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beloved57
September 24th, 2010, 06:25 AM
Rom 5:11

11And not only so, but we also joy in God through our Lord Jesus Christ, by whom we have now received the atonement.

The Atonement of Christ has reconciled the elect world to God. It secured and ensured for it [ the elect world] every spiritual blessing needed to live unto God and for His Glory through Jesus christ.

Even before the elect are born into this world as sinners, they have already [by the blood of Christ] been reconciled to God, it will now be a matter of time for it to be manifested.

The atonement accomplished the complete salvation for all whom it was offered for, that is the death of christ. It provides them Faith, repentance, sanctification, redemption, and every needful spiritual blessing to convert them to God, and remain secured forever.

Squeaky
September 24th, 2010, 06:34 AM
That all sounds good without the IF's. But when you add the IF's it sheds a whole new light on the subject.
ONLY CHRISTIANS IF? ONLY LOVED IF?

Eph 4:21
21 if indeed you have heard Him and have been taught by Him, as the truth is in Jesus:
John 6:29
29 Jesus answered and said to them, "This is the work of God, that you believe in Him whom He sent."
Matt 11:27
27 "All things have been delivered to Me by My Father, and no one knows the Son except the Father. Nor does anyone know the Father except the Son, and the one to whom the Son wills to reveal Him.
1 Pet 4:17-18
17 For the time has come for judgment to begin at the house of God; and if it begins with us first, what will be the end of those who do not obey the gospel of God?
18 Now "If the righteous one is scarcely saved, where will the ungodly and the sinner appear?"
Heb 3:14
14 For we have become partakers of Christ if we hold the beginning of our confidence steadfast to the end,
I Jn 1:8-10
8 If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us.
9 If we confess our sins, He is faithful and just to forgive us our sins and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness.
10 If we say that we have not sinned, we make Him a liar, and His word is not in us.
2 Cor 10:3-5
3 For though we walk in the flesh, we do not war according to the flesh.
4 For the weapons of our warfare are not carnal but mighty in God for pulling down strongholds,
5 casting down arguments and every high thing that exalts itself against the knowledge of God, bringing every thought into captivity to the obedience of Christ,
I Jn 2:4-5
4 He who says, "I know Him," and does not keep His commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him.
5 But whoever keeps His word, truly the love of God is perfected in him. By this we know that we are in Him.
John 15:10
10 "If you keep My commandments, you will abide in My love, just as I have kept My Father's commandments and abide in His love.
John 15:14
14 "You are My friends if you do whatever I command you.
I Jn 2:3
3 Now by this we know that we know Him, if we keep His commandments.
Matt 6:14-15
14 "For if you forgive men their trespasses, your heavenly Father will also forgive you.
15 "But if you do not forgive men their trespasses, neither will your Father forgive your trespasses.
I Jn 5:3-4
3 For this is the love of God, that we keep His commandments. And His commandments are not burdensome.
4 For whatever is born of God overcomes the world. And this is the victory that has overcome the world-- our faith.
Rev 22:18-19
18 For I testify to everyone who hears the words of the prophecy of this book: If anyone adds to these things, God will add to him the plagues that are written in this book;
19 and if anyone takes away from the words of the book of this prophecy, God shall take away his part from the Book of Life, from the holy city, and from the things which are written in this book.
Matt 28:20
20 "teaching them to observe all things that I have commanded you; and lo, I am with you always, even to the end of the age." Amen.
(NKJ)Col 1:23
23 if indeed you continue in the faith, grounded and steadfast, and are not moved away from the hope of the gospel which you heard, which was preached to every creature under heaven, of which I, Paul, became a minister.
(NKJ)
xxx The IF's in the Word of God are conditions of love. There is no such thing as unconditional love. God says He will(not is) but will be a Father to us.



2 Cor 6:14-18
14 Do not be unequally yoked together with unbelievers. For what fellowship has righteousness with lawlessness? And what communion has light with darkness?
15 And what accord has Christ with Belial? Or what part has a believer with an unbeliever?
16 And what agreement has the temple of God with idols? For you are the temple of the living God. As God has said: "I will dwell in them and walk among them. I will be their God, and they shall be My people."
17 Therefore "Come out from among them and be separate, says the Lord. Do not touch what is unclean, and I will receive you."
18 "I will be a Father to you, and you shall be My sons and daughters, says the Lord Almighty."
(NKJ)

beloved57
September 24th, 2010, 11:52 PM
Unbelief is one of the sins that the elect world is saved from, thats the significance of this portion Jn 16:8-9.

The Holy Spirit convicts the elect unbeliever of sin and gives them faith.

Paul is an example, he was an elect who in unbelief rejected Jesus christ and persecuted His followers, being blinded by the god of this world, but when it pleased God, He revealed in Him Jesus christ and he became a believer.

1 Tim 1:12-15,16

12And I thank Christ Jesus our Lord, who hath enabled me, for that he counted me faithful, putting me into the ministry;

13Who was before a blasphemer, and a persecutor, and injurious: but I obtained mercy, because I did it ignorantly in unbelief.

14And the grace of our Lord was exceeding abundant with faith [to believe] and love which is in Christ Jesus.

15This is a faithful saying, and worthy of all acceptation, that Christ Jesus came into the world to save sinners; of whom I am chief.

Being saved experimentally is being delivered from unbelief .

16Howbeit for this cause I obtained mercy, that in me first Jesus Christ might shew forth all longsuffering, for a pattern to them which should hereafter believe on him to life everlasting.

The Fact is, no one Jesus christ died to save, can ever die in unbelief, that would defeat one of the main purposes of His death accomplishments.

beloved57
September 24th, 2010, 11:55 PM
Why was it important for those He shed His blood for ? It provided unto them redemption per Eph 1:7

7In whom we have redemption through his blood, the forgiveness of sins, according to the riches of his grace;

The word for redemption is:

apolytrōsis and means:

releasing effected by payment of ransom

a) redemption, deliverance

b) liberation procured by the payment of a ransom

The death of Christ procured the Liberation of His people who had been captive by satan and under his power of darkness.

So all them whom Christ redeemed by His blood are recipients in time of the Spirit of Liberty.

2 Cor 3:17

Now the Lord is that Spirit: and where the Spirit of the Lord is, there is liberty.

It is written of Christ in the OT Isa 61:1

The Spirit of the Lord GOD is upon me; because the LORD hath anointed me to preach good tidings unto the meek; he hath sent me to bind up the brokenhearted, to proclaim liberty to the captives, and the opening of the prison to them that are bound;

also Lk 4:18

The Spirit of the Lord is upon me, because he hath anointed me to preach the gospel to the poor; he hath sent me to heal the brokenhearted, to preach deliverance to the captives, and recovering of sight to the blind, to set at liberty them that are bruised,

So, one of the objectives and effects of the death of christ for His People is their redemption which secure unto them their regeneration, or birth by the Spirit, which gives thm Spiritual liberty !

freelight
September 25th, 2010, 11:43 PM
rom 5:

11And not only so, but we also joy in God through our Lord Jesus Christ, by whom we have now received the atonement.

The Atonement of Christ has reconciled the elect world to God. It secured and ensured for it [ the elect world] every spiritual blessing needed to live unto God and for His Glory through Jesus christ.

Even before the elect are born into this world as sinners, they have already been reconciled to God, it will now be a matter of time for it to be manifested.

The atonement accomplished the complete salvation for all whom it was offered for, that is the death of christ. It provides them Faith, repentance, sanctification, redemption, and every needful spiritual blessing to convert them to God, and remain secured forever.


According to Paul yes,...He had his 'viewpoints' and his own gospel.

~*~*~

There is an alternative view on what 'The Atonement' is, and something to also 'consider' from a different premise and context-perspective.

From 'A Course In Miracles' -


"Atonement' is acheived by realization (first Jesus' and then ours) that we never left God, that the split was an illusion, that no sin was committed and no payment necessary. Atonement is thus the undoing of a split that never occurred, "the way back to what was never lost" (T-12.VIII.8:8). The Atonement releases us from all that stands between us and God—guilt, fear, the past and all illusions—through its realization that all this has never been. Jesus made this principle accessible to us [B]through his resurrection, not his death." (Glossary (http://www.circleofa.org/glossary/ab.php#Atonement))

The Son of God being immortal by nature, cannot die, but thru his resurrection he showed us the reality of eternal life, the immortality of the Spirit. The crucifixion was a mass demonstration of 'attack', the ego's full vengence and hatred to 'kill' and 'obscure' the light of truth, the innocence of love. However,...the Son of God is always innocent, guiltless, beloved of God, and such purity and virtue can never be harmed, threatened or destroyed. Death was a mirage only to be swallowed up in the truth of Life, so the Resurrection is heralded as the truth, while 'death' was only a passage-way to reveal the triumph of Spirit.

The Atonement therefore is open to all who embrace their original state of unity with 'God', which always is. Jesus coming and living the divine principle of Love showed us, that 'he and the Father were One', enabling us to also to awaken to this reality of 'non-seperation'.

The Atonement then is 'open' to all........



pj

beloved57
September 26th, 2010, 10:40 AM
Another accomplishment of the Death of Christ, it ensured the Spiritual cleansing and sanctification of all those He died for. The church.

Eph 5:25-26

Husbands, love your wives, just as Christ loved the church and gave himself up for her 26 to make her holy, cleansing her by the washing with water through the word,

to make her holy, cleansing[a] her by the washing with water through the word,




Jesus pointed that out in His Prayer Jn 17:19

19For them I sanctify myself, that they too may be truly sanctified.

PlastikBuddha
September 26th, 2010, 12:52 PM
According to B57, absolutely nothing.

alwight
September 26th, 2010, 01:16 PM
According to B57, absolutely nothing.
I already knew I was an elect so I didn't even need to become Christian.
Never mind the "Atheist" thing to the left, I just like messing with the already-damned-whatever-they-do.

beloved57
September 26th, 2010, 06:59 PM
Jesus blood shed was in order to sanctify the people, those people he shed His blood for Heb 13:12

12Wherefore Jesus also, that he might sanctify the people with his own blood, suffered without the gate.

Those Jesus Christ died for, it ensures them, the sanctifying work of the Holy Spirit and the belief of the Truth 2 Thess 2:13

13 But we are bound to give thanks alway to God for you, brethren beloved of the Lord, because God hath from the beginning chosen you to salvation through sanctification of the Spirit and belief of the truth:

He prays for this very blessing right here Jn 17:19,20

19And for their sakes I sanctify myself, that they also might be sanctified through the truth. [ see Heb 13:12]

20Neither pray I for these alone, but for them also which shall believe on me through their word;

This applies to all future believers, for Jesus says which shall believe !

Thats a promise that they shall believe, because of the sanctifying work of the Holy Ghost in them.

All this by the blood of Christ, what He accomplished !

beloved57
September 27th, 2010, 03:45 PM
The death of Christ, as i have shown from scripture, ensures sanctification fo those who He died Jn 17:17,19

17Sanctify them through thy truth: thy word is truth.

19And for their sakes I sanctify myself, that they also might be sanctified through the truth.

So, Jesus death ensures the Sovereign sanctiying work of the Holy Spirit, which results in belief of the Truth.

2 Thess 2:13

13But we are bound to give thanks alway to God for you, brethren beloved of the Lord, because God hath from the beginning chosen you to salvation through sanctification of the Spirit and belief of the truth:

Its absolutely impossible for anyone whom Christ died, not to believe the Truth as it is in Christ Jesus, for the Holy Ghost of His, is for certain to lead every blood sanctified soul into the Truth Jn 16:13

13Howbeit when he, the Spirit of truth, is come, he will guide you into all truth:

So all those God wills to be saved and come into the Knowledge of the Truth as per 1 Tim 2:4

4 who desires all men to be saved and to come to the knowledge of the truth.

They will sooner or later be subjects of the Sovereign Sanctifying work of the Spirit unto belief of the Truth.

This is a accomplishment of the Atonement of Christ.

freelight
September 27th, 2010, 06:39 PM
Jesus blood shed was in order to sanctifiy the people, those people he shed His blood for heb 13:

12Wherefore Jesus also, that he might sanctify the people with his own blood, suffered without the gate.

Those Jesus christ died for, it ensures them, the sanctifying work of the Holy Spirit and the belief of the Truth 2 thess 2:

13 But we are bound to give thanks alway to God for you, brethren beloved of the Lord, because God hath from the beginning chosen you to salvation through sanctification of the Spirit and belief of the truth:

He prays for this very blessing right here Jn 17:

19And for their sakes I sanctify myself, that they also might be sanctified through the truth. [ see heb 13:12]

20Neither pray I for these alone, but for them also which shall believe on me through their word;

This applies to all future believers, for Jesus says which shall believe !

Thats a promise that they shall believe, because of the sanctifying work of the Holy Ghost in them.

All this by the blood of Christ.


Did you ever consider Atonement without Blood (http://www.theologyonline.com/forums/showthread.php?t=42351)?

Also,...beyond such....the Atonement still holds as the Spirit sanctifies all God's sons together as One in His Kingdom. All this by the Spirit of God. All who are awakened to remember their original oneness with God,...share in the Redemption.

Murder, bloodshed, death, killing, violence - Is such really necessary? The Peace and Love of God do not require such. What kind of 'god' requires blood, which means the 'death' of a living creation OR a man? We can take 'blood' in its symbolic meaning, metaphor, allegorical significance, etc..... but I think a 'god' that demands 'blood' to pay a price or set up as the only means to reconcile or save another ought to be questioned.



pj

beloved57
September 29th, 2010, 11:00 PM
Titus 2:14

14Who gave himself for us, that he might redeem us from all iniquity, and purify [cleanse see Eph 5:26] unto himself a peculiar people, zealous of good works.

The Atonement of Christ has been successful, and has accomplished that what God intended.

It was for redemption from all iniquity [ to include unbelief] and purification from all sin and unrighteousness. For that was the Divine Purpose for which Christ gave Himself for His People [ church], in order that they should be Holy and blameless before God in Love, unto which cause God chose and predestinated them, that they should be conformed to the Holy Image of His Son, hence it was not possible for not one sin to be committed, which was outside of the counsel and purpose of God, and for which Christ did not give Himself for as an Offering, and make a full and perfect Atonement.

beloved57
October 4th, 2010, 04:43 AM
1 Pet 2:24

24Who his own self bare our sins in his own body on the tree, that we, being dead to sins, should live unto righteousness: by whose stripes ye were healed.

The healing [ Spiritually] is the sure effect and benefit of His stripes [ or atonement], and His death in His own body on the Tree for sins of His church, His elect, His sheep, without fail secures and ensures their death to sin, and their being made alive to righteousness, even the righteousness of Faith.

Many today really do not understand the power of Christ death and it's accomplishments.

beloved57
October 4th, 2010, 05:01 AM
2 Cor 5:15

15And that he died for all, that they which live should not henceforth live unto themselves, but unto him which died for them, and rose again.

Paul here in this context gives us another purpose and accomplishment of Christ death for sinners.

He died for all [ the called or chosen or church] that [in order that] they which live [ spiritually] should henceforth [ no longer, no more] live unto themselves, but [ nevertheless , rather] unto Him which died for them, and rose again.

So the very death of christ, produces in them He died for, a life of self sacrifice, and living unto Him, the crucified life.

This is why paul boasted in the power of the cross in his own life writing Gal 6:14

14But God forbid that I should glory, save in the cross of our Lord Jesus Christ, by whom the world is crucified unto me, and I unto the world.

The cross effects each life of those Christ died for to one degree or another, but it produces results, it bears fruit. Jn 12:24

24Verily, verily, I say unto you, Except a corn of wheat fall into the ground and die, it abideth alone: but if it die, it bringeth forth much fruit.

beloved57
October 6th, 2010, 05:50 AM
One of the reasons why Christ came to this earth, was to be made under the Law, for His Members [ of His Body] in order to redeem them from the curse of the Law, and that they may receive the Adoption of Sons !

Gal 4:4-5

4But when the fulness of the time was come, God sent forth his Son, made of a woman, made under the law,

5To redeem them that were under the law, that we might receive the adoption of sons.

That is to receive the Spirit of Adoption. Rom 8:15

For ye have not received the spirit of bondage again to fear; but ye have received the Spirit of adoption, whereby we cry, Abba, Father.

This Spirit is given Sovereignly to all Christ redeemed with His blood, simply, all for whom He died !

beloved57
October 6th, 2010, 06:24 AM
Gal 4:4-6

4But when the fulness of the time was come, God sent forth his Son, made of a woman, made under the law,

5To redeem them that were under the law, that we might receive the adoption of sons.

6And because ye are sons, God hath sent forth the Spirit of his Son into your hearts, crying, Abba, Father.



The objects of redemption when Christ was made of a women, that is, when He was made Flesh and Blood, it was not for all of mankind, but for the seed of Abraham per Heb 2:14-16


14Forasmuch then as the children are partakers of flesh and blood, he also himself likewise took part of the same; that through death he might destroy him that had the power of death, that is, the devil;

15And deliver them who through fear of death were all their lifetime subject to bondage.

16For verily he took not on him the nature of angels; but he took on him the seed of Abraham.

His Flesh and Blood Identification, when made under the Law, born of a women [ The virgin birth] was limited to a certain segment of mankind, the seed of Abraham.

And this seed, was not limited to a certain segment of mankind, as the jews may have thought, but it consisted in all who would believe in Christ, jew or gentile Gal 3:29

And if ye be Christ's, then are ye Abraham's seed, and heirs according to the promise.

So, Christ was made under the Law, born of a women, to Redeem the seed of Abraham, all those who should believe in Him through the Spirit of adoption !

Redemption secures unto Christ believers in Him [of the seed of Abraham], by the Working of the Spirit of Adoption !

yeshuaslavejeff
October 6th, 2010, 06:38 AM
That all sounds good without the IF's. But when you add the IF's it sheds a whole new light on the subject.
ONLY CHRISTIANS IF? ONLY LOVED IF?

Eph 4:21
21 if indeed you have heard Him and have been taught by Him, as the truth is in Jesus:
John 6:29
29 Jesus answered and said to them, "This is the work of God, that you believe in Him whom He sent."
Matt 11:27
27 "All things have been delivered to Me by My Father, and no one knows the Son except the Father. Nor does anyone know the Father except the Son, and the one to whom the Son wills to reveal Him.
1 Pet 4:17-18
17 For the time has come for judgment to begin at the house of God; and if it begins with us first, what will be the end of those who do not obey the gospel of God?
18 Now "If the righteous one is scarcely saved, where will the ungodly and the sinner appear?"
Heb 3:14
14 For we have become partakers of Christ if we hold the beginning of our confidence steadfast to the end,
........15 And what accord has Christ with Belial? Or what part has a believer with an unbeliever?
16 And what agreement has the temple of God with idols? For you are the temple of the living God. As God has said: "I will dwell in them and walk among them. I will be their God, and they shall be My people."
17 Therefore "Come out from among them and be separate, says the Lord. Do not touch what is unclean, and I will receive you."
18 "I will be a Father to you, and you shall be My sons and daughters, says the Lord Almighty."
(NKJ)

the 'ifs' are important. ignore them at risk of dying eternally.
note that catholics claim or believe all the promises, yet receive not life.
'if' one receives life, he is kicked out and is no longer a catholic, because the religious leaders cannot tolerate truth, life, nor Christ.
(watch how many of them will argue, all to no avail - they remain dead in their trespasses and sin, deceived by ol' slewfoot)

beloved57
October 7th, 2010, 12:33 AM
In being made of a woman and made under law, He took on the seed of Abraham and not the seed of mankind in general, for all mankind is not the Seed of Abraham Heb 2:16

16For verily he took not on him the nature of angels; but he took on him the seed of Abraham.

Now in taking on the seed of Abraham, Paul says that He was made sin for us !

2 Cor 5:21

21For he hath made him to be sin for us [The seed of Abraham], who knew no sin; that we might be made the righteousness of God in him.

Who are the us in 2 Cor 5:21 that Paul is referring to ? Is it all mankind without exception ? No it is not. Let us examine the scripture to find the answer. " When the fulness of time had come, God sent forth His own Son [meaning He was God's Son before Mary's Son], made of a women, made under the law, to redeem [ not to make redemption possible] them [ His members, His body] that were under the Law [Limited redemption]that [in order that] they may receive the adoption of Sons.

Now coming as such [ under the law] He came and took upon Him the seed of Abraham. The seed of Abraham is a chosen people !

Ps 105:6

O ye seed of Abraham his servant, ye children of Jacob his chosen.

Isa 41:8

But thou, Israel, art my servant, Jacob whom I have chosen, the seed of Abraham my friend.

So its plain that He came and Identified with and to redeem a Chosen People, and not the whole world of mankind.

In taking on the seed of Abraham, He took on all their Transgressions, and died for their sins !

Isa 53:4-11

4Surely he hath borne our [seed of Abraham] griefs, and carried our sorrows: yet we did esteem him stricken, smitten of God, and afflicted.


5But he was wounded for our transgressions, he was bruised for our iniquities: the chastisement of our peace was upon him; and with his stripes we are healed.

6All we like sheep have gone astray; we have turned every one to his own way; and the LORD hath laid on him the iniquity of us all.

7He was oppressed, and he was afflicted, yet he opened not his mouth: he is brought as a lamb to the slaughter, and as a sheep before her shearers is dumb, so he openeth not his mouth.

8He was taken from prison and from judgment: and who shall declare his generation? for he was cut off out of the land of the living: for the transgression of my people was he stricken.

9And he made his grave with the wicked, and with the rich in his death; because he had done no violence, neither was any deceit in his mouth.

10Yet it pleased the LORD to bruise him; he hath put him to grief: when thou shalt make his soul an offering for sin, he shall see his seed [The seed of Abraham], he shall prolong his days, and the pleasure of the LORD shall prosper in his hand.

11He shall see of the travail of his soul, and shall be satisfied: by his knowledge shall my righteous servant justify many [The seed of Abraham]; for he shall bear their [The seed of Abraham] iniquities.

1 Cor 15:3

3For I delivered unto you first of all that which I also received, how that Christ died for our [The seed of Abraham] sins according to the scriptures;

Yes, in all places above where we see the pronouns our, us, we, their, it refers to the Seed of Abraham !

Lets not forget it is written that He took on the seed of Abraham Heb 2:16

16For verily he took not on him the nature of angels; but he took on him the seed of Abraham.

beloved57
October 9th, 2010, 07:34 AM
In taking on the seed of Abraham, being made sin for us, what does this mean ? Does it mean that He actually became sin , as I understand some believe ? No, not at all; but what it does mean is that He became our sin offering, by bearing our sins Isa 53:11-12

11He shall see of the travail of his soul, and shall be satisfied: by his knowledge shall my righteous servant justify many; for he shall bear their iniquities.

12Therefore will I divide him a portion with the great, and he shall divide the spoil with the strong; because he hath poured out his soul unto death: and he was numbered with the transgressors; and he bare the sin of many, and made intercession for the transgressors.

The word bare in this verse is the hebrew word
nasa' and means:

to cause one to bear (iniquity)

To receive the punishment of sin upon oneself for others !

Heb 9:28

28So Christ was once offered to bear the sins of many; and unto them that look for him shall he appear the second time without sin unto salvation.

1 Pet 2:24

24Who his own self bare our [seed of Abraham] sins in his own body on the tree, that we, being dead to sins, should live unto righteousness: by whose stripes ye were healed.

1 Jn 3:5

5And ye know that he was manifested to take away our [seed of Abraham] sins; and in him is no sin.

Like the scape goat, He bare away the sins of Israel, that is took them away cp Jn 1:29

29The next day John seeth Jesus coming unto him, and saith, Behold the Lamb of God, which taketh away the sin of the world.

Lets not forget in this connection that it is written that he took on the seed of Abraham Heb 2:16

16For verily he took not on him the nature of angels; but he took on him the seed of Abraham.

For it was with this seed only He stood Identified with, in lieu of the seed of the serpent !

It was for this seed he bare their sins in His body on the tree, for it was as the seed of Abraham that he was recognized by the law and justice of God, as being responsible for their sins. So He was made a sin offering for their sins, bearing their sins in His body on the Tree.

beloved57
October 9th, 2010, 09:02 AM
Heb 2:16

16For verily he took not on him the nature of angels; but he took on him the seed of Abraham.

For it was with this seed only He stood Identified with, in lieu of the seed of the serpent !

It was for this seed he bare their sins in His body on the tree, for it was as the seed of Abraham that he was recognized by the law and justice of God, as being responsible for their sins. So He was made a sin offering for their sins, bearing their sins in His body on the Tree.

Think with me for a moment, if a crime is committed by ones hand, is not true that the life of the body of which that hand is a member be liable to law and justice for the crime ? For thats why it is written that Jesus is the Saviour of the body per Eph 5:23

23For the husband is the head of the wife, even as Christ is the head of the church: and he is the Saviour of the body.

In line with this Truth and subject, the High Priest confessed the sins of Israel [ the seed of Abraham] only over the head of the scape goat, and it was said their [ Israel's] sins were laid upon the head of the scapegoat and borne away per Lev 16:20-22


20And when he hath made an end of reconciling the holy place, and the tabernacle of the congregation, and the altar, he shall bring the live goat:

21And Aaron shall lay both his hands upon the head of the live goat, and confess over him all the iniquities of the children of Israel, and all their transgressions in all their sins, putting them upon the head of the goat, and shall send him away by the hand of a fit man into the wilderness:

22And the goat shall bear upon him all their iniquities unto a land not inhabited: and he shall let go the goat in the wilderness.

It is in this way Jesus was made sin for the sins of us [ The seed of Abraham] by becoming their sin bearer; for He was also made a curse for His People Gal 3:13

13Christ hath redeemed us [seed of Abraham] from the curse of the law, being made a curse for us [seed of Abraham]: for it is written, Cursed is every one that hangeth on a tree:

beloved57
October 9th, 2010, 10:15 AM
It is in this way Jesus was made sin for the sins of us [ The seed of Abraham] by becoming their sin bearer; for He was also made a curse for His People Gal 3:13

13Christ hath redeemed us [seed of Abraham] from the curse of the law, being made a curse for us [seed of Abraham]: for it is written, Cursed is every one that hangeth on a tree:

The first we read of any curse is Gen 3:17

17And unto Adam he said, Because thou hast hearkened unto the voice of thy wife, and hast eaten of the tree, of which I commanded thee, saying, Thou shalt not eat of it: cursed is the ground for thy sake; in sorrow shalt thou eat of it all the days of thy life;

and this curse is the result of Adam's Sin who BTW is the Forefather of Abraham see Lk 3:34 which was the breaking of the Law of God, the covenant of God, that Adam broke covenant is seen here:

Hos 6:7

But they like men [Adam] have transgressed the covenant: there have they dealt treacherously against me.

Well Christ as the substitute on the cross for the sins of the seed of Abraham, not only bore the curse for them, but became a curse for them, so that, when Christ took away their sin on the Tree, He redeemed them out of the curse of the Law and Covenant Deut 29:21

And the LORD shall separate him unto evil out of all the tribes of Israel, according to all the curses of the covenant that are written in this book of the law:

Gods people whom Christ died for can never be called cursed i.e Num 23:7-8

7And he took up his parable, and said, Balak the king of Moab hath brought me from Aram, out of the mountains of the east, saying, Come, curse me Jacob, and come, defy Israel.

8How shall I curse, whom God hath not cursed? or how shall I defy, whom the LORD hath not defied?

cp 2 Cor 5:19 & Rom 8:33

For Christ has become a curse for them already and has borne all their charges !

Now, it should go without saying that those who will yet hear these words from The Saviour, the Seed of Abraham Matt 25:41

41Then shall he say also unto them on the left hand, Depart from me, ye cursed, into everlasting fire, prepared for the devil and his angels:

cannot be any for whom Christ died for substituted for. Those can be only cursed for this Gal 3:10

10For as many as are of the works of the law are under the curse: for it is written, Cursed is every one that continueth not in all things which are written in the book of the law to do them.

These are born under the curse of the law and remain so, with no redemption, and so shall hear those dreadful words in the day of Judgment.

They were not of the seed of Abraham or of the woman, but of the seed of the serpent ! see Gen 3:14-15

beloved57
October 9th, 2010, 10:14 PM
Now, regarding the substitutionary death of Christ for sinners, that in and of itself was not able to meet the righteous demands of God's Law, for to merely punish the innocent and clear the guilty was also a violation of Gods Law which Christ came to fulfill. Prov 17:15

He that justifieth the wicked, and he that condemneth the just, even they both are abomination to the LORD.

However, the Head being Identified with it's body may be charged for the crimes of the body i.e Eph 5:23,30

23For the husband is the head of the wife, even as Christ is the head of the church: and he is the Saviour of the body.

30For we are members of his body, of his flesh, and of his bones.

He identified with His body in taking on the seed of Abraham ! He had the redeemers right to redeem His people as the nearest of kin to them, and holding by virtue of a higher status, as the firstborn in the seed of Abraham, because they too partook of flesh and blood Heb 2:14,16b


14Forasmuch then as the children are partakers of flesh and blood, he also himself likewise took part of the same;

16b but he took on him the seed of Abraham.

You see, He substituted for those who were of the seed of Abraham, they all belonged to the same seed line, He and they !

Damian
October 9th, 2010, 10:40 PM
What did it [the Atonement] REALLY accomplish?

I believe the atonement doctrine (as portrayed by traditional Christianity) fosters a God of fear, not of love.

Jesus said, "To the ego sin means death, and so atonement is achieved through murder. Salvation is looked upon as a way by which the Son of God was killed instead of you." ("A Course in Miracles")

* Selah *

beloved57
November 9th, 2010, 09:38 AM
When did God make us alive together with Christ ?

Eph 2:4-6



4But God, who is rich in mercy, for his great love wherewith he loved us,

5Even when we were dead in sins, hath quickened us together with Christ, (by grace ye are saved)

6And hath raised us up together, and made us sit together in heavenly places in Christ Jesus:

The answer to the question is in purpose and objectively we were raised up together with Christ at the same time He was raised up by The Father. That is what Paul is teaching here.

beloved57
December 31st, 2010, 12:02 PM
The Atonement of Christ accomplished the building of Christ Church !

Matt 16:18

18And I say also unto thee, That thou art Peter, and upon this rock I will build my church; and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it.

Jesus here did not mean a literal church building, but His People, True believers in Him, upon the rock of He being the Christ, the Son of the Living God, and the shedding of His Blood..

Within this statement Jesus ensures believers in Himself, that is all that the Father hath given Him. His building His Church produces believers, Notice Jesus states " I will build my Church " take that freewillers, for Christ depends solely on His will and not yours to build His Church.

The word build is the greek word:

oikodomeō and means:


to build a house, erect a building

a) to build (up from the foundation)

b) to restore by building, to rebuild, repair2) metaph.

a) to found, establish

b) to promote growth in Christian wisdom, affection, grace, virtue, holiness, blessedness

c) to grow in wisdom and piety

This Ideal is conveyed in Acts 15 when James quotes scripture prophecy Acts 15:13-16
13And after they had held their peace, James answered, saying, Men and brethren, hearken unto me:

14Simeon hath declared how God at the first did visit the Gentiles, to take out of them a people for his name.

15And to this agree the words of the prophets; as it is written,

16After this I will return, and will build again the tabernacle of David, which is fallen down; and I will build again the ruins thereof, and I will set it up:

This also means that Christ Church was in the OT as well..

And Christ assures us that the gates of Hell shall not prevail against it !

The gates of hell cannot prevent one for whom Christ died from believing in Christ nor from going to heaven..If anyone of the church that the blood of Christ purchased as per Acts 20:28b

to feed the church of God, which he hath purchased with his own blood.

If anyone of them perish for their sins, then the gates of hell prevailed against the Church that Christ said He would build. If anyone of that Church dies in unbelief and perish in their sins as per Jn 8:24

24I said therefore unto you, that ye shall die in your sins: for if ye believe not that I am he, ye shall die in your sins.

Then the gates of hell prevailed against Christ building His Church.

If one goes to hell its because the gates of hell prevailed against them, that is the devil prevailed against them.. Unbelief is due to the devil blinding us 2 Cor 4:3

3But if our gospel be hid, it is hid to them that are lost:

4In whom the god of this world hath blinded the minds of them which believe not,

Lk 8:12

12Those by the way side are they that hear; then cometh the devil, and taketh away the word out of their hearts, lest they should believe and be saved.

So yes, unbelief is due to the devil being victorious ! He prevails preventing one to believe and be saved..Paul says this:

2 Thess 2:10

And with all deceivableness of unrighteousness in them that perish; because they received not the love of the truth, that they might be saved.

Satan, the Devil, the gates of Hell is prevailing against such as these..

But Jesus Christ by His Atoning death will build a community of believers in Him, that shall follow Him..

He says as a complement to Matt 16:18 this Jn 12:32


32And I, if I be lifted up from the earth, will draw all men unto me.

Thats His building, His drawing all to Him that He was lifted up for as the Son of the Living God..

Caino
January 1st, 2011, 06:02 PM
"Righteousness implies that God is the source of the moral law of the universe. Truth exhibits God as a revealer, as a teacher. But love gives and craves affection, seeks understanding fellowship such as exists between parent and child. Righteousness may be the divine thought, but love is a father’s attitude. The erroneous supposition that the righteousness of God was irreconcilable with the selfless love of the heavenly Father, presupposed absence of unity in the nature of Deity and led directly to the elaboration of the atonement doctrine, which is a philosophic assault upon both the unity and the free-willness of God."



Jesus taught and practiced his religion (the gospel of the kingdom of heaven) for 3 years before he ever voluntarily shared death with humanity as an act of Love. He never taught human sacrifice nor the atonement doctrine. Sacrifice minded Jewish converts to Christianity assumed the atonement doctrine.

The atonement doctrine is a fallacy and only acts to obscure the living truth of the Father's love for mankind.


Caino

StrivesWithGod
January 1st, 2011, 06:24 PM
Beloved, how is grace applied to the believer?

beloved57
January 1st, 2011, 07:04 PM
Beloved, how is grace applied to the believer?

You tell me ! You do not even believe that Christ death is efficacious !

beloved57
January 1st, 2011, 07:08 PM
caino:


Righteousness implies that God is the source of the moral law of the universe.

Christ death accomplished, that whoever He died for, they shall be made righteous..Rom 5:19m

so by the obedience of one shall many be made righteous.

beloved57
January 17th, 2011, 08:38 AM
Heb 9:13


13For if the blood of bulls and of goats, and the ashes of an heifer sprinkling the unclean, sanctifieth to the purifying of the flesh:

14How much more shall the blood of Christ, who through the eternal Spirit offered himself without spot to God, purge your conscience from dead works to serve the living God?

Those who believe that the atoning death of Christ does not purify all for whom He died, you are reducing the preciuos blood of the Son of God to be even less effective than the blood of bulls and goats, and the ashes of an heifer that accomplished the purifying of the flesh, which was actually a type of what the Blood of Christ does..

Whereas the animal blood only provided outward sanctification and purification, the blood of Christ accomplished a purification of the inmost being, for it [His blood] actually purifies the conscience from dead works to serve the Living God..

Anyone who never comes to serve the Living God, Christ did not shed His blood for them, or His blood was ineffectual ..

beloved57
January 29th, 2011, 02:13 AM
Rom 5:17


17For if by one man's offence death reigned by one; much more they which receive abundance of grace and of the gift of righteousness shall reign in life by one, Jesus Christ.)

This is another scripture that proclaims the effects of Christ death unto those He died for, they shall reign in life by one..

Thats because the ones He died for will receive abundance of Grace and the Free Gift of righteousness..

Paul writes on down in vs 19, that all those Christ died for shall be made righteous, hence the free gift of righteousness..

The word receive here does not mean a offer was made and received or could have been rejected, but it means effectually given or applied to the ones receiving; Just like through Adam, men received death, we received condemnation, they were not offered to us but made to apply to us.

Those Jesus died for reign in this life because Jesus by His blood hath made us a Kingdom..Rev 1:5-6

5And from Jesus Christ, who is the faithful witness, and the first begotten of the dead, and the prince of the kings of the earth. Unto him that loved us, and washed us from our sins in his own blood,

6And hath made us kings and priests unto God and his Father; to him be glory and dominion for ever and ever. Amen.

Notice vs 6 He hath made us King and Priest, being washed in His blood.

Thats why Paul says they shall regin in life, the atoning blood of Christ produces that effect..

Jesus blood made those He died for a Kingdom, we are kings and priests soley because of His Blood.

Lost Comet
January 29th, 2011, 02:24 AM
The Atonement: What did it REALLY Accomplish? It turned thinking people away from Christianity.

beloved57
January 29th, 2011, 08:30 AM
Jesus blood made those He died for a Kingdom, we are kings and priests solely because of His Blood.

So it is True that by Hos own blood He made us [those He died in behalf of] a Kingdom of priest.

All for whom Christ died will sooner or later in their life time, according to the purpose of God for them, become believers in Christ, to manifest their union with Him when He died, for they were in Him just as they were in Adam when He died, and Just as our union with Adam was made manifest by our being made sinners, so likewise, our union with Christ when He died is made manifest when we are made priest by Christ blood..

1 Pet 2:9


9But ye are a chosen generation, a royal priesthood, an holy nation, a peculiar people; that ye should shew forth the praises of him who hath called you out of darkness into his marvellous light;

None can by their own freewill be made of a royal priesthood, its an Divine Appointment, and Christ by His blood, causes all for whom He died to become..

beloved57
March 9th, 2011, 08:33 AM
The Atonement of Christ or the satisfaction of Christ took care of Two major problems that sinners had in regards to God's Holy Law, He Christ rendered a Perfect obedience to all its statues, and He endured it's punishment due for its violation for His People, those the Father had given Him, this death of Christ was the taking away of the sin and its punishment due to the elect world Jn 1:29


29 The next day John seeth Jesus coming unto him, and saith, Behold the Lamb of God, which taketh away the sin of the world.

That is men and women of all ethnic groups..and all ages of world history..

beloved57
March 18th, 2011, 06:39 AM
Matt 26:28


28 For this is my blood of the new testament, which is shed for many for the remission of sins.

The word remission here is the greek word aphesis and means:

release from bondage or imprisonment

2) forgiveness or pardon, of sins (letting them go as if they had never been committed), remission of the penalty

And it is translated forgiveness six times in the NT Mk 3:29;Acts 5:31;13:38;26:18;Eph 1:7;Col 1:14

And so one of blessings of the atonement or the blood of Christ accomplished alone, for all those He died for is the remission or forgiveness of their sins all of them Col 2:13

And you, being dead in your sins and the uncircumcision of your flesh, hath he quickened together with him, having forgiven you all trespasses;

As just pointed out the word remission and forgiveness are the same in the greek, and means the cancellation of guilt, all legal guilt against the law of God, that properly belongs to guilty sinners , by means of Christ satisfaction [His Blood], He propitiated the Father in behalf of His People [Israel spiritual]. Christ made complete amends to the Law of God for every transgression which the sins of God's people committed. He by His death satisfied the alienation which our sins had made, He compensated for all the wrongs we had done against God's law Ps 69:4

then I restored that which I took not away.

So it is imperative to preach as an accomplishment of Christ blood the forgiveness of sins, not the possibility of , if a condition by the sinner is met, but premised completely on the blood of Christ Lk 24:47


47And that repentance and remission of sins should be preached in his name among all nations, beginning at Jerusalem.

Now both repentance and remission of sins were to proclaimed in Christ name, not as duties and conditions to get saved, but as accomplishments of His work on the cross, and He Now as a risen Saviour gives them to a chosen People [Israel] thats what peter preached Acts 5:31

31Him hath God exalted with his right hand to be a Prince and a Saviour, for to give repentance to Israel, and forgiveness of sins.

Note: Israel here is not national Israel, but the Israel of God made of jew and gentile..national israel was a type for all God's chosen of all nations, so this scripture shows us the limited scope of intention and application of repentance and remission or forgiveness of sins. The preaching was that God's Chosen people, throughout the world might receive the knowledge of their salvation by the remission or forgiveness of their sins Lk 1:77

77 To give knowledge of salvation unto his people by the remission of their sins, Yes, remission of sins is salvation..but notice, who receives this knowledge ? His People..see Matt 1:21 about His people !

The knowledge of salvation by the remission of sins is a experiential knowledge resulting in a change of mind and behaviour in granting repentance.. These are a effect and accomplishment of the atonement of Christ, and all for whom He died has forgiveness or remission of sins, for its a covenant blessing from His blood Heb 8:12

12For I will be merciful to their unrighteousness, and their sins and their iniquities will I remember no more.

beloved57
March 19th, 2011, 04:50 PM
Reconciliation and Remission of sins or forgiveness of sins are connected with one another as per 2 Cor 5:19

19To wit, that God was in Christ, reconciling the world unto himself, not imputing their trespasses unto them; and hath committed unto us the word of reconciliation.

For that which was the ground of reconciliation [Christ death or blood]

It also was the ground for forgiveness of sins [Christ death or blood].

For certainly reconciliation implies in its nature a canceling out of the punishment of sin. Since it implies a being received into His Favor, God could receive us thusly, because our sins had been put away or remitted.

The greek word for remission aphesis means a sending away, and its also translated deliverance and liberty as in Lk 4:18


18The Spirit of the Lord is upon me, because he hath anointed me to preach the gospel to the poor; he hath sent me to heal the brokenhearted, to preach deliverance to the captives, and recovering of sight to the blind, to set at liberty them that are bruised,

Notice by the way who this liberty / remission was preached to, " The Poor " not economically poor but the poor in spirit, the regenerated, those who had been made sensible sinners by New Birth see Matt 5:3. The word is also translated forgiveness in Acts 13:38 and Eph 1:7.

Forgiveness is another way of preaching the Truth of non imputation of sin as in 2 Cor 5 19 and Rom 4:7-8.

The remission of sins means God refuses, and will not charge sin to their account for whom Christ died and who become believers. It denotes that there has been deliverance from the curse of the law, Christ having been made a curse for them Gal 3. There are other words used in the NT that means the same thing i.e Heb 1:3


3Who being the brightness of his glory, and the express image of his person, and upholding all things by the word of his power, when he had by himself purged our sins, sat down on the right hand of the Majesty on high:

They [ their sins] have removed from the face of God the Judge.

The non imputation of sin [remission] is not only the consequent result of Christ death, but was the underlying cause of His death, hence sin is not imputed to the members of His body, since they were imputed to their Head.

beloved57
March 21st, 2011, 07:51 AM
The non imputation of sin [remission] is not only the consequent result of Christ death, but was the underlying cause of His death, hence sin is not imputed to the members of His body, since they were imputed to their Head.

Trespasses are not laid to the Charge of the members of Christ body [ 2 nd Cor 5:19], because they were imputed to their Head Christ, for He was made sin for them, that is a sin offering. God the Father legally constituted Him to be an offering for sin in accordance with the agreement between them in the everlasting covenant. Made Him to be sin means that He appointed Him to be our substitute and to bare our sins, He became legally and officially liable to God's wrath and curse. see Gal 3:13.

Christ was made sin for God's people by the reckoning of our guilt to His own account, so much so, He called them His Transgressions and foolishness see Ps 69:5 and so Divine Justice was pleased to bruise Him [in our stead] for our sins, and so by His stripes we were healed.

Now the great evidence of one having had their sins remitted or forgiven is that they all will become believers in Him Acts 13:38-39


38Be it known unto you therefore, men and brethren, that through this man is preached unto you the forgiveness of sins:

39And by him all that believe are justified from all things, from which ye could not be justified by the law of Moses.

And please pay attention to vs 39 whereby it states BY HIM, everyone believing is freed from the law of moses, they are believing by Him, through Him, because of the redemption in His blood. We will see later Lord willing how redemption has to do with believing in Christ..

So Christ is the instrumental means by which the elect believe..

A similar statement is found in 1 Pet 1:21

Who by him do believe in God, that raised him up from the dead, and gave him glory; that your faith and hope might be in God.

Again, Christ being the instrumental means by which men believe in God, and Christ is God as well..

beloved57
March 24th, 2011, 10:05 AM
Eph 1:7

7 In whom we have redemption through his blood, the forgiveness of sins, according to the riches of his grace;

As we can see Redemption is connected with remission or forgiveness of sins [which is non imputation 2 Cor 5:19] for sins are forgiven by the redeeming blood of Christ.

Because Christ on behalf of the sheep, satisfied God's wrath, the redemption of the sheep is the fruit or result thereof. In Eph 1:7 we read " In whom we have redemption through His blood, the forgiveness of sins. Its noted of the preposition Paul uses here, which is not through whom, but in whom we have redemption, because redemption was a right to each one its was to be applied to by the Spirit of promise when regenerated, and because Christ died, and we were Chosen in Him before the foundation Eph 1:4. We had a right because Jesus was our near kinsmen Redeemer because of having been chosen in Him by the Father.

Now, Just like the elect had condemnation before being born into this world, likewise the elect have redemption in Christ based upon His obedience, before being born into this world..But this ensures our release from captivity of sin.

Christ gave Himself a ransom for many, thus effecting their redemption, these terms when used in reckoning the work of Christ are joined together, the ransom denoting the price paid [ Christ life or blood] and the redemption, the effect of the ransom, is the liberation out of a prison of a prisoner [ who had been shut up into unbelief and sin, spiritual death]. The ransom paid demands the prisoners to be set free from the captivity of Satan !

beloved57
March 25th, 2011, 10:52 AM
Christ gave Himself a ransom for many, thus effecting their redemption, these terms when used in reckoning the work of Christ are joined together, the ransom denoting the price paid [ Christ life or blood] and the redemption, the effect of the ransom, is the liberation out of a prison of a prisoner [ who had been shut up into unbelief and sin, spiritual death]. The ransom paid demands the prisoners to be set free from the captivity of Satan !

This enables Two Things #1 The one being set free from the captivity of Satan has been granted repentance 2 Tim 2:25-26

25In meekness instructing those that oppose themselves; if God peradventure[B] will give them repentance to the acknowledging of the truth;

26And that they may recover themselves out of the snare of the devil, who are taken captive by him at his will.

Yes, The redemption in Christ Christ Jesus delivers from the snare and captivity of Satan to the acknowledging of the Truth.

You see those who do not obey or believe the Truth or contradict it as described in 2 Thess 2:11,12


11And for this cause God shall send them strong delusion, that they should believe a lie:

12That they all might be damned who believed not the truth, but had pleasure in unrighteousness.

Thats because they are in captivity to Satan, but if Christ died for them, they will experience redemption or liberation from Satan and His lies, thats what it means to have the Son set you free Jn 8:36

36If the Son therefore shall make you free, ye shall be free indeed.

Jesus is referring to the redemption in His blood which will set free . liberate and deliver them He shall die for..

#2. Redemption enables and effects one to believe, because unbelief is merely a symptom of being captive and blinded by the God of this world [Satan] or the prince of this world . 2 Cor 4:3-4

3But if our gospel be hid, it is hid to them that are lost:

4In whom the god of this world hath blinded the minds of them which believe not, lest the light of the glorious gospel of Christ, who is the image of God, should shine unto them.

see http://www.studylight.org/com/geb/view.cgi?book=2co&chapter=004&verse=004

It is the work of Satan to keep unbelievers minds blinded and unable to see the Truth in the Gospel, but the redemption in Christ opens up blind eyes Lk 4:18


18The Spirit of the Lord is upon me, because he hath anointed me to preach the gospel to the poor; he hath sent me to heal the brokenhearted,[B] to preach deliverance to the captives, and recovering of sight to the blind, to set at liberty them that are bruised,

see how deliverance [redemption] is connected with recovering of sight for the blind ? Redemption therefore delivers from Satan blindness so we can see and believe. One must see the Son [spiritually] in order to believe as per Jn 6:40


40And this is the will of him that sent me, that every one which seeth the Son, and believeth on him, may have everlasting life: and I will raise him up at the last day.

He is set forth in the Gospel, for paul says that Christ had been set before you to the galatians Gal 3:10

1O foolish Galatians, who hath bewitched you, that ye should not obey the truth, before whose eyes[Spiritual] Jesus Christ hath been evidently set forth, crucified among you?

So redemption in Christ blood delivers from impenitence and unbelief !

None for whom Christ died can die unrepentant and in unbelief, that would defeat His blood..

beloved57
March 25th, 2011, 08:06 PM
That Christ by His death, the ransom paid, actually redeems from Satan the strong man is set forth here Jer 31:11

11 For the LORD hath redeemed Jacob, and ransomed him from the hand of him that was stronger than he.

Does not that text remind us of what Jesus said here Matt 12:28-29

28 but if I cast out devils by the Spirit of God, then the kingdom of God is come unto you.

29 Or else how can one enter into a strong man's house, and spoil his goods, except he first bind the strong man? and then he will spoil his house.

And let it be noted who it is God ransoms and redeems " Jacob " the Chosen of God , Israel, the seed of Abraham.

Also lets look at Hos 13:14

14 I will ransom them from the power of the grave; I will redeem them from death: O death, I will be thy plagues; O grave, I will be thy destruction: repentance shall be hid from mine eyes.

The redemption Christ effects will deliver from the power of the Grave, which will be more evident at the Second Coming see Jn 5:28-29, but it also delivers from death, which is to include Spiritual death, because it delivers out from the one who had the power of death Heb 2:14

Forasmuch then as the children are partakers of flesh and blood, he also himself likewise took part of the same; that through death he might destroy him that had the power of death, that is, the devil;

He delivers by His redeeming blood, those He died for from being dead in sin Eph 2:5

5 Even when we were dead in sins, hath quickened[delivered] us together with Christ, (by grace ye are saved )

All for whom Christ died and redeemed, must be quickened out of spiritual death and given life, spiritual life. So redemption secures for God's people regeneration, or Justification unto Life !

Rom 5:18

18Therefore as by the offence of one judgment came upon all men to condemnation; even so by the righteousness of one the free gift came upon all men unto justification of life.

Life here is that quickening we receive in Eph 2: 5

So redemption is the payment of a ransom and the liberation of the ransomed, the giving of life from the dead, a quickening out of trespasses and sins. It must be added that its limited to the elect of God, His Chosen, His Israel, His Jacob out of mankind Lk 1:68

68 Blessed be the Lord God of Israel; for he hath visited and redeemed his people,

He redeems His Chosen, Those Chosen in their Kinsmen Redeemer, Christ Jesus before the world began !

So Redemption gives Life from the dead..

beloved57
March 26th, 2011, 05:40 PM
In no stretch of the imagination are those going to hell the objects of Christ redeeming death and blood, for hell is like going into a prison 1 Pet 3:19

By which also he went and preached unto the spirits in prison;.

The Redemption that Christ has effected by His Blood for all that He gave Himself a ransom for, He delivered them from the guilt and penalty [legally] of their sins which is called remission of sins Matt 26:28 which is also their Justification before God, for how can anyone whom God cannot lay a charge on not be Justified Rom 8:33-34


33 Who shall lay any thing to the charge of God's elect? It is God that justifieth.

34 Who is he that condemneth? It is Christ that died, yea rather, that is risen again, who is even at the right hand of God, who also maketh intercession for us.

This is also set forth in this scripture Rom 3:24

24 Being justified freely by his grace through the redemption that is in Christ Jesus:

This automatically concludes that all for whom Christ shed His blood are Justified before God based upon the redemption that is in His blood..

Not a charge of law breaking or its curse will come against them because of Christ redemption Gal 3:13


13 Christ hath redeemed us from the curse of the law, being made a curse for us: for it is written, Cursed is every one that hangeth on a tree:

He also delivers by His redemption from the power of sin, that those Christ died for can serve Him Lk 1:74-75

74That he would grant unto us, that [B]we being delivered out of the hand of our enemies might serve him without fear,

75 In holiness and righteousness before him, all the days of our life.

He redeems us by His blood from a vain manner of life, socially and religiously 1 Pet 1:18-19

18 Forasmuch as ye know that ye were not redeemed with corruptible things, as silver and gold, from your vain conversation received by tradition from your fathers;

19 But with the precious blood of Christ, as of a lamb without blemish and without spot:

And finally there is an aspect of redemption that is about to come and be applied to the blood redeemed, to be redeemed from this place of sin, yes thats a deliverance Dan 12:1

1And at that time shall Michael stand up, the great prince which standeth for the children of thy people: and there shall be a time of trouble, such as never was since there was a nation even to that same time: and at that time thy people shall be delivered, every one that shall be found written in the book.

This will be associated with our glorification, Jesus says of it in Lk 21:28

28And when these things begin to come to pass, then look up, and lift up your heads; for your redemption deliverance draweth nigh.

beloved57
March 30th, 2011, 06:29 AM
The death of Christ not only accomplishes and secures unto the elect their objective standing before God such as [ Justified, reconciled] by His blood, but He also secured our personal sanctification or conversion. Jesus said I sanctify myself [speaking of His High Priestly death] that they [ all for whom He died] may be sanctified Jn 17:19

19 And for their sakes I sanctify myself, that [in order that] they also might be sanctified through the truth.

Hence the cross of Christ enables all those He died for to Love and serve Him in newness of Life, beginning in this life and will serve him forever, thus eternal redemption Heb 9:12 !

Lets look at some scriptures that bring this point out ! 2 Cor 5:15


15 And that he died for all, that they which live should not henceforth live unto themselves, but unto him which died for them, and rose again.

The all He died for here, was in order that they should live [spiritually] and henceforth live for Him.. This is also what is meant in Lk 1:71-75

71That we should be saved from our enemies, and from the hand of all that hate us;

72To perform the mercy promised to our fathers, and to remember his holy covenant;

73The oath which he sware to our father Abraham,

74That he would grant unto us, that we being delivered out of the hand of our enemies might serve him without fear,

75In holiness and righteousness before him, all the days of our life.

Now as an effect of Christ Death, for all He died, the power of sin is broken [an enemy] in ones Life, setting free the person into a newness of Life, by the Spirit regenerating them and renewing them Titus 3:5.

beloved57
March 31st, 2011, 12:02 AM
So the death of Christ was for the purpose of effecting for all Christ died their personal sanctification as stated here Eph 5:25-27

25Husbands, love your wives, even as Christ also loved the church, and gave himself for it;

26That he might sanctify and cleanse it with the washing of water by the word,

27That he might present it to himself a glorious church, not having spot, or wrinkle, or any such thing; but that it should be holy and without blemish.

The word that is the greek word hina:

that, in order that, so that, to the end that


So vs 26 can read

26 in order that he might sanctify and cleanse it with the washing of water by the word,

Its stating a Divine Purpose..

So Christ giving His Life for His Church had meaning and purpose. God had chosen the Church in Him Eph 1:4 to be Holy, and so His death accomplishes that..

It [His death] effects a life of Good works Titus 2:14


14 Who gave himself for us, that he might redeem us from all iniquity, and purify unto himself a peculiar people, zealous of good works.

Notice the same purpose word is used hina who gave Himself for us to the end that He might redeem us from all iniquity and purify unto Himsel a peculiar people zealous of good works. It makes His People zealous of good works.

The greek word is:

zēlōtēs:

) one burning with zeal, a zealot

2) used of God as jealous of any rival and sternly vindicating his control

3) most eagerly desirous of, zealous for, a thing

a) to acquire a thing, (zealous of)

b) to defend and uphold a thing, vehemently contending for a thing

He causes His People to defend and earnestly contened for the Faith Jude 1:3

3Beloved, when I gave all diligence to write unto you of the common salvation, it was needful for me to write unto you, and exhort you that ye should earnestly[zealously] contend for the faith which was once delivered unto the saints.

beloved57
April 2nd, 2011, 02:30 PM
Its a shame how many so called preachers of the Gospel, the Cross of Christ, are so in the dark as to what His Death or Cross Work accomplished for all those He died for. Many don't believe that His death accomplished more than a chance to get saved, depending on the sinners response. However the True accomplishment of His death, produces effects and results unto all them He died for, He redeemed by His blood ransom.

His death takes a worthless, and dead and vain life, religious or otherwise and converts it into a Life that serves the True and Living God.

Heb 9:14

14How much more shall the blood of Christ, who through the eternal Spirit offered himself without spot to God, purge your conscience from dead works to serve the living God?

You see that ? This accomplishment is solely by the Blood Of Christ !

The word purge here is the same greek word for purify in Titus 2:14

14Who gave himself for us, that he might redeem us from all iniquity, and purify unto himself a peculiar people, zealous of good works.

These are effects of the blood of Christ, of Christ having offered or gave of Himself..

beloved57
April 5th, 2011, 10:05 AM
Titus 2:14

14 Who gave himself for us, that he might redeem us from all iniquity, and purify unto himself a peculiar people, zealous of good works.

When Jesus told Nicodemus that ye must be born again, of course He was not commanding him to be born again, for that would be like telling him he must enter back into his mothers womb, but Jesus was stating to him a condition for being able to enter into the Kingdom of God, and I know many would agree with this conclusion.

However there is another reason why one must be born again, if indeed Jesus died for their sins, and that is so they may have a new life in order to now serve God pleasingly in Spirit and in Truth, for they now must serve Him in the newness of life. Rom 6:4

Therefore we are buried with him by baptism into death: that like as Christ was raised up from the dead by the glory of the Father, even so we also should walk in newness of life.

The word for newness is the greek word kainotēs:

newness

a) in the new state of life in which the Holy Spirit places us so as to produce a new state which is eternal life.

Thats right, God's Justice provides for and demands a Newness of Life to serve Him. All for whom Christ died and redeemed must be made alive, because Christ has died the death that they have deserved and has merited for them the Full Blessing of Eternal Life. Rom 6:23

23For the wages of sin is death; but the gift of God is eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord.

Lets look at Rom 5:18

18Therefore as by the offence of one judgment came upon all men to condemnation; even so by the righteousness of one the free gift came upon all men unto justification of life.As a end result of the redemption we have in Christ, notice the b section of the verse :

"even so by the righteousness of one the free gift came upon all men[without distinction] unto justification of life."

Now Legal, forensic Justification as important as it is, it was not God's only objective for Christ's redeeming death. His death was also purposed to give Life, and this Life comes through the Spirit. Its by His Gift of the Holy Spirit, unto all for whom Christ died and redeem, we receive Justification unto Life ! based solely upon one act of righteousness or as it states in vs 19, His one act of obedience: Justification unto life by the Spirit is also what Paul refers to in 1 Cor 6:11


11And such were some of you: but ye are washed, but ye are sanctified, but ye are justified in the name of the Lord Jesus, and by the Spirit of our God.

Justification unto or into life by the Spirit. This must be because the old life has been crucified with the Lord Jesus Christ, all of its sins , past, present and future have been blotted out once and for all, so now we must be born again to serve in the Newness of Life, Gods Justice demands it for Christ sake.

beloved57
April 8th, 2011, 03:16 PM
How do those That Christ died for receive the Atonement ?

Rom 5:11

11And not only so, but we also joy in God through our Lord Jesus Christ, by whom we have now received the atonement.


The word atonement here is the greek word :

katallagē:


) exchange

a) of the business of money changers, exchanging equivalent values

2) adjustment of a difference, reconciliation, restoration to favour

a) in the NT of the restoration of the favour of God to sinners that repent and put their trust in the expiatory death of Christ

The word is used here also:

Rom 11:15

15For if the casting away of them be the reconciling of the world, what shall the receiving of them be, but life from the dead?

2 Cor 5:18-19

18And all things are of God, who hath reconciled us to himself by Jesus Christ, and hath given to us the ministry of reconciliation;

19To wit, that God was in Christ, reconciling the world unto himself, not imputing their trespasses unto them; and hath committed unto us the word of reconciliation.

So what is Paul saying in the text of Rom 5:11 ?

He is saying that we, all those Christ died for, receive the benefit of the atonement by or through Jesus Christ, that is , He ensures that its benefits are received by those He died for. He ensures that by the Holy Spirit, whom He sends, applies those benefits to those He died for, thats another role of His as Mediator. The Holy Spirit because of Christ reveals to each child of mercy that they had a covenant interest in Christ blood: Jn 16:14-15

14He shall glorify me: for he shall receive of mine, and shall shew it unto you.

15All things that the Father hath are mine: therefore said I, that he shall take of mine, and shall shew it unto you.

Initially that applied to His disciple's, but it also applies to His Church, His body. And through this effectual application they or we become Justified in our own consciousness by Faith, hence by this we receive the atonement, the comfort of it, and the peace of it..

beloved57
April 8th, 2011, 11:44 PM
Justification unto or into life by the Spirit. This must be because the old life has been crucified with the Lord Jesus Christ, all of its sins , past, present and future have been blotted out once and for all, so now we must be born again to serve in the Newness of Life, Gods Justice demands it for Christ sake.

So Legal Justification by the blood of Christ, and forgiveness of all sins because of the blood of Christ, this demands that all Christ died for be made New Creatures. This is so because the end or purpose of being redeemed was for:

1. To redeem us [All Christ died for, His Church] from all lawlessness or iniquity Titus 2:14

2a. To Purify to Himself a particular People as His very unique possession [ This speaks to the Truth of particular redemption] Titus 2:14

2b. To create a people zealous of good works which He had been before ordained see Eph 2:10

10For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus unto good works, which God hath before ordained that we should walk in them.

And these specific purposes and ends for redemption is effected by our regeneration, being born of the Spirit into His Kingdom. So redemption secures for us a New Creation, in order to live in the newness of Life and to perform the God ordained Spiritual Works He has prepared for us to walk in them.

beloved57
April 13th, 2011, 10:23 AM
2 Cor 5:18-21

18And all things are of God, who hath reconciled us to himself by Jesus Christ, and hath given to us the ministry of reconciliation;

19To wit, that God was in Christ, reconciling the world unto himself, not imputing their trespasses unto them; and hath committed unto us the word of reconciliation.

20Now then we are ambassadors for Christ, as though God did beseech you by us: we pray you in Christ's stead, be ye reconciled to God.

21For he hath made him to be sin for us, who knew no sin; that we might be made the righteousness of God in him.

In vs 20, Paul is giving [ In Christ stead or behalf] as though Christ was speaking Himself, a imperative or a command, to who , those already reconciled to God objectively vs 18, it is now time for them to be ye reconciled subjectively by the word of reconciliation, which is the Gospel.

You see, The reconciliation in the death of Christ did more than Just give objective standing of favor with God, more than just legal standing of no condemnation, but it also ensured or effects our subjective reconciliation unto God, that is we will be saved experimentally as well.

This blessed Truth is again stated by the Apostle here Rom 5:10

10For if, when we were enemies, we were reconciled to God by the death of his Son, much more, being reconciled, we shall be saved by his life.

Being saved here is what answers to or corresponds with the "be ye reconciled" in vs 20 of 2 Cor 5:20

In the greek,"be ye reconciled" is a aorist passive imperative, so the subjects are being acted upon, they are actually being reconciled by decree of imperative. They are being saved from the power of sin, and being brought to God subjectively 1 Pet 2:25

25 For ye were as sheep going astray; but are now returned or being converted unto the Shepherd and Bishop of your souls.

The word for returned here is the greek word epistrepho:

to turn to

to the worship of the true God

to cause to return, to bring back

to the love and obedience of God

to the love for the children

to love wisdom and righteousness

Also peter uses it in the passive voice, they are being acted upon, being caused to return to the Bishop of their souls.

Thats the subjective reconciliation thats effected in the Death of Christ for all He died for..His death actually brings us to God into fellowship with Him..

beloved57
April 18th, 2011, 02:40 AM
The Lord Jesus Christ in His Threefold Mediatorial Character as Priest, prophet and King, makes sure that the Salvation He accomplished for all those He died for, is experienced by them, that is, not only was His blood a bare purchase and then He sets back and offers it, but also by Him as King, He applies it to its subjects to give it effect, to bestow its benefits of grace, they being destined to be conformed into His image, which is their total salvation.

For this cause He was invested with all power in both heaven and earth as per Matt 28:18

18 And Jesus came and spake unto them, saying, All power is given unto me in heaven and in earth.

Jn 17:2

2As thou hast given him power over all flesh, that he should give[apply] eternal life to as many as thou hast given him.

The word power in Matt 28:18 and Jn 17:2 is the greek word exousia:


power of choice, liberty of doing as one pleases

a) leave or permission

2) physical and mental power

a) the ability or strength with which one is endued, which he either possesses or exercises

3) the power of authority (influence) and of right (privilege)

Jesus made this point very clear, that He has all Power to His [Disciples] at their commission. This was not just to be saying that He has all power, but in and through their witness of the Truth of His death, He would be applying that which He purchased as Priest [His offering of Himself] by His own blood, their salvation.

beloved57
April 18th, 2011, 03:04 AM
In Christ's Threefold Character as Priest, Prophet and King, each plays a role in the salvation of those He died and rose, as their Priest, He offered Himself for them, purchases their liberty, their right to life. Heb 7:27

Who needeth not daily, as those high priests, to offer up sacrifice, first for his own sins, and then for the people's: for this he did once, when he offered up himself.

Heb 9:14

How much more shall the blood of Christ, who through the eternal Spirit offered himself without spot to God, purge your conscience from dead works to serve the living God?

Lk 4:18

The Spirit of the Lord is upon me, because he hath anointed me to preach the gospel to the poor; he hath sent me to heal the brokenhearted, to preach deliverance to the captives, and recovering of sight to the blind, to set at liberty them that are bruised,

Notice, the effect , Jesus said He is to set at liberty those that are bruised, not offer them liberty, not make it possible, but He actually sets them at liberty..Its the same word for send forth

Matt 13:41


41The Son of man shall send forth his angels, and they shall gather out of his kingdom all things that offend, and them which do iniquity;

You see, He is acting as King when He sends forth His Angels, to gather out of His Kingdom !

So He applies as King, His work as Priest, He applies the redemption of His blood that He offered..

He sets or makes them free Jn 8:36

If the Son therefore shall make you free, ye shall be free indeed.

The word make means "to set at liberty" from the dominion of sin !

beloved57
April 18th, 2011, 08:55 AM
We have seen that as part of His Threefold Character, that as Priest, He has offered Himself as an offering for sin. Isa 53:10

10Yet it pleased the LORD to bruise him; he hath put him to grief: when thou shalt make his soul an offering for sin, he shall see his seed, he shall prolong his days, and the pleasure of the LORD shall prosper in his hand.

2Cor 5:21

21For he hath made him to be sin[A sin offering] for us, who knew no sin; that we might be made the righteousness of God in him.

Now, as Prophet He makes known to those He died for their forgiveness, He publishes it.

One of things He was to do was to give Light to the gentiles. Lk 2:32

A light to lighten the Gentiles, and the glory of thy people Israel.

The word lighten here is the greek word apokalypsis:

a disclosure of truth, instruction

Its a communication of the Knowledge of God to the soul.

The Amplified bible reads :

32A Light for [a]revelation to the Gentiles [to disclose what was before unknown] and [to bring] praise and honor and glory to Your people Israel.(A)


This was prophesied in the Prophet Isa Isa 42:6

6 I the LORD have called thee in righteousness, and will hold thine hand, and will keep thee, and give thee for a covenant of the people, for a light of the Gentiles;

Isa 49:6

6And he said, It is a light thing that thou shouldest be my servant to raise up the tribes of Jacob, and to restore the preserved of Israel: I will also give thee for a light to the Gentiles, that thou mayest be my salvation unto the end of the earth.

This applied also to the elect Jews as well, He made known to them, The True God.

Jn 17:1-3

1These words spake Jesus, and lifted up his eyes to heaven, and said, Father, the hour is come; glorify thy Son, that thy Son also may glorify thee:

2As thou hast given him power over all flesh, that he should give eternal life to as many as thou hast given him.

3And this is life eternal, that they might know thee the only true God, and Jesus Christ, whom thou hast sent.

As Prophet, He made Known the True God to all whom the Father hath given Him, of both jews and gentiles..

This was a result of His shedding of the blood of the New Covenant , it ensured a proper and Spiritual knowledge of God Heb 8:10-11

10For this is the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel after those days, saith the Lord; I will put my laws into their mind, and write them in their hearts: and I will be to them a God, and they shall be to me a people:

11And they shall not teach every man his neighbour, and every man his brother, saying, Know the Lord: for all shall know me, from the least to the greatest.

So As Prophet, He Reveals the True God to those He died for.

This revealing also denotes making Known to them The remission of their sins. Lk 1:77


77 To give knowledge of salvation unto his people by the remission of their sins,

The word knowledge here is to make known as in Matt 13:11

11He answered and said unto them, Because it is given unto you to know the mysteries of the kingdom of heaven, but to them it is not given.

As our Prophet, He makes Known unto us our Salvation in the remission of our sins that came through His shed blood Matt 26:28

28For this is my blood of the new testament, which is shed for many for the remission of sins.

beloved57
April 19th, 2011, 08:11 AM
Now it has been shown from scripture that Christ as Mediator, plays a Threefold role in the salvation He accomplished by and through His death of the cross, and present sitting on His Throne of Glory. He was the Priest that offered Himself, shed His blood for the sins of all His People, jew or gentile, and He is the Prophet that makes Known this salvation to His People that He died for, and finally, He is the Great King that applies and give effect to this salvation to all that He died. He applies His Salvation by sending the work of the Spirit unto each one He died for, that He [The Holy Spirit] will quicken them with New Life, that He would work in them to both will and to do of His good pleasure.

This is why it is immediately said upon His ascension to the Throne, that He received from the Father, as a reward for His cross work] the Holy Ghost Acts 2:33

Therefore being by the right hand of God exalted, and having received of the Father the promise of the Holy Ghost, he hath shed forth this, which ye now see and hear.

The Holy Ghost is the promise given to Christ that He may shed forth upon all His seed.

This is spoken of in Isa 44:1-3

1Yet now hear, O Jacob my servant; and Israel, whom I have chosen:

2Thus saith the LORD that made thee, and formed thee from the womb, which will help thee; Fear not, O Jacob, my servant; and thou, Jesurun, whom I have chosen.

3For I will pour water upon him that is thirsty, and floods upon the dry ground: I will pour my spirit upon thy seed, and my blessing upon thine offspring:

Also alluding to this at the ascension of Christ and He having received in order to give gifts to men is Eph 4:8-11

8Wherefore he saith, When he ascended up on high, he led captivity captive, and gave gifts unto men.

9(Now that he ascended, what is it but that he also descended first into the lower parts of the earth?

10He that descended is the same also that ascended up far above all heavens, that he might fill all things.)

11And he gave some, apostles; and some, prophets; and some, evangelists; and some, pastors and teachers;

The Holy Spirit embodies all the gifts needed for the completion and application of Christ redeeming work, and this is as King, having conquered, that He sends Him [The Holy Spirit] forth. It is the Holy Spirit whom Christ sheds or pours forth that regenerates and renews all those Christ died for, this is taught here Titus 3:5-6

5Not by works of righteousness which we have done, but according to his mercy he saved us, by the washing of regeneration, and renewing of the Holy Ghost;

6Which he shed on us abundantly through Jesus Christ our Saviour;

Note, the word gifts in Eph 4:8 is the greek word doma, and its the same word used for gifts in Lk 11:13

when speaking of the giving of the Holy Spirit :

13If ye then, being evil, know how to give good gifts unto your children: how much more shall your heavenly Father give the Holy Spirit to them that ask him?

And thats what King Jesus applies or sheds forth to His redeemed Church !

All the Mediatorial Offices of Christ are essential, not one of them can be neglected. The Office of King can be supposed to supersede that of Prophet and Priest, as it could be supposed that Prophet and Priest could supersede that of King, for it would be meaningless to speak of applying what has not been procured or purchased, but even more senseless to speak of procuring or purchasing what would not be applied, by the Purchaser..

beloved57
May 12th, 2011, 10:12 AM
Folks, at the Great White Throne, those who are going to hell to perish for their sins, is because of their sins against God's Law, for the strength of sin is the Law 1 Cor 15:56

56The sting of death is sin; and the strength of sin is the law.

Col 2:14

14 Blotting out the handwriting of ordinances that was against us, which was contrary to us, and took it out of the way, nailing it to his cross;

Paul here teaches that Christ by His Cross, has canceled His People's legal liability [God's Law] having erased the written code, with its regulations, that were against us, opposed to us, He took them away [Jn 1:29] nailing it to His Cross.

Now any teaching that states that in any way, that those whom Christ died for, that is His cross work on their behalf, that if any of them are legally condemned for their sins, thats a false teaching and opposes the work of Christ. Those who in light of such a scripture as this one Col 2:14, still believe that those whom Christ died for are still at any time in their lives condemned by God for their sins in the flesh, they are rejecting the clear implications of the Saving Work and Accomplishment of Christ, these will therefore by their profession become enemies to the cause of Christ.

beloved57
May 18th, 2011, 11:07 AM
Heb 5:9

9And being made perfect[Through His Death], he became the author of eternal salvation unto all them that obey him;


If we are obeying Christ, it is because He was the Author or source of our Salvation. That is obedience to the Faith is an and effect and fruit of His redeeming death Rom 5:19

19For as by one man's disobedience many were made sinners, so by the obedience of one shall many be made righteous [or obedient].

Ps 22:30

30A seed shall serve[be obedient to] him; it shall be accounted to the Lord for a generation [see 1Pet 2:9a].

9But ye are a chosen generation,

Many have corrupted Heb 5:9 and turned it into a conditional saving, as to say if one obeys Christ then Christ will save them, but its actually the opposite, If Christ has saved us by the merits of His death, then obedience to Him will be effected..

So those not obeying Christ and His Gospel, then there really is no evidence or fruit that He died for them..

beloved57
June 20th, 2011, 05:29 PM
The word accomplish :

to bring to its goal or conclusion; carry out; perform; finish:

complete, fulfill; execute, effect

This thread is about What Christ accomplished, performed , effected by His Covenant Death. He put the Blessings of it into force as in Heb 9:17

17For a testament is of force after men are dead: otherwise it is of no strength at all while the testator liveth.

The ESV For a will takes effect only at death, since it is not in force as long as the one who made it is alive.

This is what Daniel prophesied when He wrote, The Covenant shall be confirmed with Many ! Dan 9:27

27And he shall confirm the covenant with many for one week: and in the midst of the week he shall cause the sacrifice and the oblation to cease, and for the overspreading of abominations he shall make it desolate, even until the consummation, and that determined shall be poured upon the desolate.

The word confirm here means :

to confirm, give strength

2) to confirm (a covenant)

Now as a result or consequence of this accomplishment by the blood of Christ [ Matt 26:28;Heb 13:20], the following shall occur to the Heirs of the Covenant

He [Christ the Risen Mediator of the Covenant] shall open blind eyes, that is to give spiritual sight. Isa 42:6-7

6I the LORD have called thee in righteousness, and will hold thine hand, and will keep thee, and give thee for a covenant of the people, for a light of the Gentiles;

7To open the blind eyes, to bring out the prisoners from the prison, and them that sit in darkness out of the prison house.

Amen, this is an accomplishment of the death of Christ, to open up blind eyes, Spiritually Blind.

Remember when Jesus said stated in Jn 9:39 one of His purposes for coming ? Lets read vs39

39And Jesus said, For judgment I am come into this world, that they which see not might see; and that they which see might be made blind.

This was mainly for the Gentiles, because many in Israel boasted that they could see, they would say, we have moses, we be circumcised and we keep the law. But the point is, because of His death, His blood of the Covenant, many shall be given sight by Him.

Paul was used in this respect Acts 26:17-18

17Delivering thee from the people, and from the Gentiles, unto whom now I send thee,

18To open their eyes, and to turn them from darkness to light, and from the power of Satan unto God, that they may receive forgiveness of sins, and inheritance among them which are sanctified by faith that is in me.

You see that ? Paul was an instrument in the Hand of Christ in confirming the Covenant to many, to open their eyes spiritually.

beloved57
June 28th, 2011, 08:20 PM
John 12:32-33

32And I, if I be lifted up from the earth, will draw all men unto me.

33This he said, signifying what death he should die.

Jesus here is saying that His death would effect or produce results, that by it, all men will be drawn to Him, meaning shall believe in Him for Salvation.

The all men here does not mean all without exception, but all without distinction, both jews and gentiles alike see vs 20

In the original the word men does not appear, so it reads, will draw all[pas] unto me.

The All, is all types of races of men, and I believe its the all that the Father gave Him as Per Jn 6:37

37 All that the Father giveth me shall come to me; and him that cometh to me I will in no wise cast out.

Jn 17:2

2As thou hast given him power over all flesh, that he should give eternal life to as many as thou hast given him.

The reason why He is speaking about all types or races of men is because, as the Seed of Abraham [ Gal 3:16] He will draw, convert all of Abraham's promised Children to Him. Remember when God told Abraham, that A Father of Many Nations He had made him in Gen 17:5

5Neither shall thy name any more be called Abram, but thy name shall be Abraham; for a father of many nations have I made thee.

Well Jesus death as the seed of Abraham would accomplish the gathering in of Abraham's seed from all Nations.

That word in Gen 17:5 for nations is the hebrew word gowy :

nation, people

a) nation, people

1) usually of non-Hebrew people

2) of descendants of Abraham

3) of Israel

And the word is also translated gentiles as here:

Isa 11:10

10And in that day there shall be a root of Jesse, which shall stand for an ensign of the people; to it shall the Gentiles seek: and his rest shall be glorious.

Isa 42:1,6

1Behold my servant, whom I uphold; mine elect, in whom my soul delighteth; I have put my spirit upon him: he shall bring forth judgment to the Gentiles.

6I the LORD have called thee in righteousness, and will hold thine hand, and will keep thee, and give thee for a covenant of the people, for a light of the Gentiles;[Thats because the Gentiles were included in the Abrahamic Covenant in Gen 17:5]

Isa 49:6

6And he said, It is a light thing that thou shouldest be my servant to raise up the tribes of Jacob, and to restore the preserved of Israel: I will also give thee for a light to the Gentiles, that thou mayest be my salvation unto the end of the earth.

All this was in regards to God's Covenant with Abraham, that He was made a Father of Many Nations, and in doing so, He would multiply his seed. Gen 17:2,7

2And I will make my covenant between me and thee, and will multiply thee exceedingly.

7And I will establish my covenant between me and thee and thy seed after thee in their generations for an everlasting covenant, to be a God unto thee, and to thy seed after thee.

This establishes the fact, that what God said to Abraham in vs 5, had to do with His Covenantal Promises to Him.

That this matter related to Justification is clearly brought to the forefront by Paul here Gal 3:8

8And the scripture, foreseeing that God would justify the heathen through faith, preached before the gospel unto Abraham, saying, In thee shall all nations be blessed.

Also, the word for nations in Gen 17:5, also is translated heathen as here Ps 102:15

15So the heathen shall fear the name of the LORD, and all the kings of the earth thy glory.

These heathen would be Abraham's seed among the Nations or the Gentiles that were part of the Covenant to Abraham.

Now, I am presenting this, so we can understand why Jesus spake of His death as the means by which He would draw all unto Him. Not all as in all men without exception, but all without distinction, of the seed of Abraham from among the Gentile Nations.

beloved57
June 29th, 2011, 07:07 AM
So we see Jesus Himself making the claim that if He be Lifted up, meaning His death, that He would cause or draw all to Himself, all types of People. The word draw is the greek word helkō and means:

to draw, drag off

2) metaph., to draw by inward power, lead, impel

It means to lead by an inward power ! And what is this Power ? Lets look at Zech 4:6

Then he answered and spake unto me, saying, This is the word of the LORD unto Zerubbabel, saying, Not by might, nor by power, but by my spirit, saith the LORD of hosts.

Yes, thats right, the Power is the Holy Spirit of God, which is given in the New Birth, it is He which leads men unto Faith in Christ.

Ps 110:3

3Thy people shall be willing in the day of thy power, in the beauties of holiness from the womb of the morning: thou hast the dew of thy youth.

In the Day of Christ's Power, His People shall be made willing, that is the Day when His Spirit is sent to them to give them New Life, To convince them of Sin Jn 16:8-10.

Its in this day that the word of God Preached to them comes with the Holy Ghost and so with Power 1 Thess 1:5

For our gospel came not unto you in word only, but also in power, and in the Holy Ghost, and in much assurance; as ye know what manner of men we were among you for your sake.

Believing, and Hope comes through the Power of the Holy Ghost Rom 15:13

Now the God of hope fill you with all joy and peace in believing, that ye may abound in hope, through the power of the Holy Ghost.

That word power is the greek word dynamis and means:

strength power, ability

a) inherent power, power residing in a thing by virtue of its nature, or which a person or thing exerts and puts forth

b) power for performing miracles

c) moral power and excellence of soul

You see, this is needed because by nature, the elect of God are without strength Rom 5:6

For when we were yet without strength, in due time Christ died for the ungodly.

So Christ by dying, He provides the strength that His People need by supplying them with the Holy Ghost in their New Birth, and He , the Holy Ghost leads Them into all Truth Jn 16:13, and of course in doing so, He guides them to Christ who is The Truth Jn 14:6

6Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me.

So you see, the lifting up of Christ upon the cross, His death, produced the effect of the work of The Holy Ghost. Remember after His ascension, it is stated that He received of His Father the Promise of the Holy Ghost Acts 2:33

Therefore being by the right hand of God exalted, and having received of the Father the promise of the Holy Ghost, he hath shed forth this, which ye now see and hear.

Why do you think He received of the Holy Ghost ? Because of the results He was to effect in all the People He was died for, whom He was lifted up in behalf of. Thats what they heard and saw on the day of Pentecost when souls were made alive and desired to be instructed in the things of God, They were being drawn to Christ, to believe in Him. This I say is an accomplishment of Christ death. Jn 12:32

beloved57
July 1st, 2011, 04:25 PM
If anything short of life everlasting is the result or outcome of Christ coming into the world for those He died for, then God's Purpose for Him coming has failed. Also His Love has failed.

1 Jn 4:9

9In this was manifested the love of God toward us, because that God sent his only begotten Son into the world, [B]that we might live through him.

In other words, John is stating the Purpose and intent of God in sending into this world, His Only Begotten Son, it was in order that, Life everlasting would be effectually communicated unto us, and that we may live Spiritually through Him. It is similar to when Jesus said of His Sheep Jn 10:10

The thief cometh not, but for to steal, and to kill, and to destroy: I am come that they might have life, and that they might have it more abundantly.

Now both of these scriptures have one thing in common, the word That. The word that is the greek conjunction hina:

that, in order that, so that


This word when used in conjunction with the subjunctive mood, is not expressing uncertainty, but Purpose, God Himself fulfilling the conditions for the intended purpose to come into fruition.

The results therefore is that all for whom Christ came to die for, receive Life, both spiritual and eternal. Notice Jn 6:33

For the bread of God is he which cometh down from heaven, and giveth life unto the world.

All Christ died for will receive a New Birth, a New Life.

This is what Jesus meant in Jn 12:24

Verily, verily, I say unto you, Except a corn of wheat fall into the ground and die, it abideth alone: but if it die, it bringeth forth much fruit.

The fruit is Life Eternal Jn 4:36

And he that reapeth receiveth wages, and gathereth fruit unto life eternal: that both he that soweth and he that reapeth may rejoice together.

The eternal life, the Spiritual Life of all those Christ came and died for, are His wages for His work.

beloved57
July 17th, 2011, 05:37 AM
2 Cor 8:9

9For ye know the grace of our Lord Jesus Christ, that, though he was rich, yet for your sakes he became poor, that ye through his poverty might be rich.

Notice "That ye [ The Church of God see 2 Cor 1:1] through His poverty [ made in the likeness of sinful flesh] might be rich.

This is stating a Divine Purpose to be accomplished through His coming and giving His Life for the objects He gave His Life for, the Church of God. Notice to whom this Letter is written 2 Cor 1:1

1Paul, an apostle of Jesus Christ by the will of God, and Timothy our brother, unto the church of God which is at Corinth, with all the saints which are in all Achaia:

And we know scripture tells us without question That Christ gave Himself for the Church He Loved Eph 5:25

25Husbands, love your wives, even as Christ also loved the church, and gave himself for it;

The end result is to make it Rich.

Remember Christ told some in the Church Smyrna Rev 2:9

9I know thy works, and tribulation, and poverty, (but thou art rich) and I know the blasphemy of them which say they are Jews, and are not, but are the synagogue of Satan.

This is stated to be Christ Purpose for coming into the world in 2 Cor 8:9.

That ye through His Poverty might be rich.

This statement is in the subjunctive mood, which means the result in view is contingent upon a condition, in this instance the condition is Christ being made poor for them. And whenever the conjunction word hina precedes the stated end, it denotes the Divine Purpose is the First Cause, and means "in order that" or "so that"

Christ was made poor in order that ye be made rich !

This includes their sin debt being paid in full and being clothed in the fine linen of Christ Imputed Righteousness and being made rich in Faith. 2 Cor 5:21

21For he hath made him to be sin for us, who knew no sin; that we might be made the righteousness of God in him.

Rom 5:19

19For as by one man's disobedience many were made sinners, so by the obedience of one shall many be made righteous.

James 2:5

5Hearken, my beloved brethren, Hath not God chosen the poor of this world rich in faith, and heirs of the kingdom which he hath promised to them that love him?

God chose them to be and made them rich in Faith through Christ being made poor for them !

It is God only who maketh Rich 1 Sam 2:7

7The LORD maketh poor, and maketh rich: he bringeth low, and lifteth up.

Now this Truth is True in both a natural sense and Spiritual sense !

God through Christ makes us Kings and Priests Rev 1:5-6

5And from Jesus Christ, who is the faithful witness, and the first begotten of the dead, and the prince of the kings of the earth. Unto him that loved us, and washed us from our sins in his own blood,

6And hath made us kings and priests unto God and his Father; to him be glory and dominion for ever and ever. Amen.

You see that " hath made us so" not offer to make, or make it available if you accept it. But He makes it happen !

That word made is the greek word poieō and means:


to make

a) with the names of things made, to produce, construct, form, fashion,

to make a thing out of something

to (make i.e.) constitute or appoint one anything, to appoint or ordain one that

to make one do something

1) cause one to

You see that ? To make one do something. Not ask them to do it, but makes them do it !

This is being made a new creature in Christ Spiritual Kingdom !

All this is a accomplishment of the Atonement and to enter man's freewill into this is nothing less than blasphemy and attempts to steal the Crown that belongs upon the Head of Christ..

beloved57
July 26th, 2011, 05:35 AM
About Redemption, God does not call the redeemed to return to Him[Repentance] in order to be redeemed, but because they are already redeemed Isa 44:22

22I have blotted out, as a thick cloud, thy transgressions, and, as a cloud, thy sins: return unto me; for I have redeemed thee.

Thats done solely by the Blood of Christ Eph 1:7

7In whom we have redemption through his blood, the forgiveness of sins, according to the riches of his grace;

God through Christ hath already redeemed Israel, His Chosen in Christ !

Isa 43:1

But now thus saith the LORD that created thee, O Jacob, and he that formed thee, O Israel, Fear not: for I have redeemed thee, I have called thee by thy name; thou art mine.

Isa 44:23

Sing, O ye heavens; for the LORD hath done it: shout, ye lower parts of the earth: break forth into singing, ye mountains, O forest, and every tree therein: for the LORD hath redeemed Jacob, and glorified himself in Israel.

Lk 1:68

Blessed be the Lord God of Israel; for he hath visited and redeemed his people,

These are not referring to Israel according to the Flesh, Abraham's physical descendants, because they in themselves are not the Children of God Rom 9:8

8That is, They which are the children of the flesh, these are not the children of God: but the children of the promise are counted for the seed.

But this Israel are all those Chosen in Christ before the Foundation of the world, The Seed of Abraham Gal 3:16

Also its the same with reconciliation, God does not call the reconciled in order to be reconciled, but because they are already objectively reconciled by the Death of God's Son. Rom 5:10

10For if, when we were enemies, we were reconciled to God by the death of his Son, much more, being reconciled, we shall be saved by his life.

2 Cor 5:18-20

18And all things are of God, who hath reconciled us to himself by Jesus Christ, and hath given to us the ministry of reconciliation;

19To wit, that God was in Christ, reconciling the world unto himself, not imputing their trespasses unto them; and hath committed unto us the word of reconciliation.

20Now then we are ambassadors for Christ, as though God did beseech you by us: we pray you in Christ's stead, be ye reconciled to God.

So the Gospel call goes out to the already redeemed or the already reconciled, now is time for them to receive the Knowledge and comfort of them..

beloved57
August 1st, 2011, 07:52 AM
The Lord Jesus Christ of whom Adam was a Type, took the place of a countless multitude of God's Elect, who were given to Him by His Father [Jn 17:2;6:37], and He died on the cross in behalf of them, even though many had yet to be born, and through Him, they have been Redeemed, Justified, Forgiven, Sanctified, Saved and made Righteous by His Blood; For of a Truth they were accepted in the Beloved and Blessed with all Spiritual Blessings [not in their actual persons as of yet, but in their Covenant Head] before time began, in the Lamb of God which was slain from the foundation of the world. Rom 8:29-30; Eph 1:3-7; 2 Tim 1:9; Rev 13:8. For the Spirit in no uncertain terms declares " The works were finished from the foundation of the world" Heb 4:3 ! This reference is regarding creation, but its a parallel with the finished work of Redemption.

beloved57
August 1st, 2011, 03:05 PM
Christ Death accomplished and obtained Eternal Redemption for us ! Heb 9:12

12Neither by the blood of goats and calves, but by his own blood he entered in once into the holy place, having obtained eternal redemption for us

Who are the Us ? That would be the Seed of Abraham of whom He came and took on the Seed of Heb 2:16

16For verily he took not on him the nature of angels; but he took on him the seed of Abraham.

Now for this Seed, He obtained Eternal Redemption for !

The word obtained here is the greek word heuriskō and means:


to find out for one's self, to acquire, get, obtain, procure

Here are a couple of other translations:

WNT and once for all entered the Holy place, taking with Him not the blood of goats and calves, but His own blood, and thus procuring eternal redemption for us.

This word procuring also means to secure :

ISV Not with the blood of goats and calves, but with his own blood he went into the Holy of Holies once for all and secured our eternal redemption.

The word origin of procure is defined :

"bring about, cause, effect,"

So, The point is , Christ just did not obtain Eternal Redemption for us to merely have it as a possession, but that He would bring about redemptive results, effects.

You see, Heb 8-10 are Chapters describing to its readers the far Superior value of Christ's Priesthood over and above that of the Levitical Priesthood and its results and effects, which fade in comparison to what Christ accomplished with God with His Blood for His People.

So Christ obtained, procured an Eternal Redemption for us, The Seed of Abraham. And He is not stagnated with this redemption, but bequeaths it's benefits upon the Heirs. You see, He procured it for a Purpose !

beloved57
August 2nd, 2011, 10:27 AM
A fellow said once to me, that yes Jesus Christ has obtained Eternal Redemption for them, but that does not mean those who He died for receive it. How far from the Truth was that statement. Redemption requires action to be done by the one doing the redeeming or He has not accomplished redemption, He has not accomplished anything if those He died to redeem are not actually redeemed.

Lets look again at Heb 9:12

12Neither by the blood of goats and calves, but by his own blood he entered in once into the holy place, having obtained eternal redemption for us.

The word redemption here is the greek word lytrōsis:


ransoming, redemption

2) deliverance, esp. from the penalty of sin

Notice that one of the definitions is deliverance from the penalty of sin.

The Eternal Redemption of Heb 9:12, for the US the writer Identifies himself with, as to whom Christ obtained Eternal Redemption, He has obtained for them Eternal Deliverance from the penalty of what their sins deserve.

Paul says like this in Eph 1:7

7In whom we have redemption through his blood, the forgiveness of sins, according to the riches of his grace;

All whom Christ died for, have Eternal Forgiveness, even when they are by nature as others children of wrath ! Thats because this forgiveness is according to the riches of His Grace !

So one of the many acts that Christ obtained for them He died for is they all are Eternally delivered from the penalty of their sins, all of them, according to the Riches of His Grace, and this before they have any knowledge of it.

beloved57
August 2nd, 2011, 09:43 PM
As we continue to consider the Eternal Redemption Christ has procured for them He died for, we find that He has obtained for them Eternal Forgiveness, for His Death hath delivered them from the Penalty of all their sins. All who are such blessed shall receive a Knowledge [Spiritual] of their Forgiveness Lk 1:77

77To give knowledge of salvation unto his people by the remission of their sins,

Folks Forgiveness of sins is Salvation, a portion of it ! That means you never have to worry about dying in your sins Heb 8:12

12For I will be merciful to their unrighteousness, and their sins and their iniquities will I remember no more.

When He says He will remember them no more, means He will never lay them to their Charge as to condemn them.

Acts 5:31

31Him hath God exalted with his right hand to be a Prince and a Saviour, for to give repentance to Israel, and forgiveness of sins.

Israel here means His Chosen People, whether jew or gentile, again He will give them a Knowledge of their forgiveness of sins !

Lk 24:46-47

46And said unto them, Thus it is written, and thus it behooved Christ to suffer, and to rise from the dead the third day:

47And that repentance and remission of sins should be preached in his name among all nations, beginning at Jerusalem.

Forgiveness of sins should preached IN HIS NAME !

What does that mean , In His Name ? The word name here is the greek word onoma:

name: univ. of proper names

2) the name is used for everything which the name covers, everything the thought or feeling of which is aroused in the mind by mentioning, hearing, remembering, the name, i.e. for one's rank, authority, interests, pleasure, command, excellences, deeds etc.

3) persons reckoned up by name

4) the cause or reason named: on this account, because he suffers as a Christian, for this reason

The Ideal here is Repentance and Remission of sins have been accomplished by the Person and Work of Jesus Christ for His People. Both are given by Him on account of His finished work. In this scripture Repentance nor forgiveness of sins are commands or duties, but procured and bestowed blessings because of Christ's Finished work. And all that He died for will receive from Him Repentance and the knowledge of the forgiveness of their sins, as Peter puts it in Acts 5:31 see also Acts 11:18 Where it's made clear that Gentiles are included in being given Repentance unto Life !

beloved57
August 4th, 2011, 11:48 PM
This Eternal Redemption is also a ransoming ! The blood was the ransom price, redemption is the effect or result. Remember the term ransom is used here Mk 10:45

For even the Son of man came not to be ministered unto, but to minister, and to give his life a ransom for many.

1 Tim 2:6

Who gave himself a ransom for all, to be testified in due time.

Now in Mk 10:45 the word for ransom is lytron and means:


the price for redeeming, ransom

a) paid for slaves, captives

b) for the ransom of life

2) to liberate many from misery and the penalty of their sins

In 1 Tim 2:6 the word is antilytron:

) what is given in exchange for another as the price of his redemption, ransom


This definition zero's in on the fact that a Life has been given for a life.

Once the ransom price has been accepted, then Justice has been served for the ransomed, all the penalties must cease by Divine Justice. Those ransomed are freed from all penalties. One such penalty was death, all facets of it. To be ransomed is to be set free from death

Hosea 13:14

I will ransom them from the power of the grave; I will redeem them from death: O death, I will be thy plagues; O grave, I will be thy destruction: repentance shall be hid from mine eyes.

Sin brought Death Rom 6:23


23For the wages of sin is death; but the gift of God is eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord.

But, all for whom Christ gave Himself a Ransom in place of They as a matter of Justice must now Receive Life, Spiritual Life, because spiritual death no longer can be a penalty for their sins, They have by the blood of Christ liberated or set free from the penalty of sin.

Now that Christ has paid the ransom price, death must be abolished in behalf of those persons 2 Tim 1:10

10But is now made manifest by the appearing of our Saviour Jesus Christ, who hath abolished death, and hath brought life and immortality to light through the gospel:

This word abolished is the greek word katargeō and means:


to render idle, unemployed, inactivate, inoperative

a) to cause a person or thing to have no further efficiency

b) to deprive of force, influence, power

2) to cause to cease, put an end to, do away with, annul, abolish

a) to cease, to pass away, be done away

b) to be severed from, separated from, discharged from, loosed from any one

c) to terminate all intercourse with one


Because of the ransom blood and the redemption through the blood of Christ, death is caused to cease, its done away with.

Since death is abolished, Life must be communicated, Life is the antithesis of death. Spiritual Life must be communicated to all for whom Christ gave Himself a Ransom. This Life is given by the Spirit in a New Birth. The New Birth is an evidence that Christ's ransom price of His Life, His blood has satisfied all the Justice of God for our sins. This Life that God gives is Eternal Life, an immortal Life, and this Life of immortality is brought to Light by the Gospel 2 Tim 1:10

10But is now made manifest by the appearing of our Saviour Jesus Christ, who hath abolished death, and hath brought life and immortality to light through the gospel:

beloved57
August 17th, 2011, 07:05 AM
Scripture is clear that Christ's Blood is Covenant Blood ! Matt 26:28

28For this is my blood of the new testament, which is shed for many for the remission of sins.

That word testament is the greek word diathēkē and is also translated covenant :


a disposition, arrangement, of any sort, which one wishes to be valid, the last disposition which one makes of his earthly possessions after his death, a testament or will

Notice that the word used has more to do with the last disposition or testament, the bequeathing of the possessions after the death of the Testator or the one making a will.

As far as a agreement between parties are concerned, another word for covenant is used ,it is the word suntithemi lit., "to put together, which means to agree or assent.

But the prominent feature in the Covenant Blood of Christ is its accomplishments, what it actually does for and unto those for which it was shed..

Heb 13:20

20Now the God of peace, that brought again from the dead our Lord Jesus, that great shepherd of the sheep, through the blood of the everlasting covenant,

We want to look at some of the Accomplishments of the Blood of the Covenant unto its beneficiaries, those whom Christ has ordered the bestowal of the purchased possessions upon them.

Now one of the accomplishments is that His Covenant Blood abolished the need for further imprisonment.

Lets look at Isa 42:7

To open the blind eyes, to bring out the prisoners from the prison, and them that sit in darkness out of the prison house.

First lets look at vs 6 I the LORD have called thee in righteousness, and will hold thine hand, and will keep thee, and give thee for a covenant of the people, for a light of the Gentiles;


Thats speaking about His Blood being given in Covenant for the People, and one of the accomplishments vs 7 is to bring out the Prisoners from the prison house. Note that it does not say to offer them a way out if they decide to accept it, but to actually bring them out !

That word phrase bring out in vs 7 is the hebrew word yatsa and literally means:

to cause to go or come out, bring out, lead out

Now what Prison house is meant here ? The Prison house of sin ! God hath concluded all under sin ! Gal 3:22

But the scripture hath concluded all under sin, that the promise by faith of Jesus Christ might be given to them that believe.

Now the All here is speaking of the elect, and when they sinned in Adam, God concluded them under sin. Now this word concluded is the greek word sygkleiō and means:


to shut up together, enclose

a) of a shoal of fishes in a net

2) to shut up on all sides, shut up completely As in a prison Emphasis mine !

This was part of the Death we incurred when God told Adam, in the day that you eat, ye shall surely die. Well imprisonment and enslavement to sin is the outcome.

And one of the Accomplishments of Christ Covenant Blood, it bring the Prisoners out of Prison, out of captivity to sin..

This is not accomplished by anything the prisoner did, their repentance, their faith, or none of that, but accomplished by the Blood of the Covenant !

beloved57
August 17th, 2011, 10:19 PM
Yes, The Blood of the Covenant brings out the Prisoners, those that were captive by the devil 2 Tim 2:26

26And that they may recover themselves out of the snare of the devil, who are taken captive by him at his will.

The Blood of the Covenant opens blind eyes ! Isa 42:7

To open the blind eyes, to bring out the prisoners from the prison, and them that sit in darkness out of the prison house.

We by Nature are Spiritually blind ! Acts 26:18

18To open their eyes, and to turn them from darkness to light, and from the power of Satan unto God, that they may receive forgiveness of sins, and inheritance among them which are sanctified by faith that is in me.

Thats the giving also the eye of Faith. To open their eyes, not to offer it.

Paul was a Minister of the New Covenant 2 Cor 3.. The Covenant Blood of Christ demands that all for whom He died be given Spiritual sight.. Hence Jesus says Jn 6:40

40And this is the will of him that sent me, that every one which seeth the Son, and believeth on him, may have everlasting life: and I will raise him up at the last day.

beloved57
August 28th, 2011, 10:41 AM
Heb 10:14

14For by one offering he hath perfected for ever them that are sanctified.

This is one of the many many ways we know the scripture does not teach that Christ died for all mankind without exception, the fact being,those He did die for [ one offering] he hath by that death, perfected them forever !

From the merits of His death effects their sanctification in time by the Holy Spirit. The text here states that He hath perfected forever them that are sanctified. The word sanctified here is the greek word hagiazo and means:

to render or acknowledge, or to be venerable or hallow
to separate from profane things and dedicate to God consecrate things to God
dedicate people to God
to purify
to cleanse externally
to purify by expiation: free from the guilt of sin
to purify internally by renewing of the soul

And its a present passive participle, meaning they are being sanctified or renewed.

This being set apart for the active purpose of God, the internal renewing as per Titus 3:5

5Not by works of righteousness which we have done, but according to his mercy he saved us, by the washing of regeneration, and renewing of the Holy Ghost;

All this renewing and sanctifying work is being done as an accomplishment of the offering of Christ and its resultant perfecting forever.

So either Christ death will eventually cause all to be renewed by the Holy Ghost [ Titus 3:5] which we know is a lie, or His death was limited to only some, who will be renewed by the Holy Ghost or we deny the Truth of the accomplishment of His offering [death] that it hath perfected forever them He died for.

beloved57
September 11th, 2011, 09:54 AM
The Lord Jesus Christ in contemplation of His impending death and subsequent resurrection from the dead for all whom the Father hath given Him in the Everlasting Covenant, as Surety for their sins against the Law of God, stated this ! Jn 17:4

4I have glorified thee on the earth: I have finished the work which thou gavest me to do.

The word finished here is the greek word Teleioo and means:

to make perfect, complete
to carry through completely, to accomplish, finish, bring to an end
to complete (perfect)
add what is yet wanting in order to render a thing full
to be found perfect
to bring to the end (goal) proposed
to accomplish
bring to a close or fulfilment by event
of the prophecies of the scriptures

Christ has left nothing undone, all completed. Now what is the Work that God the Father gave Him to do ?

It was nothing less than to seek and to save that which was Lost Lk 19:10

10For the Son of man is come to seek and to save that which was lost.

That is the work that God the Father gave to His Son to accomplish. Jn 6:38-40

38For I came down from heaven, not to do mine own will, but the will of him that sent me.

39And this is the Father's will which hath sent me, that of all which he hath given me I should lose nothing, but should raise it up again at the last day.

40And this is the will of him that sent me, that every one which seeth the Son, and believeth on him, may have everlasting life: and I will raise him up at the last day.

Not one Lost soul for whom the Father gave to the Son to seek and to save should be Lost, if it is, Christ is a liar and has left undone the Work which His Father gave Him to do.

beloved57
September 14th, 2011, 10:07 AM
Lk 19:10

For the Son of man is come to seek and to save that which was lost.

Now what was it that was Lost that Christ came to seek and to save ?

It was the Sons of God that sinned in Adam, and Jesus Christ was successful in Saving all of them.

This has been Illustrated by the parable of the Lost Son Lk 15:11-32

The Father in this Parable would be God the Father, and the Lost Son would be all the Sons of God who went astray in Adam Lk 3:38

38Which was the son of Enos, which was the son of Seth, which was the son of Adam, which was the son of God.

Adam was the embodiment and Legal Federal Head of all the Sons of God at Creation in the Physical Lives.

They were Lost in Adam through his disobedience and became alienated from the Father.

Upon their reconciliation they are said to be found as in the Parable Lk 15:24,32

24For this my son was dead, and is alive again; he was lost, and is found. And they began to be merry.

It was meet that we should make merry, and be glad: for this thy brother was dead, and is alive again; and was lost, and is found.

The Lost Son returning to His Father is the effect of the Work of Christ done on his behalf.. Lk 15:17-20


17And when he came to himself, he said, How many hired servants of my father's have bread enough and to spare, and I perish with hunger!

18I will arise and go to my father, and will say unto him, Father, I have sinned against heaven, and before thee,

19And am no more worthy to be called thy son: make me as one of thy hired servants.

20And he arose, and came to his father. But when he was yet a great way off, his father saw him, and had compassion, and ran, and fell on his neck, and kissed him.

You see, that was the objective of Christ's Death, to bring back to God His Lost Sons 1 Pet 3:18

18For Christ also hath once suffered for sins, the just for the unjust, that he might bring us to God, being put to death in the flesh, but quickened by the Spirit:

1 Pet 2:24-25

24Who his own self bare our sins in his own body on the tree, that we, being dead to sins, should live unto righteousness: by whose stripes ye were healed.

25For ye were as sheep going astray; but are now returned unto the Shepherd and Bishop of your souls.

The word returned here is the greek word Epistrepho and means:

to cause to return, to bring back

Thats what the Prodigal Son was experiencing when he made up his mind to return to his Fathers house.

This is the effect of Christ Death for each Son of God who sinned in Adam, they will be returned back to God, and that is what Christ came to do by His Death Lk 19:10

10For the Son of man is come to seek and to save that which was lost.

If Each Son of God that was Lost in Adam does not convert as the Prodigal did in Lk 15:17-20 and it not be heard Lk 15:24

24For this my son was dead, and is alive again; he was lost, and is found. And they began to be merry.

Then the Lord Jesus Christ failed in His Mission for His Father to seek and to save that which was Lost..His death did not accomplish the objective !

beloved57
September 16th, 2011, 10:29 AM
Christ death accomplished that all for whom He died should be married to another.

Rom 7:4

Wherefore, my brethren, ye also are become dead to the law by the body of Christ; that ye should be married to another, even to him who is raised from the dead, that we should bring forth fruit unto God.

The believer is become dead to the Law, its condemnation, and all of its requirements as a covenant of works, do and live. Now how are believers in Christ dead to the Law ? Is it by their Faith in Christ ? No sir, its by the Body of Christ, meaning His Death and all that it accomplished for them in regards to God's Law. He kept it perfectly for them, and where they did offend, He bore the full cup of God's wrath for them, and the end design was so that they can be married to another to another, even Him that has been raised up from the dead for their Justification Rom 4:25, that they may bring forth Fruit unto God, that is perform those good works that God before hath ordained they they should walk in Eph 2:10.

Marriage is an fellowship, a Experiential Union, so all for whom Christ died, God out of Faithfulness calls them into the Fellowship of His Son 1 Cor 1:9

9God is faithful, by whom ye were called unto the fellowship of his Son Jesus Christ our Lord.

The word unto is the preposition eis and denotes into as in entrance into, this call actually results in entering into experiential union and fellowship with Christ !

This is an accomplishment of the Death of Christ for all whom He died and rose again for their Justification..

beloved57
September 26th, 2011, 01:58 PM
By Atonement is meant that Christ having died in the place of or in the stead of certain Chosen sinners, taking upon Himself the due and Just punishment that was due their sins, transgressions, iniquities, and offences, and for that made a sin offering, the Just for the unjust [sinners] in order that or for the purpose of bringing them to God 1 Pet 3:18

18For Christ also hath once suffered for sins, the just for the unjust, that he might bring us to God, being put to death in the flesh, but quickened by the Spirit:

Thats effecting atonement when those Christ died for, as a benefit from His Death, have it all done to them and in them, that is necessary, Spiritually, that brings them unto Faith and Fellowship with God !

Anything short of this outcome is not an atonement, and means Christ death did not succeed for those He died to bring to God. However Paul says it did succeed, because He writes, by Him [Christ] we have received Atonement Rom 5:11

11And not only so, but we also joy in God through our Lord Jesus Christ by whom we have now received the atonement

What that means is that by Christ, His Death, His accomplishment, we have been experimentally reconciled to God Col 1:21

21And you, that were sometime alienated and enemies in your mind by wicked works, [B]yet now hath he reconciled

The greek word here for reconciled is Apokatallasso and means:

to reconcile completely

to reconcile back again

bring back a former state of harmony

Yes, this is the Atonement Christ death alone accomplished for everyone He died for ,it brings them back into harmony and fellowship with God, like they had with God before they sinned in Adam.

beloved57
September 26th, 2011, 04:00 PM
You see sin resulted in alienation and hostility in our minds as is pointed out here Col 1:21

21And you, that were sometime alienated and enemies in your mind by wicked works, yet now hath he reconciled

Let me say something here. This verse is not only describing the fornicators, drunkards, drug attics in the world, but also the very religious people, the very moral people, people who live decently and honestly before men, but they just don't have the True Christ.

Also Eph 2:1-3

1And you hath he quickened, who were dead in trespasses and sins;

2Wherein in time past ye walked according to the course of this world, according to the prince of the power of the air, the spirit that now worketh in the children of disobedience:

3Among whom also we all had our conversation in times past in the lusts of our flesh, fulfilling the desires of the flesh and of the mind; and were by nature the children of wrath, even as others.

Notice Paul said that he also walked in the lusts of the flesh, fulfilling the desires of the flesh and the mind, now paul I do not believe was a fornicator, a thief or a drunkard, but this is what characterized previous lifestyle Phil 3:4-6

4Though I might also have confidence in the flesh. If any other man thinketh that he hath whereof he might trust in the flesh, I more:

5Circumcised the eighth day, of the stock of Israel, of the tribe of Benjamin, an Hebrew of the Hebrews; as touching the law, a Pharisee;

6Concerning zeal, persecuting the church; touching the righteousness which is in the law, blameless.

Paul was I believe a very pious and religious man,perhaps from his youth.

But when he was saved, he looks back at that lifestyle just described in Phil 3 as one of being "fulfilling the desires of the flesh and the mind.

Eph 4:17-18

17This I say therefore, and testify in the Lord, that ye henceforth walk not as other Gentiles walk, in the vanity of their mind,

18Having the understanding darkened, being alienated from the life of God through the ignorance that is in them, because of the blindness of their heart:

However, the reconciliation and atoning benefits of Christ's death, the Holy Spirit working in conjunction with it, working in them that Christ died for, works so in them to present them Holy and Blameless before God, in the Day of Christ. Col 1:21-22

21And you, that were sometime alienated and enemies in your mind by wicked works, yet now hath he reconciled

22In the body of his flesh through death, to present you holy and unblameable and unreproveable in his sight:

Phil 1:6

6Being confident of this very thing, that he which hath begun a good work in you will perform it until the day of Jesus Christ:

So the commencing of the good work in us , reconciling us to God subjectively, is what Paul means by us receiving the Atonement,we have received of its mighty effects, it begins a work in us by God the Holy Spirit, that actively brings back to God, Thats the Atonement that Christ's provides for everyone he died for, God's Elect..

beloved57
September 26th, 2011, 04:56 PM
I know that there are many different theories of the Atonement of which I am not going to address and dissect, but its my firm conviction that the scriptures teach a vicarious Atonement. That Christ actually died in the place of elect sinners, and consequently if this be True, and Christ did die for elect sinners 1 Cor 15:3

3For I delivered unto you first of all that which I also received, how that Christ died for our sins according to the scriptures;

Rom 8:33-34

33Who shall lay any thing to the charge of God's elect? It is God that justifieth.

34Who is he that condemneth? It is Christ that died, yea rather, that is risen again, who is even at the right hand of God, who also maketh intercession for us.

Note: Remember the OT Types for the sacrifice of sin, they also were limited to an Elect People, elect sinners .

Now as a result in the case of Christ's vicarious death for elect sinners, as a result, There are no debts of sin charged against the elect Christ died for. They were canceled or as Paul writes in Col 2:14

14Blotting out the handwriting of ordinances that was against us, which was contrary to us, and took it out of the way, nailing it to his cross;

This blotting out of the Elect's sins is so complete, God has no reason to ever punish them for sin again. Good Job Jesus Christ !

Sheila B
September 26th, 2011, 05:03 PM
..... but I think a 'god' that demands 'blood' to pay a price or set up as the only means to reconcile or save another ought to be questioned.



pj

Isn't this the mystery of Love? That the Second Splendor decided from the foundation of emergence to give His all?
Not a demand, but a freely given All.

beloved57
October 8th, 2011, 10:18 AM
Jn 10:14

14I am the good shepherd, and know my sheep[/B], and[B] am known of mine.

Christ says, " I know my Sheep and am known of Mine" that is His Sheep will Know Him savingly !

Christ ensures us that all Christ's Sheep, those He lay down His Life for, shall come into a Saving Knowledge of Him. Jn 17:2-3

3And this is life eternal, that they might know thee the only true God, and Jesus Christ, whom thou hast sent.

The word know is the same in Jn 10:14 and in Jn 17:3

It means an experiential knowing !

Christ death ensures a positive personal knowledge of Himself to all He died for, so Christ could say of them:

am known of mine !

The statement also ensures us that Christ knows experientially all those He died for !

So another conclusion we can derive from this saying of Christ is that those He shall yet say this to were never His own and He never died for Matt 7:23

23And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity.

And since He never knew them, they never knew Him, even though they called Him Lord Lord..They knew another jesus, one of their own imagination !

beloved57
October 17th, 2011, 08:59 AM
Rom 5:11

11And not only so, but we also joy in God through our Lord Jesus Christ, by whom we have now received the atonement.

This means that those Christ died for, and reconciled to God objectively, they receive the benefits subjectively of Christ atoning death, by Him.. Thats because He is the living Testator that now lives and ensures that they become beneficiaries of His death's accomplishments for them.

So we receive it by Faith, Holy Spirit given Faith from New Birth, when we receive the Knowledge of the remission of sins. Lk 1:77

77 To give knowledge of salvation unto his people by the remission of their sins,

The Knowledge here is understanding, to give understanding of salvation to His People, much like 1 Jn 5:20

20And we know that the Son of God is come, and hath given us an understanding, that we may know him that is true, and we are in him that is true, even in his Son Jesus Christ. This is the true God, and eternal life.

By the remission of sins, by that which comes through Jesus Christ, that which His blood gives to many ! Matt 26:28

28For this is my blood of the new testament, which is shed for many for the remission of sins.

Also Acts 26:18

18To open their eyes, and to turn them from darkness to light, and from the power of Satan unto God, that they may receive forgiveness of sins, and inheritance among them which are sanctified by faith that is in me.

Or that they may receive the atonement. The atonement, reconciliation and propitiation are all the same and include the forgiveness of sins because of the blood of Christ !

This was something that the Apostles were to declare among the nations along with repentances, in Christ Name Lk 24:47

47And that repentance and remission of sins should be preached[declared or made known,not offered] in his name among all nations, beginning at Jerusalem.

The word Preached here is the word kēryssō and means:

to publish, proclaim openly: something which has been done

This to publish is always in regards to things God has done, not what he might do or what He offers to do . Mk 5:20

20And he departed, and began to publish in Decapolis how great things Jesus had done for him: and all men did marvel.

Lk 8:39

39Return to thine own house, and shew how great things God hath done unto thee. And he went his way, and published throughout the whole city how great things Jesus had done unto him.

So Preaching repentance and remission of sins is not God offering anything, it is what God has done and accomplished for His People through the Person of Christ ! And all whom it pertains to will receive the Knowledge of it, thats receiving the Atonement !

Ben Masada
October 17th, 2011, 05:20 PM
I'll tell you what the Atonement really accomplished. First of all, we all must understand what was the atonement about, in order to understand what it has accomplished.

First of all, the Atonement was a prophecy to be fulfilled many years later. And, it constituted of two goats, on whose heads Aaron used to cast lots upon. One lot for the Lord and the other lot for the scapegoat. Then, Aaron would wait till verification of which goat the Lord's lot fell upon. Then, he would take that goat whose lot for the Lord had fallen upon and offered it for a sin offering. But the goat, on which the lot fell to be the scapegoat, was presented alive before the Lord to make an atonement for him, by being let go as a scapegoat into the wilderness toward the East. (Lev. 16:7-10)

Assyria was towards the East, beyond the desert whereto, every year this ritual was done as a prophecy to be fulfilled in Israel. Now, if you read Isaiah 9:8, the Lord sent a word (lot) into Jacob and it has lighted upon Israel. It is as if one was playing dice and the lot fell upon Israel rather than upon Judah. You need to understand that the two goats Aaron cast lots upon pointed to Israel and Judah. One was the goat for the Lord, which would remain to be offered as sin offering. This was Judah. The other, who was sent as a scapegoat into the desert towards the East was Israel, when this was conquered by the Assyrians and removed from the Land of Israel. That's the lot or word that was supposed to fall upon Judah and fell rather upon Israel. (Isa. 9:8) In other words, the Lord had rejected Israel which got lost in Assyria to disappear among the Gentiles and confirmed Judah to remain in Jerusalem forever. (Psalm 78:67-69) As Jeremiah says in 31:35-37, as long as the sun is for light in the sky by day, and the moon and the stars for lights by night.

Now, what did the Atonement that Israel made for Judah actually accomplish? If you read Isaiah 53:11,12, you will see that Israel was the Suffering Servant of Isaiah 53, and Israel was the one who made atonement for Judah by justifying "many," meaning those of Judah, by boring the sins of "many," meaning those of Judah. And with it, the
prophecy had met its fulfillment in the atonement that Israel executed for Judah. Now, Israel is gone as the prophetic scapegoat sent to the east wilderness every year. Today, the festival is still celebrated, but in memory to a fulfilled prophecy. Albeit not by using two literal goats because the Temple has been destroyed.
Ben

beloved57
October 18th, 2011, 12:58 AM
ben


I'll tell you what the Atonement really accomplished.

Your agenda is to be here and boast of the flesh. Gal 6:13

For neither they themselves who are circumcised keep the law; but desire to have you circumcised, that they may glory in your flesh

Phil 3:4-5

4Though I might also have confidence in the flesh. If any other man thinketh that he hath whereof he might trust in the flesh, I more:

5Circumcised the eighth day, of the stock of Israel, of the tribe of Benjamin, an Hebrew of the Hebrews; as touching the law, a Pharisee;

beloved57
October 19th, 2011, 06:29 AM
Heb 5:9

9And being made perfect, he became the author of eternal salvation unto all them that obey him;

The being made perfect here means by fulfilling every stipulation of the Everlasting Covenant of Grace, to include His obedience to death as per Phil 2:8; Rom 5:19, He became the Author of Eternal Salvation, to those obeying Him. This means His Perfect obedience causes their obedience. Evidence therefore of Christ having died for someone, is that they become obedient to the Gospel commands of God. The word obey in Heb 5:9 is the greek word hypakouō
and means:

to listen, to harken

a) of one who on the knock at the door comes to listen who it is, (the duty of a porter)

2) to harken to a command

a) to obey, be obedient to, submit to

It means to harken to a command. Now what were the Gospel commands ?

One is Repentance ! Acts 17:30

30And the times of this ignorance God winked at; but now commandeth all men every where to repent:

This word commandeth in the greek is in the present tense, God through the preaching of the Apostles was commanding repentance from all whom Christ had died for. Not only was this just a bare command, but God because of Christ wrought their obedience in them through the Preaching of the Apostles !

Paul states in Rom 15:18

For I will not dare to speak of any of those things which Christ hath not wrought by me, to make the Gentiles obedient, by word and deed,

Christ wrought by Preaching the obedience of elect gentiles ! Thats why we have Heb 5:9 That Christ is the Author of Salvation to who ? Why those obeying Him, those obeying the Gospel, those who hearken to the command to repent ! Another Gospel command that they shall hearken to is to Believe on the name of the Son of God. 1 Jn 3:23

23And this is his commandment, That we should believe on the name of his Son Jesus Christ, and love one another, as he gave us commandment.

Again, Christ work, wroughts obedience to this command, in them whom He died for. He causes their obedience.

And He wroughts obedience in them to the command to Love one another, that is brotherly love.

Lets look at this command given by Christ to His disciples See Jn 13:34;15:12,17

Peter says in 1 Pet 1:22,23

Seeing ye have purified your souls in obeying the truth through the Spirit unto unfeigned love of the brethren, see that ye love one another with a pure heart fervently: What did he base this on ? Vs 23

23Being born again, not of corruptible seed, but of incorruptible, by the word of God, which liveth and abideth for ever.

Thats who the Gospel commands are for, those being born again. They are the ones who are commanded to Repent, to Believe, and to Love one another, and Christ is the Author of them obeying Him !

beloved57
November 18th, 2011, 09:27 AM
We know that Christ could not have offered Himself for every man without exception simply because, by His offering, meaning His Death, He hath #1 Sanctified them [those He offered Himself for] once and For All. Heb 10:10

10By the which will we are sanctified through the offering of the body of Jesus Christ once for all.

Now the writer of Hebrews says this about the accomplishment of Christ's death for those He died for, that it Sanctified them. The word sanctified here is the greek word hagiazō and it means:

1) to render or acknowledge, or to be venerable or hallow

2) to separate from profane things and dedicate to God

a) consecrate things to God

b) dedicate people to God

3) to purify

a) to cleanse externally

b) to purify by expiation: free from the guilt of sin

c) to purify internally by renewing of the soul


Christ's sacrifice, contrary to the sacrifice of the OT Offerings, which purified outwardly as Per Heb 9:12

13For if the blood of bulls and of goats, and the ashes of an heifer sprinkling the unclean, sanctifieth to the purifying of the flesh:

Neither did the OT sacrifices take away the guilt of sin Heb 10:1-4

1For the law having a shadow of good things to come, and not the very image of the things, can never with those sacrifices which they offered year by year continually make the comers thereunto perfect.

2For then would they not have ceased to be offered? because that the worshippers once purged should have had no more conscience of sins.

3But in those sacrifices there is a remembrance again made of sins every year.

4For it is not possible that the blood of bulls and of goats should take away sins.

So, the Death or Offering of Christ far excelled the OT oblations for God's Chosen People, in that is #1 Took away the guilt of their sins, once and for all, and that it provides internal purification !

Now also the word sanctified here in Heb 10:10 is in the perfect tense in the greek ! The Perfect tense means:


an action which is viewed as having been completed in the past, once and for all, not needing to be repeated

Now, this Truth should be believed by any who say they are Believers in God's Truth.

If this Truth is believed, then the other scriptures that appear to teach that Christ died for everyone in the world without exception, cannot be teaching that, unless all without exception have in fact been sanctified once and for all by the blood of Christ, and have had their sins guilt put away for good and have or will indeed experience an internal purification. If they do not, then the writer of hebrews has lied, and is proven to be a false witness. Also this Truth establishes the Eternal Security of all those Christ died for !

beloved57
November 18th, 2011, 10:41 PM
We know that Christ could not have offered Himself for every man without exception simply because, by His offering, meaning His Death, He hath #1 Sanctified them [those He offered Himself for] once and For All. Heb 10:10

And #2 He hath perfected them forever by His Offering Heb 10:14

14For by one offering[His Death or Blood] he hath perfected for ever them that are sanctified.

Now, If Christ's death hath perfected forever them that are being sanctified by His death VS10, then, that means everyone without exception hath been perfected before God by the Death of Christ. That word Perfected is the greek word teleioō and means:


to make perfect, complete

a) to carry through completely, to accomplish, finish, bring to an end

2) to complete (perfect)

a) add what is yet wanting in order to render a thing full

b) to be found perfect

3) to bring to the end (goal) proposed

4) to accomplish

a) bring to a close or fulfilment by event

1) of the prophecies of the scriptures


GWT With one sacrifice he accomplished the work of setting them apart for God forever.

WNT For by a single offering He has for ever completed the blessing for those whom He is setting free from sin.

WNB For by one offering he has perfected forever those who are being sanctified.

What is important to understand, is that this perfecting has been solely accomplished by Christ's ONE OFFERING !

This is why Paul says this Rom 5:19


19For as by one man's disobedience many were made sinners, so by the obedience[Offering] of one shall many be made righteous.

You see that ? Christ,s one act of obedience or His Offering shall make many righteous, which is connected with that being made perfect by His Offering in Heb 10:14 !

Now the word Perfect in Heb 10:14 is also a Perfect tense passive verb. Again the Perfect tense means:

"an action which is viewed as having been completed in the past, once and for all, not needing to be repeated "

Now unless every single individual in the world without exception has been Perfected forever by the Offering of Christ, meaning His Death, then He could not have offered Himself in behalf of every single individual in the world without exception, lest The writer of Hebrews has been a false witness. Either the writer of Hebrews is a False witness or those preaching Christ died for all without exception, which all without exception are being saved, are false witnesses !

beloved57
November 26th, 2011, 05:34 PM
1 Jn 4:10

Herein is love, not that we loved God, but that he loved us, and sent his Son to be the propitiation[an appeasing] for our sins.

The word propitiation here as well as 1 Jn 2:2 is the greek word hilasmos and means:

an appeasing, propitiating

Our word appeases defined:

to bring to a state of peace, quiet, ease, calm, or contentment; pacify; soothe: to appease an angry king.

Christ death has accomplished Propitiation or Peace for all whom Christ died in the behalf of.

Col 1:20

And, having made peace through the blood of his cross, by him to reconcile all things unto himself; by him, I say, whether they be things in earth, or things in heaven.

Or this scripture could very well read without doing no violence at all " and having made propitiation through through the blood of His Cross.

Peace, conciliation, pacific, are the results of Christ blood being shed !

Folks this is an accomplishment of the Death of Christ for all He died for. Now many false teachers appeal to 1 Jn 2:2 as a proof text that Christ died for everyone in the world without exception, even though that is no where stated in the text. John, a believer, a jew, a minister to the circumcision Gal 2:9

9And when James, Cephas, and John, who seemed to be pillars, perceived the grace that was given unto me, they gave to me and Barnabas the right hands of fellowship; that we should go unto the heathen, and they unto the circumcision.

John therefore a jew and sent to the jews did write to believers who were of the circumcision, meaning ethnic jews, and he stated that Christ had been their or our propitiation our peace for our sins but not for ours only, meaning not for jewish believers only, but He is also the propitiation of believers in the whole world or it could be better understood, of believers amongst all Nations of the Earth, in fulfillment of Gen 12:3

3And I will bless them that bless thee, and curse him that curseth thee: and in thee shall[B] all families of the earth be blessed.

You see, all the Families of the Earth means the whole wide world !

And that is what John means by, and not of ours only, but of the whole world.

Anyone whose sins have been propitiated, God is at peace with them through Jesus Christ, they can never perish for their sins, lest somehow Christ's blood becomes a non factor with God.. The believer does not present the Blood of Christ unto the Father, but Christ does ! And Christ forever intercedes in behalf of those He died for because of His Blood ! Rom 8:

33Who shall lay any thing to the charge of God's elect? It is God that justifieth.

34Who is he that condemneth? It is Christ that died, yea rather, that is risen again, who is even at the right hand of God, who also maketh intercession for us.

Heb 7:25

25Wherefore he is able also to save them to the uttermost that come unto God by him, seeing he ever liveth to make intercession for them.

Heb 7:3

Without father, without mother, without descent, having neither beginning of days, nor end of life; but made like unto the Son of God; abideth a priest continually.

Heb 5:6

As he saith also in another place, Thou art a priest for ever after the order of Melchisedec.

Now, to whom and for whom is Christ a priest forever ? It's To God the Father, and its for all those He died for Rom 8:33-34

33Who shall lay any thing to the charge of God's elect? It is God that justifieth.

34Who is he that condemneth? It is Christ that died, yea rather, that is risen again, who is even at the right hand of God, who also maketh intercession for us.

Everyone Christ died for, He makes Intercession for, and His Blood has satisfied, propitiated the Father forever for them..

beloved57
November 27th, 2011, 08:44 PM
1 Thess 1:10

10And to wait for his Son from heaven, whom he raised from the dead, even Jesus, which delivered us from the wrath to come.

Who is Paul speaking of here ? Lets look at vs 4-5

4Knowing, brethren beloved, your election of God.

5For our gospel came not unto you in word only, but also in power, and in the Holy Ghost, and in much assurance; as ye know what manner of men we were among you for your sake

He is writing to the Election of Grace. Those that Christ died for and rose again, and by that, He delivered God's Elect from the Wrath to come !

The wrath here is that vindicative punishment that the wicked, unbelievers will receive as Per Matt 25:46

And these shall go away into everlasting punishment: but the righteous into life eternal.

2 Thess 1:8

In flaming fire taking vengeance on them that know not God, and that obey not the gospel of our Lord Jesus Christ:

Matt 25:41

41Then shall he say also unto them on the left hand, Depart from me, ye cursed, into everlasting fire, prepared for the devil and his angels:

We know Christ could not have died for those whom He will yet say these words unto, for He calls them cursed !

Now all for whom Christ did die have been redeemed from the curse of the Law, Christ being made a curse in their room and stead Gal 3:13

13Christ hath redeemed us from the curse of the law, being made a curse for us: for it is written, Cursed is every one that hangeth on a tree:

The word for is the prep huper and means:

in behalf of, for the sake of

over, beyond, more than

more, beyond, over

So , for all those He died, God made Him a curse in behalf of them ! And this released them from the curse of the Law. Now the strength of sin being the law, no sin can they ever be condemned for ! He being made a curse for them, was their deliverance, their salvation from the wrath to come 1 Thess 5:9


9For God hath not appointed us to wrath, but to obtain salvation by our Lord Jesus Christ,

Rom 5:9

Much more then, being now justified by his blood, we shall be saved from wrath through him.

beloved57
December 9th, 2011, 11:18 PM
The Death of Christ, it accomplished for all those He died for, for them to become believers in Him, yes that was one of God's Purposes behind it. Jn 3:14-17

14And as Moses lifted up the serpent in the wilderness, even so must the Son of man be lifted up:

15That whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have eternal life.

16For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.

17For God sent not his Son into the world to condemn the world; but that the world through him might be saved.

False teachers have made believing on Christ in these scriptures something man must do or perform as a condition to gain eternal life which is a lie, but believing on Christ is the purposed result and effect of the Death of Christ for all He died for and are believing [present tense] His death delivers them He died for from unbelief. The Holy Spirit applies the merits of Christ death [give life]upon all He died for, convincing them of sin [an effect of new birth] because by nature, they believe not on Him Jn 16:8-9

8And when he is come, he will reprove the world of sin, and of righteousness, and of judgment:

9Of sin, because they believe not on me;

beloved57
December 12th, 2011, 10:32 PM
Gal 6:14

14But God forbid that I should glory, save in the cross of our Lord Jesus Christ, by whom the world is crucified unto me, and I unto the world.

Paul makes a Christ Glorifying statement here about the Cross of Christ, One of it's many accomplishments and effects to them He died for. He states "by whom " meaning Christ, His Work, the world is crucified unto me, and I have been crucified unto the world. Notice that this was not by His Freewill, or His act of believing and so forth, but by a Person, Christ and His Cross accomplishment and effect for him

Paul boasted about the powerful effects of Christ crucified, something that is non existent in our day of Apostasy !


Paul is saying that the entire world system in all its Glory, but in opposition to God, is dead or destroyed in it's power to attract him; it has no influence or power over Paul, no appeal to him.And I to the world. Paul is similarly dead to the desires and attractions of the world, for he serves Christ as his new Master ESV Note on Gal 6:14

This is largely due to the God Given Faith each person that Christ died for will receive by from the Holy Spirit at New Birth and this is overcoming Faith of the world 1 Jn 5:4

For whatsoever is born of God overcometh the world: and this is the victory that overcometh the world, even our faith.

This Faith is an effect of the Cross to all whom Christ died and imparts His Victory to !

beloved57
December 13th, 2011, 06:14 PM
Gal 6:14

14But God forbid that I should glory, save in the cross of our Lord Jesus Christ, by whom the world is crucified unto me, and I unto the world.

The word Glory here is the greek word kauchaomai:


to glory (whether with reason or without)

2) to glory on account of a thing

3) to glory in a thing

It also is translated boast 2 Cor 7:14 or rejoice Phil 3:3

What do you and i boast in today ? How many of us truly boast of Glory in the Cross of Jesus Christ, His Person and Work and it's saving effects which are everlasting !

What I have observed of many of us is that we Glory not in The Person and Work of Christ and His Saving accomplishments for those He died, but in the flesh. Some of us by the teaching of the freewill of man, others by by our ethnicity, particularly ethnic jews. Yes ethnicity is of the flesh, and Paul stated this about having confidence in the flesh Phil 3:3-6

3For we are the circumcision, which worship God in the spirit, and rejoice in Christ Jesus, and have no confidence in the flesh.

4Though I might also have confidence in the flesh. If any other man thinketh that he hath whereof he might trust in the flesh, I more:

5Circumcised the eighth day, of the stock of Israel, of the tribe of Benjamin, an Hebrew of the Hebrews; as touching the law, a Pharisee;

6Concerning zeal, persecuting the church; touching the righteousness which is in the law, blameless

Notice what Paul calls confidence and trust in the flesh in vs 5

#1 Circumcised the eighth day [flesh]

#2 Being of the Tribe of Benjamin [flesh]

#3 Of the people of Israel [flesh see Rom 9:8]

#4 being a hebrew of Hebrews [flesh]

#5 being a pharisee [flesh]

Remember what Jesus told a well established pharisee of highest rank Jn 3:6

6That which is born of the flesh is flesh; and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit.

#6 Religious zeal in vs 6 all religious zeal apart from a Spiritual Revelation of the Gospel is of the flesh !

#7 Good reputation for religion before men, being blameless before men in the sight of men without Gospel revelation is [the flesh]

Paul thought being circumcised as a full blooded jew, of the tribe of Benjamin, was a gain to him, the word gain is the greek word kerdos
and means advantage.

He thought being an ethnic jew gave him advantage before God over other people who were not jewish. He thought it gave him advantage in having a relationship with God and salvation !

Many today think by being a ethnic jew that its an advantage, that it ensures special favor with God, even Salvation favor, this is confidence in the flesh, boasting in the flesh, no way around it !

That word confidence as confidence in the flesh Phil 3:3 also means trust, trusting in the flesh.

Like the pharisee Lk 18:9, this Pharisee would have trusted in the same things Paul did in Phil 3:5-6 and thats nothing more than trusting in ourselves, idolatry !

What is our Glory today ?

beloved57
December 22nd, 2011, 11:14 PM
John 12:31-33

31Now is the judgment of this world: now shall the prince of this world be cast out.

32And I, if I be lifted up from the earth, will draw all men unto me.

33This he said, signifying what death he should die.

Also Isa 53:10

Yet it pleased the LORD to bruise him; he hath put him to grief: when thou shalt make his soul an offering for sin, he shall see his seed, he shall prolong his days, and the pleasure of the LORD shall prosper in his hand.

Christ by His Death, His Work, ensures the Faith and Repentance [conversion] of all He died for, else He lied when He promised:

"And I, if I be lifted up[His Cross] from the earth, will draw all men unto me".

This said signifying what death [and effects] He should die, meaning He witnessed to the saving and converting effects it should have, which was foretold in Isa 53:10-11

10Yet it pleased the LORD to bruise him; he hath put him to grief: when thou shalt make his soul an offering for sin, he shall see his seed, he shall prolong his days, and the pleasure of the LORD shall prosper in his hand.

11He shall see of the travail of his soul, and shall be satisfied: by his knowledge shall my righteous servant justify many; for he shall bear their iniquities.

Meaning He shall see the success and good issue of His Finished Work and see it convert sinners to God ! David wrote once Ps 51:13

Then will I teach transgressors thy ways; and sinners shall be converted unto thee.

Those He shall draw unto Himself because of His Death or having been lifted up from the Earth, are His Offspring Isa 53:10, and He shall see them return to God, and be satisfied. Peter preached this saving effect of Christ Death here 1 Pet 2:24-25

24Who his own self bare our sins in his own body on the tree, that we, being dead to sins, should live unto righteousness: by whose stripes ye were healed.

25For ye were as sheep going astray; but are now returned unto the Shepherd and Bishop of your souls.

So Isa 53:10-11; Jn 12:31-33, and 1 Pet 2:24-25, all proclaim the same blessed Saving Truth of the Effects of Christ's Finished Saving Work of the Cross, anything different is a false gospel !

beloved57
December 25th, 2011, 05:11 AM
Rom 6:18,22

Being then made free from sin, ye became the servants of righteousness.

But now being made free from sin, and become servants to God, ye have your fruit unto holiness, and the end everlasting life.


All for whom Christ died are made free from sin, that is just one of the many accomplishments of His Cross, and not the will of man !

Now, Paul is not saying that all whom Christ died are made free from sinning, that's impossible while we remain in these bodies of sin Rom 7:17-20 is the experience of every true Child of God:

17Now then it is no more I that do it, but sin that dwelleth in me.

18For I know that in me (that is, in my flesh,) dwelleth no good thing: for to will is present with me; but how to perform that which is good I find not.

19For the good that I would I do not: but the evil which I would not, that I do.

20Now if I do that I would not, it is no more I that do it, but sin that dwelleth in me.

Then how are those Christ died for free from sin ?

They are made free from the guilt of sin [consciously] by the blood of Christ. You see under the Old Covenant System,those sacrifices were not geared to remove the guilt of sin consciously, for it [guilt] would return and so offerings were made annually, but not so with Faith in Christ's blood, the guilt is purged Heb 9:9

9Which was a figure for the time then present, in which were offered both gifts and sacrifices, that could not make him that did the service perfect, as pertaining to the conscience;

Heb 10:1-2

1For the law having a shadow of good things to come, and not the very image of the things, can never with those sacrifices which they offered year by year continually make the comers thereunto perfect.

2For then would they not have ceased to be offered? because that the worshippers once purged should have had no more conscience of sins.

Heb 9:14

14How much more shall the blood of Christ, who through the eternal Spirit offered himself without spot to God, purge your conscience from dead works to serve the living God?

Those Christ died for will come to the realization by a work of the Holy Spirit, that their guilt for sin has been effectually dealt with by the blood of Christ !

Ps 103:10-12

10He hath not dealt with us after our sins; nor rewarded us according to our iniquities.

11For as the heaven is high above the earth, so great is his mercy toward them that fear him.

12As far as the east is from the west, so far hath he removed our transgressions from us.

God given Faith rests in this fact !

beloved57
December 26th, 2011, 08:21 AM
Rev 1:5

5And from Jesus Christ, who is the faithful witness, and the first begotten of the dead, and the prince of the kings of the earth. Unto him that loved us, and washed us from our sins in his own blood,

All for whom Christ died washed them from their sins ! The word washed here is the greek word louō:


to bathe, wash

a) of a dead person

b) washing to cleanse blood out of wounds

Some older manuscripts translate the word to loose from our sins. That Ideal is seen with Paul here Rom 6:22

But now being made free from sin, and become servants to God, ye have your fruit unto holiness, and the end everlasting life.

To be set free from sin is not to be made sinlessly perfect, but it means to be set free from unbelief !

This washing, and loosing and being made free from our sins, that is it's dominion is by New Birth. By Christ blood, or because of His Blood shed, His Spirit gives us Life, and this New Life cannot come under the dominion of sin, it cannot become a unbeliever, it is a servant of Him that Created it !

So Christ Blood sets us free from guilt of sin and dominion of sin by providing a New Nature or New Man ! Col 3:10

And have put on the new man, which is renewed in knowledge after the image of him that created him:

beloved57
December 26th, 2011, 02:57 PM
Rev 1:5-6

5And from Jesus Christ, who is the faithful witness, and the first begotten of the dead, and the prince of the kings of the earth. Unto him that loved us, and washed us from our sins in his own blood,

6And hath made us kings and priests unto God and his Father; to him be glory and dominion for ever and ever. Amen.

The statement has been made that the way Christ looses His People from their sins is by giving them a New Birth, a New Nature Born of God. All for whom Christ shall be birthed into the Kingdom of God by the New Birth, and that is what Jesus meant in Jn 3:3-5

3Jesus answered and said unto him, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God.

4Nicodemus saith unto him, How can a man be born when he is old? can he enter the second time into his mother's womb, and be born?

5Jesus answered, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born of water and of the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God.

In vs 3 above born again, this occurs to everyone Christ died and rose again for, for 1 Pet 1:3

3Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, which according to his abundant mercy hath begotten us again unto a lively hope by the resurrection of Jesus Christ from the dead,

The Lexham version reads:

3 Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, who according to his great mercy has caused us to be born again to a living hope through the resurrection of Jesus Christ from the dead,

The ESB :

Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ! According to his great mercy, he has caused us to be born again to a living hope through the resurrection of Jesus Christ from the dead,

GWT:

Praise the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ! God has given us a new birth because of his great mercy. We have been born into a new life that has a confidence which is alive because Jesus Christ has come back to life.

This is being born into His Kingdom, Col 1:13

13Who hath delivered us from the power of darkness, and hath translated us into the kingdom of his dear Son:

This is describing the work of the New Birth, then we are delivered from the power of darkness and enter into His Kingdom, as referred to in Jn 3:3-5

beloved57
December 26th, 2011, 05:37 PM
All the Elect, those Christ died for are free from sin and it's power to condemn them Rom 8:33-34

33Who shall lay any thing to the charge of God's elect? It is God that justifieth.

34Who is he that condemneth? It is Christ that died, yea rather, that is risen again, who is even at the right hand of God, who also maketh intercession for us.

The Elect before the bar of God's Justice are Justified, because it is Christ that died. That is Christ died as being condemned in their place and stead. In fact the legal condemnation that they did incur in Adam Rom 5:16-18

16And not as it was by one that sinned, so is the gift: for the judgment was by one to condemnation, but the free gift is of many offences unto justification.

17For if by one man's offence death reigned by one; much more they which receive abundance of grace and of the gift of righteousness shall reign in life by one, Jesus Christ.)

18Therefore as by the offence of one judgment came upon all men to condemnation; even so by the righteousness of one the free gift came upon all men unto justification of life.

Their condemnation, a real condemnation was not imputed to them, was not laid to their charge 2 Cor 5:19, but was actually laid to the Charge of Christ their Head and Represenative ! Yes, in and of thmselves they are condemned and guillty and sinful, but legally God had made a Covenant with their Surety before the foundation to charge Him with their awful crimes ! Christ could say of the sins of the elect imputed to Him Ps 69:5

5O God, thou knowest my foolishness; and my sins are not hid from thee.

So because of Christ, sin cannot condemn any for whom Christ did die for, His Elect, so they are dead to sin that way as well !

It can never be imputed to them, because it was once and for all imputed to Christ, and He bear them away Jn 1:29 Dan 9:24

beloved57
December 27th, 2011, 03:37 AM
Romans 8:4

That the righteousness of the law might be fulfilled in us, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit.

The Righteousness of the Law, meaning the Righteousness that God's Holy Law requires, is fulfilled in everyone that believes or for whom Christ died by Divine Imputation, which is a Saving Act of God, as the sins of the Elect were imputed [laid to charge] unto Christ, His obedience is laid to their charge, their condemnation and death was charged upon Him Rom 5:18 and in turn Justification unto Life and the Gift of Righteousness Rom 5:17-18 comes upon all for whom Christ died, for it is written by the obedience of One many shall be made Righteous Rom 5:19, and that He was made sin [an sin offering] that those He died for should be made the Righteousness of God in Him 2 Cor 5:21

21For he hath made him to be sin for us, who knew no sin; that we might be made the righteousness of God in him.

Please note Rom 8:4 states that the Righteousness of the Law [moral] is fulfilled in us , not by us ! Who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit, which means , those who walk by Faith, having been born of the Spirit !

beloved57
December 28th, 2011, 05:49 AM
All for whom Christ died, he saves them experimentally from a lost condition. This was stated to be His objective Matt 1:21

21And she shall bring forth a son, and thou shalt call his name JESUS: for he shall save his people from their sins.

This promise of saving is limited to His People however, the seed of Abraham, the Church.

Now even His people are born into this world experientially lost and alienated from the life of God.

Eph 4:18

Having the understanding darkened, being alienated from the life of God through the ignorance that is in them, because of the blindness of their heart:

Col 1:21

And you, that were sometime alienated and enemies in your mind by wicked works, yet now hath he reconciled

This applies even to God's Elect, along with the non elect, those who do not belong to God, but their father the devil !

Notice that one of the symptoms of a spiritually lost condition is " Blindness of heart"

While in this condition, no one can believe the True Gospel because they are under the power of the evil one, the devil, which means they are in a lost condition spiritually. 2 Cor 4:3-4

3But if our gospel be hid, it is hid to them that are lost:

4In whom the god of this world hath blinded the minds of them which believe not, lest the light of the glorious gospel of Christ, who is the image of God, should shine unto them.

Its pretty cut and dry here, those in a lost condition have the gospel hid from them, because their minds are blinded by the god of this world, satan, or the prince of this world as per Jn 12:31,14:30;16:11

So, those Christ died for, though by nature as other's that are lost, they will not remain so, satans grip on them has been defeated by Christ's work on their behalf 1 Jn 3:8

He that committeth sin is of the devil; for the devil sinneth from the beginning. For this purpose the Son of God was manifested, that he might destroy the works of the devil.

This word destroy means :

to loose, dissolve, sever, break, demolish,"

Now, Christ's purpose through His death, in saving His Church from their sins, was to loose, dissove, demolish satan's power over them !

One of such works is blindness of mind and heart, which causes unbelief in the Gospel 2 Cor 4:3-4

But since Christ's work on their behalf has defeated satan, Christ opens up their blind eyes Isa 42:7

7To open the blind eyes, to bring out the prisoners from the prison, and them that sit in darkness out of the prison house.

This is a work of God, to open the eyes of the blind, to turn them from the power of darkness Acts 26:18

To open their eyes, and to turn them from darkness to light, and from the power of Satan unto God, that they may receive forgiveness of sins, and inheritance among them which are sanctified by faith that is in me.

This verse describes how God , through Christ, saves His people from a lost idolatrous condition, and gives them Faith in Christ as their Saviour.

Each and every person Christ died for, will experience a deliverance, a salvation from the power of darkness, the works of the devil, of which one of those works of his is keep one in unbelief 2 Cor 4:3-4

3But if our gospel be hid, it is hid to them that are lost:

4In whom the god of this world hath blinded the minds of them which believe not


So if one comes to believe the Gospel, it makes evident they had been saved from a lost condition prior to believing !

beloved57
December 29th, 2011, 06:55 AM
Rev 1:5-6

5And from Jesus Christ, who is the faithful witness, and the first begotten of the dead, and the prince of the kings of the earth. Unto him that loved us, and washed us from our sins in his own blood,

6And hath made us kings and priests unto God and his Father; to him be glory and dominion for ever and ever. Amen.

John writing to the Church listed a few things here that Christ did for His Church, His Bride !

First it is written that He Loved them ! Paul writes of the same Church Eph 5:25

25Husbands, love your wives, even as Christ also loved the church, and gave himself for it;

26That he might sanctify and cleanse it with the washing of water by the word,

John writes following that He Loved the Church, that He washed them with His own Blood !

And of course Paul says the same thing in Eph 5:26 following that He Loved the Church, that He may, sanctify it, and cleanse it !

That John and Paul are teaching the same thing is seen by the word wash they both use.

Now John uses the word louō which means:


to bathe, wash

a) of a dead person

b) washing to cleanse blood out of wounds

Now Paul uses the word for washing in vs 26 loutron:


bathing, bath, the act of bathing

Pretty much the same word, in fact it is derived from the same word John used in Rev 1:5

And Also He made them a Kings and Priests unto God !

How did He do that ? By New Birth into His Kingdom, through causing them to be born again through His resurrection from the dead 1 Pet 1:3

3Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, which according to his abundant mercy hath begotten us again unto a lively hope by the resurrection of Jesus Christ from the dead,

This translates them into His Kingdom Col 1:13

13Who hath delivered us from the power of darkness, and hath translated us into the kingdom of his dear Son:

Hence they are made Kings and Priest unto God ! This Peter affirms 1 Pet 2:9

9But ye are a chosen generation, a royal priesthood, an holy nation, a peculiar people; that ye should shew forth the praises of him who hath called you out of darkness into his marvellous light;

Remember Peter had wrote of this Royal Priesthood that they had been what in 1 Pet 1:3

3Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, which according to his abundant mercy hath begotten us again unto a lively hope by the resurrection of Jesus Christ from the dead,

All this was done by Christ's death, burial, and resurrection for His Church, that He Loved. The freewill of man had nothing to do with this, it was all by Christ's redemptive blood, and so as John writes Rev 1:6b

to him [Christ] be glory and dominion for ever and ever. Amen.

beloved57
December 31st, 2011, 05:19 PM
Lk 19:10

10For the Son of man is come to seek and to save that which was lost.

Couple that with Matt 1:21

21And she shall bring forth a son, and thou shalt call his name JESUS: for he shall save his people from their sins.

The Church, God's Elect , those Christ died for, though by nature they are in a Lost condition, experimentally alienated from the Life of God, during which time, they are blinded by the god of this world and in unbelief 2 Cor 4:3-4

3But if our gospel be hid, it is hid to them that are lost:

4In whom the god of this world hath blinded the minds of them which believe not, lest the light of the glorious gospel of Christ, who is the image of God, should shine unto them.


Yes, even the elect, by nature are experimentally lost in their unbelief as others, yet they will not remain so, satan's grip on them has been defeated by Christ's work on their behalf [Lk 11:21-22] and the blindness of mind whereby they once believed not, tis defeated, and Christ opens up their blind eyes, then they believe the Gospel Isa 42:7

7To open the blind eyes, to bring out the prisoners from the prison, and them that sit in darkness out of the prison house.

When a Person believes the True Gospel, it is a evidence that they have been saved from satan's power !

beloved57
January 3rd, 2012, 08:29 PM
Prov 11:4

Riches profit not in the day of wrath: but righteousness delivereth from death.

Everyone Christ died for, was made sin for, was made the Righteousness of God in Him 2 Cor 5:21

21For he hath made him to be sin for us, who knew no sin; that we might be made the righteousness of God in him.

All those God imputed their sins to Christ, He in like fashion imputed His Righteousness unto them. By The Obedience of One, many shall be made Righteous. Rom 5:19, The Obedience spoken of in that verse, is that obedience to the Cross unto death of those He had their sins Imputed to Him !

Christ's Righteousness imputed demands Life ! Righteousness demands Life, just as sin demanded death, Righteousness imputed demands life.

That Christ's death delivers from death those He Loved and died for, is manifested by their New Birth, or some may call it regeneration or quckening Eph 2:5

5Even when we were dead in sins, hath quickened us together with Christ, (by grace ye are saved )

That word quickened is the greek word syzōopoieō and means:


to make one alive together

a) of Christians, with Christ

Col 2:13

13And you, being dead in your sins and the uncircumcision of your flesh, hath he quickened together with him, having forgiven you all trespasses;

Yes, All for whom Christ died must be and are made alive together with Him. No this was not because they repented, or had faith or any performance of theirs, because they were dead ! Read Eph 2:5 again ! The quickening took place while we were dead in sin !

Folks it is impossible for any Christ died for to remain in spiritual death experimentally or else His Death did not do it's Job, it was not effectual. It was not even as effectual as adam's act of disobedience was, which caused all for whom He represented to experience spiritual death; But Christ's Death, His act of Righteousness brings Life Rom 5:18

Therefore as by the offence of one judgment came upon all men to condemnation; even so by the righteousness of one the free gift came upon all men unto justification of life.

Thats the Life of Eph 2:5, that quickening together with Christ ! That Life is also called a Resurrection or a Living Jn 5:25

25Verily, verily, I say unto you, The hour is coming, and now is, when the dead shall hear the voice of the Son of God: and they that hear shall live.

It takes a miracle for the dead to hear ! However being quickened or made alive with Christ through His Resurrection from the dead effects the New Birth of everyone Christ died and rose for 1 Pet 1:3

3Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, which according to his abundant mercy hath begotten us again unto a lively hope by the resurrection of Jesus Christ from the dead,

All of this occurs to each and Every Child of Grace because Christ's Righteousness delivers from Death ! Amen to the Glory of God !

beloved57
January 3rd, 2012, 10:55 PM
It takes a miracle for the dead to hear ! However being quickened or made alive with Christ through His Resurrection from the dead effects the New Birth of everyone Christ died and rose for 1 Pet 1:3

3Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, which according to his abundant mercy hath begotten us again unto a lively hope by the resurrection of Jesus Christ from the dead,

The First resurrection from the Dead is the Lord Jesus Christ. The firstbegotten from the dead Col 1:18

And he is the head of the body, the church: who is the beginning, the firstborn from the dead; that in all things he might have the preeminence.

Rev 1:5

5And from Jesus Christ, who is the faithful witness, and the first begotten of the dead, and the prince of the kings of the earth. Unto him that loved us, and washed us from our sins in his own blood,

Both of these scriptures speak to the Resurrection of Jesus Christ from the Dead !

Now Peter says by that Resurrection, those Christ died for, were begotten again unto a lively Hope !

That's because they were quickened together with Him Eph 2:5-6

Now that is what John means in the Revelation 20:6

Blessed and holy is he that hath part in the first resurrection: on such the second death hath no power, but they shall be priests of God and of Christ, and shall reign with him a thousand years.

The first resurrection was Christ's Col 1:18; Rev 1:5 and those who were quickened together with Him, had part in the First Resurrection !

Blessed and Holy are those who took part of that Resurrection, for the second death has no power over them !

beloved57
January 6th, 2012, 11:13 AM
Christ through His death, accomplished Eternal Redemption for all whom He died ! Heb 9:12

12Neither by the blood of goats and calves, but by his own blood he entered in once into the holy place, having obtained eternal redemption for us.

The us is the every son whom He tasted death in the behalf of Heb 2:9

But we see Jesus, who was made a little lower than the angels for the suffering of death, crowned with glory and honour; that he by the grace of God should taste death for every man.

For all Christ died He obtained or secured or achieved their redemption forever !

Lets define the word redemption here, it is the greek word lytrōsis and means:

a ransoming, redemption

2) deliverance, esp. from the penalty of sin

Scripture Truth is saying here that Christ has secured, achieved eternal deliverance from the penalty of sin for all whom He tasted death in behalf of !

And so it is never, not in a trillion years, any possibility of them being condemned for sin. to them for whom He died Rom 8:1,34

1There is therefore now no condemnation to them which are in Christ Jesus, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit.


34Who is he that condemneth? It is Christ that died!

Now if any man or woman teaches that one for whom Christ died can be condemned for sin, and Christ has already been condemned for it when He died for them, they speak against Christ, they are Anti Christ, for they are anti or against the Truth of the accomplishment of His Finished work for all He died in behalf of, and propitiated the Divine Justice for ! And to whomever He obtained this Eternal Redemption for, He will reveal it to them by His Spirit Jn 16:14-15

14He shall glorify me: for he shall receive of mine, and shall shew it unto you.

15All things that the Father hath are mine: therefore said I, that he shall take of mine, and shall shew it unto you.

That word shew is the greek word anaggellō and means:


to announce, make known

2) to report, bring back tidings, rehearse

This is a Promise to the Church, those Christ died in behalf of, yes He was speaking to His disciples, but so doing he was speaking to His Church that they were Representatives of !

So anyone, and I mean anyone, teaching that one for whom Christ died can yet be punished for their sins, they are anti Christ, and know not the Truth !

beloved57
January 9th, 2012, 09:27 AM
1 Jn 2:2

2And he is the propitiation for our sins: and not for ours only, but also for the sins of the whole world.

The word propitiation here means:

an appeasing, propitiating

The word appeasing means:

to bring to a state of peace, quiet, ease, calm, or contentment; pacify; soothe: to appease an angry king.

Christ by His Blood alone has secured and made peace for all those He died for or is a propitiation for ! Col 1:20

And, having made peace through the blood of his cross, by him to reconcile all things unto himself; by him, I say, whether they be things in earth, or things in heaven.

So this peace or propitiation is not contingent upon one's Faith or one's repentance, but soler upon The Blood of His Cross. The enjoyment of it comes through God given Faith however. But the actual peace itself is an established fact with God while we are in unbelief. Our being in unbelief cannot annul with God the Peace we have with Him by the Blood of Christ, if indeed Christ died for one ! To say that peace with God[ legally] depends upon something the sinner Christ died for must do or perform, discards makes of none effect what Christ's Blood alone established as Fact !

Now Just who did this propitiation mean for ? Was it all people without exception ? No, by no means, but for the People ! Heb 2:17

17Wherefore in all things it behoved him to be made like unto his brethren, that he might be a merciful and faithful high priest in things pertaining to God, to make reconciliation for the sins of the people.


It was made for His Brethren, The People ! The word reconciliation here means :

to render one's self, to appease, conciliate to one's self

a) to become propitious, be placated or appeased

b) to be propitious, be gracious, be merciful

2) to expiate, make propitiation for

For the sins of the People !

In the greek the People reads tou laou;

A specific people, namely in vs 16, the Seed of Abraham, the brethren He was made like unto !

However this Seed of Abraham, had a worldwide scope, in the Many Nations Gen 17:5

5Neither shall thy name any more be called Abram, but thy name shall be Abraham; for a father of many nations have I made thee.

You see God had made Abraham a Father [Spiritually] of many Nations, meaning the whole World, so the reason for John saying what He said in 1 Jn 2:2

He know Christ had propitiatied God on behalf of all Abraham's Seed of Every Nation ! So the Propitiation is still particular for a specific People, but world wide in the scope of that People !

Robert Pate
January 9th, 2012, 09:56 AM
Rom 5:11

11And not only so, but we also joy in God through our Lord Jesus Christ, by whom we have now received the atonement.

The Atonement of Christ has reconciled the elect world to God. It secured and ensured for it [ the elect world] every spiritual blessing needed to live unto God and for His Glory through Jesus christ.

Even before the elect are born into this world as sinners, they have already [by the blood of Christ] been reconciled to God, it will now be a matter of time for it to be manifested.

The atonement accomplished the complete salvation for all whom it was offered for, that is the death of christ. It provides them Faith, repentance, sanctification, redemption, and every needful spiritual blessing to convert them to God, and remain secured forever.


What do you do about Hebrews 2:9 and about 25 other scriptures that say Christ died for the sins of the world?

beloved57
January 9th, 2012, 12:44 PM
pate


What do you do about Hebrews 2:9

I have already delt with that scripture before:

http://www.theologyonline.com/forums/showthread.php?t=73661&page=3
See posts 30 and 31

Damian
January 9th, 2012, 02:39 PM
Rom 5:11

11And not only so, but we also joy in God through our Lord Jesus Christ, by whom we have now received the atonement.

The Atonement of Christ has reconciled the elect world to God. It secured and ensured for it [ the elect world] every spiritual blessing needed to live unto God and for His Glory through Jesus christ.

Even before the elect are born into this world as sinners, they have already [by the blood of Christ] been reconciled to God, it will now be a matter of time for it to be manifested.

The atonement accomplished the complete salvation for all whom it was offered for, that is the death of christ. It provides them Faith, repentance, sanctification, redemption, and every needful spiritual blessing to convert them to God, and remain secured forever.

Do you consider yourself part of the "elect?"

beloved57
January 9th, 2012, 04:41 PM
Do you consider yourself part of the "elect?"

This thread is not about me, it is about, the Atonement, and what it did accomplish !

beloved57
January 14th, 2012, 07:50 PM
All those Jesus Christ died for are by His Death made Righteous Rom 5:19, first and foremost before God, and this is their Justification, this is True because Paul states before, in regards to all for whom He died, that He was delivered on account of our sins or Transgressions, this was because they had been charged to Him 1 Cor 15:3

3For I delivered unto you first of all that which I also received, how that Christ died for [for the sake of] our sins according to the scriptures; 2 Cor 5:21

21For he hath made him to be sin for us, who knew no sin; that we might be made the righteousness of God in him.

Note: In order for Christ to have died for sin, the sins had to be charged to Him !

And He was raised again on account of our Justification, because their Justification was an accomplished Fact Rom 4:25

25Who was delivered for [on account of]our offences, and was raised again for[on account of] our justification.

Now if Christ died and rose again for an Individual in 33 ad, and this individual or individuals were not physically born sinners until 1960ad, this sinner or sinners are born already Justified, unless we undo the accomplished fact that the resurrection of Christ verified ! If all for whom Christ died for the sake of, had not been Justified or made Righteous before God, by His obedience unto Death [Phil 2:8], then He could not have or would not have been raised from the dead, and all for whom He did die would still be in their sins ! 1 Cor 15:17. You see the resurrection took place as a consequence of the Justification of all Christ died for, in the same manner, His death occurred as a consequence of the sins of all He died for. The Resurrection proved that God had been fully satisfied and propitiated, and all our sins forgiven, at the Blood of Christ !

sangridad
January 14th, 2012, 08:10 PM
I don't consider this a legitimate conversation since all we do is based on instincts and thought processes god created. if all god created was perfect how can we call what we do sins. Don't answer if you are catholic, if you think being born is a sin you could rationalize the purges.

beloved57
January 20th, 2012, 07:11 AM
Jn 6:37-40

37All that the Father giveth me shall come to me; and him that cometh to me I will in no wise cast out.

38For I came down from heaven, not to do mine own will, but the will of him that sent me.

39And this is the Father's will which hath sent me, that of all which he hath given me I should lose nothing, but should raise it up again at the last day.

The christ of antichrist religions will loose many he intended to save ! The anti christ jesus died to save millions, and yet the gates of hell prevailed against them, and they shall here these words in the day of Judgment Matt 7:23

23And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity.

Their iniquities as we can read here were held against them in the day of Judgment ! This in spite of the fact that supposedly their iniquities were charged to him Isa 53:6

6All we like sheep have gone astray; we have turned every one to his own way; and the LORD hath laid on him the iniquity of us all.

The word laid here is the hebrew word paga` and means:


to encounter, meet, reach, entreat, make intercession

a) (Qal)

1) to meet, light upon, join

2) to meet (of kindness)

3) to encounter, fall upon (of hostility)

4) to encounter, entreat (of request)

5) to strike, touch (of boundary)

The idea here is that God caused our iniquities to fall upn Him !

The NASB: All of us like sheep have gone astray, Each of us has turned to his own way; But the LORD has caused the iniquity of us all To fall on Him.

God caused our Punishment to meet upon Him for our iniquities !

However the anti christ ministers says many, millions for whom this occurred, shall here yet the dreadful words from Christ mouth Matt 7:23

That means they were lost, they perished. Now the Christ that I know and Preach of, did not Loose any, none for whom He died shall Perish.

He can always boast Jn 17:12

While I was with them in the world, I kept them in thy name: those that thou gavest me I have kept, and none of them is lost, but the son of perdition; that the scripture might be fulfilled.

Jn 18:9

That the saying might be fulfilled, which he spake, Of them which thou gavest me have I lost none.

Jesus gave one exception, the son of perdition, however none that He died for can go into perdition. Only those whose names that were not written in the book of life from the foundation shall meet with such an end Rev 17:8

8The beast that thou sawest was, and is not; and shall ascend out of the bottomless pit, and go into perdition: and they that dwell on the earth shall wonder, whose names were not written in the book of life from the foundation of the world, when they behold the beast that was, and is not, and yet is.

You see, all those whose names were not written in the book of life from the foundation, shall follow and worship the beast of perdition Rev 13:8

8And all that dwell upon the earth shall worship him, whose names are not written in the book of life of the Lamb slain from the foundation of the world.

None for whom Christ died shall go into perdition, or be lost, but every last one of them shall hear these words from their Saviour King Matt 25:34

34Then shall the King say unto them on his right hand, Come, ye blessed of my Father, inherit the kingdom prepared for you from the foundation of the world:

You know why Jesus said the Kingdom was prepared for them from the foundation of the world, before they even had being ? Because that's when their names were written in the book of Life, from the foundation of the world ! They are the antithesis of these Rev 13:8

8And all that dwell upon the earth shall worship him, whose names are not written in the book of life of the Lamb slain from the foundation of the world. or Rev 17:8

8The beast that thou sawest was, and is not; and shall ascend out of the bottomless pit, and go into perdition: and they that dwell on the earth shall wonder, whose names were not written in the book of life from the foundation of the world, when they behold the beast that was, and is not, and yet is.

What caused them to differ ? God's Eternal Elective Love, that's it. What Christ do you follow today ? The one that millions for whom he died shall shall still go into perdition, be lost, or the One that None for whom He died shall be Lost ?

beloved57
January 22nd, 2012, 09:10 PM
Rom 4:8

Blessed is the man to whom the Lord will not impute sin.

The word impute means :

to reckon, count, compute, calculate, count over

a) to take into account, to make an account of

1) metaph. to pass to one's account, to impute

For those Christ died for, who had their sins imputed to Him, or Charged to Him, those are the men that are Blessed in Rom 4:8, because God, having imputed their sins to Christ, will not imputed sin unto them !

Thats another accomplishment of the Atonement, Because sins have been already paid for by Christ's Death, those sins can never be charged to those same ones that had their sins charged to Christ. The strength of sin is the Law.

No one Christ died for owes any debt of sin against God's Law. That goes for Believer or Unbeliever who Christ died for, because Christ has already paid their debt to God's Law and Justice. This is a fact whether it is believed or not, even though in due time this fact will be made known to all for whom Christ died.

beloved57
January 23rd, 2012, 06:20 AM
Another accomplishment of the Death of Christ for all whom He died, He has taken away their sins, forever !

John the Baptist had it right when he stated this fact Jn 1:29

29The next day John seeth Jesus coming unto him, and saith, Behold the Lamb of God, which taketh away the sin of the world.

The world here cannot mean every single person in the world without exception, because Jesus makes it clear that some shall die in their sins John 8:24

I said therefore unto you, that ye shall die in your sins: for if ye believe not that I am he, ye shall die in your sins.

If they had sins they could die in, then Christ did not take them away as the lamb of God, simple as that !

But world here identifies the scope of which those whose sins have been taken away are word wide, bot jew and gentile !

And Christ bare them away, removed them as far as the east is from the west as David said Ps 103:12

12As far as the east is from the west, so far hath he removed our transgressions from us.

The word removed is the hebrew word rachaq:

to be or become far, be or become distant, be removed, go far away

a) (Qal) to be far, be distant

b) (Piel) to send far away, extend

c) (Hiphil)

1) to make or exhibit distance, be gone far

2) to remove, put far away

2) (Niphal) loose



The Ideal is like that of the scapegoat on the Day of Atonement, observe Lev 16:21-22

21And Aaron shall lay both his hands upon the head of the live goat, and confess over him all the iniquities of the children of Israel, and all their transgressions in all their sins, putting them upon the head of the goat, and shall send him away by the hand of a fit man into the wilderness:

22And the goat shall bear upon him all their iniquities unto a land not inhabited: and he shall let go the goat in the wilderness.

But as you can see, the type here pertained to only ethnic jews of Israel who were Nationally a Chosen People, but John makes it clear that the Antitype, Christ, He took away the sins of people all over the world, the gentiles also !

Now other scriptures that prove that those Christ died for, it was for the purpose of taking away their sins 1 Jn 3:5

5And ye know that he was manifested to take away our sins; and in him is no sin.

1 Jn 4:10

10Herein is love, not that we loved God, but that he loved us, and sent his Son to be the propitiation for our sins. or to take away our sins by appeasing Divine Law and Justice on our Behalf !

Daniel prophesying of this Great work accomplished by Christ for His People states it Like this Dan 9:24

24Seventy weeks are determined upon thy people and upon thy holy city, to finish the transgression, and to make an end of sins, and to make reconciliation for iniquity, and to bring in everlasting righteousness, and to seal up the vision and prophecy, and to anoint the most Holy.

Daniel here is really saying the same thing as John in Jn 1:29.

So none for whom Christ died has one sin to be punished for, not even unbelief, which is a one of the many sins Christ made an end of !

beloved57
January 23rd, 2012, 11:47 AM
What did the Death of Christ actually accomplish for all whom He died for ? You know there is no Preaching Christ and Him crucified 1 Cor 1:23;2:2 as a object of Faith if what He accomplished and effected are not publicized, as well as whom He accomplished it for. Now did the Death of Christ redeem from all iniquity those He gave Himself for ? Lets read Titus 2:14-15

14Who gave himself for us, that he might redeem us from all iniquity, and purify unto himself a peculiar people, zealous of good works.

15These things speak, and exhort, and rebuke with all authority. Let no man despise thee.

And notice the beginning of vs15 Paul said " Speak these things" or Preach them. Paul was telling Titus to Preach these Truths of the Gospel, what Christ has done. Peter wrote of the same things about Christ redemptive effects 1 Pet 1:18-19

18Forasmuch as ye know that ye were not redeemed with corruptible things, as silver and gold, from your vain conversation received by tradition from your fathers;

19But with the precious blood of Christ, as of a lamb without blemish and without spot:

However the False Gospel, preached by false witnesses, tell us that Christ's Death does not redeem all for whom He died, but that it [His Death] merely makes all men without exception redeemable !

beloved57
January 23rd, 2012, 12:18 PM
To teach that Christ's Death only made redemption from all iniquity, for those He died, merely possible for everyone without exception, is Antichrist, for its against, opposed to the real Truth of what Christ actually accomplished and effected for all for whom He died. He actually did redeem them from all iniquity. The word from see Titus 2:14 is the greek word apo and means:


of separation

a) of local separation, after verbs of motion from a place i.e. of departing, of fleeing, ...

b) of separation of a part from the whole

1) where of a whole some part is taken

c) of any kind of separation of one thing from another by which the union or fellowship of the two is destroyed

His Death separates them He died for from iniquity of which the rest of the world lies in see 1 Jn 5:19

He destroys their union with the world, flesh and the devil !

He as Peter proclaims redeems them from a vain conversation, or manner of life 1 Pet 1 Pet 1:18-21

18Forasmuch as ye know that ye were not redeemed with corruptible things, as silver and gold, from [ek away from] your vain conversation received by tradition from your fathers;

19But with the precious blood of Christ, as of a lamb without blemish and without spot:

20Who verily was foreordained before the foundation of the world, but was manifest in these last times for you,

21Who by him do believe in God, that raised him up from the dead, and gave him glory; that your faith and hope might be in God.

He redeems them from unbelief or being unbelievers, unto Faith in God 1 Pet 1:21 " that your faith and hope might be in God"

His resurrection, from His redemptive death, for all whom He died and redeemed, was for the purpose of causing them to have Faith and Hope in God, which confirms what he wrote earlier in the letter 1 Pet 1:3

3Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, which according to his abundant mercy hath begotten us again unto a lively hope by the resurrection of Jesus Christ from the dead,

His Resurrection from the dead caused them to be born again to a Living Hope, the same Hope of 1 Pet 1:21. This Lively Hope is also Faith, translated so in Heb 10:23

23Let us hold fast the profession of our faith without wavering; (for he is faithful that promised )

As you can see, this Hope or Faith is a redemptive benefit, coming out of the Resurrection of Christ from the Dead, those who deny this, preach a false Gospel, and deny Redemption by His Blood .

beloved57
January 24th, 2012, 04:09 AM
Rom 5:10

10For if, when we were enemies, we were reconciled to God by the death of his Son, much more, being reconciled, we shall be saved by his life.

He accomplished Reconciliation , that is, His Death ALONE has reconciled to God ALL for whom He died, that is precisely what the verse tells us. This reconciliation is Two Fold, it is objective, by which all the elect of God, of all time, by Christ's Death ALONE, have been reconciled to God, not that they were made reconcilable, but actually reconciled, a finished transaction, a done deal !

Can a person be reconciled to God by the Death of His Son and be a Unbeliever and at enmity with God by Nature ? Yes, of course. Paul in Rom 5:10 is stating to Believers, that WHEN or WHILE we were Enemies of God, even THEN, we had been Reconciled to God by the Death of His Son. You see when a sinner who Christ died for , and His Death had satisfied God's Law and Justice on their behalf, those sinners, who are born dead in trespasses and sins Eph 2:5, who are born as OTHERS , by Nature Children of Wrath Eph 2:3, Who are born by nature Ungodly in their manner of life Rom 5:6 , All such differ from from all others who are born in the same condition, these have already objectively been reconciled to God by the Death of His Son, and to all of them is the PROMISE GIVEN, that they shall be SAVED [ Subjective Reconciliation or Conversion which includes being given both Faith and Repentance] BY HIS LIFE !

To deny this subjective reconciliation to any for whom Christ died, is a denial of the Gospel, the Word of Reconciliation; And since it is obvious from other portions of scripture that everyone in the world without exception shall not be saved by His Life, then reason would tell us that the World in 2 Cor 5:19 is limited to only those that actually Saved by His Life Rom 5:10. So the conclusion is this, If anyone in that world of 2 Cor 5:19 is not saved by Christ's Life as promised in Rom 5:10b, then the scripture has been proven to be false, and Paul and the other Apostles are found to be False Witnesses ! However, I am absolutely SURE that the Scripture is True and that the Christ I witness of did actually accomplish and effected reconciliation to God for all whom He died, and not one shall be Lost..

beloved57
January 24th, 2012, 06:56 AM
The Lord Jesus Christ, the God Man, accomplished this also for those He died for, He took away their sins for it is written 1Jn 3:5

5 And ye know that he was manifested to take away our sins; and in him is no sin.

Jn 1:29

29The next day John seeth Jesus coming unto him, and saith, Behold the Lamb of God, which taketh away the sin of the world.

Dan 9:24

24Seventy weeks are determined upon thy people and upon thy holy city, to finish the transgression, and to make an end of sins, and to make reconciliation for iniquity, and to bring in everlasting righteousness, and to seal up the vision and prophecy, and to anoint the most Holy.

They shall be no more Jer says Jer 50:20

In those days, and in that time, saith the LORD, the iniquity of Israel shall be sought for, and there shall be none; and the sins of Judah, and they shall not be found: for I will pardon them whom I reserve. Which is the Election of Grace !

Now this Taking away of Sin is also called propitiation. The sins, iniquities, transgressions of all for whom Christ died for have been taken out the way, having been nailed to His Cross, He in their behalf has satisfied all of God's law and Justice, for all their sins, past, present, and future, so that their sins are gone , that is propitiation 1 Jn 2:2

2And he is the propitiation for our sins: and not for ours only, but also for the sins of the whole world.

1 Jn 4:10

10Herein is love, not that we loved God, but that he loved us, and sent his Son to be the propitiation for our sins.

by this, those God Loved, He took away their sins, that is the punishment they should have suffered for them !

So here is the question ! Did Christ by His Death actually put away sin [propitiate] of all those He died for, or did He only make it possible for them to be put away ? Those who follow False Teaching and a False Gospel teach that Christ's Death only possibly, contingently put away all the sins of all those Christ died for, for they teach many that Christ died for, shall still die in their sins because they did not perform a condition, and so the sins of theirs that had been taken away and forgiven by the blood of Christ were given back to them, so that God can satisfy again His Law and Justice, but this time on them, God forgetting about He punished them once already in Christ. Now of course we know this is false teaching because it makes God Unjust to Christ, who He already Punished and it makes Him Mutable and subject to change, which is a false concept of the True God, for He tells His Chosen Remnant Mal 3:6

For I am the LORD, I change not; therefore ye sons of Jacob are not consumed.

Its a done deal, regardless of the antichrist ministers, all those whom Christ died for, He put away their sins forever..

beloved57
January 24th, 2012, 09:16 AM
Isa 53:11

11He shall see of the travail of his soul, and shall be satisfied: by his knowledge shall my righteous servant justify many; for he shall bear their iniquities.

The ESV Out of the anguish of his soul he shall see and be satisfied; by his knowledge shall the righteous one, my servant, make many to be accounted righteous, and he shall bear their iniquities.

Now did Christ by His Death alone, Justify Many ? As you can see that some translations render it " accounted righteous"

This means that by His Death, many shall be accounted Righteous, or Justified. Paul preached the very same thing in Rom 5:19b

19For as by one man's disobedience many were made sinners, so by the obedience of one shall many be made righteous.

The word for righteous in Rom 5:19 is a greek word meaning Just, which is short for Justification or Justified When scripture says that a man is Just as Joseph Matt 1:19, it means he was Justified before God by the obedience of Christ, even though in time He had yet to die. When scripture states that that Cornelius was a Just Man Acts 10:22, it means He was Justified before God, also by the Obedience of the One Christ. Paul preached that believers had been Justified by His Blood Rom 5:9

9Much more then, being now justified by his blood or His Obedience unto Death, we shall be saved from wrath through him.

However, the False Preachers teaches that Justification before and with God was made only a possibility for all men without exception and that man , not Christ's Blood alone, is what causes Justification before God to become a factual reality, mans freewill they say accomplished that ! Now many of the opposer's of the Truth like to hi jack Rom 5:1 as proof that man must contribute his faith to Christ's Work, in order to be Justified before God, for Christ's Blood alone did not quite do it to hear them say it; However they are much guilty of wresting scripture to their own destruction, but what Rom 5:1 means by being Justified by or out of Faith, is that God Given Faith, the Fruit of Regeneration or New Birth, reveals to one their Justified status before God, that Justification that was declared by the resurrection of Jesus Christ from the Dead Rom 4:25, this their Justification and Righteousness was established out of the Faithfulness or Obedience of Christ Rom 5:19b

19For as by one man's disobedience many were made sinners, so by the obedience of one shall many be made righteous.

false preachers deny this Truth of the Justification before God of all for whom Christ died !

beloved57
February 4th, 2012, 07:52 PM
Dan 9:24

24Seventy weeks are determined upon thy people and upon thy holy city, to finish the transgression, and to make an end of sins, and to make reconciliation for iniquity, and to bring in everlasting righteousness, and to seal up the vision and prophecy, and to anoint the most Holy.

For all those Christ died for, by that His Death, He has finished their Transgressions, and has made an end to their sins, as to all the legal guilt it can bring against them in the Judgment, and He hath brought in to them and imputed to them Everlasting Righteousness, and they shall shine as the brightness of the firmament;and as the stars for ever and ever.

beloved57
February 6th, 2012, 12:50 AM
Jn 12:32

32And I, if I be lifted up from the earth, will draw all men unto me.

33This he said, signifying what death he should die.

Matt 26:28

For this is my blood of the new testament, which is shed for many for the remission of sins.

The Death of the True Lord Jesus Christ guarantees, for all whom He died and rose again, both Repentance and Remission of their sins. His Resurrection not only gave evidence of their Justification before God Rom 4:25

25Who was delivered for our offences, and was raised again for our justification.

But it also ensures their repentance and remission or forgiveness of sin Acts 5:31

31Him hath God exalted with his right hand to be a Prince and a Saviour, for to give repentance to Israel, and forgiveness of sins.

He is not your Saviour if He has not given you Repentance ! He is the Resurrected, Exalted, Prince and Saviour, To give [ apply or communicate] Repentance and forgiveness of sins to all for whom He died, which is restricted to a elect people that is called Israel. Every sinner that Truly Repents only gives evidence of Christ's Exaltation and He being their Saviour. Their repentance gives occasion for Joy in Heaven Lk 15:7,10

7I say unto you, that likewise joy shall be in heaven over one sinner that repenteth, more than over ninety and nine just persons, which need no repentance.

10Likewise, I say unto you, there is joy in the presence of the angels of God over one sinner that repenteth.

This is Christ's Joy in seeing the successful accomplishment and results of His suffering and Death for all He substituted for Heb 12:2

2Looking unto Jesus the author and finisher of our faith; who for the joy that was set before him endured the cross, despising the shame, and is set down at the right hand of the throne of God.

In other words, every time a sinner repents, its a credit to Christ's Cross Work on their Behalf , and He gets Joy from it , full satisfaction, Isa 53:11

11He shall see of the travail of his soul, and shall be satisfied: by his knowledge shall my righteous servant justify many; for he shall bear their iniquities.

The English word Joy means:

the emotion of great delight or happiness caused by something exceptionally good or satisfying

His Joy is that satisfaction He See's in what all His Hard Work accomplished for them He suffered and died for, it brought them back to God , which was the Design of His Death anyway:

1 Pet 3:18

18For Christ also hath once suffered for sins, the just for the unjust, that he might bring us to God, being put to death in the flesh, but quickened by the Spirit:

He was Successful !

beloved57
February 9th, 2012, 10:50 AM
The Antichrist is a failure, However the True Christ made a Promise per Jn 12:24-33

24Verily, verily, I say unto you, Except a corn of wheat fall into the ground and die, it abideth alone: but if it die, it bringeth forth much fruit.

25He that loveth his life shall lose it; and he that hateth his life in this world shall keep it unto life eternal.

26If any man serve me, let him follow me; and where I am, there shall also my servant be: if any man serve me, him will my Father honour.

27Now is my soul troubled; and what shall I say? Father, save me from this hour: but for this cause came I unto this hour.

28Father, glorify thy name. Then came there a voice from heaven, saying, I have both glorified it, and will glorify it again.

29The people therefore, that stood by, and heard it, said that it thundered: others said, An angel spake to him.

30Jesus answered and said, This voice came not because of me, but for your sakes.

31Now is the judgment of this world: now shall the prince of this world be cast out.

32And I, if I be lifted up from the earth, will draw all men unto me.

33This he said, signifying what death he should die.

In verse 24 Christ was identifying Himself as that corn of wheat, that was about to die. We now this because of vs 33

Now He says, if that corn of wheat shall die, again speaking of His Death that He is to die, He says it brings forth much fruit !

What is Fruit in this context ? Is it apples and oranges ? No its not, the word fruit here is the greek word karpos and means:


fruit

a) the fruit of the trees, vines, of the fields

b) the fruit of one's loins, i.e. his progeny, his posterity

Jesus meaning is His Progeny, or Offspring [Spiritually of course], His Posterity, shall be brought forth if He dies.

The word bring forth [pherō] means to produce, Jesus is saying that out of His death He shall produce Life, a posterity.

The word fruit also means:

that which originates or comes from something, an effect, result

Christ's Death will produce an effect, results, it will bring forth an Offspring, Life, and this Offspring will serve Him. Remember the psalmist speaks of a Offspring that shall serve Him Ps 22:30

30A seed shall serve him; it shall be accounted to the Lord for a generation.

Jesus talks about those that serve Him in Jn 12:26

26If any man serve me, let him follow me; and where I am, there shall also my servant be: if any man serve me, him will my Father honour.

Jesus is alluding to the Effects of His Death as the corn of wheat, it will produce a Offspring, a progeny that SHALL SERVE HIM Per Ps 22:30

And it is this Offspring that Jesus means in Jn 12:32. The all here that shall be drawn to Him because of His Being Lifted up or as vs 24 states it, fall into the ground and die, they all shall come to Him to Serve Him..Their coming is denoting their conversion to Him, this is the Success that He promised out of His Death.

His Death actually gives Life[Spiritual] to the World Jn 6:33

33For the bread of God is he which cometh down from heaven, and giveth life unto the world.

This of course is the World of His Seed !

Poly
February 9th, 2012, 11:49 AM
The Antichrist is a failure, However the True Christ made a Promise per Jn 12:24-33

24Verily, verily, I say unto you, Except a corn of wheat fall into the ground and die, it abideth alone: but if it die, it bringeth forth much fruit.

25He that loveth his life shall lose it; and he that hateth his life in this world shall keep it unto life eternal.

26If any man serve me, let him follow me; and where I am, there shall also my servant be: if any man serve me, him will my Father honour.

27Now is my soul troubled; and what shall I say? Father, save me from this hour: but for this cause came I unto this hour.

28Father, glorify thy name. Then came there a voice from heaven, saying, I have both glorified it, and will glorify it again.

29The people therefore, that stood by, and heard it, said that it thundered: others said, An angel spake to him.

30Jesus answered and said, This voice came not because of me, but for your sakes.

31Now is the judgment of this world: now shall the prince of this world be cast out.

32And I, if I be lifted up from the earth, will draw all men unto me.

33This he said, signifying what death he should die.

In verse 24 Christ was identifying Himself as that corn of wheat, that was about to die. We now this because of vs 33

Now He says, if that corn of wheat shall die, again speaking of His Death that He is to die, He says it brings forth much fruit !

What is Fruit in this context ? Is it apples and oranges ? No its not, the word fruit here is the greek word karpos and means:


fruit

a) the fruit of the trees, vines, of the fields

b) the fruit of one's loins, i.e. his progeny, his posterity

Jesus meaning is His Progeny, or Offspring [Spiritually of course], His Posterity, shall be brought forth if He dies.

The word bring forth [pherō] means to produce, Jesus is saying that out of His death He shall produce Life, a posterity.

The word fruit also means:

that which originates or comes from something, an effect, result

Christ's Death will produce an effect, results, it will bring forth an Offspring, Life, and this Offspring will serve Him. Remember the psalmist speaks of a Offspring that shall serve Him Ps 22:30

30A seed shall serve him; it shall be accounted to the Lord for a generation.

Jesus talks about those that serve Him in Jn 12:26

26If any man serve me, let him follow me; and where I am, there shall also my servant be: if any man serve me, him will my Father honour.

Jesus is alluding to the Effects of His Death as the corn of wheat, it will produce a Offspring, a progeny that SHALL SERVE HIM Per Ps 22:30

And it is this Offspring that Jesus means in Jn 12:32. The all here that shall be drawn to Him because of His Being Lifted up or as vs 24 states it, fall into the ground and die, they all shall come to Him to Serve Him..Their coming is denoting their conversion to Him, this is the Success that He promised out of His Death.

His Death actually gives Life[Spiritual] to the World Jn 6:33

33For the bread of God is he which cometh down from heaven, and giveth life unto the world.

This of course is the World of His Seed !


Can I get fries with that?

beloved57
February 20th, 2012, 07:36 PM
One of the sure ways to detect an antichrist, is to ask them what they believe the Death of Christ accomplished . They will for the most part say that His Death provided a possibility for everyone in the world to be saved, they do not say it made Salvation sure or that it[His Death] in and of itself saved anyone. Most of these deceivers will go to 1 Jn 2:2 to prove their point ! By it they say Jesus Christ died for everyone in the world, and propitiated God for everyone in the world without exception. Once a Person goes there, I know without question that they do not understand what propitiation is to God !

In 1 Jn 2:2 its the word Hilasmos and means:

an appeasing, propitiating
the means of appeasing, a propitiation

The english word appease means:

to bring to a state of peace, quiet, ease, calm, or contentment; pacify; soothe: to appease an angry king.

Basically propitiation means to appease God's Wrath, to make satisfaction, to be propitious or merciful which denotes acceptance and favor.

It [propitiation] is the first cousin to reconciliation !

The Lord Jesus Christ upon the Cross appeased or satisfied God's Justice that His Law demanded for everyone He died in the stead of. God's Holy law against their transgressions demanded Death, and Christ was the representative and was subrogated in their place. The Lord Jesus Christ met the Just demands of the law that was against them, and it was He instead of them that God's Justice and Righteousness put to Death. God's Justice was satisfied and His Law was Honored and Magnified, and everyone this was done for, God gives them Faith so they can know it and praise His Grace and mercy for it.

John writes that He is our Propitiation 1 Jn 2:2

2And he is the propitiation for our sins: and not for ours only, but also for the sins of the whole world.

In the greek it is present tense, that is He is presently being our satisfaction for our sins, and not at that time just to the jewish believers John wrote to, but to believers all over the world, and for all time !

Folks, simply put, God cannot, without being unjust, punish anyone Christ died for, not for anything ! His Justice cannot do it.

So for those of you who use this scripture to teach that Christ died for everyone in the world without exception, that Propitiated God on their behalf, and know at the same time people shall die in their sins Jn 8:24

24I said therefore unto you, that ye shall die in your sins: for if ye believe not that I am he, ye shall die in your sins.

We know all will not believe because Jn 10:26

26But ye believe not, because ye are not of my sheep, as I said unto you.

Now according to Jn 8:24 they shall die in their sins !

So if they die in their sins, and yet Christ is their propitiation, then God is punishing them again for their sins Christ died for 1 Cor 15:3, which makes God unjust and Christ has been betrayed, because He suffered death already for the sins that they are again to be punished for eternally !

Poly
February 25th, 2012, 06:34 PM
One of the sure ways to detect an antichrist, is to ask them what they believe the Death of Christ accomplished . They will for the most part say that His Death provided a possibility for everyone in the world to be saved, they do not say it made Salvation sure or that it[His Death] in and of itself saved anyone. Most of these deceivers will go to 1 Jn 2:2 to prove their point ! By it they say Jesus Christ died for everyone in the world, and propitiated God for everyone in the world without exception. Once a Person goes there, I know without question that they do not understand what propitiation is to God !

In 1 Jn 2:2 its the word Hilasmos and means:

an appeasing, propitiating
the means of appeasing, a propitiation

The english word appease means:

to bring to a state of peace, quiet, ease, calm, or contentment; pacify; soothe: to appease an angry king.

Basically propitiation means to appease God's Wrath, to make satisfaction, to be propitious or merciful which denotes acceptance and favor.

It [propitiation] is the first cousin to reconciliation !

The Lord Jesus Christ upon the Cross appeased or satisfied God's Justice that His Law demanded for everyone He died in the stead of. God's Holy law against their transgressions demanded Death, and Christ was the representative and was subrogated in their place. The Lord Jesus Christ met the Just demands of the law that was against them, and it was He instead of them that God's Justice and Righteousness put to Death. God's Justice was satisfied and His Law was Honored and Magnified, and everyone this was done for, God gives them Faith so they can know it and praise His Grace and mercy for it.

John writes that He is our Propitiation 1 Jn 2:2

2And he is the propitiation for our sins: and not for ours only, but also for the sins of the whole world.

In the greek it is present tense, that is He is presently being our satisfaction for our sins, and not at that time just to the jewish believers John wrote to, but to believers all over the world, and for all time !

Folks, simply put, God cannot, without being unjust, punish anyone Christ died for, not for anything ! His Justice cannot do it.

So for those of you who use this scripture to teach that Christ died for everyone in the world without exception, that Propitiated God on their behalf, and know at the same time people shall die in their sins Jn 8:24

24I said therefore unto you, that ye shall die in your sins: for if ye believe not that I am he, ye shall die in your sins.

We know all will not believe because Jn 10:26

26But ye believe not, because ye are not of my sheep, as I said unto you.

Now according to Jn 8:24 they shall die in their sins !

So if they die in their sins, and yet Christ is their propitiation, then God is punishing them again for their sins Christ died for 1 Cor 15:3, which makes God unjust and Christ has been betrayed, because He suffered death already for the sins that they are again to be punished for eternally !

And add a milkshake while you're at it.

beloved57
February 25th, 2012, 09:18 PM
All for whom Christ died, He gave Himself a ransom 1 Tim 2:6

Who gave himself a ransom for all, to be testified in due time.

Matt 20:28

Even as the Son of man came not to be ministered unto, but to minister, and to give his life a ransom for many.

This ransom price being paid [To God] demands the release of the captives for which it was made in behalf of, in fact, it effects the release of all the captives it paid a ransom price for. Now if that does not occur, and anyone of those for whom Christ died as a ransom in behalf of, and any of them remain captive to the devil as per 2 Tim 2:26

And that they may recover themselves out of the snare of the devil, who are taken captive by him at his will.

If this be the case, then Christ's Ransom Blood was not effective, and failed to produce the purposed results. Isa 61:1

The Spirit of the Lord GOD is upon me; because the LORD hath anointed me to preach good tidings unto the meek; he hath sent me to bind up the brokenhearted, to proclaim liberty to the captives, and the opening of the prison to them that are bound; Also see Lk 4:18

Christ's Ransom Payment must deliver from captivity and death, or it was fruitless, without results or success !

beloved57
February 26th, 2012, 09:05 PM
All for whom Christ died, whether they know of it or not, by His Death alone, they've been delivered from the curse of the Law, for He was made a curse for them Gal 3:13

13 Christ hath redeemed us from the curse of the law, being made a curse for us: for it is written, Cursed is every one that hangeth on a tree:

" redeemed from" the curse of the Law. The word from ek and means:

out of, from, by, away from

There is no way anyone for whom Christ died can be cursed by the Law, which gives strength to sin, no sin can be charged against them.

Now if Christ's Death alone hath done this, then how can any sin condemn anyone Christ died for. 1 Cor 15:56

The sting of death is sin; and the strength of sin is the law.

Sin can only bring condemnation through or by means of God's violated Law Rom 4:15

15Because the law worketh wrath: for where no law is, there is no transgression.

So there cannot be any Law to violate, to cause trespass or transgression to bring about God's Wrath, to those Christ, by His Death hath redeemed from the curse of the Law,in which the law worketh wrath; but there is no broken and violated Law to cause God's wrath to those Christ died for.

So those experiencing God's Wrath in Jn 3:36 and Rom 1:18, most certainly cannot be anyone Christ died for, because by His Death alone, He redeemed them from the curse of the Law, a man's believing does not accomplish that, if it did, then it does something that Christ death did not do, which is Blasphemy !

This being redeemed from the curse of the law, is a once and for all completed act by Christ's Blood, and is not contingent upon any other future conditions !

beloved57
March 6th, 2012, 11:33 AM
Jn 17:4

4I have glorified thee on the earth: I have finished the work which thou gavest me to do.

What was the Work ? it was Twofold, to seek and to save that which was Lost Lk 19:10

10For the Son of man is come to seek and to save that which was lost.

Both to seek and to save are infinitive verbs, actions Christ must do, works He must do !

Folks it is a Lie to teach that Christ came to make saving possible or to make seeking possible. For if He did not seek that which was Lost, He failed His work and it was incomplete, and if He did not save that which was Lost, He failed His Work and it was not finished but incomplete !

The Father sent Him for that specific purpose Jn 10:36

36Say ye of him, whom the Father hath sanctified, and sent into the world, Thou blasphemest; because I said, I am the Son of God?

1 Tim 1:15

15This is a faithful saying, and worthy of all acceptation, that Christ Jesus came into the world to save sinners; of whom I am chief.

This is the same aorist infinitive to save as in Lk 19:10

The question you and I must answer honestly today is if Christ really finished the work the Father gave Him to do , that is, did He seek and save all of the Lost that the Father desired to be sought and to be saved 1 Tim 2:4; Jn 6:37-40. Was Jesus Christ 100 % successful in seeking and in saving, all for whom the Father had a pleasure to be sought and to be saved ?

beloved57
March 6th, 2012, 02:25 PM
Was Jesus 100 % successful in seeking and saving all for whom the Father had a Pleasure to be saved. Folks, if Christ did not seek and save all that the Father wanted to be sought and to be saved, then Christ failed and He lied when He said " I have finished the WORK which thou gavest me to do" There is no other way to put it. The Antichrist followers tell us that Christ only made salvation Possible or Available, but if that was true, then Lk 19:10 would be false !

10For the Son of man is come to seek and to save that which was lost.

beloved57
March 9th, 2012, 07:16 AM
Heb 7:22

By so much was Jesus made a surety of a better testament.

Gen 44:32


For thy servant became surety for the lad unto my father, saying, If I bring him not unto thee, then I shall bear the blame to my father for ever.

When the Lord Jesus Christ became a Surety for those He died for, being made and set up before the world began Prov 8:22, as Surety, the obligations, guilt and debts, of all whom He would die in the stead of, The Elect, His Church, Israel were transferred to Him, the payment of their Debt to God's Law and Justice was charged to Him, consequently leaving them free from the obligation of God's Justice. To say this is also saying they had been forgiven [cancellation of all indeptness and liability], also called remission . So Paul writes of this Group, That God was in Christ [through His Suretyship engagements] reconciling the world unto Himself, not imputing or not charging their guilt unto them ! 2 Cor 5:19. This was part of Christ being made a Surety of the Better or Excellent Covenant Heb 7:22.

Those who are born into this world as sinners by nature, whom Christ was made a Surety for, they have no indebtness to God's Law, they are born as sinners, as enemies by nature and children of wrath, with all their sins forgiven because they had been charged to Christ !

beloved57
March 19th, 2012, 08:24 AM
Christ's Death God-ward accomplished much for those He died for before they ever believe in Him. For example, That which the elect are by nature as other men, children of wrath Eph 2:3, Enemies Rom 5:10, enemies in their minds by wicked works Col 1:21, yet because of Christ's finished work for them, they are not the objects of God's Wrath, not ever, but only objects of His Mercy. You see, with them, their sinfulness by nature only constitutes them what God afore ordained, Vessels of Mercy Rom 9:23

23And that he might make known the riches of his glory on the vessels of mercy, which he had afore prepared unto glory,

All the Legal condemnation that they deserve along with others, the vessels of wrath, theirs has been effectively dealt with by the Cross of Jesus Christ, for He died for all their sins in the flesh. Even after the New Birth, that Old Man that they remain in, and what carries the New Man, it still is very sinful, because it was born out of corruptible seed, the fallen Adam. Their sin nature of adam is not eradicated, but is still alive and well in the Saint of God, for that is Paul's argument in Rom 7 and Johns point in 1 Jn 1:8. However that Old Man with all of its deceitful lusts is still the object of God's mercy, David said as a New Creature Ps 130:3

If thou, LORD, shouldest mark iniquities, O Lord, who shall stand?

But that Old Man born out of Adam shall experience an Adoption, a Salvation in the Day of Redemption, Paul calls it The Redemption of the Body, this Body of Death Rom 7:24 cp Rom 8:23, so this Body and its deeds can never be under God's Legal Condemnation and Wrath, His Fatherly Chastening, Yes, but never wrath and condemnation.

The Sinful Bodies of the Saints, that did incur condemnation in Adam Rom 5:18, but it [The merited condemnation] was imputed to Christ's Charge, their Surety and Head, and He came Legally and imputatively under God's Wrath and Condemnation for them, in their stead, so not at anytime are they condemned by God's Law, but to the contrary are made objects of mercy, Mercy and Condemnation does not mix !

So the Elect are Blessed and privileged above others who are born sinners, for they had no Surety !

beloved57
March 19th, 2012, 03:14 PM
Jn 12:24

24Verily, verily, I say unto you, Except a corn of wheat fall into the ground and die, it abideth alone: but if it die, it bringeth forth much fruit.

1 Pet 1:23,3

23Being born again, not of corruptible seed, but of incorruptible, by the word of God, which liveth and abideth for ever.

Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, which according to his abundant mercy hath begotten us again unto a lively hope by the resurrection of Jesus Christ from the dead,

It was a manifest established principle from the beginning, that God ordained that a seed reproduces its Kind:

Gen 1:11,12

And God said, Let the earth bring forth grass, the herb yielding seed, and the fruit tree yielding fruit after his kind, whose seed is in itself, upon the earth: and it was so.

And the earth brought forth grass, and herb yielding seed after his kind, and the tree yielding fruit, whose seed was in itself, after his kind: and God saw that it was good.

Jesus is that corn of wheat that shall fall into the ground and die, and hence bring forth fruit of its kind ! In other words Jesus Christ is a Seed Gal 3:16; Gen 3:16 and God ordained this method for Him to bring forth fruit after His Kind, to die !

This is how the Second Adam was to be fruitful and Multiply after His Kind !

Its like one solitary seed of a Tree, its put into the ground, it undergoes death, a decomposition [ not in a putrefying sense, but in a breakdown of component sense] and then germination, and so it begins to Grow into a Tree of many roots, twigs and branches, and leaves and fruit after its Kind ! Where did it all come from ? That One Seed that fell into the ground and Died ! Through that Death of that Seed comes Life to its seed 1 Pet 1:3, 23.

Folks the Death of Christ results in Life, not a possibility of Life, not a Offer of Life, but it begets us into a Lively Hope. That word Lively is the greek word zaō and means:


to live, breathe, be among the living (not lifeless, not dead)

2) to enjoy real life

a) to have true life and worthy of the name

b) active, blessed, endless in the kingdom of God

3) to live i.e. pass life, in the manner of the living and acting

This is an Accomplishment of the Death of Christ Jn 12:24

24Verily, verily, I say unto you, Except a corn of wheat fall into the ground and die, it abideth alone: but if it die, it bringeth forth much fruit.

Fruit here would be Living converts ! His Death Produces Converts, Fruit, People after His Kind, Christians !

To deny this is to deny everything about the Cross of Christ and its Power. If anyone Christ died for does not become a Christian in the True sense of the Word, His Death failed its purpose !

beloved57
March 23rd, 2012, 05:51 PM
Rom 4:25

25Who was delivered for our offences, and was raised again for our justification.

Jesus Christ's Death on the Cross has completely satisfied all of God's Righteous requirements on behalf of those He died for, in that they are Justified, made right with God through Jesus Christ, His Death Rom 3:24

24 Being justified freely by his grace through the redemption that is in Christ Jesus:

Now His Resurrection proves that God's Law and Justice has been satisfied has been satisfied by Christ's Death and that All concerned are hereby Justified or absolved [remission of sins]because of what Christ has done for them Rom 8:33-34

33Who shall lay any thing to the charge of God's elect? It is God that justifieth.

34Who is he that condemneth? It is Christ that died, yea rather, that is risen again, who is even at the right hand of God, who also maketh intercession for us.

Everyone that Christ has died for, no matter what, no matter that they are born by nature children of wrath as others Eph 2:3, their Justification and remission of sin before God through Jesus Christ Death is a completed fact forever Heb 9:12. The word redemption in this verse means deliverance from the penalty of sin, which equals Justification ! This fact just is not known to the redeemed, until it is revealed by the Spirit through the Gospel, for the Just shall live by Faith. In other words this Free Gift of Justification that they have through the Merits of Christ Alone, shall be made known to them by the Spirit in due time 1 Tim 2:6, for since they are made Just or righteous by Christ's obedience alone [Rom 5:19] they shall and must live by Faith, So in God's Time they are given a new Birth by the Spirit, and given as a Fruit of the Spirit, Faith to receive the Gospel Revelation of their Justification, and Praise God for His Grace ! The Justification they have that was evidenced by Christ's Resurrection shall be made known to them !

beloved57
March 24th, 2012, 03:20 PM
Jn 17:1-3

1These words spake Jesus, and lifted up his eyes to heaven, and said, Father, the hour is come; glorify thy Son, that thy Son also may glorify thee:

2As thou hast given him power over all flesh, that he should give eternal life to as many as thou hast given him.

3And this is life eternal, that they might know thee the only true God, and Jesus Christ, whom thou hast sent.

If Christ has not given Eternal Life to each person given to Him by the Father, then He has failed to Glorify the Father, yet many who claim to be sent ministers of Christ, teach that many Christ died for, many of those given to Him by the Father, will receive Eternal Damnation and the Second Death !

beloved57
April 2nd, 2012, 02:55 AM
Rom 6:7

For he that is dead is freed from sin.

2 Cor 5:14

14For the love of Christ constraineth us; because we thus judge, that if one died for all, then were all dead:

All for whom Christ died for, His Body the Church, actually in the eyes of God's Law and Justice, died with Him, and so be dead, they are dead to sin and dead to the law !

Rom 7:4

Wherefore, my brethren, ye also are become dead to the law by the body of Christ; that ye should be married to another, even to him who is raised from the dead, that we should bring forth fruit unto God.

Paul is saying, all for whom Christ died are dead to the Law because of His Body, that is because of this 1 Pet 2:24

Who his own self bare our sins in his own body on the tree, that we, being dead to sins, should live unto righteousness: by whose stripes ye were healed.

You see how both Paul and Peter teach the same thing ?

Now when I say that the Elect or the Body of Christ is freed from their sins, what is meant, not that they are not born sinners, in fact, some of the worst sort of sinners they may be, but they are born free from the condemnation of sin, they are born sinners acquitted of all their transgressions. The word freed in Rom 6:7 is the greek word dikaioō:

and means:


to render righteous or such he ought to be

2) to show, exhibit, evince, one to be righteous, such as he is and wishes himself to be considered

3) to declare, pronounce, one to be just, righteous, or such as he ought to be

They are born as sinners already Justified or declared Righteous before the sight of God. They have no sins charged against them, Because, Christ has paid their redemption price already, even though it has yet been experimentally applied to them by their New Birth !

So Christ's Sheep cannot be born as others condemned already ! Those to it is said this of Jn 3:18

He that believeth on him is not condemned: but he that believeth not is condemned already, because he hath not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God.

Their condemnation is not because of their unbelief or their refusal to believe on the Son, but for their sins against God's Law are they condemned already, and their refusal believe is an evidence of they being under condemnation !

But those Christ died for, they cannot be condemned by God's law as unbelievers, because Christ has satisfied all of God's Law and Justice on their behalf, so they are born freed from sin ! and dead to the law by the body of Christ !

beloved57
April 3rd, 2012, 06:33 AM
Heb 10:10

10 By the which will we are sanctified through the offering of the body of Jesus Christ once for all.

We know that Christ could not have died or has offered Himself for everyone with exception, simply because one the accomplishments of His Death or Offering [same thing] is that it [ The Death] sanctified forever those He died for !

That word sanctified means , they were set apart for a Holy Purpose of God, permanently !

The word sanctified in the greek is in the perfect tense which means :

Perfect

The perfect tense in Greek corresponds to the perfect tense in English, and describes an action which is viewed as having been completed in the past, once and for all, not needing to be repeated.

Jesus' last cry from the cross, TETELESTAI ("It is finished!") is a good example of the perfect tense used in this sense, namely "It [the atonement] has been accomplished, completely, once and for all time."


Those Christ died for have been sanctified once and for all time !


When an Elect sinner is born into this world, since Christ died for them over 2000 yrs ago, they are born as sinners, dead in trespasses and sins, children of wrath By Nature as others, enemies in their minds against God, however that said, they are perfectly set apart by God for a Holy Purpose to perform for God. Like Jeremiah Jer 1:5

5Before I formed thee in the belly I knew thee; and before thou camest forth out of the womb I sanctified thee, and I ordained thee a prophet unto the nations.

But guess what ? Jeremiah was still born a sinner, by nature a child of wrath as others [Eph 2:3], an enemies to God in his mind by wicked works [Col 1:21]

So every elect sinner born into this world that Christ died for and consequently sanctified them for the Holy Purpose of God, must be born again to fulfill that purpose. It is inevitable, they must and all be born again by the Spirit, a Sanctifying Work of His 2 Thess 2:13

13But we are bound to give thanks alway to God for you, brethren beloved of the Lord, because God hath from the beginning chosen you to salvation through sanctification of the Spirit and belief of the truth:

Oh Yes, Like believers of the Truth today, so did Jeremiah need the same work of the Spirit to bring Him to Faith in the Truth ! So He could Preach the Gospel of Imputed Righteousness Jer 23:6

In his days Judah shall be saved, and Israel shall dwell safely: and this is his name whereby he shall be called, THE LORD OUR RIGHTEOUSNESS.

He had the same righteousness revealed to him by the Gospel as believers do today Rom 1:16-17

16For I am not ashamed of the gospel of Christ: for it is the power of God unto salvation to every one that believeth; to the Jew first, and also to the Greek.

17For therein is the righteousness of God revealed from faith to faith: as it is written, The just shall live by faith.

Now if everyone Christ died for does not come to experience the Sanctifying Work of the Holy Spirit as described in 2 Thess 2:13, Christ's death has failed its purpose of God. The Death of Christ alone has ensured and made certain the setting apart experimentally of each member, or person of His Body He died for, for each one has a Holy Purpose for God to perform 1 Cor 12 ; Eph 2:10

Now, If Christ died for these Matt 25:41 then they also had to be sanctified forever for God's Holy Purpose, which is absurd !

beloved57
April 7th, 2012, 07:48 PM
Heb 9:12

Neither by the blood of goats and calves, but by his own blood he entered in once into the holy place, having obtained eternal redemption for us.

When Christ with His Blood went into the Holy Place,it was to present His Blood before the God and Judge of His People, and because of the Resurrection we know that His Blood was accepted, His Work was accepted in behalf of all whom He died for, this meant also that all the persons had been accepted of God. So even as by nature enemies, by His Offering all for whom He died were reconciled to God Rom 5:10

10For if, when we were enemies, we were reconciled to God by the death of his Son, much more, being reconciled, we shall be saved by his life.

That word reconciled means :

return to favour with, be reconciled to one

c) to receive one into favour

They were received into God's Favor. The very receiving Christ into Glory is proof positive that His Atonement for the Elect had been accepted, and as Christ the Head had been accepted, His acceptance was the also the acceptance of His Members of His Body He represented, for they are one in God's Sight. So when one for whom Christ died is born into this world a filthy sinner, they nevertheless have been accepted by God into His Favour, to the Praise of the Glory of His Grace Eph 1:6

6 To the praise of the glory of his grace, wherein he hath made us accepted in the beloved.

beloved57
April 8th, 2012, 04:03 AM
Heb 9:12

12Neither by the blood of goats and calves, but by his own blood he entered in once into the holy place, having obtained eternal redemption for us.

Who are the Us ? Why it is the Heirs of God, Joint Heirs with Jesus Christ as Per Heb 1:14

14Are they not all ministering spirits, sent forth to minister for them who shall be heirs of salvation?

Heb 6:17

Wherein God, willing more abundantly to shew unto the heirs of promise the immutability of his counsel, confirmed it by an oath:


Heb 11:9

By faith he sojourned in the land of promise, as in a strange country, dwelling in tabernacles with Isaac and Jacob, the heirs with him of the same promise:

Heb 1:2

Hath in these last days spoken unto us by his Son, whom he hath appointed heir of all things, by whom also he made the worlds;

Rom 8:17

And if children, then heirs; heirs of God, and joint-heirs with Christ; if so be that we suffer with him, that we may be also glorified together.

Rom 9:8

8That is, They which are the children of the flesh, these are not the children of God: but the children of the promise are counted for the seed.

This was not a tempora Redemptionl, but Eternal, it's effects are outside of time. It's infinite value was Eternal and Immutable in God's sight. It being Eternal, its forgiveness is from everlasting to everlasting Ps 103:12,17

12As far as the east is from the west, so far hath he removed our transgressions from us.

17But the mercy of the LORD is from everlasting to everlasting upon them that fear him, and his righteousness unto children's children;

It comprehends from when Christ offered Himself on the Cross, and made Atonement for all the sins of all of the Election of grace, who had lived from Adam, to include all of the Election of Grace then present, and yet all that should live upon the Earth until the end of time. This redemption is without date, and of everlasting duration, and existed in the Eternal Mind of God, since the existence of God ! If we can tell when God began to exist, or when He can cease to exist, then we can know the beginning and ending of the Eternal Redemption Christ obtained for all those He died for. For it was Eternal in the engagements that were entered into [ Christ's Suretyship of the Everlasting Covenant with the Father and the Spirit], in the accomplishments of what it has done, and the Eternal Glory that shall be revealed ! 1 Pet 5:10

But the God of all grace, who hath called us unto his eternal glory by Christ Jesus, after that ye have suffered a while, make you perfect, stablish, strengthen, settle you.

beloved57
April 8th, 2012, 06:15 PM
Col 1:13-114

13 Who hath delivered us from the power of darkness, and hath translated us into the kingdom of his dear Son:

14 In whom we have redemption through his blood, even the forgiveness of sins:

In this passage, Paul gives us the effect before the cause. The cause of the translation [transfer, remove from one place to another] from one Kingdom to another, is the Redemption and forgiveness of sins we have through His Blood Cp Eph 1:7

The word redemption of Col 1:14 is the greek word apolytrōsis and means [a releasing effected by payment of ransom]

Now this is important, for to release means:

to make over (land, property, etc.), as to another.

to free from confinement, bondage, obligation, pain, etc.; let go: to release a prisoner; to release someone from a debt.

And the word effected means:

something that is produced by an agency or cause; result;

to produce a result

So, the Redemption that is solely through Christ's Blood, it effects, or produces unto them Christ died and redeemed, it effects their release from satan to God, from darkness to light, from the kingdom of darkness unto the kingdom of God's Dear Son ! Acts 26:18

To open their eyes, and to turn them from darkness to light, and from the power of Satan unto God, that they may receive forgiveness of sins, and inheritance among them which are sanctified by faith that is in me.

This is the result and effect, a translation, of the Redemption of Christ's Blood. If anyone Christ died for does not be caused to Turn from Darkness to Light, from the Power of Satan unto God, then Christ's redemptive Blood failed its objective !

ttruscott
April 8th, 2012, 11:37 PM
Rom 5:11

11And not only so, but we also joy in God through our Lord Jesus Christ, by whom we have now received the atonement.

The Atonement of Christ has reconciled the elect world to God. It secured and ensured for it [ the elect world] every spiritual blessing needed to live unto God and for His Glory through Jesus christ.

Even before the elect are born into this world as sinners, they have already [by the blood of Christ] been reconciled to God, it will now be a matter of time for it to be manifested.

The atonement accomplished the complete salvation for all whom it was offered for, that is the death of christ. It provides them Faith, repentance, sanctification, redemption, and every needful spiritual blessing to convert them to God, and remain secured forever.


I know we do not/will not agree on everything but I say "AMEN, Brother!" to this and ask God to bless your soul.

Peace, Ted

beloved57
April 9th, 2012, 05:24 AM
I know we do not/will not agree on everything but I say "AMEN, Brother!" to this and ask God to bless your soul.

Peace, Ted

Very few agree with that post ! In fact you are the very first one I know of !

beloved57
April 9th, 2012, 11:04 AM
I have posted this before, but it is impossible for Christ to have dies for everyone without exception simply because, by His Blood or Death, or Offering, He has once and for all Sanctified all for whom He died ! Meaning by His Blood, they have been permanently set apart for the service of God ! Heb 10:10

10By the which will we are sanctified through the offering of the body of Jesus Christ once for all.

The word sanctified here is the greek word Hagiazo and means:

to render or acknowledge, or to be venerable or hallow
to separate from profane things and dedicate to God
consecrate things to God
dedicate people to God
to purify
to cleanse externally
to purify by expiation: free from the guilt of sin
to purify internally by renewing of the soul

Folks Christ's Blood alone dedicates permanently those He died for to God, His service.

Thats why the writer in Heb wrote Heb 9:14

14How much more shall the blood of Christ, who through the eternal Spirit offered himself without spot to God, purge your conscience from dead works to serve the living God?

You see what the Blood of Christ did here ? It purges the conscience from dead works, to serve the Living God. Thats a must accomplishment for the Blood of Christ for everyone Christ died for or it has failed.

Also the word sanctified in Heb 10:10 its in the perfect tense which means:

The perfect tense in Greek corresponds to the perfect tense in English, and describes an action which is viewed as having been completed in the past, once and for all, not needing to be repeated.

Jesus' last cry from the cross, TETELESTAI ("It is finished!") is a good example of the perfect tense used in this sense, namely "It [the atonement] has been accomplished, completely, once and for all time."

No one Christ sanctified by His Death or Blood cannot become unsanctified, the only way that could be done is if Christ's Blood is no longer a factor before the Throne and Mercy Seat of God !

If you preach a Christ today who did not accomplish and sanctify everyone He died for permanently for the service of God, like here Rev 7:14-15

14And I said unto him, Sir, thou knowest. And he said to me, These are they which came out of great tribulation, and have washed their robes, and made them white in the blood of the Lamb.

15Therefore are they before the throne of God, and serve him day and night in his temple: and he that sitteth on the throne shall dwell among them.

Then you preach a False Gospel, and Paul said of such this Gal 1:8-9


8But though we, or an angel from heaven, preach any other gospel unto you than that which we have preached unto you, let him be accursed.

9As we said before, so say I now again, if any man preach any other gospel unto you than that ye have received, let him be accursed.

beloved57
April 9th, 2012, 01:04 PM
Its been seen from scripture that Christ's Sanctifies everyone He died for permanently, once and for all, that being the case, God the Holy Spirit must effect the partaking of that to each one Christ died for and Sanctified as well as did redeem, So He Sanctifies them also by Belief of the Truth 2 Thess 2:13

13But we are bound to give thanks alway to God for you, brethren beloved of the Lord, because God hath from the beginning chosen you to salvation through sanctification of the Spirit and belief of the truth:

This is the Father's answer to Christ when He prayed this Jn 17:17-20

17Sanctify them through thy truth: thy word is truth.

18As thou hast sent me into the world, even so have I also sent them into the world.

19And for their sakes I sanctify myself, that they also might be sanctified through the truth.

20Neither pray I for these alone, but for them also which shall believe on me through their word;

So He, the Holy Spirit makes us meet for the reception of God's Truth, that we may be of those who receive the word of the Kingdom upon good ground and bear fruit Matt 13:23

But he that received seed into the good ground is he that heareth the word, and understandeth it; which also beareth fruit, and bringeth forth, some an hundredfold, some sixty, some thirty.

Many people shall hear the word publicly but will not understand it, because if they are not spiritual, they cannot understand the things of God, its foolishness to them. Now for it to be judged foolishness by them, they must did publicly hear it to make that assessment of it !

That word understandeth in Matt 13:23 is a type of Understanding men do not have by nature, for it is the same word Paul uses of those dead in sin Rom 3:11

11 There is none that understandeth, there is none that seeketh after God.

None means no not one, so if one does understand the word in Matt 13:23, that one had been made meet by the Sanctifying work of the Holy Spirit, which person had been sanctified before by the Death or Blood of Christ ! Heb 10:10

beloved57
April 16th, 2012, 07:14 AM
The Good News is this, Thats Christ has saved that which was Lost Lk 19:10

10For the Son of man is come to seek and to save that which was lost.

When He said this Jn 19:30

30When Jesus therefore had received the vinegar, he said, It is finished: and he bowed his head, and gave up the ghost.

He had did that which the Father gave Him to do Jn 17:4-5

4I have glorified thee on the earth: I have finished the work which thou gavest me to do.

5And now, O Father, glorify thou me with thine own self with the glory which I had with thee before the world was.

And that was to seek and to save His Body the Church, for He is the Saviour of the Body, His Body Per Eph 5:23 !

That same body is also Israel, the only Israel that matters , His Seed. For Christ is the True Israel servant of God Isa 49:3 ; Ex 4:22

He is the True Israel that Glorifies God Isa 49:3

3And said unto me, Thou art my servant, O Israel, in whom I will be glorified. Now cp with Jn 17:4

4I have glorified thee on the earth: I have finished the work which thou gavest me to do.

This is Israel of Isa 49:3 bringing to pass what was then foretold He would do !

Now if He be the True Israel, and His Body the Church is One with Him, then they also be Israel, and brings to pass the salvation of His Body Israel, for it is written Isa 45:17

But Israel shall be saved in the LORD with an everlasting salvation: ye shall not be ashamed nor confounded world without end.

And it is Finished, he saved that which was Lost !

beloved57
April 16th, 2012, 04:08 PM
Jn 16:33

These things I have spoken unto you, that in me ye might have peace. In the world ye shall have tribulation: but be of good cheer; I have overcome the world.

Now why should one be of good cheer for Christ's overcoming the world ; if they have no share in it ? Ah but the fact of the matter is this, that all for whom Christ died and rose again, partake in this overcoming, because He did it primarily as Their Head and Representative, so if it's His overcoming. it's His Body's also ! Everyone Christ died for will be given overcoming Faith, that also overcomes the world 1 Jn 5:4

For whatsoever is born of God overcometh the world: and this is the victory that overcometh the world, even our faith.

Where does our faith come from here ? Why it is born of God !

You see Christ by the Gift of His Spirit is the Author and Finisher of Our Faith ! Our being everyone He died for ! This Faith that flows to us from Him by the communication of the Holy Spirit, hath overcome the World, and each person He died for will receive a New Birth of the Spirit because of His Resurrection from the Dead 1 Pet 1:3

3Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, which according to his abundant mercy hath begotten us again unto a lively hope by the resurrection of Jesus Christ from the dead,

Now vain religionists who are proud, believe that the Faith that gives the victory over the world and overcomes it, is from their own freewill ability, and not born of God's Spirit, for they are boasters and proud, and take the crown from Christ, and arrogantly crown their own selves and freewill for such a great achievement !

But the overcoming Faith, that overcomes the world, Has Christ as it's Author and Finisher, and flows From Him the Head, to all His Members that He represented ! So they become overcomer's and victorious because He did in their behalf !

beloved57
May 5th, 2012, 04:49 PM
1 Jn 3:8

1 John 3:8
He that committeth sin is of the devil; for the devil sinneth from the beginning. For this purpose the Son of God was manifested, that he might destroy the works of the devil.

The Lord Jesus Christ through His Death ALONE, hath destroyed the works of the devil, for those He died for. This was foretold eon's ago here Gen 3:15

15 And I will put enmity between thee and the woman, and between thy seed and her seed; it shall bruise thy head [destroy], and thou shalt bruise his heel.

Yes the bruising of the serpent's [satan, the devil] head is exactly what Christ did accomplish Heb 2:14

14 Forasmuch then as the children are partakers of flesh and blood, he also himself likewise took part of the same; that through death he might destroy him that had the power of death, that is, the devil;

Now death has been abolished in regards to everyone Christ died for, and who is believing, and this is brought to light by the Gospel 2 Tim 1:9-10

9 Who hath saved us, and called us with an holy calling, not according to our works, but according to his own purpose and grace, which was given us in Christ Jesus before the world began,

10 But is now made manifest by the appearing of our Saviour Jesus Christ, who hath abolished death, and hath brought life and immortality to light through the gospel:

Those who are believing the Gospel of God's Grace, is evidence that Christ abolished Death on their behalf, that He destroyed the work of the devil regarding them. Now one of the symptoms of or effects of spiritual death and the devil's power over one, is Unbelief of the Gospel, for Unbelief is work of the Devil, scripture most certainly declares that 2 Cor 4:3-4

3 But if our gospel be hid, it is hid to them that are lost:

4 In whom the god[Satan] of this world hath blinded the minds of them which believe not, lest the light of the glorious gospel of Christ, who is the image of God, should shine unto them.

The lost natural man just simply cannot believe the Gospel and why ? "the god of this world hath blinded the minds of them which believe not," this is one of the works of the devil ! So yes, unbelief of the Gospel of God's Sovereign Grace is not believed by all those that the work of the devil prevails against. See Also Matt 13:19 ! He by spiritual death blinds their minds in unbelief ! But how so to those whom Christ has died for, and consequently hath destroyed the works of the devil ? I must testify, that it is impossible for anyone Christ died for, should remain in unbelief ! They shall one Day Live by Faith after having the Gospel Reveal to them the Righteousness of God Rom 1:16-17. Folks for if that could happen, that one Christ died for lives their whole Life in unbelief of the Gospel, if that happens, then the work of the devil prevailed against one for whom Christ died, he prevailed over His Victorious Death that should have destroyed his works, yes if one soul that Christ died for, dies in unbelief or is found in Gospel Unbelief when He returns, like these will be 2 Thess 1:8, then Christ's Death did not destroy the works of the devil. But alas, it is a fact, all those who do die in unbelief, or are in unbelief when Christ Returns, then Christ did not die for them, simple as that !

beloved57
May 10th, 2012, 07:35 AM
It is Finished !

All for whom Christ died, He has by His Death alone for them, perfectly satisfied God's Law and Justice for them, and this Truth remains steadfast regardless if they for whom He died, believe it not, for there not knowing it, not believing it, can undo what Christ hath done for God and them. The Unbelief of the Elect sinner for whom Christ died cannot overturn the satisfaction Christ's Death provided to God's Law and Justice, its been accomplished; For either Christ's Death has propitiated the Father once and for all, for all their sins or it has not. If it has [and it has] it would be contrary to the Justice of God to ever punish, charge any of those Christ died for with sin ! So Paul in understanding this Writes Rom 8:33-34

33 Who shall lay any thing to the charge of God's elect? It is God that justifieth.

34 Who is he that condemneth? It is Christ that died, yea rather, that is risen again, who is even at the right hand of God, who also maketh intercession for us.

Who is Christ making Intercession for ? Quite simple, those He died for !

beloved57
May 10th, 2012, 10:03 AM
If God could punish those Christ died for, after punishing them once already in Christ, God would be Unjust to His Son Christ, and renege on The Covenant engagements ! God Justly punished Christ for all their sins. God in His Injustice would be punishing those Christ died for Twice, once in their Surety Substitute and now a Second Time in them. So all who Teach that the satisfaction the Death of Christ made for sinners that He died for, unto God's Law and Justice, on their behalf, and yet you teach many of the same shall perish in their sins [That Christ died for 1 Cor 15:3], you are openly before the world charging God with cold hearted in Justice, making Him out to be a Unjust God. You are teaching that God has and will act contrary to His own Justice, for there is simply no way around it. A persons act of belief has absolutely nothing to do with what on Christ's Sacrifice can and has accomplished before the law and Justice of God, on their behalf [Which is the Eternal Forgiveness of their sins] or Redemption Heb 9:12

12 Neither by the blood of goats and calves, but by his own blood he entered in once into the holy place, having obtained eternal redemption for us. The Eternal Redemption obtained was not for Him Personally, but for those He died for !

Now if He punishes any of the Us of Heb 9:12 for any one sin, to include unbelief, God has set aside the Satisfaction of His Son on their Behalf and becomes Unjust !

beloved57
May 10th, 2012, 09:49 PM
Perfected forever Heb 10:14

14 For by one offering[His Death] he hath perfected for ever them that are sanctified.

When scripture states that by His One Offering [His Death or Blood] of Himself , those He died for are perfected forever, it means that they are Eternally Justified Perfectly before God's Law and Justice, based solely on Christ's sacrifice !

This is True because of Imputed Righteousness of Jesus Christ, His Righteousness is in behalf of all for whom He died ! His Righteousness laid to our Charge if He died for us is:

entirely without any flaws, defects, or shortcomings

accurate, exact, or correct in every detail

As far as God's Law and Justice is concerned , those Christ died for are Isa 61:10

I will greatly rejoice in the LORD, my soul shall be joyful in my God; for he hath clothed me with the garments of salvation, he hath covered me with the robe of righteousness, as a bridegroom decketh himself with ornaments, and as a bride adorneth herself with her jewels.

Ps 132:9

Let thy priests be clothed with righteousness; and let thy saints shout for joy.

Who are His Priests ? These Rev 1:5-6

And from Jesus Christ, who is the faithful witness, and the first begotten of the dead, and the prince of the kings of the earth. Unto him that loved us, and washed us from our sins in his own blood,

6 And hath made us kings and priests unto God and his Father; to him be glory and dominion for ever and ever. Amen.
He made us that by His Love and Blood ! We have a perfect Righteousness by Christ and so have been perfected forever before God !

beloved57
May 12th, 2012, 06:42 PM
Heb 10:10

10 By the which will we are sanctified through the offering of the body of Jesus Christ once for all.

Yes, The writer is writing to Believers, however that is not how they became sanctified forever, which was solely by means of the Sacrifice or Offering of the Body of Jesus Christ, which means by His Death !

This is a Great Blessing of the Death of Christ, all for whom He died, once and for all, set them apart !

The word sanctified here is the greek word hagiazō and means:


to render or acknowledge, or to be venerable or hallow

2) to separate from profane things and dedicate to God

a) consecrate things to God

b) dedicate people to God

3) to purify

a) to cleanse externally

b) to purify by expiation: free from the guilt of sin

c) to purify internally by renewing of the soul

Please understand that Christ's Death is also the cause of internal renewing of the soul or as Paul writes it Titus 3:5

5 Not by works of righteousness which we have done, but according to his mercy he saved us, by the washing of regeneration, and [B]renewing of the Holy Ghost;

Christ's Death alone is the Sole Cause of this renewing of the Holy Ghost, for that is why when He ascended on High upon completion of His Death Work, the Father gave Him the Holy Spirit to pour upon all them He died for and to ensure their experimental sanctification by the Spirit. Here is where He receives the Holy Ghost scripture says Acts 2:33

Therefore being by the right hand of God exalted, and having received of the Father the promise of the Holy Ghost, he [Christ] hath shed forth this, which ye now see and hear.

This shed forth of the Holy Ghost is taught by Paul also Here Titus 3:5-6

5 Not by works of righteousness which we have done, but according to his mercy he saved us, by the washing of regeneration, and renewing of the Holy Ghost;

6 Which he shed on us abundantly through Jesus Christ our Saviour;

Thats why those jews on the day of Pentecost asked for spiritual instruction from hearing Peter's sermon Acts 2, their asking that question showed that they had been renewed by the Holy Ghost, which Christ just had shed forth !

beloved57
May 12th, 2012, 10:36 PM
Jesus says of those He died for Jn 17:19

19 And for their sakes I sanctify myself, that they also might be sanctified through the truth.

This here Christ sanctifying Himself has to do with offering Himself in Death, and by this, He sanctifies those He died for, this is confirmation of Heb 10:10. Notice Jesus said that they may be sanctified in the Truth. So Part of Christ's effects of His Death, is that those whom He died for, should be sanctified through the Truth ! The Holy Spirit is given to Him for that Purpose, remember Acts 2:33, so each person Christ's died for, and prayed that they should be sanctified through the Truth, the Holy Spirit effects that 2 Thess 2:13

13 But we are bound to give thanks alway to God for you, brethren beloved of the Lord, because God hath from the beginning chosen you to salvation through sanctification of the Spirit and belief of the truth:

Yes, the Holy Spirit performs this work, however its because of the merits of Christ's Death and how it sanctifies those He died for !

beloved57
May 21st, 2012, 05:57 AM
So because Christ's Death alone has once and for all sanctified or set apart for God's Purpose all those he died for, as an evidence of that Truth, the Spirit of God gives New Life unto all of them unto Gospel Obedience or Belief of the Truth, or its called Sanctification of the Spirit unto belief of the Truth. This also answers the Redeemers prayer for all whom He died Jn 17:17-20

17 Sanctify them through thy truth: thy word is truth.

18 As thou hast sent me into the world, even so have I also sent them into the world.

19 And for their sakes I sanctify myself, that they also might be sanctified through the truth.

20 Neither pray I for these alone, but for them also which shall believe on me through their word;

1 Pet 1:2

2 Elect according to the foreknowledge of God the Father, through sanctification of the Spirit, unto obedience and sprinkling of the blood of Jesus Christ: Grace unto you, and peace, be multiplied.

The prep eis unto can mean into, so it could read:

2 Elect according to the foreknowledge of God the Father, through sanctification of the Spirit, into obedience and sprinkling of the blood of Jesus Christ: Grace unto you, and peace, be multiplied.

Now this sanctifying work of the Spirit unto Gospel obedience, is the FRUIT of Christ's Death, His One offering of Heb 10:10 ! All Persons Christ died for are automatically Sanctified [once and for all] by the Divine Purpose, even before actual childbirth as sinners, even as Jeremiah was Jer 1:5

5 Before I formed thee in the belly I knew thee; and before thou camest forth out of the womb I sanctified thee, and I ordained thee a prophet unto the nations.

Yet, this did not mean that Jeremiah would not still be born a sinner, a child of wrath by nature as others, and not needing to be born again, but all that would occur by the Divine Purpose in due time so that he could fulfill his call as a prophet. However in God's Purpose, Jeremiah was always sanctified and set apart for God's Holy Purpose, his being born a sinner could not thwart that Purpose, neither for any other person Christ died for and set them apart for God's Holy Purpose in the Body of Christ. It is simply impossible for anyone Christ died for to not in time be sanctified by the Spirits Work unto obedience so they can perform the works God hath already ordained before that they should walk in Eph 2:8-10

8 For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:

9 Not of works, lest any man should boast.

10 For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus unto good works, which God hath before ordained that we should walk in them.

beloved57
May 26th, 2012, 04:20 AM
Acts 13:38

Be it known unto you therefore, men and brethren, that through this man is preached unto you the forgiveness of sins:

The word preached here is the greek word kataggellō and means:


to announce, declare, promulgate, make known

2) to proclaim publicly, publish

3) to denounce, report, betray

The word conveys the idea of making something known ! What is being made known or declared, or published to some is that they have by the grace of God, and through the redemption that is in Christ Jesus, they have the forgiveness of all their sins ! Eph 1:7

In whom we have redemption through his blood, the forgiveness of sins, according to the riches of his grace;

This is not an offer of forgiveness of sins that is contingent upon any conditions of men, not faith, not repentance, not water baptism, but solely upon the Blood of Christ shed on their behalf, the blood of the Covenant Matt 26:28

28 For this is my blood of the new testament, which is shed for many for the remission of sins.


The remission of sins is the same as the forgiveness of sins !

All those whom Christ died for, shed His Blood for have before the Justice of God, and His Holy Law, they have forgiveness of sins before they are even born into this world as sinners ! It has not been made known to them until they are born again from above and the Gospel of their Salvation is preached unto them !

Cross Reference
May 26th, 2012, 04:36 AM
Jesus, The Second Man is the Son of God historically manifested, and the prophecy of what the human race is going to be.__And this because of His obedience, even unto death.

beloved57
May 26th, 2012, 09:57 PM
There was Legal forgiveness of the sins of the elect before the world began because of the Everlasting Covenant of Grace, when Christ was established as the Surety of the Elect or of the Sheep, and therefore no sin of theirs could be legally imputed to their Charge, but unto the charge of their Surety, so the Elect were forgiven of all Trespasses, before they actually Trespassed in Adam! When they Trespaased in Adam, God could not legally charge them with sin. David understood this Transaction and wrote Ps 32:1-2

Blessed is he whose transgression is forgiven, whose sin is covered.

2 Blessed is the man unto whom the Lord imputeth not iniquity, and in whose spirit there is no guile.

Cross Reference
May 27th, 2012, 04:21 AM
There was Legal forgiveness of the sins of the elect before the world began because of the Everlasting Covenant of Grace, when Christ was established as the Surety of the Elect or of the Sheep, and therefore no sin of theirs could be legally imputed to their Charge, but unto the charge of their Surety, so the Elect were forgiven of all Trespasses, before they actually Trespassed in Adam! When they Trespaased in Adam, God could not legally charge them with sin. David understood this Transaction and wrote Ps 32:1-2

Blessed is he whose transgression is forgiven, whose sin is cover

Wow! By what you are saying, the "elect" must have already tasted of the heavenly gift and partaken of the Holy Spirit before ever being born?

beloved57
May 27th, 2012, 01:30 PM
Wow! By what you are saying, the "elect" must have already tasted of the heavenly gift and partaken of the Holy Spirit before ever being born?

No, but it is inevitable that they shall !

Cross Reference
May 27th, 2012, 02:05 PM
No, but it is inevitable that they shall !

O-Ok. Then this scripture must be for them:

"For it is impossible for those who were once enlightened, and have tasted of the heavenly gift, and were made partakers of the Holy Ghost, And have tasted the good word of God, and the powers of the world to come, If they shall fall away, to renew them again unto repentance; seeing they crucify to themselves the Son of God afresh, and put him to an open shame." Hebrews 6:4-6 (KJV)

I mean, the possibility must be there, right?

beloved57
May 27th, 2012, 04:15 PM
O-Ok. Then this scripture must be for them:

"For it is impossible for those who were once enlightened, and have tasted of the heavenly gift, and were made partakers of the Holy Ghost, And have tasted the good word of God, and the powers of the world to come, If they shall fall away, to renew them again unto repentance; seeing they crucify to themselves the Son of God afresh, and put him to an open shame." Hebrews 6:4-6 (KJV)

I mean, the possibility must be there, right?

No that scripture does not describe the elect of God, not the God i serve ! Maybe for the god you serve, which is a idol !

beloved57
May 29th, 2012, 06:22 PM
Rom 5:11

11 And not only so, but we also joy in God through our Lord Jesus Christ, by whom[Christ] we have now received the atonement.

By whom we have now received the atonement or the reconciliation. What Paul means here is that all for whom Christ died, by Him also, they receive all the benefits of His Death, as God said in Rom 8:32

32 He that spared not his own Son, but delivered him up for us all, how shall he not with him also freely give us all things?

The word give here is the greek word charizomai and means:

to do something pleasant or agreeable (to one), to do a favour to, gratify

a) to show one's self gracious, kind, benevolent

b) [B]to grant forgiveness, to pardon

c) to give graciously, give freely, bestow

1) to forgive

2) graciously to restore one to another

3) to preserve for one a person in peril

With Christ God gives forgiveness Eph 1:7, He gives restoration !

By Him, they receive experimental Saving or Salvation by New Birth. This receiving of the atonement or reconciliation is the fulfillment of the promise in vs 10 Rom 5:10

10 For if, when we were enemies, we were reconciled to God by the death of his Son, much more, being reconciled, we shall be saved by his life.

Yes, the receiving of the atonement experimentally is being saved by His Life and it brings about their experimental salvation, the application of it is by Him. All this is another way of saying being born again or from above, which is through the Resurrection of Jesus Christ from the dead 1 Pet 1:3

3 Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, which according to his abundant mercy hath begotten us again unto a lively hope by the resurrection of Jesus Christ from the dead,

Peter here uses the same preposition dia here for by the resurrection of Jesus Christ from the dead, as Paul uses in Rom 5:11 " by whom we have received the Atonement !

Folks as risen Saviour of the Church, Christ applies the Atonement that He achieved for each one He died for and rose again as their Saviour ! Not one for whom He died shall be Lost !

beloved57
May 30th, 2012, 07:45 AM
1 Pet 1:2-3

2 Elect according to the foreknowledge of God the Father, through sanctification of the Spirit, unto obedience and sprinkling of the blood of Jesus Christ: Grace unto you, and peace, be multiplied.

3 Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, which according to his abundant mercy hath begotten us again unto a lively hope by the resurrection of Jesus Christ from the dead,

Here we have by Divine inspiration that the resurrection of Christ, by way of His Redeeming Death, is being viewed as the meritorious cause of the New Birth performed by the Spirit of the Covenant, so it is feasible to call the Second Man Adam, who is Christ an Quickening Spirit 1 Cor 15:45

45 And so it is written, The first man Adam was made a living soul; the last Adam was made a quickening spirit.

That word quickening is the greek word zōopoieō and means:


to produce alive, begat or bear living young

2) to cause to live, make alive, give life

a) by spiritual power to arouse and invigorate

b) to restore to life
to give increase of life: thus of physical life

d) of the spirit, quickening as respects the spirit, endued with new and greater powers of life

3) metaph., of seeds quickened into life, i.e. germinating, springing up, growing





As the Risen Adam, having paid for the sins of all for whom He died, for all whom sins had been laid to His Charge Rom 4:25, and now having satisfied God's Law and Justice in their behalf, they have the right to live Spiritually before God, so He causes them to Live, He gives them Spiritual Life.

He does this for His Seed Isa 53:10

10 Yet it pleased the Lord to bruise him; he hath put him to grief: when thou shalt make his soul an offering for sin, he shall see his seed, he shall prolong his days, and the pleasure of the Lord shall prosper in his hand.

This is why as the Risen Lord He is a Life Giving Spirit, to give Spiritual Life to all for whom He died. Thats why He said of His Sheep Jn 10:10

The thief cometh not, but for to steal, and to kill, and to destroy: I am come that they might have life, and that they might have it more abundantly.

Life here is Spiritual Life, which His Death for them shall merit ! And so by His Resurrection He lives and shall save them by His Life Rom 5:10

10 For if, when we were enemies, we were reconciled to God by the death of his Son, much more, being reconciled, we shall be saved by his life.

Thats what Paul means, shall be saved by His Life that of 1 Cor 15:45

45 And so it is written, The first man Adam was made a living soul; the last Adam was made a quickening spirit.

Christ must make Alive Spiritually, all for whom He died and rose again ! And He does by His Resurrection 1 Pet 1:3

3 Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, which according to his abundant mercy hath begotten us again unto a lively hope by the resurrection of Jesus Christ from the dead,

This being begotten again means:

to produce again, be born again, born anew

2) metaph. to have one's mind changed so that he lives a new life and one conformed to the will of God

beloved57
June 3rd, 2012, 06:05 PM
Rom 6:11

Likewise reckon ye also yourselves to be dead indeed unto sin, but alive unto God through Jesus Christ our Lord.

The Primary Accomplishment or Effect of the Death of Christ for all those He died for, is that He makes them Alive unto God. That's what Paul taught here and what Peter taught 1 Pet 1:3. Now the word through here is the prep en which is :

A primary preposition denoting (fixed) position (in place, time or state), and (by implication) instrumentality (medially or constructively), i.e. a relation of rest (intermediate between εἰς (G1519) and ἐκ (G1537))

All for whom Christ were in Him Legally when He died and when He was made Alive from the Dead, so much so, we are are said to have be quickened together with Him when He was made alive from the grave Eph 2:5-6

5 Even when we were dead[experimentally] in sins, hath quickened us together with Christ, (by grace ye are saved )

This quickened together is the greek word syzōopoieō and means:


to make one alive together

a) of Christians, with Christ


Now this was True because we were in Him, Legally and representatively.

So Paul says reckon yourselves alive unto God through, or in Christ Jesus. Also the word in means instrument of means, we are made alive experimentally through Christ as the means !

Now Peter speaks to that in 1 Pet 1:3

3 Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, which according to his abundant mercy hath begotten us again unto a lively hope by the resurrection of Jesus Christ from the dead,

This being begotten again is by the Resurrection of Jesus Christ, now remember Paul taught in Eph 2:6 that we were made alive together with Christ, that also speaks to the resurrection of Christ, that all for whom He died were in Him Legally and representatively ! Now the evidence of that, is that all who were in Him Legally when He rose, shall be experimentally begotten again. The words begotten again is the greek word anagennaō and means:


to produce again, be born again, born anew

2) metaph. to have one's mind changed so that he lives a new life and one conformed to the will of God

This New Life we shall begin to live for God is what Paul means when He says reckon yourselves alive to God through Jesus Christ !

Yes, Christ's Death accomplished this New Life to God for everyone He died for, no exceptions. Now all those who are lost in their sins , means that Christ did not die for them !

beloved57
June 4th, 2012, 01:10 AM
Jn 12:32

32 And I, if I be lifted up from the earth, will draw all men unto me.

An effect or accomplishment of Christ's Death is that all for whom He died shall be saved by Him, shall believe in Him !

All the men that come to Him, just as it is written before in Jn 6:44

44 No man can come to me, except the Father which hath sent me draw him: and I will raise him up at the last day.

Which drawing results in their coming to Him as in Matt 11:28 and Jn 12:32, and so all who come, and the promise to such who do, is that Christ shall raise him up in the last day. Now what does Christ mean that , He shall raise them up at the last ? I believe He is speaking about for them the resurrection of the Just Acts 24:15. So now, if one forces Jn 12:32 to mean, that Christ died for all men without exception and He will draw them all unto Him, then the reasonable conclusion is that all men without exception that have died before the Second Coming shall be raised up in the resurrection of the Just, which means Universalism is True, and Eternal Punishment and Damnation is False, and neither is their a Resurrection of the Unjust which Paul did Teach !

beloved57
June 6th, 2012, 05:50 AM
It is quite apparent that God's People, those whom Christ died for and accomplished for them the forgiveness of their sins Matt 26:28

28 For this is my blood of the new testament, which is shed for many for the remission or forgiveness of sins.

And hence God shall remember their iniquties [in a way of Justice] no more Heb 8:12

12 For I will be merciful to their unrighteousness, and their sins and their iniquities will I remember no more.

It is clear that they are not the same people whom shall remain in Mystery Babylon, the false religions of the world, whom God hath remembered [in judgment and justice] and condemnation their iniquties per Rev 18:4-5

4 And I heard another voice from heaven, saying, Come out of her, my people, that ye be not partakers of her sins, and that ye receive not of her plagues.

5 For her sins have reached unto heaven, and God hath remembered her iniquities.

All such people Christ did not die for them for the remission of their sins !

beloved57
June 13th, 2012, 09:39 PM
Many in false religion sing the song:


There is pow’r, pow’r, wonder-working pow’r
In the blood of the Lamb;
There is pow’r, pow’r, wonder-working pow’r
In the precious blood of the Lamb.

Yet they do this merely in a form of godliness, and they deny the actual Power therein 2 Tim 3:5

Having a form of godliness, but denying the power thereof: from such turn away.

Yes they deny the power of Christ's blood, and exalts mans freewill in its stead, since many as they tell it that Christ died for, shed His Blood for do not experience its powerful effects, because they reject it with their freewill ! However scripture is quite clear that the offering of Christ [His Blood] had a sanctifying and purifying effect for all He offered Himself in behalf of, just as it's type, the offerings of bulls and goats had an external effect as stated here Heb 9:13

For if the blood of bulls and of goats, and the ashes of an heifer sprinkling the unclean, sanctifieth to the purifying of the flesh:

BUT the Sacrifice of Himself, the Antitype, His Blood effects inner purification Heb 9:14

14 How much more shall the blood of Christ, who through the eternal Spirit offered himself without spot to God, purge your conscience from dead works to serve the living God?



Christ's Blood by means of the Eternal Spirit, does actually purify the conscience, which is a inner faculty of man, it has to do with the inner soul of a man, but which the animal sacrifices lacked ability to accomplish Heb 9:9

9 Which was a figure for the time then present, in which were offered both gifts and sacrifices, that could not make him that did the service perfect, as pertaining to the conscience;

Now all who sin the song, Power in the Blood, and yet deny its purifying effects, they testimony is that of 2 Tim 3:5, you actually deny the power thereof ! You have only a form of Godliness, an empty profession, for you deny the power of True Religion which is in Christ's Blood ! You deny a True accomplishment of the Atonement that is in Christ's Blood !

beloved57
June 14th, 2012, 06:32 AM
Christ, His Blood, or His Offering begins for each person He died for a Purifying process which the Holy Spirit shall apply to them at an appointed hour in their life, which begins with their New Birth or what is called also the Sanctification of the Spirit 2 Thess 2:13

13 But we are bound to give thanks alway to God for you, brethren beloved of the Lord, because God hath from the beginning chosen you to salvation through sanctification of the Spirit and belief of the truth:

So we have the writer of Hebrews writing these Heb 10:10;14-18

10 By the which will we are sanctified through the offering of the body of Jesus Christ once for all.

14 For by one offering he hath perfected for ever them that are sanctified.

15 Whereof the Holy Ghost also is a witness to us: for after that he had said before,

16 This is the covenant that I will make with them after those days, saith the Lord, I will put my laws into their hearts, and in their minds will I write them;

17 And their sins and iniquities will I remember no more.

18 Now where remission of these is, there is no more offering for sin.

In other words, those who were being sanctified experientially , was the effect of the one Offering of Christ that Perfected them forever !

Those who are made perfect legally by the Offering of Christ, are those who have the Gospel and its Spiritual Message Communicated to them 1 Cor 2:6-7

6 Howbeit we speak wisdom among them that are perfect: yet not the wisdom of this world, nor of the princes of this world, that come to nought:

7 But we speak the wisdom of God in a mystery, even the hidden wisdom, which God ordained before the world unto our glory:

The Perfect are those who can understand the Wisdom and Mystery of the Gospel they spoke among them ! For the Gospel is a Mystery Eph 6:19-20

And for me, that utterance may be given unto me, that I may open my mouth boldly, to make known the mystery of the gospel,

20 For which I am an ambassador in bonds: that therein I may speak boldly, as I ought to speak.

beloved57
June 15th, 2012, 08:01 AM
One of the sure results of the purpose of Christ's Death for all for whom He died is this 1 Pet 2:24

24 Who his own self bare our sins in his own body on the tree, that we, being dead to sins, should live unto righteousness: by whose stripes ye were healed.

It is then, we know that Christ's stripes alone healed us spiritually !

Now who are the subjects of this great healing spiritually of Christ's stripes or His Death ? None but the Elect of God as Per 1 Pet 1:2

2 Elect according to the foreknowledge of God the Father, through sanctification of the Spirit, unto obedience and sprinkling of the blood of Jesus Christ: Grace unto you, and peace, be multiplied.

Which are those who have been begotten again by the resurrection of Jesus Christ from the dead 1 Pet 1:3

3 Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, which according to his abundant mercy hath begotten us again unto a lively hope by the resurrection of Jesus Christ from the dead,

This begetting again produced a New Life unto God, for the greek word here for begotten again is anagennaō and means:


to produce again, be born again, born anew

2) metaph. to have one's mind changed so that he lives a new life and one conformed to the will of God

Now you see how one for whom Christ dies, how that results in a Life that lives unto God !

Now if this is not the effect produced for each and everyone Christ died for 1 Pet 2:24, then His Death for them failed God's Purpose !

RevTestament
June 15th, 2012, 10:07 PM
The atonement was his greatest example.

beloved57
June 16th, 2012, 05:26 PM
Col 1:21-22

21 And you, that were sometime alienated and enemies in your mind by wicked works, yet now hath he reconciled

22 In the body of his flesh through death, to present you holy and unblameable and unreproveable in his sight:

Another intended purpose for the death of Christ and accomplishment, for all that He died, is to present them Holy, unblameable and unreproveable in His Sight !

Notice it was to present #1 Unblameable ἄμωμος =

without blemish

a) as a sacrifice without spot or blemish

2) morally: without blemish, faultless, unblameable

But thats not all, its to present # 2 unreproveable anegklētos =

that cannot be called into to account, unreproveable, unaccused, blameless

Its the meaning that Paul has in mind here Rom 8:33

33 Who shall lay any thing to the charge of God's elect? It is God that justifieth.

Its the same word. You see God never laid any charge to the account of His Elect !

And Holy !

But all this is in His Sight, though it may not be True to experience here in the flesh, nevertheless for Him to see His People like that in His Sight is because of the Imputed Righteousness of Christ laid to their account.

Now if this does not occur for each one He reconciled to God by the Death of His Son Rom 5:10;Col 1:21, then His Death failed God's intended purpose !

beloved57
June 18th, 2012, 09:41 AM
Jn 17:1-4

These words spake Jesus, and lifted up his eyes to heaven, and said, Father, the hour is come; glorify thy Son, that thy Son also may glorify thee:

2 As thou hast given him power over all flesh, that he should give eternal life to as many as thou hast given him.

3 And this is life eternal, that they might know thee the only true God, and Jesus Christ, whom thou hast sent.

4 I have glorified thee on the earth: I have finished the work which thou gavest me to do.

Christ came to do a work for His Father, and it is a work that He He would be rewarded for Heb 12:2

2 Looking unto Jesus the author and finisher of our faith; who for the joy that was set before him endured the cross, despising the shame, and is set down at the right hand of the throne of God.

His Reward was that Joy set before Him ! The phrase set before Him is the greek prokeimai which means :


to lie or be placed before (a person or a thing) or in front of

2) to set before

a) to be placed before the eyes, to lie in sight

1) to stand forth

b) to be appointed, destined

c) to be there, be present, be at hand

Its an appointed Joy. Remember Jesus said this Lk 22:29

And I appoint unto you a kingdom, as my Father hath appointed unto me;


This Kingdom is the Joy of the Lord Matt 25:21

His lord said unto him, Well done, thou good and faithful servant: thou hast been faithful over a few things, I will make thee ruler over many things: enter thou into the joy of thy lord.

Also the Joy that is His Reward, is the Repentance of each of His Lost Sheep, the Sheep He seeks and finds and saved Lk 15:1-7

Then drew near unto him all the publicans and sinners for to hear him.

2 And the Pharisees and scribes murmured, saying, This man receiveth sinners, and eateth with them.

3 And he spake this parable unto them, saying,

4 What man of you, having an hundred sheep, if he lose one of them, doth not leave the ninety and nine in the wilderness, and go after that which is lost, until he find it?

5 And when he hath found it, he layeth it on his shoulders, rejoicing.

6 And when he cometh home, he calleth together his friends and neighbours, saying unto them, Rejoice with me; for I have found my sheep which was lost.

7 I say unto you, that likewise joy shall be in heaven over one sinner that repenteth, more than over ninety and nine just persons, which need no repentance.

Thats Jesus Reward, for the sinner that repents is evidence of the success of His Work and the Reward of His Work. The Repenting sinners are the rewards that the Father Promised to the Son for the accomplishment of His Work Ps 2:8

Ask of me, and I shall give thee the heathen for thine inheritance, and the uttermost parts of the earth for thy possession.

The word give here also means appoint as here Ezk 45:6

6 And ye shall ]appoint [/U]the possession of the city five thousand broad, and five and twenty thousand long, over against the oblation of the holy portion: it shall be for the whole house of Israel.

Ps 2:8 is the Promised Kingdom appointed of Lk 22:29 and sinners brought into this Kingdom by the Work of Christ are Christ's Reward, His Joy set before Him. This is because He finished the Work the Father gave Him to do !

beloved57
June 19th, 2012, 04:59 AM
The Lord Jesus Christ as an reward for His obedience unto death, God Highly Exalted Him as here explained Phil 2:5-11

6 Who, being in the form of God, thought it not robbery to be equal with God:

7 But made himself of no reputation, and took upon him the form of a servant, and was made in the likeness of men:

8 And being found in fashion as a man, he humbled himself, and became obedient unto death, even the death of the cross.

9 Wherefore God also hath highly exalted him, and given him a name which is above every name:

10 That at the name of Jesus every knee should bow, of things in heaven, and things in earth, and things under the earth;

11 And that every tongue should confess that Jesus Christ is Lord, to the glory of God the Father.

Now a couple of items will pointed out as to the Reward of Christ's Sufferings or Death in Being Highly Exalted Him !

Highly Exalted in the greek is hyperypsoō and it means:


metaph. to exalt to the highest rank and power, raise to supreme majesty

2) to extol most highly

3) to be lifted up with pride, exalted beyond measure

4) to carry one's self loftily


The Lord Jesus Christ has been exalted to the Supreme Majesty, Highest in Rank and Power ! Now what Being can Be acknowledged as having Supreme Majesty but God ? 1 Chron 29:11

Thine, O LORD is the greatness, and the power, and the glory, and the victory, and the majesty: for all that is in the heaven and in the earth is thine; thine is the kingdom, O LORD, and thou art exalted as head above all.

So in other words, the Lord Jesus Christ is not one bit less than the Being being acknowledged here !

Also, The Lord Jesus Christ was given a Name above every Name !

Now what Name can possibly be above every Name but God's Name ?

Similar is what Paul wrote here Eph 1:

Far above all principality, and power, and might, and dominion, and every name that is named, not only in this world, but also in that which is to come:

Now, How Can the Name of Christ Jesus be above every Name that is Named if He be not God in the Highest Rank of Authority ?

Ps 8:1

O LORD, our Lord, how excellent is thy name in all the earth! who hast set thy glory above the heavens.

Now, Jehovah Here is acknowledged as the Saints Master ! There is Only one Lord in this regards 1 Cor 8:6

But to us there is but one God, the Father, of whom are all things, and we in him; and one Lord Jesus Christ, by whom are all things, and we by him.

And how excellent is His Name ? Jesus Christ Acts 4:12

Neither is there salvation in any other: for there is none other name under heaven given among men, whereby we must be saved.

There is no other Name in Which Salvation can be found, than Jesus Christ. Isa 45:8

Drop down, ye heavens, from above, and let the skies pour down righteousness: let the earth open, and let them bring forth salvation, and let righteousness spring up together; I the LORD have created it.

Neh 9:5

Then the Levites, Jeshua, and Kadmiel, Bani, Hashabniah, Sherebiah, Hodijah, Shebaniah, and Pethahiah, said, Stand up and bless the LORD your God for ever and ever: and blessed be thy glorious name, which is exalted above all blessing and praise

This verse can apply to the Lord Jesus Christ, whose Exaltation has given Him a Name above Every Name which is Named, so He must be Jehovah Lord God ! For only His Name could qualify for such High Praise and Recognition !

And so it is, Every Tongue will Confess Jesus as Lord God Jehovah, because its an Reward for His Obedience unto Death Phil 2:5-11

Every Tongue will confess this Truth. Some because of their Salvation Experience and giving evidence of their conversion out of jewish ignorance, which is Paul's main Point here Rom 10:9-10

9 That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved.

10 For with the heart man believeth unto righteousness; and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation.

In other words, if an jew who did now confess Jesus as Lord God, to say the same thing as Scripture says, this gave new evidence that they have been saved [regenerated], because they no longer are ignorant to whom this Jesus is, that He is God ! And at the same time Believe that God raised Him from the Dead because He was also Man ! Only experiencing Salvation can clear up that paradox in a persons mind and heart !

Also, the non elect men of the world, because of Christ's Exaltation and Reward, they also, before being cast into Hell, confess Jesus as Lord to the Glory of God the Father !

This must be because of Christ's Exaltation. That is why it is stated here "under the Earth" Phil 2:10

That at the name of Jesus every knee should bow, of things in heaven, and things in earth, and things under the earth;

So the reprobated who now deny the Deity Lordship of Christ and those who have died, shall at the Second Coming and Judgment Day, they shall all bow and confess that Jesus is Lord God to the Glory of the Father !

beloved57
June 22nd, 2012, 07:12 AM
It Gives Repentance unto Life !



Godly Repentance must come from a Godly Source, that is the kind of Repentance that worketh Salvation ! 2 Cor 7:10 (http://biblia.com/bible/nkjv/2%20Cor%207.10)

For godly sorrow worketh repentance to salvation not to be repented of: but the sorrow of the world worketh death.


This Type of Repentance is not in the nature of man because we are by nature ungodly ! Rom 5:6

But Godly Repentance is given from a Godly Source which is the Lord Jesus Christ. He gives those He died for Godly Repentance Acts 5:31 (http://biblia.com/bible/nkjv/Acts%205.31)

31 Him hath God exalted with his right hand to be a Prince and a Saviour, for to give repentance to Israel, and forgiveness of sins.

Note: Christ is not ones Saviour if He does not give them Repentance unto Life ! Acts 11:18 (http://biblia.com/bible/nkjv/Acts%2011.18)

18 When they heard these things, they held their peace, and glorified God, saying, Then hath God also to the Gentiles granted repentance unto life.


You see, repentance is the fruit of the New Birth which is the Fruit of Christ's Resurrection which is fruit of His Death !

All for whom Christ died and rose again, are by His Resurrection begotten again ! Peter writes about it here 1 Pet 1:3 (http://biblia.com/bible/nkjv/1%20Pet%201.3)

3 Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, which according to his abundant mercy hath begotten us again unto a lively hope by the resurrection of Jesus Christ from the dead,

The words begotten us again in the greek is
anagennaō and means:

to produce again, be born again, born anew

2) metaph. to have one's mind changed so that he lives a new life and one conformed to the will of God

Notice in addition of it meaning born anew or produce again, it also means to have one's mind changed !

Now this is significant because the word repentance Acts 5:31 (http://biblia.com/bible/nkjv/Acts%205.31) is the greek word

metanoia which means:

a change of mind, as it appears to one who repents, of a purpose he has formed or of something he has done
And so that is why it is said that Jesus gives Repentance to His Israel or Elect out of both israel and the gentiles.

This is True because, Repentance, Godly Repentance is a product of the New Birth !

Also in Heb the writer has repentance being something suitable for those who are Babes in Christ Heb 5:11-6:1 (http://biblia.com/bible/nkjv/Heb%205.11-6.1)

11 Of whom we have many things to say, and hard to be uttered, seeing ye are dull of hearing.

12 For when for the time ye ought to be teachers, ye have need that one teach you again which be the first principles of the oracles of God; and are become such as have need of milk, and not of strong meat.

13 For every one that useth milk is unskilful in the word of righteousness: for he is a babe.

14 But strong meat belongeth to them that are of full age, even those who by reason of use have their senses exercised to discern both good and evil.

6 Therefore leaving the principles of the doctrine of Christ, let us go on unto perfection; not laying again the foundation of repentance from dead works, and of faith toward God,

You see, Repentance from dead works and faith toward God or Christ as Per Acts 20:21 (http://biblia.com/bible/nkjv/Acts%2020.21)

21 Testifying both to the Jews, and also to the Greeks, repentance toward God, and faith toward our Lord Jesus Christ.

Those things are milk and milk is for babes 1 Pet 2:1 (http://biblia.com/bible/nkjv/1%20Pet%202.1)

Wherefore laying aside all malice, and all guile, and hypocrisies, and envies, and all evil speakings,

2 As newborn babes, desire the sincere milk of the word, that ye may grow thereby:

This confirms that the Apostles Preached Repentance in hope that New Born babes, who have been begotten again by the Resurrection of Christ from the Dead would be converted !

Those of you who believe that repentance is something man does as a condition to get saved, you are deceived and you are a deceiver, for Christ gets the joy of every sinner that Repents Lk 15:7 (http://biblia.com/bible/nkjv/Lk%2015.7)

7 I say unto you, that likewise joy shall be in heaven over one sinner that repenteth, more than over ninety and nine just persons, which need no repentance.

Thats Christ Joy in the accomplishment of His Finished work, it brings the Sheep back to God !

beloved57
June 24th, 2012, 02:12 PM
Jn 17:19

And for their sakes I sanctify myself, that they also might be sanctified through the truth.

Heb 13:12

12 Wherefore Jesus also, that he might sanctify the people with his own blood, suffered without the gate.

Heb 10:10

10 By the which will we are sanctified through the offering of the body of Jesus Christ or His Blood once for all.

All those for whom Christ died for, His offering of Himself in Death, all those must be born again, that is made experientially sanctified, an inward sanctification, so that His Sacrifice of Death for the people will be proven to be of much more effectiveness and giving inward renovation to the things of God. For even the sacrifices of animals provided an outward sanctification or one that was temporal, but did nothing for the inner man Heb 10:1

For the law having a shadow of good things to come, and not the very image of the things, can never with those sacrifices which they offered year by year continually make the comers thereunto perfect.

Heb 9:13

For if the blood of bulls and of goats, and the ashes of an heifer sprinkling the unclean, sanctifieth to the purifying of the flesh:

But because Christ's Sacrifice was so much superior, His Blood so much more excellent it provides a superior sanctification. So the promises of the Covenant He is Mediator of, Because of His Death, God promises to do these things to secure their Sanctification inwardly Jer 31:31-34

31 Behold, the days come, saith the Lord, that I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel, and with the house of Judah:

32 Not according to the covenant that I made with their fathers in the day that I took them by the hand to bring them out of the land of Egypt; which my covenant they brake, although I was an husband unto them, saith the Lord:

33 But this shall be the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel; After those days, saith the Lord, I will put my law in their inward parts, and write it in their hearts; and will be their God, and they shall be my people.

34 And they shall teach no more every man his neighbour, and every man his brother, saying, Know the Lord: for they shall all know me, from the least of them unto the greatest of them, saith the Lord: for I will forgive their iniquity, and I will remember their sin no more.

Verse 33 is the promise of the New Birth, giving that inward man sanctification, of which the OC sacrifices could not do for the people they were made in behalf of ! But Christ's Sacrifice produces so much better results !

beloved57
June 27th, 2012, 05:33 AM
Heb 10:14

14 For by one offering he hath perfected for ever them that are sanctified.

Christ's sacrifice or offering makes them He was offered in behalf of Perfect ! Now under the Old Covenant, the types and shadows, those offerings could not make the people perfect, for they must be offered annually because of this defect, for with them there was a remembering of sin year after year, for they could not take away sin so we read Heb 10:1-4

For the law having a shadow of good things to come, and not the very image of the things, can never with those sacrifices which they offered year by year continually make the comers thereunto perfect.

2 For then would they not have ceased to be offered? because that the worshippers once purged should have had no more conscience of sins.

3 But in those sacrifices there is a remembrance again made of sins every year.

4 For it is not possible that the blood of bulls and of goats should take away sins.

However this is in strike contrast to the once and forever sacrifice or offering of the Lamb of God, that took away all the sins of the people He was Offered in behalf of Jn 1:29

29 The next day John seeth Jesus coming unto him, and saith, Behold the Lamb of God, which taketh away the sin of the world.

Yes, even a world of people. This People's sins are remembered no more Heb 8:12. The People are made perfect in contrast to not being made perfect in Heb 10:1 !

beloved57
June 27th, 2012, 06:51 AM
Now who made the Offering or Offerings in behalf of the People ? Was it the People themselves ? No, it was not, but the Representative of the People, the High Priest. The shadowy and temporal results of that Covenant was provided solely by the Work of the High Priest, and the benefits of it were not a offering to the people to accept or reject with their so called freewill. No but it was the work of the High priest only that was accepted of God to bring about the results, though it needed to be done annually; Whereas by the One Sacrifice of Christ, who is both the High Priest of the People [Covenant People] as well as the offering [Gift] itself, does produce the permanent effects that the virtue of His Blood gives birth to , and it is not up to the people to either accept it or reject it, but it will just bring about the perfecting consequences for each of them, of the Covenant People !

beloved57
July 6th, 2012, 06:19 AM
Heb 9:26

For then must he often have suffered since the foundation of the world: but now once in the end of the world hath he appeared to put away sin by the sacrifice of himself.

Christ's sacrifice of Himself, or His Blood hath put away the sins of all those He died, His Blood Alone did that ! The words put away are the greek word athetēsis:

abolition, disannulling, put away, rejection

to thwart the efficacy of anything, nullify, make void, frustrate

to do away with; put an end to; annul; make void:

Daniel wrote of this here Dan 9:24

24 Seventy weeks are determined upon thy people and upon thy holy city, to finish the transgression, and to make an end of sins, and to make reconciliation for iniquity, and to bring in everlasting righteousness, and to seal up the vision and prophecy, and to anoint the most Holy.

Christ's blood did away with the sins that could condemn anyone Christ died for, yes even before they are born ! All the punishment they did deserve, Christ accepted of the Father on their behalf !

Now some false teachers tell us, that Christ's blood shed or offering alone, that in and of itself it is worthless, that without the work of the Holy Spirit it is meaningless, as if the Holy Spirit had something to do with putting away our sins by satisfying God's Law and Justice; Folks for anyone or any man to say that Christ's Death is worthless in and of itself, is nothing but an Antichrist !

Those Christ did die for, and had their sins put away from the view of God's Law and Justice, they have reason to punished ever for any sin, even if they never experienced a work of the Spirit in their lives ! I am not saying that it ever happened, or that God ever did it like that, but the point being, Christ's death alone took care of their sin problem due to condemnation.

We know this is True because even when those Christ died for are born by Nature enemies to God, while in unbelief, scripture says they have already been reconciled to God by the Death of His Son, meaning by His sacrifice of Himself that put away their sins before God's Law and Justice.

Rom 5:10

10 For if, when we were enemies, we were reconciled to God by the death of his Son, much more, being reconciled, we shall be saved by his life.

So by His Death alone, all for whom Christ died are legally reconciled to God, no sins or condemnation exist against them, even before they are experientially saved by the work of the Holy Spirit ! Yes, they are still in a state of forgiveness of sins and Justification before God, based upon the sacrifice of Christ alone, when they are born unbelievers and enemies, for anyone to deny this, is Antichrist and knows not God !

beloved57
July 11th, 2012, 09:22 PM
Rom 6:11,23

Likewise reckon ye also yourselves to be dead indeed unto sin, but alive unto God through Jesus Christ our Lord.

For the wages of sin is death; but the gift of God is eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord.

Gal 3:14

That the blessing of Abraham might come on the Gentiles through Jesus Christ; that we might receive the promise of the Spirit through faith.

Titus 3:6

Which he shed on us abundantly through Jesus Christ our Saviour;

Heb 13:21

Make you perfect in every good work to do his will, working in you that which is wellpleasing in his sight, through Jesus Christ; to whom be glory for ever and ever. Amen.

Through Jesus Christ primarily means because of Him fulfilling all the conditions of the Covenant on our behalf the blessings are received !

beloved57
July 12th, 2012, 11:13 PM
1 Pet 2:24-25

24 Who his own self bare our sins in his own body on the tree, that we, being dead to sins, should live unto righteousness: by whose stripes ye were healed.

25 For ye were as sheep going astray; but are now returned unto the Shepherd and Bishop of your souls.

See also Isa 53:5 If all for whom Christ died [the meaning of stripes] are not healed, evidenced by returning to God vs 25, then Christ's Death did not effect its God given Purpose ! It did not do its Job. What should Christ's stripes heal us from if He dies for our sins ? It will deliver us from the deadly wound sin and estrangement from God !

That word heal is the greek word iaomai

to cure, heal

2) to make whole

a) to free from errors and sins, to bring about (one's) salvation

or to bring about ones conversion, in order to live unto Righteousness !

Christ stripes heal's from death in a similar vein as in Rev 13:12

12 And he exerciseth all the power of the first beast before him, and causeth the earth and them which dwell therein to worship the first beast, whose deadly wound was healed.

Christ's Death for the Elect heals the deadly wound of sin. So Christ's Death for His People is the basis of life from the dead ! If all for whom Christ died are not given Life Spiritual from the dead, His death was of none effect, and His stripes were a failure, and yet to their shame, many today will say that all for whom Christ died will not be healed ! Will not experience Salvation !

Letsargue
July 13th, 2012, 05:25 AM
Rom 5:11

11And not only so, but we also joy in God through our Lord Jesus Christ, by whom we have now received the atonement.

The Atonement of Christ has reconciled the elect world to God. It secured and ensured for it [ the elect world] every spiritual blessing needed to live unto God and for His Glory through Jesus christ.

Even before the elect are born into this world as sinners, they have already [by the blood of Christ] been reconciled to God, it will now be a matter of time for it to be manifested.

The atonement accomplished the complete salvation for all whom it was offered for, that is the death of christ. It provides them Faith, repentance, sanctification, redemption, and every needful spiritual blessing to convert them to God, and remain secured forever.


You didn’t even answer your own question, if that’s what you call it!!!!

The Atonement, or the “Anointing”, or the “Anointed”, is simply saying “CHRIST”; the ((( Baptism of the Holy Ghost ))) ( Period )
To say, - Jesus “Christ”, the “Christ” names Jesus as one who was Baptized by the Holy Ghost in real time and deed!!! -- To put on “Christ” is to put on that which is (( Anointed )), the Holy Ghost!!! ----- How blind do all these so called ~christians~ have to be, before being witnesses as to who they are???

Paul – 071312

beloved57
July 13th, 2012, 05:35 AM
You didn’t even answer your own question, if that’s what you call it!!!!

The Atonement, or the “Anointing”, or the “Anointed”, is simply saying “CHRIST”; the ((( Baptism of the Holy Ghost ))) ( Period )
To say, - Jesus “Christ”, the “Christ” names Jesus as one who was Baptized by the Holy Ghost in real time and deed!!! -- To put on “Christ” is to put on that which is (( Anointed )), the Holy Ghost!!! ----- How blind do all these so called ~christians~ have to be, before being witnesses as to who they are???

Paul – 071312

We do not serve the same Christ, you know that !

beloved57
July 16th, 2012, 09:15 PM
Rom 7:4

Wherefore, my brethren, ye also are become dead to the law by the body of Christ; that ye should be married to another, even to him who is raised from the dead, that we should bring forth fruit unto God.

All for whom Christ died, before they know anything it, and while they are enemies in themselves to God, yet are they dead to the Law of God Legally and before God's Law and Justice, why ? Because of the Body of Christ, which simply means His Death or Sacrifice of Himself in their behalf. Now this is a actual and factual Truth for everyone Christ died for. It has nothing to do with the New Birth, or Faith or Repentance, but solely based upon the Death of Christ ! Whosoever says that Christ's Death in and of itself without the attending Work of the Spirit is worthless, is a flat out Antichrist and blasphemer ! But yet in God's time, all who are dead to the Law by the Body of Christ, they shall because of it, receive a New Birth, in fact that was the reason why they were made dead to the Law by Christ's Death, in order that they may be Married to another, even to Him that died for them, which is taught in Rom 7:4 as well as 2 Cor 5:14-15

14 For the love of Christ constraineth us; because we thus judge, that if one died for all, then were all dead:

15 And that he died for all, that they which live should not henceforth live unto themselves, but unto him which died for them, and rose again.

By New Birth they become subjectively married to Christ by Faith and aware of their Justified state before God because of the Blood of Christ. Now it does not matter when the Elect person comes to know of it, the Legality of the matter precedes the knowledge of it ! This is because of Christ's death has done its Job of satisfying all of God's Law and Justice, both in Active and Passive obedience. So God's Law has no legal claims on them, they are dead to it by or because of the Body of Christ, that is to say His Death, and the purpose was so that they should bear fruit unto God experientially, which they do as a result of the New Birth beginning with the fruits of Repentance and Faith with Love to the brethren. So Christ's death ensures for all those He died, that they become married to Him experientially because of His Resurrection from the dead, whereby they are begotten again 1 Pet 1:3

3 Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, which according to his abundant mercy hath begotten us again unto a lively hope by the resurrection of Jesus Christ from the dead,

Thats the marriage begun here on earth, but a grander celebration draws nigh !

beloved57
July 17th, 2012, 04:41 PM
1 Cor 15:57

57 But thanks be to God, which giveth us the victory through our Lord Jesus Christ.

Everyone that Christ died for, has been given the Victory. Its not that He made victory available or that it's offered to one and all upon conditions, thats false teaching, but they are given it and they are in a continual state of it, and it is over sin, death and the devil, and its given through Jesus Christ Our Lord !


That is where their Faith comes from, Christ giving them the Victory The Antichrist followers do not believe this !


1 Jn 5:4


4 For whatsoever is born of God overcometh the world: and this is the victory that overcometh the world, even our faith.

You see, everyone Christ died and rose again, by His Resurrection they are begotten again, born again, and that is what begins the victory !

beloved57
August 7th, 2012, 06:20 AM
Ps 68:18

Thou hast ascended on high, thou hast led captivity captive: thou hast received gifts for men; yea, for the rebellious also, that the LORD God might dwell among them.

As part of His Salvation Accomplishment for all those He died for, The Lord Jesus Christ at His Ascension, received from the Father, for the Grand accomplishment of His Saving Work and Death, His Redemptive Reward, He received the Spirit of Promise, also received Gifts for men See also Eph 4:8

8 Wherefore he saith, When he ascended up on high, he led captivity captive, and gave gifts unto men.

He received Gifts for men and to give to men, but what men ? For all the members of His Body, the Church that He Loved and gave Himself for.

These gifts are spiritual in nature, hence the Holy Spirit is the author of them, and they are also effectual, the effectual working of His Power in them Eph 3:7

7 Whereof I was made a minister, according to the gift of the grace of God given unto me by the effectual working of his power. Cp with Eph 4:7

7 But unto every one of us is given grace according to the measure of the gift of Christ.

Now He received these Gifts, in the Person of the Holy Spirit, to give to His Members, His Church that He died for as their Covenant Head and Shepherd; In Fact, Christ Himself is the Gift of God, for all those the Father gave Him Jn 17:2

2 As thou hast given him power over all flesh, that he should give eternal life to as many as thou hast given him.

They were given before the World began, in order that in due time they are to believe in Him. So it is written that to some, that it has been given [Them] not only to believe on Him but also to suffer Phil 1:29

29 For unto you it is given in the behalf of Christ, not only to believe on him, but also to suffer for his sake; Cp Eph 4:7

And to those it is commanded to believe on the name of the Son of God 1 Jn 3:23

23 And this is his commandment, That we should believe on the name of his Son Jesus Christ, and love one another, as he gave us commandment.

To Believe on the Name of the Son of God, because He was given to them for that Purpose Jn 3:16 because He redeemed them from death, by His Death in their behalf !

beloved57
August 18th, 2012, 05:44 PM
Rom 4:25

25 Who was delivered for our offences, and was raised again for our justification.

He was raised again for our Justification, meaning this, The Resurrection of Christ did rightly signify, that as our Surety and Head, when He died with our sins charged to Him, that He was actually Justified from all those sins of the Elect of God charged upon Him, and as the Head is declared Justified by His Resurrection from the dead, so is His Body, the Church. He rose from the dead not as a private person, but as the Shepherd of His Flock Heb 13:20

20 Now the God of peace, that brought again from the dead our Lord Jesus, that great shepherd of the sheep, through the blood of the everlasting covenant,

Now if we preach not this Resurrection, we do Preach another Christ, for to say that none of the members of the Head Christ are not Justified before they believe, is like saying the Head of those members is not Justified before God until all His members believe, which is absurd and a attempt to overthrow the blessed significance of Christ's Resurrection, which also subverts His accomplishment by His Death !

beloved57
August 21st, 2012, 07:46 PM
Rom 4:25

25 Who was delivered for our offences, and was raised again for our justification.

When the Lord Jesus Christ was delivered up for the offences of all those given to Him in Election, and bore their sins in His Body on the Tree, He did meet all the Judicial demands of the law [ on their behalf ] and having satisfied, made propitiation to the Righteous Wrath of God, He was Raised from the Dead as the Great Shepherd of the Sheep Heb 13:20

20 Now the God of peace, that brought again from the dead our Lord Jesus, that great shepherd of the sheep, through the blood of the everlasting covenant,

They, the Sheep were raised up together with Him to Justification of Life Rom 5:18

18 Therefore as by the offence of one judgment came upon all men to condemnation; even so by the righteousness of one the free gift came upon all men unto justification of life.

And so He was raised again because of their Justification, and to deny this is to deny the Gospel !

beloved57
August 24th, 2012, 06:17 AM
Rom 5:18

18 Therefore, as through one man’s offense judgment came to all men, resulting in condemnation, even so through one Man’s righteous act the free gift came to all men, resulting in justification of life

The Justification that the Resurrection of Jesus Christ gave witness to and evidence of in Rom 4:25

25 who was delivered up because of our offenses, and was raised because of our justification.

And that is Justification of Life ! That is the effect that Christ's Death alone produces. It comes through one man's righteous act, Now to deny this is to deny the Gospel of free grace salvation.

And no, ,the all men here does not mean all men without exception, but the all men whom Christ had given to Him by the Father, or the Church of which He was the Head of !

beloved57
August 25th, 2012, 06:20 PM
Jn 6:33

33 For the bread of God is he which cometh down from heaven, and giveth life unto the world.

The Lord Jesus Christ's coming into the World was by Covenant engagement,m the Everlasting Covenant, the results of which would be to give life unto the World, this is not a offer of life, nor is it merely making life available if only we would accept it or no, but it is a communication of Life, and that a Spiritual Life, a Covenant Life as Per Mal 2:5

My covenant was with him of life and peace; and I gave them to him for the fear wherewith he feared me, and was afraid before my name.

John Gill says of this verse:




My covenant was with him of life and peace…
Not with Aaron, nor with Phinehas; nor is it to be understood of a covenant, promising temporal life and outward prosperity to either of them; Aaron living a hundred and twenty three years, (Numbers 33:39) and Phinehas, according to some Jewish writers, above three hundred years, which they gather from (Judges 20:28) but of the covenant made with Christ from everlasting, called "a covenant of life", because it was made with Christ the Word of life, who was with the Father from all eternity, and in time was made manifest in the flesh; and was made in behalf of persons ordained to eternal life, and in which that was promised and given to them in him; and in which it was agreed that he should become man, and lay down his life as such, that they might enjoy it: and it is called a "covenant of peace", because the scheme of peace and reconciliation was drawn in it, and agreed unto; Christ was appointed in it to be the Peacemaker; and in consequence of which he was sent to procure peace, and he has made it by the blood of his cross: and this covenant may be said to have been and to be "with him"; because it was made with him from all eternity, as the head and representative of his people, and he had all the blessings and promises of it put into his hands; and it stands fast with him, and will do so for evermore. And I gave them to him;
namely, the blessings of life and peace; eternal life is the gift of God; and not only the promise of it, but that itself, was given to Christ in covenant for his people, and a power to give it to as many as the Father gave to him, (Psalms 21:4) (2 Timothy 1:1) (1 John 5:12) (John 17:2) he gave him also peace to make, put this work of peacemaking into his hand; and he allows it to be made by him, and that it is rightly effected; and from his blood and righteousness peace springs to his people; and they enjoy peace in him and through him, yea, all prosperity and happiness:



This Covenant Life of ours was with and in Christ from the beginning Jn 1:4

4 In him was life; and the life was the light of men.

1 Jn 1:1-2

That which was from the beginning, which we have heard, which we have seen with our eyes, which we have looked upon, and our hands have handled, of the Word of life;

2 (For the life was manifested, and we have seen it, and bear witness, and shew unto you that eternal life, which was with the Father, and was manifested unto us )

Now the basis for all whom this Life belonged to, and of them receiving of it, was His giving His Life in the stead of theirs Jn 6:51

51 I am the living bread which came down from heaven: if any man eat of this bread, he shall live for ever: and the bread that I will give is my flesh, which I will give for the life of the world.

Christ giving His Life by Covenant arrangement, entails that those He died in behalf of, that they receive Life, [a communication or quickening] Life from Him !

beloved57
August 26th, 2012, 08:46 PM
1 Tim 2:10

10 But is now made manifest by the appearing of our Saviour Jesus Christ, who hath abolished death, and hath brought life and immortality to light through the gospel:

The Death of Christ solely abolished death apart from any subsequent work of the Spirit. He has abolished death for each person He died for. And for this meritorious cause, each person He died for receives Life as a Free Gift from New Birth or Quickening which is a subsequent work of the Spirit because of His meritorious death !

Each Person that Christ died for has been delivered by His Death from Death Spiritual, Death Physical in that if they die it ushers them into the prescience of Him that died for them 2 Cor 5:8 and Phil 1:23

And the Second Death or Eternal Death ! Its impossible for anyone Christ died for to remain dead in trespasses and sins, so we read Eph 2:5

5 Even when we were dead in sins, hath quickened us together with Christ, (by grace ye are saved )

That saved Grace by which He tasted Death fir every man or son Heb 2:9-10

beloved57
August 27th, 2012, 07:43 AM
2 Cor 5:21

21 For he hath made him to be sin for us, who knew no sin; that we might be made the righteousness of God in him.

Whenever we see the word that, hina, it is stating the Divine Purpose, and here it is stating that purpose for which Christ was made sin for those He died for, it was so they could be made Righteous !

The word made is the greek word ginomai which means:

to become, i.e. [B]to come into existence, begin to be, receive being

2) to become, i.e. to come to pass, happen

a) of events

3) to arise, appear in history, come upon the stage

a) of men appearing in public

4) to be made, finished

a) of miracles, to be performed, wrought

5) to become, be made


The Idea here is that of being made a New Creation, A New Man as this Eph 4:24

And that ye put on the new man, which after God is created in righteousness and true holiness.

Yes, this is result of Christ being made sin for those He died, that they would be made a New Creation, to receive a New Being to the Glory of God through Jesus Christ, and so it is written of these Isa 43:7

Even every one that is called by my name: for I have created him for my glory, I have formed him; yea, I have made him.

This statement is based upon Christ's Work here 2 Cor 5:21

21 For he hath made him to be sin for us, who knew no sin; that we might be made the righteousness of God in him.

beloved57
August 27th, 2012, 03:52 PM
The Reason why those Christ died for must be made a New Creation, is because His Death for them satisfied the Law and Justice of God on behalf of them, which declares them Justified and Righteous before Him, and His Righteousness laid to their Charge demands Life ! As the old proverb states Prov 12:28

In the way of righteousness [Christ's Imputed] is life: and in the pathway thereof there is no death.

Thats also why Paul writes Rom 5:18

Therefore as by the offence of one judgment came upon all men to condemnation; even so by the righteousness of one the free gift came upon all men unto justification of life.

The word life here is in the genitive case describing what kind of Justification it is, It possesses Life or it brings Life or effects Life, Spiritual Life, Quickening Life !

So the effects of Christ's Death goes beyond declaring us Righteous before God, but it also provides by Quickening, making us experientially Righteous, John Rights 1 Jn 3:7

Little children, let no man deceive you: he that doeth righteousness is righteous, even as he is righteous.

Doing Righteousness here is believing on the Lord Jesus Christ. In fact, everyone doing Righteousness had been made Righteous 2 Cor 5:21.

Jesus Christ was made sin for us [ The Church ], so that [stating purpose] we may become experientially Righteous. Paul teaches that also here Rom 5:19b

19 For as by one man's disobedience many were made sinners, so by the obedience of one shall many be made[experientially] righteous.

Just like all who were in Adam in his disobedience were made [experientially] sinners !!

This Truth is what all the antichrist followers deny and do not understand, but this is the Gospel of the Kingdom of God. Christ's death or being made sin was not to make salvation and conversion merely possible, but that it would effect conversion, experiential salvation and to begin a Life that is dedicated for the Honor of God, to Worship Him in Spirit and Truth, that kind of worshiper did the Father desire Jn 4:23

23 But the hour cometh, and now is, when the true worshipers shall worship the Father in spirit and in truth: for the Father seeketh such to worship him.

And this end is accomplished by 2 Cor 5:21

21 For he hath made him to be sin for us, who knew no sin; that we might be made the righteousness of God in him.

beloved57
August 28th, 2012, 09:20 AM
The inevitable results of Christ's Obedience !

Just as by ones man's disobedience, those that he federally represented, were made actually disobedient See Paul's statement to the Elect here Titus 3:3

For we ourselves also were sometimes foolish, disobedient, deceived, serving divers lusts and pleasures, living in malice and envy, hateful, and hating one another.

So likewise, by one mans obedience, those He federally represented shall be made actually obedient !

Rom 5:19

19 For as by one man's disobedience many were made sinners, so by the obedience of one shall many be made righteous.

beloved57
September 8th, 2012, 07:30 PM
1 Pet 2:24

24 Who his own self bare our sins in his own body on the tree, that we, being dead to sins, should live unto righteousness: by whose stripes ye were healed.

The End of Christ's Death, the bearing of Our Sins on the Tree, not for everyone but for His Elect 1 Pet 1:1-2, the end design was that we may Live unto Righteousness or to Live by Faith, now if this end was not obtained in this life, for everyone Christ bared their sins, His death was a failure to the Purpose of God, but if it was not a failure, which it was not, then all who die in their sins and meet with eternal damnation Matt 25:41, He did not bear their sins on in His Body on the Tree !

beloved57
September 9th, 2012, 02:09 AM
We know that Christ's Death is efficacious for all whom He died by this Blessed Passage of the Covenant Heb 9:15-17

15 And for this cause he is the mediator of the new testament, that by means of death, for the redemption of the transgressions that were under the first testament, they which are called might receive the promise of eternal inheritance.

16 For where a testament is, there must also of necessity be the death of the testator.

17 For a testament is of force after men are dead: otherwise it is of no strength at all while the testator liveth.

In one of the ways this Covenental Death takes effect, is because the Mediator of it, the Lord Jesus Christ Vs 15 has risen from the dead to be the executor of it [apply its benefits], for He being exalted to be a Prince and Saviour Acts 5:31, He therefore dispenses with the benefits of His Covenantal Death, which includes giving Repentance and Remission of sins to His Elect [Israel of God] and in this way His death takes effect. These blessed effects were foretold here in this prophecy Isa 53:10-11

10 Yet it pleased the Lord to bruise him; he hath put him to grief: when thou shalt make his soul an offering for sin, he shall see his seed, he shall prolong his days, and the pleasure of the Lord shall prosper in his hand.

11 He shall see of the travail of his soul, and shall be satisfied: by his knowledge shall my righteous servant justify many; for he shall bear their iniquities.

By it stating " The pleasure of the Lord shall prosper in His Hand", this means for all whom He died, all the Father desired to be saved and come to a knowledge of the Truth 1 Tim 2:4, this prospered in His Hand and was accomplished !

beloved57
September 11th, 2012, 08:14 AM
Christ in being a Saviour, does not make Salvation possible, for that is only to be a possible Saviour, which is no Saviour at all, but He is Actually a Saviour,no not to everyone in the World, for that was never God's Promise, but to Israel, a elect people out of every tribe and kindred.

The promise is that Israel shall be saved Isa 45:17

But Israel shall be saved in the LORD with an everlasting salvation: ye shall not be ashamed nor confounded world without end.

Israel here means God's Elect from amongst jew and gentile.

Paul preached that according to PROMISE God hath raised up a Saviour Unto Israel Acts 13:23

23 Of this man's seed hath God according to his promise raised unto Israel a Saviour, Jesus:

Folks, Jesus came only to save a elect people name Israel Matt 1:21

21 And she shall bring forth a son, and thou shalt call his name Jesus: for he shall save his people[Israel] from their sins.

Now notice what Paul preached in Acts 13:23, that these same words did apply to some gentiles, we know from vs 42

42 And when the Jews were gone out of the synagogue, the Gentiles besought that these words might be preached to them the next sabbath.

The words of Acts 13:23, simply because they too partake of the Promises of the Gospel to Israel Eph 3:6

That the Gentiles should be fellowheirs, and of the same body, and partakers of his promise in Christ by the gospel:

What are the promises in Christ by the Gospel ? Well its promises like Isa 45:17

17 But Israel shall be saved in the Lord with an everlasting salvation: ye shall not be ashamed nor confounded world without end.

Yes, that was a mystery back then, that the gentiles would be fellowheirs of that Gospel promise to Israel.

So Christ as the risen Saviour gives Repentance to Israel His Elect Acts 5:31 and Acts 11:18

Those gentiles of Acts 11:18 are fellowheirs with the Israel of Acts 5:31.

So all for whom Christ died, His Israel, are given Repentance unto life ! Thats why He is a Saviour unto them !

beloved57
September 12th, 2012, 12:45 PM
What is repentance ? In short repentance is no more than the redeemed sinner being experientially reconcile to God, and this reconciliation is given or bestowed upon all for whom Christ died Col 1:21-22

21 And you, that were sometime alienated and enemies in your mind by wicked works, yet now hath he reconciled

22 In the body of his flesh through death, to present you holy and unblameable and unreproveable in his sight:

This reconciliation also is through Christ's death as that in Rom 5:10 was, the difference being this. The reconciliation in Rom 5:10 was God being reconciled to is Apostate people even while they are being enemies, and it is promised there, that they shall e saved by His Life, well here in 1 Col 1:21 is the fulfillment of that promise, and what Christ does here to save us, is reconcile us to God and He does away with that enmity that was in our minds by wicked works, of which constituted us enemies Rom 5:10, so basically, we have recorded between Rom 5:10 and Col 1:20 the full effect of Christ's Reconciling Death !

Col 1:20 is actually expressive of one being given repentance toward God,and again it is the effect of Christ's reconciling death, and to deny Christ's Death this accomplishment for everyone He died, is antichrist, plain and simple !

beloved57
September 15th, 2012, 12:07 PM
The Lord Jesus Christ Gives, not offer, or make available, Life [Spiritual] to the World [ Church or the World of His Sheep, both jew and gentile Sheep ! ] !

Jn 6:33

33 For the bread of God is he which cometh down from heaven, and giveth life unto the world. That is He is giving if forth from Himself, as the quickening Spirit 1 Cor 15:45

45 And so it is written, The first man Adam was made a living soul; the last Adam was made a quickening spirit.

The word quickening is the greek word zōopoieō and means:


to produce alive, begat or bear living young

2) to cause to live, make alive, give life

a) by spiritual power to arouse and invigorate

b) to restore to life

c) to give increase of life: thus of physical life

d) of the spirit, quickening as respects the spirit, endued with new and greater powers of life

3) metaph., of seeds quickened into life, i.e. germinating, springing up, growing

So He became a Life giving Spirit, by sending the Holy Spirit to give Life to His Church !

Now because Christ by dying this Covenant Death for the World He is to save Matt 26:28, the World He died for is given Life, life from the Spiritual Dead, for this must be so, for He states this Purpose Jn 10:10

10 The thief cometh not, but for to steal, and to kill, and to destroy: I am come that they might have or receive life, and that they might have it more abundantly.

All for whom Christ will be by His Resurrection or because of it, begotten again unto a Lively Hope !

1 Pet 1:3

3 Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, which according to his abundant mercy hath begotten us again unto a lively hope by the resurrection of Jesus Christ from the dead,

This begotten again is the greek anagennaō and means:


to produce again, be born again, born anew

2) metaph. to have one's mind changed so that he lives a new life and one conformed to the will of God

They produced again into a new Life. This corresponds with Him being a Life giving Spirit 1 Cor 15:45 and that is how He fulfills what is said in Jn 6:33

33 For the bread of God is he which cometh down from heaven, and giveth life unto the world.

He gives it through New Birth to each member of that World !

beloved57
September 17th, 2012, 05:14 PM
Heb 10:14 By one offering he hath perfected for ever



Heb 10:14

14 For by one offering he hath perfected for ever them that are sanctified.

It must be also that all for whom Christ died, by His Offering alone, apart from any work of the Spirit on them or in them, that by this one One Offering, they are Justified forever, because by it they are perfected forever, and within this perfection there is not one of their sins not punished in Christ for them, to include the sin of unbelief !

The word perfected here means:

to make perfect, complete

to carry through completely, to accomplish, finish, bring to an end

to complete (perfect)

add what is yet wanting in order to render a thing full

to be found perfect to bring to the end (goal) proposed

to accomplish

bring to a close or fulfilment by event

of the prophecies of the scriptures

Now remember, the Author is speaking about the Effects of the Death of Christ, and that it [Christ's Offering alone] Perfected those who are sanctified.

Now what does this mean ?

It means that Christ has perfectly fulfilled the Law for them ! He obeyed all of its Precepts Perfectly, not for Himself, but for them, Before God's Law and Justice !

Next, He has perfectly atoned for their sins, took them out of the way,absolved them before God's Law and Justice, perfectly.Cleansed them as Per Heb 1:3

3 Who being the brightness of his glory, and the express image of his person, and upholding all things by the word of his power, when he had by himself purged our sins, sat down on the right hand of the Majesty on high:

Also, He obtained forgiveness of all our sins ,Perfectly, past, present and future, for all the Elect of all time !

We have by virtue of His Offering been Justified from all things Acts 13:39

And by him all that believe are justified from all things, from which ye could not be justified by the law of Moses.

Not their believing Justified them from all things, But Christ, by His Offering, which we come to believe when that fact is Revealed to us !

All this was accomplished solely by the Offering of Christ for all whom He died, before and apart from but not to omit or cast aside, the Work of the Spirit and the Faith of the Believer !

beloved57
September 18th, 2012, 08:14 AM
Heb 10:14 By one offering he hath perfected for ever, which includes the doing away with unbelief !

The Antichrist teachers, many of them teach that Christ did not die for the sin of unbelief, but that is another lie. If Christ did not die for that sin, and believing in Christ is something man does apart from Christ's satisfying God's law and Justice on our behalf for our sins, then we are saved by something we did apart from the atonement of Christ's satisfaction, if its true that Christ did not die for unbelief !

However, the sin of unbelief along with all other sins have been paid for by Christ's Death for all whom He died, and they are before God's Law and Justice perfected forever !

For unbelief did not prevent Paul from being saved by Christ's Death from His Testimony here 1 Tim 1:12-16


12 And I thank Christ Jesus our Lord, who hath enabled me, for that he counted me faithful, putting me into the ministry;

13 Who was before a blasphemer, and a persecutor, and injurious: but I obtained mercy, because I did it ignorantly in unbelief.

14 And the grace of our Lord was exceeding abundant with faith and love which is in Christ Jesus.

15 This is a faithful saying, and worthy of all acceptation, that Christ Jesus came into the world to save sinners; of whom I am chief.

16 Howbeit for this cause I obtained mercy, that in me first Jesus Christ might shew forth all longsuffering, for a pattern to them which should hereafter believe on him to life everlasting.

Paul testifies to the Grace of God saving Him out of and in spite of His Ignorance and Unbelief, which all of God's Elect are in at first Rom 11:32

32 For God hath concluded them all[The Elect] in unbelief, that he might have mercy upon all.

But back to Heb 10:14, by His Death [alone] He hath perfected [perfect passive participle] forever all whom are being sanctified, that are in a sanctified state ! This means that everyone Christ died for, that even though as others by nature, they are children of wrath, nevertheless unlike them, they are at the same time in a state of sanctification by Christ's Blood Heb 10:10, for the passover Lamb has been slain for them. They are all like Jeremiah 1:5 He was sanctified before he came out of his Mothers womb by the Purpose of God, but that said, he was still born like other men of his day, by nature a child of wrath, a sinner, and needed to be experientially reconciled to God like this Col 1:21

21 And you, that were sometime alienated and enemies in your mind by wicked works, yet now hath he reconciled !

All of God's Elect will experience this reconciliation because of the perfection of the Death of Christ which this is the fruit of !

beloved57
September 25th, 2012, 05:25 PM
1 Pet 2:24

24 Who his own self bare our sins in his own body on the tree, that we, being dead to sins, should live unto righteousness: by whose stripes ye were healed.

By His Stripes ye are Healed. The Death of Christ here is clearly stated by the inspired writer, the Apostle to be the Sole and Meritorious Cause of Being Healed. That is His Stripes provided the Eternal Benefit of perfectly Healing those whom Christ died for from all sin in God's Sight ! Col 1:22

In the body of his flesh through death, to present you holy and unblameable and unreproveable in his sight:

Thats why by His Death alone He hath Perfected forever they who are sanctified Heb 10:14

14 For by one offering he hath perfected for ever them that are sanctified.

This is by ONE OFFERING, not by the Work of the Spirit, but BY the OFFERING of His Body , when He bare Our sins in His Own Body on the Tree 1 Pet 2:24.

The Healing is also pointed out by the OT writer who was shown the Covenant benefit of the Death of Christ Ps 103:2-3

Bless the Lord, O my soul, and forget not all his benefits:

3 Who forgiveth all thine iniquities; who healeth all thy diseases;

Yes, that is a benefit of the Death of Christ alone, for those He died for, all their sins are forgiven, a clean slate, as though they never sinned.

Remission of sins is by the Blood of Christ alone before God's Sight !

Those false teachers who teach that Christ death in and of itself does not Justify one or that its Worthless, they are not of God !

beloved57
September 30th, 2012, 12:25 AM
The Lord Jesus Christ's death is a saving Death, the benefits of His redeeming gives both Faith and Repentance to those He died for, His Church. That Faith is a gift of God given by Christ to those that He saves, that He is their Saviour, it is seen in that He gives Repentance to Israel, His Elect out of both jews and gentiles Acts 5:31

31 Him hath God exalted with his right hand to be a Prince and a Saviour, for to give repentance to Israel, and forgiveness of sins.

You see that ? God exalted Him with His Right Hand, TO BE A PRINCE AND SAVIOUR, for to GIVE REPENTANCE !

Folks Christ is not a Saviour without giving Repentance to Israel and not just ethnic jews, but that Israel of God made up of both jews and gentiles Acts 11:18

18 When they heard these things, they held their peace, and glorified God, saying, Then hath God also to the Gentiles granted repentance unto life.

Now in this sense Repentance and Faith are the same, Two sides of one Coin, for Repentance in its widest significance is a change of mind, and then embracing something that has been newly revealed, in which case, True Repentance is a changing of our mind from seeking salvation by our own righteousness, our works and conditions, and embracing the Righteousness of God being made known to one from Faith to Faith through the Gospel Rom 1:16-17

16 For I am not ashamed of the gospel of Christ: for it is the power of God unto salvation to every one that believeth; to the Jew first, and also to the Greek.

17 For therein is the righteousness of God revealed from faith to faith: as it is written, The just shall live by faith.

So when scripture states that God gives Repentance or the Saviour Christ gives Repentance, Faith is automatically included or its not genuine Repentance, and so the Apostles often Preached both hand and hand Acts 20:21

21 Testifying both to the Jews, and also to the Greeks, repentance toward God, and faith toward our Lord Jesus Christ.

Because these both were given to those being saved by the Cross !

rondonn
October 1st, 2012, 08:00 AM
The original gospel was about the Divine Kingdom. Christ used the term Kingdom over 35 times. Can you find atonement in his gospel?

Seek ye first the Kingdom of God, and first mean first. So that is why I am bringing up this question.

Can you find the at-one-ment in what we do first?

I do see it in there, but I want to see if anyone else can find it first. (hint: keep in mind, this is atonement before the cross)

beloved57
October 5th, 2012, 08:57 AM
ron


The original gospel was about the Divine Kingdom.

Which Christ establishes through His Redemptive Death. Its a Spiritual Kingdom !

beloved57
October 5th, 2012, 10:23 AM
Isa 42:6-7

6 I the Lord have called thee in righteousness, and will hold thine hand, and will keep thee, and give thee for a covenant of the people, for a light of the Gentiles;

7 To open the blind eyes, to bring out the prisoners from the prison, and them that sit in darkness out of the prison house.


Christ's Covenental Death, for all the Covenant People, which are all those the Father gave Him Per Jn 17:2

2 As thou hast given him power over all flesh, that he should give eternal life to as many as thou hast given him.

And to these it says "and give thee for a covenant of the people,"

These are also the Children of Promise Rom 9:8, now to them, He delivers them all from the prison of unbelief, for that is the promise here indicated in this scripture, because unbelief is a prison, and all for whom Christ died must be brought out of that Prison.

Unbelief is a Prison we know from Paul's statement regarding God's Judgment against the Elect for sin, He concluded them all in Unbelief Rom 11:32

32 For God hath concluded them all in or into unbelief, that he might have mercy upon all.

The key here is the meaning of the word concluded ! It is the greek word sygkleiō and means:


to shut up together, enclose

a) of a shoal of fishes in a net

2) to shut up on all sides, shut up completely

Notice, to shut up on all sides or to enclose !

It means:

to shut or hem in; close in on all sides

Of course the idea conveyed is to confine or to imprison, and so it is , all the elect are by nature imprisoned, confined, enclosed in unbelief.

God is the primary and first cause of this as stated in Rom 11:32, but God also employs satan as a secondary cause, the god and prince of this world, and so it is written of him 2 Cor 4:3-4a

3 But if our gospel be hid, it is hid to them that are lost:

4 In whom the god of this world hath blinded the minds of them which believe not,

All by nature are shut into unbelief by satan and the blindness of the mind he causes by the permission or will of God See Eph 4:18 also !

However, everyone Christ died for, His Covenental and Redemptive Death, by His Blood, has opened blind eyes and brought out the prisoners from the prison of unbelief !

The word prison in Isa 42:7 is the hebrew word macger and means:

a shutting up, locksmith, smith, dungeon, enclosure, builder of bulwarks

Christ's Redeeming Covenental Death for His People brings all for whom He died out of the prison, the enclosure of unbelief which they are in by nature.

So if any that Christ died for remain in unbelief, and never come to saving Faith in Christ, that would mean that satan, the god of this world, was victorious over Christ and His Blood, and God's justice being satisfied for that one did not release them from the prison of unbelief ! That means that satan was stronger than Christ; And many right today, who call themselves Gospel Preachers, they would tell us that a great many for whom Christ died, will died or remain in unbelief.

It should go without saying, that all such preachers and professing christians are liars and are ignorant to the Accomplishments of Christ's Covenental Death !

Zech 9:11

As for thee also, by the blood of thy covenant I have sent forth thy prisoners out of the pit wherein is no water.

beloved57
October 20th, 2012, 08:08 PM
Acts 5:31

31 Him hath God exalted with his right hand to be a Prince and a Saviour, for to give repentance to Israel, and forgiveness of sins.

What does it mean to Give Repentance and Forgiveness of Sins here ? It means for Christ gives His People forgiveness or remission of sins, that is an Spiritual Application of it to the conscious, by giving s Spiritual Knowledge of it Lk 1:77

77 To give knowledge of salvation unto his people by the remission of their sins,

Now the Word give here in both is the greek word didōmi and means:


to give

2) to give something to someone

a) of one's own accord to give one something, to his advantage

1) to bestow a gift

b) to grant, give to one asking, let have

c) to supply, furnish, necessary things

d) to give over, deliver

1) to reach out, extend, present

2) of a writing

3) to give over to one's care, intrust, commit

a) something to be administered

To administer something or to apply something ! So Christ gives by application or by applying Salvation and the Knowledge of Remission of sins.

Until it is made known to them so that so that they receive it by Faith, they are ignorant of it, or it is a Mystery ! However because of Covenant Engagement of Christ on their behalf, they always had an interest in Christ's Blood which is for their Remission of Sins Eph 1:7

7 In whom we have redemption through his blood, the forgiveness or remission of sins, according to the riches of his grace;

So receiving remission of sins in the time state by God given Faith is but receiving God's Act of Remission from Eternity !

beloved57
November 2nd, 2012, 03:31 AM
What the death of Christ accomplished of its own merit for all those that He offered Himself in behalf of Heb 10:14

14 For by one offering[His Death] he hath perfected for ever them that are sanctified.

Knowing this Truth is very important especially in light of the modern day of blasphemy of many false teachers who tell us #1 That Christ's death or offering in and of itself saves no one, which is blasphemy 1 Pet 2:24 and those who say Christ's death in and of itself, without the work of the Spirit is worthless, another blasphemy !

We must however embrace what the scripture says about what Christ's death or offering did accomplish for those Christ died for in and of itself: And here in this context of Heb 10, we are told that it [His Death or offering] perfected forever those whom are sanctified, or as the greek may indicate, those who are in a state of sanctification !

Anyone Christ died for, by virtue of His Death, even though sinners by nature as others, are nevertheless born in this world already sanctified or set apart for the holy purposes of God, this is also True because of what it states a few verses ahead in the context in Heb 10:10

10 By the which will we are sanctified through the offering of the body of Jesus Christ once for all.

Here we are enlighten that it was also the death or offering of Christ that did sanctify those He died for once and for all, that was legal sanctification, which will in God's Time manifest itself into subjective sanctification, because all whom are legally sanctified by the blood of Christ or His Death, must also be given life by the Spirit, which is also Sanctification of the Spirit 2 Thess 2:13

13 But we are bound to give thanks alway to God for you, brethren beloved of the Lord, because God hath from the beginning chosen you to salvation through sanctification of the Spirit and belief of the truth:

All of which is the fruit of Christ's death that perfected all for whom He died, so the follow up work of the Spirit is an evidence of the Great Worth and accomplishment of Christ's Death!

Also in the legal aspect alone of this perfection of Heb 10:14 is meant, that all for whom Christ died are made complete in Him, not in themselves Col 2:10

And ye are complete in him, which is the head of all principality and power:

Also it meant that not one sin of theirs has God not been propitiated for forever ! They are freed from sin forever by Christ's offering ! Rom 6:7

For he that is dead [died in Union with Christ] is freed from sin. Note: Christ could not have died for our sins if we were not in Union legally with Him !


This is a legal term, the word freed here is the greek word dikaioō:


to render righteous or such he ought to be

2) to show, exhibit, evince, one to be righteous, such as he is and wishes himself to be considered

3) to declare, pronounce, one to be just, righteous, or such as he ought to be

This offering was not for all in the World without exception, but is qualified to only those who are set apart or sanctified legally and then experimentally, and this perfect is True of all of God's Elect before its fruition or realization by the one perfected by Christ death, meaning, if Christ was to tarry another 25 years, and Elect are born physically into this world within those years as sinners and enemies by nature, they have been still legally perfected forever by Christ's death or Offering,and they are assured of being sanctified experimentally by the Spirit 2 Thess 2:13, solely because of Christ's Death alone perfecting them before God's law and Justice !

beloved57
November 22nd, 2012, 08:39 AM
Jesus said to Nicodemus Jn 3:7

Marvel not that I said unto thee, Ye must be born again.

And this is True of everyone that Christ was made sin for 2 Cor 5:21

21 For he hath made him to be sin for us, who knew no sin; that we might be made the righteousness of God in him.

This because, Christ's Death that makes all for whom He died Righteous before God, it demands that they be made Righteous experientially with a communicated principle of Holiness in them, of which without, no man shall see the Lord Heb 12:14

14 Follow peace with all men,[B] and holiness, without which no man shall see the Lord:

This Holiness is the imparted or communicated Righteousness of Christ received at New Birth !

Now that Christ's Death for those He died for does effect for them the New Birth, or their Conversion is taught in many scriptures, and particularly here 2 Cor 5:21,19

21 For he hath made him to be sin for us, who knew no sin; that we might be made the righteousness of God in him.

The fact that He was made sin for them, that is a sin offering, by God charging all their sins, trespasses upon Him, for remember God did not impute their trespasses or sins upon them Vs 19 and the stated outcome of this was for them [whose sins were imputed or charged to Christ] might be made the Righteousness of God in Him !

Now the word made is interesting, it is the greek word ginomai and its the aorist subjunctive [denoting purpose because of the conjunction hina] which means to come into existence, am born,it denotes a transitioning from one condition to another See [ Jn 5:24] a conversion, So this is speaking of the imparted Righteousness of Christ they receive in their New Birth, for it also makes them a New Man Created as in Eph 4:24

24 And that ye put on the new man, which after God is created in righteousness and true holiness.

Yes, thats the Righteousness spoken of to be made to them in 2 Cor 5:21

Thats why the verb ginomai is very relevant with its " come into existence or being meaning", which also the word created denotes !

Also God only makes them experientially Righteous with New Birth whom He made objectively Righteous by Imputation of Christ's Righteousness, which was from Christ's obedience or death Rom 5:19b, this compliments 2 Cor 5:21 !

So if anyone Christ died for does not become experientially Righteous, and receive of the Holiness by which without none shall see the Lord in peace, then His Death was a failure within the Purpose of God !

beloved57
December 12th, 2012, 05:04 PM
Heb 1:3

3 Who being the brightness of his glory, and the express image of his person, and upholding all things by the word of his power, when he had by himself purged our sins, sat down on the right hand of the Majesty on high:

See Ps 65:3; 79:9

All for whom Christ died, they have no sins for God to charge against them, yes even before they believe, because all their sins were laid to the charge of Christ, and He bore them on His Cross 1 Pet 2:24, and having done so, He purged them away from before God's Law and Justice Heb 1:3.

Now for this to have been the case, they through His Offering, have no sins recorded against them against God's Law charged against them Col 2:14

14 Blotting out the handwriting of ordinances that was against us, which was contrary to us, and took it out of the way, nailing it to his cross;

For sin is the transgression of the law, and the strength of sin [its right to be called sin] is the Law 1 Cor 15:56, so hence by the purging of our sins [if He died for us], we have been totally exonerated before God, as if we never sinned, and yes this is the case before we become believers, and is the reason we become believers ! Because the Just shall live by Faith ! And all for whom Christ died are declared Just , for there are sins charged against them before God's Law and Justice, they have been taken out the Way !

beloved57
December 31st, 2012, 02:14 PM
Rom 5:1

Therefore being justified by faith, we have peace with God through our Lord Jesus Christ:

This scripture by moving a comma will read:

Therefore being justified, by faith we have peace with God through our Lord Jesus Christ:

In other words the Peace we have with God by Christ's Death is revealed to Faith !

Jesus made Peace with God for those He died for, this Peace we have nothing to do with in having it, for it was secured for us by Christ's Death / Blood Col 1:20

20 And, having made peace through the blood of his cross, by him to reconcile all things unto himself; by him, I say, whether they be things in earth, or things in heaven.

This Peace with God was made for those Christ died for through His Blood, and this while we ourselves were being enemies Rom 5:10. This legal Peace of Col 1:20 is the same as the legal reconciliation of Rom 5:10, for Reconciliation was the result of peace being accomplished by the Cross.

This Peace and Reconciliation by the Blood of Christ is not contingent on any act or behavior of men, but is solely an accomplished and established fact, that should be preached as such, hence Paul calls it the Gospel or Good News of Peace Eph 6:15

15 And your feet shod with the preparation of the gospel of peace;

For it rightly cannot be a Gospel of Peace, if its only a possibility of peace with God.

He Preached Peace unto you Eph 2:17

17 And came and preached peace to you which were afar off, and to them that were nigh.


Its not that peace is made available or has been offered you, those are words of false preachers and witnesses, however to all for whom Peace with God through Jesus Christ [His Blood] was accomplished for, God sees to it that Peace is preached unto them Rom 10:15

15 And how shall they preach, except they be sent? as it is written, How beautiful are the feet of them that preach the gospel of peace, and bring glad tidings of good things!

Now this Peace / Reconciliation is one of the many accomplishments of the Cross Work of Jesus Christ for His Church, God's Elect World !

beloved57
January 2nd, 2013, 10:35 PM
1 Cor 15:22

For as in Adam all die, even so in Christ shall all be made alive.

All for whom Christ died, was buried and rose again the third day in behalf of Shall be made Alive, That is receive resurrection life as Per 1 Pet 1:3

3 Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, which according to his abundant mercy hath begotten us again unto a lively hope by the resurrection of Jesus Christ from the dead

They shall be made alive by the New Birth and or quickening 1 Cor 15:45

45 And so it is written, The first man Adam was made a living soul; the last Adam was made a quickening spirit.

Thats why Jesus spake thusly Jn 12:24,32

24 Verily, verily, I say unto you, Except a corn of wheat fall into the ground and die, it abideth alone: but if it die, it bringeth forth much fruit or Life !

Jn 6:37

37 All that the Father giveth me shall come to me; and him that cometh to me I will in no wise cast out.

They come to Him because they have been given life.

Jesus said on another occasion this Jn 6:53

Then Jesus said unto them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, Except ye eat the flesh of the Son of man, and drink his blood, ye have no life in you.

Eating His flesh and drinking His Blood are activities of coming to Him, but if one doesn't come is evidence of no life in them, the flip said is if they do come its an evidence of Life in them ! That they have been made Alive by Christ !


32 And I, if I be lifted up from the earth[His Death], will draw[by giving life] all men unto me.

Princely
January 3rd, 2013, 09:01 AM
Scripture has it; "Blessed is He whose way is blameless who walks in the law of the Lord."

"Walk in my presence and be blameless."says the Lord.

"The words of the upright save them, but the speech of the wicked are a deadly ambush."

"Keep the commandments of the Lord by walking in His ways and revering Him."

"The Lord guides the humble to justice and He teaches the meek His way."

"Blessed are the meek, they shall inherit the land."

"The meek shall inherit the land , they will have abundant peace."

"Blessed is he who hears the word of the Lord and keeps it."

I know the Lord and I keep His word. I know Him because I come from Him. He sent me.

beloved57
January 3rd, 2013, 09:49 AM
prince


Scripture has it; "Blessed is He whose way is blameless who walks in the law of the Lord."

It does say that Ps 119:1

Blessed are the undefiled in the way, who walk in the law of the Lord.

I agree with that, however you have evaded dialoug on my previous posts 200-204

If you are going to debate what I have stated then show us first of all that you understand the points I am making. This thread is about what Christ has accomplished by HIS WORK not how a man should do or does something !

False Prophet
January 3rd, 2013, 10:10 AM
Ro 2:1 Therefore you have no excuse, O man, whoever you are, when you judge another; for in passing judgment upon him you condemn yourself, because you, the judge, are doing the very same things. Acceptance is the answer to all my problems. When I find fault with some person, place, or thing, it is because it does not please my self. If only everyone would act the way I wanted them to act, than my self world would be perfect in my eyes. If God created this world the way I would have created it, than this world would be heaven. But this is not a just and righteous world. May God remove my self centered egotistical outlook upon this world.

False Prophet
January 3rd, 2013, 01:01 PM
Ro 2 [2] We know that the judgment of God rightly falls upon those who do such things.
Living in spiritual bankruptcy allowed me to do others moral inventories. "It's them!" It was never me. It was always somebody else's fault. [3] Do you suppose, O man, that when you judge those who do such things and yet do them yourself, you will escape the judgment of God?
I have to learn to let go of my selfcentered interests. "I want it, and I want it now." If somebody else had it, then I would try to get it from them by any means. "He does such things, and I can justify myself by pointing fingers; even though I am doing the same things." What does God think about my behaviour? God is a god of love, but God is also a god of wrath. God will render to everybody according to what they have done. This does not excuse me from the judgment of God, even though I may think that I am better than anybody else.

Princely
January 3rd, 2013, 09:15 PM
prince



It does say that Ps 119:1

Blessed are the undefiled in the way, who walk in the law of the Lord.

I agree with that, however you have evaded dialoug on my previous posts 200-204

If you are going to debate what I have stated then show us first of all that you understand the points I am making. This thread is about what Christ has accomplished by HIS WORK not how a man should do or does something !

The only thing the anointed have ever done is to be an example of how to achieve eternal life and enter the kingdom of God. Jesus was not the only anointed but He did show us how to become anointed and born from above. Paul being a so called Jew thought like a Jew and did not understand because Judaism had already misguided him. In a way Christianity thinks like Judaism because they think there is only one man as the Messiah or anointed when in fact everyone must be anointed and born from above. The son of man is born from above and anointed with the spirit of God. The prophets of the Lord are son of man and anointed. We are One in the Lord.

Jesus and I are One. I am son of man. If you do not come to believe I am son of man and god you will surely die in your sin.

No one knows the son except the Father and no one knows the Father except the son and whoever the sons wishes reveal Him.

The son can only do what he sees the Father doing whatever the Father does the son does likewise for the Father loves the son and whatever he does He shows him.

Light dawns for the righteous and joy for the upright of heart.

Anyone who has seen me has seen the Lord who sent me.

beloved57
January 3rd, 2013, 10:37 PM
princely


The only thing the anointed have ever done is to be an example of how to achieve eternal life and enter the kingdom of God.

You teach another jesus !

Princely
January 3rd, 2013, 11:50 PM
princely



You teach another jesus !

Yes, I teach as Jesus because I am son of man, like Jesus but me. I am the light of the world.

The Lord of hosts says;

"Let the man who has my words speak my words and speak the truth."

"Speak the truth to one another, judge righteously, and let honesty and peace be at your gates."

"No one acts righteously, no one speaks truthfully, they refuse to recognize me says the Lord"

Genuine worshipers shall worship the Father in spirit and in truth

Father your word is truth.

Worship God alone. Him alone shall you serve.

The son of man will come at a time you least expect.

False Prophet
January 4th, 2013, 01:03 PM
they are justified by his grace as a gift, through the redemption which is in Christ Jesus, Ro 4
[25] whom God put forward as an expiation by his blood, to be received by faith. This was to show God's righteousness, because in his divine forbearance he had passed over former sins;
[26] it was to prove at the present time that he himself is righteous and that he justifies him who has faith in Jesus.
Looking up expiation: 1: the act of making atonement
2: the means by which atonement is made
Redemption is bought with a price, which is the price of blood that we receive by faith. This shows God's righteousness and divine forebearance in passing over my sins without judgment since my sins are many. God is righteous and he justifies him who has faith in Jesus. Justify: c : to judge, regard, or treat as righteous and worthy of salvation.

Princely
January 4th, 2013, 02:03 PM
they are justified by his grace as a gift, through the redemption which is in Christ Jesus, Ro 4
[25] whom God put forward as an expiation by his blood, to be received by faith. This was to show God's righteousness, because in his divine forbearance he had passed over former sins;
[26] it was to prove at the present time that he himself is righteous and that he justifies him who has faith in Jesus.
Looking up expiation: 1: the act of making atonement
2: the means by which atonement is made
Redemption is bought with a price, which is the price of blood that we receive by faith. This shows God's righteousness and divine forebearance in passing over my sins without judgment since my sins are many. God is righteous and he justifies him who has faith in Jesus. Justify: c : to judge, regard, or treat as righteous and worthy of salvation.

Everyone must atone for their own sin. Those who serve the Lord by doing what is right and just atone for their own sins. Those who refuse to serve the Lord are sinners.

Scripture and the Lord say; "Those who fear the Lord spoke with one another and the Lord listened intently and a book was opened and a record kept of those who revere the Lord and trust in His name. And I will have compassion on them as a man has compassion on his son who serves him. Then you will again see the distinction between the righteous and the wicked, between those who serve God and those who do not."

"By your words you'll be forgiven or by your words you'll be condemned."

Anyone who hears my words and does not keep them I am not the one who condemns him for I did not come to condemn the world but to save it. Anyone who rejects me and does not accept my words he already has his judge, namely the words I've spoken that is what condemns him on the last day.

The man who wants to come to me will hear my words and put them to use.

If you continue in my teaching you are truly my disciple, then you shall know the truth and the truth shall set you free.

Be perfect as your heavenly Father is perfect.

If you wish to be made perfect, follow me and declare the kingdom of God.

beloved57
January 6th, 2013, 04:08 AM
All those Christ died for, in the place of or in behalf of, and for their benefit, His Death kept them from perishing for their own sins ! This is clearly seen in what the High Priest uttered here by the inspiration of God Jn 11:50-51

Nor consider that it is expedient for us, that one man should die for the people, and that the whole nation perish not.

And this spake he not of himself: but being high priest that year, he prophesied that Jesus should die for that nation;

Its clearly indicated in Vs 50 that the outcome and purpose of the one man dying for that nation prevents the one's of that nation from perishing !

The word perish in Vs 50 is the greek word apollumi: to destroy, destroy utterly

Its the same word used in Jn 3:16

should not perish, but have

Also the word expedient in Vs 50 is the greek word sumphero: I collect, am profitable to

I bring together, collect; I am profitable to.

properly, combine in a way that brings a profit (gain), especially by a "concurrence of circumstances" that results in benefit or advancement (M. Vincent).

This means that Christ's Death would bring together, collect all into one the Children of God or the Sheep of God as is stated in Vs 52

52 And not for that nation only, but that also he should gather together in one the children of God that were scattered abroad.

That was the benefit of His Death , the profit of His Death, it was conducive in preventing all the Children of God or Sheep of God from Perishing in their sins !

If this passage is understood spiritually it shows that Christ's Death in and of itself saves from perishing those He died in behalf of !

beloved57
January 8th, 2013, 08:01 PM
Rom 7:4

4 Wherefore, my brethren, ye also are become dead to the law by the body of Christ; that ye should be married to another, even to him who is raised from the dead, that we should bring forth fruit unto God.


Another accomplishment of the Death of Christ in the Purpose of God, is that it will cause all for whom He died and was raised from the dead for, to bring forth fruit unto God. That fruit being both faith and repentance, repentance toward God and Faith in Jesus Christ Acts 20:21

21 Testifying both to the Jews, and also to the Greeks, repentance toward God, and faith toward our Lord Jesus Christ.

Both of these are but fruits of Christ's Death and Resurrection 1 Pet 1:3 !

Remember when Jesus said this Jn 12:24

Verily, verily, I say unto you, Except a corn of wheat fall into the ground and die, it abideth alone: but if it die, it bringeth forth much fruit.

Well that is the fruit unto God Paul means here in Rom 7:4, which fruit consisteth of many men and women for whom Christ died, manifest both Faith and Repentance.


John the Baptist said to the Pharisee, questioning them about why they came to His Baptism of Repentance, but first they must bring forth fruit unto Repentance Matt 3:7-8

7 But when he saw many of the Pharisees and Sadducee's come to his baptism, he said unto them, O generation of vipers, who hath warned you to flee from the wrath to come?

8 Bring forth therefore fruits meet for repentance:

This fruit would manifest itself in confession of sin Matt 3:6

6 And were baptized of him in Jordan, confessing their sins.

However the Pharisees and Sadducee's that John directed his words to did not consider themselves sinners as other men much like the Pharisee here Lk 18:11-12

11 The Pharisee stood and prayed thus with himself, God, I thank thee, that I am not as other men are, extortioners, unjust, adulterers, or even as this publican.

12 I fast twice in the week, I give tithes of all that I possess.

You see the Pharisee did not consider those things he did works of darkness or sinful deeds of the flesh, but in reality thats what they were Jn 3:19

19 And this is the condemnation, that light is come into the world, and men loved darkness rather than light, because their deeds were evil.

Their religious deeds were nothing but dead works that needed to be repented of Heb 9:14

14 How much more shall the blood of Christ, who through the eternal Spirit offered himself without spot to God, purge your conscience from dead works to serve the living God? See also Isa 64:6.

Now this is how Christ Glorifies His Father, by those He died for bringing forth fruit Jn 15:8

8 Herein is my Father glorified, that ye bear much fruit; so shall ye be my disciples.

And this is the end and accomplishment of the Death of Christ or the Body of Christ Rom 7:4

4 Wherefore, my brethren, ye also are become dead to the law by the body of Christ; that ye should be married to another, even to him who is raised from the dead, that we should bring forth fruit unto God.

Princely
January 8th, 2013, 09:07 PM
Rom 7:4

4 Wherefore, my brethren, ye also are become dead to the law by the body of Christ; that ye should be married to another, even to him who is raised from the dead, that we should bring forth fruit unto God.


Another accomplishment of the Death of Christ in the Purpose of God, is that it will cause all for whom He died and was raised from the dead for, to bring forth fruit unto God. That fruit being both faith and repentance, repentance toward God and Faith in Jesus Christ Acts 20:21

21 Testifying both to the Jews, and also to the Greeks, repentance toward God, and faith toward our Lord Jesus Christ.

Both of these are but fruits of Christ's Death and Resurrection 1 Pet 1:3 !

Remember when Jesus said this Jn 12:24

Verily, verily, I say unto you, Except a corn of wheat fall into the ground and die, it abideth alone: but if it die, it bringeth forth much fruit.

Well that is the fruit unto God Paul means here in Rom 7:4, which fruit consisteth of many men and women for whom Christ died, manifest both Faith and Repentance.


John the Baptist said to the Pharisee, questioning them about why they came to His Baptism of Repentance, but first they must bring forth fruit unto Repentance Matt 3:7-8

7 But when he saw many of the Pharisees and Sadducee's come to his baptism, he said unto them, O generation of vipers, who hath warned you to flee from the wrath to come?

8 Bring forth therefore fruits meet for repentance:

This fruit would manifest itself in confession of sin Matt 3:6

6 And were baptized of him in Jordan, confessing their sins.

However the Pharisees and Sadducee's that John directed his words to did not consider themselves sinners as other men much like the Pharisee here Lk 18:11-12

11 The Pharisee stood and prayed thus with himself, God, I thank thee, that I am not as other men are, extortioners, unjust, adulterers, or even as this publican.

12 I fast twice in the week, I give tithes of all that I possess.

You see the Pharisee did not consider those things he did works of darkness or sinful deeds of the flesh, but in reality thats what they were Jn 3:19

19 And this is the condemnation, that light is come into the world, and men loved darkness rather than light, because their deeds were evil.

Their religious deeds were nothing but dead works that needed to be repented of Heb 9:14

14 How much more shall the blood of Christ, who through the eternal Spirit offered himself without spot to God, purge your conscience from dead works to serve the living God? See also Isa 64:6.

Now this is how Christ Glorifies His Father, by those He died for bringing forth fruit Jn 15:8

8 Herein is my Father glorified, that ye bear much fruit; so shall ye be my disciples.

And this is the end and accomplishment of the Death of Christ or the Body of Christ Rom 7:4

4 Wherefore, my brethren, ye also are become dead to the law by the body of Christ; that ye should be married to another, even to him who is raised from the dead, that we should bring forth fruit unto God.

The only fruit that is acceptable comes from the mouth by those who worship in spirit and truth as the son of man does by doing what the Lord of Host commanded Him and showing his love of the Father.

No one can enter the kingdom of God unless they are the shepherd of the sheep, born from above, and born of water and spirit.

The one who enters through the gate is the shepherd of the sheep.

Scripture says;

Take careful heed to do the commandment and the law which Moses the servant of the Lord commanded you, to love the Lord your God, to walk in all His ways, to keep His commandments, to hold fast to Him, and to serve Him with all your heart and with all your soul."

"The Lord is good; blessed are those who take refuge in him. Revere the Lord, you his holy ones, for nothing is lacking to those who revere Him. The great grow poor and hungry but those who seek the Lord want for no good thing."

"The Lord has eyes for the just, and ears for their cry. When the just cry out, the Lord hears them, and rescues them from all distress."

"The Lord redeems the life of his servants; none of those who take refuge in him incurs guilt."

If any would serve me, he must follow me. Where I am, that's where my servant will be. Whoever honors me, him the Father shall honor.

Whoever refuses to honor me refuses to honor the Lord who sent me.

beloved57
January 14th, 2013, 07:12 AM
Titus 2:14

14 Who gave himself for us, that he might redeem us from all iniquity, and purify unto himself a peculiar people, zealous of good works.

If Christ by His Death or His Offering of Himself, if by it each Person, each one He died for does not become zealous of Good Works as stated here [ See also Eph 2:10], His Death's Purpose was a Failure !

The word that here is important. Its the greek conjunction ἵνα and means:

in order that, so that


for the purpose that (in order that), looking to the aim (intended result) of the verbal idea

In other words, God's intended result in Christ giving Himself and He giving His Son Jn 3:16; Rom 8:32 as in order to produce certain and specific results, those being:

To redeem those He died for from all iniquity, and to purify unto himself a specially chosen people zealous of Good Works.

If This intention did not become a Reality for all whom Christ died, His Death failed God's Intended Purpose !

Then what about people who do not end up being a person zealous of good works ? Then simply Christ was not given for that person or persons !

beloved57
January 15th, 2013, 12:45 PM
That He might bring us to God ! 1 Pet 3:18

For Christ also hath once suffered for sins, the just for the unjust, that he might bring us to God, being put to death in the flesh, but quickened by the Spirit:

This is ones subjective Reconciliation to God by way of Faith and Repentance ; or its our conversion to God. For this was a important purpose, intention for God giving His Son to die for those He died for, for if we be True Believers; That is by His Death or His once suffering for our sins, that this would result in our conversion to God !

Now if all for whom He suffered for their sins, are not as a result of that, converted to God, then His Death or Suffering for them failed its God given Purpose ! This bringing us to God or subjective reconciliation is effected because Christ through His Death did make Satisfaction for our sins, bearing the full penalty of the broken law for us as our Representative !

beloved57
January 18th, 2013, 11:06 PM
More scripture giving the purpose and results of Christ's Death, that those He died for will serve Him ! 2 Cor 5:14-15

14 For the love of Christ constraineth us; because we thus judge, that if one died for all, then were all dead:

15 And that he died for all, that they which live should not henceforth live unto themselves, but unto him which died for them, and rose again.

Remember the words of the Psalmist Ps 22:30

A seed shall serve him; it shall be accounted to the Lord for a generation.

That word serve means :

to cause to serve as subjects

to labour, work, do work

2) to work for another, serve another by labour

3) to serve as subjects

4) to serve (God)

to compel to labour or work, cause to labour, cause to serve


And Jesus said Jn 12:26

If any man serve me, let him follow me; and where I am, there shall also my servant be: if any man serve me, him will my Father honour.

Now that any man[who serves] will be of that seed Ps 22:30

A seed shall serve him; it shall be accounted to the Lord for a generation.

That word seed means:

offspring, descendants as in Isa 53:10

10 Yet it pleased the Lord to bruise him; he hath put him to grief: when thou shalt make his soul an offering for sin, he shall see his seed, he shall prolong his days, and the pleasure of the Lord shall prosper in his hand.

That seed is all for whom He died or whom His soul was made an offering for sin for !


And Paul writes 2 Cor 5:14-15

14 For the love of Christ constraineth us; because we thus judge, that if one died for all, then were all dead:

15 And that he died for all, that they which live should not henceforth live unto themselves, but unto him which died for them, and rose again.

The Apostle perceives the Love of Christ, which moved Him to give Himself for His Body the Church [His Seed] Eph 5:25, and that He died for all [The Seed], and the All He died for, died [judicially] with Him, and so they were as He was, all dead. Purpose being:

That we which live, the we being, the all that died with Him, should not live unto themselves in the flesh, as servants of sin, but unto Him that died for them [ Christ their Surety] !

Paul here just described the fruit of Christ's Death, it produces servants for Him. The same exact thing is taught in Titus 2:14, the end of His Redemptive Death produces a People zealous of Good Works !

beloved57
February 4th, 2013, 08:06 AM
All those that the Jesus Christ I know and serve, all for whom He died, in His obedience, and because He represented them [those He died for] by that obedience of His, which is also His Faithfulness to that Eternal Covenant which He became the Surety unto Death, by this He made them all Righteous. Yes, all of them have His obedience or faithfulness or faith imputed to them ! All those Christ died for stand before God, even when they themselves are but faithless, unbelieving, enemies, they stand before God with the Faith and obedience of Christ imputed to them ! Rom 5:19

19 For as by one man's disobedience many were made sinners, so by the obedience of one shall many be made righteous.

beloved57
February 4th, 2013, 09:25 AM
And so because they [whom Christ died for] stand before God with His Faithfulness and Righteousness and Obedience imputed to them, they are commensurately given His Faith, a portion of His own Faith [in New Birth] is given them by Christ;thats what Paul means that he lives by the faith of the Son of God, who Loved him and gave Himself for him Gal 2:20

20 I am crucified with Christ: nevertheless I live; yet not I, but Christ liveth in me: and the life which I now live in the flesh I live by the faith of the Son of God, who loved me, and gave himself for me.

In other words, the Life of Faith that Paul now Lives was given to him by the Son of God who now lives in him. For he as well as all for whom Christ died were in Him representatively when He as their substitute and Surety was Crucified !

The Faith believers have to believe on Christ comes from Christ to them, He is the Author and Finisher of it. Now understand this, as their Saviour and Head He gives each member of His Body, He gives each of them an alloted portion of Faith Rom 12:3

3 For I say, through the grace given unto me, to every man that is among you , not to think of himself more highly than he ought to think; but to think soberly,[B] according as God hath dealt to every man the measure of faith.

Notice here, faith has been dealt to every man of the body of Christ. The word dealt ,greek word merizō:


to divide

a) to separate into parts, cut into pieces

1) to divide into parties, i.e. be split into factions

b) to distribute

1) a thing among people

2) bestow, impart

God imparts to every man of the Body of Christ a measure , greek word metron:

measure, an instrument for measuring

a) a vessel for receiving and determining the quantity of things, whether dry or liquid

b) a graduated staff for measuring, a measuring rod

c) proverbially, the rule or standard of judgment

2) determined extent, portion measured off, measure or limit

a) the required measure, the due, fit, measure

a determined amount of Faith

Faith has been assigned to each or every member of His Body, though it varies in degree's as fruit is variable Matt 13:23

23 But he that received seed into the good ground is he that heareth the word, and understandeth it; which also beareth fruit, and bringeth forth, some an hundredfold, some sixty, some thirty.

However each member of Christ's Body who are made Righteous or Just by Christ's Faithfulness shall receive from Him Faith to believe in Him !

beloved57
February 4th, 2013, 11:10 AM
Please notice again in Romans 12:3

3 For I say, through the grace given unto me, to every man that is among you, not to think of himself more highly than he ought to think; but to think soberly, according as God hath dealt to every man the measure of faith.


That God has assigned or dealt by allotment, to each person their portion of faith.

This corresponds with what Peter wrote here 2 Pet 1:1

Simon Peter, a servant and an apostle of Jesus Christ, to them that have obtained like precious faith with us through the righteousness of God and our Saviour Jesus Christ:

So Just as Paul's words in Rom 12:3 is speaking of Christ's Body or Believers, so it is here with Peter,and the word obtained here is very similar to the word dealt in Rom 12:3, and it is the word lagchanó:


I obtain (receive) by lot, my lot (turn) is, (b) I draw lots.

to receive by divine allotment !

And that is what Paul is referring to in Rom 12:3


Now understand, this is an accomplishment of the Death of Christ, that each man He died for or every man receives by allotment a portion of His Faith, Precious Faith.So being saved by Grace through Faith is nothing a Believer can boast about for its not of himself, but it is the gift of God, which is Christ, and He gives each member of His Body of which He is Saviour of Eph 5:23 through New Birth, a portion of His Own Faith, in that He comes and Lives in each of them by His Holy Spirit, empowering each of them to believe on Him, also giving them that right,with a portion of His Own Personal Faith. This Faith of Christ is called into believing action by the Call of His Gospel !

beloved57
February 5th, 2013, 08:11 PM
Heb 9:14

How much more shall the blood of Christ, who through the eternal Spirit offered himself without spot to God, purge your conscience from dead works to serve the living God?

This verse tells us that it is the Blood of Christ [ The God/Man] and His Death that is the cause of one leaving dead works [false religion] and serving the Living God See Jer 10:10; Acts 14:15

And saying, Sirs, why do ye these things? We also are men of like passions with you, and preach unto you that ye should turn from these vanities unto the living God, which made heaven, and earth, and the sea, and all things that are therein:

The Blood of Christ will effect that Turn from vanities [dead works] unto the Living God.

Thats exactly what Heb 9:14 teaches ! In fact Peter writes the same thing in these words 1 Pet 18-20

18 Forasmuch as ye know that ye were not redeemed with corruptible things, as silver and gold, from your vain conversation received by tradition from your fathers;

19 But with the precious blood of Christ, as of a lamb without blemish and without spot:

20 Who verily was foreordained before the foundation of the world, but was manifest in these last times for you,

The vain conversation the blood of Christ redeemed them from was false, dead work, traditional religion !

People sing it, but do not really believe it, but its power in the Blood of Christ, it actually effects a change of mind or repentance for all it was shed, God's Elect !

beloved57
February 10th, 2013, 05:39 PM
What is meant by fruit is the effects and product of Christ's Death for all whom He died, for He died an Covenental Death Matt 26:28

28 For this is my blood of the new testament or covenant, which is shed for many for the remission of sins.

Isa 42:6

6 I the Lord have called thee in righteousness, and will hold thine hand, and will keep thee, and give thee for a covenant of the people, for a light of the Gentiles;

And because of this Death certain effects must take place according to that Covenant. One of the things is that God will be the God of those Christ died for and they His People in a experiential way Heb 8:10

10 For this is the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel after those days, saith the Lord; I will put my laws into their mind, and write them in their hearts: and I will be to them a God, and they shall be to me a people:

Remember when Jesus said to Mary this Jn 20:17

Jesus saith unto her, Touch me not; for I am not yet ascended to my Father: but go to my brethren, and say unto them, I ascend unto my Father, and your Father; and to my God, and your God.

Yes, the God and Father of the Lord Jesus Christ is their Father and God Eph 1:3

Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, who hath blessed us with all spiritual blessings in heavenly places in Christ:

Sure, God is the God over all mankind as the Creator , but not in this Covenental sense through Jesus Christ !

This experiential becoming God's People is done by giving them a new inner life, implanting in them new spiritual principles, they shall be sprinkled with Clean water, taking away their natural hearts of stone, and given a heart of flesh Ezk 36:25-27

25 Then will I sprinkle clean water upon you, and ye shall be clean: from all your filthiness, and from all your idols, will I cleanse you.

26 A new heart also will I give you, and a new spirit will I put within you: and I will take away the stony heart out of your flesh, and I will give you an heart of flesh.

27 And I will put my spirit within you, and cause you to walk in my statutes, and ye shall keep my judgments, and do them.

That New Heart, the word for heart leb:


inner man, mind, will, heart, understanding

a) inner part, midst

1) midst (of things)

2) heart (of man)

3) soul, heart (of man)

4) mind, knowledge, thinking, reflection, memory

5) inclination, resolution, determination (of will)

6) conscience

7) heart (of moral character)

8) as seat of appetites

9) as seat of emotions and passions

10) as seat of courage

Notice also Vs 25, God will cleanse them from all their Idols, for thats important in becoming experientially the People of God.

And because of this Promise, that is why all for whom Christ died turn from their idols as here and serve the Living God 1 Thess 1:8-9

8 For from you sounded out the word of the Lord not only in Macedonia and Achaia, but also in every place your faith to God-ward is spread abroad; so that we need not to speak any thing.

9 For they themselves shew of us what manner of entering in we had unto you, and how ye turned to God from idols to serve the living and true God;

Yes this turning from Idols here is a confirmation of the promise in Ezk 36:25 and its an effect,a fruit of Christ's Covenental Death. This is the Blood of Christ, the Covenant Blood [Matt 26:28; Heb 13:20] producing its Covenental Effects Heb 9:14

14 How much more shall the blood of Christ or His Death, who through the eternal Spirit offered himself without spot to God, purge your conscience from dead works to serve the living God?

beloved57
February 11th, 2013, 04:28 AM
Christ's Covenental Death, for those He did die for, He delivers them from death and the fear of it Heb 2:14-15

14 Forasmuch then as the children are partakers of flesh and blood, he also himself likewise took part of the same; that through death he might destroy him that had the power of death, that is, the devil;

15 And deliver them who through fear of death were all their lifetime subject to bondage.

By the Blood of His Covenant Zech 9:11


As for thee also, by the blood of thy covenant I have sent forth thy prisoners out of the pit wherein is no water.

This speaks of deliverance !

All God's Children are given to know the reality of eternal judgment and death Heb 6:1-2

Therefore leaving the principles of the doctrine of Christ, let us go on unto perfection; not laying again the foundation of repentance from dead works, and of faith toward God,

2 Of the doctrine of baptisms, and of laying on of hands, and of resurrection of the dead, and of eternal judgment.

Recall when felix trembled at Paul's witnessing, trembled of the Judgment to come Acts 24:25

And as he reasoned of righteousness, temperance, and judgment to come, Felix trembled, and answered, Go thy way for this time; when I have a convenient season, I will call for thee.

So thoughts of Judgment produces fear like here 1 Jn 4:17-18

17 Herein is our love made perfect, that we may have boldness in the day of judgment: because as he is, so are we in this world.

18 There is no fear in love; but perfect love casteth out fear: because fear hath torment. He that feareth is not made perfect in love.

But Christ's Covenental Death delivers from both. Again lets read Zech 9:11-12

11 As for thee also, by the blood of thy covenant I have sent forth thy prisoners out of the pit wherein is no water.

12 Turn you to the strong hold, ye prisoners of hope: even to day do I declare that I will render double unto thee;

These are the prisoners of hope also Isa 42:6-7

6 I the Lord have called thee in righteousness, and will hold thine hand, and will keep thee, and give thee for a covenant of the people, for a light of the Gentiles;

7 To open the blind eyes, to bring out the prisoners from the prison, and them that sit in darkness out of the prison house.

Notice again the word Covenant in Vs 6,for that speaks of Christ's Covenant Death !

So all for whom Christ died shall be delivered from the fear of Death, the second death and the fear of the Eternal Judgment disappears more and more as the Eternal Love of God for us is more and more perceived and comprehended 1 Jn 4:11-20.

BTW, This Truth also exposes those who live their so called christian life out of a mercenary spirit of fear of loosing their salvation and reward, meaning they do fear eternal death if they do not walk the straight and narrow, this exposes them as being strangers to the Love of God, and shows they are trusting in their arm of the flesh, and not for what has been accomplished by Christ's Covenental Death for God's People out of His Eternal Love for them !

beloved57
February 11th, 2013, 06:20 AM
Hosea 2:18-20

18 And in that day will I make a covenant for them with the beasts of the field and with the fowls of heaven, and with the creeping things of the ground: and I will break the bow and the sword and the battle out of the earth, and will make them to lie down safely.

19 And I will betroth thee unto me for ever; yea, I will betroth thee unto me in righteousness, and in judgment, and in lovingkindness, and in mercies.

20 I will even betroth thee unto me in faithfulness: and thou shalt know the Lord.

Its one thing for God to be Faithful to us, but in this He causes us to be Faithful to Him.

This Covenant puts the fear of God in our heart, a great spiritual blessing and the promise to such Jer 32:40

And I will make an everlasting covenant with them, that I will not turn away from them, to do them good; but I will put my fear in their hearts, that they shall not depart from me.

God's Faithfulness is Promised here in that " He will not turn away from them to do them good" and He promises they also will be faithful to Him by they not departing from Him !

So the Covenental Death of Christ provides Faith and Faithfulness to those He died for.

In fact that word faithfulness in Hosea 2:20 is translated faith here Hab 2:4

4 Behold, his soul which is lifted up is not upright in him: but the just shall live by his faith.

And by that they shall know the Lord ! Again, another Covenant Promise Heb 8:11

11 And they shall not teach every man his neighbour, and every man his brother, saying, Know the Lord: for all shall know me, from the least to the greatest.

When Paul writes to the Faithful Eph 1:1

Paul, an apostle of Jesus Christ by the will of God, to the saints which are at Ephesus, and to the faithful in Christ Jesus:

He knows they have been partaken of the Covenant Promise Hosea 2:20

20 I will even betroth thee unto me in faithfulness: and thou shalt know the Lord.

beloved57
February 12th, 2013, 07:54 AM
Repentance, a Change of Mind, thats one of the Blessings of the Death of Christ, to all for whom He died. All for whom He doth have Redemption through His Blood and even the forgiveness of sins Eph 1:7

In whom we have redemption through his blood, the forgiveness of sins, according to the riches of his grace;

Col 1:14

In whom we have redemption through his blood, even the forgiveness of sins:

Now, as an accompaniment with forgiveness of sins is Repentance Acts 5:31

31 Him hath God exalted with his right hand to be a Prince and a Saviour, for to give repentance to Israel, and forgiveness of sins.

Thats correct, they accompany one another in the economy of Salvation and God does not grant one without the other.

Thats why also He told His Messengers to Preach both of them together in His Name Lk 24:47

47 And that repentance and remission of sins should be preached[not offered or commanded] in his name among all nations, beginning at Jerusalem.

The word preached is the greek word kēryssō:


to be a herald, to officiate as a herald

a) to proclaim after the manner of a herald

b) always with the suggestion of formality, gravity and an authority which must be listened to and obeyed

2) to publish, proclaim openly: something which has been done

3) used of the public proclamation of the gospel and matters pertaining to it, made by John the Baptist, by Jesus, by the apostles and other Christian teachers

The Disciples were to proclaim, declare openly something which had been done, completed, accomplished, effected by the Lord Jesus Christ in His Work, which were Repentance and Forgiveness or Remission of sins for Israel or God's Elect.

That is exactly what Peter Proclaimed here Acts 5:31

31 Him hath God exalted with his right hand to be a Prince and a Saviour, for to give repentance to Israel, and forgiveness of sins.

Peter was specific as to who these joint blessings belonged, The Israel of God Gal 6:16

16 And as many as walk according to this rule, peace be on them, and mercy, and upon the Israel of God.

Folks the Death of Christ for all whom He died grants to them Redemption, Forgiveness of sins and Repentance according to the Riches of His Grace !

Yes, the conclusion is, if one does not ever Repent unto Life as Per Acts 11:18

18 When they heard these things, they held their peace, and glorified God, saying, Then hath God also to the Gentiles granted repentance unto life.

Then simply put, Christ did not shed His Blood for them Matt 26:28

28 For this is my blood of the new testament, which is shed for many for the remission of sins/and repentance.

beloved57
February 14th, 2013, 05:25 PM
One of the Blessings of the Covenant Death of the Lord Jesus Christ for all whom He died, it is they shall receive a heart to know Him and the Father , to know God !

Jer 31:34

And they shall teach no more every man his neighbour, and every man his brother, saying, Know the Lord: for they shall all know me, from the least of them unto the greatest of them, saith the Lord: for I will forgive their iniquity, and I will remember their sin no more.

I just Love the shall's of God, they mean its a sure thing !

Jesus stated that was His Purpose here Jn 17:2-3

2 As thou hast given him power over all flesh, that he should give eternal life to as many as thou hast given him.

3 And this is life eternal, that they might know thee the only true God, and Jesus Christ, whom thou hast sent.

Jesus says of His Sheep that He was to lay His Life down in behalf of this Jn 10:14

14 I am the good shepherd, and know my sheep, and am known of mine.

Heb 8:11

And they shall not teach every man his neighbour, and every man his brother, saying, Know the Lord: for all shall know me, from the least to the greatest.

That word know here in Heb 8:11 does not mean a mere nominal knowing, but spiritual knowing. Its a causing one to know, turning the mind to. Its a experimental knowing/perception and includes Faith.

So its also a promise of Faith, They shall all believe in Me.

Jer 24:7

And I will give them an heart to know me, that I am the Lord: and they shall be my people, and I will be their God: for they shall return unto me with their whole heart.

beloved57
February 17th, 2013, 08:36 PM
1 Pet 2:24

24 Who his own self bare our sins in his own body on the tree, that we, being dead to sins, should live unto righteousness: by whose stripes ye were healed.

There is perhaps no clearer scripture testimony in the word of God, that does declare the Saving Effects of the Death of Christ, in fact the very word healed means :

to cure, heal

2) to make whole

a) to free from errors and sins, to bring about (one's) salvation

Now if all for whom He died [ The meaning of His Stripes] are not healed, made whole, converted or saved experientially so that they died to sin and begin to live to Righteousness, then His Stripes [Death] was a Utter failure. By Christ's Death [Stripes], its to effect a conversion, a New Life unto God. This conversion unto a New Life of Righteousness includes living for now on by Faith, resting in the imputed Righteousness of God revealed in the Gospel Rom 1:16-17.

So the Healing that comes from Christ's stripes is a New Creation inside of each one He died for, and by it they live in Righteousness and Holiness all the days of their lives Lk 1:74-75


74 That he would grant unto us, that we being delivered out of the hand of our enemies might serve him without fear,

75 In holiness and righteousness before him, all the days of our life.

beloved57
February 26th, 2013, 12:25 AM
All for whom Christ died, to the exclusion of not one, have been given by Him Glory, in the form of a Promise Note Jn 17:20-22

20 Neither pray I for these alone, but for them also which shall believe on me through their word;

21 That they all may be one; as thou, Father, art in me, and I in thee, that they also may be one in us: that the world may believe that thou hast sent me.

22 And the glory which thou gavest me I have given them; that they may be one, even as we are one:

Jesus here also makes it unquestionably clear that His present intercession request did not just pertain to those who were at that specific time hearing Him while in His immediate presence [His Chosen Disciples excluding judas], but for them also who shall believe o Him through their Word or their Testimony; and so He goes on to say of them ALL Vs 22

And the glory which thou gavest me I have given them; that they may be one, even as we are one:

That is, He has given it to His Chosen disciples, judas the son of perdition not included, and secondly, all whom shall believe on Him through their word of Testimony, whether by their literal preaching or by their present epistles and letters. This is the same Glory Paul writes about in this chain of predetermined events Rom 8:29-30

29 For whom he did foreknow, he also did predestinate to be conformed to the image of his Son, that he might be the firstborn among many brethren.

30 Moreover whom he did predestinate, them he also called: and whom he called, them he also justified: and whom he justified, them he also glorified.

By Christ's actual statement that He has given [Perfect Tense] it to them already,though it has not yet come to past in its completion and perfection, they cannot be without it, or He will be found a liar, but the performance of it is sure, based upon the Word of Him that cannot lie.This was Glory contingent upon His Death for them Heb 2:9-10

9 But we see Jesus, who was made a little lower than the angels for the suffering of death, crowned with glory and honour; that he by the grace of God should taste death for every man.

10 For it became him, for whom are all things, and by whom are all things, in bringing many sons unto glory, to make the captain of their salvation perfect through sufferings.

All whom He tasted death for [in behalf of] every man of them, brings them to Glory, which is the fruit of His Sufferings and Death for them !

beloved57
February 27th, 2013, 06:04 PM
Rom 8:32

32 He that spared not his own Son, but delivered him up for us all, how shall he not with him also freely give us all things?

Jn 3:16

16 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.


If God gave His Son in Death for Some, then also with Him were given them , all things freely !

Now what are these all things given freely with Him ? Lets read 2 Pet 1:3

3 According as his divine power hath given unto us all things that pertain unto life and godliness, through the knowledge of him that hath called us to glory and virtue:

The all things that accompany the giving of Christ to those He was given in behalf of, consiteth in,All things that pertaineth to Life[Spiritual] and Godliness !

The first thing He gives them is Life Spiritually. When Christ was given, to those He was given in behalf of, to them also is freely given Life, Spiritual. Jn 6:33

33 For the bread of God is he which cometh down from heaven, and giveth life[Spiritual] unto the world.

Jn 5:21

21 For as the Father raiseth up the dead, and quickeneth them; even so the Son quickeneth whom he will.

That word quickeneth is zōopoieō:


to produce alive, begat or bear living young

2) to cause to live, make alive, give life

1 Cor 15:45

45 And so it is written, The first man Adam was made a living soul; the last Adam was made a quickening[life giving] spirit.

All whom God gave Christ unto in Death, with Him, Gives them Life, to cause to be made alive unto God !

He gave them Justification of Life Rom 5:18

18 Therefore as by the offence of one judgment came upon all men to condemnation; even so by the righteousness of one the free gift came upon all men unto justification of life.

Next,He gives them Godly Repentance unto Salvation 2 Cor 7:9-10

9 Now I rejoice, not that ye were made sorry, but that ye sorrowed to repentance: for ye were made sorry after a godly manner, that ye might receive damage by us in nothing.

10 For godly sorrow worketh repentance to salvation not to be repented of: but the sorrow of the world worketh death.

That word godly is key. Godly Repentance accompanies Salvation, it accompanies Spiritual Life out of the Spirit of God.

Christ gives Repentance as Saviour Acts 5:31

31 Him hath God exalted with his right hand to be a Prince and a Saviour, for to give repentance to Israel, and forgiveness of sins.

This confirms that with Him, God gives all things. Repentance to Life Acts 11:18

18 When they heard these things, they held their peace, and glorified God, saying, Then hath God also to the Gentiles granted repentance unto life.

He also with Him gives them Faith to believe in Him. Phil 1:29

29 For unto you it is given in the behalf of Christ, not only to believe on him, but also to suffer for his sake;

There can be no godliness without Faith. For the Just [Justified] shall live by Faith All these are things that accompany Salvation, which is all in the giving of Christ Heb 6:9

9 But, beloved, we are persuaded better things of you, and things that accompany salvation, though we thus speak.

If Faith, Godly Repentance, are not sooner or later manifested in our lives, then there is no evidence or proof that Christ died or was given for us, as in Rom 8:32 and John 3:16, because with Him is also given all things that pertain to Life and Godliness for the Glory of God through Him !

beloved57
February 28th, 2013, 05:26 AM
For all whom He died, Christ is the Author of their Salvation, thats why they are obeying Him Heb 5:9

9 And being made perfect, he became the author of eternal salvation unto all them that obey[or are obeying] him;

And so He is the Author of their Faith Heb 12:2

Looking unto Jesus the author and finisher of our faith; who for the joy that was set before him endured the cross, despising the shame, and is set down at the right hand of the throne of God.

He is the Author of the Obedience of Faith, like with Abraham the Father of the Faithful Heb 11:8

8 By faith Abraham, when he was called to go out into a place which he should after receive for an inheritance, obeyed; and he went out, not knowing whither he went.

Christ is the Author of Abraham's obedience of Faith here !

So Christ, for everyone He died, is the Author, the Causer of their Conversion experience whereby they begin to live by obedient faith, as does all the seed of Abraham Heb 11:8 all the True Heirs are called the same way Heb 9:15

15 And for this cause he is the mediator of the new testament, that by means of death, for the redemption of the transgressions that were under the first testament, they which are called might receive the promise of eternal inheritance.

Understand, that Both in Heb 11:8 and Heb 9:15 its a Divine Call unto the same Eternal Inheritance. The Eternal Inheritance in Heb 9:15 is the equivalent to the Everlasting Canaan Land that was Promised Abraham and his seed here Gen 17:5-8

5 Neither shall thy name any more be called Abram, but thy name shall be Abraham; for a father of many nations have I made thee.

6 And I will make thee exceeding fruitful, and I will make nations of thee, and kings shall come out of thee.

7 And I will establish my covenant between me and thee and thy seed after thee in their generations for an everlasting covenant, to be a God unto thee, and to thy seed after thee.

8 And I will give unto thee, and to thy seed after thee, the land wherein thou art a stranger, all the land of Canaan, for an everlasting possession; and I will be their God.

The promise Eternal Inheritance was not given to Abraham and his physical seed ethnic isreal, but to Abraham as an Spiritual man of Faith and his Spiritual seed of Faith, comprised of men and women of all Nations Vs 5. Abraham's physical seed was only a type and shadow, His True descendants related to him in regards to this promise is through His spiritual seed Christ and all who belong to Him Gal 3:16,29

16 Now to Abraham and his seed were the promises made. He saith not, And to seeds, as of many; but as of one, And to thy seed, which is Christ.

29 And if ye be Christ's, then are ye Abraham's seed, and heirs according to the promise.

And all of this seed of promise, have Christ as the Author of their Salvation and Obedience of Faith !

beloved57
February 28th, 2013, 04:39 PM
Not only did Christ's Blood alone redeem us from all Iniquity if He died for us Titus 2:14

14 Who gave himself for us, that he might redeem us from all iniquity, and purify unto himself a peculiar people, zealous of good works.

But its also responsible for providing us a life of Good Works and or Spiritual Service unto God, Titus 2:14; Eph 2:10

10 For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus unto good works, which God hath before ordained that we should walk in them.

Rom 5:9-10

9 And they sung a new song, saying, Thou art worthy to take the book, and to open the seals thereof: for thou wast slain, and hast redeemed us to God by thy blood out of every kindred, and tongue, and people, and nation;

10 And hast made us unto our God kings and priests: and we shall reign on the earth.

Being made a Kingdom of Priests [Spiritual Service] denotes God Glorifying Works of Service, again Spiritual Services.

1 Pet 2:5

Ye also, as lively stones, are built up a spiritual house, an holy priesthood, to offer up spiritual sacrifices, acceptable to God by Jesus Christ.

beloved57
March 1st, 2013, 10:31 AM
1 Cor 15:57


But thanks be to God, which giveth us the victory through our Lord Jesus Christ.

All for whom Christ died, He causes them to be overcomer's, they are the overcomer's.

The word victory nikos:

to utterly vanquish

Its also connected with the word nikaō:


to conquer

a) to carry off the victory, come off victorious

1) of Christ, victorious over all His foes

2) of Christians, that hold fast their faith even unto death against the power of their foes, and temptations and persecutions

3) when one is arraigned or goes to law, to win the case, maintain one's cause

Since Christ by His Death was victorious over all His Foes, its the same as they were since He was and is the Head of them He died for. His Victorious Death was not for Him as a Private Individual, so His Victory or Overcoming is not for Him as an Private Individual.

So scriptures like these where the word overcome is used as here Rev 2:7

He that hath an ear, let him hear what the Spirit saith unto the churches; To him that overcometh will I give to eat of the tree of life, which is in the midst of the paradise of God.

That applies to them He died for, they overcome by Him 1 Cor 15:57

57 But thanks be to God, which giveth us the victory/overcoming through our Lord Jesus Christ.

Rev 2:11

11 He that hath an ear, let him hear what the Spirit saith unto the churches; He that overcometh shall not be hurt of the second death.

He has abolished Death for all whom He died !2 Tim 1:9-10

9 Who hath saved us, and called us with an holy calling, not according to our works, but according to his own purpose and grace, which was given us in Christ Jesus before the world began,

10 But is now made manifest by the appearing of our Saviour Jesus Christ, who hath abolished death, and hath brought life and immortality to light through the gospel:

Rev 2:17

17 He that hath an ear, let him hear what the Spirit saith unto the churches; To him that overcometh will I give to eat of the hidden manna, and will give him a white stone, and in the stone a new name written, which no man knoweth saving he that receiveth it.

God has already with Him given us all things Rom 8:31-32

31 What shall we then say to these things? If God be for us, who can be against us?

32 He that spared not his own Son, but delivered him up for us all, how shall he not with him also freely give us all things?

He gives us with Christ, if He died for us, the Victory and all the overcoming Promises we have rehearsed in Rev 2-3 !

beloved57
March 4th, 2013, 06:03 PM
Many in false religion deny the life giving effects f Christ's Death, unto all for whom He died. For simply put, He died in order for them to live unto God ! 2 Cor 5:14-15

14 For the love of Christ constraineth us; because we thus judge, that if one died for all, then were all dead:

15 And that he died for all, that they which live should not henceforth live unto themselves, but unto him which died for them, and rose again.

Here we have a Truth given that Christ died for all, that He died for, gave His life for Eph 5:25, but what is seriously neglected, is that by His Death for all, its concluded, that all died with Him, meaning, that in His Death for them, God legally declares that they have died too n His Death. Now understand this, its this Truth that exposes the false teaching of those who say that Christ's Death was merely a sacrifice for sin, for that is only a half truth, but not only was it that, it was also substitutionary,vicarious, in that in Him, all for whom He died, died as a result of God's law and Justice against their sins, being now satisfied against their persons, as it was satisfied in His Person. Its like saying that through Him, they have all personally paid the penalty of all their sins, past, present and future, and now its nothing left for them but to be given a New Life, to start afresh, which New Life is granted by New Birth, becoming a New Creation, so it comes into fruition as to the purpose Christ died for them, that they may live [spiritually] not unto themselves, but for Him that for their sakes, and in their stead, died and was raised.Its by this Resurrection they are begotten again unto a New Life. 1 Pet 1:3. The word begotten again in the original is anagennao and means:


to produce again, be born again, born anew

2) metaph. to have one's mind changed so that he lives a new life and one conformed to the will of God

This New Life is Granted because that old life of sin against God's law and Justice is dead, and so Paul writes here Rom 7:4

4 Wherefore, my brethren, ye also are become dead to the law by the body of Christ; that ye should be married to another, even to him who is raised from the dead, that we should bring forth fruit unto God.

They have died to the Law by the Body of Christ [His Vicarious Death],to the same thing in 2 Cor 5:14, that they should be married to another [The Son of God] or not to live unto themselves, but unto Him which died for them and rose again !

Peter also writes to the purport as the result of His Death 1 Pet 2:24

24 Who his own self bare our sins in his own body on the tree, that we, being dead to sins, should live unto righteousness[ By a New Life]: by whose stripes ye were healed.

Christ's Death accomplished this New Life for all whom He died, it makes them alive to God.

Rom 6:11


Likewise reckon ye also yourselves to be dead indeed unto sin, but alive unto God through Jesus Christ our Lord.

glew
March 5th, 2013, 05:14 AM
beloved57,

You are very brave indeed.

glew

beloved57
March 5th, 2013, 06:12 AM
beloved57,

You are very brave indeed.

glew

This thread is not about me pal, but what My Saviour Accomplished by His Cross Work !

glew
March 5th, 2013, 06:43 AM
You are brave to be posting like you are considering where you are at.

I know it is not about you. I am commending you. And I am your pal.

beloved57
March 6th, 2013, 03:47 AM
Col 2:13-14

13 And you, being dead in your sins and the uncircumcision of your flesh, hath he quickened together with him, having forgiven you all trespasses;

14 Blotting out the handwriting of ordinances that was against us, which was contrary to us, and took it out of the way, nailing it to his cross;

Who is it that hath been quickened ? Why its them only who has been forgiven of all their trespasses;Yes thats right, for they were not quickened to have their trespasses forgiven, but since they were already forgiven, they had to be quickened or made to live or made alive !

Now how and when were they forgiven, why it was at the Cross, where Christ was victorious over their sins and the law,where He made a show of them openly, of which they can never be charged against us or Him again, neither can they condemn us or Him again, and this goes for all transgressions, past, present and future, and so it behooves Christ as their Saviour to give unto them He died for, a communication of the Knowledge of the remission of their sins Lk 1:77

77 To give knowledge of salvation unto his people by the remission of their sins,

Acts 5:31

31 Him hath God exalted with his right hand to be a Prince and a Saviour, for to give repentance to Israel, and forgiveness of sins.

glew
March 6th, 2013, 05:05 AM
beloved57 (my pal),

You give so much scripture that it is hard to sift through it all. Are you willing to take a look at a couple of verses that are thrashed around this website and give an opinion please?


"For if we sin wilfully after that we have received the knowledge of the truth, there remaineth no more sacrifice for sins" (Hebrews 10:26)

Thanks pal

glew
March 6th, 2013, 08:48 AM
beloved57,

It doesn't look like you want to be my pal after all as there was not response to Hebrews 10:26. So will you at least critique my offer?

glew's analysis of Hebrews 10:26-

The Hebrews that heard the Gospel but did not take the Gospel into their hearts can be liked to an internet browser-

1 It has information that can be accessed
2 If the browser is not out of date yet it will be shortly

Still your pal,
glew

beloved57
March 6th, 2013, 09:52 AM
glew


you want to be my pal after all as there was not response to Hebrews 10:26. So will you at least critique my offer?

No. Do your own study of that scripture and bring it to the forum, I am not here to do your work for you. Also this thread is about what Christ accomplished by His Death for them He died for.

glew
March 6th, 2013, 10:55 AM
beloved57,

Ok. Then don't call me pal if you don't mean it. As for the meaning of Christ's Atonement-

It has two meanings-

Life for those who beleive.

Death for those who do not.

As far as doing my own studying-

Your postings are very helpful. I am using them in my own personal study.

Thank you,
And still your pal,
glew

beloved57
March 12th, 2013, 03:12 AM
When we have been given a good understanding of the scripture by the Author of it, the Holy Spirit, who is promised to Christ's Redeemed Church, and promised to lead it [every member of it] into all Truth relevant for Faith and Practice Jn 16:13; 1 Jn 2:20,27, then that Christ did not lay down His Life for all men without exception, but for the Sheep Jn 10:11-15, it is clearly obvious by realizing the accomplishments and effects it gives and bestows upon them He surely died in behalf of, now understand this ye who are against Christ, all them Christ died for, tasted death for Heb 2:9, He offered Himself as a sacrifice for, for His Death, an one offering for their sins, and by this fact we shall know that it was not an offering for all men without exception, because all for whom this sacrifice was offered, are sanctified and perfected by it in God's Reckoning Heb 10:10,14, also having through it Justification from or remission of all sins, and also by this sacrifice, their sins and iniquities will never be remembered again in a manner of condemnation and eternal judgment, but that this is not true of all individuals without exception is evident from these scenarios yet imminent Matt 25:41; Rev 20:11-15

beloved57
March 12th, 2013, 06:38 AM
Heb 13:12

12 Wherefore Jesus also, that he might sanctify the people with his own blood, suffered without the gate.

All for whom Christ died, by it [ His Death] it was to provide a inward sanctification as well, not only are they sanctified in the Divine Purpose of God as was Jeremiah 1:5

5 Before I formed thee in the belly I knew thee; and before thou camest forth out of the womb I sanctified thee, and I ordained thee a prophet unto the nations.

BTW this sanctification applies to all the foreknown People of God Rom 11:2; Rom 8:29, but His Death communicates an inward sanctification which is consistent with the sanctification in His Purpose, hence by His Blood / Death, all for whom He died has their conscious purposed from dead works, to serve the Living God Heb 9:14

14 How much more shall the blood of Christ, who through the eternal Spirit offered himself without spot to God, purge your conscience from dead works to serve the living God?

Notice what the Blood of Christ is said to do, to purge our conscience. The word purge is the word καθαρίζω and means:


I cleanse, make clean, literally, ceremonially, or spiritually, according to context.

And the word conscience suneidésis:

the conscience, a persisting notion.

properly, joint-knowing, i.e. conscience which joins moral and spiritual consciousness as part of being created in the divine image. Accordingly, all people have this God-given capacity to know right from wrong because each is a free moral agent

The conscience is part of the inward man, and the blood of Christ is said to cleanse it.

Cleanse it from what ? Dead Works ! What are Dead Works ? Religious works performed by dead men, dead spiritually ! Its religion without God given Faith. Its not worshiping God in Spirit and in Truth as Per Jn 4:23-24

23 But the hour cometh, and now is, when the true worshippers shall worship the Father in spirit and in truth: for the Father seeketh such to worship him.

24 God is a Spirit: and they that worship him must worship him in spirit and in truth.

Well, Christ's Blood provides God with those type of worshippers that God the Father seeketh such to Worship Him !

The Blood of Christ sets apart God's People experientially, from dead men religion which is Idolatry. It redeems them from a vain religious life received by tradition of our fathers 1 Pet 1:18-19

18 Forasmuch as ye know that ye were not redeemed with corruptible things, as silver and gold, from your vain conversation received by tradition from your fathers;

19 But with the precious blood of Christ, as of a lamb without blemish and without spot:

Thats dead works also of Heb 9:14 this vain[devoid of truth] conversation received by tradition.

Now understand this, if each person for whom Christ died, shed His Blood, does not experience this conversion, this Sanctification from dead works, unto serving [worship] of the True and Living God, then His Blood has lost its Value and Purpose, it has miserably failed the Divine Purpose !

But I know that it will, to the Glory of God !

beloved57
March 17th, 2013, 03:14 AM
All for whom Christ died and rose again, all of them by the purpose of God, did exist in Him by Purpose and Representation, even when He sat down in heavenly places as Per Eph 2:6

6 And hath raised us up together, and made us sit together in heavenly places in Christ Jesus:

This even though they in and of themselves may not have yet been born sinners in the flesh and then afterwards been born again, none of that has to occur for them to be risen together with Christ. In fact the Resurrection of Christ from the dead was their First Resurrection Rev 20:6

6 Blessed and holy is he that hath part in the first resurrection: on such the second death hath no power, but they shall be priests of God and of Christ, and shall reign with him a thousand years.

The first resurrection, or the chief one is that of Christ Himself from the dead as the Head of the Body, His Church Col 1:18

18 And he is the head of the body, the church: who is the beginning, the firstborn from the dead; that in all things he might have the preeminence.

Notice that this Resurrection constitutes them Priests of God, notice 1 Pet 2:9

9 But ye are a chosen generation, a royal priesthood, an holy nation, a peculiar people; that ye should shew forth the praises of him who hath called you out of darkness into his marvellous light;

And remember that these were those who had been begotten again how ? By the Resurrection of Christ from the Dead 1 Pet 1:3

3 Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, which according to his abundant mercy hath begotten us again unto a lively hope by the resurrection of Jesus Christ from the dead,

beloved57
March 18th, 2013, 06:51 AM
2 Cor 8:9

9 For ye know the grace of our Lord Jesus Christ, that, though he was rich, yet for your sakes he became poor, that or in order that ye through his poverty might be rich.

This is an express purpose of His Death, or His becoming poor [Phil 2:5-8] it makes those He died for become Rich [spiritually], which richness is the source of their Faith James 2:5

5 Hearken, my beloved brethren, Hath not God chosen the poor of this world rich in faith, and heirs of the kingdom which he hath promised to them that love him?

The poor in spirit become rich in Faith, because Christ was made poor for their sakes. The poor in spirit are heirs also stated here Matt 5:3

3 Blessed are the poor in spirit: for theirs is the kingdom of heaven.

That chosen poor that become rich in Faith are the Chosen of God here Eph 1:3-4


3 Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, who hath blessed us with all spiritual blessings in heavenly places in Christ:

4 According as he hath chosen us in him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and without blame before him in love:

Being poor in spirit is one of the many spiritual blessings they get according to their choice in Christ !

So Christ died that those He died for might be made rich in Faith because they are joint heirs together with Him of God !

beloved57
March 27th, 2013, 04:37 AM
All for whom Christ died and rose again, they are already made alive with Him, being made alive together with Him their Head, even though they in themselves are sinners and His enemies by nature. That this is so is taught here Eph 2:6

6 And hath raised us up together, and made us sit together in heavenly places in Christ Jesus:

The word raised here is the greek verb synegeirō:

to raise together, to cause to raise together

2) to raise up together from mortal death to a new and blessed life dedicated to God

Now this is True of all for whom Christ died for and rose again in God's Perspective !

This was also stated in the OT in type here Isa 26:19


19 Thy dead men shall live, together with my dead body shall they arise. Awake and sing, ye that dwell in dust: for thy dew is as the dew of herbs, and the earth shall cast out the dead.

Hos 6:2

2 After two days will he revive us: in the third day he will raise us up, and we shall live in his sight.

This speaks of those that Christ died for and arose the Third day. 1 Cor 15:3-4

3 For I delivered unto you first of all that which I also received, how that Christ died for our sins according to the scriptures;

4 And that he was buried, and that he rose again the third day according to the scriptures:

For instance, when Saul, who is now Paul, when he was going about persecuting Believers and consenting to their death, he was already, raised up together with Christ and sitting in heavenly places with Him ! This is True of all those Christ died for while in a state of Nature. This is Grace untold, and a Truth like this cannot be received by the natural man, its foolishness to him.

beloved57
April 1st, 2013, 04:45 AM
For whomever Christ did die for, the following is True of them no matter what, either before and after conversion, meaning before and after they become believers !

First, its True that He indeed died for them, both in their stead as a substitute and on their behalf, or for their good 1 Pet 2:24

24 Who his own self bare our sins in his own body on the tree, that we, being dead to sins,[B] should live unto righteousness: by whose stripes ye were healed.

Secondly, For all whom He died, He also arose, because of their Justification Rom 4:25

25 Who was delivered for our offences, and was raised again for[Because of] our justification.

Many do celebrate easter , supposedly commemorating the Lords Resurrection, but very few understand the True significance of that Blessed Event, for it was the evidence that all for whom Christ was delivered for their offences, that they are now Justified before God ! Yes, even before they believe !

Thirdly, For them, He sits on the Right Hand of God !

Fourthly, He makes intercession for them, and all this is witnessed to by the Apostle here Rom 8:33-34

33 Who shall lay any thing to the charge of God's elect? It is God that justifieth.

34 Who is he that condemneth? It is Christ that died, yea rather, that is risen again[For our Justification], who is even at the right hand of God, who also maketh intercession for us.

This making Intercession, Isaiah wrote of the same Isa 53:12

12 Therefore will I divide him a portion with the great, and he shall divide the spoil with the strong; because he hath poured out his soul unto death: and he was numbered with the transgressors; and he bare the sin of many, and made intercession for the transgressors.

You see that ? He made Intercession, not for the believers, but for the transgressors, those He bare their the sins, the many ! Any Transgressor Christ makes Intercession for shall be saved by His Life, shall come to God by Him Heb 7:25

25 Wherefore he is able also to save them to the uttermost that come unto God by him, seeing he ever liveth to make intercession for them.

Isaiah's here by prophecy is speaking of Christ's Priestly Work for those only that He Represented, the Israel of God, and this Work Justifies them before God or accounts them as Righteous, Yes even before they believe, because its not based upon their believing, but upon Christ bearing their sins !

Notice how Isaiah under inspiration of the same Spirit as Paul, did link together, the bearing of sins, and the making of Intercession,m in either case this is Priestly Work done by Christ for those He died for before they believe !

beloved57
April 1st, 2013, 11:12 AM
By Christ's Blood alone, all for whom He died have, even before they are born sinners, and after being born sinners but not yet believers in Christ, in fact, while they are His Enemies by nature, they all have by the Blood of Christ alone: Reconciliation, Redemption, Remission / Forgiveness of sins, Justification, and these are all in a scriptural sense the same, and the result of the Death or Blood of Christ alone.

Eph 1:7

In whom we have redemption through his blood, the forgiveness of sins, according to the riches of his grace;

To say we have Redemption through His Blood, and even the forgiveness of sins, is the same as saying we have Reconciliation or even Justification through His Blood.

Understand, to say that we were Reconciled to God by Christ,s Death, while being Enemies Rom 5:10, is no less or different in saying that we are Justified or have forgiveness of sins while being enemies, by or through His Death !