CRTL's Jason Troyer In Studio

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Jefferson

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CRTL's Jason Troyer In Studio

Tuesday November 14th, 2006.

BEST QUOTES OF THE SHOW:
Instead of depicting the mother as the victim they should have educated the public about the humanity and rights of the child. When rape and incest came up, the sympathy would rightly still be on the baby and people could see that violence toward a victim is not the solution to the problem. It is the problem.
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Every beautiful pre-born picture or grizzly post-abortion picture is like a wrecking ball to the lie that this baby is just a blob of tissue.
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SUMMARY:

Colorado Right to Life Director Jason Troyer is in studio discussing the various feedback he has recieved on the World Net Daily piece he authored the day after South Dakota failed to outlaw abortion statewide.
 
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Granite

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I'm amazed pro-lifers can't face facts: they were beaten, fair and square. South Dakota did not want to outlaw abortion badly enough. Deal with it, for crying out loud.
 
Granite

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They seem to be thinking the message just wasn't communicated clearly enough, or something. The message was communicated just fine. South Dakota rejected it. Abortion opponents seem mystified when they are actually defeated or beaten at the polls, as though they think "most people" must really be pro-life. This kind of head scratching is indicative of what is wrong with the pro-life movement.
 
Granite

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The message has been out there since Roe in 1973. If people don't get it now, how much longer is it going to take?
 
Delmar

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Granite said:
I'm amazed pro-lifers can't face facts: they were beaten, fair and square. South Dakota did not want to outlaw abortion badly enough. Deal with it, for crying out loud.
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If I'm not mistaken I can remember a time when you were one of us( pro lifers). It saddens me so to see how wicked you have become!
 
Granite

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Delmar said:
If I'm not mistaken I can remember a time when you were one of us( pro lifers). It saddens me so to see how wicked you have become!
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Get over yourself, Delmar. I'm still pro-life. But Dakotans need to stop being in denial here and figure out a different way to tackle this.
 
Jefferson

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Granite is right. Most people want abortion to remain legal. Therefore, Granite is agreeing with us Bible thumpers when we claim most people are basically evil and not good.
 
Granite

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Jefferson said:
Granite is right. Most people want abortion to remain legal. Therefore, Granite is agreeing with us Bible thumpers when we claim most people are basically evil and not good.
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No, not really. I would say people are fundamentally self-serving, but "good" and "evil" aren't terms I use because they've been twisted and abused to death.

In any event it's a mistake to think the message wasn't properly conveyed. It was. The message was rejected. Question: what is there to learn from this?
 
Delmar

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Jefferson said:
Granite is right. Most people want abortion to remain legal. Therefore, Granite is agreeing with us Bible thumpers when we claim most people are basically evil and not good.
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OK, I was wrong! Still, I am sad about Granite!
 
Jefferson

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Granite said:
...it's a mistake to think the message wasn't properly conveyed. It was.
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If the message put the emphasis on the woman being the victim of abortion rather than the baby, then the message was not properly conveyed.
 
Granite

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Jefferson said:
If the message put the emphasis on the woman being the victim of abortion rather than the baby, then the message was not properly conveyed.
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Both are victims. It's merely a question of degree. But considering people have had since 1973 to ponder this issue, how much more time do you think it'll take?
 
Delmar

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Granite said:
Both are victims. It's merely a question of degree. But considering people have had since 1973 to ponder this issue, how much more time do you think it'll take?
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The idea that we may never totally prevail might well be true. It is , however, possible to win one heart and mind at a time.
 
Granite

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Delmar said:
The idea that we may never totally prevail might well be true. It is , however, possible to win one heart and mind at a time.
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Agreed. I've said for a long time that this is the key: the hearts and minds, not a new piece of legislation. Passing a law is a lot easier than a paradigm shift.
 
Servo

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Granite said:
Both are victims. It's merely a question of degree. But considering people have had since 1973 to ponder this issue, how much more time do you think it'll take?
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How much time? I don't know. How long was slavery considered ok?

BTW, all abortions result in 50% of the victims being murdered. I would say the degree of victim-hood is higher with the babies.
 
Aethril

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Shimei said:
How much time? I don't know. How long was slavery considered ok?

BTW, all abortions result in 50% of the victims being murdered. I would say the degree of victim-hood is higher with the babies.
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Right. Jason Troyer said, "There is a greater victim and a lesser victim...women suffer from abortions, but babies die".
 
Granite

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Shimei said:
How much time? I don't know. How long was slavery considered ok?

BTW, all abortions result in 50% of the victims being murdered. I would say the degree of victim-hood is higher with the babies.
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Ummm...I'd agree, Shimei. Maybe just calm down a notch. Both are victims; the question is to what degree.

Slavery was considered acceptable for thousands of years and is still practiced in many countries, so perhaps that's not the most optimistic of comparisons. Of course deliberative abortion has been in existence for at least as long.

Incidently, do you consider those lives lost from spontaneous abortions to be "victims"?
 
Servo

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Granite said:
Ummm...I'd agree, Shimei. Maybe just calm down a notch. Both are victims; the question is to what degree.
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Uhh…I wasn’t actually riled up, but ok. To what degree? Aethril in post #18 covers that aspect.
Granite said:
Slavery was considered acceptable for thousands of years and is still practiced in many countries, so perhaps that's not the most optimistic of comparisons. Of course deliberative abortion has been in existence for at least as long.
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But slavery was legal here (it was the norm) and now it is not. Somehow that victory was one. The same can be done with abortion.


Granite said:
Incidently, do you consider those lives lost from spontaneous abortions to be "victims"?
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A miscarriage is not murder, no one deliberately tried to kill the baby. If the baby is deliberately killed, it is murder and the baby is the obvious victim.
 
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