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  • the four beasts

    the four beasts

    the two beasts of the apocalypse are the last two beasts of daniel

    the beasts of Daniel

    daniel 11 (king of the south)


    back to
    the apocalypse
    Last edited by chrysostom; July 15th, 2015, 09:12 AM.
    a voice crying in the wilderness :chrysost:

  • #2
    islam is the fourth beast of daniel

    the second beast of the apocalypse


    the history of Islam
    Last edited by chrysostom; August 10th, 2015, 03:58 PM.
    a voice crying in the wilderness :chrysost:

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    • #3
      Originally posted by chrysostom View Post
      islam is the fourth beast of daniel

      the second beast of the apocalypse

      the history of islam
      My understanding is the second beast of Daniel, "like to a bear" that devoured "much flesh," is the same second beast of Revelation described as, "another horse that was red: and power was given to him that sat thereon to take peace from the earth, and that they should kill one another: and there was given unto him a great sword."

      That second beast, I believe, is Russia/Esau/Edom...whose symbol is known as the bear. A powerful red/communist nation that takes peace from the earth and carries a mighty sword.

      Daniel 7:3-5 And four great beasts came up from the sea, diverse one from another. The first was like a lion, and had eagle's wings: I beheld till the wings thereof were plucked, and it was lifted up from the earth, and made stand upon the feet as a man, and a man's heart was given to it. And behold another beast, a second, like to a bear, and it raised up itself on one side, and it had three ribs in the mouth of it between the teeth of it: and they said thus unto it, Arise, devour much flesh.

      7:6-8 After this I beheld, and lo another, like a leopard, which had upon the back of it four wings of a fowl; the beast had also four heads; and dominion was given to it. After this I saw in the night visions, and behold a fourth beast, dreadful and terrible, and strong exceedingly; and it had great iron teeth: it devoured and brake in pieces, and stamped the residue with the feet of it: and it was diverse from all the beasts that were before it; and it had ten horns. I considered the horns, and, behold, there came up among them another little horn, before whom there were three of the first horns plucked up by the roots: and, behold, in this horn were eyes like the eyes of man, and a mouth speaking great things.


      Revelation 6:3-6 And when he had opened the second seal, I heard the second beast say, Come and see. And there went out another horse that was red: and power was given to him that sat thereon to take peace from the earth, and that they should kill one another: and there was given unto him a great sword. And when he had opened the third seal, I heard the third beast say, Come and see. And I beheld, and lo a black horse; and he that sat on him had a pair of balances in his hand. And I heard a voice in the midst of the four beasts say, A measure of wheat for a penny, and three measures of barley for a penny; and see thou hurt not the oil and the wine.


      6:7-9 And when he had opened the fourth seal, I heard the voice of the fourth beast say, Come and see. And I looked, and behold a pale horse: and his name that sat on him was Death, and Hell followed with him. And power was given unto them over the fourth part of the earth, to kill with sword, and with hunger, and with death, and with the beasts of the earth.

      Then there is the fourth beast...of Daniel and Revelation. They are, I believe, one and the same...Islam!

      In Daniel the fourth beast is described as, "dreadful and terrible, and strong exceedingly; and it had great iron teeth: it devoured and brake in pieces, and stamped the residue with the feet of it: and it was diverse from all the beasts that were before it; and it had ten horns. I considered the horns, and, behold, [B]there came up among them another little horn."

      The other beasts of Daniel are nations/kingdoms...political powers while the fourth beast is diverse...a religious beast...Islam and this beast is in power in the last days for from it's horns/powers comes the little horn. God through Daniel tells us:
      Daniel 7:23 Thus he said, The fourth beast shall be the fourth kingdom upon earth, which shall be diverse from all kingdoms, and shall devour the whole earth, and shall tread it down, and break it in pieces.

      This fourth beast/kingdom of Daniel is described in Revelation as.....a pale horse associated with Death and Hell and it is powerful. Properly translated "pale" is green. This fourth green horse/kingdom/nation is Islam. As Russia is associated with "red/communism" the color of Islam is green, "the sacred color of Islam."

      The fourth beast of Daniel and the fourth horse of the Apocalypse is one and the same....Islam.
      Revelation 3:20 Behold, I stand at the door, and knock: if any man hear My voice, and open the door, I will come in to him, and will sup with him, and he with Me.

      Comment


      • #4
        Originally posted by Hearmyvoice View Post

        The fourth beast of Daniel and the fourth horse of the Apocalypse is one and the same....Islam.
        why are you mixing beasts and horsemen?

        a horseman may or may not bring forth a beast
        but
        they are not the beast

        did you see my four horsemen thread?
        a voice crying in the wilderness :chrysost:

        Comment


        • #5
          Originally posted by chrysostom View Post
          why are you mixing beasts and horsemen?

          a horseman may or may not bring forth a beast
          but
          they are not the beast

          did you see my four horsemen thread?

          The "horsemen" are the leaders of the beasts/kingdoms. It is not me mixing them but rather God describing them.

          The fourth beast of Daniel and the fourth beast of Revelation is Islam.
          Revelation 3:20 Behold, I stand at the door, and knock: if any man hear My voice, and open the door, I will come in to him, and will sup with him, and he with Me.

          Comment


          • #6
            Why Islam?


            Posted from the TOL App cause that's how I roll.

            Comment


            • #7
              Originally posted by Thunder's Muse View Post
              Why Islam?
              islam is the greatest threat to christianity

              communism is a poor second

              history should tell you that
              a voice crying in the wilderness :chrysost:

              Comment


              • #8
                Originally posted by chrysostom View Post
                islam is the greatest threat to christianity



                communism is a poor second



                history should tell you that

                Just trying to piece it together.


                Posted from the TOL App cause that's how I roll.

                Comment


                • #9
                  Given that all these events are in the past, all you have to do is look at history and the meaning of the symbols is pretty evident.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Originally posted by HisServant View Post
                    Given that all these events are in the past, all you have to do is look at history and the meaning of the symbols is pretty evident.
                    how about some examples?
                    a voice crying in the wilderness :chrysost:

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Once again, your hatred for Islam leads you to wild anachronistic readings of the texts. Please tell, what would be the purpose of a text that would be incomprehensible to readers and hearers of it for about 700-800 years after it was written?

                      Read the history of Israel and the four beasts of Daniel become something more concrete than distant future religions, persons or empires. The beasts in Daniel are surrounding empires that were contemporary with the author of Daniel: Namely the Neo-Babylonian empire, the Median empire, the Persian empire and the Machedonian empire of Alexander the Great. The profaning of the temple referenced in Daniel 9, 11 and 12 refer to concrete historical events that Daniel knew about (in what sense is there a desecration of the Jewish temple by Islam when Islam originated long after Rabbinical Judaism arose, which has no temple in Jerusalem?). The profaning was the desecration of the temple done by Antiochius IV Epiphanes, the Seleucid king, who put a pagan statue within the sacred confines of the temple.
                      "By the tender mercy of our God, the dawn from on high will break upon us to give light to those who sit in darkness and in the shadow of death, to guide our feet into the way of peace." (Luke 1:78-79)

                      The Light Eternal, breaking through,
                      the world to gleam anew;
                      His beams have pierced the core of night,
                      He makes us children of the light.

                      -Martin Luther

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Originally posted by Selaphiel View Post
                        Once again, your hatred for Islam leads you to wild anachronistic readings of the texts. Please tell, what would be the purpose of a text that would be incomprehensible to readers and hearers of it for about 700-800 years after it was written?

                        Read the history of Israel and the four beasts of Daniel become something more concrete than distant future religions, persons or empires. The beasts in Daniel are surrounding empires that were contemporary with the author of Daniel: Namely the Neo-Babylonian empire, the Median empire, the Persian empire and the Machedonian empire of Alexander the Great. The profaning of the temple referenced in Daniel 9, 11 and 12 refer to concrete historical events that Daniel knew about (in what sense is there a desecration of the Jewish temple by Islam when Islam originated long after Rabbinical Judaism arose, which has no temple of Jerusalem?). The profaning was the desecration of the temple done by Antiochius IV Epiphanes, the Seleucid king, who put a pagan statue within the sacred confines of the temple.
                        what about
                        the abomination of desolation?

                        what is preventing the third temple?
                        a voice crying in the wilderness :chrysost:

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Originally posted by chrysostom View Post
                          what about
                          the abomination of desolation?

                          what is preventing the third temple?
                          I just wrote what the desolation consisted of, it was Antiochus IV Epihanes desecration of the temple by erecting pagan statues within the temple confines, the worst possible thing for a conservative and devout Jew during that time. You cannot desecrate a temple by preventing it to be built, desecration presumes an existing temple that is desecrated. The Dome of the Rock is not desecrating a temple, there is no functioning temple there to be desecrated in the first place. The Dome of the Rock was built over 600 years after the destruction of the second temple by the Romans.

                          You are letting hatred being your guide to interpretation, rarely a good idea. Jewish prophecy simply is not particularly interested in distant future predictions, Jewish prophecy is more about a particular perspective on current events.
                          "By the tender mercy of our God, the dawn from on high will break upon us to give light to those who sit in darkness and in the shadow of death, to guide our feet into the way of peace." (Luke 1:78-79)

                          The Light Eternal, breaking through,
                          the world to gleam anew;
                          His beams have pierced the core of night,
                          He makes us children of the light.

                          -Martin Luther

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            That's why I asked - Why Islam?


                            Posted from the TOL App cause that's how I roll.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Originally posted by Selaphiel View Post
                              I just wrote what the desolation consisted of, it was Antiochus IV Epihanes desecration of the temple by erecting pagan statues within the temple confines, the worst possible thing for a conservative and devout Jew during that time. You cannot desecrate a temple by preventing it to be built, desecration presumes an existing temple that is desecrated. The Dome of the Rock is not desecrating a temple, there is no functioning temple there to be desecrated in the first place. The Dome of the Rock was built over 600 years after the destruction of the second temple by the Romans.

                              You are letting hatred being your guide to interpretation, rarely a good idea. Jewish prophecy simply is not particularly interested in distant future predictions, Jewish prophecy is more about a particular perspective on current events.
                              what is preventing the daily sacrifice?

                              Daniel 9:27 [Full Chapter]
                              And he shall confirm the covenant with many for one week: and in the midst of the week he shall cause the sacrifice and the oblation to cease, and for the overspreading of abominations he shall make it desolate, even until the consummation, and that determined shall be poured upon the desolate.
                              a voice crying in the wilderness :chrysost:

                              Comment

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