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  • #31
    Originally posted by hitek357
    If Karla Faye Tucker is to be used as evidence, then Christianity supports conversion at sword point.
    That doesn't make any sense. She came to Christ--that's the important thing! Theo's point was made regardless. No one would think accepting Christ would free them from the death penalty. Just because she became a Christian on death row does not mean Christianity supports conversion at sword point. No one forced her to become a Christian! Duh!

    Comment


    • #32
      Originally posted by Lynn73
      They both appear to be able to defend their position well but I'd like to see one question answered by them and maybe it will be or has been and I missed it. Since our prisons are already overcrowded, what are we supposed to do with murderers, just let them go? Evidently the government isn't interested in building more prisons. I'm for the death penalty.
      Were you trying to be funny? Because that is the dumbest thing I have read! Why would we kill people because of an overpopulation problem? Sounds like China to me!

      Comment


      • #33
        Originally posted by Pringhar
        No one would think accepting Christ would free them from the death penalty.
        Karla Faye Tucker did. SHE thought that accepting Christ should have freed her from the death penalty, you silly.
        Originally posted by Primghar
        Just because she became a Christian on death row does not mean Christianity supports conversion at sword point. No one forced her to become a Christian! Duh!
        I'll TRY to help you understand this: The sword point is her looming executing. The escape clause - at least in the minds of TheoVictus and Karla Faye Tucker - is her conversion. Not to convert means you die; to convert means you live. That's quite an incentive, WHETHER OR NOT IT IS EVER EXPLICITLY STATED THAT WAY.
        Whenever you hear the consensus of scientists agrees on something or other, reach for your wallet, because you're being had. - Michael Crichton

        Comment


        • #34
          Originally posted by hitek357
          The sword point is her looming executing. The escape clause - at least in the minds of TheoVictus and Karla Faye Tucker - is her conversion. Not to convert means you die; to convert means you live. That's quite an incentive, WHETHER OR NOT IT IS EVER EXPLICITLY STATED THAT WAY.
          From what i understand, her actions during the trial were not in line with someone who was concerned about saving their life. Didn't she admit everything and brag about the murders to excess? Why the sudden change of heart? Also, are we really in a position to judge whose conversions are real and whose aren't?

          Comment


          • #35
            Originally posted by theo_victus
            "Forgiveness is taking action of sin through Christ whose sacrifice condemns all sin effectively.”
            (bolding by Redfin)
            Okay, can anyone interpret this for me? Any guesses?

            And, are the combatants allowed by the rules to comment here if they so desire?
            "The truly wise talk little about religion, and are not given to taking sides on doctrinal issues...
            They have no time, they say, for that kind of thing.
            They have enough to do in trying to faithfully practice what is beyond dispute."

            -- George MacDonald

            Comment


            • #36
              i think he means that to be like christ is to forgive.
              Where is the evidence for a global flood?
              E≈mc2
              "the best maths don't need no stinkin' numbers"

              "The waters under the 'expanse' were under the crust."
              -Bob B.

              Comment


              • #37
                Originally posted by stipe
                i think he means that to be like christ is to forgive.
                If so, I think you put it more clearly.
                "The truly wise talk little about religion, and are not given to taking sides on doctrinal issues...
                They have no time, they say, for that kind of thing.
                They have enough to do in trying to faithfully practice what is beyond dispute."

                -- George MacDonald

                Comment


                • #38
                  i wonder if this BR will be accessible to the pagans ...
                  Where is the evidence for a global flood?
                  E≈mc2
                  "the best maths don't need no stinkin' numbers"

                  "The waters under the 'expanse' were under the crust."
                  -Bob B.

                  Comment


                  • #39
                    Originally posted by stipe
                    i think so ..

                    is this a misprint:

                    .you shall give life for life, eye for eye, tooth for tooth, hand for hand, foot for foot, burn for burn, wound for wound, stipe for stipe. Exodus 21:24-25

                    ..??
                    Have you heard of this dude named Jesus?

                    "If you look upon ham and eggs and lust, you have already committed breakfast in your heart." - C.S. Lewis

                    Comment


                    • #40
                      If your child punched another child in the face and knocked out his tooth, what would you do? If your neighbor scratched your car, what would you do? Some people read the passage of Scripture in Exodus 21:24 and in Deut. 25:11-12 and conclude that they should give back in kind. After all, doesn't the Bible say, "...eye for eye, tooth for tooth, hand for hand, foot for foot.." etc??

                      It is easy to misunderstand this passage. The passage of Exodus 21:15-35 is not a passage for individual conduct. It is a passage for the government of Israel and its judges. It contains a statement of the principle of fairness and a limit on retaliation. In the Latin language it is called "lex tallionis" or the law of retaliation.

                      Jesus quoted it in the sermon on the mount because in His day it had also become misunderstood. People were applying it personally in their every day lives. Jesus said, "You have heard that it was said, 'An eye for an eye and a tooth for a tooth.' But I say to you, ‘Do not resist injuries (evil in KJV), but whoever strikes you on the right cheek turn to him the other as well’"

                      http://www.guardian-ministries.org/neye4eye.htm

                      "If you look upon ham and eggs and lust, you have already committed breakfast in your heart." - C.S. Lewis

                      Comment


                      • #41
                        Originally posted by hitek357
                        Karla Faye Tucker did. SHE thought that accepting Christ should have freed her from the death penalty, you silly.
                        I'll TRY to help you understand this: The sword point is her looming executing. The escape clause - at least in the minds of TheoVictus and Karla Faye Tucker - is her conversion. Not to convert means you die; to convert means you live. That's quite an incentive, WHETHER OR NOT IT IS EVER EXPLICITLY STATED THAT WAY.
                        So, does this mean you had a conversation with Tucker and she told you she thought accepting Christ would free her from the death penalty? Wow--i can't believe you talked to her!
                        Since when does converting mean you live? That is just silly. I have never heard of someone on death row accepting Christ and being set free because of it. Even IF Tucker's motives for accepting Christ were not pure, the important thing is she accepted Christ!
                        Who are you (or me, for that matter) to decide whether anyone's conversion is sincere? Maybe my conversion was not sincere, or yours...

                        Comment


                        • #42
                          Originally posted by Primghar
                          Were you trying to be funny? Because that is the dumbest thing I have read! Why would we kill people because of an overpopulation problem? Sounds like China to me!
                          She's not talking about overpopulation in the sense you're thinking, she's talking about the over-abundance of people in our prison system.

                          Prisons are evil and are Schools for Criminals. They should 1) pay restitution, 2) be flogged, or 3) executed.
                          "I maintain my pride in the face of men, but I abandon it before God, who drew me out of nothingness to make me what I am." - The Count of Monte Cristo

                          Comment


                          • #43
                            Originally posted by Dread Helm
                            She's not talking about overpopulation in the sense you're thinking, she's talking about the over-abundance of people in our prison system.

                            Prisons are evil and are Schools for Criminals. They should 1) pay restitution, 2) be flogged, or 3) executed.
                            I know she was talking about overpopulation in prisons. What about the people who are in prison for theft--should we kill them as well?

                            I am so confused. Why do you have such a "no tolerance" attitude? Weren't all Christians given a chance to accept Christ; why should we take that chance away from anyone else? Are we more "worthy" of being saved than others?
                            Christ taught many times that we should forgive others, so I am wondering why you (or any other Christian) is exempt from doing that. Does that teaching not apply to you?

                            I have a question for you, Dread Helm. What does Matthew 18:21-35 mean to you?

                            Comment


                            • #44
                              jesus .. .jesus ...

                              played football for paraguay?
                              Where is the evidence for a global flood?
                              E≈mc2
                              "the best maths don't need no stinkin' numbers"

                              "The waters under the 'expanse' were under the crust."
                              -Bob B.

                              Comment


                              • #45
                                If I may, I know this was not addressed to me, but I believe we will have similar answers.
                                Originally posted by Primghar
                                I know she was talking about overpopulation in prisons. What about the people who are in prison for theft--should we kill them as well?
                                Dread Helm's points 1 and 2 were paying restitution and/or being flogged (whipped). That would apply to theft.
                                I am so confused. Why do you have such a "no tolerance" attitude? Weren't all Christians given a chance to accept Christ; why should we take that chance away from anyone else? Are we more "worthy" of being saved than others?
                                No, we are not more "worthy" we would be carrying out what God commands us (or the government rather) to do.
                                "Whoever kills a person, the murderer shall be put to death on the testimony of witnesses..." Numbers 35:30

                                Christ taught many times that we should forgive others, so I am wondering why you (or any other Christian) is exempt from doing that. Does that teaching not apply to you?
                                Christ said to forgive others if they were sorry. It depends.
                                Writhe in the cruel bloom

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