bereans, and not only read and study the chapters would discuss, but will also search the Scriptures to see whether these things be so.

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    Quote Originally Posted by meshak View Post
    Jesus nor any of His disciple did not say you have to believe in the trinity to be saved.

    It is that simple. Why do you make your doctrine to ostracize Jesus' followers just because they don't agree with your doctrine? Jesus did not do it, why should you?
    bump

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    Quote Originally Posted by meshak View Post
    Jesus nor any of His disciple did not say you have to believe in the trinity to be saved.

    It is that simple. Why do you make your doctrine to ostracize Jesus' followers just because they don't agree with your doctrine? Jesus did not do it, why should you?
    Who gave you such a BIG word as, "Ostracize?" Seems too big a word
    coming from someone who can barely speak English?

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    Is meshak trying to reply to me after her rudeness
    If any of my views seem to be strange or new to you, it is to be hoped that you will not close your mind to them, but will emulate the noble Bereans, and not only read and study the chapters would discuss, but will also search the Scriptures to see whether these things be so.

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    Quote Originally Posted by drbrumley View Post
    Is meshak trying to reply to me after her rudeness


    I am sorry if I offended you. I just don't play manipulative games.

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    Over 5000 post club Cruciform's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lazy afternoon View Post
    Knowing Jesus heart to heart is the only means of being saved from the wrath to come.
    Your comment here fails to address the OP's question, which I've answered in Post #3 above.
    "The very tradition, teaching, & faith of the Catholic Church from the beginning was preached by the Apostles & preserved by the Fathers. On this the Church was founded..." ~ St. Athanasius (4th cent.)

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    Quote Originally Posted by meshak View Post
    I am sorry if I offended you. I just don't play manipulative games.
    You're just here to make yourself look silly.

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    Quote Originally Posted by meshak View Post
    Jesus nor any of His disciple did not say you have to believe in the trinity to be saved.

    It is that simple. Why do you make your doctrine to ostracize Jesus' followers just because they don't agree with your doctrine? Jesus did not do it, why should you?
    You have to believe in Jesus. And to believe in Jesus, mean's that you want to be the best Christian you can be, not the best person; but the best Christian you can be. (You can be the best person you can be, without believing in Jesus. People try to do that all the time.)

    If you believe in the Trinity, but you don't want to be the best Christian you can be, you should wonder if you really believe in Jesus.

    And stop saying "Jesus' follower's," its creepy. 'Sound's like zombie's.


    Daniel

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