PDA

View Full Version : Death: When Time Stands Still.



Robert Pate
November 3rd, 2018, 11:58 AM
After my massive heart attack on May 30th I have been thinking a lot about death. While I was experiencing the heart attack I had no fear of death. I really thought that this was it, I was going to die, but I was not afraid. As the paramedics loaded me into the ambulance I said to my wife, "See you on the other side babe, this is it". When I arrived at the operating room they were ready for me. There was a large screen overhead and I could see everything. The large artery that led to my heart was totally collapsed. I could see it all, which only confirmed the fact that I was going to die, but I still was not afraid. I was wide awake, but still a little groggy from the pain medication. To make a long story short, they ran a catheter from my groin area to the collapsed artery and somehow installed a stent to hold the collapsed artery open and saved my life.

There is no conception of time in death. Those that have been dead for thousands of years will be resurrected in the twinkling of an eye, 1 Corinthians 15:52. It will be like they just died because the dead know nothing, Ecclesiastes 9:5. Christians don't really die, they go to sleep, 1 Corinthians 15:51. That sleep will be very short because there is no conception of time in death. It will be like we just died and then there we are face to face with Jesus. Unfortunately, those that have died in their sins will go into the judgment, known as the resurrection of the damned, John 5:29. I am actually looking forward to dying and being with Christ. This old body is tired and worn out. I am looking forward to my new body that will never get sick or die.

There is the popular misconception that people are in heaven looking down on us. no one is in heaven yet, nor is anyone in hell. It would not be heaven if your loved ones could see you suffering here on this corrupt planet. The resurrection has not taken place yet, no one is in heaven nor is anyone in hell. Nothing is going to happen until Jesus returns and then everything is going to happen.

Ask Mr. Religion
November 3rd, 2018, 02:46 PM
no one is in heaven yet, nor is anyone in hell. It would not be heaven if your loved ones could see you suffering here on this corrupt planet. The resurrection has not taken place yet, no one is in heaven nor is anyone in hell. Nothing is going to happen until Jesus returns and then everything is going to happen.

Thanks be to God for His gifts to the surgeons that saved your life.

More of your heterodox psychopannychia (soul sleep):


If a persons spirit is already in heaven then why would there be a resurrection?

There is a lot of controversy concerning this.

The way I see it is, the whole person goes into the ground and the whole person is resurrected.

The Christian does not really die. He falls asleep until the resurrection.
Dig deeper, Robert:

http://theologyonline.com/showthread.php?113700-Heaven-when-do-we-go-there&p=4492357#post4492357

Sigh.

AMR

iamaberean
November 3rd, 2018, 03:05 PM
There is the popular misconception that people are in heaven looking down on us. no one is in heaven yet, nor is anyone in hell. It would not be heaven if your loved ones could see you suffering here on this corrupt planet. The resurrection has not taken place yet, no one is in heaven nor is anyone in hell. Nothing is going to happen until Jesus returns and then everything is going to happen.

Jesus came as the Messiah of the children of Israel. They were the ones that had died who were resurrected.

Joh 11:22 But I know, that even now, whatsoever thou wilt ask of God, God will give it thee.
Joh 11:23 Jesus saith unto her, Thy brother shall rise again.
Joh 11:24 Martha saith unto him, I know that he shall rise again in the resurrection at the last day.
Joh 11:25 Jesus said unto her, I am the resurrection, and the life: he that believeth in me, though he were dead, yet shall he live:
Joh 11:26 And whosoever liveth and believeth in me shall never die. Believest thou this?
Joh 11:27 She saith unto him, Yea, Lord: I believe that thou art the Christ, the Son of God, which should come into the world.

The scriptures above answers all. Martha knew her dead brother would rise again at the last day. That last day was the end of the age of law.

Jesus said those that believe on him, shall never die. Never die would mean that our spirit would go directly on to be with the Lord.

How can we believe on Jesus and not believe what He said?

Robert Pate
November 3rd, 2018, 03:26 PM
Jesus came as the Messiah of the children of Israel. They were the ones that had died who were resurrected.

Joh 11:22 But I know, that even now, whatsoever thou wilt ask of God, God will give it thee.
Joh 11:23 Jesus saith unto her, Thy brother shall rise again.
Joh 11:24 Martha saith unto him, I know that he shall rise again in the resurrection at the last day.
Joh 11:25 Jesus said unto her, I am the resurrection, and the life: he that believeth in me, though he were dead, yet shall he live:
Joh 11:26 And whosoever liveth and believeth in me shall never die. Believest thou this?
Joh 11:27 She saith unto him, Yea, Lord: I believe that thou art the Christ, the Son of God, which should come into the world.

The scriptures above answers all. Martha knew her dead brother would rise again at the last day. That last day was the end of the age of law.

Jesus said those that believe on him, shall never die. Never die would mean that our spirit would go directly on to be with the Lord.

How can we believe on Jesus and not believe what He said?



All that have faith in Christ and his Gospel are indwelt with the Holy Spirit. The Holy Spirit is God's mark of ownership. Perhaps the Spirit remains with the body after death.

"It is sown a natural body; it is raised a spiritual body. There is a natural body and there is a spiritual body" 1 Corinthians 15:44.

I believe that the whole man goes into the grave and the whole man comes out of the grave in the resurrection.

iamaberean
November 3rd, 2018, 04:04 PM
All that have faith in Christ and his Gospel are indwelt with the Holy Spirit. The Holy Spirit is God's mark of ownership. Perhaps the Spirit remains with the body after death.

"It is sown a natural body; it is raised a spiritual body. There is a natural body and there is a spiritual body" 1 Corinthians 15:44.

I believe that the whole man goes into the grave and the whole man comes out of the grave in the resurrection.


Robert, we can be happy living for the LORD without studying God's word in depth, but it will really open up for one if they just ask Jesus for understanding.

Mat 22:29 Jesus answered and said unto them, Ye do err, not knowing the scriptures, nor the power of God.
Mat 22:30 For in the resurrection they neither marry, nor are given in marriage, but are as the angels of God in heaven.
Our resurrection comes when the body dies.

Robert Pate
November 3rd, 2018, 05:11 PM
Robert, we can be happy living for the LORD without studying God's word in depth, but it will really open up for one if they just ask Jesus for understanding.

Mat 22:29 Jesus answered and said unto them, Ye do err, not knowing the scriptures, nor the power of God.
Mat 22:30 For in the resurrection they neither marry, nor are given in marriage, but are as the angels of God in heaven.
Our resurrection comes when the body dies.

The Lord is not bound by time like we are.

Our resurrection will occur when Jesus arrives. At the last trump.

"In a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trump: for the trumpet shall sound and the dead shall be raised incorruptible and we shall be changed" 1 Corinthians 15:52.

This has not happened yet. The dead In Christ are still sleeping.

Ask Mr. Religion
November 3rd, 2018, 11:44 PM
The Lord is not bound by time like we are.


So far so good, Robert. But then...


You are assuming that God knows everything that is happening on the earth.

Truth of the matter is that God is very absent from what is happening on the earth.

:AMR:

Adding to your "soul sleep" error, comes this:


I have trouble with eternal punishment. I believe that the soul of the person that has rejected Christ will be destroyed in hell, but not eternally punished.

I am hoping, but don't know for sure, that in the judgment there will be another chance to accept Christ as your savior.

What ever it is, and whatever God decides, it will be right. He is the just judge of all things.


I believe that the soul will be destroyed in hell. I see little to no value in the doctrine of ECT. Why would God make someone suffer in hell for all eternity? The destruction of the soul would be eternal death and would be very painful.

Sigh.

It bears repeating:
http://theologyonline.com/showthread.php?111969-Why-I-Don-t-Believe-in-Calvinism-or-Predestination/page3&p=4402162#post4402162

AMR

Robert Pate
November 4th, 2018, 08:55 AM
So far so good, Robert. But then...



:AMR:

Adding to your "soul sleep" error, comes this:





Sigh.

It bears repeating:
http://theologyonline.com/showthread.php?111969-Why-I-Don-t-Believe-in-Calvinism-or-Predestination/page3&p=4402162#post4402162

AMR


I retract NOTHING.

God sees ALL THINGS in his Son Jesus Christ. If God saw the world as it is today, he would wrap up the whole thing in one big ball of fire. But thanks be that when God looks at this fallen planet all that he can see is his Son Jesus Christ.

I still have a problem with eternal punishment, even though the Bible teaches it. I am hoping that the Souls of the lost will be destroyed in hell and not have to experience eternal punishment. Is there something wrong with that?

No one is in heaven or in hell yet. The judgment has not taken place yet. Show me scripture that says anything different from that?

You like to think that you have caught me in some sort of error. There is no error. I know in what and in whom I believe.

beloved57
November 4th, 2018, 09:25 AM
I retract NOTHING.

God sees ALL THINGS in his Son Jesus Christ. If God saw the world as it is today, he would wrap up the whole thing in one big ball of fire. But thanks be that when God looks at this fallen planet all that he can see is his Son Jesus Christ.

I still have a problem with eternal punishment, even though the Bible teaches it. I am hoping that the Souls of the lost will be destroyed in hell and not have to experience eternal punishment. Is there something wrong with that?

No one is in heaven or in hell yet. The judgment has not taken place yet. Show me scripture that says anything different from that?

You like to think that you have caught me in some sort of error. There is no error. I know is what and in whom I believe.

I know you dont believe in Christs saving blood since you teach sinners that He shed His precious blood for are lost and unredeemed and condemned. Who knows, God may grant you repentance from your idolatry !

Robert Pate
November 4th, 2018, 02:13 PM
I know you dont believe in Christs saving blood since you teach sinners that He shed His precious blood for are lost and unredeemed and condemned. Who knows, God may grant you repentance from your idolatry !


Jesus claims to be the savior of the whole world, John 12:47.

You don't believe him.

Ask Mr. Religion
November 4th, 2018, 02:16 PM
No one is in heaven or in hell yet. The judgment has not taken place yet. Show me scripture that says anything different from that?



Robert,

Take the time to actually read my posted content, e.g., the link clearly provided (http://theologyonline.com/showthread.php?131075-Death-When-Time-Stands-Still&p=5285399&viewfull=1#post5285399) which includes the Scripture you deny exists:

http://theologyonline.com/showthread.php?113700-Heaven-when-do-we-go-there&p=4492357#post4492357

Soul sleep is nonsense.

AMR

beloved57
November 4th, 2018, 04:27 PM
Jesus claims to be the savior of the whole world, John 12:47.

You don't believe him.

You still are in Idolatry and denial of the saving blood of Christ !

Robert Pate
November 5th, 2018, 08:27 AM
Robert,

Take the time to actually read my posted content, e.g., the link clearly provided (http://theologyonline.com/showthread.php?131075-Death-When-Time-Stands-Still&p=5285399&viewfull=1#post5285399) which includes the Scripture you deny exists:

http://theologyonline.com/showthread.php?113700-Heaven-when-do-we-go-there&p=4492357#post4492357

Soul sleep is nonsense.

AMR


Soul sleep is biblical, Matthew 27:52, John 11:11, 1 Thessalonians 4:14, 1 Corinthians 15:51.

You also think that Justification by faith is nonsense.

JudgeRightly
November 5th, 2018, 08:41 AM
Soul sleep is biblical, Matthew 27:52, John 11:11, 1 Thessalonians 4:14, 1 Corinthians 15:51.

You also think that Justification by faith is nonsense.

Are these people asleep?

When He opened the fifth seal, I saw under the altar the souls of those who had been slain for the word of God and for the testimony which they held.And they cried with a loud voice, saying, “How long, O Lord, holy and true, until You judge and avenge our blood on those who dwell on the earth?”Then a white robe was given to each of them; and it was said to them that they should rest a little while longer, until both the number of their fellow servants and their brethren, who would be killed as they were, was completed. - Revelation 6:9-11 http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Revelation6:9-11&version=NKJV

Or perhaps "sleep" is used as a euphemism for death, as Jesus said Lazarus was asleep, when he was clearly dead?

Robert Pate
November 5th, 2018, 09:08 AM
Are these people asleep?

When He opened the fifth seal, I saw under the altar the souls of those who had been slain for the word of God and for the testimony which they held.And they cried with a loud voice, saying, “How long, O Lord, holy and true, until You judge and avenge our blood on those who dwell on the earth?”Then a white robe was given to each of them; and it was said to them that they should rest a little while longer, until both the number of their fellow servants and their brethren, who would be killed as they were, was completed. - Revelation 6:9-11 http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Revelation6:9-11&version=NKJV

Or perhaps "sleep" is used as a euphemism for death, as Jesus said Lazarus was asleep, when he was clearly dead?


It appears that they were sleeping, but then they awoke to plead God's judgment on their unbelieving oppressors that murdered them.

If Christians are going to be resurrected then "sleep" is the proper word. The word "death" means the permanent end of life.

Ask Mr. Religion
November 5th, 2018, 04:04 PM
Soul sleep is biblical, Matthew 27:52, John 11:11, 1 Thessalonians 4:14, 1 Corinthians 15:51.

You also think that Justification by faith is nonsense.
Robert,

The use of sleep is an "earthy" phrase, similar to Jesus' expression, John 11:11, "Lazarus sleeps," Paul's , "...many sleep," "sleep in Jesus," and Peter's, "...for since the fathers fell asleep," and to Stephen's martyrdom, "...he fell asleep."

No one that is thinking aright by how the term is used in Scripture thinks that this "sleep" is a denial of the alertness of the soul in the intermediate state. Rather it is a phrase that has in view the appearance of one recently dead.

AMR

Robert Pate
November 5th, 2018, 04:21 PM
Robert,

The use of sleep is an "earthy" phrase, similar to Jesus' expression, John 11:11, "Lazarus sleeps," Paul's , "...many sleep," "sleep in Jesus," and Peter's, "...for since the fathers fell asleep," and to Stephen's martyrdom, "...he fell asleep."

No one that is thinking aright by how the term is used in Scripture thinks that this "sleep" is a denial of the alertness of the soul in the intermediate state. Rather it is a phrase that has in view the appearance of one recently dead.

AMR


The word "sleep" in the New Testament is very proper. When we sleep we are not conscious as to what is going on, otherwise it is not sleep. Some have been sleeping for thousands of years, but will awake at the last trump, 1 Corinthians 15:52. The word "death" means the permanent end of life. Those that have died "In Christ" are not really dead because they will live again.