Since this thread has become the official Battle Royale VII Copyright record, I thought I'd paste here the text from Turbo's
post and Zakath's
post:
Bob Enyart: So, if I promote the debate in a relatively high-profile way on my radio show and KGOV.com website, then the audience can know that I believe I won the debate. If Zakath promotes the completed debate in some relatively high-profile way for him, then the audience can believe that he really thinks that he won the debate. Since Zakath has kept his anonimity, it might be more difficult for him to publicize his performance. However, he could do somethings, for example, change his TOL signature to advertise the Battle Royale VII debate with a link to thread 7709. Also, he could establish Zakath.com with a prominent link to the debate. Or, he could go public with his true identity, and in his real-world context, inform his family, friends, co-workers, and any atheist colleagues he has contact with about the debate. Sincerely, -Bob Enyart
Turbo: Or Zakath could give an outside source... say some atheist website or atheist author the right to use Zakaths argument in Battle Royale VII the right to reprint or use for profit or publicity etc. We shall see if Zakath would want to do that or if the outside source would be interested.
---------
Zakath: If I had known beforehand that it would line Enyart's pocket, I would have turned you down flat.
---------
Knight (well before BR-VII began): RULE ADDITION #8 By agreeing to participate in a Battle Royale you also agree to allow your Battle to be reprinted or reused in full or in part by TheologyOnLine and it's various entities. In short... Battle Royales belong to TheologyOnLine and can be reprinted only with prior approval from TheologyOnLine.
Turbo: Did you not read and understand the rules before the debate began? Why not line your own pockets while taking business away from Enyart? You were specifically invited to publish or publicize the debate yourself after the fourth round. Have you publicized the debate in any way? (I have.)
---------
Zakath: The rule reads this way: "...you also agree to allow your Battle to be reprinted or reused in full or in part by TheologyOnLine and it's various entities. " After reading for years that TOL and Enyart are not related, I found it disingenuous, at best that BEL (Enyart's organization) now has copyrights to somehting reserved to "TheologyOnLine and it's various entities." So when did BEL become one of TOL's "entities"?
---------
Turbo: It hasn't. Knight owns the rights. He has the right to give anyone he chooses the rights. He chose to give both you and Enyart the rights to publish the debate. So why are you complaining and acting like you were exploited?
Zakath: First of all, Enyart's post does not deal with publishing the debate (i.e. on the Internet or in book form), merely publicizing it by using links on web sites or comments on his radio show. Secondly, Enyart was merely one of the debators, as such he had no legal authority to grant me any kind of rights over the material THAT WE HAD BOTH BEEN REQUIRED TO AGREE BELONGED SOLELY TO TOL.
Turbo: But Zakath, I didn't link to Enyart's post. I linked to Knight's:
Knight: Or Zakath could give an outside source... say some atheist website or atheist author the right to use Zakaths argument in Battle Royale VII the right to reprint or use for profit or publicity etc. We shall see if Zakath would want to do that or if the outside source would be interested.
Turbo: He not only gave you the right to publish the debate (even for your own profit), but he gave you the right to give others the right to publish the debate (even for profit).
Zakath: As I understand things, perhaps incorrectly, Knight owns TOL, not Bob Enyart. To my understanding, Enyart is not on staff at TOL, nor has he been presented to me as TOL's legal counsel. Knight asserts vigorously that TOL is independent from BEL and Enyart himself.
Turbo: You are correct. Knight giving Enyart the rights to publish the debate does not make Enyart the owner of TOL (or anything like that) any more than Knight giving you the same rights makes you the owner of TOL.
---------
Turbo: ...Knight owns the rights. He has the right to give anyone he chooses the rights. He chose to give both you and Enyart the rights to publish the debate. So why are you complaining and acting like you were exploited?
Zakath: That's odd. I don't recall Knight never notifying me of that change. But there's been so many posts I might have missed something...
Turbo: But Zakath, I didn't link to Enyart's post. I linked to Knight's: He not only gave you the right to publish the debate (even for your own profit), but he gave you the right to give others the right to publish the debate (even for profit).
You are correct.
Zakath: As I read it, the post in question is merely Knight's hypothecating on whether or not I would be interested in giving someone else rights to publish my words, not the entire debate. He did not indicate that I could do so.
Turbo: Knight giving Enyart the rights to publish the debate does not make Enyart the owner of TOL (or anything like that) any more than Knight giving you the same rights makes you the owner of TOL.
Zakath: If Knight wants to give me rights to publish the debate and to sell the resuts, as Enyart has done, then he should do so clearly and unambiguously. Your assertions mean nothing, legally. You do not have any rights to the material one way or another (unless you are Knight).
---------
Zakath: And you still can't get over the fact that your precious St. Bob the Broadcaster agreed to debate an anonymous Internet persona... all for the opportunity to line his pockets by publishing the debate. You people are pathetic...
Turbo: Knight owns the rights to Battle Royale VII, along with the rest of TOL's threads. If he had wanted to allow Bob to publish the debate and deny you the same privilege, he could have. But before BRVII even began, Knight graciously gave you the same rights to publish the finished debate as Bob was, so what's your problem? Don't pretend that anyone pulled a fast one on you. You can still publish the debate in its entirety if you so choose. I bought a copy from Bob last week. I would have bought the Zakath edition, but for some reason, you haven't publish it as of yet. You've never so much as had a link to the debate in your profile or your signature.
Bob Enyart (from his 9th round post): Before this debate began, I requested from and offered to Zakath a reciprocal agreement by which either party could publish this Does God Exist? Battle Royale VII, which Zakath agreed to. I want to thank Zakath for his eight rounds, and express my concern that he has decided to forfeit these last two and thus the Battle itself. Regarding my concern for Zakath, Jesus Christ reinforced the Old Testament teaching that man’s rebellion against God is the great cause of human suffering. And since the world is filled with pain that we humans inflict upon one another, then Zakath’s lack of humility before God means that he is not part of the solution but part of the problem. And the problem includes the extraordinary heartache of human suffering and ruined lives. This is why Jesus spoke so much about punishment for unbelievers. Therein lies my concern. ... ... ... Now, after round eight and the repeated deadline extensions offered to Zakath, Knight informs us that Zakath “is just fine,” but that he will not be finishing the Battle. Knight has called the battle “an official TKO” (technical knock out), stating that “Zakath has been knocked out in the 8th round.” We offered to be even more flexible, and Zakath has chosen not to accept that offer, preferring to quit, and indicating that he will be back on the boards soon. Just like old times!
Bob Enyart (from his 10th round post): Who wins this
Battle Royale VII on
Does God Exist? Often in debates, both sides claim victory. In the Grandstands early in the debate I made a challenge to Zakath, acknowledging that we might both claim victory. I suggested that eventually we will reveal our own true opinions as the participants, as to whether we have won or not. One rule of thumb for discerning if an opponent really believes his own claim of victory is to see if he promotes the finished debate to a wider audience or not. If the one who claims victory puts a permanent link to the debate on his website or in his forum signature, or somehow attempts to publicize the contest in his own sphere of influence, then that is evidence that at least this opponent really does believe he won. On the other hand, if one side claims victory, but makes no effort to promote the completed debate, and even would rather everyone forget it ever occurred (Zakath, are you listening?), then that provides evidence that this opponent does not believe his own claim of victory. Knowing who truly believes he won or lost of course does not ultimately decide whether a certain opponent was right or wrong on the matter being debated, but if the debaters have significant experience in the subject, and one opponent believes his side lost (or showed poorly), that of course is of interest to those evaluating the debate. It appears obvious as Zakath has been posting casually on the boards recently, that he would rather we forget about the debate and just get on with life. (Zakath, I directly challenge you, put a link to BRVII in your signature!) And while the atheists in the Grandstands have proclaimed boldly all along that the atheist side was winning the debate and the theist side was offering no arguments whatsoever, I challenge you all collectively to promote this debate in your own sphere of influence. After all, if I offered nothing in evidence and Zakath so deftly refuted my arguments, then his abbreviated effort would easily outshine my lengthier one, and more so by his succinctness. So TheologyOnline.com atheists, you are challenged to link to this debate in your signatures. After all, it is probably your loyalty to Zakath that kept most of you from making a composite post for the tenth round, so why not publicize his work? Of course, I will promote the debate as I have said I would from the beginning, because I truly believe that the theist side won, while the actions of the atheists will speak louder than their words.
like you even comes here and disguises as a intelligent man. Don't you see that we don't buy into your atheist crap.
Linear Mode
